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Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from news talks it B.

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Speaker 1: Follow this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: It's time for all the attitude, all the opinion, all

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Speaker 1: the information, all the debates of the US, Now the

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Speaker 1: Layton Smith Podcast powered by news talks it B.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to podcasts three hundred and four for October one,

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty five. This morning, I was giving considerable thought

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Speaker 2: to a number of issues that I decided or realized,

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Speaker 2: if you like, had connections in common, albeit not in

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Speaker 2: the same literal category. Example, how to make a great

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Speaker 2: cappuccino on a plane versus how to deal with a

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Speaker 2: medical crisis on the same aircraft. The only commonality is

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Speaker 2: the plane. Now try and resolve a dilemma involving truth.

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Speaker 2: Why so well, at the moment there's much disagreement on

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Speaker 2: precisely that, and more recently, we have politicians in different

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Speaker 2: countries wanting to introduce legislation outlawing commentary that does not

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Speaker 2: represent their truth, which in itself is nuts. And then

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Speaker 2: I opened an article by a medical professor in the

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Speaker 2: US on that same question. It was total coincidence. Herein

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Speaker 2: lies the problem, herein lies the problem he writes, how

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Speaker 2: can we ever arrive at a true representation of reality?

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Speaker 2: During the Great COVID Disaster, I kept thinking that if

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Speaker 2: only the actual, unbiased data could be shared with those

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Speaker 2: who insisted the virus evolved naturally, or those who believed

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Speaker 2: early treatment was impossible, or those who insisted that mRNA

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Speaker 2: agents were safe and effective, the impulse could be broken.

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Speaker 2: Alas that never happened because the source of illumination had

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Speaker 2: been altered from what it was in the past. With

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Speaker 2: the advent of postmodernism, the literal definition of truth itself

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Speaker 2: has changed. The truth has been replaced by my truth

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Speaker 2: and your truth. Truth has become an opinion, no more

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Speaker 2: important than whether you like your stake rare or medium. Now.

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Speaker 2: In the past, we relied on ethical medical science to

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Speaker 2: lead the way to find the truth. But is that

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Speaker 2: even possible now? In current medical studies, it seems that

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Speaker 2: the conclusions are now made first, then the study is

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Speaker 2: designed to fit those conclusions. A recently published study on

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Speaker 2: a trial of a new drug to treat hypertension had

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Speaker 2: this statement appended to the end. The sponsor designed and

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Speaker 2: conducted the study, including collection, management, analysis, and interpretation of

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Speaker 2: the data. The sponsor was involved in the preparation, review

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Speaker 2: and approval of the manuscript, and decision to submit the

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Speaker 2: manuscript for publication in collaboration with all authors. The final

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Speaker 2: decision on content was exclusively retained by the authors. Now,

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Speaker 2: he says, I realized that rug companies are interested in

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Speaker 2: proving their products indeed help people. But if the drug

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Speaker 2: manufacturer designs and conducts the study, including collection, management, analysis,

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Speaker 2: and interpretation of the data, does it not give one pause?

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Speaker 2: Is it appropriate for the drug manufacturer to have this

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Speaker 2: degree of control?

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Speaker 3: Now?

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Speaker 2: I want to take this a little further, but let

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Speaker 2: me tell you first. The author is russ A. Gonering

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Speaker 2: Gooble n Erng, Adjunct Professor of Ophthalmology at the Medical

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Speaker 2: College of Wisconsin, and the article appeared in Brownstone. I

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Speaker 2: want to go further with it, though, because it makes

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Speaker 2: a very good point. That is, I think, I think terribly,

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Speaker 2: terribly contributive to understanding some of the issues that we've

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Speaker 2: been well, I want to say, bitching about for some

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Speaker 2: time in this country and others, with the one side

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Speaker 2: being right and one side being wrong. Do I need

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Speaker 2: to explain? Gonoring gives a number of examples, and I

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Speaker 2: want to choose two of Consider this article by Carlton

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Speaker 2: Giles in the Canadian Veteranary Journal, published in twenty fifteen.

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Speaker 2: This was five years before the Great COVID disaster. Giles

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Speaker 2: references the statements of editors of two of the most

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Speaker 2: renowned medical journals in the English language and bemoans the

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Speaker 2: state of medical publications. This is a quote published in

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Speaker 2: Drama from Marcia Angel, former editor in chief of the

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Speaker 2: New England Journal of Medicine. Over the past two decades,

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Speaker 2: the pharmaceutical industry has gained unprecedented control over the evaluation

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Speaker 2: of its own products. Drug companies now finance most clinical

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Speaker 2: research on prescription drugs, and there is mounting evidence that

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Speaker 2: they often skew the research they sponsor to make their

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Speaker 2: drugs look better and safer. Two recent articles underscore the problem.

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Speaker 2: One showed that many publications concerning Merck's rofe kobics that

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Speaker 2: were attributed primarily or solely to academic investigators were actually

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Speaker 2: written by Merck employees or medical publishing companies hired by merk.

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Speaker 2: The other showed that the company manipulated the data analysis

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Speaker 2: in two clinical trials to minimize the increased mortality associated

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Speaker 2: with Rofe Kobix bias in the way industry sponsored research

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Speaker 2: is conducted and reported is not unusual and by no

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Speaker 2: means limited to merk Then, in his twenty fifteen commentary,

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Speaker 2: Richard Horton, the editor in chief of The Lancet, wrote,

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Speaker 2: the case against science is straightforward. Much of the scientific literature,

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Speaker 2: perhaps half, may simply be untrue, afflicted by studies with

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Speaker 2: small sample sizes, tiny effects, invalid exploratory analysis, and flagrant

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Speaker 2: conflicts of interest, together with an ab session for pursuing

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Speaker 2: fashionable trends of dubious importance, science has taken a turn

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Speaker 2: towards darkness. This from the editor in chief of The Lancet.

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Speaker 2: The author then asks the question is their remedy, and

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Speaker 2: cutting to the quick, he says things may have changed.

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Speaker 2: On August fifteen, twenty twenty five, J. Batticharia, the new

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Speaker 2: director of National Institutes of Healthy NIH, published his vision

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Speaker 2: of a unified strategy to redirect the priorities of the

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Speaker 2: NIH in order to restore confidence in the science. And

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Speaker 2: there's a number of points that I might go into.

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Speaker 2: You can read it for yourself though on Brownstone. Now

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Speaker 2: at the back end of the podcast, a brief mention

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Speaker 2: of a couple of technical matters that will very likely

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Speaker 2: interfere with your life, if not immediately, then in the

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Speaker 2: not too distant future. Spooky, but in a moment. Guy Hatchet.

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Speaker 2: Guy Hatchard is director and principal contributor to the Hatchard Report. Actually,

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Speaker 2: he's made some adjustments to the Hatchard Report, and we'll

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Speaker 2: mention that at the end of the podcast. He's been

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Speaker 2: a lifelong advocate of food safety. He was formerly Director

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Speaker 2: of Natural Products at genetic Id, a global food safety

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Speaker 2: testing and certification company now known as food Chain Id.

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Speaker 2: Genetic Id developed techniques to test for the presence of

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Speaker 2: genetically modified organisms in food and provided services to Bolk

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Speaker 2: food trading companies like ADM, Cargol and many others in

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Speaker 2: order to facilitate access to export markets and increase consumer trust.

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Speaker 2: He's presented his findings to the governments and industry leaders

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Speaker 2: around the world. He appeared before the New Zealand Royal

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Speaker 2: Commission on Genetic Modification and has been a key figure

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Speaker 2: in discussions since twenty seventeen, which eventually led to the

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Speaker 2: repeal of the Natural Products Bill. And he's written the

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Speaker 2: book Your DNA Diet, which is available from Amazon's great

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Speaker 2: to have you back.

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Speaker 3: Great to be here, Laton.

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Speaker 2: There is so much, so much to discuss. Well, let

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Speaker 2: me make this observation and get your comment. Am I wrong?

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Speaker 2: And it could be because you know, I spent five

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Speaker 2: weeks out of the country and in Europe it didn't

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Speaker 2: pay a lot of attention to things. Am I wrong

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Speaker 2: in saying that there has been an increase in input

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Speaker 2: as in research, reporting, writing, and I don't mean media

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Speaker 2: research and reporting in the area that we are basically

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Speaker 2: here to discuss, and that is the gene technology bill.

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Speaker 3: Oh yes, I think there's a big buzs isn't there?

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Speaker 2: And I'm talking just the last few months.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I think it's an issue. You know, this is

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Speaker 4: a big change for New Zealand, it's a big change

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Speaker 4: for the world, of course. And people are expressing their

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Speaker 4: I'm not going to say opinions, They're expressing what they

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Speaker 4: know about the issue, because there is a lot known

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Speaker 4: about the issue, a lot of research published, and I

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Speaker 4: think the centers around the whole notion of substantial equivalent.

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Speaker 4: There has been this assumption that gene auto products are

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Speaker 4: somehow very much the same as naturally occurring products or

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Speaker 4: their sort of genetic ancestors. But research has come out

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Speaker 4: and that's simply not the case. And people are aware

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Speaker 4: of this, and they're talking about writing to their MPs,

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Speaker 4: they're setting up public forums and this is a matter

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Speaker 4: of concern because what we eat affects us and that's

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Speaker 4: this is the whole point of my book Your DNA Diet,

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Speaker 4: that the missing factor in our understanding of nutrition is

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Speaker 4: the fact that we rely on the genetic structures in

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Speaker 4: our food for our health, not just the vitamins, not

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Speaker 4: just the fats, proteins, cofactors of digestion and so on, carbohydrates,

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Speaker 4: the actual natural food that has a genetic structure is

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Speaker 4: vital for our health and there's an enormous amount of

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Speaker 4: research on this now. Altering that genetic structure is degrading

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Speaker 4: the essential quality of the food that we eat, and

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Speaker 4: there's a lot known about it. A lot of the parameters,

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Speaker 4: the cacture of food, the nutritional content changes when you

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Speaker 4: genetically modify an organism, so it's it's you know, this

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Speaker 4: is something of huge public concern and we have been

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Speaker 4: protected from this in New Zealand after the big debate

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Speaker 4: that we had at the end of the nineties that

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Speaker 4: the genetic modification debate and the government is proposing to

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Speaker 4: change that. Well, there has to be a national debate

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Speaker 4: about this, and it just doesn't these days. It's not

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Speaker 4: just about food, it's about medical procedures, it's about vaccines,

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Speaker 4: it's about food processing as well, using genetically modified microorganisms

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Speaker 4: and so on. Quite an extensive subject and we need

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Speaker 4: to inform ourselves about it.

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Speaker 2: It's got a very broad base now, doesn't it.

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Speaker 4: It does, and I think these concerns are genuine. They

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Speaker 4: have to be thrashed out and I'm very pleased to

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Speaker 4: see that New Zealand Versus has taken a lot of

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Speaker 4: these concerns very seriously, and that is the reason that

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Speaker 4: this bill hasn't rushed through parliament. We're still waiting for

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Speaker 4: the Health Select Committee to report and Shane Jones publicly

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Speaker 4: announced that they're very concerned about the content of the

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Speaker 4: bill and they wish to negotiate what it covers. Personally,

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Speaker 4: I think that they need a much stronger regulatory regi

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Speaker 4: than the when they've got at the moment, not the

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Speaker 4: proposed deregulation, and I think the reasons for that are obvious,

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Speaker 4: aren't they we've just had five years pandemic. It seems

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Speaker 4: virtually certain that that COVID itself came out of a lab.

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Speaker 4: The intervent, the health interventions after which weren't really very

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Speaker 4: successful and in fact carried a lot of harm with them,

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Speaker 4: the vaccine and so on, and the procedures in hospitals,

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Speaker 4: all of these things came out of a paradigm based

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Speaker 4: on biotechnology. Thirty million people. This is the figure that

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Speaker 4: our world and data a very reliable health data.

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Speaker 3: Source, thirty million people. Excess deaths in the world during

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Speaker 3: the last five years. That should be really a wake

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Speaker 3: up caution.

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Speaker 2: Well, it should. There's been a volcanic eruption of information

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Speaker 2: that's flooded the market, but its only flooded the market

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Speaker 2: that is willing to process it and proceed with it.

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Speaker 2: And you've got plenty of media that still won't have

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Speaker 2: a bar of it, won't touch it because it's still,

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Speaker 2: as far as they're concerned, not the narrative, and they

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Speaker 2: are making fools of themselves. And that's being revealed day

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Speaker 2: by day, week by week.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, you've only got a look at the publishing that's

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Speaker 4: going on. The facts that are coming out about the

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Speaker 4: dangers of the gene technology and we're looking at anchogenesis

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Speaker 4: and people are so uninformed.

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Speaker 3: Just this morning, a few.

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Speaker 4: Minutes ago, I was reading an article and Stuff about

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Speaker 4: increases in bowel cancer and.

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Speaker 2: There's in New Zealand.

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Speaker 3: In New Zealand, there's.

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Speaker 4: Been an academic epidemic which is overwhelming according to the

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Speaker 4: people working in the field, the oncologists and so on.

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Speaker 4: A doctor Frizell, who works in this field was interviewed

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Speaker 4: by Stuff and he said he started off by saying,

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Speaker 4: looking for the causes of this massive rise in bowel

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Speaker 4: cancer among young people, he said, genes haven't changed, they

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Speaker 4: are the same as they always were, and therefore he

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Speaker 4: concludes the must be due to environmental factors. Well, he's

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Speaker 4: completely off base. Our genetic functions have changed substantially and

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Speaker 4: there are a lot of studies now published in reputable journals,

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Speaker 4: period reviewed journals showing that there are significant changes in

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Speaker 4: genetic functions following mass vaccination with m RNA vaccines, and

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Speaker 4: these have been linked to increases in cancer incidents. Now,

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Speaker 4: these are very significant studies and here we have members

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Speaker 4: of our hospital system who are uninformed about this. Oh,

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Speaker 4: obviously these are busy people. If they're dealing with a

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Speaker 4: pandemic or an epidemic of rising epidemic of bowel cancer.

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Speaker 4: Obviously they're very busy and really unable to look into

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Speaker 4: it given the time that's available to them to look

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Speaker 4: at this sort of broad landscape of scientific publishing about

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Speaker 4: the effect of the vaccine. But they need to look

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Speaker 4: into it. We need to ask, has there been a

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Speaker 4: decrease in immunity and the general population and an increase

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Speaker 4: in susceptibility to cancers and other neurodegenerative diseases?

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Speaker 2: All right, a couple of points that increase includes younger

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Speaker 2: and younger people. Does it not?

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Speaker 3: Absolutely?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, And that's what's frightening about it is because we've

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Speaker 4: never seen this before.

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Speaker 3: This is totally new.

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Speaker 4: We're in uncharted territory, and we have to ask why,

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Speaker 4: and we have to have an open mind about that.

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Speaker 4: We can't go back to the previous kinds of explanations.

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Speaker 4: You know, for the last you know, twenty thirty years,

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Speaker 4: we've had increasing rates of answers, and there are environmental

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Speaker 4: factors and dietary factors that have been identified as causal.

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Speaker 4: But what we've seen now is not more of the same,

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Speaker 4: but a sudden jump in cancers and unusually not found

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Speaker 4: in the previous system. In the previous series, young people

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Speaker 4: coming down with cancers. And when we say young people,

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Speaker 4: we're talking about the sort of twenty to thirty range.

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Speaker 4: And you have to when you have a data series

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Speaker 4: like that, you have to conclude that something novel has changed.

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Speaker 4: It's not more of the same, it's not business as usual.

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Speaker 4: Something different has been introduced, and that gives you the

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Speaker 4: ability to understand and look into what are the causal

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Speaker 4: factors here. We have to have a national debate. The

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Speaker 4: lack of a national debate, the fact that the medical establishment,

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Speaker 4: the media and the government have closed down debate on

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Speaker 4: this subject and pontificated about it. It's not just that

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Speaker 4: it's a national scandal that we're not having a debate,

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Speaker 4: or it's not just that you know, it's unfortunate and

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Speaker 4: we wish we talk more. People are dying at a

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Speaker 4: greater rate than before. Our excess desk is still five

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Speaker 4: percent of the pre pandemic levels, and we have to

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Speaker 4: ask some difficult questions. We have to have some conversations.

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Speaker 2: When you say we opens the door to any number

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Speaker 2: of questions and responses. Will the Gene Technology build pass

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Speaker 2: that was published on the twelfth of August. Then if

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Speaker 2: we go to the twenty fourth of September, a long

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Speaker 2: essential read on the brink of disaster, A watershed moment.

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Speaker 2: Not overstated, no.

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Speaker 3: Not at all.

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Speaker 4: All Right, so we're sliding into a very unfortunate future

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Speaker 4: and we're not asking the right questions.

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Speaker 2: A long essential read is what you published on the

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Speaker 2: brink of disaster, a watershed moment. If enacted, the Gene

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Speaker 2: Technology Bill will take us further away from our Keiwi

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Speaker 2: foundational principles and our cultural heritage of independence and care.

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Speaker 2: The bill signals have proposed new direction for New Zealand

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Speaker 2: in alignment with and with and subsidiary to the world's

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Speaker 2: leading biotechnology nations that will have a radical effect on

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Speaker 2: our food and our health. Now, what got me hooked

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Speaker 2: on what you were working on some little time back

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Speaker 2: was when I discovered that if the Gene Technology Bill passes,

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Speaker 2: then there will be no information on products that you

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Speaker 2: buy in the supermarket in tins or packets or whatever.

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Speaker 2: There will be no information on what's in there or

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Speaker 2: what's been what's been done to the product that's in there.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, so all those sorry, all those all those people

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Speaker 5: who you see looking looking at the information on the

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Speaker 5: side of a box or on a tin before they

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Speaker 5: put it in their basket will not be able to

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Speaker 5: do that because it won't exist anymore.

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Speaker 2: Why do they want to.

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Speaker 4: Do that, because they're aware of the fact that people do.

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Speaker 4: There's a significant cohort of people who do care about

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Speaker 4: what goes into their food, and they know and the

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Speaker 4: research shows that if it's labeled as altered in some way,

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Speaker 4: then it's acceptability goes down and their sales are going down.

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Speaker 4: So they absolutely this is a you know, this is

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Speaker 4: a line that they want to cross. They want to

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Speaker 4: get to a point in the food industry, as it

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Speaker 4: is to a large extent in America already. They want

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Speaker 4: to get to a point where you don't have to

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Speaker 4: identify what cocent food. And there are huge issues here

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Speaker 4: because they are changing what coast into food.

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Speaker 2: I'll give you I'll give you a personal example. Only

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Speaker 2: two days ago, I presented my wife with a box

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Speaker 2: of breakfast cereal granola, and I said, is this better

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Speaker 2: or worse? Then, because she's the prow in the house,

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Speaker 2: is this better or worse than what I'm eating? And

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Speaker 2: she looked at it and she read it for a minute.

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Speaker 2: She said, this is good, this is what you want.

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Speaker 2: And the very fact that they will deprive her and

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Speaker 2: everybody else probably who's listening, the ability to make a

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Speaker 2: judgment call on what they want and certainly don't want

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Speaker 2: to eat too much sugar, too much salt, or whatever

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Speaker 2: it might be. Then I think that's criminal.

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Speaker 3: Absolutely.

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Speaker 4: It's one of the things here that, yeah, it is

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Speaker 4: denying people information about what they're eating and changing surreptitiously

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Speaker 4: changing what we're eating without telling this obviously is criminal.

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Speaker 4: But it's happening on a scale. It's such a vast,

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Speaker 4: vast scale that the whole notion that someone might be

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Speaker 4: prosecuted for this is kind of it's just not likely

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Speaker 4: to happen. It's like at the end of the Second

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Speaker 4: World War there in the Nuremberg trials, but you know

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Speaker 4: a handful of people, a couple of dozen people were

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Speaker 4: prosecuted at Nuremberg, but actually you had a vast mass

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Speaker 4: the whole nation, and not just one nation involved in

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Speaker 4: genocide in war and so on and so forth. What

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Speaker 4: is going to change the situation is knowledge. There is

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Speaker 4: significant evidence published research analysis of the outcomes of the

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Speaker 4: pandemic and analysis of what is happening to our health

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Speaker 4: that can be connected back to what we're eating. This

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Speaker 4: has to be come to the front. The knowledge has

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Speaker 4: to come to the front, because that's going to be

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Speaker 4: capable of resolving the situation. It's just not going to

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Speaker 4: go be resolved through courts because of the vast mass

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Speaker 4: of people who just simply got caught up in government

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Speaker 4: regulations or lack of regulations, where the whole mass of

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Speaker 4: humanity is moving towards a less healthy diet some particular

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Speaker 4: medical interventions which are affecting health. To change that, we

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Speaker 4: have to move back to knowledge. We have to re

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Speaker 4: anchor ourselves. We're in scientific age. We have to re

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Speaker 4: anchor ourselves the science. We have to re anchor ourselves

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Speaker 4: to our own personal experience about what life is, what

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Speaker 4: constitutes life, and realize that we are being We are

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Speaker 4: a part of nature, and nature is an integrated, holistic

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Speaker 4: system that has evolved over billions of years, and it's nourishing.

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Speaker 4: It's essential characteristic is nourishing and evolutionary. And if we

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Speaker 4: go too far away from nature, then we're getting out

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Speaker 4: of not a comfort zone, but we're getting out of

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Speaker 4: a health zone essential that we start to re establish

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Speaker 4: our relationship with nature, We start to re establish our

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Speaker 4: relationship with knowledge, and we start to re establish our

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Speaker 4: relationship with who we actually are, understand ourselves.

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Speaker 2: Let me ask you about the Royal Commission. Where are

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Speaker 2: we up to now with the commission hearing?

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Speaker 4: It's hard to know, isn't it? Because they back down

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Speaker 4: on having public hearings. They said it wouldn't serve any

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Speaker 4: useful purpose to have a public hearing where people like

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Speaker 4: Ashley Bloomfield and to Cinderad and so on gave evidence.

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Speaker 4: You know, extraordinary. What's the whole purpose of public commission?

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Speaker 4: Royal Commission is to reassure the public that the right

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Speaker 4: questions have been asked of the right people and the

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Speaker 4: evidence has been assessed properly.

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Speaker 2: I know that you made a submission. What sort of

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Speaker 2: reaction did you get?

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Speaker 3: I wrote, I wrote a submission, but I wasn't called

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Speaker 3: to give evidence.

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Speaker 2: Who did they call to give evidence? Not names, necessarily,

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Speaker 2: but what sort of people?

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Speaker 4: They picked a selection of industry representatives and community groups

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Speaker 4: to give evidence, and I think a lot of ideas

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Speaker 4: were left out of that. And they had what thirty

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Speaker 4: seven thousand submissions. They might have heard from fifty or

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Speaker 4: so people.

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Speaker 2: Is there anyone else in New Zealand that has the

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Speaker 2: food background that you do, that might have that might

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Speaker 2: have been giving evidence.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, there are. There are some people who are very

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Speaker 4: aware of some of the issues. I believe that some

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Speaker 4: of them did presentations to the Commission. I don't think

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Speaker 4: so much in the food industry, in the food side

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Speaker 4: of things. I think the food side of things is

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Speaker 4: very very important. There are some fundamental principles that need

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Speaker 4: to be understood and thought about. And the whole medical well,

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Speaker 4: you know, this is a huge bandwagon. When I said,

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Speaker 4: I to think about it, and I just think that

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Speaker 4: the whole tech bandwagon that means biotech, AI and so on,

390
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Speaker 4: it's a huge there's a huge amount of money riding

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Speaker 4: in that and it has a huge influence on government.

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Speaker 4: Governments pay attention to money. And because the potential profits

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Speaker 4: in the food industry are so enormous, if you can

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Speaker 4: capture the food industry, food is something everybody has to

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Speaker 4: eat every day. It's that, it's the it's the golds

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Speaker 4: that if you want to make money, if you can

397
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Speaker 4: come up with a food that everybody has to eat

398
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Speaker 4: every day and you have the patent to it, then

399
00:28:10,733 --> 00:28:13,893
Speaker 4: you're going to make massive, massive amounts of money. So

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Speaker 4: this is the battleground, the sort of technological battleground that's

401
00:28:17,933 --> 00:28:22,053
Speaker 4: going on. People want us to stop eating things that

402
00:28:22,093 --> 00:28:24,813
Speaker 4: you can grow in your garden and start eating things

403
00:28:24,813 --> 00:28:27,173
Speaker 4: that they make in a factory that they alone have

404
00:28:27,253 --> 00:28:31,173
Speaker 4: the right to make. And so there's a lot of

405
00:28:31,213 --> 00:28:36,973
Speaker 4: money and influence pouring into government and being bought essentially.

406
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Speaker 4: I mean, the head of Oracles named Larry Elson just

407
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Speaker 4: gave two hundred and seventy five billion to the UK

408
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Speaker 4: government to establish a science research center at one thing

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Speaker 4: he's Oxford, I think, basically centered on biotechnology.

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Speaker 3: And how much was that two hundred and seventy five

411
00:29:05,013 --> 00:29:07,133
Speaker 3: million it?

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Speaker 4: You know, people are buying influence in order to buy deregulation,

413
00:29:14,533 --> 00:29:18,053
Speaker 4: to buy deregulation of the food industry so that they

414
00:29:18,093 --> 00:29:22,373
Speaker 4: can capture a bigger slice of the food industry, which

415
00:29:22,453 --> 00:29:26,013
Speaker 4: will be a massive money making for them. So we're

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00:29:26,053 --> 00:29:31,013
Speaker 4: dealing here with forces that are just they're almost unstoppable,

417
00:29:31,133 --> 00:29:35,253
Speaker 4: but we can stop them by being careful about what

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Speaker 4: we buy in the supermarket. So a key thing here

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Speaker 4: is to remove labeling of novel content in foods, because

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Speaker 4: then our capacity to be aware of what we're buying

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Speaker 4: is radically decreased.

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Speaker 2: And I said that's criminal.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, well basically I agree absolutely that it's criminal. Just

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00:30:00,253 --> 00:30:03,453
Speaker 4: working out how to move ahead into that area. We

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00:30:03,573 --> 00:30:07,853
Speaker 4: have to sort of become more knowledgeable people. That's my answer.

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Speaker 2: So how you touched on this how the AI and

427
00:30:12,653 --> 00:30:16,293
Speaker 2: biotech alliance will affect New Zealand. Now that that was

428
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Speaker 2: published on August three, I'm giving dates because people will

429
00:30:20,653 --> 00:30:25,733
Speaker 2: want to find them or try to, and also because

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Speaker 2: it endorses what I This is how I got the impression.

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Speaker 2: Because I've got all these printouts and they've all congregated

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Speaker 2: over the last few months. It's like there was a

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Speaker 2: major breakthrough or that everyone people have got onto it

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00:30:43,733 --> 00:30:47,893
Speaker 2: or whatever. An article published in Nature on July thirty,

435
00:30:48,373 --> 00:30:54,373
Speaker 2: entitled Crisper GPT for Agentic Automation and Gene Editing Experiments

436
00:30:54,373 --> 00:30:59,013
Speaker 2: explains how genetic modification of human and plants cell lines

437
00:30:59,413 --> 00:31:04,493
Speaker 2: en mass is now being controlled by computers. What could

438
00:31:04,533 --> 00:31:08,493
Speaker 2: possibly go wrong? Was that was your opening paragraph, So

439
00:31:09,173 --> 00:31:09,973
Speaker 2: take it from there.

440
00:31:10,813 --> 00:31:17,693
Speaker 4: Well, what has happened is that now thousands of genetic

441
00:31:17,813 --> 00:31:26,973
Speaker 4: experiments can be basically initiated using specialized AI computerized control.

442
00:31:28,253 --> 00:31:33,453
Speaker 4: And so we're seeing an exponential you know, it's an

443
00:31:33,493 --> 00:31:37,413
Speaker 4: ex volcanic is the word you use quite rightly, We're

444
00:31:37,413 --> 00:31:42,173
Speaker 4: seeing a volcanic explosion in genetic experimentation. If we think

445
00:31:42,213 --> 00:31:46,533
Speaker 4: that the pandemic, as most people do, came out of

446
00:31:47,053 --> 00:31:50,413
Speaker 4: an experiment in a lab in Wuhan, now just rethink

447
00:31:50,493 --> 00:31:54,413
Speaker 4: that and start to realize that labs all over the

448
00:31:54,413 --> 00:32:01,373
Speaker 4: world are now using AI to initiate not one or

449
00:32:01,413 --> 00:32:04,093
Speaker 4: two or three or four experiments as they were doing

450
00:32:04,533 --> 00:32:09,813
Speaker 4: in Wuhan, but tens of thousands of experiments on our genes.

451
00:32:10,173 --> 00:32:17,773
Speaker 4: And remember that our genes are very precise and specific,

452
00:32:19,013 --> 00:32:24,693
Speaker 4: and altering them is fraught with risk. Altering them on

453
00:32:25,013 --> 00:32:28,853
Speaker 4: mass as is now starting to happen all around the

454
00:32:28,893 --> 00:32:34,653
Speaker 4: world is absolutely mad. Why are we doing this when

455
00:32:34,653 --> 00:32:40,733
Speaker 4: we've just gone through this problem with world health which

456
00:32:40,853 --> 00:32:42,693
Speaker 4: is connected to altering genes.

457
00:32:42,733 --> 00:32:44,133
Speaker 3: I mean, just think for a moment.

458
00:32:44,253 --> 00:32:48,893
Speaker 4: One codeon out of place is the cause of Huntington's disease,

459
00:32:49,253 --> 00:32:53,773
Speaker 4: which is an inevitably fatal disease. One code on, well,

460
00:32:54,013 --> 00:32:58,933
Speaker 4: one tiny. It's not a one gene, it's one letter

461
00:32:59,333 --> 00:33:03,853
Speaker 4: out of place among billions, and that's sufficient to cause

462
00:33:03,893 --> 00:33:08,813
Speaker 4: the seriously in a serious inherited disease, which reflects reflects

463
00:33:08,813 --> 00:33:10,973
Speaker 4: a very large number of people around the world because

464
00:33:10,973 --> 00:33:13,653
Speaker 4: it can be passed through the generations. Why are we

465
00:33:13,733 --> 00:33:21,213
Speaker 4: suddenly saying we're going to let computers decide what you know,

466
00:33:21,293 --> 00:33:26,573
Speaker 4: what is altered? How is that in any way at

467
00:33:26,653 --> 00:33:27,893
Speaker 4: all sensible?

468
00:33:28,213 --> 00:33:30,853
Speaker 2: Well this, well, it doesn't have to be, does it.

469
00:33:30,853 --> 00:33:36,133
Speaker 2: It just has to produce. I'm a capitalist, always have been,

470
00:33:37,133 --> 00:33:41,893
Speaker 2: always will be. But there are some common sense matters

471
00:33:42,053 --> 00:33:44,653
Speaker 2: that have to be taken into account. You've got kids

472
00:33:44,653 --> 00:33:47,133
Speaker 2: growing up these days thinking capitalists are evil and horrible

473
00:33:47,133 --> 00:33:49,893
Speaker 2: and they should all be strung up. All over the world.

474
00:33:50,333 --> 00:33:54,133
Speaker 2: They're thinking that, and you read about it quite quite seriously,

475
00:33:54,733 --> 00:34:00,053
Speaker 2: particularly in the United States. But there are, if not

476
00:34:00,293 --> 00:34:05,533
Speaker 2: rules to the game of capitalism, there are requirements if

477
00:34:05,533 --> 00:34:08,853
Speaker 2: you're going to if you're going to have a capitalist society,

478
00:34:09,053 --> 00:34:11,533
Speaker 2: and all of that seems to be lost.

479
00:34:11,973 --> 00:34:16,453
Speaker 6: We live in a chaotic world where you know, we've

480
00:34:16,453 --> 00:34:21,253
Speaker 6: reached a point where our moral and ethical basis has

481
00:34:21,373 --> 00:34:27,413
Speaker 6: been degraded and people are entering into things, into activities

482
00:34:27,453 --> 00:34:32,013
Speaker 6: which harm others, or mislead others and justifying on the

483
00:34:32,053 --> 00:34:34,973
Speaker 6: basis of the fact that they're making a profit.

484
00:34:35,653 --> 00:34:36,573
Speaker 3: I'm a capitalist.

485
00:34:39,453 --> 00:34:42,613
Speaker 4: I can't say I've worked in business, but I you know,

486
00:34:42,813 --> 00:34:52,773
Speaker 4: I believe that financial stability, financial fluidity, innovation are fundamentally good.

487
00:34:53,173 --> 00:34:56,053
Speaker 4: But let me put it a completely another way. Actually,

488
00:34:56,533 --> 00:35:00,413
Speaker 4: the way I see what has happened is that our

489
00:35:00,613 --> 00:35:07,373
Speaker 4: fundamental goodness, the goodness of mankind, arises from our connection

490
00:35:07,533 --> 00:35:13,213
Speaker 4: with what is universal in life, universal consciousness, the universal

491
00:35:13,333 --> 00:35:20,173
Speaker 4: good that exists that is behind the whole universal progress

492
00:35:20,213 --> 00:35:25,413
Speaker 4: and evolution of life everywhere. Our connection with that relies

493
00:35:25,653 --> 00:35:30,333
Speaker 4: on our genetic structure. Our consciousness is expressed through our

494
00:35:30,373 --> 00:35:36,453
Speaker 4: genetic structure. If we set about altering our genetic structure

495
00:35:36,493 --> 00:35:41,573
Speaker 4: and function, we're degrading our connection with that universal consciousness,

496
00:35:41,573 --> 00:35:43,693
Speaker 4: which is the source of good. And what we're going

497
00:35:43,733 --> 00:35:46,573
Speaker 4: to get is chaos. And that is what we're seeing

498
00:35:46,613 --> 00:35:50,213
Speaker 4: at the moment in the world. We're seeing chaos. We're

499
00:35:50,253 --> 00:35:55,213
Speaker 4: seeing people taking decisions which are obviously morally or ethically wrong,

500
00:35:55,773 --> 00:35:58,653
Speaker 4: and they've lost their connection with the thread of life,

501
00:35:59,253 --> 00:36:03,653
Speaker 4: the thread of universal consciousness. Or put it in another way,

502
00:36:04,013 --> 00:36:08,773
Speaker 4: in you know, my original training was in physics, second

503
00:36:08,853 --> 00:36:13,853
Speaker 4: law ofload a thermodynamics. The second law of thermodynatics says

504
00:36:13,933 --> 00:36:19,893
Speaker 4: that disorder increases is always increasing. What it means is

505
00:36:19,893 --> 00:36:22,133
Speaker 4: if you put a car out on your front lawn,

506
00:36:22,253 --> 00:36:27,093
Speaker 4: eventually it's going to rust. It's becoming from the orderly

507
00:36:27,573 --> 00:36:30,413
Speaker 4: structure of a car. It eventually becomes a pile of rust.

508
00:36:30,893 --> 00:36:35,813
Speaker 4: So what goes against that in the universe are living

509
00:36:35,853 --> 00:36:43,853
Speaker 4: systems where organization order increases. Why do living systems increase

510
00:36:44,013 --> 00:36:49,133
Speaker 4: in order? They increase because they're consciousness. They're conscious, they're awake.

511
00:36:49,733 --> 00:36:54,413
Speaker 4: And why are we conscious and awake. We're awake because

512
00:36:54,693 --> 00:37:01,333
Speaker 4: our genetics enables us to express consciousness. If you alter genetics,

513
00:37:01,573 --> 00:37:06,053
Speaker 4: you'll degrade our ability to express consciousness, and as a

514
00:37:06,093 --> 00:37:11,693
Speaker 4: result of that, disorder will start to increase rather than decrease.

515
00:37:11,773 --> 00:37:14,853
Speaker 4: You'll see chaos. And that is what precisely we have

516
00:37:14,973 --> 00:37:18,253
Speaker 4: seen since the beginning of the pandemic, when we had

517
00:37:18,453 --> 00:37:23,933
Speaker 4: mass genetic vaccination of almost the whole world's population. We're

518
00:37:23,973 --> 00:37:27,733
Speaker 4: seeing chaotic situations developing everywhere.

519
00:37:28,613 --> 00:37:31,013
Speaker 2: He's right, you know, everywhere and spreading.

520
00:37:31,533 --> 00:37:34,173
Speaker 4: Yeah, we read about it every day in the newspapers,

521
00:37:34,213 --> 00:37:38,253
Speaker 4: and some of which we don't read about because the

522
00:37:38,293 --> 00:37:41,493
Speaker 4: media simply ignores it. For what's going on in places

523
00:37:41,533 --> 00:37:42,333
Speaker 4: like Nigeria.

524
00:37:43,933 --> 00:37:47,493
Speaker 2: Let me refer to the modern age cannot be an

525
00:37:47,533 --> 00:37:51,573
Speaker 2: age of biotechnology. And you open that with there are

526
00:37:51,573 --> 00:37:54,253
Speaker 2: turning points in history when the direction and destiny of

527
00:37:54,293 --> 00:38:01,413
Speaker 2: the human race shifts. These times are characterized by new experiences, ideas, choices, inventions,

528
00:38:01,413 --> 00:38:04,573
Speaker 2: and conflicts. We've arrived at a fork in the road

529
00:38:04,773 --> 00:38:10,173
Speaker 2: of mechanistic, rationalistic, scientific parent time of life which has

530
00:38:10,493 --> 00:38:13,813
Speaker 2: dominated our outlook for the last four hundred years. The

531
00:38:13,933 --> 00:38:16,853
Speaker 2: choices we make at this point in time will determine

532
00:38:16,853 --> 00:38:21,973
Speaker 2: the future direction of our health, wealth, comfort, and happiness.

533
00:38:22,653 --> 00:38:24,933
Speaker 2: And I want to read the bit where you quote

534
00:38:25,013 --> 00:38:28,493
Speaker 2: Leonardo da Vinci, because we've had We've had da Vinci

535
00:38:28,613 --> 00:38:32,453
Speaker 2: featured at least two times on different podcasts very recently.

536
00:38:33,413 --> 00:38:37,733
Speaker 2: Human subtlety will never devise an invention more beautiful, more simple,

537
00:38:37,973 --> 00:38:43,333
Speaker 2: or more direct than does nature because in her inventions

538
00:38:43,933 --> 00:38:49,013
Speaker 2: nothing is lacking and nothing is superfluous. Is that as

539
00:38:49,213 --> 00:38:51,573
Speaker 2: relevant today as it was when he wrote that?

540
00:38:53,053 --> 00:38:54,893
Speaker 3: Absolutely and timeless?

541
00:38:55,933 --> 00:38:58,573
Speaker 2: All right, So I'm going to take a different stance

542
00:38:58,613 --> 00:39:01,333
Speaker 2: with you for a moment. Why is it then, that

543
00:39:01,373 --> 00:39:05,333
Speaker 2: we have developed so many things in the period of

544
00:39:05,373 --> 00:39:10,173
Speaker 2: time since Da Vinci was alive in that era of enlightenment.

545
00:39:11,013 --> 00:39:15,293
Speaker 2: Why is it that we can't accept that maybe things

546
00:39:15,333 --> 00:39:18,693
Speaker 2: that were unknown then have been shall we say, developed,

547
00:39:18,733 --> 00:39:23,373
Speaker 2: worked on, discovered, and maybe they're not so bad after all?

548
00:39:24,173 --> 00:39:25,773
Speaker 3: Modern technology you mean.

549
00:39:26,813 --> 00:39:29,573
Speaker 2: Anything you want to include, but certainly modern technology.

550
00:39:30,493 --> 00:39:30,733
Speaker 3: Yeah.

551
00:39:30,813 --> 00:39:35,893
Speaker 4: I'm not against progress and I'm not against I'm not

552
00:39:36,573 --> 00:39:40,213
Speaker 4: a luddite who feels that we need to go back

553
00:39:40,253 --> 00:39:44,133
Speaker 4: to the to the part of the distant past. But

554
00:39:44,333 --> 00:39:49,853
Speaker 4: we need to be aware of the depth of life.

555
00:39:50,533 --> 00:39:54,493
Speaker 4: It's essential sacred core if you want to talk in

556
00:39:54,573 --> 00:40:02,333
Speaker 4: religious terms, or it's the essential profundity of the silence

557
00:40:02,413 --> 00:40:04,453
Speaker 4: of the cosmos, which is.

558
00:40:04,333 --> 00:40:05,413
Speaker 3: In our own mind.

559
00:40:06,413 --> 00:40:10,053
Speaker 4: If you add that in, then you get and naturally

560
00:40:10,133 --> 00:40:14,173
Speaker 4: you get a precautionary view. You get tremendous you know,

561
00:40:14,413 --> 00:40:19,493
Speaker 4: the depths of human consciousness, and maybe depths is not

562
00:40:19,573 --> 00:40:23,453
Speaker 4: the right term, the grand state of human consciousness, our

563
00:40:23,493 --> 00:40:28,333
Speaker 4: inner unbounded silence, those inner unbounded spaces. If you're well

564
00:40:28,413 --> 00:40:33,013
Speaker 4: grounded in that, you can handle technology. But if you're not,

565
00:40:33,493 --> 00:40:38,173
Speaker 4: technology can become a tool of destruction, which is again

566
00:40:38,573 --> 00:40:42,533
Speaker 4: what we're seeing. We saw it in the Second World War,

567
00:40:42,573 --> 00:40:46,213
Speaker 4: and I was suddenly seeing all of seeing all of

568
00:40:46,253 --> 00:40:50,573
Speaker 4: that coming up again everywhere, popping up, this kind of

569
00:40:51,333 --> 00:40:56,773
Speaker 4: technological destruction of life everywhere that occurs when we've lost

570
00:40:56,813 --> 00:41:01,133
Speaker 4: touch with our inner nature, with who we are, we've

571
00:41:01,173 --> 00:41:06,813
Speaker 4: lost touch with nature itself. Is that that's the cure

572
00:41:06,933 --> 00:41:11,533
Speaker 4: as well of our situation is to reconnect with our

573
00:41:11,573 --> 00:41:12,133
Speaker 4: in their self.

574
00:41:12,813 --> 00:41:16,173
Speaker 2: Maybe too many people who don't think fondly of themselves

575
00:41:16,213 --> 00:41:21,853
Speaker 2: and don't want to know. Look, you you wrote this.

576
00:41:21,853 --> 00:41:25,293
Speaker 2: This is a continuation of what I started reading. The

577
00:41:25,333 --> 00:41:28,733
Speaker 2: reality of experimental results in fundamental physics is a fat

578
00:41:28,773 --> 00:41:32,933
Speaker 2: cry from this gray, lifeless view of existence. Their rigorous

579
00:41:32,973 --> 00:41:37,773
Speaker 2: interpretation requires an observer who is not passive, but rather

580
00:41:37,813 --> 00:41:42,173
Speaker 2: an intimately involved actor on the cosmic stage. There are

581
00:41:42,213 --> 00:41:45,653
Speaker 2: six key ways in which consciousness has entered into and

582
00:41:45,773 --> 00:41:51,653
Speaker 2: occupied a central place in twentieth twentieth century physics. And

583
00:41:51,693 --> 00:41:54,973
Speaker 2: you go one, two, three, what you start with Einstein actually,

584
00:41:56,973 --> 00:42:01,773
Speaker 2: but one that caught my eye was the second one. Secondly,

585
00:42:01,853 --> 00:42:06,373
Speaker 2: the emergence of quantum mechanics revealed that measurements, and hence

586
00:42:06,453 --> 00:42:10,893
Speaker 2: the observer plays a call in the evolution of physical states,

587
00:42:11,173 --> 00:42:16,373
Speaker 2: which can even extend to backwards causation in time, which

588
00:42:16,413 --> 00:42:21,013
Speaker 2: is written by Green the fabric of the cosmos. Measurement

589
00:42:21,093 --> 00:42:25,293
Speaker 2: collapses the quantum mechanical wave function from an abstract, multi

590
00:42:25,293 --> 00:42:31,293
Speaker 2: dimensional probabilistic Hilbert space of all possibilities into what we

591
00:42:31,373 --> 00:42:34,933
Speaker 2: call concrete reality. Can you please break that down for me?

592
00:42:37,333 --> 00:42:39,853
Speaker 4: I think the simplest thing is to say that this

593
00:42:39,933 --> 00:42:43,573
Speaker 4: is not an alien concept for us. You know, it's

594
00:42:43,613 --> 00:42:48,253
Speaker 4: an everyday thing. We're always juggling all kinds of possibilities

595
00:42:48,293 --> 00:42:53,293
Speaker 4: in our everyday thinking. And then when we finally do

596
00:42:53,333 --> 00:42:55,853
Speaker 4: something and decide what we're going to do about something,

597
00:42:55,933 --> 00:43:00,493
Speaker 4: then it collapses to a point we actually do something specific.

598
00:43:00,573 --> 00:43:05,293
Speaker 3: But before that, you know, maybe I will have.

599
00:43:05,733 --> 00:43:10,053
Speaker 4: A vanillaized cream, or maybe oh, a banana flavored ice cream,

600
00:43:11,293 --> 00:43:13,653
Speaker 4: and maybe I won't have an ice cream at all,

601
00:43:15,053 --> 00:43:22,453
Speaker 4: where the consciousness space is full of possibilities, which when

602
00:43:22,493 --> 00:43:27,053
Speaker 4: we actually do something, collapses to a point. In physics,

603
00:43:29,173 --> 00:43:37,653
Speaker 4: events evolve in what's called a virtual abstract space, a

604
00:43:37,773 --> 00:43:42,093
Speaker 4: Hilbert space. It's a mathematical concept, but when an actual

605
00:43:42,173 --> 00:43:45,933
Speaker 4: measurement takes place, then it collapses to something you can

606
00:43:45,973 --> 00:43:50,653
Speaker 4: see and feel, and that shouldn't be an alien concept.

607
00:43:50,653 --> 00:43:54,773
Speaker 4: It's a concept that people worry about a lot.

608
00:43:55,093 --> 00:43:56,213
Speaker 3: They think that.

609
00:43:56,373 --> 00:44:00,293
Speaker 4: People often say O continent canacters counterintuitive. Well, I take

610
00:44:00,333 --> 00:44:02,693
Speaker 4: the opposite point of view. I think it's very intuitive.

611
00:44:02,773 --> 00:44:08,133
Speaker 4: I think it's our everyday experience that life sort of

612
00:44:08,893 --> 00:44:13,733
Speaker 4: evolves in an abstract space, our consciousness, and then collapses

613
00:44:13,773 --> 00:44:21,053
Speaker 4: into specific actions. That is physics, but it's also our

614
00:44:21,093 --> 00:44:26,453
Speaker 4: personal experience. And there are so many ways you mentioned

615
00:44:26,453 --> 00:44:30,373
Speaker 4: as I wrote, there are six different ways that and

616
00:44:30,693 --> 00:44:35,893
Speaker 4: you know, in particular where consciousness, you can't formulate a

617
00:44:35,973 --> 00:44:39,813
Speaker 4: consistent physical theory of the world around us without invoking

618
00:44:39,853 --> 00:44:44,813
Speaker 4: an observer. But here's what has been missed is that

619
00:44:45,053 --> 00:44:49,093
Speaker 4: physics tends to call consciousness an observer, as if it's

620
00:44:49,133 --> 00:44:52,373
Speaker 4: a sort of it's just looking on at what is

621
00:44:52,413 --> 00:44:56,133
Speaker 4: happening in the cosmos. Well, actually, consciousness is an actor.

622
00:44:57,573 --> 00:45:02,213
Speaker 4: It changes things. If there are bananas in Germany, it's

623
00:45:02,253 --> 00:45:08,013
Speaker 4: because someone introduced bananas into Germany. Consciousness is an actor.

624
00:45:08,333 --> 00:45:14,773
Speaker 4: We are on the stage in when Copernicus discovered that

625
00:45:14,813 --> 00:45:18,453
Speaker 4: we're not at the center of a crystalline sphere, that

626
00:45:18,653 --> 00:45:22,333
Speaker 4: actually we're on a planet orbiting a sun and so

627
00:45:22,413 --> 00:45:25,093
Speaker 4: on and so forth. People felt a certain amount of

628
00:45:25,093 --> 00:45:29,733
Speaker 4: ex extential angst because they weren't at the center of

629
00:45:29,773 --> 00:45:31,893
Speaker 4: the universe. Well, I'd like to put people back at

630
00:45:31,893 --> 00:45:36,173
Speaker 4: the center of the universe. We are an actor on

631
00:45:36,293 --> 00:45:42,373
Speaker 4: the cosmic stage, and we can become more aware of that.

632
00:45:42,533 --> 00:45:46,493
Speaker 4: We can start to experience more of that. I learned

633
00:45:46,573 --> 00:45:49,973
Speaker 4: meditation when I was very young, and it has helped

634
00:45:49,973 --> 00:45:53,893
Speaker 4: me understand the life around me and also my own

635
00:45:53,933 --> 00:45:59,213
Speaker 4: consciousness and unravel the things that we're faced with.

636
00:45:59,653 --> 00:46:01,893
Speaker 3: But anyone can do that. That's not unique to me.

637
00:46:02,253 --> 00:46:06,973
Speaker 4: Anyone can and should, I believe, have a journey into

638
00:46:07,013 --> 00:46:09,613
Speaker 4: the old, into the whole yield of consciousness.

639
00:46:10,253 --> 00:46:12,333
Speaker 3: I did transmit meditation.

640
00:46:12,533 --> 00:46:16,853
Speaker 4: I met Marishi Maheshyogi and he taught me meditation and

641
00:46:18,253 --> 00:46:22,533
Speaker 4: that was amazing. But it wasn't him telling me what

642
00:46:22,693 --> 00:46:25,813
Speaker 4: to do. He said, look, here's a technique who will

643
00:46:25,853 --> 00:46:30,253
Speaker 4: explore consciousness. And once you've explored consciousness, you can do

644
00:46:30,373 --> 00:46:34,933
Speaker 4: research and find out actually what exploring consciousness does. And

645
00:46:34,973 --> 00:46:41,133
Speaker 4: it increases the orderliness in the brain. It provides more

646
00:46:41,253 --> 00:46:44,933
Speaker 4: energy and deep breast and better health and torn that's

647
00:46:45,173 --> 00:46:49,373
Speaker 4: the frontier that we have the title of the article

648
00:46:49,413 --> 00:46:51,453
Speaker 4: we're looking at is the modern age cannot be the

649
00:46:51,493 --> 00:46:56,493
Speaker 4: age of biotechnology, has to be the age of consciousness.

650
00:46:55,933 --> 00:46:59,693
Speaker 4: This is the frontier that we have to pass if

651
00:46:59,733 --> 00:47:03,133
Speaker 4: we're going to deal with all these technological challenges, we're

652
00:47:03,173 --> 00:47:08,453
Speaker 4: going to be able to deal with unscrupulous people or warmongers,

653
00:47:08,933 --> 00:47:11,613
Speaker 4: we have to pass. We have to go into the

654
00:47:11,653 --> 00:47:17,093
Speaker 4: age of consciousness because in that universal silence of the

655
00:47:18,733 --> 00:47:23,173
Speaker 4: conscious universe which we can experience and participate in, in

656
00:47:23,253 --> 00:47:30,413
Speaker 4: that these problems get resolved, the pettiness of conflict and hate,

657
00:47:30,973 --> 00:47:37,213
Speaker 4: and the debility of ill health get resolved. That's the

658
00:47:37,733 --> 00:47:40,893
Speaker 4: that's the age that we have to enter into. The

659
00:47:40,933 --> 00:47:45,053
Speaker 4: Age of biotechnology is a colder sack. It's a frightening

660
00:47:45,213 --> 00:47:47,093
Speaker 4: colder sack. It's a dead end.

661
00:47:47,893 --> 00:47:51,933
Speaker 2: It's interesting you you've been pilloried in the past for

662
00:47:52,133 --> 00:47:57,253
Speaker 2: your approach to such things. Are they still at it?

663
00:47:59,853 --> 00:48:02,533
Speaker 4: Well, I think one of the things that happened is

664
00:48:02,573 --> 00:48:04,493
Speaker 4: that there's been this pole and you'll be aware of

665
00:48:04,573 --> 00:48:10,973
Speaker 4: this completely, Like is the polarization of you know, people

666
00:48:11,013 --> 00:48:15,133
Speaker 4: turned off, They've they've they've said, oh, I'm not listening

667
00:48:15,133 --> 00:48:18,133
Speaker 4: to this person that person, and it's a very very

668
00:48:18,253 --> 00:48:24,693
Speaker 4: long list. Now that people have been canceled. So it's

669
00:48:24,933 --> 00:48:28,453
Speaker 4: it's not so much that people spend any time attacking

670
00:48:28,533 --> 00:48:31,573
Speaker 4: me or people who have similar abuse. Is that they

671
00:48:32,293 --> 00:48:36,013
Speaker 4: just switched off. They don't want to know. They're hiding.

672
00:48:37,173 --> 00:48:40,013
Speaker 3: But how can you how can you hide from your

673
00:48:40,013 --> 00:48:41,013
Speaker 3: own consciousness?

674
00:48:42,093 --> 00:48:45,373
Speaker 2: Well, I have to say that I don't know that

675
00:48:45,413 --> 00:48:47,773
Speaker 2: too many people wander around worrying about that.

676
00:48:48,373 --> 00:48:50,853
Speaker 4: Well, look at look Put it this way, is that

677
00:48:51,293 --> 00:48:56,173
Speaker 4: if it's like living in a house and you the

678
00:48:56,253 --> 00:48:59,733
Speaker 4: how the whole house relies on the foundation, and if

679
00:48:59,773 --> 00:49:02,173
Speaker 4: you live in the house for a long time and

680
00:49:02,253 --> 00:49:04,973
Speaker 4: you ignore the foundation, the whole house can fault a bit.

681
00:49:05,493 --> 00:49:10,013
Speaker 4: And the foundation of life is conscious business. You have

682
00:49:10,133 --> 00:49:13,373
Speaker 4: to pay attention to the foundation of life. You have

683
00:49:13,453 --> 00:49:17,173
Speaker 4: to understand your consciousness. And if you are going to

684
00:49:17,213 --> 00:49:21,493
Speaker 4: live in the house and ignore the foundation, then ultimately

685
00:49:22,133 --> 00:49:23,773
Speaker 4: that house is going to be at risk.

686
00:49:24,453 --> 00:49:28,173
Speaker 2: Is this a way of putting well, is this a

687
00:49:28,173 --> 00:49:31,933
Speaker 2: way of putting it that you have to be aware

688
00:49:32,093 --> 00:49:35,933
Speaker 2: of your You have to understand yourself.

689
00:49:37,533 --> 00:49:40,453
Speaker 4: Yes, and not in an intellectual sense, but you have

690
00:49:40,533 --> 00:49:45,733
Speaker 4: to take time to be silent in yourself. You have

691
00:49:45,813 --> 00:49:49,573
Speaker 4: to have a period in the day. There are different

692
00:49:49,893 --> 00:49:55,053
Speaker 4: forms of meditation, and there are cultural practices and their

693
00:49:55,533 --> 00:49:59,133
Speaker 4: forms of prayer and that have been honored through time

694
00:49:59,493 --> 00:50:03,253
Speaker 4: and contemplation and so on. One has to have that

695
00:50:03,373 --> 00:50:08,693
Speaker 4: time to be to go in rather than just out.

696
00:50:08,933 --> 00:50:17,453
Speaker 4: We were very we're very object orientated, object referral conscious society.

697
00:50:18,653 --> 00:50:21,973
Speaker 4: We're so busy with everything that happens outside of ourselves

698
00:50:22,013 --> 00:50:24,893
Speaker 4: and what we own and so on. So proud of

699
00:50:24,933 --> 00:50:27,613
Speaker 4: what we own and what we've achieved, but we have

700
00:50:27,693 --> 00:50:30,053
Speaker 4: to go within. Change begins within.

701
00:50:30,533 --> 00:50:37,133
Speaker 2: It's the starting point. You mentioned vanilla ice cream. Do

702
00:50:37,173 --> 00:50:37,973
Speaker 2: you like vanilla?

703
00:50:39,653 --> 00:50:39,853
Speaker 3: Yes?

704
00:50:39,893 --> 00:50:42,853
Speaker 4: I do, But it's funny you should say that, because

705
00:50:44,373 --> 00:50:48,093
Speaker 4: it's being very it's become very very hard to actually

706
00:50:48,133 --> 00:50:52,453
Speaker 4: buy anything that is real vanilla.

707
00:50:52,253 --> 00:50:53,173
Speaker 3: Yes.

708
00:50:53,493 --> 00:50:58,373
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think there's only one variety of that's now

709
00:50:58,413 --> 00:51:03,173
Speaker 4: available in one of our supermarkets that actually genuinely vanilla.

710
00:51:03,293 --> 00:51:07,733
Speaker 4: So there's little bottles of so called vanilla extract there's

711
00:51:08,213 --> 00:51:12,253
Speaker 4: very very few of them, possibly one. My daughter, who

712
00:51:12,253 --> 00:51:14,333
Speaker 4: does a lot of research on this, tells me there's

713
00:51:14,453 --> 00:51:19,493
Speaker 4: just one variety now that really is just extracted simply

714
00:51:20,133 --> 00:51:25,413
Speaker 4: and traditionally from a vanilla bean, rather than using various

715
00:51:25,533 --> 00:51:31,133
Speaker 4: kind of chemicals and or then of course it's artificial vanilla,

716
00:51:31,173 --> 00:51:33,133
Speaker 4: which goes into my most ice screen.

717
00:51:33,253 --> 00:51:37,813
Speaker 2: Now, yeah, you're probably wondering why I asked you then

718
00:51:38,733 --> 00:51:43,013
Speaker 2: when it was just a passing, passing illustration. It's because

719
00:51:43,053 --> 00:51:45,613
Speaker 2: earlier this morning I saw a review. It was in

720
00:51:45,653 --> 00:51:48,693
Speaker 2: the Wall Street Journal, and they send out, you know,

721
00:51:48,733 --> 00:51:53,613
Speaker 2: they mail me the books of the week, and vanilla

722
00:51:55,173 --> 00:52:00,533
Speaker 2: occupies an uneasy status between culinary necessity and luxury, a

723
00:52:00,733 --> 00:52:06,733
Speaker 2: temperamental crop plagued by unpredictable weather and criminal activity. But

724
00:52:06,773 --> 00:52:09,213
Speaker 2: it's much more than that, because it's it's just over

725
00:52:09,253 --> 00:52:13,893
Speaker 2: three hundred pages, just being published, just being released, Vanilla,

726
00:52:14,013 --> 00:52:18,453
Speaker 2: the History of an Extraordinary Bean. I love coincidence. But

727
00:52:18,493 --> 00:52:20,853
Speaker 2: I read that. I read that probably two hours ago.

728
00:52:21,453 --> 00:52:24,933
Speaker 4: Well my covering on that is it seems that this

729
00:52:25,013 --> 00:52:29,013
Speaker 4: is the history of an extraordinary bean that is being

730
00:52:29,373 --> 00:52:35,253
Speaker 4: consigned to history currently by the biotechnology industry.

731
00:52:35,773 --> 00:52:38,613
Speaker 2: Well, it's a good example, yeah, it is.

732
00:52:38,733 --> 00:52:41,093
Speaker 3: Of course, it's an expensive crop.

733
00:52:41,333 --> 00:52:45,613
Speaker 4: You know, if you want a tiny little bottle vanilla flavor,

734
00:52:45,653 --> 00:52:48,013
Speaker 4: it costs you ten dollars or more of these.

735
00:52:47,893 --> 00:52:53,373
Speaker 2: Days anything with vanilla, and it I love it. Yeah,

736
00:52:53,933 --> 00:52:56,773
Speaker 2: So let me just get back to something quite serious.

737
00:52:57,653 --> 00:53:00,253
Speaker 2: We touched on this earlier, but I really want to

738
00:53:00,813 --> 00:53:05,293
Speaker 2: I want to investigate further with you. This is This

739
00:53:05,373 --> 00:53:08,933
Speaker 2: is published on September twenty four. We need a open

740
00:53:09,013 --> 00:53:12,933
Speaker 2: national debate on healthcare and biotechnology. It refers to the

741
00:53:13,653 --> 00:53:18,773
Speaker 2: Listener article New Zealand spends more on health than most countries,

742
00:53:18,813 --> 00:53:21,453
Speaker 2: So why is our health system still sick?

743
00:53:22,053 --> 00:53:26,293
Speaker 4: Take it from there, Well, we're in a health emergency

744
00:53:26,533 --> 00:53:32,453
Speaker 4: where some hospitals are actually considering have said that they're

745
00:53:32,493 --> 00:53:36,573
Speaker 4: considering setting up tents outside the hospital to triage the

746
00:53:36,653 --> 00:53:40,293
Speaker 4: number of people who are who are falling sick. This

747
00:53:40,333 --> 00:53:45,253
Speaker 4: is particularly this winter August of this year, there were

748
00:53:45,533 --> 00:53:49,253
Speaker 4: more ambulance callouts than at any other time in New

749
00:53:49,373 --> 00:53:55,653
Speaker 4: Zealand's history. We're in a health crisis whose origin is

750
00:53:56,373 --> 00:54:02,693
Speaker 4: not really being discussed. Instead, people are suggesting our health

751
00:54:02,733 --> 00:54:07,693
Speaker 4: service is not being managed very well, or there should

752
00:54:07,693 --> 00:54:15,373
Speaker 4: be a need for more AI in medical consultations, or

753
00:54:15,573 --> 00:54:19,253
Speaker 4: perhaps we need to spend more money on it. We're

754
00:54:19,293 --> 00:54:23,853
Speaker 4: not actually asking the big question, which is there's another

755
00:54:23,933 --> 00:54:29,373
Speaker 4: possibility that the immunity of the population as a whole

756
00:54:29,853 --> 00:54:34,933
Speaker 4: has been compromised. We have to ask why is our

757
00:54:34,973 --> 00:54:39,373
Speaker 4: health service failing? We have to probe deeply and look

758
00:54:39,413 --> 00:54:43,293
Speaker 4: at the statistics, and instead of that, there's this statistics

759
00:54:43,453 --> 00:54:48,813
Speaker 4: are being kept from the public. It's actually hard to

760
00:54:48,893 --> 00:54:51,653
Speaker 4: know how many people have cancer, or how many people

761
00:54:51,653 --> 00:54:58,653
Speaker 4: have dying of heart disease, or how exactly what people

762
00:54:58,733 --> 00:55:03,653
Speaker 4: are dying. Are they vaccinated or unvaccinated, Have they had

763
00:55:03,693 --> 00:55:07,893
Speaker 4: COVID or have they not really had COVID. These kind

764
00:55:07,933 --> 00:55:12,773
Speaker 4: of questions are not being looked into, and they need

765
00:55:12,813 --> 00:55:17,093
Speaker 4: to be The listener, to its credit, said that there's

766
00:55:17,133 --> 00:55:20,013
Speaker 4: a mystery here and we need to get to the

767
00:55:20,173 --> 00:55:23,453
Speaker 4: bottom of the mystery. I think they would have done

768
00:55:23,493 --> 00:55:28,933
Speaker 4: better service to the article if they'd taken a more

769
00:55:29,013 --> 00:55:33,453
Speaker 4: rigorous investigative attitude, and they might have got to the

770
00:55:33,493 --> 00:55:36,493
Speaker 4: bottom of the problem. They should have asked how much

771
00:55:36,573 --> 00:55:41,653
Speaker 4: worse is the problem today and why? And it's when

772
00:55:41,693 --> 00:55:44,133
Speaker 4: you start to look at that that you realize there

773
00:55:44,173 --> 00:55:48,253
Speaker 4: was a sudden change in the health of the nation

774
00:55:48,853 --> 00:55:54,453
Speaker 4: in twenty twenty one when we started the mass genetic

775
00:55:55,013 --> 00:56:00,533
Speaker 4: mRNA vaccination of the whole population. There are studies now

776
00:56:00,573 --> 00:56:05,253
Speaker 4: which are coming out which show that this has particularly

777
00:56:05,373 --> 00:56:11,853
Speaker 4: affected our immunity. So putting this whole discussion we've had

778
00:56:11,893 --> 00:56:16,093
Speaker 4: today in this perspective is this is not a kind

779
00:56:16,093 --> 00:56:20,373
Speaker 4: of an abstract intellectual discussion. It's a matter of life

780
00:56:20,453 --> 00:56:23,453
Speaker 4: and death. You know what could be more serious than

781
00:56:23,453 --> 00:56:27,413
Speaker 4: that for a nation as a whole. That's where we

782
00:56:27,533 --> 00:56:30,053
Speaker 4: have to get. We have to have that kind of discussion.

783
00:56:31,293 --> 00:56:32,773
Speaker 4: And it's happening in America.

784
00:56:34,133 --> 00:56:37,453
Speaker 2: Well, it's happening in America because of Kennedy, is it not.

785
00:56:38,133 --> 00:56:43,653
Speaker 4: Yeah, they're having a national debate. They're raising questions, and

786
00:56:43,693 --> 00:56:46,933
Speaker 4: of course it's in a political context, because you know,

787
00:56:47,093 --> 00:56:52,213
Speaker 4: almost everything these days has a political context. But what's

788
00:56:52,213 --> 00:56:56,773
Speaker 4: happening in our media is we're laughing at it. People

789
00:56:56,813 --> 00:57:02,133
Speaker 4: are laughing at Trump. And when he said, for example,

790
00:57:02,173 --> 00:57:07,093
Speaker 4: about Thailand or which is paracetamol, that it could cause

791
00:57:07,093 --> 00:57:10,893
Speaker 4: a risk of autism, people in our newspapers laughed about it.

792
00:57:10,933 --> 00:57:13,973
Speaker 4: That's all our population is getting but a natural fact.

793
00:57:14,533 --> 00:57:18,213
Speaker 4: There are a lot of serious studies pointing to the

794
00:57:18,253 --> 00:57:24,213
Speaker 4: fact that paracetamol use in pregnancy especially carries a risk

795
00:57:24,253 --> 00:57:29,413
Speaker 4: associated with autism. Even the makers of dailanol have omitted

796
00:57:30,653 --> 00:57:34,933
Speaker 4: that there is a risk. The government there is starting

797
00:57:34,973 --> 00:57:38,493
Speaker 4: to assess how big of a risk is that. That's

798
00:57:38,573 --> 00:57:42,373
Speaker 4: the kind of discussion we should be having here looking

799
00:57:42,413 --> 00:57:47,973
Speaker 4: at what particular kinds of problems and illnesses are increasing,

800
00:57:48,693 --> 00:57:53,253
Speaker 4: and then asking why and delving into the figures. And

801
00:57:53,333 --> 00:57:57,373
Speaker 4: that has to be an open discussion. It can't be

802
00:57:57,493 --> 00:58:01,093
Speaker 4: a discussion. Well at the moment, I get the impression

803
00:58:01,133 --> 00:58:05,293
Speaker 4: there is no discussion behind closed doors in New Zealand.

804
00:58:05,413 --> 00:58:06,453
Speaker 2: Oh, I think you're right.

805
00:58:07,333 --> 00:58:10,733
Speaker 3: This authodo that it's.

806
00:58:12,253 --> 00:58:15,613
Speaker 4: The New Zealand Herald had an article following on this

807
00:58:15,733 --> 00:58:22,053
Speaker 4: debate in America headlined experts reject Trump's baseless parasita mold claims,

808
00:58:22,093 --> 00:58:25,093
Speaker 4: and they quoted a Dr Brian Betty, a New Zealand

809
00:58:25,413 --> 00:58:30,613
Speaker 4: GP and chair of the General Practice New Zealand, who

810
00:58:30,693 --> 00:58:33,893
Speaker 4: basically said, oh, this is all baseless. He hadn't done

811
00:58:33,933 --> 00:58:37,333
Speaker 4: his research, and that's all we're that's all we're getting.

812
00:58:38,493 --> 00:58:41,813
Speaker 4: But actually it's a very genuine debate that's happening, a

813
00:58:41,933 --> 00:58:45,213
Speaker 4: very public debate that's happening in America. The papers are

814
00:58:45,253 --> 00:58:47,773
Speaker 4: writing about it almost every single day.

815
00:58:48,693 --> 00:58:54,173
Speaker 2: Well, I think that I think that the laughing is partly, strongly,

816
00:58:54,253 --> 00:59:00,013
Speaker 2: partly anchored to Kennedy's speech, and I think I find

817
00:59:00,053 --> 00:59:00,813
Speaker 2: that deplorable.

818
00:59:01,413 --> 00:59:05,133
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, it could well be. He has a medical condition,

819
00:59:05,253 --> 00:59:08,773
Speaker 4: which means that is when he talks, he us this

820
00:59:08,853 --> 00:59:12,453
Speaker 4: kind of gravely hesitation in his voice that you know,

821
00:59:12,493 --> 00:59:16,613
Speaker 4: and he's struggling to speak. But that's a medical condition

822
00:59:16,693 --> 00:59:22,293
Speaker 4: that has nothing about his grasp of the statistics, which

823
00:59:22,333 --> 00:59:27,093
Speaker 4: is when you see him perform in front of congressional

824
00:59:27,173 --> 00:59:30,613
Speaker 4: panels and so on, he is as sharp as tack.

825
00:59:31,973 --> 00:59:37,253
Speaker 4: And that they're going slowly. There they're going. They're appointing

826
00:59:37,453 --> 00:59:42,453
Speaker 4: people to positions and these are not unqualified people or

827
00:59:42,573 --> 00:59:47,173
Speaker 4: fanatical people. There are people who are asking questions and

828
00:59:47,213 --> 00:59:53,733
Speaker 4: the medical establishment and the media establishment are very apparently,

829
00:59:54,013 --> 00:59:59,733
Speaker 4: very uncomfortable with people asking questions here in New Zealand.

830
00:59:59,893 --> 01:00:03,893
Speaker 4: We're not being allowed to ask questions. We're being silenced.

831
01:00:04,013 --> 01:00:09,973
Speaker 4: Where are the questions being asked? And that debate has

832
01:00:10,013 --> 01:00:16,613
Speaker 4: to start. That's absolutely essential. What chance democracy is open,

833
01:00:17,293 --> 01:00:19,293
Speaker 4: open capacity to ask questions.

834
01:00:21,213 --> 01:00:25,853
Speaker 2: You're right, it is, and the media are failing in

835
01:00:25,933 --> 01:00:29,533
Speaker 2: their job, in my opinion, in a big way on

836
01:00:29,693 --> 01:00:32,693
Speaker 2: more fronts than we're discussing today.

837
01:00:33,413 --> 01:00:36,933
Speaker 3: Absolutely absolutely, guy.

838
01:00:37,213 --> 01:00:39,893
Speaker 2: Just let me run through some numbers for you from

839
01:00:39,893 --> 01:00:44,093
Speaker 2: the piece that was tagged staggering new data from Health

840
01:00:44,173 --> 01:00:50,493
Speaker 2: New Zealand and others and based on a freedom of

841
01:00:50,493 --> 01:00:53,493
Speaker 2: information request to Health New Zealand. You asked for the

842
01:00:53,893 --> 01:00:57,413
Speaker 2: number of people under the age of forty presenting to

843
01:00:57,533 --> 01:01:02,333
Speaker 2: emergency departments A and E throughout New Zealand hospitals with

844
01:01:02,493 --> 01:01:08,293
Speaker 2: chest pain or heart issues by the year. The Health

845
01:01:08,373 --> 01:01:14,693
Speaker 2: New Zealand answer contains shattering information. Let me quote. In

846
01:01:14,733 --> 01:01:18,333
Speaker 2: twenty nineteen, the number presenting to emergency departments with chest

847
01:01:18,333 --> 01:01:23,493
Speaker 2: pain was two thousand, two hundred and nineteen. Twenty twenty

848
01:01:24,653 --> 01:01:30,413
Speaker 2: four thousand, four hundred and six, twenty twenty one, thirteen

849
01:01:30,533 --> 01:01:34,813
Speaker 2: thousand and sixty three. These are people under forty in

850
01:01:34,893 --> 01:01:39,733
Speaker 2: twenty two, twenty one thousand, four hundred and sixteen, and

851
01:01:39,813 --> 01:01:46,293
Speaker 2: in twenty three, twenty thousand and five, and then finally

852
01:01:46,653 --> 01:01:51,333
Speaker 2: twenty twenty four fourteen thousand, six hundred and thirty nine. Now,

853
01:01:51,373 --> 01:01:53,733
Speaker 2: don't get carried away with the fact that that number

854
01:01:53,773 --> 01:01:57,413
Speaker 2: is down on the rest, because that figure is only

855
01:01:57,493 --> 01:02:01,333
Speaker 2: to June twenty half the year fourteen thousand, six hundred

856
01:02:01,333 --> 01:02:04,373
Speaker 2: and thirty nine. Is it fair to ask you what's

857
01:02:04,413 --> 01:02:05,653
Speaker 2: happened since then?

858
01:02:07,773 --> 01:02:09,093
Speaker 3: Well, then the.

859
01:02:11,173 --> 01:02:14,413
Speaker 4: Department of Health are refusing to release any further information.

860
01:02:14,933 --> 01:02:20,053
Speaker 4: I and these but these are not isolated figures there.

861
01:02:21,733 --> 01:02:24,733
Speaker 4: We did another article a little bit earlier than this

862
01:02:25,613 --> 01:02:33,013
Speaker 4: where there was an eighty three percent increase in heart

863
01:02:33,013 --> 01:02:40,293
Speaker 4: attacks in Wellington region. There are little snapshots, little looks

864
01:02:40,293 --> 01:02:43,373
Speaker 4: into the health data. You know, it seems to me

865
01:02:43,653 --> 01:02:48,373
Speaker 4: normally when they release these kind of figures under oias

866
01:02:49,653 --> 01:02:54,293
Speaker 4: or it's leaked data, is it kind of it's almost

867
01:02:54,493 --> 01:02:57,693
Speaker 4: it seems it comes out by mistake and then someone

868
01:02:57,733 --> 01:03:04,573
Speaker 4: gets their knuckles wrapped for letting people know what happened,

869
01:03:04,733 --> 01:03:08,133
Speaker 4: or there's a witch hunt in the health service to

870
01:03:08,173 --> 01:03:14,133
Speaker 4: try and find out who leaked the information. That has

871
01:03:14,173 --> 01:03:17,253
Speaker 4: the stop. There has to be a public debate when

872
01:03:17,253 --> 01:03:21,973
Speaker 4: we get these massive increases in serious health conditions, as

873
01:03:22,373 --> 01:03:25,373
Speaker 4: was where we began today in close to where we

874
01:03:25,453 --> 01:03:28,293
Speaker 4: began to day in the Stuff article about the massive

875
01:03:28,333 --> 01:03:32,213
Speaker 4: increase in bowel cancer, that there has to be a debate.

876
01:03:32,973 --> 01:03:37,373
Speaker 4: This can't be swept under the carpets. And this is

877
01:03:37,613 --> 01:03:41,653
Speaker 4: among young people. A bowel cancer is among young people.

878
01:03:42,813 --> 01:03:47,333
Speaker 4: It's unprecedented, and yet somehow other people want to look

879
01:03:47,373 --> 01:03:49,973
Speaker 4: the other way, They want to sweep it under the carpet.

880
01:03:50,613 --> 01:03:55,173
Speaker 4: You know, we're getting massive, massive increases in particular kinds

881
01:03:55,213 --> 01:03:57,653
Speaker 4: of conditions. We need to know what their conditions are,

882
01:03:58,493 --> 01:04:01,813
Speaker 4: which people are getting them were is it a part

883
01:04:01,853 --> 01:04:06,853
Speaker 4: of the vaccination program? Is this associated with COVID? These

884
01:04:06,853 --> 01:04:08,253
Speaker 4: are questions that need to be on.

885
01:04:08,773 --> 01:04:11,773
Speaker 2: All right, here's the question that you can answer. Which

886
01:04:12,133 --> 01:04:17,413
Speaker 2: which of the two chest pain and bowel cancer? Which

887
01:04:17,453 --> 01:04:21,893
Speaker 2: of the two is the worst? From a health and

888
01:04:22,773 --> 01:04:23,973
Speaker 2: fix it perspective?

889
01:04:24,853 --> 01:04:29,213
Speaker 4: Heart attacks? So the cardiac issues are. Cardiac disease is

890
01:04:29,213 --> 01:04:32,933
Speaker 4: the second. I think it's the second biggest killer in

891
01:04:33,013 --> 01:04:37,853
Speaker 4: New Zealand, but cancer may be the first.

892
01:04:40,733 --> 01:04:46,053
Speaker 7: It's it's uh, but but there are various cancers, Yeah,

893
01:04:46,213 --> 01:04:49,373
Speaker 7: of course there are. But bowel cancer. New Zealand has

894
01:04:49,373 --> 01:04:53,053
Speaker 7: the highest rate of bowel cancer in the world. There's

895
01:04:53,093 --> 01:04:54,373
Speaker 7: a statistic for you.

896
01:04:54,493 --> 01:04:59,733
Speaker 2: That's the capita. Yeah, that's wicked.

897
01:05:00,213 --> 01:05:01,773
Speaker 3: Both serious issues.

898
01:05:03,013 --> 01:05:07,693
Speaker 2: I want to conclude with this. Over the years of podcasting,

899
01:05:08,973 --> 01:05:15,053
Speaker 2: I've made many friends across the planet. It's been fascinating

900
01:05:15,493 --> 01:05:18,733
Speaker 2: and I sent your article, the long Essential Read on

901
01:05:18,773 --> 01:05:22,093
Speaker 2: the Brink of Disaster a watershed moment. I said it

902
01:05:22,133 --> 01:05:25,653
Speaker 2: to one of those who is in the medical fraternity,

903
01:05:27,213 --> 01:05:33,173
Speaker 2: and it came back to me. Nice article. It's really

904
01:05:33,173 --> 01:05:37,493
Speaker 2: a technology without much use, so they had to fabricate one,

905
01:05:38,413 --> 01:05:39,893
Speaker 2: hence the pandemic agenda.

906
01:05:41,333 --> 01:05:45,533
Speaker 3: That was the comment, Wow, well that's a good comment.

907
01:05:47,293 --> 01:05:53,533
Speaker 4: I'm trying to reach a wider audience. Laden I've shifted

908
01:05:54,773 --> 01:05:59,613
Speaker 4: my more technical articles about biotechnology and the dangers of

909
01:05:59,653 --> 01:06:06,933
Speaker 4: biotechnology per se to substack because you get a you know,

910
01:06:06,973 --> 01:06:10,733
Speaker 4: you pick up readership around the world, and my aim

911
01:06:10,893 --> 01:06:15,733
Speaker 4: is to move the debate away from the kind of

912
01:06:16,293 --> 01:06:25,573
Speaker 4: the details of the pandemic into biotechnology in general and

913
01:06:24,933 --> 01:06:30,133
Speaker 4: the risks involved in biotechnology in general. So that's why

914
01:06:30,173 --> 01:06:37,373
Speaker 4: we've moved a lot of articles to substack, and i'courage

915
01:06:37,453 --> 01:06:42,773
Speaker 4: people to go to substack and subscribe to just look

916
01:06:42,813 --> 01:06:45,973
Speaker 4: for Guy Hatchad doctor Guy Hatchad, and then you can

917
01:06:46,013 --> 01:06:50,493
Speaker 4: subscribe to that and subscription. It doesn't cost money. You

918
01:06:50,533 --> 01:06:54,573
Speaker 4: can contribute if you want, but you can subscribe and

919
01:06:54,613 --> 01:06:57,773
Speaker 4: then you'll be notified about those articles which used to

920
01:06:57,813 --> 01:07:01,453
Speaker 4: go out on the Hatchid Report, they no longer do

921
01:07:01,533 --> 01:07:04,613
Speaker 4: because I don't want to duplicate. So they saw a

922
01:07:04,693 --> 01:07:09,413
Speaker 4: significant number of articles that I'm writing are now going

923
01:07:09,413 --> 01:07:13,813
Speaker 4: out on substat with the purpose of reaching a wider

924
01:07:14,613 --> 01:07:23,733
Speaker 4: international audience. We're continuing with the Hatchad report, particularly there's

925
01:07:23,733 --> 01:07:26,613
Speaker 4: a closer focus on New Zealand and the whole New

926
01:07:26,733 --> 01:07:30,773
Speaker 4: Zealand situation. But you're aware, and I'm aware that what

927
01:07:30,853 --> 01:07:37,453
Speaker 4: happens in New Zealand is quite tightly tied to global events,

928
01:07:37,773 --> 01:07:47,133
Speaker 4: global developments, multinational companies in commercial interests that go beyond

929
01:07:47,173 --> 01:07:52,213
Speaker 4: our borders. So to solve the situation about what is

930
01:07:52,253 --> 01:07:57,853
Speaker 4: happening here, of course, we have to reassert our independence,

931
01:07:58,413 --> 01:08:00,573
Speaker 4: but at the same time we have to be involved

932
01:08:00,613 --> 01:08:01,973
Speaker 4: in the international debate.

933
01:08:02,653 --> 01:08:05,613
Speaker 2: So Guy, thank you so much. It's been very informative

934
01:08:05,773 --> 01:08:09,973
Speaker 2: and I look forward to discussion whenever it might be.

935
01:08:10,933 --> 01:08:14,253
Speaker 4: That's wonderful, Latent. It's always a pleasure talking to you.

936
01:08:14,213 --> 01:08:18,373
Speaker 4: You're a very sane voice in a rather mad world.

937
01:08:28,613 --> 01:08:33,013
Speaker 2: Leverrix is an antihistamine made in Switzerland to the highest quality.

938
01:08:33,253 --> 01:08:37,093
Speaker 2: Leverrix relieves hay fever and skin allergies or itchy skin.

939
01:08:37,573 --> 01:08:41,893
Speaker 2: It's a dual action antihistamine and has a unique nasal

940
01:08:42,133 --> 01:08:46,733
Speaker 2: decongestent action. It's fast acting for fast relief, and it

941
01:08:46,813 --> 01:08:49,933
Speaker 2: works in under an hour and lasts for over twenty

942
01:08:49,933 --> 01:08:53,373
Speaker 2: four hours. Leverrix is a tiny tablet that unblocks the

943
01:08:53,453 --> 01:08:57,853
Speaker 2: nose deals with itchy eyes and stops sneezing. Leverrix is

944
01:08:57,853 --> 01:09:02,013
Speaker 2: an antihistamine made in Switzerland to the highest quantity. So

945
01:09:02,133 --> 01:09:05,653
Speaker 2: next time you're in need of an effective antihistamine, call

946
01:09:05,733 --> 01:09:09,013
Speaker 2: into the pharmacy and ask for Leverrix l e v

947
01:09:09,653 --> 01:09:14,133
Speaker 2: r ix leveris and always read the label. Take us directed,

948
01:09:14,373 --> 01:09:18,213
Speaker 2: and if symptoms persist, see your health professional Farmer Broker

949
01:09:18,253 --> 01:09:31,493
Speaker 2: Auckland Late and Smith Podcast three hundred and four in

950
01:09:31,493 --> 01:09:34,653
Speaker 2: the mail Room with missus producer who else? How are you?

951
01:09:34,933 --> 01:09:35,133
Speaker 1: Late?

952
01:09:35,173 --> 01:09:36,173
Speaker 2: And I'm great?

953
01:09:36,373 --> 01:09:36,853
Speaker 8: Thank you?

954
01:09:36,973 --> 01:09:38,533
Speaker 2: How are you? I'm going to get a new script

955
01:09:38,573 --> 01:09:41,973
Speaker 2: next year, I think, and the how are you will disappear.

956
01:09:41,733 --> 01:09:45,213
Speaker 8: So I have to check three or four different ones

957
01:09:45,253 --> 01:09:47,893
Speaker 8: off before right, I'm really bad today.

958
01:09:47,773 --> 01:09:50,493
Speaker 2: I think, so all right, why don't you lead?

959
01:09:51,573 --> 01:09:54,133
Speaker 8: James says, it has been a wee while since I

960
01:09:54,253 --> 01:09:56,693
Speaker 8: last wrote to you. I was very interested to hear

961
01:09:56,733 --> 01:09:59,413
Speaker 8: your travel stories of your recent holidays. My wife and

962
01:09:59,453 --> 01:10:01,893
Speaker 8: I had a five week holiday in Greece and Italy

963
01:10:02,013 --> 01:10:05,693
Speaker 8: and July, probably the best holiday we've ever had. We

964
01:10:06,253 --> 01:10:09,613
Speaker 8: didn't have the unfortunate drama you exp sperienced. Thank goodness.

965
01:10:10,253 --> 01:10:12,853
Speaker 8: I've just finished listening to your talk with Muriel Newman.

966
01:10:13,373 --> 01:10:15,133
Speaker 8: All I can say is I'm grateful that there are

967
01:10:15,173 --> 01:10:17,413
Speaker 8: people like her keeping a finger on the pulse of

968
01:10:17,453 --> 01:10:19,333
Speaker 8: things we should all be aware of but are not

969
01:10:19,453 --> 01:10:22,573
Speaker 8: duly and properly covered in media. The two of you

970
01:10:22,653 --> 01:10:25,413
Speaker 8: did touch on cbdc's and the fact that it is

971
01:10:25,453 --> 01:10:28,453
Speaker 8: not something that is widely spoken of in the public domain.

972
01:10:29,013 --> 01:10:31,733
Speaker 8: I one, I've never heard anyone I know of talking

973
01:10:31,733 --> 01:10:34,733
Speaker 8: about it or even knowing what they are. With respect

974
01:10:34,813 --> 01:10:36,733
Speaker 8: to you and your podcast, perhaps you could have a

975
01:10:36,733 --> 01:10:39,413
Speaker 8: word in the air of your old mate mister Hosking

976
01:10:39,573 --> 01:10:41,413
Speaker 8: and see if he would mention it on his show.

977
01:10:42,213 --> 01:10:44,293
Speaker 8: I know that sometimes he brings up a topic that

978
01:10:44,373 --> 01:10:49,853
Speaker 8: gets plenty of people talking afterwards changing the subject, says James.

979
01:10:50,293 --> 01:10:55,253
Speaker 8: I admit I'm an unashamed fan of Donald Trump, although

980
01:10:55,293 --> 01:10:57,973
Speaker 8: sometimes I do cringe at some things he may say,

981
01:10:57,973 --> 01:11:00,573
Speaker 8: and other times I laugh and applaud his direct and

982
01:11:00,613 --> 01:11:04,773
Speaker 8: defiant manner. Admirably, he makes it absolutely clear on where

983
01:11:04,773 --> 01:11:08,093
Speaker 8: he stands on certain sensitive topics, despite the world's c

984
01:11:08,733 --> 01:11:12,973
Speaker 8: against him and his views. His Oval Office press conferences

985
01:11:13,013 --> 01:11:16,493
Speaker 8: are very entertaining, bold, brash, proud, He's not afraid to

986
01:11:16,533 --> 01:11:19,213
Speaker 8: be blunt and will definitely put a journalist in his

987
01:11:19,373 --> 01:11:23,253
Speaker 8: or her rightful place. And then James says, our own

988
01:11:23,293 --> 01:11:26,213
Speaker 8: Winston Peters and Shane Jones come to mind, and New

989
01:11:26,293 --> 01:11:29,293
Speaker 8: Zealand needs more of them. And he says Trump is

990
01:11:29,333 --> 01:11:31,813
Speaker 8: not afraid to change his mind or change tack if

991
01:11:31,813 --> 01:11:35,813
Speaker 8: things don't work out the way he anticipated. Trump's attempts

992
01:11:35,853 --> 01:11:39,973
Speaker 8: at negotiating a peace plan between Russia and Ukraine are

993
01:11:39,973 --> 01:11:45,173
Speaker 8: an example. Trump's latest brilliant piece of upfront honesty was

994
01:11:45,213 --> 01:11:48,573
Speaker 8: in his un speech stating Climate Changed as the biggest

995
01:11:48,613 --> 01:11:51,973
Speaker 8: con job ever. Yes again, I laughed when this drew

996
01:11:52,013 --> 01:11:56,093
Speaker 8: the US and ours from the audience. Absolutely fantastic. Glad

997
01:11:56,093 --> 01:11:59,933
Speaker 8: you're both back. I always look forward to Wednesday afternoons. James.

998
01:11:59,973 --> 01:12:02,853
Speaker 2: Thank you, James. I've got to tell you that, if

999
01:12:02,853 --> 01:12:05,973
Speaker 2: you don't already know it, that the one comment that

1000
01:12:06,053 --> 01:12:10,133
Speaker 2: I hear as frequently as any other is if only

1001
01:12:10,173 --> 01:12:12,413
Speaker 2: we had a man like Donald Trump.

1002
01:12:13,573 --> 01:12:14,853
Speaker 8: I think there's only room for one.

1003
01:12:15,453 --> 01:12:20,333
Speaker 2: Well, that's not entirely true. Trump operates under the laws

1004
01:12:20,573 --> 01:12:23,533
Speaker 2: of the United States and our prime ministers and what

1005
01:12:23,573 --> 01:12:27,773
Speaker 2: have you operate under the laws of New Zealand. Originating

1006
01:12:28,933 --> 01:12:34,053
Speaker 2: in England, of course, and they don't all have the

1007
01:12:34,133 --> 01:12:38,853
Speaker 2: same powers. Sadly, maybe we could have a revolution though

1008
01:12:39,933 --> 01:12:43,573
Speaker 2: so from somebody who's asked to remain anonymous, I enjoyed

1009
01:12:43,653 --> 01:12:46,413
Speaker 2: Muriel Newman this week and her take on the state

1010
01:12:46,453 --> 01:12:50,053
Speaker 2: of the current government. It was sobering at a times

1011
01:12:50,053 --> 01:12:53,613
Speaker 2: alarming to listen to the fact that mari is forced

1012
01:12:53,653 --> 01:12:57,693
Speaker 2: into many aspects of government and other positions of corporate

1013
01:12:57,773 --> 01:13:00,973
Speaker 2: leadership is really beginning to cause me and I'm sure

1014
01:13:01,053 --> 01:13:05,333
Speaker 2: others to turn off. And New Zealand have opted to

1015
01:13:05,533 --> 01:13:08,493
Speaker 2: constantly play Marie songs on their planes as you sit

1016
01:13:08,613 --> 01:13:12,053
Speaker 2: on board, waiting to depart and on arriving at your destination.

1017
01:13:12,413 --> 01:13:16,533
Speaker 2: They also recently chose to conduct a complete flight from

1018
01:13:16,533 --> 01:13:20,933
Speaker 2: Auckland to Queenstown in Mary language to celebrate Mary Language Week.

1019
01:13:21,773 --> 01:13:25,413
Speaker 2: There wouldn't have been a chance to opt out short

1020
01:13:25,453 --> 01:13:30,493
Speaker 2: of catching another service Jetstar anyone, boy. That'd be a

1021
01:13:30,493 --> 01:13:34,973
Speaker 2: tough decision. SkyTV have also publicly announced their intention to

1022
01:13:34,973 --> 01:13:38,733
Speaker 2: inject more Mary language into their English sport commentary. This

1023
01:13:39,173 --> 01:13:42,053
Speaker 2: despite the fact that Mary commentary is already an option

1024
01:13:42,413 --> 01:13:46,693
Speaker 2: for those who wish to listen. It's too much. On

1025
01:13:46,773 --> 01:13:50,933
Speaker 2: another note to you, Layton you mentioned in the last

1026
01:13:50,973 --> 01:13:54,933
Speaker 2: podcast your amazement at how Erica Kirk was able to

1027
01:13:54,973 --> 01:13:58,093
Speaker 2: forgive the killer of Charlie Kirk. Erica will be well

1028
01:13:58,133 --> 01:14:01,053
Speaker 2: aware that her forgiveness was not for the guy who

1029
01:14:01,133 --> 01:14:05,533
Speaker 2: pulled the trigger, but for herself. She won't be entrapped

1030
01:14:05,573 --> 01:14:09,613
Speaker 2: in a prison of bitterness and resentment. Her husband's murderer

1031
01:14:09,973 --> 01:14:13,893
Speaker 2: will likely receive a lengthy prison sentence at the least,

1032
01:14:14,573 --> 01:14:19,133
Speaker 2: and forever be haunted by what he did. Erica walks free.

1033
01:14:19,653 --> 01:14:23,173
Speaker 2: It's a very good interpretation of it. Actually, always love

1034
01:14:23,213 --> 01:14:25,653
Speaker 2: the podcast. Look forward to Wednesday afternoons every week, so

1035
01:14:25,733 --> 01:14:28,413
Speaker 2: do why because it means I finished for the week? No,

1036
01:14:28,573 --> 01:14:31,213
Speaker 2: why my Wednesday night is my Friday night?

1037
01:14:31,293 --> 01:14:33,693
Speaker 8: Yes? And about half an hour later you say, I

1038
01:14:33,733 --> 01:14:36,013
Speaker 8: wonder what guest I should get for next week? And

1039
01:14:36,053 --> 01:14:40,653
Speaker 8: it all starts again, lady, and interesting that your last

1040
01:14:40,733 --> 01:14:44,853
Speaker 8: correspondent talked about Erica Kirk. Mike says, I have a

1041
01:14:44,893 --> 01:14:48,253
Speaker 8: couple of comments with regard to last week's podcast. You

1042
01:14:48,333 --> 01:14:50,533
Speaker 8: said that you would find it very difficult, indeed, to

1043
01:14:50,613 --> 01:14:54,733
Speaker 8: forgive someone like Erica Kirk did, and then Mike goes

1044
01:14:54,733 --> 01:14:57,533
Speaker 8: on to say, Jesus Christ, an innocent man as we

1045
01:14:57,653 --> 01:15:00,373
Speaker 8: know was crucified in the cruelest way, and while on

1046
01:15:00,453 --> 01:15:03,733
Speaker 8: the cross, he asked God to forgive those who crucified him.

1047
01:15:04,533 --> 01:15:07,493
Speaker 8: Erica made her decision to forgive because of the example

1048
01:15:07,573 --> 01:15:11,133
Speaker 8: given by Gess. In addition, she well knows that the

1049
01:15:11,173 --> 01:15:13,773
Speaker 8: Word says that God is the judge, so the killer

1050
01:15:13,813 --> 01:15:17,413
Speaker 8: will see justice one day. By forgiving, she doesn't have

1051
01:15:17,493 --> 01:15:19,493
Speaker 8: to carry that burden for the rest of her life.

1052
01:15:19,493 --> 01:15:24,213
Speaker 2: Well, that's a duplicate that attitude to the one before exactly.

1053
01:15:24,493 --> 01:15:27,733
Speaker 2: Look I get that, don't I do not want to

1054
01:15:27,773 --> 01:15:32,653
Speaker 2: be misunderstood. If God forbid something like that happened in

1055
01:15:32,693 --> 01:15:34,973
Speaker 2: my life, I would not be able to forgive, and

1056
01:15:34,973 --> 01:15:38,133
Speaker 2: I wouldn't be thinking about it. Were given time, you

1057
01:15:38,173 --> 01:15:40,653
Speaker 2: don't know what might come. But the one thing I

1058
01:15:40,653 --> 01:15:45,373
Speaker 2: want to impress on you is I don't hate. And

1059
01:15:45,373 --> 01:15:50,053
Speaker 2: there's a difference between not forgiving somebody and hating them.

1060
01:15:50,413 --> 01:15:52,853
Speaker 2: I don't hate anybody. I cannot think of anybody I

1061
01:15:53,453 --> 01:15:56,533
Speaker 2: truly hate it. I've said this before and not too

1062
01:15:56,573 --> 01:16:00,253
Speaker 2: long ago. It just doesn't reside in me. It doesn't

1063
01:16:00,293 --> 01:16:03,173
Speaker 2: mean I have to like them, but I don't hate them.

1064
01:16:03,573 --> 01:16:06,693
Speaker 2: Can I detest them? Yes, I can, because that's different

1065
01:16:06,693 --> 01:16:10,573
Speaker 2: to hating. In my you can hate somebody because you

1066
01:16:10,613 --> 01:16:15,333
Speaker 2: hate them, but you can't necessarily detest somebody because you

1067
01:16:15,493 --> 01:16:18,253
Speaker 2: detest them, If that makes sense does to me.

1068
01:16:18,613 --> 01:16:21,173
Speaker 3: Anyway, it's semantics to me.

1069
01:16:22,013 --> 01:16:22,493
Speaker 2: Thank you for that.

1070
01:16:22,653 --> 01:16:23,333
Speaker 8: No, I don't hate.

1071
01:16:23,893 --> 01:16:28,253
Speaker 2: Thank you for your attention, Layton. This is my first

1072
01:16:28,253 --> 01:16:31,253
Speaker 2: time emailing you. Firstly, i'd like to thank you for

1073
01:16:31,293 --> 01:16:34,213
Speaker 2: all the amazing podcasts you provide us with. There is

1074
01:16:34,533 --> 01:16:37,253
Speaker 2: so much going on behind the scenes in the world today,

1075
01:16:37,333 --> 01:16:40,413
Speaker 2: and most kiwis do not have a clue about it,

1076
01:16:41,093 --> 01:16:44,093
Speaker 2: often because they're too busy trying to survive. That's true.

1077
01:16:45,093 --> 01:16:48,173
Speaker 2: You bring a real perspective which is sorely lacking in

1078
01:16:48,253 --> 01:16:52,013
Speaker 2: the general media. A big thank you for that. I

1079
01:16:52,093 --> 01:16:53,653
Speaker 2: might have left that out if i'd pre read this,

1080
01:16:53,733 --> 01:16:56,973
Speaker 2: but I didn't. I listened to your podcast three h

1081
01:16:57,093 --> 01:16:59,933
Speaker 2: three with Muriel Newman this morning. She is another person

1082
01:17:00,013 --> 01:17:03,133
Speaker 2: we can thank for her exposure of what is going

1083
01:17:03,173 --> 01:17:05,933
Speaker 2: on in the background in New Zealand. It was a

1084
01:17:05,973 --> 01:17:09,693
Speaker 2: great interview. I am sort of call it a discussion

1085
01:17:10,093 --> 01:17:13,853
Speaker 2: as much more more than an interviewer. Anyway, toward the

1086
01:17:13,933 --> 01:17:17,253
Speaker 2: end of this podcast, you were commenting on Erica Kirk

1087
01:17:17,693 --> 01:17:20,813
Speaker 2: forgiving the man who killed her husband. You admitted that

1088
01:17:20,853 --> 01:17:23,253
Speaker 2: you could not understand how she could do that. I

1089
01:17:23,333 --> 01:17:30,533
Speaker 2: wanted to share with you the answer. Jesus. Without submitting

1090
01:17:30,533 --> 01:17:33,693
Speaker 2: oneself to his reign in our lives, forgiveness for such

1091
01:17:33,733 --> 01:17:38,893
Speaker 2: a heinous act is probably impossible. But as Christians knowing

1092
01:17:38,933 --> 01:17:42,373
Speaker 2: it's not only what he commands, but what he knows

1093
01:17:42,453 --> 01:17:45,653
Speaker 2: is good for us, forgiveness is not only possible but vital.

1094
01:17:46,573 --> 01:17:49,493
Speaker 2: If we ourselves want Jesus forgiveness, and we all need

1095
01:17:49,533 --> 01:17:54,373
Speaker 2: that it is his command that we forgive others. It

1096
01:17:54,413 --> 01:17:56,453
Speaker 2: also puts an end to the bitterness which comes with

1097
01:17:56,733 --> 01:18:00,613
Speaker 2: unforgiveness and which can ruin our lives. I'm not saying

1098
01:18:00,653 --> 01:18:03,973
Speaker 2: it's easy, but it's the only way. I commend Erica

1099
01:18:04,053 --> 01:18:07,173
Speaker 2: for so quickly being able to do so in public.

1100
01:18:07,213 --> 01:18:10,653
Speaker 2: I was stunned by it, just because you say you

1101
01:18:10,693 --> 01:18:14,533
Speaker 2: forgive someone, though, how do you know you really mean

1102
01:18:14,573 --> 01:18:17,653
Speaker 2: it if you're going to spout it? And I'm not

1103
01:18:17,693 --> 01:18:20,693
Speaker 2: referring to her, she had her act together, But how

1104
01:18:21,213 --> 01:18:24,813
Speaker 2: do you know that you mean it if it just

1105
01:18:25,733 --> 01:18:30,173
Speaker 2: comes on you quickly because you haven't given you You

1106
01:18:30,213 --> 01:18:33,693
Speaker 2: haven't given yourself time to adjust to anything. You may

1107
01:18:33,693 --> 01:18:35,573
Speaker 2: be doing it just because you believe it's the right

1108
01:18:35,613 --> 01:18:37,853
Speaker 2: thing to do, and believing it's the right thing to

1109
01:18:37,893 --> 01:18:41,173
Speaker 2: do isn't necessary, doesn't necessarily endorse what you're saying.

1110
01:18:42,213 --> 01:18:44,693
Speaker 8: I suppose that's where the phrase forgive and forget comes from,

1111
01:18:44,693 --> 01:18:47,493
Speaker 8: because you can definitely forgive but never forget.

1112
01:18:48,173 --> 01:18:50,453
Speaker 2: You see, I'll go back to the family situation that

1113
01:18:50,493 --> 01:18:54,333
Speaker 2: I sort of alluded to before. If something happened, you'd

1114
01:18:54,373 --> 01:18:57,573
Speaker 2: never forget, And if you never forget, have you really forgiven?

1115
01:18:58,333 --> 01:19:01,653
Speaker 8: It's an interesting question, though, isn't it, As you say,

1116
01:19:01,693 --> 01:19:04,453
Speaker 8: at what point do you know that you've truly forgiven? Anyway,

1117
01:19:04,453 --> 01:19:06,573
Speaker 8: we could carry on like this for ages.

1118
01:19:07,813 --> 01:19:09,613
Speaker 2: We should do it, or often we might discover things.

1119
01:19:10,533 --> 01:19:13,413
Speaker 8: Let me do my little part from Malcolm So enjoyed

1120
01:19:13,453 --> 01:19:16,653
Speaker 8: podcast three oh three with Muri on Newman. It's frightening

1121
01:19:16,693 --> 01:19:18,933
Speaker 8: how far off course we are and how much effort

1122
01:19:19,013 --> 01:19:22,093
Speaker 8: is needed to get us back on track. Totally agree

1123
01:19:22,093 --> 01:19:24,133
Speaker 8: with you and Muriel. Keep up the great work.

1124
01:19:24,733 --> 01:19:28,293
Speaker 2: Here's another thing. If you don't to forgive somebody for

1125
01:19:28,373 --> 01:19:33,013
Speaker 2: something like she has done, is it appropriate if that

1126
01:19:33,053 --> 01:19:38,173
Speaker 2: person continues to hate, condemn, and what to kill more people.

1127
01:19:38,533 --> 01:19:42,933
Speaker 2: You forgive somebody when they ask you for forgiveness. Yes,

1128
01:19:42,973 --> 01:19:47,813
Speaker 2: that's really where it happens, not when they haven't, although

1129
01:19:47,813 --> 01:19:50,773
Speaker 2: the cross experience that was described a moment ago doesn't

1130
01:19:50,813 --> 01:19:51,253
Speaker 2: forward that.

1131
01:19:51,453 --> 01:19:54,133
Speaker 8: Yes, I understand that if they ask for forgiveness it

1132
01:19:54,213 --> 01:19:56,653
Speaker 8: behooves you to think yes or no?

1133
01:19:56,773 --> 01:19:57,213
Speaker 3: Shall I?

1134
01:19:57,293 --> 01:19:59,253
Speaker 8: But if they don't ask you.

1135
01:19:59,213 --> 01:20:01,373
Speaker 2: For fagiveness and keep rolling on the table.

1136
01:20:01,333 --> 01:20:06,453
Speaker 8: Yeah, and there they're not sorry for what they've done,

1137
01:20:06,653 --> 01:20:09,213
Speaker 8: then why should they get for thank you?

1138
01:20:09,613 --> 01:20:13,973
Speaker 2: I think we've instigated more conversation from Mike Muriel. Newman

1139
01:20:14,053 --> 01:20:17,173
Speaker 2: is right with her summation of our coalition government's progress

1140
01:20:17,533 --> 01:20:22,293
Speaker 2: effecting their election promises. However, I feel she was too

1141
01:20:22,333 --> 01:20:26,253
Speaker 2: soft on them by offering as a partial excuse the

1142
01:20:26,293 --> 01:20:29,973
Speaker 2: depth of the previous Labor government's entrenchment of a poor

1143
01:20:29,973 --> 01:20:35,653
Speaker 2: poor and satyrty in legislation and other woke nonsense. The

1144
01:20:35,693 --> 01:20:38,093
Speaker 2: best example of how they could have handled this is

1145
01:20:38,373 --> 01:20:43,893
Speaker 2: Argentina's Millay reforms. Milay came to power around the same

1146
01:20:43,933 --> 01:20:47,813
Speaker 2: time as Luxon, but compare the results. Argentina is about

1147
01:20:47,853 --> 01:20:49,453
Speaker 2: to have a surplus for the first time in one

1148
01:20:49,533 --> 01:20:53,933
Speaker 2: hundred years. Inflation has dropped from two hundred percent into

1149
01:20:53,973 --> 01:20:57,933
Speaker 2: the twenties, thousands of civil servants have been laid off

1150
01:20:58,173 --> 01:21:03,093
Speaker 2: and socialist controls have been removed. We should follow his

1151
01:21:03,213 --> 01:21:07,293
Speaker 2: example and take an acts to everything that Muriel was

1152
01:21:07,373 --> 01:21:10,773
Speaker 2: correctly criticized. While having a majority in the House, they

1153
01:21:10,813 --> 01:21:14,253
Speaker 2: could legislate, as many other countries have done that. All

1154
01:21:14,413 --> 01:21:19,893
Speaker 2: race references must be removed from all legislation and education immediately.

1155
01:21:20,653 --> 01:21:23,813
Speaker 2: Civil servant numbers should be wound back to pre twenty

1156
01:21:23,853 --> 01:21:30,573
Speaker 2: seventeen numbers. Numerous government departments should be disestablished, health should

1157
01:21:30,613 --> 01:21:34,613
Speaker 2: be privatized, and the central Bank should be this established

1158
01:21:34,613 --> 01:21:37,933
Speaker 2: over time. The definition of insanity is doing the same

1159
01:21:38,013 --> 01:21:40,853
Speaker 2: things and expecting a different result. This is exactly what

1160
01:21:40,933 --> 01:21:44,653
Speaker 2: they're doing with some slight fiddling at the margins. Muriel

1161
01:21:44,773 --> 01:21:50,013
Speaker 2: and h alluded to politicians' lack of courage. This is

1162
01:21:50,053 --> 01:21:54,293
Speaker 2: a major problem. Luxeon's party demonstrates this perfectly by sticking

1163
01:21:54,373 --> 01:21:57,933
Speaker 2: with him on the net zero Paris Accord nonsense. This

1164
01:21:58,053 --> 01:22:02,333
Speaker 2: country's woes could be turned around overnight with a courageous government.

1165
01:22:03,453 --> 01:22:06,733
Speaker 2: And I agree with I think everything that Mike said.

1166
01:22:07,533 --> 01:22:11,573
Speaker 8: Leyden Allen's quickly much enjoyed listening to Muriel. I also

1167
01:22:11,693 --> 01:22:16,133
Speaker 8: enjoy seeing Christian hosting George. So that's on the Geopolitical

1168
01:22:16,173 --> 01:22:20,533
Speaker 8: Futures website. And Alan goes on to say, the apple

1169
01:22:20,573 --> 01:22:22,813
Speaker 8: doesn't fall far from the tree. You must be a

1170
01:22:22,853 --> 01:22:27,413
Speaker 8: proud dad, which you are. Well, I'm not too, and

1171
01:22:27,493 --> 01:22:28,493
Speaker 8: I'm a proud stepmother.

1172
01:22:30,013 --> 01:22:36,453
Speaker 2: I'm enjoying it. And finally from a Rick, I understand

1173
01:22:36,493 --> 01:22:40,413
Speaker 2: why you're troubled by what Erica Kirk said about forgiving

1174
01:22:40,573 --> 01:22:46,453
Speaker 2: the murderer. Nice sentiment, but what the Bible says, quote,

1175
01:22:46,973 --> 01:22:51,813
Speaker 2: we are to forgive others as Christ forgave us. If

1176
01:22:51,813 --> 01:22:54,093
Speaker 2: I did not ask God for forgiveness of my sins,

1177
01:22:54,493 --> 01:22:57,173
Speaker 2: I would not be saved. In other words, it is

1178
01:22:57,213 --> 01:23:01,533
Speaker 2: a transaction. She can't forgive the murderer because he has

1179
01:23:01,573 --> 01:23:06,813
Speaker 2: not asked for forgiveness. Eger I had endorsement. This is

1180
01:23:06,853 --> 01:23:07,933
Speaker 2: what the Bible teaches.

1181
01:23:08,773 --> 01:23:08,933
Speaker 3: Now.

1182
01:23:08,973 --> 01:23:11,893
Speaker 2: I know we've had a fair bit of religious commentary

1183
01:23:12,213 --> 01:23:16,093
Speaker 2: this week in particular on this, but it was probably inevitable.

1184
01:23:16,893 --> 01:23:19,813
Speaker 2: I foresaw it well, I expected it, and I find

1185
01:23:19,813 --> 01:23:21,973
Speaker 2: no fault with it. If I may borrow a phrase,

1186
01:23:22,413 --> 01:23:25,053
Speaker 2: it's up to individuals to make their own decisions. And

1187
01:23:25,213 --> 01:23:28,413
Speaker 2: I decide that the mail room is now closed. Very

1188
01:23:28,413 --> 01:23:29,893
Speaker 2: good and I may see you next week.

1189
01:23:29,973 --> 01:23:31,893
Speaker 8: You may thank you so much.

1190
01:23:31,893 --> 01:23:37,053
Speaker 2: Thank you, missus p.

1191
01:23:46,573 --> 01:23:46,693
Speaker 3: Now.

1192
01:23:46,733 --> 01:23:49,453
Speaker 2: In last week's podcast, I mentioned that I got a letter,

1193
01:23:49,653 --> 01:23:55,053
Speaker 2: a long letter from King's Council Gary Judd, and I

1194
01:23:55,053 --> 01:23:56,973
Speaker 2: said I was going to leave it for this week,

1195
01:23:57,733 --> 01:23:59,773
Speaker 2: and I'm glad I did because well, I'm glad I

1196
01:23:59,773 --> 01:24:02,453
Speaker 2: did for a number of reasons. I'm going to read

1197
01:24:02,453 --> 01:24:06,333
Speaker 2: it to you in its entirety, because I think it's

1198
01:24:06,373 --> 01:24:09,693
Speaker 2: almost impossible to miss the imports of it. He wrote

1199
01:24:09,693 --> 01:24:13,933
Speaker 2: this on the twentieth of September. He said, Latent, thank

1200
01:24:13,973 --> 01:24:17,973
Speaker 2: you for your most interesting discussion with Louise Klegg. Her

1201
01:24:18,013 --> 01:24:22,733
Speaker 2: description of some of her progressive friends as a little

1202
01:24:22,733 --> 01:24:29,613
Speaker 2: bit malleable and credulous and also fashionable is perceptive. A

1203
01:24:29,613 --> 01:24:32,773
Speaker 2: few more descriptors may be added. An uncritical desire to

1204
01:24:32,813 --> 01:24:36,693
Speaker 2: be part of the good and on the right side

1205
01:24:36,693 --> 01:24:40,133
Speaker 2: of history, a need to look good in the eyes

1206
01:24:40,173 --> 01:24:43,933
Speaker 2: of others, asking not if this is true, but do

1207
01:24:44,013 --> 01:24:47,493
Speaker 2: others think it's true? Seeking the approval of others, all

1208
01:24:47,653 --> 01:24:51,373
Speaker 2: leading to a reluctance to engage in critical thinking and debate.

1209
01:24:51,653 --> 01:24:53,933
Speaker 2: This is the mode of thinking of those whom iron

1210
01:24:54,053 --> 01:24:58,573
Speaker 2: Rand described as second handers and portrayed in The fountain Head,

1211
01:24:58,933 --> 01:25:03,773
Speaker 2: contrasted with the individualist Howard Rock. As Rand put it elsewhere,

1212
01:25:04,373 --> 01:25:08,293
Speaker 2: it is to a second hander that the moral appraisal

1213
01:25:08,413 --> 01:25:13,653
Speaker 2: of himself by others is a primary concern which supersedes truth, facts,

1214
01:25:13,893 --> 01:25:17,293
Speaker 2: reason and logic. The divide in this aspect of the

1215
01:25:17,493 --> 01:25:21,013
Speaker 2: human condition is not between the left or progressives on

1216
01:25:21,093 --> 01:25:24,893
Speaker 2: the one hand and conservatives on the other. Conservatives can

1217
01:25:24,933 --> 01:25:28,333
Speaker 2: be secondhanders as much as others. The divide is between,

1218
01:25:28,733 --> 01:25:31,413
Speaker 2: on the one hand, second handers and those who have

1219
01:25:31,573 --> 01:25:34,853
Speaker 2: loyalty to the group as a primary and on the

1220
01:25:34,893 --> 01:25:40,133
Speaker 2: other those of independent thoughts and action who take responsibility

1221
01:25:40,173 --> 01:25:43,173
Speaker 2: for those thoughts and actions. There is no doubt that

1222
01:25:43,213 --> 01:25:46,933
Speaker 2: in New Zealand, like Louis's perception of Australia, too many

1223
01:25:46,973 --> 01:25:50,133
Speaker 2: members of the legal profession are in the first camp.

1224
01:25:51,053 --> 01:25:56,693
Speaker 2: Louise referred to Francis Fukuyana I consider right scary Judd.

1225
01:25:56,773 --> 01:26:01,173
Speaker 2: I consider Fukiyama's The Origins of Political Order, tracing the

1226
01:26:01,173 --> 01:26:04,333
Speaker 2: growth of political order from pre human times to the

1227
01:26:04,333 --> 01:26:10,053
Speaker 2: French Revolution, and political order and legal decay from the

1228
01:26:10,173 --> 01:26:14,853
Speaker 2: Industrial Revolution to what he calls the globalization of democracy.

1229
01:26:15,333 --> 01:26:19,573
Speaker 2: To be great works. As Luis says in her Sliding

1230
01:26:19,653 --> 01:26:25,293
Speaker 2: into Technocracy article in The Spectator Australia, fuki Yama places

1231
01:26:25,333 --> 01:26:30,093
Speaker 2: faith in a properly functioning administrative state. What needs emphasis

1232
01:26:30,253 --> 01:26:33,933
Speaker 2: is that it is critical to fuki Yama's conception of

1233
01:26:33,973 --> 01:26:38,493
Speaker 2: a properly functioning administrative state that the state be one

1234
01:26:38,533 --> 01:26:42,573
Speaker 2: where the rule of law prevails. He notes in Origins,

1235
01:26:42,613 --> 01:26:45,013
Speaker 2: page two four six. Up to this point, I have

1236
01:26:45,093 --> 01:26:50,053
Speaker 2: discussed political developments in terms of state building, the ability

1237
01:26:50,093 --> 01:26:54,093
Speaker 2: of states to concentrate and use power. The rule of

1238
01:26:54,173 --> 01:26:57,613
Speaker 2: law is a separate component of political order that puts

1239
01:26:57,653 --> 01:27:02,053
Speaker 2: limitations on a state's power. The first checks on executive

1240
01:27:02,093 --> 01:27:07,053
Speaker 2: power were not those imposed by democratic assemblies or elections. Rather,

1241
01:27:07,213 --> 01:27:10,733
Speaker 2: they were the result of societies believing that rulers had

1242
01:27:10,773 --> 01:27:14,333
Speaker 2: to operate under the law. State building and the rule

1243
01:27:14,373 --> 01:27:18,213
Speaker 2: of law therefore coexist in a certain tension. On the

1244
01:27:18,213 --> 01:27:22,533
Speaker 2: one hand, rulers can enhance their authority by acting within

1245
01:27:22,693 --> 01:27:25,453
Speaker 2: and on behalf of the law. On the other hand,

1246
01:27:25,653 --> 01:27:28,573
Speaker 2: the law can prevent them from doing things that they

1247
01:27:28,573 --> 01:27:31,933
Speaker 2: would like to do, not just in their own private interest,

1248
01:27:32,333 --> 01:27:34,533
Speaker 2: but in the interest of the community as a whole.

1249
01:27:35,213 --> 01:27:38,173
Speaker 2: And Gary writes on. In her discussion with you, Louise

1250
01:27:38,253 --> 01:27:41,373
Speaker 2: noted how during her legal career the profession in Australia

1251
01:27:41,453 --> 01:27:45,933
Speaker 2: had moved steadily leftward. During my legal career in New Zealand,

1252
01:27:46,173 --> 01:27:50,853
Speaker 2: the distance between the conservatism of most judges and other

1253
01:27:50,973 --> 01:27:54,933
Speaker 2: legal elites at the start and today's frequent lack of

1254
01:27:54,933 --> 01:27:59,653
Speaker 2: obedience to disliked legislation and abandonment of the virtues of

1255
01:27:59,733 --> 01:28:03,613
Speaker 2: deciding a present case in the same way as a

1256
01:28:03,653 --> 01:28:09,573
Speaker 2: previous case has become extreme. Incremental Ism is being supplanted

1257
01:28:09,653 --> 01:28:14,773
Speaker 2: by radicalism, often driven by political ideology. This means that

1258
01:28:14,893 --> 01:28:18,133
Speaker 2: judges and leaders of the legal profession, who should be

1259
01:28:18,213 --> 01:28:21,533
Speaker 2: upholding and protecting the rule of law, are undermining it

1260
01:28:21,653 --> 01:28:26,653
Speaker 2: by judges assuming the role of lawmaker without condemnation from

1261
01:28:26,653 --> 01:28:30,533
Speaker 2: the profession, all the while pretending that they're acting to

1262
01:28:30,653 --> 01:28:35,013
Speaker 2: advance the rule of law, when in truth, in truth,

1263
01:28:35,413 --> 01:28:38,533
Speaker 2: they are trying to advance the rule of judges and lawyers.

1264
01:28:39,173 --> 01:28:41,973
Speaker 2: The essence of the rule of law is that rule

1265
01:28:42,213 --> 01:28:46,653
Speaker 2: is by law, not man. Practicality demands that society choose

1266
01:28:46,853 --> 01:28:50,293
Speaker 2: some people to be responsible for making and implementing law.

1267
01:28:50,613 --> 01:28:55,373
Speaker 2: In today's democracies, we need not rely only on societal

1268
01:28:55,453 --> 01:28:58,573
Speaker 2: pressure to keep lawmakers within the law, but on the

1269
01:28:58,613 --> 01:29:04,293
Speaker 2: ability to get rid of elected representatives. No such ability

1270
01:29:04,413 --> 01:29:07,853
Speaker 2: exists regarding those who are charged with implementing the law,

1271
01:29:09,013 --> 01:29:13,213
Speaker 2: that is the judges. And to conclude in his final paragraph,

1272
01:29:13,533 --> 01:29:18,653
Speaker 2: when judges ignore the sovereignty of Parliament, abandon precedent and incrementalism,

1273
01:29:19,093 --> 01:29:22,733
Speaker 2: and make themselves law makers, they place themselves above the law,

1274
01:29:22,853 --> 01:29:26,013
Speaker 2: and in confrontation with the rule of law, in defiance

1275
01:29:26,093 --> 01:29:28,973
Speaker 2: of the o's they took when entering office to be

1276
01:29:29,133 --> 01:29:32,853
Speaker 2: faithful and bear true allegiance to the sovereign according to

1277
01:29:32,893 --> 01:29:36,413
Speaker 2: the law, and to serve the sovereign according to the

1278
01:29:36,493 --> 01:29:41,973
Speaker 2: law in the office of Judge. Regards Gary Zogary, I

1279
01:29:42,013 --> 01:29:45,573
Speaker 2: appreciate the letter that it was a pleasure to read it,

1280
01:29:45,613 --> 01:29:48,253
Speaker 2: so thank you, and I would invite any members of

1281
01:29:48,293 --> 01:29:51,533
Speaker 2: the judiciary or the legal profession who have an opinion

1282
01:29:51,533 --> 01:29:55,053
Speaker 2: they'd like to express on it to go for your life,

1283
01:29:55,493 --> 01:29:58,533
Speaker 2: send it to me Layton at newstorg ZB dot co

1284
01:29:58,693 --> 01:30:01,973
Speaker 2: dot NZ, and I will shall we say, entertain it,

1285
01:30:02,293 --> 01:30:07,413
Speaker 2: but there is room for discussion, Layton Smith. Now before

1286
01:30:07,413 --> 01:30:09,933
Speaker 2: we call it quits for or three four there are

1287
01:30:09,933 --> 01:30:13,293
Speaker 2: two stories and they're not the only ones either, But

1288
01:30:13,333 --> 01:30:15,213
Speaker 2: there are two stories. I just want to draw to

1289
01:30:15,653 --> 01:30:20,093
Speaker 2: your attention. It's just in case you are unaware of it,

1290
01:30:20,453 --> 01:30:22,693
Speaker 2: but I'm sure that most of you are probably not.

1291
01:30:23,373 --> 01:30:27,133
Speaker 2: The digital gulag is being erected before your very eyes,

1292
01:30:27,253 --> 01:30:31,533
Speaker 2: reads the headline. At the WEF the World Economic Forum

1293
01:30:31,573 --> 01:30:35,693
Speaker 2: twenty twenty five, Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sanchez presented a

1294
01:30:35,813 --> 01:30:39,453
Speaker 2: vision for the digital future that should send a chill

1295
01:30:40,173 --> 01:30:44,333
Speaker 2: down the spine of every free citizen. Framed as a

1296
01:30:44,373 --> 01:30:48,173
Speaker 2: solution to online harms, his proposal is in reality a

1297
01:30:48,213 --> 01:30:54,493
Speaker 2: blueprint for a panopticon of digital control, perfectly aligned with

1298
01:30:54,533 --> 01:30:58,253
Speaker 2: the globalist agenda of the World Economic Forum. He called

1299
01:30:58,253 --> 01:31:02,413
Speaker 2: for an end to online anonymity, demanding that every social

1300
01:31:02,453 --> 01:31:05,533
Speaker 2: media profile in Europe be linked to a state issued

1301
01:31:06,653 --> 01:31:10,933
Speaker 2: You guess that European didgit digital identity wallet. He compared

1302
01:31:10,973 --> 01:31:14,653
Speaker 2: the Internet to public streets, arguing that just as one

1303
01:31:14,653 --> 01:31:17,853
Speaker 2: cannot drive without a license plate, one should not post

1304
01:31:17,893 --> 01:31:22,493
Speaker 2: online without state verified ID. That's what Sanchez said. Then

1305
01:31:22,693 --> 01:31:27,333
Speaker 2: the author writes what Sanchez is really saying. He's declaring

1306
01:31:27,373 --> 01:31:31,053
Speaker 2: that the digital public square the last truly global space

1307
01:31:31,133 --> 01:31:35,533
Speaker 2: for free unvetted discourse must be brought under the direct

1308
01:31:35,533 --> 01:31:40,773
Speaker 2: supervision of the state. His retric is a masterclass in misdirection.

1309
01:31:41,373 --> 01:31:46,853
Speaker 2: For instance, fighting misinformation is code for establishing a verifiable

1310
01:31:46,893 --> 01:31:51,653
Speaker 2: identity for dissent. Under this system, any opinion deemed inconvenient

1311
01:31:51,693 --> 01:31:54,053
Speaker 2: by the authorities can be traced directly back to the

1312
01:31:54,053 --> 01:31:57,413
Speaker 2: citizen who voiced it. You know what's going on in

1313
01:31:57,533 --> 01:31:59,733
Speaker 2: Ingot at the moment. You know that they're arresting people

1314
01:31:59,773 --> 01:32:02,333
Speaker 2: in the middle of the night for a simple little

1315
01:32:02,333 --> 01:32:08,253
Speaker 2: comment they made online. Ending cyber harassment is the pretext

1316
01:32:08,453 --> 01:32:12,493
Speaker 2: for ending digital privacy. The principle that one can speak

1317
01:32:12,533 --> 01:32:17,893
Speaker 2: without fear of state retribution is being reclassified as impunity

1318
01:32:18,613 --> 01:32:25,213
Speaker 2: and pseudonimity is a trojan horse pseudonymity. It offers the

1319
01:32:25,293 --> 01:32:28,853
Speaker 2: illusion of a nickname while ensuring that a government database

1320
01:32:28,933 --> 01:32:32,653
Speaker 2: holds the key to your real identity, accessible whenever the

1321
01:32:32,653 --> 01:32:38,733
Speaker 2: public authorities deem your speech a crime. This is not pseudonimity.

1322
01:32:38,813 --> 01:32:42,813
Speaker 2: It is state mandated identity registration for speech. Now. This

1323
01:32:42,893 --> 01:32:45,333
Speaker 2: is the ultimate goal of the World Economic Forum's Great

1324
01:32:45,453 --> 01:32:50,573
Speaker 2: Reset and Digital Idea agenda, not safety but control. It

1325
01:32:50,613 --> 01:32:54,933
Speaker 2: creates a system where participation in modern society is contingent

1326
01:32:55,893 --> 01:33:00,213
Speaker 2: on accepting a government issued digital leash. The threats of

1327
01:33:00,293 --> 01:33:04,893
Speaker 2: being banned or prosecuted for undefined crimes will inevitably lead

1328
01:33:04,973 --> 01:33:13,333
Speaker 2: to self censorship, silencing legitimate criticism and neutralizing opposition. Sanchez's

1329
01:33:13,373 --> 01:33:17,573
Speaker 2: second proposal to force open the black box of algorithms

1330
01:33:17,813 --> 01:33:21,573
Speaker 2: completes the picture. It's not about transparency for users, but

1331
01:33:21,653 --> 01:33:25,773
Speaker 2: about regulatory capture for the state. The gold is for

1332
01:33:25,933 --> 01:33:30,493
Speaker 2: governments to dictate what content is amplified and what is suppressed,

1333
01:33:31,013 --> 01:33:36,373
Speaker 2: shaping public opinion under the guise of managing the public conversation. Now,

1334
01:33:36,413 --> 01:33:40,773
Speaker 2: the second one is to do with Britain and Starma.

1335
01:33:41,533 --> 01:33:44,973
Speaker 2: UK goes all well in with mandatory digital ID and

1336
01:33:45,173 --> 01:33:49,453
Speaker 2: biometric tracking Chinese commenters style digital tracking is coming to

1337
01:33:49,493 --> 01:33:53,213
Speaker 2: the UK with a new quote right to work scheme

1338
01:33:53,973 --> 01:33:58,373
Speaker 2: in the form of a universal ID called the brit Card.

1339
01:33:58,853 --> 01:34:01,293
Speaker 2: I know you've probably heard of it. British Prime Minister

1340
01:34:01,373 --> 01:34:05,613
Speaker 2: Keir Starmer, facing unprecedented backlash from native born citizens for

1341
01:34:05,653 --> 01:34:10,333
Speaker 2: his open border policies and two tier justice system protecting

1342
01:34:10,413 --> 01:34:15,533
Speaker 2: migrants from prosecution, is attempting to exploit public anger to

1343
01:34:15,613 --> 01:34:20,373
Speaker 2: gain support for an Orwelly and surveillance rollout. The government

1344
01:34:20,373 --> 01:34:23,573
Speaker 2: says the mandatory ID based on the UK one login

1345
01:34:23,693 --> 01:34:28,813
Speaker 2: system will help stop illegal immigrants from crossing the channel

1346
01:34:28,893 --> 01:34:31,493
Speaker 2: by denying them access to work. Look, I'm not going

1347
01:34:31,493 --> 01:34:34,253
Speaker 2: to take it any further because you know that that's garbage.

1348
01:34:34,413 --> 01:34:38,933
Speaker 2: It won't It's all part of the rolling out of

1349
01:34:38,973 --> 01:34:42,533
Speaker 2: the limitation of freedom. Can't put it any better, but

1350
01:34:42,613 --> 01:34:45,333
Speaker 2: it's true. So at that point we shall roll up

1351
01:34:45,373 --> 01:34:50,053
Speaker 2: the carpet for podcasts three hundred and four. Most of

1352
01:34:50,093 --> 01:34:53,893
Speaker 2: those pieces, by the way, came from one of the

1353
01:34:53,893 --> 01:34:57,213
Speaker 2: best sources, Zero Hedge, who are very good at breaking

1354
01:34:57,293 --> 01:35:00,613
Speaker 2: stories along along these lines. Now, if you would like

1355
01:35:00,653 --> 01:35:04,213
Speaker 2: to write Layton at newstalksb dot co dot z or

1356
01:35:04,293 --> 01:35:09,733
Speaker 2: Carolyn at newstalksb dot co dot nz of your correspondence,

1357
01:35:09,973 --> 01:35:13,053
Speaker 2: so keep it up. We shall return, of course with

1358
01:35:13,413 --> 01:35:16,853
Speaker 2: podcast three oh five in the meantime. As always, thank

1359
01:35:16,893 --> 01:35:19,213
Speaker 2: you for listening and we shall talk soon.

1360
01:35:27,013 --> 01:35:30,653
Speaker 1: Thank you for more from News Talks at b Listen

1361
01:35:30,733 --> 01:35:33,693
Speaker 1: live on air or online, and keep our shows with

1362
01:35:33,813 --> 01:35:36,933
Speaker 1: you wherever you go with our podcasts on iHeartRadio