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Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from News Talk sed B.

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Speaker 1: Follow this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Hello great, you said us.

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Speaker 3: Welcome to man Tyl Full Show pocast number one six

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Speaker 3: five for the twenty first of July ment some Monday.

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Speaker 3: Had a fantastic show and unfortunately we got embedded and

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Speaker 3: boring in c chat that sucked the absolute life out

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Speaker 3: of me and we didn't get round to what I

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Speaker 3: wanted to talk about, which was the CEO. We got

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Speaker 3: there for half an hour.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's so many phone calls on that.

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Speaker 3: The CEO and the bloody ye.

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Speaker 4: Lady.

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Speaker 3: But so we only have a juicy little half hour

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Speaker 3: of gossip at the India.

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Speaker 2: But it was a good half hour of pass it

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Speaker 2: wasn't it.

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Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah, And we had some great chats about lying

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Speaker 3: on the CV. So ultimately a good show. But I

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Speaker 3: could have done with another hour on that salacious, sexy

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Speaker 3: topic of infidelity.

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Speaker 2: We might bring it back tomorrow maybe, Yeah, plenty more

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Speaker 2: to come in that story. But download, subscribe, give us

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Speaker 2: a review, and give a task Kim love you.

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Speaker 1: The big stories, the big issue, the big trends, and

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Speaker 1: everything in between. Matt Heath and Tyler Adams afternoons News

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Speaker 1: Talk said the welcome into Monday.

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Speaker 2: Hope you're having a great day and you had a

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Speaker 2: fantastic weekend as well. Awesome to have your company as

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Speaker 2: it always is.

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Speaker 3: You get a Tyler one. And before we get on

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Speaker 3: to how much you should lie on your CV or not,

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Speaker 3: I've got a question for you, yep and everyone. So

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Speaker 3: I was out at a restaurant in the weekend. I

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Speaker 3: want to really ask the question about how demanding you

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Speaker 3: can be at a restaurant. So I was out with

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Speaker 3: my partner and her mum for her mum's birthday. Nice

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Speaker 3: happy birthday, Rosie. And I was sitting there and my

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Speaker 3: partner goes, oh, the light here, it's too bright. And

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Speaker 3: she goes, I'm going to ask them to turn the

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Speaker 3: light down, and I said, you categorically cannot in a

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Speaker 3: restaurant ask them to change the lighting setting.

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Speaker 2: You can't.

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Speaker 3: That's too far. That's you can ask for a glass

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Speaker 3: of order. You can maybe asked to taste the wine

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Speaker 3: before they pour it. I don't know, depending on how

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Speaker 3: flash places now, but I was mortified. As a good

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Speaker 3: Southern land you get what you get and you don't

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Speaker 3: get upset. You cannot in my opinion, am I wrong?

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Speaker 3: Love to hear on nineteen nineteen. You cannot ask that

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Speaker 3: is outside of the remit of the the wait staff.

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Speaker 3: The lighting design is what it is.

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Speaker 2: I don't know. This is a great discussion. I love this.

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Speaker 2: I got a few follow up questions for you. How

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Speaker 2: much did you pay for the dinner?

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Speaker 3: How much do I pay for the dinner?

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Speaker 2: Yeah?

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Speaker 3: Wow, well the dinner was pretty expensive?

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Speaker 2: Okay? Well that it was a move?

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Speaker 5: Was it at?

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Speaker 3: It was at Kazuya Kazuya your Kazuya, which is which

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Speaker 3: is a nice Japanese restaurant on Simon Street in Lookland.

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Speaker 2: Yep, whoo. I'm just having a look at the menu now,

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Speaker 2: that's flash mate, where goo beef ebaloney put a crayfish

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Speaker 2: in there as well?

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Speaker 3: The tasting menuo Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, the premium seven course tasting menu. Yeah, lardie dah yeah.

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Speaker 2: I think for that price and I'm eving to look

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Speaker 2: at the price now, what was the price two hundred

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Speaker 2: and ten per person? Geez, geez, what a treat? I

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Speaker 2: would say, you're okay to ask for them to turn

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Speaker 2: the lights down a little bit. What if it was

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Speaker 2: the AC unit that was blasting and you were freezing

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Speaker 2: your butt off. At that point, you'd think, geez, can

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Speaker 2: I just ask them to crank the heating up a

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Speaker 2: little bit? But you are grin and bear at. You're

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Speaker 2: at a nice place. It's just a bit of bright lights.

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Speaker 2: Just look down.

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Speaker 3: It's just it's this thing that I talk about a

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Speaker 3: lot in this show called chronic dissatisfaction syndrome. You just

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Speaker 3: sit down.

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Speaker 2: It's okay.

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Speaker 3: You just suck it up as it is. You enjoy

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Speaker 3: the environment as it has been presented to you. You

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Speaker 3: don't sit there and immediately find things to be annoyed at.

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Speaker 3: The lights are slightly too bright. I just think it's

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Speaker 3: a wrong attitude to take towards the evening.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, all right, okay, I look the teachts are already

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Speaker 2: coming in thick and fast.

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Speaker 3: I have definitely asked for the music to be turned

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Speaker 3: down in restaurants because when I'm out with my elderly

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Speaker 3: parents and they are hard of hearing, it can be

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Speaker 3: incredibly difficult for them if the backcome music is too loud.

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Speaker 3: That's from Nikola. Well, yeah, that's different. That's different than

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Speaker 3: the lights. Music's too loud and your parents with their

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Speaker 3: hearing aids can't hear.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you don't want to be shelting at Grandad or

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Speaker 2: your parents.

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Speaker 3: Anyway, anyway we had to talk about I thought everyone

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Speaker 3: would support me and I could use it against my

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Speaker 3: lovely partner as proof that she's too fussy.

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Speaker 2: But no, no, no, no, full come in. It's not

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Speaker 2: of Tracy turning the lights down. It turns out, once again,

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Speaker 2: I'm the dick. You get used to that, mate, Right

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Speaker 2: our to today's show after three o'clock. Gone of the

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Speaker 2: days where you could have and a fear in a

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Speaker 2: public setting. In piece, it turns out in the Internet age,

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Speaker 2: we all know the cameras are always rolling and people's

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Speaker 2: worst moments draw millions of eyeballs as online audiences flock

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Speaker 2: and to weigh in, and such as the case for

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Speaker 2: Andy Byer and the chief executive of tech company Astronomer,

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Speaker 2: who last week was film cuddling with his human resources

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Speaker 2: chief at a Coldplay concert in Boston. It's gone everywhere.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's what everyone's been talking over the weekend. There's

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Speaker 3: been some very funny memes. Look who knows why, but

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Speaker 3: the CEO has stepped down, and there was comments from

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Speaker 3: his company about the standards they set. But what should

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Speaker 3: the penalty be for being caught cheating? You know, personally,

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Speaker 3: I don't care what my workmates are up to. And look,

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Speaker 3: I guarantee right now, whoever you are, where you are,

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Speaker 3: there's a good chance that someone that you're working with

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Speaker 3: is cheating.

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Speaker 2: Highly likely.

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Speaker 3: I mean it's a good chance you went to a

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Speaker 3: concert with another woman in the weekend and your partner,

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Speaker 3: lovely partner, may doesn't know about it. Good chance you

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Speaker 3: just didn't go viral on it. Yeah, but is it

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Speaker 3: any any of your works business that you've been cheating?

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Speaker 3: I know, what should the penalty for that be? In

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Speaker 3: twenty twenty five, we'll talk about that after three o'clock.

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Speaker 2: After two o'clock, a damning government briefing is raised significant

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Speaker 2: concerns about the credibility of NCEEA. So this document was

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Speaker 2: obtained by The Herald over the weekend and among the

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Speaker 2: red light alerts to Minister Stanford is that the flexibility

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Speaker 2: built into NCEA, including regarding what assessment students sit, mean

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Speaker 2: courses can be structured around those perceived to be easier

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Speaker 2: to accumulate credits. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Look, as a parent with kids that have done the

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Speaker 3: NCAA system. I just want to know exactly how well

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Speaker 3: my child is doing. I want to know the cold

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Speaker 3: hard facts. If they're rubbish at something, I want to

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Speaker 3: know that so they can either get better at it

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Speaker 3: and we can put some resources there, or they can

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Speaker 3: focus their energies on something that they're actually good at.

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Speaker 3: All we need, as far as I'm concerned as a parent,

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Speaker 3: is a cold heart percentage point yep, A cold hard

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Speaker 3: where they are at. If it's ten percent, I need

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Speaker 3: to know. If it's ninety percent, I need to know.

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Speaker 3: But I don't want to sugarcoated with funny words or whatever.

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Speaker 3: I just want to know exactly how they're doing. And

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Speaker 3: I want to be told straight to their face you

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Speaker 3: are doing very badly or you are doing very well,

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Speaker 3: and you want everyone to know.

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Speaker 2: Do you agree with that? Oh? Eight one hundred and

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Speaker 2: eighty ten eighty.

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Speaker 3: So I don't care if it's Cambridge or NCAA. Let's

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Speaker 3: get a systemhere that happens.

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Speaker 2: Yep, that is going to be a good chad after

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Speaker 2: talk clop it right now. Let's have a chat about

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Speaker 2: embellishing things on your CV. This after new Justice appointee

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Speaker 2: Farley Andrew Lesser says he's decided to resign from everything

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Speaker 2: after an investigation explore exposed rather than flaws in his CV.

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Speaker 2: So in June, Lessa was appointed of Visiting Justice, with

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Speaker 2: the power to investigate prisons and prisoner treatment. He does

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Speaker 2: have an impressive list of credentials, but a claim he

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Speaker 2: made in a speech at the University of Texas that

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Speaker 2: he had a jurist doctor that's a law degree at

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Speaker 2: Lale Yale turns out not to have been true. Here's

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Speaker 2: the quote from him, that degree doesn't exist. What I

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Speaker 2: meant by that is I have studied at Yale. It

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Speaker 2: was during COVID. It was an online course on governance. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: but I don't have a doctorate at Yale.

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Speaker 3: No, who says that who pretends to have a doctor

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Speaker 3: is a doctorate from Yale is quite something.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, to just say that you've got easy to pick apart,

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Speaker 2: isn't it? If anyone does the slightest bit of digging

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Speaker 2: on that, they can find out. But where do you.

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Speaker 3: Get into you are fantasis? Where do you get into

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Speaker 3: a position where you start saying things that are so

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Speaker 3: ridiculously untrue? But CVS in general, I know this isn't

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Speaker 3: a CV issue with him. But cvs are qualifications And

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Speaker 3: in general, have you lied on a CDV?

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Speaker 2: Because and how much?

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Speaker 3: Because I would say that most people kind of massage

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Speaker 3: a CV definitely, So how much lying on a CV

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Speaker 3: is okay? And are you an idiot if you don't

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Speaker 3: sort of just massage it from say I worked here

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Speaker 3: for three years too. I was an exemplary employee, much

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Speaker 3: loved by my fellow workers, and made a real difference

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Speaker 3: at this company for three years.

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Speaker 2: Team member attention to detail is top notch. But you're right,

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Speaker 2: I mean any sort of.

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Speaker 3: Have any weakness is working too hard.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm a perfectionist, but you're right. I mean, when

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Speaker 2: it comes to a CVN you've got to present what

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Speaker 2: you achieved at your previous job, and you are part

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Speaker 2: of a team that achieved that. You don't mention the

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Speaker 2: team members, you say and you CV. Surely most people

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Speaker 2: would do this. So I was a critical part of

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Speaker 2: achieving this particular goal. And then you set out what

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Speaker 2: that goal was. You don't just say you are a limming.

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Speaker 2: You were just one of twenty people involved in this project.

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Speaker 2: You claim ownership of that project. It was only got

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Speaker 2: across the line because of what I brought to that situation.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and say a secondary question on e one hundred

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Speaker 3: and eighty ten eighty. If you're an employer and you

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Speaker 3: find out that your employee has lied on their CV,

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Speaker 3: how do you feel about it? Is that immediate dismissal?

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Speaker 3: But what if they have lied on their CV and

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Speaker 3: they've ended up being a great employee anyway, and so

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Speaker 3: what they did to get over the hurdle for you

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Speaker 3: to hire them has ended up being a boon for

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Speaker 3: both of you. Then do you care? Do you care

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Speaker 3: if they've said they've got a doctorate from Yale and

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Speaker 3: it turns out that they're excellent on the floor of

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Speaker 3: nol Leaming or whatever you're.

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Speaker 2: Working out, Oh, eight, one hundred and eighty ten eighty.

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Speaker 2: I would hope on that question most employers, unless the

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Speaker 2: lie was incredibly far featured or even damaging to the company,

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Speaker 2: would you care? Because half the hassle of trying to

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Speaker 2: find a good worker is trying to find a good worker.

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Speaker 2: You can go through all the pilava of looking at

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Speaker 2: a CV and doing multiple interviews and a lot of

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Speaker 2: people still get duds. So if you've got someone who's

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Speaker 2: told a few porky's on their CV, but it turns

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Speaker 2: out to be an excellent worker. Why would you give

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Speaker 2: a stuff? Surely you'd look past that.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well, eight hundred and eighty ten eighty What makes

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Speaker 3: a good CV if you're writing a CV, as a

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Speaker 3: good CV include not necessarily lying, but some stretching of

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Speaker 3: the truth. And are you an idiot if you tell

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Speaker 3: the full truth on your CV?

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Speaker 2: Oh, eight hundred and eighty ten eighty is the number

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Speaker 2: to call. It is sixteen past one.

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Speaker 1: The big stories, the big issues, the big trends, and

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Speaker 1: everything in between. Matt Heathan Taylor Adams. Afternoons used talks.

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Speaker 2: Be very good afternoons. You we're talking about cvs. Have

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Speaker 2: you ever embellished on your CV? Is that the normal

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Speaker 2: thing to do? You talk up your experiences that you've

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Speaker 2: had in the past to make you stand out. It's

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Speaker 2: on the back of a gentleman who has resigned from

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Speaker 2: all other jobs that he's got after he was found

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Speaker 2: out to have made a bit of a pulky about

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Speaker 2: a doctorate he got at Yale.

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Speaker 3: As this lying, says Robert. As I approached my sixties

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Speaker 3: and beyond, I started leaving things out of my CV

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Speaker 3: and for fear that they'd think I'm an old bloke.

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Speaker 3: That's an interesting one. So you've got some great things

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Speaker 3: on your CV, but there's just slightly too many of

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Speaker 3: them in the years add up. Yeah, I would say

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Speaker 3: that anyone that's thinking of not employing someone because they're

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Speaker 3: in their late fifties or sixties as an idiot. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: I agree, because you're going to get some of your

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Speaker 3: best employees around that age exactly, experience, you know, dedication,

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Speaker 3: all those kind of things come with age.

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Speaker 2: Yep, one hundred percent. Stephanie, how are you.

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Speaker 6: Hi?

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Speaker 7: Good?

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Speaker 2: And what's your view on on CVS and embellishing or

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Speaker 2: potentially even telling a few white lives.

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Speaker 7: No, I've had a care and so I've employed a

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Speaker 7: lot of people and built a lot of teams. And

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Speaker 7: the most important thing I think you can have in

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Speaker 7: your work environment is trust. It's a value that you

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Speaker 7: have to have in order to build a solid team.

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Speaker 7: And you know and enjoy and appreciate each other and

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Speaker 7: trust each other and hard work, attitude and trust are

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Speaker 7: really important. So I think that lying isn't a good value.

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Speaker 7: It's against our values, and it was certainly against things

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Speaker 7: that I have all my working life, and I actually

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Speaker 7: ended up unfortunately hiring a couple of people have had

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Speaker 7: lied and then by downate it the most sneaky damn

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Speaker 7: things to other people and their teams and go far

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Speaker 7: for them. Because they're live, they're not putting out you

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Speaker 7: can't trust them. So it's a big deal when your

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Speaker 7: values don't line was the integrity of the organization and

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Speaker 7: the team working.

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Speaker 3: Is it possible though, that they desperately want and need

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Speaker 3: this job and so the CV and maybe it's something

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Speaker 3: like I don't know, they slightly upgrade the job title

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Speaker 3: that had at another place from from to or they

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Speaker 3: I don't know, they sort of changed the dates a

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Speaker 3: little bit, or you know, they stretched slightly the credentials.

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Speaker 2: You know, Like, is that really that bad?

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Speaker 7: Well, I think it is because it's not telling the truth.

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Speaker 4: I thought.

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Speaker 7: You know, someone earlier just said something like, you know

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Speaker 7: you can say in your TV and yours are part

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Speaker 7: of that team. If you just think I was a

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Speaker 7: part of that team, that we achieved it in my

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Speaker 7: heart in that team's development or achievements or whatever, I

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Speaker 7: do this and this and that and that. I think

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Speaker 7: that's really powerful. And when you're interviewing someone to FORTI,

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Speaker 7: you'll follow up on that, and then a good person

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Speaker 7: who's interviewing will certainly pursue and actually uncover mostly whether

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Speaker 7: or not people are all actually they should do.

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Speaker 2: And that's the point, Stephanie, isn't it? Sorry? You carry on? Sorry?

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Speaker 2: Say that part again?

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Speaker 7: You've got I mean, if you've got a company you're

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Speaker 7: trying to run with integrity, look after your customers, hopefully

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Speaker 7: make a positive bottom line, you have to have people

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Speaker 7: you can trust who are in your team.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, But to your point about getting to the interview stage,

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Speaker 2: because that's where I sit with people who embellish or

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Speaker 2: maybe look make themselves look a bit better than they

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Speaker 2: actually are at their previous position. To me, that is

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Speaker 2: to get to the interview stage. And at that point

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Speaker 2: it's up to the interviewer to get a measure of

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Speaker 2: the person that they are talking to and to ask

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Speaker 2: those questions, to try and break down some of those

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Speaker 2: things that they might have questions over. So I've got

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Speaker 2: no problem with people embellishing and making themselves look like

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Speaker 2: a fantastic candidate, but by maybe tweaking a few of

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Speaker 2: their skills to get to that stage and then at

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Speaker 2: that point that's on the employer, isn't it.

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Speaker 7: Well, no, I just agree because I mean a lie,

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Speaker 7: a lie, you know you're not you're not telling the truth.

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Speaker 7: And I can remember someone once years and years ago,

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Speaker 7: they they applied for a job and they knew that

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Speaker 7: lots of people are the other people were, and they

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Speaker 7: used a particular calligraphy on the on the application m hm.

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Speaker 7: And I mean they because you get lots and lots

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Speaker 7: of people submitting in there having their cvs. But this

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Speaker 7: person drew attention to themselves for doing something different and

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Speaker 7: I obviously did it themselves. And so yes, that came

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Speaker 7: to it in the pile and came up to interview.

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Speaker 7: And whilst the person doesn't have probably a lot of

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Speaker 7: us experienced some of the others. I took that as

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Speaker 7: being really good because they had initiative and they didn't lie.

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Speaker 7: That's what they did. They consequently used that to advance

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Speaker 7: several different ways. So no, I'm not being on liars

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Speaker 7: because they turn out to be self serving in a team.

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Speaker 7: And also the company doesn't benefit because they can they

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Speaker 7: don't serve the customers to the best of their efforts

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Speaker 7: all the time. They put themselves. First, I don't approve

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Speaker 7: of lying, I really don't. I think it's just sets

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Speaker 7: the business if everyone on the team really knows they

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Speaker 7: can trust it. God, they had so many people who

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Speaker 7: just thin would be staggered about. And they took my

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Speaker 7: breath away because how could they be so awful to

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Speaker 7: do these various things that I'm described haven't described, to

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Speaker 7: just get one over their teammates. It's just not coming

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Speaker 7: in the weekend, falsifying documents, lying about what they did

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Speaker 7: in comparison to somebody else, almost kind of thing. This

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Speaker 7: is a filthy, filthy culture. It's a topic culture.

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Speaker 6: And I don't of lying because how about it, how.

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Speaker 3: About this example Stephanie, just to see, just test the

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Speaker 3: limits on it. So, back in the day, I used

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Speaker 3: to be a television like an editor right the edited

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Speaker 3: TV ads and TV shows and such, and so I

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Speaker 3: was going for a job at C four was the

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Speaker 3: place at the time. And in the interview they said,

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Speaker 3: can you edit on an Avid? And I said, yep,

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Speaker 3: I'm excellent on an Avid. I've had a lot of experience.

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Speaker 3: I hadn't. But but but I edited on another Michelle.

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Speaker 3: I was editing on final cut at the time and

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Speaker 3: an Adobe Premier year, just to give the exact examples.

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Speaker 3: And so I said that, and then just once I

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Speaker 3: got the job, I spent a couple of days boning

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Speaker 3: up on Avid editing and turned up completely capable of

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Speaker 3: doing the job and ended up being an excellent employee

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Speaker 3: in my opinion going forward. If i'd see it at

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Speaker 3: that point, nah, I go, no, I've never used EVID before.

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Speaker 3: They might not have employed me, and then I would

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Speaker 3: have missed out on a job and they would have missed.

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Speaker 2: Out on me.

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Speaker 7: Well, and I hear what you're saying, and I completely

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Speaker 7: agree was why you did it? But why wouldn't you

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Speaker 7: say I've been editing on the three fours or the

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Speaker 7: thirty months. I've done that and this came out very well.

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Speaker 7: And I've also adjusted to this one. You know, you

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Speaker 7: can always tell yourself and someone who's got employer, it's

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Speaker 7: going to pick that up immediately.

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Speaker 3: Ye, But a lot of people are going for this job,

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Speaker 3: and you you you'd be concerned that they'll just go, well,

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Speaker 3: the last guy, these guys are equal, but that other

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Speaker 3: guys had ever experience, ever editing experience. So I'll go

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Speaker 3: with him. So for me and my family. The most

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Speaker 3: important thing for me was I got this job so

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Speaker 3: I could put food on the table.

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Speaker 7: So that would that they stopped my emotional blackmail.

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Speaker 2: You can see why you got the job, Stephanie. You

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Speaker 2: can see why you got the job. He's got away

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Speaker 2: with words.

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Speaker 7: If I, if I had a mession, I would have

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Speaker 7: pardoned because I would have been able to tell, you know,

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Speaker 7: if you told the truth, and I would have got

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Speaker 7: the message that you were a damn good guy and

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Speaker 7: crazy boy that's the keys.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, right, well, thank you so much for your call, Steffan.

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Speaker 3: I appreciate that. So a's what's your ever experience? But yeah,

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Speaker 3: I'm great.

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Speaker 2: It's awesome, light so much high level. Yeah, I love

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Speaker 2: that program so much.

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Speaker 3: On that program.

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Speaker 2: Yes, heepes, that was a great call. Thank you very much, Stephanie.

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Speaker 2: Oh eight hundred and eighty ten eighty love to hear

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Speaker 2: from you. Is it okay to embellish on your c

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Speaker 2: V to make yourself look better there? Maybe you were

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Speaker 2: at your last position. Nine two nine two is the

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Speaker 2: text number. It is twenty eight past one.

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Speaker 3: The sixer says, would you get on a plane with

403
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Speaker 3: the pilot that had lied about the training you idiot.

404
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Speaker 3: Uh probably not. No, No, let us at the far end.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, very true.

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Speaker 3: Example pass one.

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Speaker 1: Putting the tough questions to the newspeakers. The mic asking Breakfast.

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Speaker 3: The Prime Minister is with us, So you've cut into

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Speaker 3: the public service.

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Speaker 8: And yet I read a rung A tomaerriki is spending

411
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Speaker 8: two million dollars a year plus on communications stuff.

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Speaker 3: How's this possible? It's funny you say that someone raised

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Speaker 3: that with me. I say that at all.

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Speaker 9: No, What I mean is it is an awful lot

415
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Speaker 9: of comms people in the government service and we've been

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Speaker 9: trying to say, get rid of the back office, make

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Speaker 9: sure you put the resources in the front line.

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Speaker 3: Why don't you just second? Well, I mean we're putting.

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Speaker 9: The pressure back on CEOs to say, you've got these

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Speaker 9: goals to deliver for us. How you organize your resources

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Speaker 9: is up to you, but we're going to hold you accountable,

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Speaker 9: so you're in.

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Speaker 3: Charge of it.

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Speaker 8: And this is I rung A tomaeriki who couldn't get

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Speaker 8: out of their own way if their life depended on it.

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Speaker 8: Back tomorrow at six am, the Mic Asking Breakfast with

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Speaker 8: Maylee's Real Estate News.

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Speaker 2: Talk z B Afternoon have passed one. Plenty of great

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Speaker 2: techs coming through.

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Speaker 3: So we're talking about embalancing your CV on the back

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Speaker 3: of this. It's a different situation.

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Speaker 2: What's his name was, Andrew I fairly Andrew lessis so

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Speaker 2: quite a different situation here that he told a Texas

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Speaker 2: University crowd during a speech that he had a doctorate

435
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Speaker 2: from Yale. He does not have that degree. He did

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Speaker 2: an online course during COVID and that was found out.

437
00:21:19,093 --> 00:21:20,333
Speaker 2: And it's a weird thing to lie about.

438
00:21:20,413 --> 00:21:23,373
Speaker 3: And back here he had stepped down from his position.

439
00:21:24,053 --> 00:21:27,133
Speaker 2: Yeah, so he was appointed a new position to oversee

440
00:21:27,573 --> 00:21:29,933
Speaker 2: all the prisons within New Zealand. But he has now

441
00:21:30,013 --> 00:21:32,413
Speaker 2: resigned from all of his roles and he did have

442
00:21:32,653 --> 00:21:34,973
Speaker 2: quite a lot of credentials in a CV, but it's

443
00:21:35,013 --> 00:21:36,173
Speaker 2: all tumbled down now.

444
00:21:36,373 --> 00:21:40,173
Speaker 3: Just made up, just a ridiculous lie for no good reason. Yeah,

445
00:21:40,333 --> 00:21:43,453
Speaker 3: it's so odd. But that's a bit different then slightly

446
00:21:43,573 --> 00:21:46,533
Speaker 3: embellishing your CV. As this textas says, fake it till.

447
00:21:46,413 --> 00:21:47,133
Speaker 2: You make it, yep.

448
00:21:47,733 --> 00:21:49,733
Speaker 3: I think there's something in that. Yeah, you just got

449
00:21:49,813 --> 00:21:51,893
Speaker 3: to get the job for you yep. And then when

450
00:21:51,933 --> 00:21:53,733
Speaker 3: you're there, you can be the most honest person in

451
00:21:53,773 --> 00:21:55,253
Speaker 3: the world and be a real force.

452
00:21:55,093 --> 00:21:55,733
Speaker 2: For the workplace.

453
00:21:55,813 --> 00:21:58,613
Speaker 3: But if you don't massage your CV, then you may

454
00:21:58,693 --> 00:22:02,493
Speaker 3: never get the ability to shine and make everyone's lives better.

455
00:22:02,853 --> 00:22:04,853
Speaker 3: I applied for a position in the New Zealand Police

456
00:22:04,853 --> 00:22:07,733
Speaker 3: and missed out. Said this is text to lance. During

457
00:22:07,773 --> 00:22:09,933
Speaker 3: the feedback, I got told I had been too honest

458
00:22:10,013 --> 00:22:10,933
Speaker 3: in my interview.

459
00:22:10,653 --> 00:22:14,853
Speaker 2: At two hodents for the police. Here you go, right,

460
00:22:14,933 --> 00:22:16,773
Speaker 2: we're taking more of your calls on eight hundred and

461
00:22:16,813 --> 00:22:19,413
Speaker 2: AC ten eighty were a little bit late. So headlines

462
00:22:19,533 --> 00:22:21,733
Speaker 2: coming up and if you want to see the tax

463
00:22:21,893 --> 00:22:24,213
Speaker 2: nine two nine two, it is twenty eight to two.

464
00:22:26,613 --> 00:22:30,133
Speaker 10: You talk said, be headlines with blue bubble taxis it's

465
00:22:30,213 --> 00:22:33,493
Speaker 10: no trouble with a blue bubble. Inflation rose to two

466
00:22:33,573 --> 00:22:36,453
Speaker 10: point seven percent over the year to June. That's up

467
00:22:36,493 --> 00:22:39,813
Speaker 10: from two point five to March. But that's alongside tough

468
00:22:39,893 --> 00:22:44,653
Speaker 10: conditions for households, with steep food price rises, particularly hard

469
00:22:44,733 --> 00:22:49,333
Speaker 10: on lower income families. Principles say consultation is the key

470
00:22:49,413 --> 00:22:52,653
Speaker 10: to developing a high school qualification New Zealand can be

471
00:22:52,773 --> 00:22:56,533
Speaker 10: proud of. After criticism and a new report on NCEA,

472
00:22:57,253 --> 00:23:02,093
Speaker 10: the Secondary Principles Association says NCAA needs to be robust

473
00:23:02,493 --> 00:23:07,453
Speaker 10: and work to educate students from all backgrounds. Regional Airlines

474
00:23:07,573 --> 00:23:10,933
Speaker 10: sounds As says costs imposed in the past three months

475
00:23:11,293 --> 00:23:13,573
Speaker 10: are forcing it to drop its Blenham to christ Church

476
00:23:13,853 --> 00:23:17,493
Speaker 10: and Christchurch Twarnica flights from September. It's selling a fleet

477
00:23:17,573 --> 00:23:21,413
Speaker 10: of small planes and ten jobs will go. A Dunedin

478
00:23:21,453 --> 00:23:24,613
Speaker 10: woman who was pulled over transporting children in an after

479
00:23:24,733 --> 00:23:28,333
Speaker 10: school car pool on Friday scord nearly four times the

480
00:23:28,453 --> 00:23:33,493
Speaker 10: legal alcohol limit. The well Being Protocol reckons community funding

481
00:23:33,773 --> 00:23:36,373
Speaker 10: can be done way better. You can find out more

482
00:23:36,413 --> 00:23:39,573
Speaker 10: at enz at Herald Premium. Back to matt Ethan Tyler Adams.

483
00:23:39,653 --> 00:23:41,613
Speaker 2: Thank you very much, Rayleen, and we're talking about a

484
00:23:41,693 --> 00:23:45,133
Speaker 2: story today. New Justice appointee Farley Andrew Larsa says he's

485
00:23:45,173 --> 00:23:49,733
Speaker 2: decided to resign from everything after an investigation exposed flaws

486
00:23:49,813 --> 00:23:50,453
Speaker 2: in his CV.

487
00:23:50,693 --> 00:23:50,733
Speaker 4: So.

488
00:23:50,893 --> 00:23:52,853
Speaker 2: The big one was a speech he made to the

489
00:23:52,973 --> 00:23:56,133
Speaker 2: University of Texas that he had completed a jurist doctor

490
00:23:56,173 --> 00:23:59,813
Speaker 2: a law degree at Lale at Yale, and after an

491
00:23:59,853 --> 00:24:02,133
Speaker 2: investigation he admitted that wasn't true. He said, I quote,

492
00:24:02,173 --> 00:24:04,133
Speaker 2: the agree doesn't exist. What I meant by that as

493
00:24:04,173 --> 00:24:06,333
Speaker 2: I had studied at Yale. It was an online course

494
00:24:06,373 --> 00:24:08,893
Speaker 2: on governance. But I do not have a jd at Yale,

495
00:24:09,493 --> 00:24:12,453
Speaker 2: so that is very different. And we've taken a step

496
00:24:12,733 --> 00:24:15,973
Speaker 2: backwards to talking about emballishing on your CV. Clearly that

497
00:24:16,213 --> 00:24:19,053
Speaker 2: is an outright lie about a degree that that person

498
00:24:19,213 --> 00:24:21,613
Speaker 2: did not have. But we're talking about embellishing or making

499
00:24:21,653 --> 00:24:23,453
Speaker 2: yourself look better on a CV.

500
00:24:23,933 --> 00:24:26,653
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean just little things like you're part of

501
00:24:26,733 --> 00:24:28,733
Speaker 3: a team, but then you just put in might call

502
00:24:28,773 --> 00:24:32,133
Speaker 3: it my team, or you claim you lead the team,

503
00:24:32,213 --> 00:24:32,773
Speaker 3: but you're part of.

504
00:24:32,773 --> 00:24:34,052
Speaker 2: A successful team exactly.

505
00:24:34,133 --> 00:24:37,933
Speaker 3: I mean that's a classic CV embellishment, or you know,

506
00:24:38,093 --> 00:24:41,653
Speaker 3: claiming skills you don't have. I mean, there's a lot

507
00:24:41,733 --> 00:24:44,253
Speaker 3: of things you could do that are a long way

508
00:24:44,373 --> 00:24:47,933
Speaker 3: from making up a doctorate from Yale. Yeah, there's a

509
00:24:48,013 --> 00:24:48,973
Speaker 3: long way back, you know.

510
00:24:49,333 --> 00:24:52,853
Speaker 2: But like saying I've got attention great attention to detail,

511
00:24:53,053 --> 00:24:55,813
Speaker 2: now that highly likely is not true all of the time.

512
00:24:55,893 --> 00:24:57,933
Speaker 2: There might be sometimes where you're pretty good at the

513
00:24:58,213 --> 00:25:00,573
Speaker 2: smaller things, but I'd say most people put that on

514
00:25:00,653 --> 00:25:03,013
Speaker 2: their CV, and it's just the reality. There's a lot

515
00:25:03,013 --> 00:25:05,373
Speaker 2: of people who are not great at attention to detail.

516
00:25:05,413 --> 00:25:06,893
Speaker 2: But of course you put it there because you want

517
00:25:06,933 --> 00:25:08,253
Speaker 2: to put your best foot forwar.

518
00:25:08,813 --> 00:25:12,533
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I mean that's probably like a step too far.

519
00:25:12,773 --> 00:25:14,613
Speaker 3: Maybe I'm just trying to find the limit is to say,

520
00:25:15,453 --> 00:25:18,373
Speaker 3: claim a title if you're a director, and use if

521
00:25:18,373 --> 00:25:21,093
Speaker 3: you're a manager and you call yourself director, yeah, you know,

522
00:25:21,853 --> 00:25:25,292
Speaker 3: or you're a slightly upgrading yourself.

523
00:25:25,493 --> 00:25:27,573
Speaker 2: Yeah. But there's that line though, wasn't it say you're

524
00:25:27,613 --> 00:25:30,653
Speaker 2: a salesperson and then you decided to put executive salesperson.

525
00:25:31,013 --> 00:25:33,253
Speaker 2: That is closer to what you could do. But if

526
00:25:33,293 --> 00:25:35,173
Speaker 2: you said you ran the company, clearly that's too far.

527
00:25:35,293 --> 00:25:36,173
Speaker 2: That's a straight up lie.

528
00:25:36,453 --> 00:25:38,293
Speaker 3: Yeah, can't Welcome to the show.

529
00:25:39,853 --> 00:25:44,413
Speaker 4: Yeah, thanks, guys. Can I start my saying when you

530
00:25:44,573 --> 00:25:47,133
Speaker 4: take your wife out to dinner, mat, I feel like

531
00:25:47,213 --> 00:25:50,733
Speaker 4: you do everything you possibly can to make your white

532
00:25:50,773 --> 00:25:54,933
Speaker 4: heads the most enjoyable night you can mean, I'm about

533
00:25:55,293 --> 00:25:58,533
Speaker 4: the lights down in body lightsown nice.

534
00:25:58,733 --> 00:26:00,493
Speaker 3: So you're saying that I should have put instead of

535
00:26:00,573 --> 00:26:02,813
Speaker 3: going you don't make it fast, Just be quiet, just

536
00:26:02,973 --> 00:26:07,093
Speaker 3: enjoy the meal. I should have been one, darling. If

537
00:26:07,133 --> 00:26:09,053
Speaker 3: you don't like the lights of get the lights sort

538
00:26:09,093 --> 00:26:11,973
Speaker 3: of for you anything you want and I'll move you

539
00:26:13,173 --> 00:26:14,373
Speaker 3: play to be let.

540
00:26:14,293 --> 00:26:15,893
Speaker 4: They'd be like because there's all the things you are.

541
00:26:16,053 --> 00:26:21,413
Speaker 4: But yeah, I have a light too, has orders. So

542
00:26:21,533 --> 00:26:23,853
Speaker 4: when we go to a restaurant, there is quite a

543
00:26:23,933 --> 00:26:28,573
Speaker 4: few things that sensory. We like to sit in the

544
00:26:28,613 --> 00:26:31,333
Speaker 4: booth and there's a few things. It's lights and the

545
00:26:31,453 --> 00:26:33,973
Speaker 4: heats and different things that I need to have sort

546
00:26:34,013 --> 00:26:36,733
Speaker 4: of at the restaurant when we go to make her.

547
00:26:39,093 --> 00:26:39,133
Speaker 11: So.

548
00:26:39,733 --> 00:26:41,613
Speaker 3: Yeah, so what you're saying is instead of trying to

549
00:26:42,093 --> 00:26:44,613
Speaker 3: fix her, I should try and fix her problems for her.

550
00:26:46,213 --> 00:26:49,133
Speaker 4: Absolutely, that's like.

551
00:26:51,133 --> 00:26:53,853
Speaker 3: To be fair to a testy start to what was

552
00:26:53,853 --> 00:26:55,093
Speaker 3: supposed to be quite a nice dinner.

553
00:26:59,013 --> 00:27:06,853
Speaker 4: Yeah you told man, Ye see, any think we actually

554
00:27:06,933 --> 00:27:11,373
Speaker 4: I'm old school. I'm forty five and I've been a

555
00:27:11,413 --> 00:27:13,773
Speaker 4: truck driver or a Darius barber for most of my life.

556
00:27:15,893 --> 00:27:20,253
Speaker 4: I'll have a light on a CV. I I have

557
00:27:21,013 --> 00:27:25,413
Speaker 4: only the last five or six jobs i've got. I've

558
00:27:25,893 --> 00:27:28,213
Speaker 4: handed my CV and I so I answered you. I've

559
00:27:28,253 --> 00:27:31,013
Speaker 4: said to them, I will work for you guys free

560
00:27:31,173 --> 00:27:33,893
Speaker 4: for a day. You can put someone in the truckle

561
00:27:33,893 --> 00:27:36,533
Speaker 4: with me and they can walk for me, and I'll

562
00:27:36,613 --> 00:27:38,973
Speaker 4: drive sweet for a day. And I will get a

563
00:27:39,013 --> 00:27:42,573
Speaker 4: job with the Innident. And I've got my last five

564
00:27:42,693 --> 00:27:47,573
Speaker 4: jobs out there that's slowly becoming out like that today's.

565
00:27:49,253 --> 00:27:53,213
Speaker 4: But yeah, that's my question to you. Event would be

566
00:27:53,733 --> 00:27:56,893
Speaker 4: if you were going for a job and somebody else

567
00:27:57,053 --> 00:27:59,173
Speaker 4: was going for that job and they lied and enough

568
00:27:59,293 --> 00:28:02,373
Speaker 4: to get the job ahead of you with that flying

569
00:28:02,613 --> 00:28:03,613
Speaker 4: s CV okay, or.

570
00:28:04,133 --> 00:28:08,853
Speaker 3: Like, yeah, I see what you're saying because the moral Yeah,

571
00:28:08,933 --> 00:28:11,533
Speaker 3: I totally see what you're saying there. So you're because

572
00:28:11,573 --> 00:28:13,733
Speaker 3: you'd be gutted if you found out that they lied

573
00:28:13,893 --> 00:28:16,213
Speaker 3: to get ahead of you, and you would think that

574
00:28:16,333 --> 00:28:19,813
Speaker 3: they're a terrible human being for doing it. But I'm

575
00:28:19,893 --> 00:28:22,053
Speaker 3: kind of saying that you should be an equally terrible

576
00:28:22,133 --> 00:28:24,413
Speaker 3: human being to get what you want, which is kind

577
00:28:24,453 --> 00:28:26,733
Speaker 3: of a shaky moral standpoint for me to take you

578
00:28:27,053 --> 00:28:28,013
Speaker 3: quite right there, you can't.

579
00:28:28,133 --> 00:28:34,613
Speaker 2: You're very smart man, quite easily here. You're like a

580
00:28:34,693 --> 00:28:42,493
Speaker 2: life coach form at the stage can carry on.

581
00:28:42,973 --> 00:28:46,293
Speaker 4: I just I gave up alcohol and drugs nine and

582
00:28:46,333 --> 00:28:48,653
Speaker 4: a half years ago, and I talked to the first

583
00:28:48,653 --> 00:28:51,453
Speaker 4: couple of people may talking about honestly. They just want

584
00:28:51,533 --> 00:28:54,373
Speaker 4: me to be honest, yeah, and I want and I

585
00:28:54,493 --> 00:28:56,533
Speaker 4: told them about it, and I didn't get the job.

586
00:28:57,973 --> 00:29:00,053
Speaker 4: So it was kind of but I've struck with that.

587
00:29:01,013 --> 00:29:04,893
Speaker 4: Somebody asked if I haven't issue without whole, Like, yes, absolutely,

588
00:29:05,093 --> 00:29:07,013
Speaker 4: I'm an addict and I'm a nine and a half

589
00:29:07,093 --> 00:29:11,213
Speaker 4: year scene and I'm doing everything I need to stay cletenance. Yeah,

590
00:29:11,333 --> 00:29:12,533
Speaker 4: just as the job.

591
00:29:13,013 --> 00:29:17,733
Speaker 2: Yeah, And a lot of people are saying that. I mean,

592
00:29:17,853 --> 00:29:21,853
Speaker 2: just to to Khn's point about someone else told a

593
00:29:21,933 --> 00:29:24,133
Speaker 2: porky and they got the job ahead of you, I

594
00:29:24,373 --> 00:29:27,213
Speaker 2: would if that happened to me, I would think they're

595
00:29:27,253 --> 00:29:28,973
Speaker 2: going to get found out, depending on how big that

596
00:29:29,093 --> 00:29:31,853
Speaker 2: lie is and Khn's example, if they like and said, yep,

597
00:29:31,893 --> 00:29:34,093
Speaker 2: I've driven trucks for twenty years and they don't know

598
00:29:34,133 --> 00:29:35,573
Speaker 2: how to drive a truck, They're going to be found

599
00:29:35,613 --> 00:29:37,693
Speaker 2: out pretty fast, and so then there's a bit of

600
00:29:37,893 --> 00:29:40,613
Speaker 2: a shoulden freud. And but also you'd look at that

601
00:29:40,653 --> 00:29:42,173
Speaker 2: and thinking they're not going to last. They're going to

602
00:29:42,213 --> 00:29:43,933
Speaker 2: get found out pretty quick, and then I'm ready to

603
00:29:44,013 --> 00:29:44,693
Speaker 2: go to step up.

604
00:29:45,013 --> 00:29:47,373
Speaker 3: But I guess I would push back on that a

605
00:29:47,413 --> 00:29:51,893
Speaker 3: little bit and say, desperate times, cause for death, desperate measures.

606
00:29:52,053 --> 00:29:52,173
Speaker 4: Right.

607
00:29:52,373 --> 00:29:55,373
Speaker 3: Yeah, So if you've got a family to feed and

608
00:29:55,573 --> 00:29:59,373
Speaker 3: you really need the job, and it's a slight embellishment

609
00:29:59,413 --> 00:30:02,453
Speaker 3: of the situation, then I don't know where to see

610
00:30:02,493 --> 00:30:06,813
Speaker 3: moral that that that's when things get murky in a

611
00:30:06,893 --> 00:30:09,373
Speaker 3: moral sense, because I would think that your first moral

612
00:30:09,493 --> 00:30:13,373
Speaker 3: duty is to make sure that you can house and

613
00:30:13,573 --> 00:30:17,293
Speaker 3: feed your family right deferently. So that's whatever that takes

614
00:30:17,533 --> 00:30:21,013
Speaker 3: at that point beyond breaking the law. I guess yeah,

615
00:30:21,213 --> 00:30:23,373
Speaker 3: I would say you'd go to and if that means

616
00:30:23,533 --> 00:30:25,933
Speaker 3: in my case, saying I could use software that I couldn't,

617
00:30:26,853 --> 00:30:29,973
Speaker 3: then I would maybe don't feel great about that, but

618
00:30:30,093 --> 00:30:33,453
Speaker 3: better than you know, the not being able to pay.

619
00:30:33,333 --> 00:30:36,213
Speaker 2: The rent, Yeah, yeap, or your kids going hungry. Absolutely.

620
00:30:36,493 --> 00:30:38,213
Speaker 2: Oh eight one hundred and eighty ten eighty is the

621
00:30:38,373 --> 00:30:40,613
Speaker 2: number to call. We'll take more of your calls very shortly.

622
00:30:40,653 --> 00:30:41,773
Speaker 2: It's seventeen to two.

623
00:30:43,693 --> 00:30:46,973
Speaker 1: Your home of Afternoon Talk mad he than Taylor Adams

624
00:30:47,133 --> 00:30:51,093
Speaker 1: afternoons call Oh eight hundred eighty ten eighty News Talk said, be.

625
00:30:51,693 --> 00:30:53,733
Speaker 2: Very good afternoon due. It is a quarter to two

626
00:30:53,813 --> 00:30:56,373
Speaker 2: and we're talking about embellishing things on your CV to

627
00:30:56,413 --> 00:30:58,173
Speaker 2: get a foot on the door. Is it ever okay?

628
00:30:58,213 --> 00:30:59,653
Speaker 2: I eight one hundred and eighty ten eighty is the

629
00:30:59,773 --> 00:31:00,253
Speaker 2: number to call.

630
00:31:00,493 --> 00:31:03,213
Speaker 3: You've got to say, there's a lot of very strictly

631
00:31:03,293 --> 00:31:05,493
Speaker 3: honest people here, and it's good to see, especially on

632
00:31:05,573 --> 00:31:08,133
Speaker 3: nine two ninety two. How about the companies that mister

633
00:31:08,413 --> 00:31:10,173
Speaker 3: is that themselves at the interview saying they have a

634
00:31:10,253 --> 00:31:13,333
Speaker 3: great culture, et cetera. I mean, I'm sure there's a

635
00:31:13,333 --> 00:31:15,093
Speaker 3: lot of people out there that have gone to an interview,

636
00:31:15,333 --> 00:31:18,053
Speaker 3: and the way the place has been sold to you

637
00:31:18,413 --> 00:31:20,853
Speaker 3: is very different from the actuality when you start the job.

638
00:31:22,013 --> 00:31:25,253
Speaker 3: You know, we're a place that looks to move people

639
00:31:25,333 --> 00:31:26,733
Speaker 3: up quickly on merit.

640
00:31:26,893 --> 00:31:27,453
Speaker 2: Yep, you know.

641
00:31:27,533 --> 00:31:29,773
Speaker 3: There's a lot of opportunities for you to make a

642
00:31:29,853 --> 00:31:30,453
Speaker 3: difference here.

643
00:31:31,053 --> 00:31:34,533
Speaker 2: The great team culture. We're a family here. Yeah, that's right,

644
00:31:35,133 --> 00:31:35,773
Speaker 2: We're a family.

645
00:31:35,813 --> 00:31:38,333
Speaker 3: It's a classic one. I don't see this workplace so

646
00:31:38,493 --> 00:31:42,253
Speaker 3: much as a workplace, but more as a family. You

647
00:31:42,333 --> 00:31:44,813
Speaker 3: hear that so much it's not a family.

648
00:31:44,613 --> 00:31:46,413
Speaker 2: And then you get in there and realize everybody hates

649
00:31:46,453 --> 00:31:46,773
Speaker 2: each other.

650
00:31:48,373 --> 00:31:51,133
Speaker 3: I lied on my life that I was straight and

651
00:31:51,253 --> 00:31:53,293
Speaker 3: married with kids, but in reality I am gay.

652
00:31:53,573 --> 00:31:53,893
Speaker 2: Wow, this.

653
00:31:55,933 --> 00:31:58,573
Speaker 3: Texture So if you if you couldn't get the job

654
00:31:58,653 --> 00:32:02,493
Speaker 3: back in the day when people were prejudiced against gay people,

655
00:32:03,253 --> 00:32:08,093
Speaker 3: would was that morally wrong for them to not share

656
00:32:08,173 --> 00:32:08,693
Speaker 3: that information?

657
00:32:08,813 --> 00:32:11,453
Speaker 2: It's a great question, Jeremy, welcome to the show.

658
00:32:12,093 --> 00:32:16,493
Speaker 3: Your anti your anti CV embellishment totally.

659
00:32:16,613 --> 00:32:18,893
Speaker 12: I think it's a moral and I think it goes

660
00:32:18,933 --> 00:32:21,533
Speaker 12: against the grain and a lot of us. But one

661
00:32:21,613 --> 00:32:24,773
Speaker 12: stage further, I'd just like to amplify as people out

662
00:32:24,813 --> 00:32:29,493
Speaker 12: there who actually wear medals to remember to parade in

663
00:32:29,533 --> 00:32:32,533
Speaker 12: anzac service that they've never been given or their family

664
00:32:32,613 --> 00:32:34,253
Speaker 12: hasn't given. How bad is that?

665
00:32:35,093 --> 00:32:37,213
Speaker 3: Stolen vala as they call.

666
00:32:37,133 --> 00:32:41,453
Speaker 12: It, correct stolen valor yes as I call them.

667
00:32:42,213 --> 00:32:43,693
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean.

668
00:32:45,093 --> 00:32:47,213
Speaker 3: I listened to this podcast recently about this woman I

669
00:32:47,253 --> 00:32:51,013
Speaker 3: can't remember her name, but she lied about being in

670
00:32:51,293 --> 00:32:53,973
Speaker 3: the Twin Towers and nine to eleven to the point

671
00:32:54,013 --> 00:32:56,893
Speaker 3: where she happened to people investigated she'd seen all the

672
00:32:56,933 --> 00:32:59,813
Speaker 3: major events and these heroes, and then started talking to

673
00:32:59,893 --> 00:33:02,453
Speaker 3: families about what she'd seen, became a head of this

674
00:33:02,653 --> 00:33:05,693
Speaker 3: charity and took all the glory about her time in

675
00:33:05,813 --> 00:33:07,613
Speaker 3: nine to eleven, and then it was proven that she

676
00:33:07,813 --> 00:33:09,893
Speaker 3: was not nine to eleven at all. You just go,

677
00:33:10,173 --> 00:33:13,253
Speaker 3: you're it'spect what a despicable human being.

678
00:33:13,453 --> 00:33:17,733
Speaker 12: Yeah, it's just stoopid low to try and get something

679
00:33:17,893 --> 00:33:21,573
Speaker 12: or gain credit or kudos for something. Really that you

680
00:33:21,653 --> 00:33:24,053
Speaker 12: haven't had in the first place, you know, And why

681
00:33:24,133 --> 00:33:26,293
Speaker 12: do people stoop that load? Why do you want to

682
00:33:26,333 --> 00:33:28,893
Speaker 12: embellish you see the if you haven't got that credential.

683
00:33:29,133 --> 00:33:30,693
Speaker 12: But they're going to get found out, you know what

684
00:33:30,733 --> 00:33:30,973
Speaker 12: I mean.

685
00:33:31,173 --> 00:33:33,733
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that is despicable talking about wearing medals that

686
00:33:33,773 --> 00:33:36,853
Speaker 2: you haven't earned to an Anzac Day ceremony or Mett's case,

687
00:33:36,893 --> 00:33:38,413
Speaker 2: the woman who said she was a nine to eleven

688
00:33:38,453 --> 00:33:40,493
Speaker 2: and she wasn't there. But to me, Jeremy, there's a

689
00:33:40,533 --> 00:33:43,893
Speaker 2: spectrum here. You might disagree about the and let's call

690
00:33:43,973 --> 00:33:46,573
Speaker 2: them embellishments. And I think, you know, I just need

691
00:33:46,653 --> 00:33:48,293
Speaker 2: to clarify that because there's a lot of people coming

692
00:33:48,333 --> 00:33:50,733
Speaker 2: through on the text machine saying no, never lie. But

693
00:33:50,853 --> 00:33:53,453
Speaker 2: I think there's a difference there between a pathological liar

694
00:33:53,453 --> 00:33:55,453
Speaker 2: who's clearly got some sort of mental illness that would

695
00:33:55,453 --> 00:33:58,373
Speaker 2: do the things you're talking about, versus someone saying that

696
00:33:58,493 --> 00:34:00,813
Speaker 2: they were a greater part of a team and a

697
00:34:00,933 --> 00:34:03,093
Speaker 2: previous job to make themselves look a bit better.

698
00:34:04,453 --> 00:34:06,693
Speaker 12: Yeah, but it's what Matt just said previously. You know,

699
00:34:06,813 --> 00:34:09,212
Speaker 12: he said you'd do everything and any thing for the

700
00:34:09,253 --> 00:34:12,013
Speaker 12: sake of his family. You know, Well, if it's anything

701
00:34:12,093 --> 00:34:15,173
Speaker 12: and everything in your embellishing cv possibly to get greater

702
00:34:15,293 --> 00:34:18,773
Speaker 12: renumeration or greater title in the job, which would lead

703
00:34:18,773 --> 00:34:22,253
Speaker 12: to a better position remuneration. Yeah, that's one point, a

704
00:34:22,293 --> 00:34:25,453
Speaker 12: su guest, which were saying. But to actually put like

705
00:34:25,653 --> 00:34:28,213
Speaker 12: if you said stolen valor medals upon your chest for

706
00:34:28,333 --> 00:34:30,733
Speaker 12: conflicts that you've been to, or a massive instance like

707
00:34:30,813 --> 00:34:33,973
Speaker 12: the Twin Towers, that is wrong in every single sense

708
00:34:34,013 --> 00:34:36,293
Speaker 12: in the world, and in fact, up in the UK

709
00:34:36,533 --> 00:34:40,333
Speaker 12: there is an actual Walt Amittis Hunters Club which goes

710
00:34:40,373 --> 00:34:44,653
Speaker 12: out sort of sorting these people out, and to actually

711
00:34:44,693 --> 00:34:46,933
Speaker 12: do it in the United Kingdom, wearing medals on your

712
00:34:47,013 --> 00:34:49,893
Speaker 12: chest is actually going to be a legal thing, and

713
00:34:49,973 --> 00:34:51,693
Speaker 12: that leads to a custodial sentence.

714
00:34:52,133 --> 00:34:56,053
Speaker 3: You're right, there are limits, because I generally believe that

715
00:34:57,093 --> 00:35:00,093
Speaker 3: and I tell my kids no white lies, and generally

716
00:35:00,133 --> 00:35:02,773
Speaker 3: in my life I believe that honesty is the best policy.

717
00:35:02,893 --> 00:35:06,693
Speaker 3: But there are eache cases Jeremy say, for example, and

718
00:35:06,853 --> 00:35:10,333
Speaker 3: I know people always go to this era for the

719
00:35:10,573 --> 00:35:14,253
Speaker 3: edge case examples, but say you're in the house of

720
00:35:14,653 --> 00:35:18,733
Speaker 3: Anne Frank and she's in the attic and the Nazis

721
00:35:18,853 --> 00:35:21,293
Speaker 3: knock on the door and they say, is there anyone

722
00:35:21,373 --> 00:35:25,373
Speaker 3: in your house? In this house, then that is the

723
00:35:25,453 --> 00:35:29,773
Speaker 3: far edge case with I believe that you go, no,

724
00:35:30,293 --> 00:35:31,333
Speaker 3: there's no one else in here.

725
00:35:35,413 --> 00:35:37,893
Speaker 12: Life or death, isn't it? That is life or death.

726
00:35:37,933 --> 00:35:39,373
Speaker 12: I mean, at the end of the day, if it's

727
00:35:39,413 --> 00:35:41,013
Speaker 12: your life or their life, and you're going to get

728
00:35:41,053 --> 00:35:44,613
Speaker 12: away with not losing your life for making a story

729
00:35:44,693 --> 00:35:46,613
Speaker 12: up or to protect your family and your loved ones,

730
00:35:46,693 --> 00:35:49,533
Speaker 12: that's it. Yes, I mean that's an isolated incident. But

731
00:35:49,933 --> 00:35:52,853
Speaker 12: going back to writing, it's physically writing and coringuring up

732
00:35:52,893 --> 00:35:56,133
Speaker 12: a CV and then applying for a position, which you

733
00:35:56,293 --> 00:35:58,813
Speaker 12: know on the CV, quite a lot of the information

734
00:35:58,893 --> 00:36:02,013
Speaker 12: that you supplied or just an isolated piece isn't correct.

735
00:36:02,373 --> 00:36:06,533
Speaker 12: It's fabricated. That's where I'm coming from. But it's also.

736
00:36:08,013 --> 00:36:10,133
Speaker 3: I think we don't agree qualifications too far.

737
00:36:10,733 --> 00:36:14,133
Speaker 12: Yeah, it's all in human instinct. It's what you're going

738
00:36:14,213 --> 00:36:15,773
Speaker 12: to get out of it. Why would you do it

739
00:36:15,813 --> 00:36:18,533
Speaker 12: in the first place? Yeah, tell the Nazis that there's

740
00:36:18,533 --> 00:36:20,653
Speaker 12: nobody obviously, well I'm going to I'm going to survive.

741
00:36:21,093 --> 00:36:23,093
Speaker 12: But to put something on a CV for what for

742
00:36:23,133 --> 00:36:25,013
Speaker 12: an extra ten fifteen, one hundred K?

743
00:36:25,573 --> 00:36:25,613
Speaker 10: What?

744
00:36:25,813 --> 00:36:26,373
Speaker 13: What? What? What?

745
00:36:26,533 --> 00:36:30,172
Speaker 12: Is the benefit, you know, what is the benefit? Well fabricating?

746
00:36:30,853 --> 00:36:34,093
Speaker 3: What about what about a mission? So say you're a

747
00:36:34,173 --> 00:36:38,413
Speaker 3: CV and you've recently been photograph Okay, let's say what

748
00:36:38,453 --> 00:36:41,333
Speaker 3: if you work in HR and you've been recently recently

749
00:36:41,733 --> 00:36:44,613
Speaker 3: photographed at a Coldplay concert and you get probably looking

750
00:36:44,653 --> 00:36:47,813
Speaker 3: for another job and your and your CV up to

751
00:36:47,853 --> 00:36:49,133
Speaker 3: that point has been pretty good.

752
00:36:49,573 --> 00:36:53,013
Speaker 2: But you just lying by what are they call it

753
00:36:53,093 --> 00:36:54,013
Speaker 2: lying by mission?

754
00:36:54,453 --> 00:36:54,733
Speaker 3: Mission?

755
00:36:54,813 --> 00:36:54,973
Speaker 14: Yeah?

756
00:36:55,653 --> 00:36:58,893
Speaker 3: Mission? So basically you say you don't mention that one

757
00:36:58,973 --> 00:37:03,293
Speaker 3: time that you accorded the coldplate concept, canodling with your

758
00:37:03,773 --> 00:37:04,453
Speaker 3: with your CEO.

759
00:37:05,693 --> 00:37:07,613
Speaker 14: But yeah, but what things like that?

760
00:37:07,693 --> 00:37:09,973
Speaker 12: I mean, that's just gone tone out and that's been

761
00:37:10,013 --> 00:37:12,573
Speaker 12: around the world five times. Everybody's talking about in the pub,

762
00:37:12,853 --> 00:37:16,373
Speaker 12: around the breakfast table, in the Smoko bar, two love birds,

763
00:37:16,533 --> 00:37:19,613
Speaker 12: but looking at a Coldplay concert makes national headlines. Yeah,

764
00:37:19,693 --> 00:37:23,013
Speaker 12: I think that's absolutely crazy. You know their lives are

765
00:37:23,133 --> 00:37:24,213
Speaker 12: ruined through media.

766
00:37:24,453 --> 00:37:26,773
Speaker 2: Well, Jeremy, you won't get media, Jeremy, you won't like

767
00:37:26,813 --> 00:37:30,293
Speaker 2: a topic. After three o'clock, I'm turning off, boys, I'm

768
00:37:30,293 --> 00:37:31,253
Speaker 2: turning back.

769
00:37:32,213 --> 00:37:35,013
Speaker 3: It's gonna be a good honestly, honestly, honestly, I can

770
00:37:35,093 --> 00:37:37,413
Speaker 3: say honestly that we've got a good angle on it.

771
00:37:37,533 --> 00:37:39,732
Speaker 3: We've done our research and we're up.

772
00:37:39,653 --> 00:37:40,133
Speaker 2: To the task.

773
00:37:40,213 --> 00:37:42,652
Speaker 3: And I think if you just employ us for from

774
00:37:42,693 --> 00:37:45,172
Speaker 3: three to four, I think we'll deliver what you need

775
00:37:45,693 --> 00:37:46,373
Speaker 3: from from us.

776
00:37:46,533 --> 00:37:49,253
Speaker 12: Well, I'll stay tuned in, but you've got further than

777
00:37:49,293 --> 00:37:51,533
Speaker 12: sixty degrees in the angle to sort it out. Otherwise

778
00:37:51,533 --> 00:37:52,733
Speaker 12: you're coming back on yourselves.

779
00:37:53,813 --> 00:37:55,893
Speaker 2: Jeremy, thanks you call, Jeremy, appreciate it. Right're going to

780
00:37:55,933 --> 00:37:57,853
Speaker 2: play some messages, but beat with more of your calls. Oh,

781
00:37:57,893 --> 00:38:00,053
Speaker 2: eight hundred and eighteen eighty is the number of calls.

782
00:38:00,093 --> 00:38:00,652
Speaker 2: Seven to two.

783
00:38:01,973 --> 00:38:05,573
Speaker 1: Mediath Tyler Adams taking your calls on eight hundred and

784
00:38:05,613 --> 00:38:09,613
Speaker 1: eighty eight. It's mad Heath and Tyler Adamsons news Dogs.

785
00:38:11,333 --> 00:38:14,253
Speaker 2: It is five to two windy. Good afternoon to you.

786
00:38:14,333 --> 00:38:17,333
Speaker 2: We've got about ninety seconds before the news. Sure.

787
00:38:17,573 --> 00:38:20,333
Speaker 15: I am an employer and had an applicant last week

788
00:38:21,053 --> 00:38:25,293
Speaker 15: emailed to me. It said, hey, mate, I'm applying for

789
00:38:25,733 --> 00:38:30,533
Speaker 15: this job at your esteemed organization and went on to

790
00:38:30,613 --> 00:38:33,013
Speaker 15: say that you know she was applying for this particular role.

791
00:38:33,253 --> 00:38:35,293
Speaker 15: I opened her CV and she was applying for a

792
00:38:35,333 --> 00:38:38,773
Speaker 15: different role at a different company. Now she's gone on

793
00:38:38,853 --> 00:38:42,693
Speaker 15: about her detailed, her attention to detail and professionalisms. I

794
00:38:42,773 --> 00:38:45,613
Speaker 15: wrote back and said, you'll have no attention to detail

795
00:38:45,653 --> 00:38:47,973
Speaker 15: and not very professional calling to the owner of the company.

796
00:38:48,053 --> 00:38:50,252
Speaker 2: Hey mate, Yeah, that's good.

797
00:38:51,213 --> 00:38:52,373
Speaker 15: He got out chart for those.

798
00:38:52,733 --> 00:38:52,933
Speaker 13: Yeah.

799
00:38:53,133 --> 00:38:56,133
Speaker 3: Now, I wonder if people using chat GPT to write

800
00:38:56,133 --> 00:38:59,453
Speaker 3: their cvs and and it's going to make people dumber

801
00:38:59,493 --> 00:39:01,172
Speaker 3: and dumber. Are not doing that kind of thing?

802
00:39:01,453 --> 00:39:05,373
Speaker 15: Just oh, esteemed organization has always chat GBT or AI

803
00:39:05,493 --> 00:39:09,173
Speaker 15: because that do they No one would talk like that.

804
00:39:09,533 --> 00:39:13,013
Speaker 2: Jee such a red flag we did. That's a great one.

805
00:39:13,093 --> 00:39:14,693
Speaker 2: Thank you very much for We're going to carry this

806
00:39:14,773 --> 00:39:16,732
Speaker 2: on for a little bit because we've had so many

807
00:39:16,773 --> 00:39:20,413
Speaker 2: phone calls and texts. So eight hundred eighty ten acy

808
00:39:20,613 --> 00:39:23,813
Speaker 2: little white lies or embellishments on your CV? Are they ever? Okay?

809
00:39:24,093 --> 00:39:25,773
Speaker 3: Yeah, Well, I'm impressed by the amount of people that

810
00:39:25,853 --> 00:39:28,133
Speaker 3: listen to news talks. He'd been Texan and nineteen nine

811
00:39:28,213 --> 00:39:30,413
Speaker 3: two and say they would never lie about anything.

812
00:39:30,493 --> 00:39:31,373
Speaker 2: Ever, liars.

813
00:39:31,493 --> 00:39:32,853
Speaker 3: I'd like to test the limits of that.

814
00:39:33,213 --> 00:39:35,493
Speaker 2: Yeah, right, that is coming up. Oh, eight hundred and

815
00:39:35,493 --> 00:39:37,732
Speaker 2: eighty ten and eighty is the number to cool New

816
00:39:37,853 --> 00:39:40,413
Speaker 2: Sport and weather is on its way. Really great to

817
00:39:40,493 --> 00:39:43,133
Speaker 2: have your company. As always, you're listening to Matt and Tyler.

818
00:39:43,173 --> 00:39:43,893
Speaker 2: Good afternoon to you.

819
00:39:46,773 --> 00:39:51,053
Speaker 1: Your new home are insateful and entertaining talk. It's Mattie

820
00:39:51,293 --> 00:39:54,573
Speaker 1: and Taylor Adams Afternoons on news Talk.

821
00:39:54,533 --> 00:40:00,293
Speaker 2: Sevvy, very very good afternoons. You welcome back into the show.

822
00:40:00,333 --> 00:40:02,493
Speaker 2: At is seven past two. I've just been involved in

823
00:40:02,533 --> 00:40:05,693
Speaker 2: the most exciting possible thing. Yeah, so on the.

824
00:40:05,693 --> 00:40:07,573
Speaker 3: Coffee machine out here in News Talks, he'd be it's

825
00:40:07,613 --> 00:40:09,733
Speaker 3: got a percentage of how long to go in the

826
00:40:09,813 --> 00:40:12,053
Speaker 3: making of the coffee. And I was third in the

827
00:40:12,133 --> 00:40:15,773
Speaker 3: queue and the time was ticking down for us to

828
00:40:15,853 --> 00:40:21,213
Speaker 3: be on air, and someone was making a complicated late

829
00:40:21,453 --> 00:40:24,133
Speaker 3: macchiato that was going incredibly slowly, and I was like, oh,

830
00:40:24,133 --> 00:40:26,973
Speaker 3: I've still got time. And then you abandoned ship, Tyler

831
00:40:26,973 --> 00:40:27,933
Speaker 3: because you thought it was too close.

832
00:40:28,053 --> 00:40:29,293
Speaker 2: I got out of that. I mean, it was a

833
00:40:29,333 --> 00:40:31,933
Speaker 2: wonderful thing to watch, folks, because Matt was very diplomatic.

834
00:40:32,013 --> 00:40:33,973
Speaker 2: He was sitting there and saying, how much time we got,

835
00:40:34,053 --> 00:40:36,253
Speaker 2: Tyler trying to hurry this feller along, but the guy

836
00:40:36,373 --> 00:40:36,973
Speaker 2: was in no hurry.

837
00:40:37,013 --> 00:40:39,692
Speaker 3: We there's someone else after that as well. Meanwhile, we're

838
00:40:39,693 --> 00:40:42,013
Speaker 3: about to go live, and I'm not willing to abandon

839
00:40:42,053 --> 00:40:44,613
Speaker 3: my coffee. No, So then I'm watching it. It was

840
00:40:44,653 --> 00:40:45,853
Speaker 3: like one of those scenes in the movie, you know,

841
00:40:46,013 --> 00:40:49,293
Speaker 3: you're trying to download the secret files onto the USB

842
00:40:49,453 --> 00:40:52,173
Speaker 3: stack and the person's coming back to their office.

843
00:40:52,413 --> 00:40:53,693
Speaker 2: Yeah, we've got to go. We're going to go.

844
00:40:53,893 --> 00:40:57,773
Speaker 3: It's really increased my my heart rates. It's quite exciting actually.

845
00:40:57,853 --> 00:40:59,373
Speaker 2: But we made it and you got your coffee, so

846
00:40:59,453 --> 00:41:01,652
Speaker 2: there was good news. No coffee for me at this stage.

847
00:41:01,693 --> 00:41:03,493
Speaker 2: We ran out of time, but I'll get mine. Hey,

848
00:41:04,013 --> 00:41:06,373
Speaker 2: now before we're going to carry on this conversation for

849
00:41:06,373 --> 00:41:08,173
Speaker 2: a little bit because we had so many people texting

850
00:41:08,413 --> 00:41:10,613
Speaker 2: wanting to have a chat about this embellishing things on

851
00:41:10,773 --> 00:41:14,093
Speaker 2: your CV. Is it okay? This is after an investigation

852
00:41:14,333 --> 00:41:18,973
Speaker 2: has discovered a man called Farley Andrew Lesser. He did

853
00:41:19,053 --> 00:41:21,733
Speaker 2: tell a bit of a poky about his credentials to

854
00:41:21,853 --> 00:41:25,172
Speaker 2: a speech to Texas University where he said he had

855
00:41:25,573 --> 00:41:28,533
Speaker 2: a jurist doctorate degree from Yale. That wasn't the truth,

856
00:41:28,573 --> 00:41:31,853
Speaker 2: and now he's decided to resign from everything but talking

857
00:41:31,893 --> 00:41:35,053
Speaker 2: about white lies. And I've just been reading a chapter

858
00:41:35,413 --> 00:41:40,533
Speaker 2: in a book about telling white lies. Okay, so can

859
00:41:40,613 --> 00:41:42,413
Speaker 2: I mention this chapter? So I mentioned the book for

860
00:41:42,493 --> 00:41:43,613
Speaker 2: you just before we go to the book.

861
00:41:43,693 --> 00:41:49,493
Speaker 3: So what I'm saying on a CV there's room Morally,

862
00:41:49,733 --> 00:41:52,413
Speaker 3: I believe if you really need the job or you

863
00:41:53,173 --> 00:41:57,853
Speaker 3: want the job, to just leave a few things a

864
00:41:57,973 --> 00:42:03,053
Speaker 3: little bit unsaid, and maybe if you take a little

865
00:42:03,253 --> 00:42:05,973
Speaker 3: bit more credit for something, then maybe was yours at

866
00:42:06,053 --> 00:42:08,293
Speaker 3: the last job. And if you know that you can

867
00:42:08,373 --> 00:42:10,373
Speaker 3: an up skill by the time you start the job,

868
00:42:10,493 --> 00:42:15,253
Speaker 3: to maybe not mention that you haven't quite used that software, right,

869
00:42:15,453 --> 00:42:17,853
Speaker 3: just just a little it's not even it's not a

870
00:42:17,933 --> 00:42:20,172
Speaker 3: white lie, or maybe it is. Maybe they're just sort

871
00:42:20,173 --> 00:42:22,573
Speaker 3: of a white lie to get into the job. And

872
00:42:22,653 --> 00:42:26,133
Speaker 3: generally speaking, I believe in honesty. Yeah, absolutely truth. So

873
00:42:26,253 --> 00:42:29,453
Speaker 3: I just think you can just in the CV world

874
00:42:29,533 --> 00:42:30,293
Speaker 3: because you.

875
00:42:30,333 --> 00:42:32,573
Speaker 2: Know, so it's a white lie, but a white lie

876
00:42:32,693 --> 00:42:35,213
Speaker 2: is lying for good reasons, right, good intentions. It might

877
00:42:35,293 --> 00:42:36,853
Speaker 2: be a bit of a selfless act if you're trying

878
00:42:36,853 --> 00:42:38,413
Speaker 2: to get the job to make sure that your family

879
00:42:38,453 --> 00:42:40,093
Speaker 2: has food on the table. But here's a bit of

880
00:42:40,133 --> 00:42:42,373
Speaker 2: the chapter, and then I'll mention the book. So telling

881
00:42:42,453 --> 00:42:46,093
Speaker 2: lies is an excellent way to complicate life and pilot

882
00:42:46,173 --> 00:42:46,933
Speaker 2: on stress.

883
00:42:46,693 --> 00:42:48,213
Speaker 3: Okay, I see what you're doing here. You're hoisting me

884
00:42:48,293 --> 00:42:49,253
Speaker 3: on my own potad.

885
00:42:49,573 --> 00:42:51,613
Speaker 2: Yep. So the book in question, by the way, is

886
00:42:51,613 --> 00:42:53,732
Speaker 2: a life less punishing Thirteen Ways to Love the Life

887
00:42:53,773 --> 00:42:56,172
Speaker 2: You've Got, written by Matt Heaths. Telling lies is an

888
00:42:56,213 --> 00:42:59,493
Speaker 2: excellent way to complicate life and pylon stress, whether it's

889
00:42:59,573 --> 00:43:04,173
Speaker 2: making untrue statements, creating false or misleading impressions, hiding secrets,

890
00:43:04,293 --> 00:43:07,973
Speaker 2: or telling white lies. In his book Lying, neuroscientist Sam

891
00:43:08,333 --> 00:43:11,933
Speaker 2: Harris makes a strong case against dishonesty. Dishonesty. He points

892
00:43:11,973 --> 00:43:15,613
Speaker 2: out that a liar must expand expend rather mental space

893
00:43:15,693 --> 00:43:19,333
Speaker 2: and energy to uphold a falsehood, remembering what he has

894
00:43:19,453 --> 00:43:22,093
Speaker 2: said to whom, and when this is effort you could

895
00:43:22,133 --> 00:43:25,533
Speaker 2: be using for authentic communication. This is well written. The

896
00:43:25,573 --> 00:43:29,093
Speaker 2: stress grows because a liar then has to analyze every

897
00:43:29,293 --> 00:43:32,453
Speaker 2: conversation to protect the lie. Whether you get rumbled on

898
00:43:32,573 --> 00:43:36,213
Speaker 2: it or not, it generally makes things more complex and difficult.

899
00:43:35,933 --> 00:43:37,812
Speaker 3: Whether you go and I can see why that book

900
00:43:37,893 --> 00:43:39,453
Speaker 3: by me was the number one best seller.

901
00:43:40,493 --> 00:43:41,413
Speaker 2: Very well brilliant.

902
00:43:41,453 --> 00:43:43,453
Speaker 3: But you have done what you've done there, Tyler, and

903
00:43:43,453 --> 00:43:46,093
Speaker 3: it's very clever. You've hoisted me on my own potat Yeah, correct,

904
00:43:46,173 --> 00:43:49,213
Speaker 3: because I have written extensive, extensively about how I think

905
00:43:49,293 --> 00:43:50,013
Speaker 3: liag is a bad thing.

906
00:43:50,053 --> 00:43:52,333
Speaker 2: I researched and what would Sam Harris think about So

907
00:43:52,413 --> 00:43:53,453
Speaker 2: this conversation.

908
00:43:53,133 --> 00:43:56,053
Speaker 3: Now I'm currently on shaky ground because I'm saying that

909
00:43:56,253 --> 00:43:58,293
Speaker 3: there are points. But in that book, I go on

910
00:43:58,413 --> 00:44:01,013
Speaker 3: to say I tried to spend a week not lying,

911
00:44:01,533 --> 00:44:05,493
Speaker 3: and then in the first five minutes, within five minutes

912
00:44:05,533 --> 00:44:08,293
Speaker 3: of trying, I lied when my my lovely partner asked

913
00:44:08,413 --> 00:44:12,493
Speaker 3: me whether I liked her matching brown shorts and single

914
00:44:12,533 --> 00:44:15,173
Speaker 3: it combo, Yeah, I said, it looks amazing, Daylor.

915
00:44:15,013 --> 00:44:15,732
Speaker 2: You're a smart man.

916
00:44:15,973 --> 00:44:19,373
Speaker 3: Yeah. So I failed on the first step with a

917
00:44:19,453 --> 00:44:19,933
Speaker 3: white life.

918
00:44:20,453 --> 00:44:22,613
Speaker 2: But when it comes to white lies, and this is

919
00:44:22,653 --> 00:44:24,933
Speaker 2: a question for you, Matt and for our listeners. So

920
00:44:25,293 --> 00:44:28,692
Speaker 2: to me, embellishing the CV or a white light if

921
00:44:28,733 --> 00:44:31,573
Speaker 2: it is done for a selfless purpose, whether that's getting

922
00:44:31,613 --> 00:44:34,733
Speaker 2: your job, to look after your family, or in that instance,

923
00:44:34,853 --> 00:44:37,653
Speaker 2: saying that your partner looks really good on whatever she's wearing,

924
00:44:37,693 --> 00:44:40,732
Speaker 2: even if she's not to me, is a selfless act.

925
00:44:40,813 --> 00:44:43,453
Speaker 2: So that's a difference. Even if it is dishonest, it

926
00:44:43,573 --> 00:44:47,373
Speaker 2: is still selfless. If you lie to better yourself. Then

927
00:44:47,453 --> 00:44:48,613
Speaker 2: that to me is a no.

928
00:44:48,733 --> 00:44:51,773
Speaker 3: No, is it a selfish act. The reason why you're

929
00:44:51,853 --> 00:44:54,213
Speaker 3: saying to your partner that they look great in this thing,

930
00:44:54,333 --> 00:44:57,213
Speaker 3: and they do look great in it, but maybe what

931
00:44:57,253 --> 00:44:59,853
Speaker 3: they're wearing slightly odd. The reason why you do that

932
00:45:00,053 --> 00:45:02,652
Speaker 3: is not to be selfless. You do it to get

933
00:45:02,733 --> 00:45:04,933
Speaker 3: rid of the hassle and just to smooth things over,

934
00:45:05,533 --> 00:45:08,853
Speaker 3: because the actual right thing to do is say, know,

935
00:45:09,453 --> 00:45:11,373
Speaker 3: that looks a bit weird, rather than them going out

936
00:45:11,413 --> 00:45:12,732
Speaker 3: and someone saying that's a bit weird.

937
00:45:12,853 --> 00:45:12,973
Speaker 11: Right.

938
00:45:13,453 --> 00:45:18,893
Speaker 3: And actually, if you're listening, Tracy, we've disgusted because she

939
00:45:18,933 --> 00:45:19,413
Speaker 3: read the book.

940
00:45:19,453 --> 00:45:21,173
Speaker 2: Yeah, and she read, But that was my brown outfit,

941
00:45:21,253 --> 00:45:24,173
Speaker 2: wasn't it? Your bloody lied you look good, Tracy. It

942
00:45:24,253 --> 00:45:25,813
Speaker 2: was just you know, the clothes were a bit different,

943
00:45:25,853 --> 00:45:27,333
Speaker 2: That's all. But yeah, I hears it.

944
00:45:27,493 --> 00:45:31,573
Speaker 3: So arguably, the honest truth makes people make the right

945
00:45:31,653 --> 00:45:35,692
Speaker 3: decision for themselves. And that's and I guess the reason

946
00:45:35,733 --> 00:45:37,973
Speaker 3: why I'm seeing a little bit of nuance in it

947
00:45:38,053 --> 00:45:40,613
Speaker 3: in the CV region is because you're trying to get

948
00:45:40,893 --> 00:45:43,733
Speaker 3: the Ah, God, it's hard. I could be on shaky

949
00:45:43,773 --> 00:45:48,252
Speaker 3: ground with maybe maybe if you think that you could

950
00:45:48,293 --> 00:45:50,853
Speaker 3: be great for the employer. Yes, right, if you honestly

951
00:45:50,973 --> 00:45:53,613
Speaker 3: believe that you can do the job and you'll be fantastic,

952
00:45:54,173 --> 00:45:57,093
Speaker 3: then maybe leaving a couple of things out and twisting

953
00:45:57,133 --> 00:45:59,573
Speaker 3: a few things here and there isn't the bad worst thing.

954
00:45:59,653 --> 00:46:01,533
Speaker 3: But yeah, I understand I'm on shaky ground logically.

955
00:46:01,613 --> 00:46:03,373
Speaker 2: Oh one hundred and eighty, ten to eighty. If you've

956
00:46:03,453 --> 00:46:07,013
Speaker 2: ever embellished on your CV, why did you do it?

957
00:46:07,093 --> 00:46:09,013
Speaker 2: And what did you embellish? Love to hear from you.

958
00:46:09,253 --> 00:46:12,973
Speaker 3: And look, we all agree that this muppet that's saying

959
00:46:13,053 --> 00:46:16,053
Speaker 3: he's got a doctorate from Yale and he didn't. I mean,

960
00:46:16,093 --> 00:46:18,253
Speaker 3: that's that's out the gate. That's insanity.

961
00:46:18,413 --> 00:46:21,293
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know that fabrication. Yeah, and a degree.

962
00:46:21,533 --> 00:46:23,253
Speaker 3: And if you're a pilot, don't say that you've got

963
00:46:23,293 --> 00:46:23,613
Speaker 3: your part.

964
00:46:23,733 --> 00:46:26,212
Speaker 2: Listen your tone. And if you're a heart surgeon, et cetera.

965
00:46:26,253 --> 00:46:29,053
Speaker 3: The obvious points, Mike, whatever you want to say to

966
00:46:29,173 --> 00:46:32,253
Speaker 3: a prospective boss, nothing beats a reference from former employers

967
00:46:32,333 --> 00:46:35,973
Speaker 3: to secure the job. So important keeps people honest and reliable. Yeah,

968
00:46:36,013 --> 00:46:38,172
Speaker 3: but I've always got people asking me to be their

969
00:46:38,213 --> 00:46:40,933
Speaker 3: reference and asking me to say certain things, and.

970
00:46:40,973 --> 00:46:42,893
Speaker 2: You've got to tell them a white lie and say look,

971
00:46:42,933 --> 00:46:43,213
Speaker 2: I'm just.

972
00:46:43,333 --> 00:46:45,413
Speaker 3: Well, I'm an honest person, so I don't. But if

973
00:46:45,453 --> 00:46:47,693
Speaker 3: they're asking me, they're actually asking around their groups of

974
00:46:47,733 --> 00:46:51,213
Speaker 3: friends to come up with references. Anyway, David, welcome to

975
00:46:51,253 --> 00:46:54,172
Speaker 3: the showy fellows. Are right, very good.

976
00:46:55,413 --> 00:46:57,853
Speaker 14: Just going back twenty five thirty years ago. Top of

977
00:46:57,893 --> 00:47:02,333
Speaker 14: thing when we were living in London, flatipus and one

978
00:47:02,373 --> 00:47:05,653
Speaker 14: of the guys went along. He was actually a property value,

979
00:47:07,013 --> 00:47:12,293
Speaker 14: quite a smart guy named Matt Taylor. He's got practice

980
00:47:12,333 --> 00:47:14,613
Speaker 14: here in New Zealand now. But anyway, he went along

981
00:47:15,253 --> 00:47:18,812
Speaker 14: to a job as a handyman and the guy said

982
00:47:18,813 --> 00:47:20,453
Speaker 14: to Mark, could you go and hang a door? And

983
00:47:20,573 --> 00:47:23,573
Speaker 14: he goes, I met before and he goes, oh, well

984
00:47:24,333 --> 00:47:26,813
Speaker 14: could you go to knock down this wall? And he goes,

985
00:47:27,173 --> 00:47:30,053
Speaker 14: well I'm not too sure, I've never done that before.

986
00:47:30,773 --> 00:47:33,413
Speaker 14: And he asked him something about and then they got

987
00:47:34,493 --> 00:47:36,453
Speaker 14: what's the handing about you? And he goes, I just

988
00:47:36,533 --> 00:47:37,293
Speaker 14: live around.

989
00:47:37,053 --> 00:47:41,252
Speaker 3: The corner, so he is a handy man.

990
00:47:41,533 --> 00:47:45,493
Speaker 14: Yeah, And he laughed him off and carried on the goad.

991
00:47:45,933 --> 00:47:48,093
Speaker 14: They just ended up on the building side shed of

992
00:47:48,173 --> 00:47:52,573
Speaker 14: boxing with some old Irish guy getting paid the same money.

993
00:47:52,733 --> 00:47:55,172
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a great Yeah, that's good one.

994
00:47:55,253 --> 00:47:58,172
Speaker 14: Thanks how many time you can how many times I've

995
00:47:58,213 --> 00:47:59,813
Speaker 14: told that story to people?

996
00:48:00,173 --> 00:48:02,733
Speaker 3: Yeah, well you nailed the delivery of it. Thank you

997
00:48:02,773 --> 00:48:06,293
Speaker 3: so much for your call, David. Now, I had a

998
00:48:06,333 --> 00:48:09,333
Speaker 3: friend who he was working in the mind over and

999
00:48:10,453 --> 00:48:12,933
Speaker 3: you know Australia, as so many of us do, and

1000
00:48:13,453 --> 00:48:15,413
Speaker 3: he sought he wanted to get out of the mines

1001
00:48:15,573 --> 00:48:17,733
Speaker 3: and he took a job on a farm. It was

1002
00:48:17,773 --> 00:48:20,453
Speaker 3: a sort of a man from Snow River situation. If

1003
00:48:20,493 --> 00:48:23,133
Speaker 3: you're listening, you know who you are, and you know

1004
00:48:23,173 --> 00:48:25,893
Speaker 3: who you are, Logan Pain. And I won't use this

1005
00:48:25,933 --> 00:48:27,733
Speaker 3: full name. I'll take that back. We'll call him l

1006
00:48:27,853 --> 00:48:31,453
Speaker 3: Pain now, we'll call them Logan p. Anyway, he just

1007
00:48:31,533 --> 00:48:36,133
Speaker 3: turned up and for a job breaking in horses, and

1008
00:48:36,973 --> 00:48:40,613
Speaker 3: so he arrived with this farmer, you know, out back,

1009
00:48:41,053 --> 00:48:42,733
Speaker 3: and the guy said, okay, let's see what you got,

1010
00:48:42,773 --> 00:48:45,853
Speaker 3: and he got a Logan to his credit, got with

1011
00:48:45,973 --> 00:48:48,413
Speaker 3: a horse and tried to imitate what it was like

1012
00:48:48,533 --> 00:48:51,973
Speaker 3: to break in the horse. And then eventually the farmer

1013
00:48:52,053 --> 00:48:53,613
Speaker 3: just said, mate, you've never been near a horse in

1014
00:48:53,653 --> 00:48:55,973
Speaker 3: your life, as you have you and Logan said no.

1015
00:48:56,133 --> 00:48:58,013
Speaker 3: And then and the farmer said, you know, I'll give

1016
00:48:58,013 --> 00:49:00,293
Speaker 3: you a job. Just the pure gumption for you to

1017
00:49:00,373 --> 00:49:02,812
Speaker 3: come out here and try and break in a horse

1018
00:49:02,853 --> 00:49:04,973
Speaker 3: and nearly kill yourself means you've got something.

1019
00:49:05,013 --> 00:49:07,573
Speaker 2: Mate. That's his sort of king. Ended up working for

1020
00:49:07,653 --> 00:49:08,293
Speaker 2: him for quite a while.

1021
00:49:08,373 --> 00:49:08,893
Speaker 14: I love that.

1022
00:49:09,093 --> 00:49:11,453
Speaker 2: Oh one hundred eighty ten eighty is the number to call.

1023
00:49:11,613 --> 00:49:13,853
Speaker 2: It is sixteen past two. Plenty of texts to get

1024
00:49:13,893 --> 00:49:14,692
Speaker 2: to as well.

1025
00:49:16,693 --> 00:49:20,853
Speaker 1: Your home of afternoon Talk Matt Heathen, Taylor Adams afternoons

1026
00:49:21,093 --> 00:49:24,133
Speaker 1: call Oh, eight hundred eighty ten eighty youth Talk said.

1027
00:49:24,013 --> 00:49:24,093
Speaker 16: Be.

1028
00:49:26,453 --> 00:49:29,493
Speaker 2: Very good afternoon, dear. We're talking about embellishing on your CV.

1029
00:49:29,773 --> 00:49:33,333
Speaker 2: On the back of his story about a gentleman who lied,

1030
00:49:33,733 --> 00:49:36,333
Speaker 2: straight up lied about a doctorate that he said he

1031
00:49:36,373 --> 00:49:38,613
Speaker 2: got at Yale during a speech to the University of Texas,

1032
00:49:38,693 --> 00:49:40,893
Speaker 2: But he never got that degree. He studied at Yale

1033
00:49:41,213 --> 00:49:44,453
Speaker 2: online during COVID. His name is Farlet. Andrew Lesso was

1034
00:49:44,533 --> 00:49:47,652
Speaker 2: appointed to quite a high powered job and now he's

1035
00:49:47,693 --> 00:49:49,253
Speaker 2: decided to resign from everything.

1036
00:49:49,613 --> 00:49:52,853
Speaker 3: This Texter who's a recruiter says, Hi, guys, who are

1037
00:49:52,893 --> 00:49:56,253
Speaker 3: the absolute muppets who are conducting the interviews. Any decent

1038
00:49:56,333 --> 00:49:58,893
Speaker 3: recruiter would expose all eyes and then the applicant would

1039
00:49:58,933 --> 00:50:01,733
Speaker 3: never get a chance to get another opportunity. Cheers Graham.

1040
00:50:02,373 --> 00:50:04,413
Speaker 3: This Texas says, I've hired a lot of people into

1041
00:50:04,653 --> 00:50:07,413
Speaker 3: accountancy jobs over the years, never really cared what's in

1042
00:50:07,493 --> 00:50:10,573
Speaker 3: the CV more if I can communicate easily with them,

1043
00:50:11,293 --> 00:50:14,773
Speaker 3: always looking to provide some upskilled opportunities. Perhaps some embellishment

1044
00:50:14,933 --> 00:50:17,773
Speaker 3: may have filtered a few of my hires out right.

1045
00:50:19,013 --> 00:50:21,253
Speaker 3: What if you endanger others, sayss texta at getting the

1046
00:50:21,333 --> 00:50:25,573
Speaker 3: job via lying, Matt, You're on very shaky ground. I

1047
00:50:25,893 --> 00:50:27,773
Speaker 3: really do believe I can drive this to go.

1048
00:50:27,893 --> 00:50:32,053
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, but you made the point that if it's

1049
00:50:32,093 --> 00:50:35,172
Speaker 2: a pilot, for example, when you say that you've got

1050
00:50:35,253 --> 00:50:38,893
Speaker 2: ten thousand flight hours and you've got zero flight hours,

1051
00:50:39,093 --> 00:50:42,613
Speaker 2: that is very different to say that I've got attention

1052
00:50:42,733 --> 00:50:44,533
Speaker 2: to detail and I'm a team player and you might

1053
00:50:44,573 --> 00:50:45,333
Speaker 2: not be a team player.

1054
00:50:45,453 --> 00:50:47,493
Speaker 3: Well yeah, It's like the example I gave when I

1055
00:50:47,573 --> 00:50:50,773
Speaker 3: was going for a TV editing job, editing for a

1056
00:50:50,813 --> 00:50:55,493
Speaker 3: TV station, an overnight editor, and they said the software

1057
00:50:55,533 --> 00:50:58,653
Speaker 3: that they use, and I said, yeah, I can do that,

1058
00:50:59,613 --> 00:51:01,733
Speaker 3: but I hadn't done it before. But I backed myself

1059
00:51:01,773 --> 00:51:04,373
Speaker 3: before I started the job to learn the software exactly,

1060
00:51:04,373 --> 00:51:05,653
Speaker 3: and that was a difference between getting the job and

1061
00:51:05,733 --> 00:51:07,413
Speaker 3: not getting the job and getting the job. I mean,

1062
00:51:07,453 --> 00:51:09,653
Speaker 3: I could feed the fan so sweet airs.

1063
00:51:09,693 --> 00:51:11,533
Speaker 2: And nobody's going to die, and then using a different

1064
00:51:11,813 --> 00:51:14,732
Speaker 2: and then then I landed it and was buddy, great, yeah,

1065
00:51:14,773 --> 00:51:16,293
Speaker 2: and look at you now, I wait, one hundred and

1066
00:51:16,333 --> 00:51:19,453
Speaker 2: eighty teen eighties the number to call Jack. Your thoughts

1067
00:51:19,493 --> 00:51:21,773
Speaker 2: on this very good? Yeah, I have.

1068
00:51:22,293 --> 00:51:24,293
Speaker 6: There's a couple of things, just just The first one

1069
00:51:24,453 --> 00:51:26,893
Speaker 6: was there was a politician that declared he had a

1070
00:51:26,933 --> 00:51:28,893
Speaker 6: couple of degrees and he didn't and he was a

1071
00:51:28,973 --> 00:51:31,413
Speaker 6: leader of a political party, and the the you know,

1072
00:51:31,533 --> 00:51:37,133
Speaker 6: that's pretty pretty rude. Really, yeah, it's just disgusting. I

1073
00:51:37,253 --> 00:51:40,173
Speaker 6: found that out. I'm a I'm a I've got a

1074
00:51:40,213 --> 00:51:43,133
Speaker 6: couple of degrees myself, and I had a company and

1075
00:51:43,213 --> 00:51:46,252
Speaker 6: I was hiring people from overseas because they were hard

1076
00:51:46,293 --> 00:51:48,732
Speaker 6: to find in New Zealand. And when I found out,

1077
00:51:48,933 --> 00:51:52,533
Speaker 6: James Shott, really I really got really really angry with

1078
00:51:52,613 --> 00:51:55,413
Speaker 6: that because it's not it's not it's not really really right.

1079
00:51:57,013 --> 00:51:59,893
Speaker 2: So can I just get sorry because I'm not I

1080
00:51:59,973 --> 00:52:01,013
Speaker 2: see this on TV?

1081
00:52:01,493 --> 00:52:03,853
Speaker 3: Was it on a c as LinkedIn?

1082
00:52:03,973 --> 00:52:07,133
Speaker 6: Was it yeah, yeah, when you when you googled him

1083
00:52:07,213 --> 00:52:11,293
Speaker 6: on his part elementary when they say what they are

1084
00:52:11,373 --> 00:52:14,533
Speaker 6: in their parliamentary standards. He had a degree in Wellington

1085
00:52:14,773 --> 00:52:17,813
Speaker 6: University and he had a degree in bath University in Scotland,

1086
00:52:18,573 --> 00:52:20,293
Speaker 6: and when they checked them, they were all bullshit. He

1087
00:52:20,373 --> 00:52:21,573
Speaker 6: didn't have anything anyway.

1088
00:52:21,693 --> 00:52:24,692
Speaker 2: I got just got to make sure where I create

1089
00:52:24,813 --> 00:52:28,533
Speaker 2: that Jack slightly, and you're quite right about the Bachelor

1090
00:52:28,573 --> 00:52:30,573
Speaker 2: of Arts, but that was on his LinkedIn and I'm

1091
00:52:30,613 --> 00:52:32,573
Speaker 2: not defending this at all, but I'll just read back

1092
00:52:32,613 --> 00:52:34,533
Speaker 2: what that story was at the time. So he had

1093
00:52:34,573 --> 00:52:36,053
Speaker 2: to go back and never look at his socials to

1094
00:52:36,133 --> 00:52:38,213
Speaker 2: correct his study history. Asked if he had a Bacheler

1095
00:52:38,213 --> 00:52:40,613
Speaker 2: of Laws, sure said he didn't, so why did his

1096
00:52:40,693 --> 00:52:42,613
Speaker 2: LinkedIn say he did, I haven't looked at my Lincoln

1097
00:52:42,653 --> 00:52:45,172
Speaker 2: in years LinkedIn in years? He said, I will take

1098
00:52:45,173 --> 00:52:46,693
Speaker 2: a look at it. But ultimately, when I put the

1099
00:52:46,733 --> 00:52:48,733
Speaker 2: stuff on my LinkedIn, I put the dates I was

1100
00:52:48,813 --> 00:52:51,453
Speaker 2: studying towards the BA. But I've always been very open,

1101
00:52:51,533 --> 00:52:53,053
Speaker 2: and I've joked about it quite a lot that my

1102
00:52:53,173 --> 00:52:55,453
Speaker 2: qualification for this job is that I am a middle

1103
00:52:55,453 --> 00:52:56,212
Speaker 2: class guy.

1104
00:52:56,413 --> 00:52:58,613
Speaker 3: So hang on a minute, how did he get the

1105
00:52:58,693 --> 00:52:59,533
Speaker 3: point we.

1106
00:52:59,573 --> 00:53:01,853
Speaker 6: Don't need to we don't really done it to go

1107
00:53:02,053 --> 00:53:04,293
Speaker 6: he did anyway, he lied it. But the thing is,

1108
00:53:04,373 --> 00:53:06,413
Speaker 6: when you're a guy like me as an engineer, I'm

1109
00:53:06,453 --> 00:53:09,173
Speaker 6: the engineering company, and when you're spending a lot of

1110
00:53:09,253 --> 00:53:12,293
Speaker 6: money hiring people and you've got these people come up

1111
00:53:12,333 --> 00:53:14,453
Speaker 6: and say they've got these things, and whether they've forgotten it,

1112
00:53:14,493 --> 00:53:17,333
Speaker 6: you don't forget these things, right. And I was spending

1113
00:53:17,333 --> 00:53:21,453
Speaker 6: a lot of money as a business owner trying to

1114
00:53:21,573 --> 00:53:26,172
Speaker 6: hire qualified people, and there was very short We were

1115
00:53:26,293 --> 00:53:28,373
Speaker 6: very short at the time ten and fifteen years ago

1116
00:53:28,653 --> 00:53:33,773
Speaker 6: of very highly qualified engineers. So I was actually hiring

1117
00:53:33,853 --> 00:53:36,293
Speaker 6: people from overseas. And there was a certain country where

1118
00:53:36,333 --> 00:53:38,212
Speaker 6: a lot of people were running away. I won't stay where,

1119
00:53:38,293 --> 00:53:40,333
Speaker 6: but they were coming to His Zealand with these cvs

1120
00:53:41,053 --> 00:53:42,453
Speaker 6: and they look like they're pretty good.

1121
00:53:42,453 --> 00:53:42,813
Speaker 15: And I was.

1122
00:53:43,213 --> 00:53:45,693
Speaker 6: I hired one guy and I says, mate, are you

1123
00:53:45,853 --> 00:53:48,252
Speaker 6: really an engineer? I was watching his work and I says, mate,

1124
00:53:49,133 --> 00:53:50,693
Speaker 6: who was doing the work for you?

1125
00:53:50,773 --> 00:53:51,013
Speaker 4: Is old?

1126
00:53:51,053 --> 00:53:52,773
Speaker 6: We had other followers do the work. We just set

1127
00:53:52,813 --> 00:53:56,333
Speaker 6: in an office and I sacked him immediately. He took

1128
00:53:56,373 --> 00:53:58,613
Speaker 6: me to the small claims court. I just ignored him

1129
00:53:58,653 --> 00:54:00,333
Speaker 6: to turn up. I kept on throwing the letter and

1130
00:54:00,693 --> 00:54:03,133
Speaker 6: I didn't turn up at all. And when they said

1131
00:54:03,133 --> 00:54:04,493
Speaker 6: they're going to they're going to have me up for

1132
00:54:04,533 --> 00:54:07,093
Speaker 6: a fine, I just ignored them because the guy wasn't qualified.

1133
00:54:07,613 --> 00:54:08,253
Speaker 4: He said he was.

1134
00:54:09,253 --> 00:54:11,653
Speaker 6: But then when I had several other guys came in

1135
00:54:11,773 --> 00:54:14,333
Speaker 6: from the same country with these big cvs who didn't

1136
00:54:14,493 --> 00:54:16,373
Speaker 6: see that the CV's out for you guys, because I

1137
00:54:16,373 --> 00:54:20,053
Speaker 6: couldn't checked the qualifications. So in the end I asked them,

1138
00:54:20,213 --> 00:54:22,093
Speaker 6: I said, well, there's a worlder there, there's a peat

1139
00:54:22,133 --> 00:54:23,533
Speaker 6: weld in the midweld, and I want your well, this

1140
00:54:23,613 --> 00:54:25,093
Speaker 6: sends up for me. And you know, none of them

1141
00:54:25,093 --> 00:54:28,613
Speaker 6: could act welopers. And they go from this country where

1142
00:54:28,613 --> 00:54:30,613
Speaker 6: you couldn't check them out, and I says, well where

1143
00:54:30,653 --> 00:54:33,573
Speaker 6: did you guys learn you get do degrees from? And

1144
00:54:33,693 --> 00:54:36,613
Speaker 6: I thought, Jesus is difficult. You know, it's really difficult

1145
00:54:36,653 --> 00:54:40,413
Speaker 6: to check the place from a certain countries with their qualifications.

1146
00:54:40,533 --> 00:54:43,813
Speaker 6: And I think it was so hard when you own

1147
00:54:43,893 --> 00:54:46,533
Speaker 6: a company and you've got it, you've got a lot

1148
00:54:46,573 --> 00:54:48,933
Speaker 6: of work on and you get these people with these

1149
00:54:49,013 --> 00:54:51,053
Speaker 6: bulls at TVs and you say, well, how do you

1150
00:54:51,173 --> 00:54:51,652
Speaker 6: really work?

1151
00:54:51,853 --> 00:54:54,173
Speaker 3: So it's the current situation. You'll know this because I

1152
00:54:54,213 --> 00:54:56,893
Speaker 3: know there's ninety day trials or whatever. And we had

1153
00:54:56,933 --> 00:54:59,213
Speaker 3: a caller before Cahn, I think it was who was

1154
00:54:59,253 --> 00:55:01,933
Speaker 3: saying that he offers when he goes for a job, Look,

1155
00:55:01,933 --> 00:55:03,613
Speaker 3: I'll work for you for free for a day and

1156
00:55:03,693 --> 00:55:05,813
Speaker 3: show you what I can do. So what is the

1157
00:55:06,453 --> 00:55:10,253
Speaker 3: you know, there's there's a job interview, a practical side

1158
00:55:10,253 --> 00:55:12,652
Speaker 3: of it. Sounds like that's what you do, Jack, as

1159
00:55:12,733 --> 00:55:13,573
Speaker 3: you go, well.

1160
00:55:14,613 --> 00:55:16,973
Speaker 6: I'm retired and now I gave up. It's just too difficult.

1161
00:55:17,893 --> 00:55:19,893
Speaker 6: One of the last governments that made it too differ

1162
00:55:19,973 --> 00:55:21,853
Speaker 6: with me to be in business. I gave it up

1163
00:55:21,853 --> 00:55:22,173
Speaker 6: in the end.

1164
00:55:22,373 --> 00:55:23,653
Speaker 2: But but you know what I mean, you know, you

1165
00:55:23,693 --> 00:55:24,692
Speaker 2: know know what I'm saying. Jack.

1166
00:55:24,773 --> 00:55:27,293
Speaker 3: It seems like in your in your world, it would

1167
00:55:27,333 --> 00:55:29,613
Speaker 3: make sense that you go, it's not let's have a

1168
00:55:29,653 --> 00:55:31,613
Speaker 3: talky bit. We'll sit around and you can talk about

1169
00:55:31,653 --> 00:55:33,933
Speaker 3: we'll read your CV, but let's go out into the

1170
00:55:34,373 --> 00:55:36,813
Speaker 3: out on the floor and see what you can actually do.

1171
00:55:37,053 --> 00:55:37,773
Speaker 12: That's that's right.

1172
00:55:38,893 --> 00:55:40,733
Speaker 6: You've got to give them a trial here and sometimes

1173
00:55:40,813 --> 00:55:44,373
Speaker 6: some of the in the engineering world, it's quite sophisticated

1174
00:55:44,373 --> 00:55:46,812
Speaker 6: because lots of different world you know, it's different parts

1175
00:55:46,853 --> 00:55:49,732
Speaker 6: to it. They work the engine. There's lots of different bits,

1176
00:55:49,773 --> 00:55:51,733
Speaker 6: and some people are good at some bits and some

1177
00:55:51,813 --> 00:55:53,453
Speaker 6: people are good at others, and you work that out

1178
00:55:53,493 --> 00:55:55,413
Speaker 6: and you can streamline them to that sort of work.

1179
00:55:56,013 --> 00:55:57,893
Speaker 6: So you look through the work that they've done, and

1180
00:55:58,053 --> 00:56:00,133
Speaker 6: I try to go from England. He was very very

1181
00:56:00,173 --> 00:56:04,253
Speaker 6: good on farm machinery, but useless on everything else. So

1182
00:56:04,413 --> 00:56:06,933
Speaker 6: you sort of how much farm machinery work do I do?

1183
00:56:07,453 --> 00:56:07,933
Speaker 13: You know what I mean?

1184
00:56:07,973 --> 00:56:10,053
Speaker 6: And how which value is this guy going to be

1185
00:56:10,173 --> 00:56:16,813
Speaker 6: for me? Inc You're not going to really be beneficial

1186
00:56:16,853 --> 00:56:18,333
Speaker 6: to me because you can't do this. He says, all,

1187
00:56:18,333 --> 00:56:20,453
Speaker 6: you're going to give me three three months thing, And

1188
00:56:20,533 --> 00:56:22,373
Speaker 6: I said, well, I'll give you three months right now.

1189
00:56:22,973 --> 00:56:24,652
Speaker 6: There's the door out you go, and he says, I'll

1190
00:56:24,693 --> 00:56:26,413
Speaker 6: take you to court. I just made I can't be bothered.

1191
00:56:26,493 --> 00:56:30,413
Speaker 6: Let's go away. And I had one guy had me

1192
00:56:30,453 --> 00:56:32,413
Speaker 6: on he's going to assume me and everything else. I said, look,

1193
00:56:32,493 --> 00:56:34,653
Speaker 6: just I haven't got any time for this sort of stuff.

1194
00:56:35,413 --> 00:56:37,293
Speaker 6: So what I did in the end, and I'd laid

1195
00:56:37,333 --> 00:56:39,453
Speaker 6: one guy off, I just kept on throwing throwing the

1196
00:56:39,693 --> 00:56:41,613
Speaker 6: letters from the rubbish, and I just couldn't be bothered

1197
00:56:41,653 --> 00:56:44,093
Speaker 6: with it, and they tried to take me to court

1198
00:56:44,173 --> 00:56:46,693
Speaker 6: and I just didn't play the game. Honestly, I couldn't

1199
00:56:46,693 --> 00:56:48,253
Speaker 6: play the game, which just skipt on threaten of the bin.

1200
00:56:49,573 --> 00:56:52,613
Speaker 6: They said I was too difficult to deal with. They's

1201
00:56:52,693 --> 00:56:55,493
Speaker 6: top bothering me because I really said, I look, I

1202
00:56:55,613 --> 00:57:00,053
Speaker 6: wanted somebody that said the CV was a lie. I

1203
00:57:00,173 --> 00:57:02,613
Speaker 6: had sex good guys working for me, and I wanted

1204
00:57:02,693 --> 00:57:04,453
Speaker 6: eight and I couldn't find two more.

1205
00:57:05,293 --> 00:57:07,573
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's that's rough, Jack. Sorry, we got to go

1206
00:57:07,613 --> 00:57:10,013
Speaker 3: to the break. But you know what I'm saying, though,

1207
00:57:11,253 --> 00:57:13,653
Speaker 3: you know, there's the there's you know, maybe it's not.

1208
00:57:14,293 --> 00:57:16,493
Speaker 3: You don't even need three months for most jobs. You

1209
00:57:16,613 --> 00:57:19,293
Speaker 3: get someone in for a day and the rubble would

1210
00:57:19,333 --> 00:57:20,733
Speaker 3: hit the road where they can do what they said

1211
00:57:20,733 --> 00:57:21,173
Speaker 3: they're going to do.

1212
00:57:21,253 --> 00:57:24,813
Speaker 2: Definitely, particularly an engineering firm say all right, there's the machine,

1213
00:57:24,853 --> 00:57:25,333
Speaker 2: go for gold.

1214
00:57:25,413 --> 00:57:27,533
Speaker 3: I was like Jack saying that if it's a very

1215
00:57:27,653 --> 00:57:30,053
Speaker 3: you know, there's a there's a lot to it, you know, Yeah, yeah,

1216
00:57:30,533 --> 00:57:31,973
Speaker 3: a lot lot of different disciplines.

1217
00:57:32,053 --> 00:57:33,333
Speaker 2: Yep, absolutely, thank you very much.

1218
00:57:33,413 --> 00:57:33,573
Speaker 7: Jack.

1219
00:57:33,613 --> 00:57:35,333
Speaker 2: Got to take a break, but back with more of

1220
00:57:35,373 --> 00:57:37,453
Speaker 2: your call shortly, oh eight hundred eighty ten eighties.

1221
00:57:37,453 --> 00:57:38,173
Speaker 3: The number to call.

1222
00:57:41,973 --> 00:57:45,333
Speaker 1: Matt Heath and Taylor Adams afternoons call oh eight hundred

1223
00:57:45,413 --> 00:57:47,533
Speaker 1: eighty ten eighty. On News Talk vs.

1224
00:57:47,773 --> 00:57:52,093
Speaker 3: Twenty nine past two, we're talking about CV embellishment, Tony.

1225
00:57:52,213 --> 00:57:54,213
Speaker 3: You've got an employer's perspective on this.

1226
00:57:56,333 --> 00:58:00,333
Speaker 2: Oh you godae mate, and what's your take on it

1227
00:58:00,373 --> 00:58:01,013
Speaker 2: as an employer?

1228
00:58:02,413 --> 00:58:04,893
Speaker 13: So Justina, Yeah, I was you on the CVS and

1229
00:58:06,453 --> 00:58:09,253
Speaker 13: you know we employed that forty forty stuff. We don't

1230
00:58:10,333 --> 00:58:13,533
Speaker 13: advertise really off, but I've been doing one or two

1231
00:58:13,613 --> 00:58:16,373
Speaker 13: lately because I've had a couple of guys retire and

1232
00:58:17,093 --> 00:58:20,333
Speaker 13: the big things we ask for on a CV for

1233
00:58:20,493 --> 00:58:23,333
Speaker 13: three previous employers, their phone numbers. We don't really care

1234
00:58:23,333 --> 00:58:25,773
Speaker 13: about a reference. We try to make it some it's

1235
00:58:25,813 --> 00:58:32,173
Speaker 13: not three people I've worked for and just maybe how

1236
00:58:32,213 --> 00:58:34,413
Speaker 13: long they've worked somewhere, like when they see in the CV,

1237
00:58:34,533 --> 00:58:36,493
Speaker 13: that's about all I look at. I don't take too

1238
00:58:36,573 --> 00:58:40,213
Speaker 13: much notice of what they're say they do or because

1239
00:58:40,213 --> 00:58:46,093
Speaker 13: everyone's a good team good team person. Yeah, they're all

1240
00:58:46,253 --> 00:58:49,933
Speaker 13: fairly matched the same And the main thing for me

1241
00:58:50,093 --> 00:58:52,853
Speaker 13: is if I don't get those people, they just go

1242
00:58:52,973 --> 00:58:56,453
Speaker 13: on the bin. We might get twenty or thirty cvs.

1243
00:58:56,613 --> 00:59:00,373
Speaker 13: So my big thing is anyone's listening. You really want

1244
00:59:00,413 --> 00:59:01,813
Speaker 13: to put in there what people are asking.

1245
00:59:03,973 --> 00:59:06,693
Speaker 2: Yeah, and so just growing back to the referees, do

1246
00:59:06,813 --> 00:59:08,653
Speaker 2: you ring them or you don't even ring? You just

1247
00:59:08,693 --> 00:59:10,533
Speaker 2: got to make sure that you've got your three referees

1248
00:59:10,573 --> 00:59:12,413
Speaker 2: there with numbers, and that for you is enough that

1249
00:59:12,533 --> 00:59:15,253
Speaker 2: they you at least start to give them a shot.

1250
00:59:16,373 --> 00:59:18,533
Speaker 1: Hi, one hundred ring though no you yeah?

1251
00:59:19,053 --> 00:59:22,373
Speaker 13: Yeah, And if I can't get them unfortunately, I do

1252
00:59:22,573 --> 00:59:24,573
Speaker 13: have to flip those cbs as well.

1253
00:59:25,253 --> 00:59:26,573
Speaker 2: What about that catch twenty two?

1254
00:59:27,453 --> 00:59:29,933
Speaker 3: What about that catch sorry, Tony, what about that catch

1255
00:59:30,013 --> 00:59:32,813
Speaker 3: twenty two situation where you've just finished training?

1256
00:59:33,253 --> 00:59:35,253
Speaker 2: You're good, but you need to get your first job?

1257
00:59:35,333 --> 00:59:36,973
Speaker 3: If you know what I'm saying, Like, how do you

1258
00:59:37,493 --> 00:59:38,893
Speaker 3: how do you get into your first job if you

1259
00:59:38,973 --> 00:59:41,293
Speaker 3: need three referees before you can start.

1260
00:59:42,493 --> 00:59:46,453
Speaker 13: They might have teachers. That doesn't necessarily someone that've worked

1261
00:59:46,453 --> 00:59:49,853
Speaker 13: for most, right people, I would have thought they would

1262
00:59:49,853 --> 00:59:54,013
Speaker 13: have done something or like, we like local people, so

1263
00:59:54,133 --> 00:59:59,533
Speaker 13: they might know someone who we know for Yeah, that's

1264
00:59:59,573 --> 01:00:00,933
Speaker 13: tracking for the young ones. And to be sure we

1265
01:00:01,133 --> 01:00:03,293
Speaker 13: like the young ones. We've got about we've probably got

1266
01:00:04,733 --> 01:00:09,773
Speaker 13: half a dozen guys under twenty five even more probably

1267
01:00:09,773 --> 01:00:13,653
Speaker 13: about that actually, so we like getting to them, but

1268
01:00:13,773 --> 01:00:16,253
Speaker 13: we just got to persevere with the young.

1269
01:00:17,813 --> 01:00:18,933
Speaker 4: Yeah, we do you like them?

1270
01:00:18,973 --> 01:00:22,453
Speaker 13: And I've got about seven questions, So I asked those

1271
01:00:22,533 --> 01:00:25,253
Speaker 13: employees then't eb eight dollops them and if anyone gets

1272
01:00:25,293 --> 01:00:30,053
Speaker 13: to know, it's yeah, that's the end of it as well.

1273
01:00:30,213 --> 01:00:31,853
Speaker 2: Can you give us those can you give us those

1274
01:00:31,893 --> 01:00:32,533
Speaker 2: key questions?

1275
01:00:34,013 --> 01:00:39,133
Speaker 13: You can ask you that. One of them is don't

1276
01:00:39,293 --> 01:00:42,653
Speaker 13: not any sort of order? How they get on with

1277
01:00:43,333 --> 01:00:48,253
Speaker 13: people like that they work with and whoever's employer was,

1278
01:00:48,413 --> 01:00:52,013
Speaker 13: or probably school teacher, someone that they've given me, who's

1279
01:00:52,053 --> 01:00:57,533
Speaker 13: a friend or whatever. And one of th questions is

1280
01:00:58,053 --> 01:01:02,173
Speaker 13: what's the attitude? Will tell the safety? Do they say

1281
01:01:02,213 --> 01:01:06,493
Speaker 13: it's strap or you know, do they just to say yep,

1282
01:01:06,573 --> 01:01:07,173
Speaker 13: we go and.

1283
01:01:07,413 --> 01:01:08,053
Speaker 12: It's all gird.

1284
01:01:10,333 --> 01:01:12,653
Speaker 2: Oh we got Yeah, just lost Tony.

1285
01:01:12,733 --> 01:01:14,853
Speaker 3: We lost Tony before people got their questions to bone

1286
01:01:14,893 --> 01:01:15,053
Speaker 3: up on.

1287
01:01:15,173 --> 01:01:15,333
Speaker 14: Yep.

1288
01:01:15,373 --> 01:01:17,973
Speaker 2: Sounds like you're a good employer, though, Tony. Hey, here's

1289
01:01:17,973 --> 01:01:21,653
Speaker 2: a good text, guys. Richard Branson says, if somebody offers

1290
01:01:21,693 --> 01:01:24,013
Speaker 2: you an amazing opportunity but you are not sure if

1291
01:01:24,013 --> 01:01:25,973
Speaker 2: you can do it, say yes, then learn how to

1292
01:01:26,053 --> 01:01:26,533
Speaker 2: do it later.

1293
01:01:26,853 --> 01:01:28,493
Speaker 3: See, that was what I was saying. That's what I

1294
01:01:28,573 --> 01:01:31,933
Speaker 3: did around this particular editing software. It's a bit different

1295
01:01:31,973 --> 01:01:34,133
Speaker 3: than this text here. I worked at an international airline,

1296
01:01:34,213 --> 01:01:38,213
Speaker 3: was involved in the simulator and training phase, flying passengers

1297
01:01:38,253 --> 01:01:40,653
Speaker 3: with a couple of guys who were clearly fraudulent in

1298
01:01:40,693 --> 01:01:41,853
Speaker 3: their claims of experience.

1299
01:01:42,293 --> 01:01:45,093
Speaker 2: They would fired. I mean, yeah, there's levels.

1300
01:01:45,173 --> 01:01:47,853
Speaker 3: There's one thing when you sort of slightly embellish things

1301
01:01:48,933 --> 01:01:51,933
Speaker 3: as opposed to anything to do with flying people or

1302
01:01:51,973 --> 01:01:55,853
Speaker 3: putting people's lives at riskin very different. So this text is, so,

1303
01:01:55,933 --> 01:01:58,013
Speaker 3: which is it Matt okay to lie to benefit your

1304
01:01:58,013 --> 01:02:00,453
Speaker 3: family or because the employee will benefit You're putting a

1305
01:02:00,493 --> 01:02:03,213
Speaker 3: lot of energies into justifying your big fat Porky's says

1306
01:02:03,213 --> 01:02:07,173
Speaker 3: the sext there. Yeah, looking back now, and I actually

1307
01:02:07,213 --> 01:02:10,453
Speaker 3: think that maybe generally speaking, it's best to be as

1308
01:02:10,493 --> 01:02:13,773
Speaker 3: honest as you possibly can. Yeah, generally speaking, and as

1309
01:02:13,813 --> 01:02:16,213
Speaker 3: you wrote in your generally yeah, just be honest. Come on,

1310
01:02:16,453 --> 01:02:19,653
Speaker 3: as you wrote in your book, it makes things complicated, right,

1311
01:02:19,693 --> 01:02:22,773
Speaker 3: and just add stress. Even white lies sometimes. Yeah, yeah,

1312
01:02:22,853 --> 01:02:23,293
Speaker 3: that's right.

1313
01:02:23,333 --> 01:02:25,773
Speaker 2: All right, all right, good discussion, Thank you very I

1314
01:02:25,813 --> 01:02:26,213
Speaker 2: think we can.

1315
01:02:26,133 --> 01:02:27,693
Speaker 3: All agree with this guy that said that he had

1316
01:02:27,733 --> 01:02:31,293
Speaker 3: a doctorate from Yale, you know, even though it was

1317
01:02:31,373 --> 01:02:33,453
Speaker 3: just in a speech, not a CV mate.

1318
01:02:33,533 --> 01:02:33,973
Speaker 2: Don't do that.

1319
01:02:34,213 --> 01:02:37,333
Speaker 3: That's silly. That is very sad as an absolute muppet show.

1320
01:02:37,413 --> 01:02:40,893
Speaker 2: Yeah, right, headlines with Raylen coming up. Then we want

1321
01:02:40,933 --> 01:02:44,133
Speaker 2: to have a chat about NCEA. Is there a problem

1322
01:02:44,253 --> 01:02:46,733
Speaker 2: with that? If you're a student, if you're a parent,

1323
01:02:46,773 --> 01:02:48,733
Speaker 2: if you're a teacher. Love to get into this one.

1324
01:02:48,733 --> 01:02:49,893
Speaker 2: I Waite hundred eighty ten eighty.

1325
01:02:49,973 --> 01:02:52,333
Speaker 3: Honesty is always the best policy.

1326
01:02:52,053 --> 01:02:52,653
Speaker 2: Nicely said.

1327
01:02:54,933 --> 01:02:59,133
Speaker 10: You talk headlines with blue bubble taxis it's no trouble

1328
01:02:59,213 --> 01:03:02,333
Speaker 10: with a blue bubble. A group of skiers were rescued

1329
01:03:02,373 --> 01:03:06,533
Speaker 10: on Mantepe who after an avalanche buried two people, one

1330
01:03:06,653 --> 01:03:10,773
Speaker 10: who had only their hand proto from the snow. STATSN

1331
01:03:10,853 --> 01:03:14,093
Speaker 10: said figures show annual inflations reach two point seven percent.

1332
01:03:14,453 --> 01:03:17,533
Speaker 10: That's up from two point five to March. The heralds

1333
01:03:17,573 --> 01:03:20,893
Speaker 10: Liam Dan says people will notice inflation's cooling as they

1334
01:03:20,933 --> 01:03:24,733
Speaker 10: book services like a plumber, but power bills and groceries

1335
01:03:24,853 --> 01:03:28,733
Speaker 10: are still high. Auckland Council's head is looking into the

1336
01:03:28,813 --> 01:03:33,573
Speaker 10: mayor's chief of Staff's property company going into liquidation owing

1337
01:03:33,813 --> 01:03:37,253
Speaker 10: in land revenue more than half a million dollars. No

1338
01:03:37,453 --> 01:03:41,373
Speaker 10: Leming says it will vigorously defend itself against Commerce Commission

1339
01:03:41,493 --> 01:03:45,813
Speaker 10: charges laid over its price promise promotion, which the Commission

1340
01:03:45,893 --> 01:03:51,253
Speaker 10: calls misleading because of its limitations and conditions. Worker First

1341
01:03:51,333 --> 01:03:53,733
Speaker 10: Union says its rate of ide and industry leading two

1342
01:03:53,813 --> 01:03:57,253
Speaker 10: year pay deal for kmart workers. It matches the living

1343
01:03:57,333 --> 01:04:01,693
Speaker 10: wage and will rise when it increases next year. Is

1344
01:04:01,773 --> 01:04:05,813
Speaker 10: Flying business Class worth it? An experts guide on how

1345
01:04:05,973 --> 01:04:07,773
Speaker 10: to make the most of it. You can see the

1346
01:04:07,813 --> 01:04:10,493
Speaker 10: story at it and said Herald Premium back to matt

1347
01:04:10,533 --> 01:04:11,653
Speaker 10: Ethan Tyler Adams.

1348
01:04:14,013 --> 01:04:16,133
Speaker 2: Oh, thank you very much, Raileen, turn your mi con

1349
01:04:16,213 --> 01:04:19,093
Speaker 2: Tyler right. This is going to be a good discussion NCEA.

1350
01:04:19,413 --> 01:04:23,373
Speaker 2: There are questions being raised about n CEA at the

1351
01:04:23,533 --> 01:04:27,853
Speaker 2: highest levels. Erica Stanford has been given advice around the

1352
01:04:28,493 --> 01:04:31,333
Speaker 2: implementation of that system and whether it's working as well

1353
01:04:31,373 --> 01:04:34,453
Speaker 2: as it should. Among the red light alerts. This was

1354
01:04:34,813 --> 01:04:38,133
Speaker 2: in a document obtained by The Herald. Was that flexibility

1355
01:04:38,213 --> 01:04:41,893
Speaker 2: built into the system included regarding what assessment students that

1356
01:04:42,133 --> 01:04:44,973
Speaker 2: mean mean courses can be structured around those perceived to

1357
01:04:45,053 --> 01:04:48,733
Speaker 2: be easier to accumulate credits, and that has long been

1358
01:04:48,773 --> 01:04:51,613
Speaker 2: one of the criticisms of NZA. They call it credit farming,

1359
01:04:52,173 --> 01:04:59,413
Speaker 2: that they can utilize what might be considered uneducational things

1360
01:04:59,533 --> 01:05:01,613
Speaker 2: like picking up rubbish, and they can acquire credits to

1361
01:05:01,653 --> 01:05:02,533
Speaker 2: get them over the line.

1362
01:05:03,173 --> 01:05:07,973
Speaker 3: Right yeah, I mean whatever, It's complicated, Incaa, I've got kids.

1363
01:05:08,013 --> 01:05:09,533
Speaker 3: I've got one kid doing it now, and I've had

1364
01:05:09,533 --> 01:05:11,173
Speaker 3: a kid that's gone through it. I've never really fully

1365
01:05:11,253 --> 01:05:13,413
Speaker 3: understood what was going on with the system. I just

1366
01:05:13,613 --> 01:05:16,053
Speaker 3: want as a parent, I just want to know how

1367
01:05:16,093 --> 01:05:20,013
Speaker 3: well they're doing so a percentage, and I don't want

1368
01:05:20,013 --> 01:05:21,493
Speaker 3: them going because I always talk to them they're going

1369
01:05:21,533 --> 01:05:23,253
Speaker 3: to exams and one of them might go, yeah, well

1370
01:05:23,253 --> 01:05:24,533
Speaker 3: I've got this and this and this, so i don't

1371
01:05:24,533 --> 01:05:26,333
Speaker 3: need to get much in the exam. And I'm like, well,

1372
01:05:27,053 --> 01:05:28,613
Speaker 3: that doesn't seem right to me.

1373
01:05:29,853 --> 01:05:29,973
Speaker 7: Am.

1374
01:05:30,013 --> 01:05:32,053
Speaker 3: I just looking at it. When I was at school,

1375
01:05:32,093 --> 01:05:34,213
Speaker 3: that was just the exam, right I think. No. I

1376
01:05:34,293 --> 01:05:39,493
Speaker 3: know we had internal assessment in year twelve, but I

1377
01:05:39,533 --> 01:05:41,173
Speaker 3: don't know. What do you want as a parent and

1378
01:05:41,213 --> 01:05:43,293
Speaker 3: what do you want as a students? That's what I

1379
01:05:43,333 --> 01:05:45,013
Speaker 3: want to know. One hundred and eighty ten eighty. If

1380
01:05:45,013 --> 01:05:46,533
Speaker 3: we're going to it says there's a Cambridge system. The

1381
01:05:46,653 --> 01:05:50,373
Speaker 3: NCAA system, Right. The NCAA system seems incredibly complex to me,

1382
01:05:50,493 --> 01:05:54,653
Speaker 3: and it feels like you can hide amongst it and

1383
01:05:54,773 --> 01:05:56,253
Speaker 3: it and it feels like there's a hell of a

1384
01:05:56,293 --> 01:05:58,053
Speaker 3: lot of work for teachers in it. There's a lot

1385
01:05:58,093 --> 01:06:02,093
Speaker 3: of internal assessment. My gut feeling is just exams at

1386
01:06:02,093 --> 01:06:04,133
Speaker 3: the end of the year and then you just get

1387
01:06:04,133 --> 01:06:07,053
Speaker 3: a percentage and that sums it up. It's very clean.

1388
01:06:07,333 --> 01:06:09,333
Speaker 3: You find out that you useless at math, and that's

1389
01:06:09,373 --> 01:06:10,293
Speaker 3: interesting knowledge to know.

1390
01:06:10,533 --> 01:06:12,653
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that was an easy way to determine whether

1391
01:06:12,733 --> 01:06:14,293
Speaker 2: you needed some more help as it. You know, my

1392
01:06:14,493 --> 01:06:17,733
Speaker 2: parents saw in year eleven, fifth form at the time

1393
01:06:17,893 --> 01:06:20,053
Speaker 2: that I was terrible at math because I got about

1394
01:06:20,093 --> 01:06:22,653
Speaker 2: thirty percent of my final examination. So at that point

1395
01:06:22,733 --> 01:06:24,653
Speaker 2: they came into the mold. They could see quite clearly

1396
01:06:24,733 --> 01:06:27,413
Speaker 2: Tyler is terrible at maths and started getting me a tutor.

1397
01:06:27,493 --> 01:06:29,333
Speaker 2: But for everything else I kind of just got over

1398
01:06:29,413 --> 01:06:32,453
Speaker 2: the mark. But still my old man knew when he said, Tyler,

1399
01:06:32,453 --> 01:06:34,213
Speaker 2: you're better than fifty five percent in English.

1400
01:06:34,253 --> 01:06:34,653
Speaker 14: You know that.

1401
01:06:35,093 --> 01:06:37,973
Speaker 2: But that was a clear cut So instead of this achieved,

1402
01:06:38,173 --> 01:06:40,893
Speaker 2: and achieve sounds good that you've achieved something, but that

1403
01:06:41,053 --> 01:06:43,453
Speaker 2: is the bare minimum. Then you've got merit. What is merit?

1404
01:06:43,533 --> 01:06:43,573
Speaker 13: Me?

1405
01:06:43,813 --> 01:06:44,013
Speaker 2: Yeah?

1406
01:06:44,133 --> 01:06:46,333
Speaker 3: And when I say to my one of my kids

1407
01:06:46,413 --> 01:06:48,093
Speaker 3: said he got a merit on something, and I said,

1408
01:06:48,133 --> 01:06:49,973
Speaker 3: well that's good, he goes, no, Merrit's not very good.

1409
01:06:50,013 --> 01:06:52,773
Speaker 3: They've lowered the bar, so merit isn't really anything. Yeah,

1410
01:06:53,013 --> 01:06:54,693
Speaker 3: and you're like, well, I don't know, just give me

1411
01:06:54,693 --> 01:06:56,653
Speaker 3: a percentage. What was your percentage? I don't know what

1412
01:06:56,733 --> 01:06:57,373
Speaker 3: my percentage was.

1413
01:06:57,533 --> 01:06:57,693
Speaker 14: Yeah.

1414
01:06:58,173 --> 01:07:00,173
Speaker 2: I mean part of me looking at the system thinks

1415
01:07:00,213 --> 01:07:02,333
Speaker 2: that it was designed to keep self esteem of the

1416
01:07:02,853 --> 01:07:05,653
Speaker 2: children in mind, right, that if you're not achieving that

1417
01:07:05,813 --> 01:07:10,013
Speaker 2: well and you get an achievement there, the ideology there

1418
01:07:10,253 --> 01:07:12,213
Speaker 2: is that you're not telling the kid that they're failing.

1419
01:07:12,493 --> 01:07:14,293
Speaker 2: You're not telling the child that they're not doing well.

1420
01:07:14,333 --> 01:07:16,413
Speaker 2: They've achieved. They can just do a bit better and

1421
01:07:16,533 --> 01:07:18,493
Speaker 2: get some merit. But I wonder how good that is

1422
01:07:18,613 --> 01:07:20,933
Speaker 2: for a child, surely, even children.

1423
01:07:21,013 --> 01:07:23,853
Speaker 3: You want the raw, cold hard data. We've just been

1424
01:07:23,853 --> 01:07:27,813
Speaker 3: talking about the truth, and that's what you want, right.

1425
01:07:27,893 --> 01:07:30,413
Speaker 3: You want to know that if you are useless at something,

1426
01:07:30,573 --> 01:07:32,613
Speaker 3: that you're currently useless at it. You don't want You

1427
01:07:32,653 --> 01:07:35,613
Speaker 3: don't want it to be given to you softly, do you?

1428
01:07:35,733 --> 01:07:37,653
Speaker 3: And I don't think parents want that either. Yeah, I

1429
01:07:37,733 --> 01:07:40,133
Speaker 3: mean we're talking about parents I know that put their

1430
01:07:40,333 --> 01:07:42,773
Speaker 3: report cards through chet GPT just to understand what it's

1431
01:07:42,773 --> 01:07:45,653
Speaker 3: trying to actually say to them. Yeah, And meanwhile, teachers

1432
01:07:45,693 --> 01:07:48,413
Speaker 3: are spending ages and ages on this. Don't you just

1433
01:07:48,533 --> 01:07:52,093
Speaker 3: want the teachers to teach to the curriculum and then

1434
01:07:52,893 --> 01:07:55,573
Speaker 3: you're examined from the outside and you get the results.

1435
01:07:55,693 --> 01:07:57,973
Speaker 2: Yeah. Oh, eight, one hundred eighty ten eighty is the

1436
01:07:58,093 --> 01:07:58,613
Speaker 2: number to call.

1437
01:07:58,933 --> 01:08:00,653
Speaker 3: But is that the system you want for your kids?

1438
01:08:00,693 --> 01:08:03,493
Speaker 3: And if you have recently been through the system, or

1439
01:08:03,533 --> 01:08:06,613
Speaker 3: you've been through NCAA or you've been through Cambridge, love

1440
01:08:06,653 --> 01:08:08,573
Speaker 3: to hear from teachers as well, what are we want

1441
01:08:08,613 --> 01:08:10,973
Speaker 3: from the system because a lot of people don't seem

1442
01:08:10,973 --> 01:08:12,013
Speaker 3: to be happy with the current system.

1443
01:08:12,133 --> 01:08:14,133
Speaker 2: Yeah, and obviously it got changed at the time from

1444
01:08:14,173 --> 01:08:17,093
Speaker 2: the Cambridge system. So can you hear your thoughts? What

1445
01:08:17,253 --> 01:08:19,612
Speaker 2: does the perfect system look like at the secondary call

1446
01:08:19,693 --> 01:08:23,012
Speaker 2: our school system level? I should say it is eighteen

1447
01:08:23,053 --> 01:08:26,053
Speaker 2: to three, the phones of a letter, the.

1448
01:08:26,173 --> 01:08:28,692
Speaker 1: Issues that affect you and a bit of fun along

1449
01:08:28,772 --> 01:08:32,333
Speaker 1: the way Matt Heath and Taylor Adams afternoons news talks

1450
01:08:32,372 --> 01:08:32,692
Speaker 1: that'd be.

1451
01:08:33,253 --> 01:08:37,293
Speaker 2: Supporter to three. Is NCEEA working and if it's not working,

1452
01:08:37,492 --> 01:08:42,133
Speaker 2: what is the perfect system to assess those in secondary school?

1453
01:08:42,333 --> 01:08:43,253
Speaker 2: And your thoughts on this?

1454
01:08:47,053 --> 01:08:47,612
Speaker 7: How you guys?

1455
01:08:48,213 --> 01:08:52,732
Speaker 17: My thoughts are that too many parents and employers don't

1456
01:08:52,732 --> 01:08:58,452
Speaker 17: actually understand NCA, and that's that's a big you know,

1457
01:08:58,853 --> 01:09:02,213
Speaker 17: people talk about being able to pick up credits for

1458
01:09:02,333 --> 01:09:09,173
Speaker 17: doing very little. It stems back to enter school certificate.

1459
01:09:10,133 --> 01:09:12,772
Speaker 17: Fifty percent of us were branded as failures at the

1460
01:09:12,812 --> 01:09:16,293
Speaker 17: first academic hurdle and that's no good for anyone. And

1461
01:09:16,572 --> 01:09:19,572
Speaker 17: we can all tell tales about people who have made

1462
01:09:19,652 --> 01:09:22,053
Speaker 17: millions and millions of dollars and pale school. See, so

1463
01:09:23,532 --> 01:09:27,013
Speaker 17: it wasn't a great system. We then the you know,

1464
01:09:28,452 --> 01:09:31,972
Speaker 17: if you're looking for quality candidate, look to set. They've

1465
01:09:32,013 --> 01:09:37,293
Speaker 17: got university entrants. And if I've done those subjects and

1466
01:09:37,973 --> 01:09:41,852
Speaker 17: pass them, including sitting external exams that have passed all

1467
01:09:41,933 --> 01:09:45,692
Speaker 17: on internals, then they've got their level toes or their

1468
01:09:45,772 --> 01:09:49,652
Speaker 17: level trees, but they aren't necessarily university firefight.

1469
01:09:51,452 --> 01:09:54,732
Speaker 3: Can I just it's interesting you say that so in

1470
01:09:54,893 --> 01:09:57,572
Speaker 3: school shirt if you weren't fifty percent, then you weren't

1471
01:09:57,612 --> 01:10:00,772
Speaker 3: fifty percent. So maybe it's not great to hear that.

1472
01:10:00,893 --> 01:10:03,372
Speaker 3: But but isn't that Isn't that information that you need

1473
01:10:03,492 --> 01:10:05,972
Speaker 3: to know? So if you if you're seeing so let's

1474
01:10:05,973 --> 01:10:10,333
Speaker 3: take that. Yeah, so let's se you can only be

1475
01:10:10,532 --> 01:10:13,892
Speaker 3: within the world, right, So fifty percent only means how

1476
01:10:14,013 --> 01:10:16,972
Speaker 3: you sit between everyone else and you you maybe that's

1477
01:10:17,013 --> 01:10:19,092
Speaker 3: how you you set the course.

1478
01:10:19,612 --> 01:10:21,652
Speaker 2: But do you see what I'm saying? Don't you need

1479
01:10:21,732 --> 01:10:23,492
Speaker 2: to know if you're no good at a subject?

1480
01:10:25,372 --> 01:10:27,013
Speaker 17: Yeah, but I mean that you come to the end

1481
01:10:27,053 --> 01:10:29,452
Speaker 17: of that year and your brand of a failure and

1482
01:10:29,572 --> 01:10:31,372
Speaker 17: there are no more for you if you if you

1483
01:10:31,412 --> 01:10:33,852
Speaker 17: can't pass, you see that you can't go on it.

1484
01:10:34,053 --> 01:10:36,213
Speaker 14: But if you're you're lead forward nothing.

1485
01:10:36,612 --> 01:10:38,652
Speaker 2: But you're a failure if you are a failure, So

1486
01:10:38,772 --> 01:10:40,132
Speaker 2: don't you need to know that you're a failure?

1487
01:10:42,013 --> 01:10:44,333
Speaker 17: But how many people who have failed to sor fee

1488
01:10:44,412 --> 01:10:46,412
Speaker 17: have gone on to do go very well in life?

1489
01:10:46,452 --> 01:10:48,733
Speaker 17: So it was an a you're a measure of someone's.

1490
01:10:48,412 --> 01:10:53,612
Speaker 3: Wear, Well, it is a measure. So if your massage

1491
01:10:53,692 --> 01:10:56,053
Speaker 3: around the edges, and I guess this is the complaint

1492
01:10:56,492 --> 01:11:00,133
Speaker 3: when you massage the system such that everyone feels like

1493
01:11:00,973 --> 01:11:04,253
Speaker 3: they are doing okay, then you don't have a realistic

1494
01:11:05,933 --> 01:11:09,612
Speaker 3: information on the decisions you should make life. So if

1495
01:11:09,612 --> 01:11:12,333
Speaker 3: you're if you're terrible at if you're terrible at math,

1496
01:11:13,013 --> 01:11:17,173
Speaker 3: then either you know, deploy the resources so you get

1497
01:11:17,213 --> 01:11:19,972
Speaker 3: better at it, or focus your energies in another area.

1498
01:11:21,893 --> 01:11:22,932
Speaker 17: Oh, you'll know if you are.

1499
01:11:23,013 --> 01:11:24,372
Speaker 13: But it's it's more the people.

1500
01:11:24,492 --> 01:11:27,892
Speaker 17: It's more the parents than the employers. Now have they

1501
01:11:27,973 --> 01:11:33,333
Speaker 17: got there twelve numerous the credits you know, and you

1502
01:11:33,412 --> 01:11:36,572
Speaker 17: can actually get your numeracy and your literacy credits than

1503
01:11:36,652 --> 01:11:41,333
Speaker 17: other subjects they are it's not necessarily math. Yeah, but

1504
01:11:41,732 --> 01:11:44,093
Speaker 17: you need to get those level of credits in order

1505
01:11:44,133 --> 01:11:45,012
Speaker 17: to pass your A year.

1506
01:11:45,853 --> 01:11:46,612
Speaker 2: Is this so you can?

1507
01:11:46,893 --> 01:11:47,253
Speaker 4: You can.

1508
01:11:48,692 --> 01:11:49,612
Speaker 17: Credits and science?

1509
01:11:50,173 --> 01:11:52,172
Speaker 3: So do you have Do you think the NCAA system

1510
01:11:52,412 --> 01:11:56,012
Speaker 3: as it is is going well or are there any

1511
01:11:56,093 --> 01:11:57,213
Speaker 3: changes that you would make to it?

1512
01:11:58,652 --> 01:12:01,532
Speaker 17: What the say? I had three kids go through The

1513
01:12:01,612 --> 01:12:07,372
Speaker 17: oldest didn't get any university entrance subjects, but past everything

1514
01:12:07,492 --> 01:12:10,972
Speaker 17: but really with me at school read as much. Now

1515
01:12:11,133 --> 01:12:14,532
Speaker 17: runs a very successful business employing quite a few guys,

1516
01:12:14,652 --> 01:12:15,612
Speaker 17: doing really really.

1517
01:12:15,452 --> 01:12:18,052
Speaker 4: Well because he took these value being educated.

1518
01:12:18,612 --> 01:12:24,213
Speaker 17: The next one's got an honors degree and you know,

1519
01:12:24,333 --> 01:12:27,173
Speaker 17: and he worked really really hard all the way through,

1520
01:12:27,253 --> 01:12:28,972
Speaker 17: but he's not making as much as the old one.

1521
01:12:29,652 --> 01:12:29,972
Speaker 2: MM.

1522
01:12:31,253 --> 01:12:34,052
Speaker 18: I don't think how education system is particularly great.

1523
01:12:34,532 --> 01:12:37,812
Speaker 3: So in that regard, would you say that everyone then

1524
01:12:38,093 --> 01:12:42,293
Speaker 3: should be awarded school certificate? Not that we have that anymore?

1525
01:12:44,572 --> 01:12:45,013
Speaker 7: Is that with that?

1526
01:12:45,372 --> 01:12:47,293
Speaker 2: I was done level one yep.

1527
01:12:48,652 --> 01:12:50,253
Speaker 17: I think my captain probably past that.

1528
01:12:50,812 --> 01:12:53,612
Speaker 2: Yeah, But just going back to the old system, ndy,

1529
01:12:54,053 --> 01:12:58,293
Speaker 2: and look, I was terrible mess and I failed school

1530
01:12:58,372 --> 01:13:00,732
Speaker 2: sert mass in the fifth form and was threatened to

1531
01:13:00,772 --> 01:13:02,892
Speaker 2: go into what they called the accelerate class at the time.

1532
01:13:03,572 --> 01:13:06,213
Speaker 2: But that enabled me to get some support around me

1533
01:13:06,293 --> 01:13:10,173
Speaker 2: to actually achieve in the sixth formers. So, because you know,

1534
01:13:10,213 --> 01:13:12,772
Speaker 2: it was pretty clear that I had thirty percent of

1535
01:13:12,853 --> 01:13:15,892
Speaker 2: mess in the fifth form, that gave me a boot

1536
01:13:15,973 --> 01:13:18,133
Speaker 2: up the bum to start actually achieving and getting that

1537
01:13:18,173 --> 01:13:18,772
Speaker 2: support needed.

1538
01:13:20,492 --> 01:13:20,692
Speaker 19: Yep.

1539
01:13:21,372 --> 01:13:23,532
Speaker 17: That said your school should be doing that. They should

1540
01:13:23,532 --> 01:13:27,173
Speaker 17: be they should be seeing that you needed that wrap

1541
01:13:27,213 --> 01:13:32,093
Speaker 17: around support and that subject awsome remedial training and that's

1542
01:13:32,333 --> 01:13:33,093
Speaker 17: what you that's what.

1543
01:13:33,133 --> 01:13:33,612
Speaker 4: They're paid for.

1544
01:13:35,053 --> 01:13:35,973
Speaker 2: So with n c A.

1545
01:13:37,333 --> 01:13:39,532
Speaker 3: So, so I just asked you before what you change?

1546
01:13:39,572 --> 01:13:41,932
Speaker 3: So you get rid of level one. What else don't

1547
01:13:41,973 --> 01:13:42,772
Speaker 3: you like about.

1548
01:13:42,652 --> 01:13:43,093
Speaker 5: N c A.

1549
01:13:44,933 --> 01:13:47,572
Speaker 17: I would tend to narrow it up a little bit more.

1550
01:13:48,652 --> 01:13:53,253
Speaker 17: They so the kids do things called credit mining, and

1551
01:13:53,412 --> 01:13:56,252
Speaker 17: they will look and they will say, Okay, here's an internal.

1552
01:13:56,412 --> 01:13:58,972
Speaker 17: It's going to take me sixty hours and I get

1553
01:13:59,013 --> 01:14:03,293
Speaker 17: four credits for it. But here's another one and I

1554
01:14:03,372 --> 01:14:05,652
Speaker 17: get six credits and it's only going to take me

1555
01:14:05,933 --> 01:14:08,932
Speaker 17: forty hours. And they will do that and ternel over

1556
01:14:09,013 --> 01:14:09,492
Speaker 17: the other one.

1557
01:14:09,652 --> 01:14:11,772
Speaker 13: Yeah, let's work quiet.

1558
01:14:11,853 --> 01:14:13,973
Speaker 17: But then when they get to UNI, they find they

1559
01:14:14,093 --> 01:14:16,692
Speaker 17: really needed that other paper and they hadn't done it.

1560
01:14:17,053 --> 01:14:19,973
Speaker 17: Yeah right, that they weren't taught well enough, but it

1561
01:14:20,133 --> 01:14:21,812
Speaker 17: was it was their mining credits.

1562
01:14:23,053 --> 01:14:23,253
Speaker 5: Yeah.

1563
01:14:23,933 --> 01:14:27,253
Speaker 3: So and and I think that's the problem that everyone has,

1564
01:14:27,492 --> 01:14:30,293
Speaker 3: as it's so complicated, and you you find it very

1565
01:14:30,372 --> 01:14:32,932
Speaker 3: hard as a parent anyway, I find it quite hard

1566
01:14:32,973 --> 01:14:36,652
Speaker 3: to find out exactly where the child is at.

1567
01:14:37,333 --> 01:14:38,013
Speaker 7: And so you just.

1568
01:14:40,732 --> 01:14:43,213
Speaker 3: But but you know they're running a campaign against you

1569
01:14:43,293 --> 01:14:45,013
Speaker 3: as well. And then you go and then you go

1570
01:14:45,093 --> 01:14:47,772
Speaker 3: and meet the teachers, and then and then the kids

1571
01:14:47,893 --> 01:14:52,572
Speaker 3: run the parent teacher interviews. Now, so the teacher that

1572
01:14:53,053 --> 01:14:55,412
Speaker 3: they get their laptop out and it's I'm like, this

1573
01:14:55,572 --> 01:14:57,612
Speaker 3: is this is this just a whitewash?

1574
01:14:57,692 --> 01:14:59,732
Speaker 2: What's going on here? I just want to know?

1575
01:14:59,772 --> 01:15:03,293
Speaker 3: And that's why I quite like just I'm sure no

1576
01:15:03,412 --> 01:15:05,372
Speaker 3: system is going to be perfect, but it seems to

1577
01:15:05,452 --> 01:15:07,093
Speaker 3: me as a parent, if I could just find out

1578
01:15:07,133 --> 01:15:09,213
Speaker 3: exactly where they sit. And I was saying before, Andy,

1579
01:15:09,893 --> 01:15:12,133
Speaker 3: one of my kids got a merit on a paper

1580
01:15:12,173 --> 01:15:13,772
Speaker 3: and I was like, that's good, and he was like, no,

1581
01:15:13,893 --> 01:15:14,612
Speaker 3: a Merit's bad.

1582
01:15:14,732 --> 01:15:14,892
Speaker 2: Now.

1583
01:15:15,412 --> 01:15:16,812
Speaker 3: I was like, so, how can it be called merit

1584
01:15:16,853 --> 01:15:19,452
Speaker 3: if it's not great? And he goes, oh, Merrit's more

1585
01:15:19,492 --> 01:15:21,812
Speaker 3: like a C in your in your day and age.

1586
01:15:21,853 --> 01:15:23,372
Speaker 3: And I'm like, what, I don't get it.

1587
01:15:24,253 --> 01:15:28,372
Speaker 13: A merits from sixty five to eighty ten, sixty.

1588
01:15:28,093 --> 01:15:29,973
Speaker 3: Five to eighty is huge, but you know what I mean,

1589
01:15:30,053 --> 01:15:32,053
Speaker 3: sixty five to eighty it's like sixty five is very

1590
01:15:32,053 --> 01:15:32,772
Speaker 3: different from eighty.

1591
01:15:34,173 --> 01:15:38,293
Speaker 17: Yeah, well that's that range. But it depends on the

1592
01:15:38,372 --> 01:15:42,412
Speaker 17: expectations of your kids. Maybe if if they got a

1593
01:15:42,452 --> 01:15:44,892
Speaker 17: merit were disappointed with it, then they're an excellent student

1594
01:15:44,973 --> 01:15:46,452
Speaker 17: and I wouldn't be too concerned about them.

1595
01:15:47,013 --> 01:15:49,093
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a good point, Andy, Thanks for your call. Yeah,

1596
01:15:49,133 --> 01:15:50,933
Speaker 2: great call. Oh eight hundred and eighty ten eighty is

1597
01:15:51,013 --> 01:15:53,652
Speaker 2: the number to call. We're going to play some messages

1598
01:15:53,692 --> 01:15:55,973
Speaker 2: and come back with that. But very interesting. I mean

1599
01:15:56,013 --> 01:16:00,532
Speaker 2: Andy's been on a school board and clearly there are

1600
01:16:00,612 --> 01:16:03,013
Speaker 2: some elements there that are incredibly confusing that needs to

1601
01:16:03,053 --> 01:16:04,732
Speaker 2: be tight and up. But keen to hear your views.

1602
01:16:05,293 --> 01:16:06,892
Speaker 2: Nine two nine TiO is a text number as well.

1603
01:16:06,933 --> 01:16:10,093
Speaker 2: We'll get to feel those short leaders to three, the

1604
01:16:10,213 --> 01:16:11,532
Speaker 2: issues that affect.

1605
01:16:11,253 --> 01:16:13,572
Speaker 1: You, and a bit of fun along the way. Matt

1606
01:16:13,652 --> 01:16:18,612
Speaker 1: Heath and Taylor Adams Afternoons news talks'd be afternoon.

1607
01:16:18,692 --> 01:16:21,132
Speaker 2: It is five to three this Texas.

1608
01:16:21,133 --> 01:16:24,652
Speaker 3: Scott says, how, hey, what about using the Cambridge system? Yeah,

1609
01:16:24,652 --> 01:16:27,372
Speaker 3: that's really what we're discussing here is so how far

1610
01:16:27,572 --> 01:16:30,412
Speaker 3: away from NCAA towards Cambridge you wanted to be? Is

1611
01:16:30,452 --> 01:16:31,492
Speaker 3: Cambridge system perfect?

1612
01:16:32,013 --> 01:16:32,253
Speaker 2: Or as?

1613
01:16:32,692 --> 01:16:34,412
Speaker 3: What would you like to see change in the NCAA?

1614
01:16:34,532 --> 01:16:35,972
Speaker 3: Is this something in the middle between the two?

1615
01:16:36,412 --> 01:16:36,572
Speaker 18: Yeah?

1616
01:16:36,612 --> 01:16:39,253
Speaker 2: Oh, one hundred and eighteen eighties and number to call. Julie,

1617
01:16:39,333 --> 01:16:40,053
Speaker 2: welcome to the show.

1618
01:16:40,213 --> 01:16:41,333
Speaker 3: You've got three kids at UNI.

1619
01:16:42,812 --> 01:16:46,133
Speaker 19: I have and so obviously it all went through the

1620
01:16:46,412 --> 01:16:50,732
Speaker 19: NCAA system at two different schools and my oldest son

1621
01:16:50,853 --> 01:16:54,013
Speaker 19: I'd say, we had to his school. I felt I

1622
01:16:54,093 --> 01:16:56,133
Speaker 19: had to be a lot more onto it, a lot

1623
01:16:56,213 --> 01:16:58,772
Speaker 19: more sort of what was going on. How many credits

1624
01:16:58,772 --> 01:17:01,173
Speaker 19: did he have or was he going to pass to

1625
01:17:01,293 --> 01:17:05,612
Speaker 19: the point that even year thirteen, he had handed everything

1626
01:17:05,652 --> 01:17:09,333
Speaker 19: in said it was completely is exam. Just had gone

1627
01:17:09,372 --> 01:17:12,293
Speaker 19: up the school to kind of put Olio and the

1628
01:17:12,532 --> 01:17:16,772
Speaker 19: art teacher lot at his everything and said you don't

1629
01:17:16,893 --> 01:17:19,852
Speaker 19: have three the three three of the writing credits, you

1630
01:17:19,893 --> 01:17:25,132
Speaker 19: won't get your ui. And that was basically he had two.

1631
01:17:25,093 --> 01:17:27,973
Speaker 7: Days and everything was going to close wow for the.

1632
01:17:28,372 --> 01:17:28,932
Speaker 19: End of the year.

1633
01:17:29,572 --> 01:17:30,812
Speaker 1: So he managed to do that.

1634
01:17:31,053 --> 01:17:33,933
Speaker 19: He got us into and he got yui. But that

1635
01:17:34,093 --> 01:17:36,093
Speaker 19: was the year going back off probably about five or

1636
01:17:36,133 --> 01:17:40,452
Speaker 19: six years by only thirty thirty percent of the whole

1637
01:17:40,893 --> 01:17:42,732
Speaker 19: nation children got the yui.

1638
01:17:43,333 --> 01:17:46,772
Speaker 3: So, Julie, sorry, we've got some poor time management here,

1639
01:17:47,053 --> 01:17:48,893
Speaker 3: and we actually have to go to the news. But

1640
01:17:49,053 --> 01:17:50,772
Speaker 3: can we can we get back after the news to

1641
01:17:51,253 --> 01:17:51,932
Speaker 3: finish this chat?

1642
01:17:52,973 --> 01:17:55,732
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, yeah, awesome, Sorry, sorry about that, You're great.

1643
01:17:55,893 --> 01:17:58,412
Speaker 2: Tyler's fault entirely my fault on the on the time

1644
01:17:58,532 --> 01:18:00,932
Speaker 2: master here and that was poor time keeping. But Julie,

1645
01:18:00,973 --> 01:18:02,093
Speaker 2: we've got plenty of questions.

1646
01:18:01,853 --> 01:18:03,812
Speaker 3: Called Tyler the time Lord that I might take that

1647
01:18:04,173 --> 01:18:05,133
Speaker 3: away from after this.

1648
01:18:05,812 --> 01:18:08,333
Speaker 2: Back Oh inner, back right, new sport of weather coming up.

1649
01:18:08,372 --> 01:18:09,532
Speaker 2: Then we're going to go back to Julian and we

1650
01:18:09,532 --> 01:18:11,532
Speaker 2: want to hear from you. Oh eight hundred eighty ten

1651
01:18:11,572 --> 01:18:13,132
Speaker 2: eighty is the number car.

1652
01:18:14,492 --> 01:18:18,172
Speaker 1: Talking with you all afternoon. It's Matt Heathan Taylor Adams

1653
01:18:18,333 --> 01:18:20,173
Speaker 1: Afternoons used talk.

1654
01:18:20,093 --> 01:18:22,333
Speaker 6: Zid be good a to you.

1655
01:18:22,492 --> 01:18:24,892
Speaker 2: Welcome back into the show. Six past three and we're

1656
01:18:24,893 --> 01:18:28,333
Speaker 2: having a great discussion about NCEEA. There are questions being

1657
01:18:28,452 --> 01:18:31,093
Speaker 2: raised to the upper inchelons about whether that is the

1658
01:18:31,213 --> 01:18:33,052
Speaker 2: right system for our secondary school students.

1659
01:18:33,293 --> 01:18:35,253
Speaker 3: So the other option is Cambridge. Do you want it

1660
01:18:35,293 --> 01:18:37,612
Speaker 3: to be exactly Cambridge? Or is this some changes that

1661
01:18:37,652 --> 01:18:40,293
Speaker 3: can be made to NCA to make it better. What's

1662
01:18:40,333 --> 01:18:43,053
Speaker 3: the perfect system you'd like to see now, Tyler? Yes,

1663
01:18:43,133 --> 01:18:44,932
Speaker 3: speaking of being able to see, can you see a clock?

1664
01:18:45,853 --> 01:18:49,012
Speaker 2: Yep, I've got seven in the studio as we speak.

1665
01:18:49,133 --> 01:18:51,732
Speaker 3: Because your lack of following the time and the last

1666
01:18:51,772 --> 01:18:54,452
Speaker 3: down I mean that we had to rudely cut off Julie.

1667
01:18:54,532 --> 01:18:56,372
Speaker 2: So Julie, thank you very much for hanging on and

1668
01:18:56,532 --> 01:18:58,732
Speaker 2: so sorry for wasting seven minutes of your time.

1669
01:19:02,133 --> 01:19:04,253
Speaker 3: So just to just recap your three you've got three

1670
01:19:04,333 --> 01:19:06,852
Speaker 3: kids at university, so you're talking about your experience of

1671
01:19:07,173 --> 01:19:08,772
Speaker 3: NCA and so.

1672
01:19:08,853 --> 01:19:09,732
Speaker 5: It's very different.

1673
01:19:09,933 --> 01:19:10,253
Speaker 2: I think.

1674
01:19:10,572 --> 01:19:12,572
Speaker 5: So what I really just wanted to say was I

1675
01:19:12,652 --> 01:19:16,372
Speaker 5: think that how the school's manage it can be incredibly different.

1676
01:19:16,933 --> 01:19:21,172
Speaker 5: My daughter school, on the other hand, just so so different,

1677
01:19:21,532 --> 01:19:22,052
Speaker 5: very onto.

1678
01:19:22,173 --> 01:19:24,132
Speaker 15: It very about.

1679
01:19:24,173 --> 01:19:27,093
Speaker 5: What they did was they managed each child individually tone

1680
01:19:27,133 --> 01:19:30,933
Speaker 5: as a large school. She got to year eleven and

1681
01:19:31,253 --> 01:19:35,732
Speaker 5: they called me, called us an apparent interview, and they

1682
01:19:35,853 --> 01:19:37,772
Speaker 5: just said that she's doing really, really well, but she's

1683
01:19:37,812 --> 01:19:42,932
Speaker 5: actually struggling with mad We believe we've got a class

1684
01:19:42,973 --> 01:19:45,013
Speaker 5: set up. So what they did was if they thought

1685
01:19:45,133 --> 01:19:48,173
Speaker 5: any students were struggling with this particular subject, they would

1686
01:19:48,213 --> 01:19:50,652
Speaker 5: call talk to the parents. They would say that we

1687
01:19:50,732 --> 01:19:53,053
Speaker 5: can set up this class. It's a smaller class. What

1688
01:19:53,173 --> 01:19:55,093
Speaker 5: we do is we take out on one of the

1689
01:19:55,253 --> 01:19:57,532
Speaker 5: sort of credits for the year that might have been

1690
01:19:57,612 --> 01:19:59,612
Speaker 5: what she was she was struggling with the couples side

1691
01:19:59,612 --> 01:19:59,772
Speaker 5: of it.

1692
01:20:00,133 --> 01:20:00,932
Speaker 19: We take that out.

1693
01:20:01,013 --> 01:20:03,013
Speaker 5: She can have an extra week on everything else in

1694
01:20:03,093 --> 01:20:05,852
Speaker 5: that mass curriculum. I think it was a set or

1695
01:20:06,213 --> 01:20:09,133
Speaker 5: not one being to be maths sorry, and so she

1696
01:20:09,173 --> 01:20:12,972
Speaker 5: gets alonger with each So then ideally her marks actually higher,

1697
01:20:13,013 --> 01:20:17,412
Speaker 5: which they were across the board, because she's more confident

1698
01:20:17,532 --> 01:20:20,612
Speaker 5: because she's not failing or she's not just getting a shaved.

1699
01:20:21,133 --> 01:20:21,973
Speaker 19: So they did that.

1700
01:20:22,013 --> 01:20:24,812
Speaker 5: Apparently were just with every subject that they had as

1701
01:20:24,812 --> 01:20:25,213
Speaker 5: a student.

1702
01:20:25,253 --> 01:20:28,972
Speaker 2: It was like a very focused school, a good school.

1703
01:20:29,053 --> 01:20:31,732
Speaker 5: They just didn't want They had a very good path rate,

1704
01:20:32,093 --> 01:20:34,333
Speaker 5: but they had a pass rate. Her high path rate

1705
01:20:34,452 --> 01:20:37,333
Speaker 5: in the lower that the students that started there in

1706
01:20:37,492 --> 01:20:40,372
Speaker 5: lower they had one of the highest pass row. They

1707
01:20:40,452 --> 01:20:42,812
Speaker 5: didn't not fit them, and they didn't tell them. They

1708
01:20:42,853 --> 01:20:45,973
Speaker 5: wouldn't undersit just because they thought they might fail. They

1709
01:20:46,013 --> 01:20:46,732
Speaker 5: actually help them.

1710
01:20:47,772 --> 01:20:51,932
Speaker 3: Yeah, right now, Julie, do you think that your children,

1711
01:20:52,333 --> 01:20:54,412
Speaker 3: you know, say, this daughter that we're talking about right

1712
01:20:54,492 --> 01:20:56,052
Speaker 3: now has an.

1713
01:20:56,053 --> 01:20:57,772
Speaker 5: Accurate I'd love to hear them on here.

1714
01:21:00,372 --> 01:21:03,492
Speaker 3: Do you think she is getting and you're getting or

1715
01:21:03,572 --> 01:21:08,372
Speaker 3: got accurate information at where she actually sat.

1716
01:21:08,372 --> 01:21:11,572
Speaker 5: In terms of yes, very much so, I think. And

1717
01:21:11,692 --> 01:21:13,452
Speaker 5: they did that for all the students I know, some

1718
01:21:13,532 --> 01:21:15,333
Speaker 5: of her friends. Sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off.

1719
01:21:15,333 --> 01:21:19,532
Speaker 5: The she some of her friends the same situation a

1720
01:21:19,612 --> 01:21:22,612
Speaker 5: different subject, and so they would so they might have

1721
01:21:22,652 --> 01:21:24,932
Speaker 5: had been in that class story and then maybe even

1722
01:21:24,973 --> 01:21:29,093
Speaker 5: two or three features because they possibly had some the

1723
01:21:29,173 --> 01:21:33,213
Speaker 5: techarades and there with them, and so when knew exactly

1724
01:21:33,293 --> 01:21:35,133
Speaker 5: what was happening, and the way it was handled was

1725
01:21:35,532 --> 01:21:38,852
Speaker 5: very respectfully. So it was not telling her that she

1726
01:21:38,893 --> 01:21:41,213
Speaker 5: couldn't pass. I was telling her that she would actually

1727
01:21:41,213 --> 01:21:43,492
Speaker 5: get a better That was maybe something that she wasn't

1728
01:21:43,532 --> 01:21:46,852
Speaker 5: interested in talk to her about it. She had to

1729
01:21:46,933 --> 01:21:51,253
Speaker 5: say in the decision, but ultimately it was the better.

1730
01:21:52,173 --> 01:21:53,412
Speaker 12: So how do you think does that makes sense?

1731
01:21:53,612 --> 01:21:53,812
Speaker 4: Yeah?

1732
01:21:53,893 --> 01:21:55,692
Speaker 3: So how do you think she would have gone or

1733
01:21:55,732 --> 01:21:57,412
Speaker 3: the other students would have gone if they'd been in

1734
01:21:57,492 --> 01:21:59,412
Speaker 3: the system where it's just at the end of the

1735
01:21:59,532 --> 01:22:02,772
Speaker 3: year there's an exam and that's your year. What percent

1736
01:22:02,853 --> 01:22:03,253
Speaker 3: did you get?

1737
01:22:03,973 --> 01:22:05,492
Speaker 5: I think she would have struggled with the mats and

1738
01:22:05,572 --> 01:22:07,492
Speaker 5: she wouldn't have liked it. And I think that is

1739
01:22:07,572 --> 01:22:10,253
Speaker 5: the big thing, because she would have helped that that

1740
01:22:10,492 --> 01:22:13,612
Speaker 5: even just that one part the calculus, it would have

1741
01:22:13,692 --> 01:22:16,852
Speaker 5: made her It sort of taints everything else because it

1742
01:22:16,933 --> 01:22:20,053
Speaker 5: sort of that I'm not good at maths, where she

1743
01:22:20,293 --> 01:22:22,572
Speaker 5: was just not good it, well not not even not

1744
01:22:22,732 --> 01:22:26,892
Speaker 5: good it, but she was just found that part harder

1745
01:22:27,933 --> 01:22:28,213
Speaker 5: some of.

1746
01:22:28,253 --> 01:22:32,173
Speaker 2: The opposition I hear, Julie is the interpretation that's open

1747
01:22:32,253 --> 01:22:35,572
Speaker 2: to some teachers and individual schools. And from what we're

1748
01:22:35,612 --> 01:22:38,652
Speaker 2: hearing from you, clearly this school was very competent in

1749
01:22:38,772 --> 01:22:41,492
Speaker 2: how they interpreted it and how they helped their students

1750
01:22:41,532 --> 01:22:43,253
Speaker 2: and your daughter through. But do you think that's part

1751
01:22:43,293 --> 01:22:45,652
Speaker 2: of the problem, that there's too much flexibility there for

1752
01:22:45,772 --> 01:22:46,412
Speaker 2: different schools.

1753
01:22:46,612 --> 01:22:49,093
Speaker 5: Yes, And I think some of the problems also, as

1754
01:22:49,452 --> 01:22:52,173
Speaker 5: I think somebody were saying before, just this whole idea,

1755
01:22:52,293 --> 01:22:57,012
Speaker 5: is that maybe we're just making it seem like everyone

1756
01:22:57,053 --> 01:22:59,532
Speaker 5: has to pass and we're dumbing it down a weaver

1757
01:22:59,532 --> 01:23:02,693
Speaker 5: it and maybe you've got to have the real conversations

1758
01:23:03,492 --> 01:23:05,812
Speaker 5: and the schools. And I know that the school doesn't

1759
01:23:06,093 --> 01:23:08,253
Speaker 5: run that for the many more that I'm talking about,

1760
01:23:08,732 --> 01:23:12,173
Speaker 5: because they I think they've had some complaints about the

1761
01:23:12,492 --> 01:23:16,293
Speaker 5: effect of their stream and some parents didn't like streaming,

1762
01:23:16,452 --> 01:23:19,972
Speaker 5: so they've changed the system that lost very very well,

1763
01:23:20,293 --> 01:23:22,492
Speaker 5: and they don't do that in what to my knowledge.

1764
01:23:23,213 --> 01:23:25,772
Speaker 3: Yeah, the whole getting bit of streaming thing confuses me

1765
01:23:26,372 --> 01:23:31,013
Speaker 3: because that, you know, and another complaint that you sort

1766
01:23:31,013 --> 01:23:33,532
Speaker 3: of get about this is that whilst trying to make

1767
01:23:33,612 --> 01:23:37,612
Speaker 3: it less painful for people that aren't doing so well.

1768
01:23:38,013 --> 01:23:42,492
Speaker 3: You fail to celebrate the excellence of the students that

1769
01:23:42,853 --> 01:23:46,173
Speaker 3: are really, really good. And that's a problem because there's

1770
01:23:46,173 --> 01:23:49,492
Speaker 3: a country we need, we need more excellent people and

1771
01:23:50,013 --> 01:23:53,093
Speaker 3: we and and I guess people would complain that when

1772
01:23:53,133 --> 01:23:56,933
Speaker 3: you move the the goalpost around to sort of massage

1773
01:23:56,973 --> 01:24:01,812
Speaker 3: people through the passing, then it sort of takes away

1774
01:24:02,053 --> 01:24:06,412
Speaker 3: the competitive situation that leads to just exemplary students.

1775
01:24:07,093 --> 01:24:09,532
Speaker 5: But is it that or is it actually some people

1776
01:24:09,812 --> 01:24:12,772
Speaker 5: some I didn't just take away but longer to mature

1777
01:24:12,933 --> 01:24:15,133
Speaker 5: and sometimes take away bit longer to work it out.

1778
01:24:15,692 --> 01:24:18,652
Speaker 5: So if you have a system that's heared so to

1779
01:24:18,893 --> 01:24:20,532
Speaker 5: manage that, then you.

1780
01:24:20,652 --> 01:24:23,732
Speaker 2: Can see a lot get the best out of every student.

1781
01:24:23,893 --> 01:24:26,972
Speaker 5: Maybe, yeah, absolutely, but it's just taking away more time

1782
01:24:27,093 --> 01:24:29,453
Speaker 5: in managing or working for the individuals.

1783
01:24:30,133 --> 01:24:31,892
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think if you called Julie, yeah, great call.

1784
01:24:31,973 --> 01:24:33,652
Speaker 3: Qologies again for Tyler's poor men.

1785
01:24:34,173 --> 01:24:35,893
Speaker 2: I'm going to hang of the clock. Hey watch this,

1786
01:24:36,013 --> 01:24:38,173
Speaker 2: I'm going to nail it right now. It's thirty past three.

1787
01:24:38,213 --> 01:24:39,933
Speaker 2: We're taking more of your calls very shortly. I know

1788
01:24:40,013 --> 01:24:41,853
Speaker 2: one hundred and eighty ten eighty.

1789
01:24:41,893 --> 01:24:46,572
Speaker 3: Including this text around the crippling problem with school SERT back.

1790
01:24:46,452 --> 01:24:50,052
Speaker 2: In the day you still ZIBB sixteen past three.

1791
01:24:50,532 --> 01:24:53,293
Speaker 3: We're just asking the question, what is the ultimate system?

1792
01:24:53,372 --> 01:24:56,452
Speaker 3: People are saying that NCAA isn't the way, and maybe

1793
01:24:56,572 --> 01:24:59,772
Speaker 3: Cambridge system's too far the other way. What's your ultimate

1794
01:25:00,013 --> 01:25:03,053
Speaker 3: system for your kids at high school? The sex says

1795
01:25:03,093 --> 01:25:05,452
Speaker 3: the problem with school SIRT was that only fifty percent

1796
01:25:05,492 --> 01:25:07,772
Speaker 3: were allowed to pass. Therefore, if ninety percent scored more

1797
01:25:07,812 --> 01:25:10,892
Speaker 3: than fifty sent the forty percent above there allowed were

1798
01:25:11,053 --> 01:25:13,852
Speaker 3: failed even though they had scored a pass. That was

1799
01:25:13,933 --> 01:25:18,572
Speaker 3: called scaling. So I did school SERT and I remember

1800
01:25:18,853 --> 01:25:20,772
Speaker 3: a lot of pressure because you couldn't go on to

1801
01:25:20,853 --> 01:25:23,692
Speaker 3: the next year unles you passed, Yeah, and it was

1802
01:25:24,013 --> 01:25:25,692
Speaker 3: it was just exams at the end of the year.

1803
01:25:26,333 --> 01:25:28,852
Speaker 3: And I thought that I could understand that, and it

1804
01:25:28,893 --> 01:25:30,852
Speaker 3: put a lot of pressure on and it made me

1805
01:25:30,893 --> 01:25:33,213
Speaker 3: step up and actually concentrate because I didn't want to

1806
01:25:33,213 --> 01:25:35,133
Speaker 3: be held back another year, Definitely. I didn't want to

1807
01:25:35,133 --> 01:25:37,732
Speaker 3: be held back. Yeah, So the threat was real, the

1808
01:25:37,853 --> 01:25:40,852
Speaker 3: risks were real. Yeah, And isn't that a representation of

1809
01:25:41,652 --> 01:25:44,452
Speaker 3: the real world? And isn't school getting you ready for

1810
01:25:44,612 --> 01:25:46,812
Speaker 3: the risk and reward of the real world.

1811
01:25:46,973 --> 01:25:48,732
Speaker 2: That was my thinking when I got threatened to be

1812
01:25:48,772 --> 01:25:50,772
Speaker 2: put in the accelerant class, which is the class you

1813
01:25:50,853 --> 01:25:52,532
Speaker 2: get put into if you need to do better in

1814
01:25:52,612 --> 01:25:55,812
Speaker 2: a subject. Because I flunked Mass. That made me get

1815
01:25:55,893 --> 01:25:58,412
Speaker 2: my A into G So I mean they let me

1816
01:25:58,532 --> 01:26:00,893
Speaker 2: carry on because I did okay and some of the

1817
01:26:00,933 --> 01:26:03,532
Speaker 2: other subjects, but Mass. I had to go in front

1818
01:26:03,532 --> 01:26:05,852
Speaker 2: of the principal with mum and he said, You're going

1819
01:26:05,933 --> 01:26:08,253
Speaker 2: to have to go into the accelerant class unless you

1820
01:26:08,492 --> 01:26:11,692
Speaker 2: can step up, and thankfully I did the next.

1821
01:26:11,933 --> 01:26:13,692
Speaker 3: And would you have you didn't want to go into

1822
01:26:13,692 --> 01:26:15,812
Speaker 3: that class because what you would have felt shame?

1823
01:26:16,013 --> 01:26:18,452
Speaker 2: Yep, one hundred Yeah, it was. That was a hard

1824
01:26:18,492 --> 01:26:20,412
Speaker 2: thing in secondary school. There was a different name for it.

1825
01:26:20,692 --> 01:26:22,492
Speaker 2: I can't say that on air, but we all remember

1826
01:26:22,532 --> 01:26:24,692
Speaker 2: those classes and what it was an all boys school

1827
01:26:24,732 --> 01:26:26,452
Speaker 2: and of course, yeah, the fellas that were in that

1828
01:26:26,532 --> 01:26:28,932
Speaker 2: class kept it very quiet because there was shame involved.

1829
01:26:29,133 --> 01:26:33,652
Speaker 3: Yes, so maybe those days are too extreme, but really

1830
01:26:33,732 --> 01:26:36,693
Speaker 3: I guess what I'm saying, maybe there's somewhere between Cambridge

1831
01:26:36,812 --> 01:26:39,612
Speaker 3: and NCIA and maybe that's what the government's looking for.

1832
01:26:39,893 --> 01:26:40,013
Speaker 1: Matt.

1833
01:26:40,213 --> 01:26:42,213
Speaker 3: You are suggesting that people who are great at passing

1834
01:26:42,213 --> 01:26:46,012
Speaker 3: exams are the best and smartest. Those days are gone. Yeah,

1835
01:26:46,532 --> 01:26:52,253
Speaker 3: but NCAA seems to be too far the other way

1836
01:26:52,333 --> 01:26:55,892
Speaker 3: I would say, I mean, if you study your subject

1837
01:26:56,572 --> 01:26:59,492
Speaker 3: and you know it, then you can pass the exam exactly,

1838
01:27:00,732 --> 01:27:04,532
Speaker 3: you can. So it's not that you're the brightest, but

1839
01:27:04,692 --> 01:27:07,692
Speaker 3: you've got a definite time and a place that you

1840
01:27:07,893 --> 01:27:11,812
Speaker 3: have to know the subject, and that's the exam. It's

1841
01:27:11,893 --> 01:27:15,293
Speaker 3: not doing a little bit here, doing some papers here,

1842
01:27:15,532 --> 01:27:18,533
Speaker 3: moving things around the classes there and there, and massaging

1843
01:27:18,572 --> 01:27:21,572
Speaker 3: your way through. So maybe there's something. There's somewhere in

1844
01:27:21,612 --> 01:27:21,932
Speaker 3: the middle.

1845
01:27:22,093 --> 01:27:24,852
Speaker 2: It's retention and knowledge across the year. Afternoon NCAA.

1846
01:27:24,933 --> 01:27:27,133
Speaker 3: As a joke, my example, my son and best friend

1847
01:27:27,173 --> 01:27:29,492
Speaker 3: at different high schools in Auckland did the same subjects.

1848
01:27:29,532 --> 01:27:31,933
Speaker 3: They would compare results in what one school considered an

1849
01:27:32,053 --> 01:27:35,173
Speaker 3: excellence would only be an achieved at the other. No

1850
01:27:35,293 --> 01:27:37,133
Speaker 3: consistency at all. And yeah, that's a problem with it

1851
01:27:37,253 --> 01:27:41,492
Speaker 3: not being outside the school, being done within the school,

1852
01:27:42,093 --> 01:27:43,572
Speaker 3: I think could be a bit of a problem rather

1853
01:27:43,692 --> 01:27:45,933
Speaker 3: being external examine and examinations.

1854
01:27:46,612 --> 01:27:47,652
Speaker 2: Grant your thoughts on this.

1855
01:27:48,973 --> 01:27:51,973
Speaker 18: Yeah, hi guys, second time you are calling into talk

1856
01:27:52,053 --> 01:27:53,612
Speaker 18: back radio. So you've touched the nerve.

1857
01:27:53,452 --> 01:27:54,892
Speaker 2: With me on this topic, Well, come in.

1858
01:27:56,412 --> 01:28:00,852
Speaker 18: For I'm an engineer for my SINS. I spent six

1859
01:28:00,973 --> 01:28:03,772
Speaker 18: years lecturing and engineering it at probably what you call

1860
01:28:03,853 --> 01:28:08,732
Speaker 18: a second tier university, and I rocked in the class

1861
01:28:09,013 --> 01:28:12,293
Speaker 18: and what I discovered was that the students basically couldn't

1862
01:28:12,293 --> 01:28:17,093
Speaker 18: do mass and this concerned me. I would give them

1863
01:28:17,293 --> 01:28:19,492
Speaker 18: what I would consider to be a year simple year

1864
01:28:19,652 --> 01:28:24,293
Speaker 18: ten mass test, six questions in ten minutes, and two

1865
01:28:24,372 --> 01:28:28,133
Speaker 18: thirds of the class couldn't do it, and I was astounded.

1866
01:28:29,053 --> 01:28:33,053
Speaker 18: We held on file their school transcripts, so I went

1867
01:28:33,093 --> 01:28:36,173
Speaker 18: and looked up the transcripts of the students that couldn't

1868
01:28:36,213 --> 01:28:40,653
Speaker 18: do the test, and what I discovered was that the schools,

1869
01:28:42,173 --> 01:28:45,133
Speaker 18: and it wasn't the top schools that were doing this.

1870
01:28:45,452 --> 01:28:47,492
Speaker 18: There was schools that you would regard as being not

1871
01:28:47,612 --> 01:28:52,053
Speaker 18: top schools. They would not have let the students sit

1872
01:28:52,812 --> 01:29:02,333
Speaker 18: external papers. So to simplified, if mass is divided into multiplication, division, addition,

1873
01:29:02,412 --> 01:29:05,732
Speaker 18: and subtraction, the students would only have done the addition

1874
01:29:05,853 --> 01:29:09,612
Speaker 18: of subtraction papers, which were internal and they'd pass those,

1875
01:29:09,933 --> 01:29:12,572
Speaker 18: and they wouldn't even have attempted the balance of the

1876
01:29:12,692 --> 01:29:17,093
Speaker 18: course and the schools are really doing a terrible disservice

1877
01:29:17,213 --> 01:29:22,492
Speaker 18: to these students. And with those internal papers, they would

1878
01:29:22,492 --> 01:29:25,012
Speaker 18: also give them what they call a mock test, which

1879
01:29:25,093 --> 01:29:27,612
Speaker 18: was basically the same test with the numbers slightly different,

1880
01:29:28,253 --> 01:29:30,732
Speaker 18: so that they could practice exactly what they were going

1881
01:29:30,812 --> 01:29:36,532
Speaker 18: to get. And the end result was you had students

1882
01:29:36,612 --> 01:29:38,692
Speaker 18: turning up to do engineering that couldn't do math.

1883
01:29:40,412 --> 01:29:42,492
Speaker 3: Yeah, so that doesn't help anyone. It doesn't help the

1884
01:29:42,812 --> 01:29:45,972
Speaker 3: student because they don't have the truth, and it doesn't

1885
01:29:46,013 --> 01:29:49,732
Speaker 3: help you teach them to move forward to learn to

1886
01:29:49,933 --> 01:29:53,612
Speaker 3: do something they need math for. So yeah, sort of

1887
01:29:53,692 --> 01:29:56,412
Speaker 3: massage in the truth. I guess that's what I've been

1888
01:29:56,452 --> 01:29:58,692
Speaker 3: trying to say is massage in the truth doesn't help anyone.

1889
01:29:59,053 --> 01:30:00,652
Speaker 3: You need to know what you can do so you

1890
01:30:00,732 --> 01:30:03,732
Speaker 3: can make decisions about your life and where to put

1891
01:30:03,772 --> 01:30:04,372
Speaker 3: your energies.

1892
01:30:05,293 --> 01:30:05,492
Speaker 4: Yeah.

1893
01:30:05,532 --> 01:30:07,452
Speaker 18: So I'm of an age that I did school see

1894
01:30:07,492 --> 01:30:11,932
Speaker 18: you an bursary, and I did very well at that system.

1895
01:30:11,973 --> 01:30:14,532
Speaker 18: I went onto university and got an honest degree in

1896
01:30:14,572 --> 01:30:17,652
Speaker 18: engineering and in a postgraduate degree, and so that system

1897
01:30:17,692 --> 01:30:20,892
Speaker 18: worked very well for me. My son went through NCAA.

1898
01:30:21,053 --> 01:30:24,093
Speaker 18: I think NCAA is a really good system. You need

1899
01:30:24,173 --> 01:30:29,372
Speaker 18: to understand how the achieved merit and excellence works, and

1900
01:30:29,572 --> 01:30:32,492
Speaker 18: obviously I'm focused on the STEM subjects, but it needs

1901
01:30:32,532 --> 01:30:36,452
Speaker 18: some tweaking to stop the gaming of the system.

1902
01:30:37,412 --> 01:30:38,812
Speaker 2: Is there any way that it could be complete?

1903
01:30:38,853 --> 01:30:41,412
Speaker 3: Do you think the fact that it's the schools have

1904
01:30:41,532 --> 01:30:44,133
Speaker 3: that power that you're talking about internally, which you know

1905
01:30:44,293 --> 01:30:48,293
Speaker 3: they may have motivations around their own personal numbers to

1906
01:30:48,532 --> 01:30:51,173
Speaker 3: massage things. Do you think there's a way it could

1907
01:30:51,173 --> 01:30:55,852
Speaker 3: all be externally? You know all the grading has done

1908
01:30:55,893 --> 01:30:57,572
Speaker 3: externally well.

1909
01:30:57,452 --> 01:30:59,652
Speaker 18: It wasn't out in my day, so I think that

1910
01:30:59,732 --> 01:31:02,972
Speaker 18: would be that would be something. Do feel slightly sorry

1911
01:31:03,013 --> 01:31:04,812
Speaker 18: for those schools because they get beaten up in the

1912
01:31:04,893 --> 01:31:08,133
Speaker 18: media about their results, right, so they have found a

1913
01:31:08,173 --> 01:31:13,093
Speaker 18: way to put on their website their pass rates for

1914
01:31:13,173 --> 01:31:15,772
Speaker 18: the various level of levels of NCAA. But when you

1915
01:31:16,013 --> 01:31:20,052
Speaker 18: drilled down into it, it's it's not a very pretty site.

1916
01:31:20,333 --> 01:31:23,013
Speaker 18: The sad thing is that those kids that failed the

1917
01:31:23,452 --> 01:31:27,412
Speaker 18: engineering or sorry, failed that little test I gave them

1918
01:31:28,492 --> 01:31:31,812
Speaker 18: should never have been doing engineering exactly university they.

1919
01:31:31,732 --> 01:31:32,412
Speaker 13: Would have made.

1920
01:31:32,612 --> 01:31:36,612
Speaker 18: They would have made the best plumbers and builders and

1921
01:31:36,933 --> 01:31:41,652
Speaker 18: electricians exactly who we're now importing those people from overseas.

1922
01:31:43,013 --> 01:31:45,852
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly, because they haven't been given the information they

1923
01:31:45,933 --> 01:31:48,933
Speaker 3: need to make the decisions about their life. And you know,

1924
01:31:49,133 --> 01:31:50,812
Speaker 3: so many people you were going to, so many people

1925
01:31:50,853 --> 01:31:53,492
Speaker 3: that text through that said that they failed school. Certain

1926
01:31:53,572 --> 01:31:56,932
Speaker 3: that made them make decisions in their life to lead

1927
01:31:57,053 --> 01:31:59,492
Speaker 3: us anyway. So what would be the basic changes you

1928
01:31:59,492 --> 01:32:00,453
Speaker 3: would make Grant.

1929
01:32:00,732 --> 01:32:06,772
Speaker 18: Around Yeah, external assessment that you have to do all

1930
01:32:06,973 --> 01:32:09,372
Speaker 18: the units and you have to tempt allar units. So

1931
01:32:09,492 --> 01:32:11,612
Speaker 18: the other the gaming that goes on at the top schools,

1932
01:32:11,772 --> 01:32:13,973
Speaker 18: one of which my son went to, is that the

1933
01:32:14,093 --> 01:32:16,372
Speaker 18: top students have stood going really well and I've got

1934
01:32:16,412 --> 01:32:19,293
Speaker 18: an excellent average, and they go into the exam at

1935
01:32:19,333 --> 01:32:21,253
Speaker 18: the end of the year to sit your external standard

1936
01:32:21,492 --> 01:32:24,093
Speaker 18: and they pick up, say the calculus paper, and they

1937
01:32:24,173 --> 01:32:26,333
Speaker 18: look at it and it's very difficult, and they think

1938
01:32:26,372 --> 01:32:28,732
Speaker 18: it's going to be a challenge. They're instructed by the

1939
01:32:28,812 --> 01:32:30,293
Speaker 18: school to screw it up and throw it in the

1940
01:32:30,333 --> 01:32:32,812
Speaker 18: pin and walk out of the exam because it will

1941
01:32:32,893 --> 01:32:37,612
Speaker 18: drag their average down. So I think that that really

1942
01:32:37,732 --> 01:32:38,253
Speaker 18: needs to be.

1943
01:32:40,173 --> 01:32:43,972
Speaker 2: The head What about what about you go Grant?

1944
01:32:44,013 --> 01:32:48,053
Speaker 18: Sorry, Yeah, the basic structure of it. I was a

1945
01:32:48,133 --> 01:32:50,213
Speaker 18: bit wary of it until my son came home with

1946
01:32:50,333 --> 01:32:53,092
Speaker 18: sort of a mess thing and pointed to the excellence

1947
01:32:53,213 --> 01:32:54,973
Speaker 18: question and I had to go away and research it

1948
01:32:55,053 --> 01:32:57,412
Speaker 18: before I could figure out how to do it. So

1949
01:32:57,532 --> 01:33:00,852
Speaker 18: I think the basic structure is fine. There just needs

1950
01:33:00,853 --> 01:33:03,652
Speaker 18: to be more those tweaks and more understanding of how

1951
01:33:03,692 --> 01:33:04,532
Speaker 18: it's all put together.

1952
01:33:05,173 --> 01:33:07,572
Speaker 3: Do you think that's some advantage in getting rid of

1953
01:33:07,732 --> 01:33:11,253
Speaker 3: excellence and merit and these wide I know, you know

1954
01:33:12,013 --> 01:33:17,052
Speaker 3: there was more divisions of A plus as the more divisions,

1955
01:33:17,133 --> 01:33:19,692
Speaker 3: because what if you're rocking along and you're at the

1956
01:33:20,013 --> 01:33:23,293
Speaker 3: high end of merit and you're and if there's a

1957
01:33:23,333 --> 01:33:26,532
Speaker 3: fifteen point range in it, then you don't know how

1958
01:33:27,253 --> 01:33:28,692
Speaker 3: you know what I mean, You're not getting the reward

1959
01:33:28,812 --> 01:33:32,012
Speaker 3: you are for being close to excellence. You're one percent

1960
01:33:32,093 --> 01:33:35,852
Speaker 3: off excellence because because the you just get us merit.

1961
01:33:37,372 --> 01:33:43,333
Speaker 18: Yeah, there's some merit in that for some students. Equally,

1962
01:33:43,532 --> 01:33:45,053
Speaker 18: if you take the mess paper, which is what I

1963
01:33:45,173 --> 01:33:47,253
Speaker 18: was sort of focused on, it's very clear when you

1964
01:33:47,372 --> 01:33:49,852
Speaker 18: open up the paper that this question and this question

1965
01:33:50,133 --> 01:33:53,013
Speaker 18: are the achieved questions, and if you're not very good

1966
01:33:53,013 --> 01:33:56,532
Speaker 18: at MASS, you can identify those questions and examine focus

1967
01:33:56,612 --> 01:33:58,812
Speaker 18: on those A question and at least walk out with

1968
01:33:59,013 --> 01:34:02,293
Speaker 18: and achieved, and then the merrit questions are very easily identifiable,

1969
01:34:02,933 --> 01:34:06,612
Speaker 18: and then the excellence questions are identifiable. So within the paper, right,

1970
01:34:06,692 --> 01:34:10,093
Speaker 18: if you're not very good at mass and focus on

1971
01:34:10,253 --> 01:34:13,412
Speaker 18: the two questions in the paper and try and pass those.

1972
01:34:13,772 --> 01:34:13,892
Speaker 10: Right.

1973
01:34:14,973 --> 01:34:17,532
Speaker 2: But then this all seems quite cruel. For you're talking

1974
01:34:17,532 --> 01:34:21,253
Speaker 2: about engineering school at varsity and then medical school, and

1975
01:34:21,293 --> 01:34:23,412
Speaker 2: I've got questions about how they figure out who are

1976
01:34:23,452 --> 01:34:25,612
Speaker 2: going to be the top achievers and get through medical school.

1977
01:34:25,652 --> 01:34:27,732
Speaker 2: But that seems to be the point where these kids

1978
01:34:28,013 --> 01:34:30,612
Speaker 2: get a rude awakening, is that they're passed in CEA

1979
01:34:30,893 --> 01:34:34,852
Speaker 2: through gaming the system. Then they get into varsity and realize, shit,

1980
01:34:35,093 --> 01:34:38,293
Speaker 2: I you know, I do not have the skills to

1981
01:34:39,013 --> 01:34:40,812
Speaker 2: move any further. And that would be a real blow

1982
01:34:40,853 --> 01:34:41,612
Speaker 2: for a lot of these kids.

1983
01:34:42,532 --> 01:34:45,892
Speaker 18: Yeah, I mean, how long have you got I said,

1984
01:34:45,933 --> 01:34:48,612
Speaker 18: I was lectured at a second tier university. I got

1985
01:34:48,612 --> 01:34:56,333
Speaker 18: my PhD from a first tier university. The students, basically,

1986
01:34:56,412 --> 01:34:58,572
Speaker 18: if they could tick the box to say the university

1987
01:34:58,612 --> 01:35:01,173
Speaker 18: will get some money from the government for the course,

1988
01:35:01,293 --> 01:35:05,973
Speaker 18: they let them in. Yeah, and it's a bums on

1989
01:35:06,053 --> 01:35:09,733
Speaker 18: seat funding model, and that's what's that's where the universities

1990
01:35:09,853 --> 01:35:10,572
Speaker 18: are to blame.

1991
01:35:10,893 --> 01:35:13,772
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's that's that's a problem as well. This teacher says,

1992
01:35:13,772 --> 01:35:16,253
Speaker 3: I'm a math teacher. This teacher says, this text to

1993
01:35:16,293 --> 01:35:18,213
Speaker 3: says I'm a math teacher. And the previous call is

1994
01:35:18,253 --> 01:35:20,572
Speaker 3: completely incorrect. It is not the school's decision whether a

1995
01:35:20,652 --> 01:35:22,932
Speaker 3: student sits the externals. It is up to the student.

1996
01:35:23,333 --> 01:35:25,492
Speaker 3: A school teacher, to the best of their abilities, cannot

1997
01:35:25,492 --> 01:35:28,412
Speaker 3: make a student go to an external We do our best.

1998
01:35:28,853 --> 01:35:31,852
Speaker 3: He has no idea about how it works. Okay, right, guys,

1999
01:35:31,933 --> 01:35:34,213
Speaker 3: the guys correct. My daughter was told she couldn't sit

2000
01:35:34,293 --> 01:35:36,812
Speaker 3: the maths exam because she needed more help and they

2001
01:35:36,853 --> 01:35:39,093
Speaker 3: didn't want their numbers not passing to show up. So

2002
01:35:39,213 --> 01:35:40,892
Speaker 3: we're getting some contradictory messages here.

2003
01:35:41,013 --> 01:35:44,173
Speaker 2: Certainly it is twenty six to three bag visually.

2004
01:35:47,772 --> 01:35:51,452
Speaker 1: Matt Heathan Tyler Adams afternoons call oh, eight hundred eighty

2005
01:35:51,532 --> 01:35:53,372
Speaker 1: ten eighty on used talk ZB.

2006
01:35:53,372 --> 01:35:55,812
Speaker 2: Twenty nine past three. So many texts on this one.

2007
01:35:56,133 --> 01:35:56,372
Speaker 7: You know.

2008
01:35:56,732 --> 01:36:01,173
Speaker 3: Unsurprisingly, we haven't solved the NCAA situation and our hour

2009
01:36:01,293 --> 01:36:03,532
Speaker 3: on talkback radio, but we've given a good, good go.

2010
01:36:04,013 --> 01:36:07,933
Speaker 3: People have been able to have voiced their opinion. So

2011
01:36:08,053 --> 01:36:10,732
Speaker 3: let's with some texts here. NCAA should be bind and

2012
01:36:10,853 --> 01:36:15,493
Speaker 3: we should adopt Cambridge. I have taught both, no comparison.

2013
01:36:15,612 --> 01:36:15,893
Speaker 2: There you go.

2014
01:36:16,652 --> 01:36:20,133
Speaker 3: This teaches, this text says I teach a diploma course.

2015
01:36:20,293 --> 01:36:24,053
Speaker 3: And the difference and knowledge of NCAA and students who

2016
01:36:24,093 --> 01:36:27,053
Speaker 3: have had school set or more focus exams as chalk

2017
01:36:27,133 --> 01:36:29,572
Speaker 3: and cheese. They don't even really know how to time manage,

2018
01:36:30,013 --> 01:36:33,012
Speaker 3: let alone access of computer or even spell properly. Don't

2019
01:36:33,053 --> 01:36:35,452
Speaker 3: even know how to put commas and paragraphs that take

2020
01:36:35,532 --> 01:36:38,812
Speaker 3: them back to the basics. Blah blah blah. Yeah, I

2021
01:36:38,893 --> 01:36:42,412
Speaker 3: get what you're saying here, but ironically, there's a lot

2022
01:36:42,452 --> 01:36:43,732
Speaker 3: of errors in your text message.

2023
01:36:43,893 --> 01:36:44,892
Speaker 2: Too many commas in that one.

2024
01:36:44,933 --> 01:36:47,253
Speaker 3: I'm not blaming you. I'm sure it's spell check or something.

2025
01:36:48,412 --> 01:36:51,412
Speaker 3: As an employer, I need to know the capabilities otherwise

2026
01:36:51,492 --> 01:36:53,692
Speaker 3: I end up with the problem, and we have having

2027
01:36:53,772 --> 01:36:56,253
Speaker 3: to deal with more and more. Let's have some honesty

2028
01:36:56,333 --> 01:36:59,052
Speaker 3: for all parties and lean into helping and directing people

2029
01:36:59,093 --> 01:37:02,653
Speaker 3: to help themselves. Sometimes parents also need to take responsibility

2030
01:37:02,692 --> 01:37:05,213
Speaker 3: to help their kids thrive. It can't always be other

2031
01:37:05,213 --> 01:37:07,412
Speaker 3: people's issue to deal with. Oh my god, sixty five

2032
01:37:07,452 --> 01:37:10,652
Speaker 3: to eighty percent waters going on. Yeah, good text My

2033
01:37:10,853 --> 01:37:13,293
Speaker 3: daughter was told not to sit English exam because she's

2034
01:37:13,293 --> 01:37:14,692
Speaker 3: already had literacy.

2035
01:37:14,893 --> 01:37:17,213
Speaker 2: And there's hundreds and hundreds of others and so.

2036
01:37:17,213 --> 01:37:19,652
Speaker 3: We've got teachers saying that they don't do that, and

2037
01:37:19,732 --> 01:37:21,892
Speaker 3: then lots of parents saying that that's what's happened.

2038
01:37:21,973 --> 01:37:24,572
Speaker 2: Yeah, So the debate will carry on and we'll see

2039
01:37:24,612 --> 01:37:28,012
Speaker 2: what Minister Stanford has to say about NCAA going forward.

2040
01:37:28,412 --> 01:37:30,333
Speaker 2: But thank you to everybody who called and text on

2041
01:37:30,372 --> 01:37:32,573
Speaker 2: that right, looking forward to this discussion.

2042
01:37:32,772 --> 01:37:36,692
Speaker 3: It's what everyone's been talking about. Yes, like the CEO

2043
01:37:37,372 --> 01:37:43,052
Speaker 3: and the HR lady being caught at the Coldplay concert.

2044
01:37:43,572 --> 01:37:48,173
Speaker 3: But our question is what's the price for cheating? What

2045
01:37:48,612 --> 01:37:51,253
Speaker 3: is the price? What should the penalty be for being

2046
01:37:51,293 --> 01:37:53,732
Speaker 3: caught cheating? Personally, I find the whole thing pretty funny

2047
01:37:54,133 --> 01:37:59,732
Speaker 3: and amusing, but I wouldn't care if my CEO was

2048
01:37:59,812 --> 01:38:02,253
Speaker 3: caught cheating with the HR person. I wouldn't think they'd

2049
01:38:02,253 --> 01:38:05,333
Speaker 3: need to step down. I mean, the punishment is within

2050
01:38:05,412 --> 01:38:06,333
Speaker 3: your family, right.

2051
01:38:06,492 --> 01:38:09,333
Speaker 2: Yeah, Oh, eight hundred is the number to call. This

2052
01:38:09,452 --> 01:38:11,253
Speaker 2: is going to be a great discussion. You would have

2053
01:38:11,333 --> 01:38:14,052
Speaker 2: seen this story over the weekend. It is the biggest

2054
01:38:14,093 --> 01:38:16,612
Speaker 2: thing in the world right now, Andy Byron, the chief

2055
01:38:16,652 --> 01:38:20,812
Speaker 2: executive and his HR head of HR, what should be

2056
01:38:20,893 --> 01:38:22,293
Speaker 2: the punishment for that little warfare?

2057
01:38:22,372 --> 01:38:24,932
Speaker 3: And before you text in with nine two nine two,

2058
01:38:25,013 --> 01:38:27,093
Speaker 3: why are you guys talking about this?

2059
01:38:27,772 --> 01:38:27,812
Speaker 13: Is?

2060
01:38:27,893 --> 01:38:30,732
Speaker 3: They're not more important using the world than an a

2061
01:38:30,853 --> 01:38:33,372
Speaker 3: fear between a CEO and an AhR lady on the

2062
01:38:33,412 --> 01:38:36,972
Speaker 3: other side of the planet. Let's be honest, everyone's talking

2063
01:38:37,013 --> 01:38:37,812
Speaker 3: about it exactly.

2064
01:38:38,492 --> 01:38:40,412
Speaker 2: One hundred and eighty ten eighty is the number to call.

2065
01:38:40,492 --> 01:38:41,812
Speaker 2: Headlines with Raylene coming up.

2066
01:38:44,053 --> 01:38:47,973
Speaker 10: Jew's talks'd be headlines with blue bubble taxis It's no

2067
01:38:48,133 --> 01:38:51,253
Speaker 10: trouble with a blue bubble. The Commerce Commissions found no

2068
01:38:51,452 --> 01:38:56,093
Speaker 10: evidence of cartel behavior affecting lending to farmers from our

2069
01:38:56,213 --> 01:39:00,092
Speaker 10: Bank's involvement in the un organized Net zero Banking Alliance,

2070
01:39:00,372 --> 01:39:05,532
Speaker 10: which aims to support climate mitigation. Two skiers were briefly

2071
01:39:05,772 --> 01:39:09,333
Speaker 10: buried in an avalanche on Mantrupe Who on Friday, but

2072
01:39:09,572 --> 01:39:12,092
Speaker 10: they were quickly freed by other members of their group

2073
01:39:12,173 --> 01:39:17,173
Speaker 10: of six. Noel Leming has complained about inconsistent consumer protections

2074
01:39:17,492 --> 01:39:21,932
Speaker 10: from overseas traders, while denying charges from the Commerce Commission

2075
01:39:22,173 --> 01:39:25,812
Speaker 10: over its price promise promotion at a need and woman

2076
01:39:25,933 --> 01:39:28,492
Speaker 10: is due in court next month, charged with driving a

2077
01:39:28,612 --> 01:39:31,412
Speaker 10: car full of children on an after school carpool on

2078
01:39:31,612 --> 01:39:36,133
Speaker 10: Friday with an alcohol reading nearly four times the legal limit.

2079
01:39:37,133 --> 01:39:39,492
Speaker 10: A twenty five year old real estate agent has been

2080
01:39:39,612 --> 01:39:43,293
Speaker 10: arrested at Auckland Airport accused of importing four kilos of

2081
01:39:43,372 --> 01:39:48,772
Speaker 10: cocaine into suitcases. Yesterday, a Wellington worker has been sentenced

2082
01:39:48,812 --> 01:39:51,172
Speaker 10: to three and a half years in prison for stealing

2083
01:39:51,253 --> 01:39:55,253
Speaker 10: more than a million dollars from a charity families buying

2084
01:39:55,333 --> 01:40:00,372
Speaker 10: transportable houses as alternatives to retirement villagers. You can read

2085
01:40:00,452 --> 01:40:02,972
Speaker 10: more at Ens and Herald Premium. Now back to matt

2086
01:40:03,013 --> 01:40:04,052
Speaker 10: Ethan Tyner Adams.

2087
01:40:04,173 --> 01:40:06,452
Speaker 2: Thank you very much, railing right. It's the story that

2088
01:40:06,772 --> 01:40:09,492
Speaker 2: everyone everyone around the world is talking about.

2089
01:40:09,492 --> 01:40:13,173
Speaker 3: It's interesting what stories catch on. This one has just

2090
01:40:13,333 --> 01:40:17,333
Speaker 3: gone absolutely crazy, and I think it's primarily their reaction. Yep,

2091
01:40:17,732 --> 01:40:21,852
Speaker 3: so the CEO and the head of HR or if

2092
01:40:21,933 --> 01:40:24,652
Speaker 3: someone a lady that works in agr up on the

2093
01:40:24,732 --> 01:40:28,293
Speaker 3: kisscam at a Coldplay concert camera comes on them, they

2094
01:40:28,572 --> 01:40:30,812
Speaker 3: jump for cover like they've been shot at there on

2095
01:40:30,853 --> 01:40:34,652
Speaker 3: the head there's a sniper. Chris Martin from Coldplay, A

2096
01:40:34,692 --> 01:40:38,333
Speaker 3: great man says, either they're very shy or they're having

2097
01:40:38,333 --> 01:40:42,213
Speaker 3: an affair. Yep, clearly having an affair because everything has

2098
01:40:42,293 --> 01:40:45,772
Speaker 3: blown up and the CEO has stepped down from his position.

2099
01:40:46,013 --> 01:40:48,772
Speaker 2: Yep, resigned from his position. We don't know what's happening

2100
01:40:48,812 --> 01:40:51,612
Speaker 2: to the head of HR at this stage, but as

2101
01:40:51,692 --> 01:40:55,173
Speaker 2: we mentioned, this is a story that's gripped the entire world,

2102
01:40:55,492 --> 01:40:59,492
Speaker 2: and the pylon and the humorous side of things, as

2103
01:40:59,532 --> 01:41:02,253
Speaker 2: the Internet tends to do, has been significant over the

2104
01:41:02,333 --> 01:41:04,572
Speaker 2: course of the weekend. But the question we've got for

2105
01:41:04,612 --> 01:41:07,173
Speaker 2: you is what should be the punishment for being caught

2106
01:41:07,452 --> 01:41:10,972
Speaker 2: having an affair a place like a Coldplay concert. Yeah,

2107
01:41:11,173 --> 01:41:13,053
Speaker 2: I mean, has it got anything to do with your

2108
01:41:13,093 --> 01:41:17,013
Speaker 2: employment at all? I would say no. I would say

2109
01:41:17,053 --> 01:41:20,013
Speaker 2: absolutely no. The fact that I mean he resigned, but

2110
01:41:20,492 --> 01:41:23,972
Speaker 2: arguably he was pushed to resign because the board got

2111
01:41:24,053 --> 01:41:27,093
Speaker 2: so freaked out with the mass of publicity around the

2112
01:41:27,093 --> 01:41:30,372
Speaker 2: world that this was causing for their company. But having

2113
01:41:30,412 --> 01:41:33,852
Speaker 2: an affair is, you know, a personal side of your life,

2114
01:41:33,933 --> 01:41:35,812
Speaker 2: and granted it is absolutely wrong.

2115
01:41:39,053 --> 01:41:43,212
Speaker 3: Just watching the footage again, it is poor old.

2116
01:41:43,133 --> 01:41:45,772
Speaker 2: Dere in the headlights in that freeze frame has been

2117
01:41:45,893 --> 01:41:47,012
Speaker 2: seen so many times.

2118
01:41:47,293 --> 01:41:49,013
Speaker 3: Yeah, and the Phillies Mescot imitating it.

2119
01:41:49,093 --> 01:41:49,772
Speaker 2: I mean the memes.

2120
01:41:50,492 --> 01:41:52,492
Speaker 3: The memes have been great, and this is when the

2121
01:41:52,572 --> 01:41:55,852
Speaker 3: Internet is at its best. Yea, as just how quickly

2122
01:41:56,692 --> 01:41:59,572
Speaker 3: people crowdsourced the funniest things, as I was saying before

2123
01:42:00,412 --> 01:42:02,973
Speaker 3: the one where they replaced the lady with Max for

2124
01:42:03,053 --> 01:42:10,133
Speaker 3: stepping and the CEO worth Toto Wolf, and then cut

2125
01:42:10,213 --> 01:42:12,812
Speaker 3: to George Russell crying for if one fans that I

2126
01:42:12,853 --> 01:42:13,532
Speaker 3: found it very much.

2127
01:42:13,612 --> 01:42:17,052
Speaker 2: There is very very clever people out there. But seen

2128
01:42:17,213 --> 01:42:19,812
Speaker 2: watching this over the weekend. Matt and I have been

2129
01:42:19,893 --> 01:42:24,452
Speaker 2: enjoying the content content like everybody else. But you see,

2130
01:42:26,013 --> 01:42:28,532
Speaker 2: I mean everyone the whole entire world knows about this

2131
01:42:28,692 --> 01:42:32,692
Speaker 2: now that and you're still enjoying it, and as you should,

2132
01:42:32,692 --> 01:42:36,852
Speaker 2: because it's an enjoyable piece of content. But the guy

2133
01:42:37,612 --> 01:42:40,212
Speaker 2: has had his life dismantled it by Bert.

2134
01:42:40,732 --> 01:42:43,652
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean has Astronomer, which is the name of

2135
01:42:43,692 --> 01:42:45,452
Speaker 3: Coming has committed to the values and culture that have

2136
01:42:45,532 --> 01:42:47,652
Speaker 3: guided us since our founding. They said, our leaders are

2137
01:42:47,692 --> 01:42:50,293
Speaker 3: expected to set the standard and both conduct and accountability.

2138
01:42:50,333 --> 01:42:53,333
Speaker 3: The Border Directors has initiated a formal investigation to this

2139
01:42:53,492 --> 01:42:57,012
Speaker 3: matter and we will have additional details to share very shortly.

2140
01:42:57,093 --> 01:43:00,293
Speaker 3: That's what the company said. Yeah, so you know they're

2141
01:43:00,293 --> 01:43:02,612
Speaker 3: committed to the values and culture that have guided us,

2142
01:43:03,253 --> 01:43:06,692
Speaker 3: is it? I mean, ideally you don't cheat on your partner,

2143
01:43:06,973 --> 01:43:09,612
Speaker 3: but I mean as any workplace in the world where

2144
01:43:09,652 --> 01:43:11,772
Speaker 3: someone right now isn't cheating on their partner with someone

2145
01:43:11,853 --> 01:43:14,253
Speaker 3: in the workplace, many they just happen to end up

2146
01:43:14,253 --> 01:43:17,173
Speaker 3: on the internet. Yeah, just out of pure bad luck.

2147
01:43:17,973 --> 01:43:19,852
Speaker 2: And I think that's the big quition here is does

2148
01:43:19,893 --> 01:43:22,812
Speaker 2: your workplace have any say when it comes to what

2149
01:43:22,973 --> 01:43:24,093
Speaker 2: happens in your private life?

2150
01:43:24,572 --> 01:43:28,452
Speaker 3: Or what should the punishment be for straying from your

2151
01:43:28,492 --> 01:43:32,293
Speaker 3: partner professionally. Let's be honest, guys. If a couple truly

2152
01:43:32,372 --> 01:43:34,892
Speaker 3: love one another, then they will never cheat on each other.

2153
01:43:35,213 --> 01:43:37,772
Speaker 3: Why would anyone spoil this magic? If someone cheats, then

2154
01:43:37,812 --> 01:43:40,173
Speaker 3: there is some sort of breakdown of the relationship and

2155
01:43:40,253 --> 01:43:42,652
Speaker 3: someone is doing something very wrong. That's from Mike, Yeah,

2156
01:43:42,973 --> 01:43:45,293
Speaker 3: or just someone likes a bit on the side.

2157
01:43:46,293 --> 01:43:48,572
Speaker 2: Yeah. Oh, one hundred eight, ten and eighty is the

2158
01:43:48,692 --> 01:43:51,532
Speaker 2: number to call. What should be the punishment for having

2159
01:43:51,572 --> 01:43:54,372
Speaker 2: an affair? Should your place of employment have anything to

2160
01:43:54,452 --> 01:43:55,572
Speaker 2: do with that? Love to hear your thoughts.

2161
01:43:55,572 --> 01:43:57,973
Speaker 3: If you're cheating on your partner and your domestic relationship,

2162
01:43:58,053 --> 01:43:59,973
Speaker 3: then there's every likely that you will cheat on your

2163
01:44:00,013 --> 01:44:03,532
Speaker 3: work colleagues as well, and are therefore untrustworthy.

2164
01:44:03,692 --> 01:44:05,053
Speaker 2: Wow, I don't know about that.

2165
01:44:05,893 --> 01:44:13,052
Speaker 3: Yeah, Hi guys, it wouldn't be funny. If he hurt himself,

2166
01:44:13,133 --> 01:44:15,932
Speaker 3: the tide would turn. He's really had the whole world

2167
01:44:15,973 --> 01:44:19,892
Speaker 3: criticize him. He's devastated while you're having fun and laughing, I.

2168
01:44:22,652 --> 01:44:25,013
Speaker 2: Matt Heath is not having fun. Oh, come on, if

2169
01:44:25,013 --> 01:44:25,972
Speaker 2: you don't find that funny.

2170
01:44:27,492 --> 01:44:29,492
Speaker 3: We always get this text on news talks. He'd be

2171
01:44:29,532 --> 01:44:32,652
Speaker 3: for these people that are the absolute epitome of moral

2172
01:44:32,772 --> 01:44:33,013
Speaker 3: like they.

2173
01:44:32,973 --> 01:44:35,692
Speaker 2: Would never laugh at anything like this. How dare you

2174
01:44:35,812 --> 01:44:36,173
Speaker 2: laugh at it?

2175
01:44:36,253 --> 01:44:38,532
Speaker 3: What about this? We always get these textas, who are

2176
01:44:38,572 --> 01:44:39,893
Speaker 3: these people that are so much better than me?

2177
01:44:40,053 --> 01:44:40,173
Speaker 4: Oh?

2178
01:44:40,173 --> 01:44:42,492
Speaker 2: I guarantee they are consuming this content as we all

2179
01:44:42,572 --> 01:44:45,053
Speaker 2: are over the weekend. Oh wait, hundred eighty ten eighty

2180
01:44:45,213 --> 01:44:47,132
Speaker 2: is the number to call? What should be the punishment

2181
01:44:47,253 --> 01:44:49,933
Speaker 2: for cheating? And should your weekplas have anything to do

2182
01:44:50,053 --> 01:44:51,052
Speaker 2: with it? Love to hear your thoughts.

2183
01:44:51,053 --> 01:44:55,053
Speaker 1: It's twenty to four, Matt Heath Taylor Adams with you

2184
01:44:55,173 --> 01:44:58,172
Speaker 1: as your afternoon rolls on Matt Heath and Taylor Adams

2185
01:44:58,293 --> 01:44:59,892
Speaker 1: Afternoons news Talks.

2186
01:44:59,893 --> 01:45:01,932
Speaker 2: The'd be seventeen to four.

2187
01:45:02,772 --> 01:45:05,692
Speaker 3: This Texas says no one, no one's business, but there

2188
01:45:05,772 --> 01:45:08,253
Speaker 3: is how many people within the company knew and couldn't care.

2189
01:45:08,893 --> 01:45:11,612
Speaker 3: Do what you like with whomever you like your business.

2190
01:45:11,692 --> 01:45:13,652
Speaker 3: No one else is is that text to this Textic

2191
01:45:13,732 --> 01:45:16,093
Speaker 3: disagrees and says the punishment for adultery should be death

2192
01:45:16,133 --> 01:45:18,893
Speaker 3: by stoning old school let's go. That's from buzz. This

2193
01:45:19,013 --> 01:45:22,053
Speaker 3: person says they should be tired and feathered and then

2194
01:45:22,133 --> 01:45:22,492
Speaker 3: tase it.

2195
01:45:23,293 --> 01:45:25,572
Speaker 2: I'm sure that would be preferable. But what's happened to them?

2196
01:45:26,013 --> 01:45:28,572
Speaker 3: I reckon if they could choose that, they could choose

2197
01:45:28,572 --> 01:45:34,093
Speaker 3: a tasering over the public shaming. Yeah, just even a

2198
01:45:34,133 --> 01:45:35,732
Speaker 3: couple of wounders all the way down here in New

2199
01:45:35,772 --> 01:45:38,572
Speaker 3: Zealand on one hundred and eighty, ten to eighty talking

2200
01:45:38,612 --> 01:45:40,173
Speaker 3: about it, Sharon, Welcome to the show.

2201
01:45:41,572 --> 01:45:41,692
Speaker 5: Hi.

2202
01:45:42,213 --> 01:45:47,333
Speaker 11: Two things in this particular case. You know, he's been

2203
01:45:47,372 --> 01:45:49,932
Speaker 11: intimate with or having an affair with somebody who reports

2204
01:45:50,013 --> 01:45:52,692
Speaker 11: to him, and that adds a whole different kind of

2205
01:45:52,812 --> 01:45:57,452
Speaker 11: layer of complexity to the workplace and his potential future

2206
01:45:57,492 --> 01:45:59,933
Speaker 11: decision making and all of those sorts of things. So

2207
01:46:00,933 --> 01:46:03,852
Speaker 11: I believe losing his job's probably been the right thing

2208
01:46:03,933 --> 01:46:06,173
Speaker 11: on that basis, because how could the board trust him

2209
01:46:06,253 --> 01:46:09,732
Speaker 11: to make balanced visions in the interests of the business

2210
01:46:09,893 --> 01:46:13,053
Speaker 11: rather than himself on that basis. But the other thing

2211
01:46:13,133 --> 01:46:15,812
Speaker 11: I wanted to say is, you know, I personally have

2212
01:46:15,933 --> 01:46:17,932
Speaker 11: never been into it with the work, colleague. I've seen

2213
01:46:18,013 --> 01:46:21,053
Speaker 11: thinking of people who have been, and it's usually the

2214
01:46:21,133 --> 01:46:25,372
Speaker 11: woman who loses, right, Ultimately, it's her career who's compromised.

2215
01:46:25,412 --> 01:46:26,253
Speaker 11: And it's really great.

2216
01:46:26,253 --> 01:46:30,732
Speaker 3: Really, I mean, well, I think it's generally the man

2217
01:46:30,812 --> 01:46:31,932
Speaker 3: that loses these days.

2218
01:46:32,732 --> 01:46:35,372
Speaker 17: I mean, I know, a bit longer than the two.

2219
01:46:35,572 --> 01:46:37,132
Speaker 11: Maybe I'm going back too fast.

2220
01:46:37,293 --> 01:46:40,732
Speaker 3: Yeah, But when you say that they're on that she

2221
01:46:40,933 --> 01:46:44,492
Speaker 3: reported to him, do you think that within an office relationship,

2222
01:46:44,572 --> 01:46:48,372
Speaker 3: let's just say that neither of them have partners, would

2223
01:46:48,412 --> 01:46:51,452
Speaker 3: it be okay then for you? Or do you think

2224
01:46:51,492 --> 01:46:53,772
Speaker 3: that the power and balance is such that he shouldn't

2225
01:46:53,812 --> 01:46:55,772
Speaker 3: be seeing her, whether she he's got a wife or not.

2226
01:46:56,933 --> 01:47:01,452
Speaker 11: Absolutely so, does that mean she's a power and balance?

2227
01:47:01,532 --> 01:47:04,972
Speaker 3: So should CEOs only be able to date CEOs at work?

2228
01:47:07,933 --> 01:47:10,612
Speaker 11: You know, it's not just about the two of them,

2229
01:47:10,692 --> 01:47:13,293
Speaker 11: it's about everybody else who works in the company, So

2230
01:47:13,772 --> 01:47:18,253
Speaker 11: it's for you know, So how other people view any

2231
01:47:18,372 --> 01:47:23,012
Speaker 11: special relationship that may compromise their roles or their careers

2232
01:47:23,133 --> 01:47:24,612
Speaker 11: or decisions that impacted them.

2233
01:47:24,812 --> 01:47:26,972
Speaker 2: What do you think about her being from HR?

2234
01:47:27,572 --> 01:47:30,812
Speaker 3: Surely she has been in a situation before which she

2235
01:47:30,893 --> 01:47:33,772
Speaker 3: said she's had to deal with this, so there's a

2236
01:47:33,812 --> 01:47:36,772
Speaker 3: certain amount of hypocrisy she You would think, of all

2237
01:47:36,812 --> 01:47:40,052
Speaker 3: people would be schooled up on the risks of going

2238
01:47:40,093 --> 01:47:42,652
Speaker 3: to a cold place, play concert and cuddling up with

2239
01:47:42,692 --> 01:47:43,812
Speaker 3: the CEO that's married.

2240
01:47:44,933 --> 01:47:47,013
Speaker 11: I'll be tactful and say that it would appear to

2241
01:47:47,093 --> 01:47:48,612
Speaker 11: me that her judgment was flawed.

2242
01:47:49,372 --> 01:47:51,173
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, thank you for your call.

2243
01:47:51,253 --> 01:47:51,532
Speaker 3: Sharing.

2244
01:47:51,612 --> 01:47:54,333
Speaker 2: Yeah, good call. Plenty of teas coming through on nine

2245
01:47:54,412 --> 01:47:55,013
Speaker 2: two ninety two.

2246
01:47:55,093 --> 01:47:56,892
Speaker 3: Well, I've seen some good memes online and how they

2247
01:47:56,893 --> 01:47:59,772
Speaker 3: should have behaved. Yeah, there's one saying that he should

2248
01:47:59,772 --> 01:48:02,292
Speaker 3: have immediately if he was smart, he would have immediately

2249
01:48:02,372 --> 01:48:07,612
Speaker 3: pretend he was doing the Hemrich maneuver and then she

2250
01:48:07,692 --> 01:48:10,052
Speaker 3: could have faked spat out a piece of food.

2251
01:48:10,133 --> 01:48:13,852
Speaker 2: That would have been quick thinking. If only, if only, Linda,

2252
01:48:14,013 --> 01:48:14,932
Speaker 2: how are you this afternoon?

2253
01:48:16,013 --> 01:48:16,572
Speaker 11: I have to.

2254
01:48:16,612 --> 01:48:19,812
Speaker 5: Completely concur with Sharon. Everything she said was exactly what

2255
01:48:19,933 --> 01:48:21,892
Speaker 5: I was about to say. But there's one other matter.

2256
01:48:22,853 --> 01:48:24,973
Speaker 5: If he had stood his ground and smiled at the

2257
01:48:25,053 --> 01:48:29,132
Speaker 5: camera and not reacted, no one would ever.

2258
01:48:29,213 --> 01:48:33,492
Speaker 2: Have none, Absolutely definitely, if he had had the courage.

2259
01:48:33,933 --> 01:48:36,652
Speaker 5: He obviously had the courage to have an affair outside

2260
01:48:36,692 --> 01:48:40,333
Speaker 5: of his marriage. If he had, if he was genuinely courageous,

2261
01:48:40,412 --> 01:48:44,093
Speaker 5: he would have stood his ground, carried on cuddling her, smiling,

2262
01:48:44,612 --> 01:48:47,173
Speaker 5: and Chris Martin would have moved on. No one would

2263
01:48:47,333 --> 01:48:48,452
Speaker 5: ever have picked it up.

2264
01:48:48,692 --> 01:48:50,772
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean the chances of it that we definitely

2265
01:48:50,772 --> 01:48:53,852
Speaker 3: would have gone globally vibe viral, would it so? The

2266
01:48:53,933 --> 01:48:56,213
Speaker 3: way she put her hand on her face, and the

2267
01:48:56,253 --> 01:48:58,572
Speaker 3: way he died for cover like there was a sniper

2268
01:48:58,612 --> 01:49:01,333
Speaker 3: shooting at him, and the way her their friend that

2269
01:49:01,452 --> 01:49:04,452
Speaker 3: was there, stared over at them, it was just you

2270
01:49:04,492 --> 01:49:07,333
Speaker 3: couldn't have looked more guilty if you'd planned it.

2271
01:49:07,652 --> 01:49:11,812
Speaker 5: But he does deserve to Louise's job because the power

2272
01:49:11,853 --> 01:49:15,572
Speaker 5: and balance he hired the HR specialist, he hired the

2273
01:49:15,652 --> 01:49:17,933
Speaker 5: lady he was having an affair with. Now did he

2274
01:49:18,133 --> 01:49:21,012
Speaker 5: hire her before the affairs started or after?

2275
01:49:21,492 --> 01:49:24,133
Speaker 3: But but are you saying do you think that Linda

2276
01:49:24,213 --> 01:49:28,772
Speaker 3: the woman are just so easily led astray and have

2277
01:49:28,933 --> 01:49:32,012
Speaker 3: no agency in their life. Surely she's a powerful woman

2278
01:49:32,213 --> 01:49:34,492
Speaker 3: with her own life and her own ability to make

2279
01:49:34,572 --> 01:49:37,133
Speaker 3: decisions precisely, But the.

2280
01:49:37,253 --> 01:49:41,133
Speaker 5: Power and balance between them is such that he does

2281
01:49:41,372 --> 01:49:46,053
Speaker 5: have the power to end her employment and in that.

2282
01:49:46,173 --> 01:49:49,892
Speaker 3: Situation, but if you're an HR, you have the power

2283
01:49:49,973 --> 01:49:52,333
Speaker 3: to end people's employment as well, I mean, if you're

2284
01:49:52,333 --> 01:49:52,772
Speaker 3: an HR.

2285
01:49:53,333 --> 01:49:57,452
Speaker 5: But if she reports to him, she is in a

2286
01:49:57,532 --> 01:50:02,173
Speaker 5: position where if she ended the relationship suddenly she might

2287
01:50:02,253 --> 01:50:03,452
Speaker 5: find herself out of work.

2288
01:50:03,652 --> 01:50:08,293
Speaker 3: If it was a female CEO with a male HR employer,

2289
01:50:08,452 --> 01:50:11,293
Speaker 3: you'd still just just the same.

2290
01:50:12,372 --> 01:50:14,732
Speaker 5: Just as sad. It's a power thing.

2291
01:50:15,093 --> 01:50:17,133
Speaker 3: So who can who can? Who can who can have

2292
01:50:17,532 --> 01:50:19,772
Speaker 3: Let's just say, I mean, I was going to ask

2293
01:50:19,812 --> 01:50:22,133
Speaker 3: the question Linda, who can have an affair with who?

2294
01:50:22,333 --> 01:50:26,652
Speaker 3: And work? So maybe let's let's let's take away the

2295
01:50:26,692 --> 01:50:28,812
Speaker 3: affair part of it. So who do you think can

2296
01:50:28,933 --> 01:50:32,852
Speaker 3: have a relationship with who in a workplace?

2297
01:50:32,973 --> 01:50:34,213
Speaker 5: Do they have to be they have to be on

2298
01:50:34,293 --> 01:50:37,772
Speaker 5: the same level, not necessarily if they're in a situation

2299
01:50:38,013 --> 01:50:41,692
Speaker 5: like that. If you have a senior executive who is

2300
01:50:41,893 --> 01:50:44,892
Speaker 5: free to have a relationship and meet someone at work.

2301
01:50:45,412 --> 01:50:48,572
Speaker 5: The sensible thing was if it were serious, one of

2302
01:50:48,612 --> 01:50:49,812
Speaker 5: them would change jobs.

2303
01:50:50,372 --> 01:50:53,772
Speaker 2: Mm hmm. So you're so the a fair side of

2304
01:50:53,812 --> 01:50:55,652
Speaker 2: things doesn't even come into it for you, Linda. You're

2305
01:50:55,732 --> 01:50:57,973
Speaker 2: just saying on a power and balance, even if these

2306
01:50:58,013 --> 01:51:03,772
Speaker 2: two individuals were single, you'd still see an issue with it. Absolutely, Okay,

2307
01:51:04,412 --> 01:51:05,213
Speaker 2: that's interesting.

2308
01:51:06,053 --> 01:51:08,213
Speaker 3: I just think that women are more powerful than that.

2309
01:51:09,013 --> 01:51:11,452
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, that's that's my thinking is. And I'm

2310
01:51:11,452 --> 01:51:13,652
Speaker 2: glad you asked that question. But someone in a senior

2311
01:51:13,692 --> 01:51:16,133
Speaker 2: executive role, it doesn't really matter what their gender is.

2312
01:51:16,293 --> 01:51:19,293
Speaker 2: She is the head of HR, she's intelligent in her

2313
01:51:19,333 --> 01:51:22,572
Speaker 2: own right, and it's seemed by all accounts consensual. And

2314
01:51:22,612 --> 01:51:25,972
Speaker 2: if she wasn't happy with it, then, as someone who's

2315
01:51:26,013 --> 01:51:28,012
Speaker 2: you know, got a bit of nounced, don't get involved.

2316
01:51:28,412 --> 01:51:31,812
Speaker 2: And you know historically that was how you jumped classes,

2317
01:51:32,612 --> 01:51:36,253
Speaker 2: so you know you married up. Yep, very true.

2318
01:51:36,412 --> 01:51:38,973
Speaker 3: I disagree with the power and balance, says Denise. How

2319
01:51:39,053 --> 01:51:43,213
Speaker 3: many doctors marry their nurse or pilots their Stewardessa's principles

2320
01:51:43,293 --> 01:51:44,253
Speaker 3: with teachers.

2321
01:51:44,372 --> 01:51:46,732
Speaker 2: Yep, does happen? Absolutely right. I got to play some

2322
01:51:46,812 --> 01:51:48,372
Speaker 2: messages and come back with more of your calls on

2323
01:51:48,612 --> 01:51:51,732
Speaker 2: eight Under at eighty ten eighty. It's tender for the.

2324
01:51:51,893 --> 01:51:55,772
Speaker 1: Big stories, the big issues, the big trends and everything

2325
01:51:55,853 --> 01:51:59,492
Speaker 1: in between. Matt Heath and Tyler Adams Afternoons US Talks

2326
01:51:59,732 --> 01:52:01,973
Speaker 1: B News Talks.

2327
01:52:01,652 --> 01:52:04,772
Speaker 2: There B we're talking about this viral moment that people

2328
01:52:04,812 --> 01:52:07,333
Speaker 2: are still talking about. The CEO of a company called

2329
01:52:07,333 --> 01:52:10,253
Speaker 2: Astronomer and his head of HR caught on the kiss

2330
01:52:10,293 --> 01:52:14,533
Speaker 2: cam having an affair. It's all gone pear shaped, but everybody,

2331
01:52:14,853 --> 01:52:16,412
Speaker 2: everybody is talking about it.

2332
01:52:17,093 --> 01:52:17,253
Speaker 13: Now.

2333
01:52:17,372 --> 01:52:19,093
Speaker 2: Just before we get back to the calls, I can

2334
01:52:19,133 --> 01:52:23,532
Speaker 2: see you tapping away their matte. Heath, You're you're responding

2335
01:52:23,572 --> 01:52:27,492
Speaker 2: to some of our beloved Texas. A few texts here,

2336
01:52:27,772 --> 01:52:30,253
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, a bit of a bit of a bit

2337
01:52:30,293 --> 01:52:34,812
Speaker 2: of trouble and going on, yeah yeah, good times. Okay, Jean,

2338
01:52:34,933 --> 01:52:35,612
Speaker 2: welcome to the show.

2339
01:52:36,452 --> 01:52:41,892
Speaker 16: Oh hi, I'm coming from a distant, distant, different thing.

2340
01:52:42,093 --> 01:52:45,173
Speaker 16: You're all laughing about it, But has anybody's got to

2341
01:52:45,253 --> 01:52:50,732
Speaker 16: think about if they've got children's Yeah, yeah, Well I

2342
01:52:50,812 --> 01:52:53,293
Speaker 16: don't think it's fair on the kids because the kids

2343
01:52:53,812 --> 01:52:56,012
Speaker 16: once they hear anything, and they'd all go to school

2344
01:52:56,452 --> 01:52:58,293
Speaker 16: and they'll all be making fun of them. You don't

2345
01:52:58,333 --> 01:53:00,452
Speaker 16: know what the outcome might come from those Do.

2346
01:53:00,412 --> 01:53:02,213
Speaker 3: You think it's okay for us to be laughing on

2347
01:53:02,333 --> 01:53:03,973
Speaker 3: it all the way over here in New Zealand though so,

2348
01:53:04,093 --> 01:53:06,173
Speaker 3: I'm not sure if those kids listen to news talks,

2349
01:53:06,173 --> 01:53:07,052
Speaker 3: he'd be in the afternoon.

2350
01:53:07,412 --> 01:53:10,333
Speaker 16: I'm just taking it from the point of view that

2351
01:53:10,452 --> 01:53:12,852
Speaker 16: if they have got children, I couldn't care less what

2352
01:53:13,053 --> 01:53:16,213
Speaker 16: they do. Doesn't affect me. But I'm thinking of you've

2353
01:53:16,253 --> 01:53:20,093
Speaker 16: got children over there. Everybody's carrying on like they are here.

2354
01:53:20,572 --> 01:53:22,213
Speaker 16: They're doing it over where they live.

2355
01:53:22,572 --> 01:53:25,293
Speaker 3: The thing is that laughter is a great leveler gene

2356
01:53:25,492 --> 01:53:28,732
Speaker 3: because once you've laughed, you've you whether it's morally right

2357
01:53:28,853 --> 01:53:31,093
Speaker 3: or not, you've you've admitted that you laughed. So the

2358
01:53:31,213 --> 01:53:34,253
Speaker 3: fact that I saw it and laughed, there's no there's

2359
01:53:34,253 --> 01:53:35,492
Speaker 3: no there's no coming back down.

2360
01:53:36,293 --> 01:53:38,173
Speaker 16: Yeah, you can laugh at it, but you don't have

2361
01:53:38,293 --> 01:53:40,692
Speaker 16: to keep talking about it. I'm talking it from the

2362
01:53:40,853 --> 01:53:44,133
Speaker 16: child's point of view. You don't know how that's going

2363
01:53:44,213 --> 01:53:47,293
Speaker 16: to affect them. If they've got children in the are

2364
01:53:47,372 --> 01:53:48,852
Speaker 16: the parents talking about it?

2365
01:53:49,253 --> 01:53:52,412
Speaker 3: Well, you're a bestian, You're a bestion of moral virtue,

2366
01:53:52,612 --> 01:53:55,532
Speaker 3: and I admire that look I wish that I was

2367
01:53:55,772 --> 01:53:58,372
Speaker 3: the kind of person that didn't gossip and find things

2368
01:53:58,412 --> 01:54:00,133
Speaker 3: like this funny. But I'm afraid, Jean, I'm not as

2369
01:54:00,173 --> 01:54:02,333
Speaker 3: good a person as you, but I admire, I admire

2370
01:54:02,372 --> 01:54:03,213
Speaker 3: your stand good on.

2371
01:54:03,293 --> 01:54:06,532
Speaker 16: You well as I say, I'm parent myself and I've

2372
01:54:06,572 --> 01:54:10,173
Speaker 16: got grandchildren, but I would interesting to happen. And those

2373
01:54:10,213 --> 01:54:13,932
Speaker 16: who people laughing and stories going around about their parents.

2374
01:54:14,173 --> 01:54:16,852
Speaker 3: Yeah, well there you go, here you go. Thank you

2375
01:54:17,013 --> 01:54:18,973
Speaker 3: very much better than she's better than you. And all

2376
01:54:19,013 --> 01:54:22,412
Speaker 3: these hundreds of other people that are trying to ring in. Yeah, Jean,

2377
01:54:22,812 --> 01:54:25,012
Speaker 3: and all these people making the memes and the whole

2378
01:54:25,053 --> 01:54:27,892
Speaker 3: world laughing about it. Walks through the news at HEROLD,

2379
01:54:27,933 --> 01:54:31,452
Speaker 3: you know the news. What do you call it? Box room?

2380
01:54:31,772 --> 01:54:34,533
Speaker 2: Yep. Everyone was talking about it, and everyone's still talking

2381
01:54:34,573 --> 01:54:36,413
Speaker 2: about it. And that's why we're talking about it. But

2382
01:54:36,533 --> 01:54:41,253
Speaker 2: more Jean's less Tyler's Yeah, absolute, here's a good dicks here.

2383
01:54:41,493 --> 01:54:43,693
Speaker 2: I was a secretary met my partner at work. He

2384
01:54:43,812 --> 01:54:46,613
Speaker 2: was a partner of the firm. I was not his secretary.

2385
01:54:46,693 --> 01:54:49,053
Speaker 2: He was married. We've now been married thirty years. You

2386
01:54:49,173 --> 01:54:53,053
Speaker 2: get to know someone while working with them, though, one

2387
01:54:53,213 --> 01:54:55,413
Speaker 2: of the partners said of secretary is what you get

2388
01:54:55,453 --> 01:54:57,893
Speaker 2: your leg over, not what you leave your wife for

2389
01:54:58,093 --> 01:54:59,453
Speaker 2: years he had many affairs. Son.

2390
01:55:00,373 --> 01:55:04,013
Speaker 3: Okay, but you know historically, you know, if you make it,

2391
01:55:04,893 --> 01:55:09,493
Speaker 3: you know, there's if everyone just only on the same level,

2392
01:55:10,413 --> 01:55:12,052
Speaker 3: then how do people move up levels?

2393
01:55:12,333 --> 01:55:12,533
Speaker 2: Yep?

2394
01:55:12,772 --> 01:55:15,413
Speaker 3: And surely were in a world where someone the fanciest

2395
01:55:15,413 --> 01:55:17,653
Speaker 3: person in the world can fall in love with the

2396
01:55:17,693 --> 01:55:20,053
Speaker 3: most lowly person in the world. I mean, ideally it's

2397
01:55:20,093 --> 01:55:22,093
Speaker 3: not a fear, but I'm not so sure about this

2398
01:55:22,133 --> 01:55:23,333
Speaker 3: whole parrotpower balance though.

2399
01:55:23,373 --> 01:55:23,493
Speaker 13: Yea.

2400
01:55:23,613 --> 01:55:26,573
Speaker 2: No, that's an orientic view on things. Thank you very

2401
01:55:26,653 --> 01:55:28,653
Speaker 2: much to everyone who text and phoned on that good

2402
01:55:28,653 --> 01:55:31,052
Speaker 2: discussion and more will come out of that story, no doubt,

2403
01:55:31,413 --> 01:55:33,253
Speaker 2: but that is asked for another day.

2404
01:55:33,733 --> 01:55:33,932
Speaker 12: Yeah.

2405
01:55:34,013 --> 01:55:35,453
Speaker 3: Thank you to all your great New Zealanders for listening

2406
01:55:35,453 --> 01:55:36,972
Speaker 3: to the show. Thanks so much for all your calls

2407
01:55:37,013 --> 01:55:38,772
Speaker 3: and text We had a great time chatting. I hope

2408
01:55:38,812 --> 01:55:40,253
Speaker 3: you had a good time listening. The Matt and Tyler

2409
01:55:40,253 --> 01:55:42,053
Speaker 3: Afternoons podcast will be out and about now, So if

2410
01:55:42,053 --> 01:55:44,613
Speaker 3: you missed out jets on lying on your CV and

2411
01:55:44,653 --> 01:55:47,573
Speaker 3: the morality about that and what would be a better

2412
01:55:47,653 --> 01:55:50,653
Speaker 3: system than NCAA, then follow our podcast wherever you get

2413
01:55:50,693 --> 01:55:56,293
Speaker 3: your pots hither dooper Cee Ellen is back, Yes, next

2414
01:55:57,213 --> 01:56:00,053
Speaker 3: she's a great New Zealander. But right now, Tyler, why

2415
01:56:00,093 --> 01:56:04,253
Speaker 3: would I be playing this song from Coldplay Viva?

2416
01:56:04,453 --> 01:56:06,173
Speaker 2: And I think one of the lyrics is quite apt

2417
01:56:06,293 --> 01:56:09,053
Speaker 2: to the situation we've just been talking about. He used

2418
01:56:09,053 --> 01:56:12,013
Speaker 2: to be so high, king of the world, Now he's

2419
01:56:12,013 --> 01:56:13,173
Speaker 2: sweeping streets. No, we're not really.

2420
01:56:13,213 --> 01:56:16,772
Speaker 3: I'm sure that CEO is going to be absolutely fine.

2421
01:56:17,013 --> 01:56:18,653
Speaker 3: And so I said, thank you so much for listening. Everyone,

2422
01:56:18,733 --> 01:56:19,693
Speaker 3: see you tomorrow Ava.

2423
01:56:20,453 --> 01:56:23,893
Speaker 20: Until then, give a taste a key Jesus when I

2424
01:56:24,013 --> 01:56:30,573
Speaker 20: came the world Now, Tyler.

2425
01:56:32,173 --> 01:56:34,733
Speaker 1: For more from News Talks at b listen live on

2426
01:56:34,933 --> 01:56:37,852
Speaker 1: air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever

2427
01:56:37,933 --> 01:56:40,453
Speaker 1: you go with our podcasts on iHeartRadio.