1 00:00:05,000 --> 00:00:05,440 Speaker 1: Hilda. 2 00:00:05,519 --> 00:00:08,640 Speaker 2: I'm Chelsea Daniels and This is the Front Page, a 3 00:00:08,720 --> 00:00:16,680 Speaker 2: daily podcast presented by the New Zealand Herald. Only a 4 00:00:16,680 --> 00:00:20,040 Speaker 2: few weeks after he had reportedly been in contention for 5 00:00:20,120 --> 00:00:24,880 Speaker 2: the country's top police job, Deputy Police Commissioner Jevin mcskimming 6 00:00:25,160 --> 00:00:29,160 Speaker 2: was suspended and put on leave. The Independent Police Conduct 7 00:00:29,160 --> 00:00:32,519 Speaker 2: Authority and the New Zealand Police are investigating, but the 8 00:00:32,640 --> 00:00:36,440 Speaker 2: nature of the allegations could not be reported. Months went 9 00:00:36,520 --> 00:00:40,800 Speaker 2: by without any developments. That was until last week, when 10 00:00:40,880 --> 00:00:47,159 Speaker 2: mcskimming resigned after allegations surfaced of objectionable material being found 11 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:51,240 Speaker 2: on his work computer and Zaid Herald senior crime reporter 12 00:00:51,360 --> 00:00:54,520 Speaker 2: Jared Savage broke the story back in December and joins 13 00:00:54,600 --> 00:00:57,640 Speaker 2: us today on the Front Page to explain what's going on. 14 00:01:02,800 --> 00:01:05,919 Speaker 2: First off, Jared, who is Jevin mcskimming. 15 00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:09,479 Speaker 1: Well, up until last week, he was the Deputy Commissioner 16 00:01:09,560 --> 00:01:13,360 Speaker 1: of Police, the second most sort of powerful or influential 17 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:18,160 Speaker 1: officer in the country. He's fifty one years old, married, 18 00:01:18,400 --> 00:01:23,080 Speaker 1: father of two children, and very senior person within the 19 00:01:23,080 --> 00:01:24,560 Speaker 1: police executive in this country. 20 00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:26,679 Speaker 2: I read somewhere that he is noted to have a 21 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:30,480 Speaker 2: relatively unique career path within the New Zealand Police. 22 00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:31,200 Speaker 3: What does that mean? 23 00:01:31,480 --> 00:01:34,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, those are the exact words used by the Public 24 00:01:34,720 --> 00:01:38,600 Speaker 1: Service Commission when he was recommended to be Deputy Commissioner 25 00:01:38,920 --> 00:01:41,440 Speaker 1: a couple of years ago. I mean, I guess by 26 00:01:41,520 --> 00:01:45,800 Speaker 1: that they mean that most police officers who reached sort 27 00:01:45,840 --> 00:01:50,040 Speaker 1: of the upper echelon the more traditional paths would be 28 00:01:50,080 --> 00:01:53,320 Speaker 1: to come through as a senior investigator or perhaps the 29 00:01:53,360 --> 00:01:58,360 Speaker 1: district commander of an entire region. Jim mcskimming had a 30 00:01:58,360 --> 00:02:01,640 Speaker 1: more sort of unique career path because he started off 31 00:02:01,720 --> 00:02:05,840 Speaker 1: back in ninety six as a constable around the country Auckland, 32 00:02:06,000 --> 00:02:10,440 Speaker 1: West Coast, Southland, you know, and these rural communities, and 33 00:02:10,480 --> 00:02:13,440 Speaker 1: he kind of jumped straight from there, sent about ten 34 00:02:13,520 --> 00:02:15,600 Speaker 1: years in those kind of frontline roles and then jumped 35 00:02:15,639 --> 00:02:19,000 Speaker 1: straight into sort of Wellington and then quickly into Police 36 00:02:19,080 --> 00:02:22,280 Speaker 1: National Headquarters where he was doing responsible for more kind 37 00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:26,320 Speaker 1: of like strategic or sort of organizational kind of reviews 38 00:02:26,360 --> 00:02:29,760 Speaker 1: and projects and things like that. So, for example, he 39 00:02:30,040 --> 00:02:33,600 Speaker 1: was sort of the brains behind the rollout of digital 40 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:36,840 Speaker 1: technology to the frontline stuff, so iPads and iPhones and 41 00:02:36,880 --> 00:02:41,600 Speaker 1: things like that, sort of revolutionizing that side of policing. 42 00:02:41,680 --> 00:02:44,800 Speaker 1: He was also in charge of procurement for you know, 43 00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:49,960 Speaker 1: the property portfolios within the Police commercial arrangements. He was 44 00:02:50,600 --> 00:02:54,600 Speaker 1: one of the architects of the overhaul of the police 45 00:02:55,240 --> 00:02:58,280 Speaker 1: fleet of vehicles moving to Scoda about five years ago. 46 00:02:58,400 --> 00:03:01,040 Speaker 1: So you know, he had been in NHQ or Police 47 00:03:01,080 --> 00:03:05,360 Speaker 1: National Headquarters for about fifteen years or so U up 48 00:03:05,440 --> 00:03:06,160 Speaker 1: until recently. 49 00:03:06,320 --> 00:03:07,959 Speaker 4: So slightly different. 50 00:03:07,680 --> 00:03:11,720 Speaker 1: Career path to many others, and I guess that led 51 00:03:11,760 --> 00:03:14,120 Speaker 1: to a feeling on the front line, perhaps that he 52 00:03:14,200 --> 00:03:17,320 Speaker 1: was a little bit sort of removed or distant from 53 00:03:17,320 --> 00:03:19,359 Speaker 1: the realities of day to day policing. 54 00:03:21,880 --> 00:03:24,959 Speaker 5: Mc skimming had been on suspension since late last year 55 00:03:25,120 --> 00:03:29,840 Speaker 5: facing a criminal investigation, but Police Minister Mark Mitchell recently 56 00:03:29,919 --> 00:03:34,160 Speaker 5: received new allegations of a very serious nature. In a 57 00:03:34,200 --> 00:03:37,520 Speaker 5: statement today, Mitchell said when mister mc skimming was invited 58 00:03:37,560 --> 00:03:41,640 Speaker 5: to respond to the allegations, he chose to resign, confirming 59 00:03:41,720 --> 00:03:45,320 Speaker 5: my view that his continuation in the role was untenable. 60 00:03:45,480 --> 00:03:49,360 Speaker 5: Mc skimming was appointed Statutory Deputy Commissioner in twenty twenty 61 00:03:49,400 --> 00:03:52,720 Speaker 5: three on the recommendation of then Prime Minister Chris Hipkins. 62 00:03:52,840 --> 00:03:56,640 Speaker 1: Police Commissioner and the Public Service Commissioner both recommended his appointment. 63 00:03:56,960 --> 00:03:59,920 Speaker 3: There were no red flags at all through that process. 64 00:04:02,160 --> 00:04:04,320 Speaker 2: Moving ahead to where we are now, can you give 65 00:04:04,400 --> 00:04:06,680 Speaker 2: us a bit of a timeline. How did he come 66 00:04:06,720 --> 00:04:09,400 Speaker 2: to be under investigation at the end of last year. 67 00:04:09,920 --> 00:04:14,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, so, in about sort of October last year, mc 68 00:04:14,440 --> 00:04:17,840 Speaker 1: skimming was actually one of the final two front runners 69 00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:21,520 Speaker 1: to become the Commissioner of Police, so he was one 70 00:04:21,520 --> 00:04:24,559 Speaker 1: of the only two interviewed for the job, which later 71 00:04:24,640 --> 00:04:28,400 Speaker 1: went to Richard Chambers, who's the Commissioner of Police now. 72 00:04:29,440 --> 00:04:31,920 Speaker 1: A couple of weeks after that, or several weeks after that, 73 00:04:32,480 --> 00:04:35,800 Speaker 1: mc skimming was put on leave very quietly, there was 74 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:39,120 Speaker 1: no sort of announcement really like that, and put on 75 00:04:39,200 --> 00:04:42,040 Speaker 1: leave and we became aware that he was actually under 76 00:04:42,080 --> 00:04:45,920 Speaker 1: investigation by the police and also by the IPCA, which 77 00:04:45,960 --> 00:04:49,920 Speaker 1: is the Independent Police Conduct Authority. There's not actually a 78 00:04:49,960 --> 00:04:52,560 Speaker 1: lot we can say about the reason for why he's 79 00:04:52,640 --> 00:04:56,440 Speaker 1: under investigation at the moment, but we managed to break that. 80 00:04:56,520 --> 00:04:58,440 Speaker 4: Story sort of middle of December. 81 00:04:58,560 --> 00:05:01,320 Speaker 1: Obviously quite big news even though he'd missed out on 82 00:05:01,360 --> 00:05:06,160 Speaker 1: the top job, still a very senior police officer, and 83 00:05:06,200 --> 00:05:08,760 Speaker 1: it didn't take long for kind of other media to 84 00:05:08,760 --> 00:05:11,560 Speaker 1: sort of jump in on that as well, you know, 85 00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:15,400 Speaker 1: Police Commissioner couldn't say much, Minister of Police couldn't say much, 86 00:05:15,440 --> 00:05:18,640 Speaker 1: IPCA didn't say much, and so all we really had 87 00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:20,680 Speaker 1: it was out there there was that a very senior 88 00:05:20,720 --> 00:05:25,640 Speaker 1: person was under investigation. And things went quiet for sort 89 00:05:25,680 --> 00:05:27,560 Speaker 1: of a month or so into the new year. 90 00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:30,160 Speaker 2: And so what are we looking at now, How did 91 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:32,960 Speaker 2: these latest delegations come about or are they the same 92 00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:34,599 Speaker 2: allegations made last year. 93 00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:36,840 Speaker 6: Well, I'll just back to check a little bit on that, 94 00:05:36,880 --> 00:05:39,520 Speaker 6: because earlier in the new year, sort of about the 95 00:05:39,640 --> 00:05:44,040 Speaker 6: middle of January, mc skimmings lawyers Mike here in Casey 96 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:45,960 Speaker 6: at the time in Lindakark actually put out a statement 97 00:05:46,080 --> 00:05:49,360 Speaker 6: saying confirming that he was under police investigation, that he 98 00:05:49,360 --> 00:05:52,560 Speaker 6: had in fact been suspended from the job, not just 99 00:05:53,200 --> 00:05:56,080 Speaker 6: not just on leave, but you know, he was cooperating 100 00:05:56,120 --> 00:06:00,840 Speaker 6: with the investigation and also essentially saying once I'm I'm 101 00:06:00,880 --> 00:06:02,440 Speaker 6: going to get back to work, I'm going to resume 102 00:06:02,440 --> 00:06:03,000 Speaker 6: my duties. 103 00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:04,520 Speaker 1: And that was sort of like the last sort of 104 00:06:04,560 --> 00:06:07,640 Speaker 1: update that we'd had back in January, and then everything 105 00:06:07,720 --> 00:06:09,640 Speaker 1: kind of went quiet again for a little while, was 106 00:06:10,080 --> 00:06:13,919 Speaker 1: sort of meander along, and then last week out of 107 00:06:13,960 --> 00:06:16,600 Speaker 1: the you know, so here we have in January, he's saying, 108 00:06:17,720 --> 00:06:19,400 Speaker 1: I'm going to I'm going to clear my name, I'm 109 00:06:19,400 --> 00:06:20,880 Speaker 1: going to come back, I'm going to I'm going to. 110 00:06:20,839 --> 00:06:21,520 Speaker 4: Get back to work. 111 00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:25,160 Speaker 1: And then suddenly last Monday there was the announcement that 112 00:06:25,200 --> 00:06:27,600 Speaker 1: he had actually resigned, and it was a bit of 113 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:29,800 Speaker 1: a bit of a bombshell and I came out of 114 00:06:29,960 --> 00:06:31,640 Speaker 1: came out of left field a little bit. I guess 115 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:34,320 Speaker 1: probably the more sort of the more sort of really 116 00:06:34,360 --> 00:06:36,520 Speaker 1: interesting thing about it was that sort of Mark Mitchell, 117 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:38,840 Speaker 1: the Minister of Police, put out a very strongly worded 118 00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:43,160 Speaker 1: statement shortly after the news broke that he had resigned, saying, 119 00:06:44,080 --> 00:06:46,440 Speaker 1: you know, had he not resigned, we would have removed 120 00:06:46,520 --> 00:06:50,480 Speaker 1: him from office. There's been some very serious allegations come 121 00:06:50,520 --> 00:06:53,920 Speaker 1: to light recently. We put those to dm M skimming 122 00:06:53,960 --> 00:06:58,520 Speaker 1: and then he chose to resign. Very unusual statement. Really after, 123 00:06:58,720 --> 00:07:01,360 Speaker 1: you know, after months of truly everyone's saying nothing, we 124 00:07:01,400 --> 00:07:06,799 Speaker 1: had this very strong statement come out. What the statement 125 00:07:06,839 --> 00:07:09,920 Speaker 1: did say didn't say what the allegations were, but it 126 00:07:09,920 --> 00:07:12,760 Speaker 1: did say that they were separate to the original the 127 00:07:12,800 --> 00:07:16,240 Speaker 1: original complaint that he was being investigated for, so two 128 00:07:16,280 --> 00:07:21,480 Speaker 1: separate investigations unrelated to each other, but clearly some information 129 00:07:21,800 --> 00:07:25,200 Speaker 1: had some new information had come to light as part 130 00:07:25,240 --> 00:07:26,560 Speaker 1: of the original inquiring. 131 00:07:35,080 --> 00:07:38,280 Speaker 2: One of the latest developments here is the super injunction. 132 00:07:38,760 --> 00:07:42,280 Speaker 3: What is that and what does it mean for this case? 133 00:07:42,760 --> 00:07:44,440 Speaker 1: So I'll just spac take a little bit too there 134 00:07:44,480 --> 00:07:49,280 Speaker 1: because with when Mark Mencheled the police minister put out 135 00:07:49,320 --> 00:07:52,880 Speaker 1: that statement about these, you know, quote very serious allegations, 136 00:07:52,880 --> 00:07:55,600 Speaker 1: he didn't actually say what those allegations were. It was 137 00:07:55,760 --> 00:07:58,680 Speaker 1: sort of left out there and didn't tate long. We 138 00:07:59,120 --> 00:08:02,160 Speaker 1: broke a story to say that that pornography had allegedly 139 00:08:02,200 --> 00:08:06,440 Speaker 1: me found on GEMM Mcskimmings sort of work computer. And 140 00:08:06,520 --> 00:08:09,080 Speaker 1: in the next day there was sort of a further 141 00:08:09,160 --> 00:08:12,480 Speaker 1: development to that that amongst the pornography allegedly found in 142 00:08:12,520 --> 00:08:16,600 Speaker 1: his computer, there was images or videos that were being 143 00:08:17,080 --> 00:08:23,000 Speaker 1: investigated as potentially objectionable material. So that's you know, potentially 144 00:08:23,040 --> 00:08:25,640 Speaker 1: criminal charges could be laid as a result of that. 145 00:08:25,800 --> 00:08:30,280 Speaker 1: So that discovery alleged discovery, I might add on on 146 00:08:30,400 --> 00:08:35,440 Speaker 1: Mcskimmings computers. That was what prompted Mark Mitchell to sort 147 00:08:35,440 --> 00:08:39,240 Speaker 1: of go to say, well, ke jump before he was pushed. 148 00:08:39,320 --> 00:08:41,960 Speaker 1: So that was a big story last week. There was 149 00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:44,120 Speaker 1: lots of sort of media friends around that and lots 150 00:08:44,160 --> 00:08:46,800 Speaker 1: of reporting amongst sours and R and Z and stuff. 151 00:08:47,240 --> 00:08:50,320 Speaker 1: We were able to report that there had in fact 152 00:08:50,320 --> 00:08:54,040 Speaker 1: been a superinjunction laid against media in this case because 153 00:08:54,160 --> 00:08:58,160 Speaker 1: mcskimmings lawyers became aware that media were going to report 154 00:08:59,360 --> 00:09:03,160 Speaker 1: from specific details about the alleged objection and material found 155 00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:07,320 Speaker 1: on mcskimmings computers, and they went to the High Court 156 00:09:07,400 --> 00:09:10,559 Speaker 1: late on Friday night sought an injunction to stop publication 157 00:09:10,720 --> 00:09:14,400 Speaker 1: of those details, which would sort of explain the nature 158 00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:17,559 Speaker 1: of the alleged objection and material. But not only that, 159 00:09:17,679 --> 00:09:20,600 Speaker 1: the superinjunction also meant that media could not report the 160 00:09:20,640 --> 00:09:23,520 Speaker 1: fact that they had been juncted from reporting on it. 161 00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:26,520 Speaker 1: So that's known as a superinjunction. It's quite a rare 162 00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:29,520 Speaker 1: kind of legal move. We don't see it often in 163 00:09:29,640 --> 00:09:33,840 Speaker 1: New Zealand media. It's more common overseas. Sometimes that sort 164 00:09:33,840 --> 00:09:36,880 Speaker 1: of put a stop to everything that was happening on 165 00:09:36,920 --> 00:09:39,439 Speaker 1: that point. There was another hearing yesterday at the High 166 00:09:39,520 --> 00:09:43,319 Speaker 1: Court where mc skimmings lawyers have conceded that the superinjunction 167 00:09:43,440 --> 00:09:47,280 Speaker 1: aspect of that that we couldn't even report the gagging 168 00:09:47,360 --> 00:09:51,880 Speaker 1: order should fall away, which subsequently was reported on Monday, 169 00:09:51,920 --> 00:09:54,200 Speaker 1: And then there's now been another hearing set in a 170 00:09:54,200 --> 00:09:56,560 Speaker 1: couple of weeks time to argue whether or not the 171 00:09:56,600 --> 00:09:59,800 Speaker 1: media should be able to report the material that would 172 00:09:59,800 --> 00:10:01,559 Speaker 1: carrently been gagged from writing about. 173 00:10:01,960 --> 00:10:04,400 Speaker 2: Because generally, I mean, and the general public may not 174 00:10:04,520 --> 00:10:08,120 Speaker 2: know the intricacies of media law, but generally when someone 175 00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:12,320 Speaker 2: hasn't been charged yet and isn't before the courts, you 176 00:10:12,480 --> 00:10:17,280 Speaker 2: can give some details about what allegations are, right, we. 177 00:10:17,320 --> 00:10:20,640 Speaker 1: Can you know, And obviously every story is very carefully 178 00:10:21,160 --> 00:10:25,719 Speaker 1: checked and legally vetted beforehand. There's normally a little bit 179 00:10:25,720 --> 00:10:28,520 Speaker 1: more sway before somebody has been charged. But of course 180 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:32,439 Speaker 1: any any reporter or any newser in publishing something has 181 00:10:32,480 --> 00:10:34,640 Speaker 1: to be very certain of what they're what they're about 182 00:10:34,679 --> 00:10:37,439 Speaker 1: to say, because there's no sort of when you're reporting 183 00:10:37,480 --> 00:10:40,720 Speaker 1: on allegations in court following court charges, there's sort of 184 00:10:40,760 --> 00:10:43,800 Speaker 1: a there's a legal as a qualified privilege that you 185 00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:47,840 Speaker 1: can report these allegations in court as long as it's 186 00:10:47,840 --> 00:10:50,560 Speaker 1: done in a fair and accurate manner without any sort 187 00:10:50,559 --> 00:10:53,920 Speaker 1: of like legal recourse. If someone hasn't been charged you don't. 188 00:10:54,320 --> 00:10:57,680 Speaker 1: We don't have that prediction. So yeah, there's a little 189 00:10:57,720 --> 00:11:00,600 Speaker 1: bit more a little bit more leeway, but also need 190 00:11:00,640 --> 00:11:02,440 Speaker 1: to be very key for him. I'm very sure of 191 00:11:02,480 --> 00:11:06,120 Speaker 1: the facts before you press publish on something like that. 192 00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:12,079 Speaker 5: Just on jo gone mac skimming, should you have removed 193 00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:13,199 Speaker 5: him before he. 194 00:11:13,240 --> 00:11:16,959 Speaker 4: Was able to quit? Look, I'm aware of the resignation. 195 00:11:17,160 --> 00:11:19,160 Speaker 7: I'm not actually going to go into that given the 196 00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:22,840 Speaker 7: ongoing police investigation that is in place, as you would expect, 197 00:11:22,880 --> 00:11:24,880 Speaker 7: and I've got no further comment to say about. 198 00:11:24,640 --> 00:11:25,080 Speaker 2: That right now. 199 00:11:25,360 --> 00:11:28,080 Speaker 5: Tell the public what some of the allegations are in 200 00:11:28,080 --> 00:11:30,200 Speaker 5: regards to Does the public header right to know what 201 00:11:30,280 --> 00:11:32,480 Speaker 5: those allegations are in regards to it? 202 00:11:32,559 --> 00:11:34,960 Speaker 7: Yeah, I think you'll understand it's an employment matter. I 203 00:11:35,000 --> 00:11:38,960 Speaker 7: am aware of the circumstances and of his resignation, and 204 00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:41,360 Speaker 7: I think that's appropriate. But again, I'm going to let 205 00:11:41,400 --> 00:11:44,480 Speaker 7: the police investigation continue and close out before we have 206 00:11:44,520 --> 00:11:45,400 Speaker 7: further comment on it. 207 00:11:50,200 --> 00:11:54,280 Speaker 2: So we know that Police Minister Mark Mitchell has responded 208 00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:55,800 Speaker 2: to all of this, and you've mentioned a couple of 209 00:11:55,800 --> 00:11:56,720 Speaker 2: things that he's said there. 210 00:11:56,760 --> 00:11:59,000 Speaker 3: What about Police Commissioner Richard Chambers. 211 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:04,559 Speaker 1: Oh, well, Richard Chambers has also been clearly everyone has 212 00:12:04,600 --> 00:12:07,520 Speaker 1: to be kind of quite careful as to what they say. 213 00:12:07,800 --> 00:12:12,240 Speaker 1: There's ongoing police investigations here, and sort of initially Richard 214 00:12:12,320 --> 00:12:15,160 Speaker 1: Chambers has sort of declined to comment and say, look, 215 00:12:15,840 --> 00:12:17,679 Speaker 1: we can't really get into the ins and outs of this, 216 00:12:17,840 --> 00:12:20,360 Speaker 1: but you know, Chambers is trying to be a bit 217 00:12:20,360 --> 00:12:24,360 Speaker 1: more open and transparent with media where he can, and 218 00:12:24,440 --> 00:12:27,280 Speaker 1: he sort of unsolicited actually put out a press release 219 00:12:27,280 --> 00:12:29,440 Speaker 1: sort of last week after a day or two of 220 00:12:29,480 --> 00:12:33,160 Speaker 1: conjecture and no comments coming out of Police National Headquarters, 221 00:12:33,160 --> 00:12:36,040 Speaker 1: he put out of statement saying, look, we understand that 222 00:12:36,120 --> 00:12:38,120 Speaker 1: there's a lot of public interest in this. We understand 223 00:12:38,120 --> 00:12:42,040 Speaker 1: there are a lot of unanswered questions. We can't answer 224 00:12:42,120 --> 00:12:44,680 Speaker 1: those right now, but we you know, we understand that 225 00:12:44,720 --> 00:12:47,000 Speaker 1: this could effects of trust and confidence in the police, 226 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:51,120 Speaker 1: and no matter you know, no matter how senior somebody is, 227 00:12:51,120 --> 00:12:53,360 Speaker 1: we're going to we're going to investigate this to the 228 00:12:53,440 --> 00:12:56,240 Speaker 1: to the fullest and you know, the best that we 229 00:12:56,440 --> 00:12:59,120 Speaker 1: possibly can. So he's very much trying to sort of 230 00:12:59,240 --> 00:13:01,720 Speaker 1: reassure the public I guess through the media that they're 231 00:13:02,120 --> 00:13:04,640 Speaker 1: they're doing doing their best in this in this incidence, 232 00:13:04,679 --> 00:13:07,520 Speaker 1: and that in the you know, in the fullness of time, 233 00:13:07,920 --> 00:13:10,720 Speaker 1: a lot of those unanswered questions will be answered. A 234 00:13:10,720 --> 00:13:13,400 Speaker 1: couple of days later, I mean, this wasn't in direct 235 00:13:13,440 --> 00:13:17,120 Speaker 1: reference to Genmic Skimming's resignation, but a couple of days 236 00:13:17,200 --> 00:13:19,439 Speaker 1: later they put out a statement saying, we're doing an 237 00:13:19,440 --> 00:13:25,640 Speaker 1: independent review of how police IT systems can be, you know, 238 00:13:25,679 --> 00:13:27,760 Speaker 1: make sure that they're fully safeguarded and that no one 239 00:13:27,800 --> 00:13:32,880 Speaker 1: can access material inappropriately. That wasn't you know, there was 240 00:13:32,920 --> 00:13:36,040 Speaker 1: no direct reference to what had happened with Genemic Skimming, 241 00:13:36,040 --> 00:13:36,960 Speaker 1: but clearly. 242 00:13:36,880 --> 00:13:39,360 Speaker 4: There is there is a connection there. So you know, 243 00:13:39,440 --> 00:13:41,040 Speaker 4: this is a big story for the police. 244 00:13:41,120 --> 00:13:44,000 Speaker 1: This is the potential to go really sideways for them 245 00:13:44,040 --> 00:13:48,559 Speaker 1: and really impact on their reputation. But I'm pretty sure 246 00:13:48,600 --> 00:13:50,480 Speaker 1: in the fullness of time there will be a lot 247 00:13:50,520 --> 00:13:53,079 Speaker 1: of answers, a lot of the unanswered questions will be answered. 248 00:13:53,520 --> 00:13:56,480 Speaker 3: What happens next, Jared, Well, we're. 249 00:13:56,360 --> 00:13:57,920 Speaker 4: Going to be in a bit of a holding pattern here. 250 00:13:58,040 --> 00:14:01,160 Speaker 1: I mean, the police clearly issessing whether or not the 251 00:14:01,480 --> 00:14:07,160 Speaker 1: alleged objectional material on Mcskimmings electronic devices there may you know, 252 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:10,120 Speaker 1: that will need to be as normally these things are 253 00:14:10,160 --> 00:14:12,160 Speaker 1: sort of assessed by the Chief Censor and who makes 254 00:14:12,200 --> 00:14:16,480 Speaker 1: a ruling or a classification ruling on the material if 255 00:14:16,520 --> 00:14:19,160 Speaker 1: it's seems to be ejectionable. I would expect that criminal 256 00:14:19,240 --> 00:14:23,960 Speaker 1: charges would be laid against giem Mcskimming, which would obviously 257 00:14:25,840 --> 00:14:28,360 Speaker 1: be huge for the New Zealand Police and the public 258 00:14:28,360 --> 00:14:32,200 Speaker 1: to have such a senior person facing criminal charges. There's 259 00:14:32,240 --> 00:14:36,720 Speaker 1: also a separate so the Independent Police Conduct Authority is 260 00:14:36,760 --> 00:14:40,520 Speaker 1: also overseeing the criminal investigation by the police, but they 261 00:14:40,600 --> 00:14:43,920 Speaker 1: put out of statement last week to which sort of 262 00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:47,360 Speaker 1: confirmed that they were having oversight of the criminal investigations, 263 00:14:47,400 --> 00:14:52,640 Speaker 1: but also an independent sort of inquiry looking into how 264 00:14:52,720 --> 00:14:57,360 Speaker 1: the police handled the original complaints, the original allegations last 265 00:14:57,440 --> 00:15:00,880 Speaker 1: year which set this all off, and they will be 266 00:15:02,080 --> 00:15:05,640 Speaker 1: looking into who knew what and when and how and 267 00:15:05,720 --> 00:15:08,400 Speaker 1: who did what and I think that'll answer a lot 268 00:15:08,440 --> 00:15:11,560 Speaker 1: of questions as to how he got to this point. 269 00:15:11,680 --> 00:15:13,720 Speaker 1: Some of the most senior police officers in the country 270 00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:16,480 Speaker 1: are going to be interviewed as part of that. I 271 00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:19,400 Speaker 1: would expect that to be the former Police Commissioner Andy Costa, 272 00:15:19,760 --> 00:15:24,560 Speaker 1: who now heads up the Social Investment Agency. Media were 273 00:15:24,600 --> 00:15:27,600 Speaker 1: asking him last week some questions and he said, look, 274 00:15:27,640 --> 00:15:30,440 Speaker 1: I can't really comment right now because of these ongoing inquiries. 275 00:15:30,520 --> 00:15:32,920 Speaker 1: But in the fullness of time, I'll be able to 276 00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:36,120 Speaker 1: give my version of events as well. So there's a 277 00:15:36,160 --> 00:15:39,840 Speaker 1: lot to play out here, both for mc skimming and 278 00:15:39,960 --> 00:15:43,720 Speaker 1: the White Police executive I think as well. You know, 279 00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:47,520 Speaker 1: it's obviously going to have political ramifications as well for 280 00:15:47,560 --> 00:15:51,560 Speaker 1: the government they are. They've come in as a law 281 00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:54,040 Speaker 1: and order government and they've come in at a time 282 00:15:54,080 --> 00:15:55,920 Speaker 1: they've got to get a new police commissioner in place, 283 00:15:55,920 --> 00:15:59,120 Speaker 1: so they've put in there to sort of to roll 284 00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:02,480 Speaker 1: out there sort of policy programs, and you're overshadowing all 285 00:16:02,520 --> 00:16:04,360 Speaker 1: of that work at the moment is the fact that 286 00:16:05,560 --> 00:16:07,880 Speaker 1: you know, the second most powerful police offers in the 287 00:16:07,880 --> 00:16:12,640 Speaker 1: country resigned last week and space thing serious, potentially serious 288 00:16:12,680 --> 00:16:13,640 Speaker 1: coming allegations. 289 00:16:13,720 --> 00:16:16,040 Speaker 4: So there's a lot more to play out here. 290 00:16:16,520 --> 00:16:18,280 Speaker 3: Thanks for joining us, Jared. 291 00:16:18,360 --> 00:16:19,520 Speaker 4: No problem, Chelsea. Thank you. 292 00:16:22,680 --> 00:16:25,800 Speaker 2: That's it for this episode of The Front Page. You 293 00:16:25,840 --> 00:16:29,640 Speaker 2: can read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage 294 00:16:29,680 --> 00:16:33,720 Speaker 2: at enzdherld dot co dot nz. The Front Page is 295 00:16:33,720 --> 00:16:37,480 Speaker 2: produced by Ethan Sills and Richard Martin, who is also 296 00:16:37,640 --> 00:16:38,720 Speaker 2: our sound engineer. 297 00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:40,720 Speaker 3: I'm Chelsea Daniels. 298 00:16:41,280 --> 00:16:44,440 Speaker 2: Subscribe to the Front Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you 299 00:16:44,480 --> 00:16:45,479 Speaker 2: get your podcasts 300 00:16:45,800 --> 00:16:49,600 Speaker 3: And tune in tomorrow for another look behind the headlines.