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Speaker 1: Now back to that warning letter that the Chair of

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Speaker 1: the Reserve Bank sent to Treasury over Adrian All. What

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Speaker 1: happened was Treasury was getting ready to release the minutes

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Speaker 1: of a meeting between Adrian Or and Treasury officials. They

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Speaker 1: told this is Treasury. They told the Reserve Bank chair

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Speaker 1: Neil quickly they were going to do it, which prompted

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Speaker 1: him to email back that it would immediately destroy the

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Speaker 1: goodwill between the two organizations if it happened. Jenetibscherny is

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Speaker 1: The Herald's Wellington Business editor and with us Hello Jane, Hi. Ever,

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Speaker 1: it's pretty extraordinary.

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Speaker 2: Yes, I mean immediately destroy the good will. That is

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Speaker 2: pretty strong language. Now I have seen the minute that

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Speaker 2: was taken after a meeting on February twenty four, shortly

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Speaker 2: before Adrianau resigned. This was a meeting between Nikola Willis,

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Speaker 2: Adrian Or, the head of the Treasury in Rennie, the

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Speaker 2: Board of the Reserve Bank, Neil Quigley, and some other staff.

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Speaker 2: And you know, to be honest, there was nothing dramatic

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Speaker 2: about this minute. I don't understand what the what the

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Speaker 2: drama is. So the minute at the minute said that

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Speaker 2: Adrian Or made it clear that he disagreed with the

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Speaker 2: Treasury over the amount of government funding he thought, you know,

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Speaker 2: the Reserve Bank needed. The minutes also say that he

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Speaker 2: expressed his frustration regarding the relationship between the Reserve Bank

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Speaker 2: and Treasury, and then he left the meeting. Now, the

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Speaker 2: minute suggests he left the meeting early. I had that confirmed.

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Speaker 2: He did leave before he was meant to. Did he

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Speaker 2: leave quietly? Did he storm out? We don't know, you know,

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Speaker 2: but I don't think it is crazy for it to

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Speaker 2: be noted that there was a disagreement between two departments.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it does seem quite wild. Is it possible that actually,

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Speaker 1: is it possible that what made Neil quickly so upset

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Speaker 1: is because he was in the meeting and he knew

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Speaker 1: how it went down. And any kind of any kind

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Speaker 1: of confirmation, even if it is a mild confirmation, is

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Speaker 1: not a great confirmation.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Look, presumably, And I think at that time things

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Speaker 2: were really rocky, Like we know through other information release,

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Speaker 2: Adrian or raised his voice in another meeting with a

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Speaker 2: staff member from Treasury over this whole funding issue. You know,

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Speaker 2: Adrian thought the Reserve Bank needed a lot more funding.

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Speaker 2: So things were tense and you know, as we've realized

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Speaker 2: the way that the information came out was really vague.

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Speaker 2: So you know, it just doesn't help. It's one of

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Speaker 2: these these situations where things obviously weren't great, but it doesn't.

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Speaker 2: It's almost like at the at this point, the cover

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Speaker 2: up is worse than the crime.

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Speaker 1: Ages ago, ages ago, though right it totally it jumped

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Speaker 1: the shark a long time ago. I'll tell you what's

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Speaker 1: fascinating is that he was angry that Treasury had even

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Speaker 1: kept notes, which I think is interesting. But also then

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Speaker 1: you have a look at the Director of Legal Services,

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Speaker 1: Nick McBride, who writes from from the Reserve Bank to

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Speaker 1: Treasury and says, even if the note tries to be

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Speaker 1: quite careful with its summary, recording such details of the

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Speaker 1: discussions and closing, it would undoubtedly inhibit future expression of

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Speaker 1: blah blah blah blahlah. But heat point, I mean, what

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Speaker 1: he's basically made quite clear there is that the version

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Speaker 1: that we've got is a very tame version of what

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Speaker 1: actually went down.

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Speaker 2: Well, I mean, I don't know, it looks like it,

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Speaker 2: and you know, I don't I've never worked in the

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Speaker 2: public sector. I don't understand the risk of version that

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Speaker 2: there seems to be around these things. But historically there

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Speaker 2: has been tension between the Reserve Bank and the Treasury.

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Speaker 2: I can think of numerous examples of this, and you know,

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Speaker 2: it's healthy for there to be some tension between the two,

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Speaker 2: and there is tension between different government departments. I mean,

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Speaker 2: we've seen this recently with this whole banking inquiry competition issue,

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Speaker 2: where we had the Commerce Commission say the Reserve Bank

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Speaker 2: should change its bank capital rules and then Adrian all

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Speaker 2: say no, and then the Reserve Bank come back and say, Okay,

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Speaker 2: we will change the rules. So I don't really think

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Speaker 2: it's the end of the world now, Heather. I do

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Speaker 2: have some other news for you today that's the related

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Speaker 2: to this. I've heard back from the Ombudsman this afternoon.

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Speaker 2: I was one of many people who made comp plaints

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Speaker 2: about the way the Reserve Bank had released information about

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Speaker 2: Adriana's resignation. The Omusman has decided that, you know, the

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Speaker 2: Reserve Bank was in fact entitled to withhold the information

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Speaker 2: it has, but that there is an overriding public interest

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Speaker 2: in the Reserve Bank releasing a summary timeline of the

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Speaker 2: key information requested. So it sounds like we will get

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Speaker 2: a summary timeline of information, so we will get a

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Speaker 2: little bit more, but not necessarily a whole lot more

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Speaker 2: to answer the questions which I had, which is quite honestly,

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Speaker 2: why did he resign? You know, did he choose to

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Speaker 2: resign or was he kind of push to resign?

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Speaker 1: Personal decision? Don't you know?

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Speaker 2: Jene's purpose about yes? And actually I should just quickly

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Speaker 2: credit Michael Riddell, who's the person who made these official

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Speaker 2: information requests, and my colleague Jamie Insl who wrote about

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Speaker 2: it for The Hero.

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Speaker 1: Thank you for they Hey, listen, have a look at

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Speaker 1: this stuff and then let us know if there's anything

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Speaker 1: in it. And I appreciate everything about this a nerdual

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Speaker 1: tenacity Jane Tipschraney, The Herald's Wellington Business editor. Interesting. What

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Speaker 1: I didn't mention earlier is that Nikola Willis has had

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Speaker 1: to disagree with Neil quickly again. Nichola Willis told The

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Speaker 1: Herald she was aware of Nick Neil Quigley's email. I

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Speaker 1: disagree with the views put forward by the Chair because

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Speaker 1: I think it's entirely appropriate for treasury officials to take

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Speaker 1: minutes of a significant government meeting. She said, I don't

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Speaker 1: know how many more times Nichola Willis can disagree with

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Speaker 1: Neil Quickley and yet retain him in the position. Yes,

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Speaker 1: it's bloody awkward.

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Speaker 2: For more from Heather Duplessy Allen Drive, Listen live to

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Speaker 2: news Talks it'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow

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