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Speaker 1: Well, who hasn't spent some time over the holidays Following

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Speaker 1: the headline that is the new first Buddy Elon Musky

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Speaker 1: as an office in the West Wing seemingly has the

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Speaker 1: President's here. Dinnis Neil knows him very well. He's a

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Speaker 1: former host at CNBC and Fox Business. His new book

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Speaker 1: is called The Leadership Genius of Elon Musk, and Dennis

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Speaker 1: Needles with us from New York.

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Speaker 2: Good morning, It's great to see you.

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Speaker 1: So you are, you know, an expert on Elon. We

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Speaker 1: can't talk about Elon without talking about Donald just generally.

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Speaker 1: What have you made of the last week or so?

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Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, it is unbelievable. You know, a founding belief.

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Speaker 3: My new book, The Leadership Genius Elon Musk, offers eleven lessons.

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Speaker 2: Of Elon, like how does he succeed? How does he live?

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Speaker 2: And what can we borrow from that?

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Speaker 3: Well, the one founding belief of Elon's is that we

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Speaker 3: very well be made, maybe living inside a huge computer

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Speaker 3: simulation operated by somebody somewhere far off in the future. Now,

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Speaker 3: this frees him up to take huge risk to do

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Speaker 3: things no one else will do, right, But it also

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Speaker 3: means that who's ever running that simulation.

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Speaker 2: They wouldn't run it for boring us. They run it

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Speaker 2: for the most entertaining unexpected outcomes. And can you believe

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Speaker 2: the past week is definitely the most unexpected outcome of

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Speaker 2: all Trump all those people trying to stop him from

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Speaker 2: getting into office.

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Speaker 3: Elon coming alongside Trump and helping him get into office

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Speaker 3: the very opposite outcome of what was expected or what

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Speaker 3: people tried to make happen. And that's another lesson of

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Speaker 3: Elon that the most likely outcome often is the most

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Speaker 3: ironic one, the most opposite of what was expected. And

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Speaker 3: that's in part because if this is a simulation, they'd want.

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Speaker 2: It to be really entertaining.

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Speaker 1: Now do you reckon it's a simulation.

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Speaker 2: You know the weird thing Mike is. At first, I

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Speaker 2: guess thought he's kidding, He's kidding.

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Speaker 3: No, But then I did ten years worth of research

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Speaker 3: into how long he's been talking about it, and I

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Speaker 3: looked at the science of it, and I interviewed a

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Speaker 3: physicist named Melvin Bobson at a UK university whose name

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Speaker 3: is escaped me just now. And Melvin came up with

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Speaker 3: the second law of infodynamics. Melvin the physicists found it

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Speaker 3: across all of the universe, all of nature. This weird

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Speaker 3: thing happens. Information is reducing itself all the time. The

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Speaker 3: first COVID nineteen.

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Speaker 2: Virus had you know, a plethora of base pairs of DNA,

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Speaker 2: but as it mutated mutinator, it got less and less

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Speaker 2: and less and less, even though it did the same job.

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Speaker 2: Everywhere in nature is reducing, and this physinessist says, you know,

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Speaker 2: if this were a computer simulation, you'd want to save

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Speaker 2: on storage and processing power as much as possible. So

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Speaker 2: maybe this is proof there's a simulation. So it starts

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Speaker 2: to get very fun. But here's the one thing. Even

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Speaker 2: if we don't.

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Speaker 3: Believe literally it's a simulation technologyally it could be. You know,

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Speaker 3: if you look at where we came. Elon says from

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Speaker 3: Pong in nineteen seventy, just kind of two little bits

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Speaker 3: of light hitting a ball back and forth against a

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Speaker 3: black background into these three D video realistic you're inside,

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Speaker 3: you know, doom, you know, shooting monsters. Well, if you

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Speaker 3: can advance that much in seventy years, imagine what could

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Speaker 3: do in ten thousand years. So it would definitely be

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Speaker 3: true ten thousand years from now to have a simulation

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Speaker 3: that's so undetectable from reality that you don't even know it.

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Speaker 3: And if it's true in ten thousand years, and you

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Speaker 3: look at the Earth as about four four billion years.

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Speaker 2: Old, that's something like four hundred thousand or four million

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Speaker 2: different ten thousand year patches in which it could have happened.

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Speaker 2: The thought that's never happened until ten thousand years from

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Speaker 2: now seems unlikely. So Elon therefore, says, and if there's

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Speaker 2: one simulation, there's probably billions a lot of people playing simulations. Jesus,

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Speaker 2: So aren't the chances billions to one in favor of simulation?

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Speaker 2: But let's say we reject all that. It's just fun

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Speaker 2: to think what if it were it? Lets us look

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Speaker 2: at the world in a different way. I've got a

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Speaker 2: new job offer, but it's crazy, it's such a high risk.

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Speaker 2: Well maybe I should take it because this could all

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Speaker 2: be a video game. I've just had a terrible loss.

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Speaker 2: My wife has left me, divorced me. You know, as

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Speaker 2: hard as it is, if I could put on glasses

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Speaker 2: that say, hey man, this is all fake, this is

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Speaker 2: all just a simulation, maybe I could heal a little

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Speaker 2: bit and feel a little more philosophical about it and

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Speaker 2: kind of remove myself from it. There's one more thing

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Speaker 2: about this thing, okay, that I throw in there. Ketamine,

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Speaker 2: a drug that used to be purely a hospital painkiller

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Speaker 2: for surgical patients and now is a therapy for depression.

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Speaker 2: My own doctor fifteen years quit his practice to join

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Speaker 2: a ketamine company. Ketamine is very popular with Elon, and

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Speaker 2: I'm told that when you take ketamine and you're sitting there,

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Speaker 2: there comes a point where you are dissociated from the

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Speaker 2: picture in front of you. You are suddenly sitting on high.

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Speaker 2: Everything's super sharply defined, and it's as if everything is

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Speaker 2: a prop It's as if all of it is an illusion,

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Speaker 2: and you suddenly realize that it's like what the materialists

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Speaker 2: said one hundred and fifty years ago. This desk is

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Speaker 2: here only because I think this desk is here. It

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Speaker 2: has substance only because my mind gives it that. So

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Speaker 2: it starts to get.

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Speaker 3: Really quite fascinating. And the publisher warned me, and talking

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Speaker 3: about the book, not to start there. It's just too weird.

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Speaker 3: I've just started with you know less than number five.

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Speaker 3: Most people are loafers, work.

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Speaker 2: Harder than you ever before, and yet I remained fascinated

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Speaker 2: by its possibilities.

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Speaker 1: What are you? How much in the genius of Musk?

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Speaker 1: How much is genius and how much is pure insanity?

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Speaker 2: Oh? I think it's ninety percent genius. The guy is unbelievable.

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Speaker 3: I mean, we've never seen and I've been understood of

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Speaker 3: a business reporter Wall Street Journal, managing under of Forbes,

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Speaker 3: anchor at CNBC, anchor at Fox Business for thirty plus years,

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Speaker 3: and I've never seen anything like it. It's one thing

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Speaker 3: to see Jeff Bezos, who once crashed a dinner party

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Speaker 3: of mine and sat with me for an hour and

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Speaker 3: a half.

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Speaker 2: Great guy, fantastic laugh, amazing ambition.

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Speaker 3: But he's been great at one thing, and on Blue

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Speaker 3: Origin his space rocket stuff, you get the feeling he's

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Speaker 3: not that deeply involved. He leaves it to the engineers.

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Speaker 3: Elon is super successful on half of different fronts and companies,

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Speaker 3: and he gets deeply involved in each thing and is

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Speaker 3: actually technically involved. And he continually amazes the engineers around

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Speaker 3: him when he comes up with solutions that they just

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Speaker 3: don't see, because then you get to that ten percent

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Speaker 3: insanity that gives them that extra ability to see things

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Speaker 3: that most people don't.

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Speaker 1: All right, Dennis, So tell me Dennis about Tiesla. See,

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Speaker 1: I'm not a massive fan of Tesla. The genius I

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Speaker 1: think of what he did with Tiesla was he beat

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Speaker 1: everybody to it. So you know, he had an EV

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Speaker 1: before the world hit an EV. But now he's going

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Speaker 1: to get beaten by the Chinese and badly. So what's

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Speaker 1: you know, what's genius about that?

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Speaker 2: Okay?

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Speaker 3: So first he bought into Tesla right with his own money.

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Speaker 3: He staked I think seventy million, which was at the

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Speaker 3: time a substantial portion of his own wealth, which no

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Speaker 3: one ever does. You raise other people's money. He did

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Speaker 3: that and made it into something better than it ever

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Speaker 3: would have been. But to me, the biggest gift of

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Speaker 3: Tesla is I always said along I was an opponent

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Speaker 3: of green policy. I thought it's there is no crisis.

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Speaker 3: The profit motive and technological advance will take care of

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Speaker 3: any threat. The thought that a four billion years old

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Speaker 3: Earth suddenly is in danger only because of one hundred

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Speaker 3: years of industrial use by humans seems a little arrogant, okay.

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Speaker 3: And yet Tesla was a great car. People who drive

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Speaker 3: buy it and drive it say his self driving goes

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Speaker 3: something like one and a half million or two million

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Speaker 3: miles without an accident.

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Speaker 2: If you look at the whole fleet, that is.

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Speaker 3: Three times the links without an accident of regular cars

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Speaker 3: made by Detroit. He made a car that was better

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Speaker 3: than other cars, never mind whether it's electric or what

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Speaker 3: it was, was just a great car, and people love it.

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Speaker 3: They feel out affection. But one other thing, there's this

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Speaker 3: synergy that goes on. But among all these different Elon businesses.

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Speaker 3: So his EXAI engine AI check bought learns from reading stuff. Right, Well,

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Speaker 3: it's able to read six thousand messages per second posted

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Speaker 3: to the x platform that Elon owns. Meanwhile, the Tesla car,

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Speaker 3: its self driving system changed a year or two ago

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Speaker 3: over from lines of computer code. If then do this,

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Speaker 3: If then then do that to instead reacting to video,

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Speaker 3: eliminating the computer code in favor of ingested video. Very

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Speaker 3: few other AI efforts have been able to do this. Now,

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Speaker 3: all that information that ingests also can be fed to

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Speaker 3: x AI, the platform that learns only by seeing and

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Speaker 3: reading more things. So there's a way it hooks into everything.

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Speaker 3: But then when he takes Tesla and he says, you know,

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Speaker 3: if you're going on vacation for a month. There's no

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Speaker 3: reason your car should sit idle. We can just order

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Speaker 3: it up and have it go pick up people and

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Speaker 3: get paid for you and you don't have to do

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Speaker 3: anything because but we have self driving. So it ends

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Speaker 3: up becoming its own taxi fleet. And then you look,

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Speaker 3: Tesla has this robodies making. Have you seen this thing?

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Speaker 3: It's human sized. And by the way, one of the

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Speaker 3: most fascinating things is that the human hand is one

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Speaker 3: of the hardest things to replicate. Five fingers. It's why

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Speaker 3: cartoon characters only have three, and yet this thing has

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Speaker 3: five four fingers and a thumb perfectly operating. All right, Now,

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Speaker 3: this thing supposed to make Tesla cars is going to

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Speaker 3: end up he thinks, being thousands of them in the home, right,

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Speaker 3: But it also is ingesting everything, and it can feed

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Speaker 3: that further to the AI engine. Its arm can end

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Speaker 3: up being attached to an amputee thirty Now, let's say

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Speaker 3: in the future using the brain chip at his Neuralink

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Speaker 3: brain ship company, so that an amputee could be using

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Speaker 3: the brain chip to operate this mechanical arm.

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Speaker 2: And that is from Olympus. I mean, so no one

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Speaker 2: else sees how it all fits together, and I think Elon.

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Speaker 1: Does what do you reading he wants with Trump?

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Speaker 3: I truly believe he never would have gotten involved if

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Speaker 3: he hadn't felt that America was about truly to tumble

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Speaker 3: down into the woke mind virus and never come back

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Speaker 3: from it. I think he did so reluctantly. He knows

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Speaker 3: that he turns off half the audience, and he wants

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Speaker 3: one hundred percent of the audience buying Tesla cars. All right,

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Speaker 3: But and also because he has the zeal of a convert.

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Speaker 3: He is an adopted American, he became a US citizen.

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Speaker 3: He has more appreciation for the First Amendment right to

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Speaker 3: freedom of speech and free expression than most Americans. Do

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Speaker 3: you know something like this is shocking to me? When

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Speaker 3: I did the research on it, A third of Americans

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Speaker 3: believe that preventing hate speech, which is protected by our

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Speaker 3: First Amendment, preventing hate speech is more important than ensuring

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Speaker 3: free speech. Well, you bunch of whimps and babies, how

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Speaker 3: about you turn the channel. How about you don't listen

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Speaker 3: to the hate speech. It's so upcter it makes you

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Speaker 3: feel unsafe.

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Speaker 2: You seek They actually talk about safe spaces at university campuses.

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Speaker 3: What a bunch of babies. I can't even believe that

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Speaker 3: we got into a whole problem when we began to

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Speaker 3: accept this term called harmful content, as if words they're

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Speaker 3: mean can leap off the screen and smack you in

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Speaker 3: the face. And so when someone smacks you in the face,

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Speaker 3: you blame the words that made them do that, when

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Speaker 3: you should blame the person that smacked you in the face.

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Speaker 3: Stop with this, because as soon as you decide content

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Speaker 3: can be harmful, well then now we got to restrain it.

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Speaker 2: We got a censor it, don't we.

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Speaker 3: And that is what Elon Musk utterly blew apart by

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Speaker 3: spending forty four billion dollars, most of it his money

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Speaker 3: and not insane expense, by spending that to buy Twitter,

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Speaker 3: read Avid X and tell government, no, we're not going

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Speaker 3: to censor thousands of voices that you don't like to hear.

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Speaker 2: No weird thing happened.

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Speaker 3: All social media continued censoring after the Twitter files came out,

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Speaker 3: thanks to Elon Musk and Matt Taibi, the independent journalist

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Speaker 3: and the guys he works with.

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Speaker 2: All right, so so, but now.

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Speaker 3: Finally Mark Zuckerberg just came out the other day and said, look,

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Speaker 3: we're sorry, man, we like bowed the government. We censored

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Speaker 3: like crazy. We want to literally, he said, quote restore

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Speaker 3: free expression to Facebook, threads, Instagram. Now he says we're

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Speaker 3: going to get rid of the fact checking based on

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Speaker 3: liberal media who are biased. Clearly, he says, we're going

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Speaker 3: to do community notes the way X does. So that

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Speaker 3: means that much of the social media world is going

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Speaker 3: to go toward the X approach. And yet the media

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Speaker 3: and politicians told us he had destroyed Twitter, it was

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Speaker 3: going to die. He's ruined it, and yet today it's

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Speaker 3: stronger than ever before. It is the most powerful media

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Speaker 3: platform in the world. And he did that, and he

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Speaker 3: did the Trump thing at considerable risk, just because he

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Speaker 3: felt like there was no other choice. But how long Mike,

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Speaker 3: before that relationship gets rendered asunder the new chief of staff,

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Speaker 3: this woman that Trump put in, you know, Mark Cuban,

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Speaker 3: the billionaire, said that he doesn't surround himself with strong women,

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Speaker 3: and Trump is the first president to ever have a

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Speaker 3: woman as chief of staff. She you know, Elon has

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Speaker 3: an office in the executive wing. Okay, so he's not

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Speaker 3: in the White House, and she's now making sure he

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Speaker 3: doesn't have direct contact with Trump unless he goes through her,

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Speaker 3: and that's got to be frustrating for him because he's

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Speaker 3: been hanging out and living at mar A Lago for

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Speaker 3: weeks and like partying with Baron and hanging with Trump.

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Speaker 3: But then once he becomes president, you get kind of

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Speaker 3: secunded or secreted and no one can get to you.

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Speaker 3: And it's got to be frustrating. And I know that

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Speaker 3: the Democrats and the media are working hard as they

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Speaker 3: can and some Trump allies to break up that relationship.

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Speaker 2: They fear it.

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Speaker 1: Dennis got a guy that I appreciate your time, Dinners, Neil.

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Speaker 1: The book is the leadership genius of Elon Musk.

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Speaker 2: For more from the Mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to

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Speaker 2: News Talks at b from six am weekdays, or follow

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Speaker 2: the podcast on iHeartRadio