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Speaker 1: Hi, and welcome to Shared Lunch Today. I'm at the

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Speaker 1: William Sanders Village here in Devonport Auckland with Ryman Healthcare.

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Speaker 1: Raymond is one of New Zealand's most well known retirement

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Speaker 1: and age care providers, and shortly will be joined by

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Speaker 1: its CEO, Naomi James. In this episode, we'll be talking

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Speaker 1: through the Ryman business model and what's unique about it,

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Speaker 1: what's been most challenging about the last few years, and

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Speaker 1: the significant reset that the company's undertaking, and what this

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Speaker 1: next chapter means for Raymond's staff, It's residents, and its shareholders.

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Speaker 2: Investing involves the risk you might lose the money you

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Speaker 2: start with. We recommend talking to a licensed financial advisor.

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Speaker 2: We also recommend reading product disclosure documents before deciding to invest.

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Speaker 2: Everything you're about to see and here is current at

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Speaker 2: the time of recording.

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Speaker 3: Hi, Susannah, Welcome to William Sanders Village. It is great

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Speaker 3: to have you here today. Let's go have a look.

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Speaker 3: We're in the heart of the village. This is where

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Speaker 3: all of our residents can come to socialize, to do

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Speaker 3: activities from our happy hour to our bowling groom.

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Speaker 1: Not to meet you the piano today I notice it too.

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Speaker 3: So we're right in the center of the village now, Susannah,

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Speaker 3: and you get us since of the scale this village

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Speaker 3: has been open for us seven years. The gardens are

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Speaker 3: really established. They're a key part of what our residents

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Speaker 3: just love. And all these places to go and enjoy

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Speaker 3: the surroundings, meet with friends from the village or from

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Speaker 3: the community. They make for a really special place to live.

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Speaker 3: Oh wow, what of you. It really shows you the

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Speaker 3: premium locations that some of our villages are in. We

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Speaker 3: build these really high quality assets. We build to own,

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Speaker 3: and so we want this to be a great home

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Speaker 3: for fifty plus years for the people who will live here.

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Speaker 1: Thanks Naomi for having us and hosting us in such

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Speaker 1: a beautiful livery here at the village.

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Speaker 3: Great to have you here today, Susanna.

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Speaker 1: So it's been a challenging few years for Ryman and

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Speaker 1: for Ryman shareholders, and this is such an interesting and

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Speaker 1: frankly pivotal time for the business as you've been tasked

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Speaker 1: with leading this reset and changing the trajectory for the company.

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Speaker 1: I'd love to talk a bit more about that in

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Speaker 1: this episode. Before we do so, though, I'd love to

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Speaker 1: zoom out a bit for our listeners and for our viewers,

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Speaker 1: How would you describe what exactly Ryman does.

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Speaker 3: I think one of the biggest misconceptions in this industry

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Speaker 3: is that it's just a property business. It is so

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Speaker 3: much more than that. Yes, we have a really significant

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Speaker 3: property portfolio, over twelve billion dollars of property assets in

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Speaker 3: our portfolio, but we're also a very large healthcare business

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Speaker 3: and we have relationships with our customers that last a lifetime.

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Speaker 3: And so it's that combination of that that really brings

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Speaker 3: this unique value proposition for our customers, our residents, as

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Speaker 3: well as we think for shareholders, especially with how the

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Speaker 3: growth and outlook is going to come in terms of

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Speaker 3: the aging population.

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Speaker 1: Both Australia and New Zealand are aging populations and aging quickly.

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Speaker 1: What are some of these structural components over say the

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Speaker 1: next decade that need to take place in order to

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Speaker 1: translate to a healthy sector and a great business.

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Speaker 3: One of the things that is less talked about is

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Speaker 3: how we how we need to change how we are

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Speaker 3: delivering to a much larger population. We need to evolve

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Speaker 3: our business and evolve our sector and do that in

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Speaker 3: a way that is going to align with the government

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Speaker 3: funding settings, policy settings. We need to have more care

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Speaker 3: in the home, We need to have higher acuity care

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Speaker 3: in residential care settings. The baby boomers are more and

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Speaker 3: more going to become an increasing part of our customer base,

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Speaker 3: but they're very different consumers. They want a lot more choice.

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Speaker 3: They're not old, you know, and so they're looking for

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Speaker 3: different things. And so all of that means we need

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Speaker 3: to think about how we evolve and continue to serve

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Speaker 3: both our residents and form part of a really healthy

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Speaker 3: system that is able to meet the needs of this

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Speaker 3: much bigger population that's going to be coming through.

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Speaker 1: And you talk about, you know, Ryman, it's much more

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Speaker 1: than just a property business. Albeit that property portfolio is

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Speaker 1: large and property prices and interest rates that are clearly

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Speaker 1: a key dependency, are a big part of that. How

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Speaker 1: do you manage those risks that really are outside of

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Speaker 1: your control and it's all that you've got still a

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Speaker 1: really strong underlying operating business.

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Speaker 3: What we've done with our strategy refresh we've just announced

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Speaker 3: is really looked at those things that have been key

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Speaker 3: to our success in the past. We are renowned for

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Speaker 3: the quality of care that we provide to our residents,

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Speaker 3: and that drives a huge degree of community trust. We've

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Speaker 3: got a brand that is a household name in New

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Speaker 3: Zealand and we've built that recognition in Victoria now with

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Speaker 3: the investments that we've made. At the same time, all

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Speaker 3: of those things haven't translated into financial success and never been.

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Speaker 3: The things we've got to address. Part of the problem

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Speaker 3: of the past was that performance was not transparent. You

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Speaker 3: couldn't necessarily see financially how the business was performing. We

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Speaker 3: then need to go and improve it. And so having

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Speaker 3: stabilized the business over the last year with the reset,

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Speaker 3: balance sheet and a reset and a lot of our

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Speaker 3: pricing and terms other and our cost base, we now

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Speaker 3: are able to really make a shift on improving performance

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Speaker 3: and looking at how we grow these recurring earnings out

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Speaker 3: of this business that should be fairly consistent and growing

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Speaker 3: over time, and manage the more cyclical side of the business,

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Speaker 3: which can be the property housing market. And a big

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Speaker 3: part of that was a changed approach to development to

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Speaker 3: say we want to grow, but we want to grow

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Speaker 3: in the right way and be really clear when we're

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Speaker 3: deploying shareholder capital in the future, we can give confidence

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Speaker 3: to shareholders on the return they'll get on that capital.

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Speaker 1: We have been in a bit of a period further

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Speaker 1: back in the last few years where we had declining

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Speaker 1: interstrates for a long period of time and then ult

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Speaker 1: to low interest rates, and clearly that's a massive tailwind

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Speaker 1: for property prices and then indeed for a company like

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Speaker 1: Rayman with a large property book. So in your view,

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Speaker 1: did that actually perhaps mask some of the deteriorating operating

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Speaker 1: parts of the business. Hence why you're real focus on

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Speaker 1: that transparency so that it's really easy to understand what

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Speaker 1: are those underlying dynamics and being able to diagnose those

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Speaker 1: much earlier on.

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Speaker 3: If you think about what happened in New Zealand post GFC,

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Speaker 3: we've had very much above average trend growth in property

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Speaker 3: prices driven by the population growth that occurred. We've then

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Speaker 3: had COVID, we've had a bit of a reset in

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Speaker 3: the property market starting to recover, but still quite a

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Speaker 3: recovery to come, particularly here in Auckland where we are today,

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Speaker 3: and so we've got to have a business that isn't

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Speaker 3: just works in strong property up strong cycle. It's got

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Speaker 3: to work through the cycle. And that's really the shift

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Speaker 3: that we're making. We don't want to rely on just

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Speaker 3: big capital gains in the way that occurred in the past,

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Speaker 3: because we're not in control of that.

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Speaker 1: You know, with those interest rate cycles and with different

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Speaker 1: property cycles that you might be going through. I'm just

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Speaker 1: curious to know how quickly do you see those show

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Speaker 1: up in your numbers, that sluggish property market, when you're

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Speaker 1: seeing those green shoots, how do those sort of reveal

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Speaker 1: themselves in the numbers as well.

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Speaker 3: Yes, so most of our residents will need to sell

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Speaker 3: their family home to move into the village. People want

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Speaker 3: to sell in the right property market, So we definitely

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Speaker 3: see the impact when we're in those down cycles in

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Speaker 3: terms of turnover rate at which people can sell, and

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Speaker 3: when the market comes back, it goes the other way.

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Speaker 3: So we have higher level of stock today than we'd

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Speaker 3: like to have. There's no doubt that it's easier to

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Speaker 3: sell down stock in a stronger property market, but the

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Speaker 3: business model can't be dependent on that. And if you

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Speaker 3: think about the scale we have and the unique offering

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Speaker 3: we have, you do want a bit of scarcity. There's

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Speaker 3: something special about coming into a Raman village, and we

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Speaker 3: also make it really seamless for people in moving in,

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Speaker 3: and there's a lot of things we're working on to

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Speaker 3: make that experience even better. And our offering is uniquely

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Speaker 3: suited to where we see the strongest demand coming through

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Speaker 3: in the future, which is in assisted living as well

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Speaker 3: as through to care. And so as people start to

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Speaker 3: think about potentially needing a bit more support or help

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Speaker 3: in the home, or just wanting the security of knowing

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Speaker 3: when I need care, when I need more help and support,

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Speaker 3: it's going to be there for me. That's often what

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Speaker 3: drives decision making, and our job is just to make

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Speaker 3: it really attractive and a good value proposition, no doubt.

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Speaker 3: When the property market tailwinds come back, it makes our

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Speaker 3: job a lot a lot easier, but we're not waiting

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Speaker 3: for that. We focus on the things that are in

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Speaker 3: our control and really driving performance throughout the cycle, and.

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Speaker 1: Also thinking about these residents and the retirement sector. And

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Speaker 1: you know, it is such an important part of the

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Speaker 1: social fabric for New Zealand and for Australia. We all

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Speaker 1: have loved ones, we all have older relatives who we

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Speaker 1: really want to see looked after, and it's clearly such

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Speaker 1: an important part of living with dignity in the latter years.

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Speaker 1: There's so many trade offs that you must have to

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Speaker 1: balance around resident outcomes, around staff workloads, around affordability, shield

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Speaker 1: a return. How on earth do you think about balancing

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Speaker 1: all of those outcomes.

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Speaker 3: We always start with our resident in mind first. People

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Speaker 3: choose to work for Ryman because of all those reasons

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Speaker 3: that you talk about. We employ staff who love older people,

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Speaker 3: who want to serve and support and care for older people,

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Speaker 3: who want to provide them with that choice and experience,

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Speaker 3: so that your latter days they can kind of be

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Speaker 3: these full days where you experience more connection and joy

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Speaker 3: often than when you're living in the community it's a

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Speaker 3: bit more isolated, so we don't compromise on the quality

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Speaker 3: of the care. At the same time, we have had

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Speaker 3: to do some resets in the business. We've needed to

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Speaker 3: bring a lot more just discipline through the business in

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Speaker 3: terms of how we manage our costs, our non village costs.

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Speaker 3: We've taken a different approach to our development, not having

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Speaker 3: a big development team where we have to keep building

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Speaker 3: to keep those people employed to cover those costs. We've

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Speaker 3: also needed to review our care capacity here in New

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Speaker 3: Zealand where the funding settings aren't right at the moment,

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Speaker 3: and that's seen us close to of our care centers

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Speaker 3: as a result. But again when we make those decisions,

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Speaker 3: when we do that, we are constantly thinking about what's

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Speaker 3: the impact for our residents. How do we keep them

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Speaker 3: at the center of what we're doing, because that's key

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Speaker 3: to our success long term.

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Speaker 1: Rayman is often described as having a very distinct model

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Speaker 1: around that full continuum of care. Could you talk us

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Speaker 1: through the resident journey from start to finish and then

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Speaker 1: how goal it gets created. So someone that might be

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Speaker 1: looking to buy a unit unit they move in, you know,

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Speaker 1: maybe when they go into sort of greater care after

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Speaker 1: a decade or a decade and a half, can you

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Speaker 1: talk us through that guini.

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Speaker 3: If I summarize it in one word, it's one move.

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Speaker 3: This is often the biggest move people will make in

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Speaker 3: their life to leave their family home. And you're moving once.

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Speaker 3: So when you come into a Rhyman village, whether you're

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Speaker 3: coming in to independent living, or you're coming into a

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Speaker 3: service department with assisted living, or you're coming into residential care,

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Speaker 3: what you can have is the confidence that there is

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Speaker 3: the capacity and the offering at the village to meet

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Speaker 3: your care needs and your support needs as they change

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Speaker 3: over your lifetime. We don't just have the flexibility in

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Speaker 3: our model to provide care across the village. We've got

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Speaker 3: it to provide it at a resident level based on

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Speaker 3: what you individual need. And the portfolio has got that.

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Speaker 3: And this is unique about Raymond. Fifty percent independent living capacity,

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Speaker 3: twenty percent assisted living service department capacity, which can you

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Speaker 3: can provide residential care into or you can live independent

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Speaker 3: more independently, and then thirty percent age care capacity. So

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Speaker 3: a really sizable flexible offering in premium locations that's unique

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Speaker 3: and almost irreplaceable in terms of being able to be

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Speaker 3: copied in the market. How does that work financially in

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Speaker 3: simple terms at the independent living if you think about

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Speaker 3: what we're providing, it's a home. We're looking after the

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Speaker 3: gardens for you, we're looking after the building maintenance.

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Speaker 1: It's peace of mind.

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Speaker 3: It's peace of mind. You don't need to worry it.

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Speaker 3: You just enjoy living your life with the activities available

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Speaker 3: on site, but also to free to lock up and

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Speaker 3: go and do whatever you're wanting to do and know

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Speaker 3: your home is secure. And the financial returns in that

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Speaker 3: side of the business are more in the growth, with

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Speaker 3: the capital gain on property over time falling through to

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Speaker 3: the shareholder. So our job is to manage the costs

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Speaker 3: of the business to recover those through the weekly charges

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Speaker 3: and that and we've had to do some resetting to

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Speaker 3: make sure we can do that and then manage the

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Speaker 3: portfolio really well so that we're investing to grow that

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Speaker 3: capital gain, to realize that capital gain for our shareholders

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Speaker 3: over time and the resident funds, the funding from our residents.

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Speaker 3: Putting capital in helps us provide that low cost of

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Speaker 3: capital that enables that model to work. If you go

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Speaker 3: to the other end, the care end services business, so

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Speaker 3: this is a margin business. It's fairly high cost to

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Speaker 3: provide care. Occupancy is really important. Utilization is really important

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Speaker 3: understanding where and how you make money, and we might

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Speaker 3: not make money, and so at that end of the business,

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Speaker 3: you know, it's about managing well for margin with high occupancy.

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Speaker 3: We're the largest age care provider in New Zealand. That

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Speaker 3: gives us the scale to do those things really well

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Speaker 3: and to offer a unique proposition that if you're a

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Speaker 3: smaller operator can be quite hard to do, but you know,

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Speaker 3: scale truly integrated living in an irreplaceable property portfolio. Unique

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Speaker 3: locations like the one in Devenport where we are today,

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Speaker 3: that's a pretty unique asset base.

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Speaker 1: Well, let's talk a bit more about care. You've mentioned

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Speaker 1: that it is really service business. It is really about

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Speaker 1: being laser focused on the margins. You also mentioned that

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Speaker 1: you've closed to facilities recently and that model is clearly

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Speaker 1: quite challenged at the moment. And I know there's been

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Speaker 1: a lot of dialogue between industry and the government in

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Speaker 1: New Zealand around what needs to change and some of

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Speaker 1: the settings that are just not working. Can you talk

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Speaker 1: us through some of those settings now you know what

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Speaker 1: is broken about the model, what does need to change?

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Speaker 1: In any other thoughts that you've got around that.

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Speaker 3: Australia is a little bit ahead of New Zealand, having

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Speaker 3: already worked through its funding reforms, but New Zealand right

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Speaker 3: now is right on the threshold of that. In simple terms,

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Speaker 3: we need to make sure that care is properly funded.

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Speaker 3: We need to provide more care in the home, and

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Speaker 3: we need to provide higher acuity care in residential care settings.

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Speaker 3: That's reflected in the government's policy and both sides of

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Speaker 3: the tasmum. How does that translate back into our business

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Speaker 3: and those reforms? The age care funding has lagged growth

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Speaker 3: in costs. It's very well understood and documented in multiple

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Speaker 3: government reports. What we need to work through is the

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Speaker 3: new funding regime that's going to set us up for

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Speaker 3: the future. So clinical care, which is the entitlement of

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Speaker 3: everyone being funded by government and being funded properly, and

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Speaker 3: then accommodation and living costs in the same way as

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Speaker 3: when you live in your own home, you pay for

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Speaker 3: those things. And so a shift to if you can

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Speaker 3: afford to pay, you pay, and where people do need

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Speaker 3: support from the government that's available to They're the big

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Speaker 3: shifts that are coming. We're onto this exciting phase with

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Speaker 3: the minister or advisory group that's been set up to

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Speaker 3: work through what's the hell how do we actually make

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Speaker 3: that happen, and how do we make that happen not

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Speaker 3: in five years time, how do we make this happen

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Speaker 3: next year? Because if we don't address this, the risk

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Speaker 3: for all kiwis is that it impacts our public hospital system.

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Speaker 3: Good care for our older citizens is an everyone issue

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Speaker 3: and a well functioning public health system. Actually it's foundational.

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Speaker 1: To that and the latest results, the entim results at

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Speaker 1: the end of last year you did record a positive

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Speaker 1: free cash flow, which I think was the first and

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Speaker 1: over a decade, can you talk us through a what

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Speaker 1: is free cash flow? And then be how did you

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Speaker 1: achieve it? How did you turn that around? And what

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Speaker 1: were some of the leavers that you needed to pull

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Speaker 1: to do that?

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Speaker 3: Yes, in really simple terms, free cash flow is you

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Speaker 3: look in the bank account and there is more money

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Speaker 3: in it or less did so the great thing about

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Speaker 3: cash cash nevalize and so one of the shifts that

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Speaker 3: our board made before I joined was a shift in

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Speaker 3: our reporting to put much more emphasis on cash based metrics,

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Speaker 3: which is really where we've already built our villages. What's

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Speaker 3: the cash they're generating? Cash flow from development activities, how

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Speaker 3: much are we spending in investing in new facilities, and

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Speaker 3: how is that recycling capital to invest in the next one.

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Speaker 3: But having really clear line a site to both. The

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Speaker 3: asset base is still well under earning what it should be.

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Speaker 3: But that's about resetting our cost base. That's about resetting

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Speaker 3: some of our pricing to market. It's about adjusting our

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Speaker 3: approach to development to build in line with demand. So

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Speaker 3: we've made early progress and a really great start to that,

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Speaker 3: but we've still got a good amount to go. And

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Speaker 3: we've been really clear what we're targeting. So one hundred

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Speaker 3: and fifty million dollar improvement and sustainable cash and performance

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Speaker 3: and a five hundred million dollar release in cash release

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Speaker 3: from the business by FYI twenty nine. So for in

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Speaker 3: the next three years, we'll keep reporting against that, We'll

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Speaker 3: keep telling people how we're going, but we want to

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Speaker 3: be really clear and transparent with the market about how

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Speaker 3: we are properly managing what is significant shareholder capital.

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Speaker 1: I'm curious to know what have been the hardest couple

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Speaker 1: of calls you've had to make since joining Ryman, and

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Speaker 1: if you talk through maybe some of the trade offs

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Speaker 1: that you had to think about through those calls.

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Speaker 3: There are some big decisions that are much bigger than others.

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Speaker 3: But ultimately I know my legacy as a CEO you

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Speaker 3: will only see when I'm no longer in the chair.

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Speaker 3: It's in the long term capability and capacity. Each time

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Speaker 3: we're approaching a big decision and important decision, how are

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Speaker 3: we building the capacity within the organization to make good decisions,

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Speaker 3: not just this one, but the ten that are going

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Speaker 3: to come after it, because that's what's critical to long

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Speaker 3: term value. What's been hard we obviously had to make

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Speaker 3: early on in my time, a decision to come back

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Speaker 3: to shareholders, and I should acknowledge and think how many

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Speaker 3: shares these shareholders who supported us through that. That's not easy.

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Speaker 3: But having done that, we are so well set up.

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Speaker 3: You know, the balance sheet side is done, it's reset.

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Speaker 3: We can now fully focus on getting this business performing. Similarly,

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Speaker 3: when we the decision with a couple of our care centers,

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Speaker 3: the hard decisions to make because we know they are

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Speaker 3: people's homes, but what we did with our teams and

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Speaker 3: what we did with every single one of our residents

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Speaker 3: at those sites was worked with them one on one.

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Speaker 3: It was so wonderful to get the feedback from many

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Speaker 3: of our residents who moved to other villages to not

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Speaker 3: just have managed that change, which can be quite difficult,

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Speaker 3: but they were so excited to be moving to a

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Speaker 3: newer village, a new home. So we're making good decisions

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Speaker 3: for shareholders, but we're also making good decisions for residents.

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Speaker 3: So yeah, I think, yes, there's been some hard decisions,

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Speaker 3: but actually the organization is leaning into the change and

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Speaker 3: as importantly, the opportunity that it presents for us to

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Speaker 3: not just get through this but lead the industry for

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Speaker 3: the next forty years, because that's what Rayman did forty

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Speaker 3: years ago. It invented the continuum of care model and

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Speaker 3: it led the industry and that's what I'd love to

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Speaker 3: be the legacy.

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Speaker 1: Well, speaking of opportunity and about growth and the next

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Speaker 1: forty years, I'd love to turn to Australia. You recently

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Speaker 1: juelisted on the A six, So tell me about how

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Speaker 1: do you think about Australia and what does success look

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Speaker 1: like there.

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Speaker 3: So Australia has got lots of the similar market opportunity,

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Speaker 3: the aging population, the housing shortage and the housing cycle.

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Speaker 3: You know, the rebound in the housing cycle that's coming.

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Speaker 3: Where it's different, it's at a different point in funding

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Speaker 3: reform as we've touched on. And also Ryman today is

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Speaker 3: only in Victoria. It's a much bigger market than New Zealand.

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Speaker 3: We are large in New Zealand, we are the largest

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Speaker 3: by a good amount. We have established scale and platform

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Speaker 3: now in Victoria and we want to build on that.

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Speaker 3: So part of the AX listing was really a foundation

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Speaker 3: to go and say we see future growth and opportunity

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Speaker 3: to be a bigger player in Australia. We've open minded

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Speaker 3: about how we do that. We're also very disciplined in

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Speaker 3: how we think about growth and that was part of

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Speaker 3: what we've set out in our capital management framework. So

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Speaker 3: whether it's more green field growth, new sites we've already

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Speaker 3: got a good quality land bank over there, or M

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Speaker 3: and A or other ways to grow, we definitely see

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Speaker 3: that as a key part of our future.

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Speaker 1: You mentioned M and A and that being a possibility.

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Speaker 1: There has been quite a lot of consolidation in the

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Speaker 1: Australian market. How likely do you think that is. Could

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Speaker 1: we assume that there are sort of no plans to

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Speaker 1: raise additional capital in the future or need additional capital

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Speaker 1: future outside of something like a big M and A opportunity.

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Speaker 3: M and A is not our focus at present. We

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Speaker 3: are focused on getting the operating performance in the assets

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Speaker 3: we have today, to get that return for shareholders from

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Speaker 3: what has already been invested. And clearly, when we're trading

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Speaker 3: at a little under point seven times NTA, we wouldn't

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Speaker 3: want to go and pay one time's NTA to dilute

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Speaker 3: our shareholders. That would be nonsensical. But we do see

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Speaker 3: M and A potentially in the future as the business

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Speaker 3: performs better, and we are watching the consolidation that is

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Speaker 3: playing out in Australia. Scale matters in this industry and

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Speaker 3: it's going to matter even more in the future. And

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Speaker 3: so i'd say that's we're going to monitor. We're going

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Speaker 3: to focus on getting our existing business performing first.

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Speaker 1: Great And finally I'd like to finish with a bit

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Speaker 1: more about you at the home of Rayman And speaking

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Speaker 1: of capital intensity, you came into the retirement sector from

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Speaker 1: a background and here vs it regulated infrastructure, big operation

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Speaker 1: or environments. So, you know, while the different sector definitely parallels,

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Speaker 1: what leadership instincts from your previous roles, have you been

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Speaker 1: able to play here or been most useful and are

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Speaker 1: they any that you've had to maybe tweak or unlearn,

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Speaker 1: you know, because retirement is a different, different ball game.

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Speaker 3: Yes, So in terms of the similarities, these are big

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Speaker 3: capital intensive businesses that means getting capital decision making capital

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Speaker 3: allocation right is critically important. They're big cost businesses that

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Speaker 3: means disciplined operations and operational excellence is important. And they're

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Speaker 3: big you know, quality and safety. We provide essential services

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Speaker 3: in the same way as we did in my last job.

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Speaker 3: And so being really clear on not just the financial

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Speaker 3: performance but the non financial you know those quality, safety,

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Speaker 3: clinical indicators. So while we're measuring different things, it's actually

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Speaker 3: the same ingredients. From a leadership perspective, what as we've

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Speaker 3: touched on, the creating clarity and setting standards in organizations

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Speaker 3: like this is critically important, particularly through change, and helping

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Speaker 3: people know what is expected, know what good looks like,

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Speaker 3: and thinking about how they're going to continue to improve

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Speaker 3: and contribute to that. I see a key part of change.

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Speaker 3: When you get organizations leaning into change, it's an opportunity

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Speaker 3: not just for organizational growth, but for personal growth. And

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Speaker 3: organizations don't just survive change. People don't just survive change.

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Speaker 3: They get stronger because they left to respond to the challenge,

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Speaker 3: rise to that challenge, and they come out better versions

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Speaker 3: of themselves. And I have no doubt that's what Ryman

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Speaker 3: will be. And so that's the opportunity.

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Speaker 1: Well know me. Thanks so much for your time and insights.

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Speaker 1: We've covered a lot. It's been so valuable to understand

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Speaker 1: more about the Ryman business model and your approach going

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Speaker 1: forward through this reset, and I for one, am really

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Speaker 1: looking forward to seeing how this chapter unfolds for residents,

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Speaker 1: for staff, and for shareholders. And thanks to listeners and

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Speaker 1: viewers for tuning in. You can catch this episode on YouTube, Spotify,

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Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast