1 00:00:09,093 --> 00:00:12,693 Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from News Talks EDB. Follow 2 00:00:12,773 --> 00:00:16,173 Speaker 1: this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio. 3 00:00:19,253 --> 00:00:25,293 Speaker 2: Straight down the Middle of Dry dipny score by try these. 4 00:00:28,693 --> 00:00:33,213 Speaker 1: Get inside the game from every angle. It's Rugby Direct 5 00:00:33,333 --> 00:00:37,053 Speaker 1: with Elliot Smith and Leam Napier, powered by News Talks EDB. 6 00:00:37,293 --> 00:00:40,133 Speaker 3: Welcome into Rugby Very, powered by Habit Health, tackling all 7 00:00:40,133 --> 00:00:43,693 Speaker 3: your aches and pains from sports and work. Elliott Smith 8 00:00:43,733 --> 00:00:46,853 Speaker 3: with me Liam Napier, Back for another week of rugby 9 00:00:46,853 --> 00:00:50,093 Speaker 3: Snannigan's and covering everything else that's gone on in the 10 00:00:50,173 --> 00:00:52,813 Speaker 3: rugby globe this time. A week ago, Liam, we had 11 00:00:52,813 --> 00:00:56,893 Speaker 3: the All Black squads locked in thirty three names, and 12 00:00:56,973 --> 00:01:00,973 Speaker 3: inevitably we come back and reconvene a week later, and 13 00:01:01,093 --> 00:01:04,213 Speaker 3: the squad has changed somewhat. Wallace a Titi out first 14 00:01:04,213 --> 00:01:07,893 Speaker 3: and foremost that came out late last week and now 15 00:01:08,053 --> 00:01:10,413 Speaker 3: on the we record to Mighty Williams also out for 16 00:01:11,253 --> 00:01:13,773 Speaker 3: the French series with a torn at meniscus, so a 17 00:01:13,813 --> 00:01:17,293 Speaker 3: couple of blows there from the All Blacks perspective. These 18 00:01:17,293 --> 00:01:19,773 Speaker 3: are both first choice players so in certainly ended that 19 00:01:19,893 --> 00:01:22,573 Speaker 3: last year as their first choice players in key positions. 20 00:01:23,893 --> 00:01:26,293 Speaker 3: So a bit of a blow for Scott Robertson. 21 00:01:26,573 --> 00:01:30,213 Speaker 4: Big setbacks Elliott. They were two of the All Black's 22 00:01:30,293 --> 00:01:32,933 Speaker 4: best performance last year. Wallas Titi was the All Black's 23 00:01:32,973 --> 00:01:36,893 Speaker 4: Player of the Year and World Rugby Breakthrough Player for 24 00:01:36,973 --> 00:01:39,053 Speaker 4: a good reason, the way he came on the test scene, 25 00:01:39,093 --> 00:01:42,613 Speaker 4: the impact he had and to Mighty Williams was a 26 00:01:42,613 --> 00:01:46,173 Speaker 4: big mover last year, went past Ethan de Grout on 27 00:01:46,253 --> 00:01:50,333 Speaker 4: that Northern tour and then this season really cemented that status. 28 00:01:50,853 --> 00:01:53,053 Speaker 4: He can play both sides of the scrum. He's a 29 00:01:53,093 --> 00:01:57,213 Speaker 4: destructive scrummager. He plays big minutes for a big man, 30 00:01:57,333 --> 00:02:00,853 Speaker 4: great ball in hands, scores from close range, great feet, 31 00:02:00,933 --> 00:02:03,773 Speaker 4: good hands. Really does it all for a modern day 32 00:02:03,773 --> 00:02:08,853 Speaker 4: prop so it does while it does a lot of 33 00:02:08,853 --> 00:02:12,493 Speaker 4: talking points and give others opportunities. We've got Christian Leo 34 00:02:12,573 --> 00:02:15,653 Speaker 4: ready coming into the full squad as well as George Bauer. 35 00:02:16,973 --> 00:02:18,773 Speaker 4: Those are two big setbacks Phil Blacks. 36 00:02:18,853 --> 00:02:21,053 Speaker 3: They are as you mentioned, those players coming in there. 37 00:02:21,093 --> 00:02:24,173 Speaker 3: But it would tend to sugguce that Ethan de group 38 00:02:24,173 --> 00:02:26,333 Speaker 3: will start in Dunedin. Team will be named as per 39 00:02:26,453 --> 00:02:29,653 Speaker 3: on a Thursday afternoon, Thursday morning, late Thursday morning, Thursday 40 00:02:29,653 --> 00:02:31,813 Speaker 3: afternoon New Zealand. Ethan, the group should come in you 41 00:02:31,813 --> 00:02:36,173 Speaker 3: would think as starting prop. The loose Ford max is 42 00:02:36,413 --> 00:02:39,613 Speaker 3: very interesting because Luke Jacobson has been ruled out as 43 00:02:39,653 --> 00:02:44,613 Speaker 3: well this week, So how does that shake down for 44 00:02:44,853 --> 00:02:47,213 Speaker 3: this testing to need and your three starters and player 45 00:02:47,213 --> 00:02:49,733 Speaker 3: coming off the bench. To me, it's just is going 46 00:02:49,773 --> 00:02:51,933 Speaker 3: to be probably a couple of debutants, one starting, one 47 00:02:51,973 --> 00:02:52,733 Speaker 3: coming off the bench. 48 00:02:53,093 --> 00:02:56,053 Speaker 4: It's going to be multiple debutantes across this all black team. 49 00:02:56,093 --> 00:02:59,253 Speaker 4: Because I agree Ethan, the group will come in and start, 50 00:02:59,253 --> 00:03:02,373 Speaker 4: and then you'll highly likely have Olie Norris coming off 51 00:03:02,373 --> 00:03:05,213 Speaker 4: the bench for his first cap, so it'll be a 52 00:03:05,213 --> 00:03:08,253 Speaker 4: big moment for him. You wouldn't imagine George Bauer, having 53 00:03:08,413 --> 00:03:11,493 Speaker 4: just been called in over the weekend, will come on 54 00:03:11,533 --> 00:03:13,653 Speaker 4: to the bench and it is a nice mix of 55 00:03:13,693 --> 00:03:17,133 Speaker 4: having an experienced play with the debutant there and the 56 00:03:17,173 --> 00:03:18,053 Speaker 4: loose forward mix. 57 00:03:18,413 --> 00:03:19,733 Speaker 5: Yeah, really up for grabs. 58 00:03:19,973 --> 00:03:22,693 Speaker 4: Luke Jacobson, I think first and foremost it should be 59 00:03:22,773 --> 00:03:26,853 Speaker 4: questions about why and how he came back to finish 60 00:03:26,933 --> 00:03:31,773 Speaker 4: that game having passed his HIA and then been ruled 61 00:03:31,773 --> 00:03:33,933 Speaker 4: out mandatory twelve days standown. 62 00:03:34,453 --> 00:03:36,373 Speaker 5: So he's out of this first test. 63 00:03:36,373 --> 00:03:39,333 Speaker 3: Well, it does present to question because his eyes were 64 00:03:39,373 --> 00:03:42,693 Speaker 3: like sources that night, and look, you can only trust 65 00:03:42,693 --> 00:03:45,453 Speaker 3: what information you were given, and if you were if 66 00:03:45,493 --> 00:03:49,133 Speaker 3: he's been passed to play through the ha protocols to 67 00:03:49,133 --> 00:03:50,533 Speaker 3: come back on the field, you know it's a fifteen 68 00:03:50,533 --> 00:03:53,853 Speaker 3: minute stand down, they have to go through a cognitive test. 69 00:03:54,973 --> 00:03:55,573 Speaker 2: Is past that. 70 00:03:56,013 --> 00:03:59,493 Speaker 3: Questions whether that test is rigorous enough, whether this or 71 00:03:59,533 --> 00:04:02,573 Speaker 3: just a one off, whether he was fine to pass 72 00:04:02,613 --> 00:04:05,733 Speaker 3: that test and then had spells afterwards. There's a little 73 00:04:05,733 --> 00:04:07,533 Speaker 3: bit up in the air as to what happened there. 74 00:04:07,613 --> 00:04:09,413 Speaker 4: Yeah, I think it's one those examples where if you, 75 00:04:09,853 --> 00:04:12,893 Speaker 4: I mean most people watching live, it looked like he 76 00:04:12,933 --> 00:04:17,813 Speaker 4: had been knocked unconscious and so he probably shouldn't have 77 00:04:17,893 --> 00:04:20,693 Speaker 4: even gone through the HIA protocols. He should have been 78 00:04:20,733 --> 00:04:24,373 Speaker 4: ruled out then and there I guess at least he's 79 00:04:24,413 --> 00:04:29,413 Speaker 4: been ruled out subsequently. But in that moment, I definitely 80 00:04:29,453 --> 00:04:31,293 Speaker 4: don't think he should have came back and finished that 81 00:04:31,373 --> 00:04:35,653 Speaker 4: game and losing him as another blow. Because of his versatility, 82 00:04:35,813 --> 00:04:38,533 Speaker 4: he can play six seven eights, and that's one of 83 00:04:38,533 --> 00:04:40,973 Speaker 4: the reasons he has been included in this squad. So 84 00:04:41,373 --> 00:04:45,013 Speaker 4: let's go to the balance of that loose forward trio, 85 00:04:45,173 --> 00:04:49,533 Speaker 4: and for me, it really comes down to where. 86 00:04:49,533 --> 00:04:50,693 Speaker 5: Artie Severe plays. 87 00:04:51,173 --> 00:04:51,373 Speaker 2: Now. 88 00:04:51,933 --> 00:04:54,773 Speaker 4: All indications were that Artie was going to move to 89 00:04:54,813 --> 00:04:58,373 Speaker 4: seven this year. The All Blacks were impressed by what 90 00:04:58,413 --> 00:05:02,813 Speaker 4: he did for Moana at seven. Wallace a Titi's preferred 91 00:05:02,813 --> 00:05:04,893 Speaker 4: position was eight. It was all set up for that 92 00:05:04,973 --> 00:05:07,493 Speaker 4: to happen. And now they're going to have to have 93 00:05:07,533 --> 00:05:11,493 Speaker 4: a rethink. Do they stick with Ardie seven or do 94 00:05:11,573 --> 00:05:13,973 Speaker 4: they just push that out a little bit and and 95 00:05:14,813 --> 00:05:17,773 Speaker 4: Plamer eight, where he has featured for the All Blacks 96 00:05:17,813 --> 00:05:20,533 Speaker 4: and the Hurricanes previously for what the best part of 97 00:05:20,653 --> 00:05:21,933 Speaker 4: two three years. 98 00:05:22,013 --> 00:05:23,653 Speaker 3: Well, I think we're down to a question of whether 99 00:05:23,693 --> 00:05:26,453 Speaker 3: you start Duplessy Kafi on deboo or whether you start 100 00:05:26,533 --> 00:05:30,973 Speaker 3: Christian Leo Willi on deboo' that's the option, and for me, 101 00:05:31,093 --> 00:05:34,453 Speaker 3: I almost think that having Artie back at seven would 102 00:05:34,493 --> 00:05:35,413 Speaker 3: be the preferred option. 103 00:05:35,853 --> 00:05:36,293 Speaker 2: This week. 104 00:05:36,373 --> 00:05:38,053 Speaker 3: I like the balance probably a little bit better of 105 00:05:38,093 --> 00:05:43,133 Speaker 3: female Savia Christian Leo Willi than I would female Kadifi Savia. 106 00:05:43,773 --> 00:05:46,613 Speaker 5: Well, female starts at six regardless. 107 00:05:45,973 --> 00:05:52,213 Speaker 3: As Lockton's unless then move to po II or Scott 108 00:05:52,213 --> 00:05:54,773 Speaker 3: Barrett to start at six, which was sort of mentioned 109 00:05:54,853 --> 00:05:58,253 Speaker 3: last week by Scott Robertson that they could are going 110 00:05:58,293 --> 00:06:00,773 Speaker 3: to have a couple of locks that will cover blindside. 111 00:06:00,813 --> 00:06:02,853 Speaker 3: Now two of them can two of them probably can't 112 00:06:02,853 --> 00:06:04,813 Speaker 3: tap a lot in holand being the ones that can't. 113 00:06:05,613 --> 00:06:07,773 Speaker 3: Is that an option this week or do you just 114 00:06:07,853 --> 00:06:10,493 Speaker 3: go with the loose forwards that you've selected in the squad. 115 00:06:11,093 --> 00:06:13,413 Speaker 4: I think it's it's a live option, but I think 116 00:06:13,413 --> 00:06:16,093 Speaker 4: it's probably something you look at in game or later 117 00:06:16,213 --> 00:06:18,813 Speaker 4: in the match, rather than a starting rather than getting 118 00:06:18,853 --> 00:06:21,413 Speaker 4: too cute. It's something that you go to, maybe out 119 00:06:21,413 --> 00:06:23,973 Speaker 4: of necessity if you had an injury later in the week. 120 00:06:24,013 --> 00:06:27,173 Speaker 4: We saw that previously with to provide starting at six 121 00:06:27,213 --> 00:06:31,533 Speaker 4: in the All Blacks lost to France at the World Cup. 122 00:06:32,573 --> 00:06:35,053 Speaker 4: But there is enough loose for cover in that All 123 00:06:35,053 --> 00:06:39,453 Speaker 4: Black squad, so I agree with you that it does 124 00:06:39,493 --> 00:06:42,893 Speaker 4: come down to where Ardi plays and whether they throw 125 00:06:42,973 --> 00:06:48,973 Speaker 4: Christianly aware straight in. I think they probably will. Personally, 126 00:06:49,213 --> 00:06:52,253 Speaker 4: I would put Arty to eight and give Duple C 127 00:06:52,453 --> 00:06:55,893 Speaker 4: the crack from the outset. I think he has earned it, 128 00:06:55,973 --> 00:07:01,293 Speaker 4: not that Weady hasn't, but Dup was firstly selected in 129 00:07:01,333 --> 00:07:07,173 Speaker 4: the squad. Leo Weirdy was injury cover, and I think 130 00:07:07,453 --> 00:07:10,533 Speaker 4: I would like to see grief he given an extended 131 00:07:10,573 --> 00:07:12,453 Speaker 4: crack at that seven jersey. 132 00:07:12,653 --> 00:07:13,973 Speaker 2: It looks so would I to an extent. 133 00:07:14,133 --> 00:07:16,373 Speaker 3: I don't know that the hierarchy of your selected first 134 00:07:16,493 --> 00:07:18,773 Speaker 3: kind of matters though, because they didn't select enough loose Fords. 135 00:07:18,813 --> 00:07:21,373 Speaker 3: I don't think in the first place they went one short, 136 00:07:21,613 --> 00:07:22,053 Speaker 3: they could have. 137 00:07:22,053 --> 00:07:24,893 Speaker 4: Slipkepd at thirty five players they sent left themselves exposed 138 00:07:24,893 --> 00:07:27,333 Speaker 4: by yeah, selecting five and Ethan. 139 00:07:27,013 --> 00:07:30,573 Speaker 3: Black At, according to Scott Robinson speaking to Jason Pine 140 00:07:30,613 --> 00:07:33,893 Speaker 3: on his show yesterday, has a medical issues so not 141 00:07:33,933 --> 00:07:36,853 Speaker 3: available for selection currently. He would have been in contention 142 00:07:37,013 --> 00:07:40,573 Speaker 3: potentially to come in with that Satiti injury, at least 143 00:07:40,653 --> 00:07:44,573 Speaker 3: his injury cover, which is what Dalton Papaliti's role is 144 00:07:44,773 --> 00:07:47,653 Speaker 3: at the moment. But they've left themselves a little bit 145 00:07:47,653 --> 00:07:50,253 Speaker 3: short there, and maybe if Simon Parker was fit, they 146 00:07:50,293 --> 00:07:53,933 Speaker 3: might have also looked to blood him, but they have basically, 147 00:07:54,013 --> 00:07:56,413 Speaker 3: as I see it, two options this week. I think 148 00:07:56,453 --> 00:07:58,053 Speaker 3: you're going one way. I'm probably going the other. I 149 00:07:58,053 --> 00:07:59,733 Speaker 3: don't think there's a well they probably is a right 150 00:07:59,773 --> 00:08:02,933 Speaker 3: or wrong answer, but either way we're going to see 151 00:08:02,933 --> 00:08:05,173 Speaker 3: two new all Blacks in the loose Ford Mikes this weekend. 152 00:08:05,493 --> 00:08:07,933 Speaker 4: Well, it's a matter of whether Leah Whitt is on 153 00:08:07,933 --> 00:08:12,093 Speaker 4: the bench or Carefair, and I think whatever the case, 154 00:08:12,653 --> 00:08:15,973 Speaker 4: it is an exciting proposition, isn't it to see? The 155 00:08:16,053 --> 00:08:18,573 Speaker 4: loose forwards were always the most contentious element of the 156 00:08:18,613 --> 00:08:21,973 Speaker 4: squad from the outset. Now you've had it further injury setbacks. 157 00:08:22,333 --> 00:08:24,813 Speaker 4: Now there's going to be a couple of rookies thrust 158 00:08:24,853 --> 00:08:27,733 Speaker 4: into the mix, and it will be a bit of 159 00:08:27,773 --> 00:08:30,533 Speaker 4: an evolving picture as the seria goes on. But yeah, 160 00:08:30,533 --> 00:08:33,253 Speaker 4: as it stands, I'd leave Ardi at eight. I'll put 161 00:08:33,293 --> 00:08:38,173 Speaker 4: through Perceeed a seven and Summer Penny at six. But 162 00:08:38,253 --> 00:08:43,013 Speaker 4: there is less flexibility with your bench options as well 163 00:08:43,053 --> 00:08:47,013 Speaker 4: having those injuries, because you don't have a guy like 164 00:08:47,093 --> 00:08:49,373 Speaker 4: Ja Gibson, you don't have a guy likes tiqu both 165 00:08:49,453 --> 00:08:51,093 Speaker 4: of whom can play multiple positions. 166 00:08:51,413 --> 00:08:54,733 Speaker 5: What about Leo Weady? Would you consider him as a six? 167 00:08:54,973 --> 00:08:56,453 Speaker 3: I think he's played a bit of six before, hasn't 168 00:08:56,493 --> 00:08:58,733 Speaker 3: he for a Tigo? I'm not sure about the Crusaders. 169 00:08:58,773 --> 00:09:02,573 Speaker 3: Off the top of my head, I think there would 170 00:09:02,573 --> 00:09:05,973 Speaker 3: be the less than ideal scenario, and given you've got 171 00:09:06,053 --> 00:09:09,333 Speaker 3: also to provide in the twenty three, you would think 172 00:09:10,413 --> 00:09:12,813 Speaker 3: he could potentially cover that blind side, so I wouldn't 173 00:09:12,853 --> 00:09:15,293 Speaker 3: necessarily want to see him there at six. At test level, 174 00:09:15,333 --> 00:09:18,373 Speaker 3: he hasn't played a lot of it, but it's probably 175 00:09:18,413 --> 00:09:20,533 Speaker 3: if you had a couple of injuries, you could probably 176 00:09:20,653 --> 00:09:21,213 Speaker 3: slote in there. 177 00:09:21,573 --> 00:09:21,773 Speaker 5: Yeah. 178 00:09:21,813 --> 00:09:24,653 Speaker 4: So while there'll be a lot of focus on seven 179 00:09:24,693 --> 00:09:29,573 Speaker 4: and eight, whether it's Ardi Carrefi or Leo Werdi, this 180 00:09:29,853 --> 00:09:35,373 Speaker 4: series is really set up for female. Jacobson will return 181 00:09:35,453 --> 00:09:39,173 Speaker 4: and will likely get a crack, but female has not 182 00:09:39,333 --> 00:09:42,933 Speaker 4: convinced at test level. The All Blacks partly selected him 183 00:09:42,933 --> 00:09:45,973 Speaker 4: because they felt like he was really ready to go 184 00:09:46,253 --> 00:09:49,733 Speaker 4: before that French the loss to France and Paris last year, 185 00:09:49,813 --> 00:09:51,973 Speaker 4: and he got knocked down in the first minute or 186 00:09:52,053 --> 00:09:55,653 Speaker 4: so when luck I came on, Luckeye came on, and 187 00:09:55,813 --> 00:10:00,013 Speaker 4: so they've invested a lot in him and he hasn't 188 00:10:00,573 --> 00:10:03,213 Speaker 4: repaid that faith yet and he needs too soon. 189 00:10:03,373 --> 00:10:06,093 Speaker 3: Well, he's the prototype that they want, and in selecting 190 00:10:06,173 --> 00:10:08,133 Speaker 3: him of a black Adder, they've gone, this is the 191 00:10:08,173 --> 00:10:11,093 Speaker 3: kind kind of player that we want, a player that 192 00:10:11,773 --> 00:10:14,653 Speaker 3: gets over the game line, that has will post contact 193 00:10:14,733 --> 00:10:20,933 Speaker 3: meters than Blackadder is involved in that intangible of explosiveness. 194 00:10:20,973 --> 00:10:23,293 Speaker 2: But he has that explosiveness a genue about him. 195 00:10:23,413 --> 00:10:24,493 Speaker 5: Line out figure. 196 00:10:24,373 --> 00:10:27,333 Speaker 3: Exactly, but a threat with ball and hands and black 197 00:10:27,373 --> 00:10:31,173 Speaker 3: added simply isn't that he busted and put a number 198 00:10:31,173 --> 00:10:33,253 Speaker 3: of tackles in. We saw that in the super ruggy Plovs. 199 00:10:33,293 --> 00:10:36,413 Speaker 3: I think, what thirty against the Blues and another big 200 00:10:36,493 --> 00:10:38,813 Speaker 3: shifter against the Chiefs in the final. But that's not 201 00:10:38,893 --> 00:10:41,093 Speaker 3: what they're looking for at the moment. So they've gone 202 00:10:41,133 --> 00:10:42,933 Speaker 3: with the prototype. This is the body, this is the 203 00:10:43,053 --> 00:10:45,533 Speaker 3: kind of player that we want. Now they need the 204 00:10:45,573 --> 00:10:48,493 Speaker 3: player to match up. Will they get it in this 205 00:10:48,573 --> 00:10:50,493 Speaker 3: French series? They kind of have to. They've invested a 206 00:10:50,533 --> 00:10:50,933 Speaker 3: lot in them. 207 00:10:51,093 --> 00:10:53,933 Speaker 4: They have and while this is a seconds very much 208 00:10:53,973 --> 00:10:57,733 Speaker 4: a second string French side, we are going to find 209 00:10:57,773 --> 00:11:00,813 Speaker 4: out about female because it will be a big French 210 00:11:00,933 --> 00:11:06,133 Speaker 4: pack that that's a non negotiables that's how they approach it. 211 00:11:06,573 --> 00:11:10,493 Speaker 4: The other big thing with female discipline. He had some 212 00:11:10,573 --> 00:11:14,493 Speaker 4: issues with the Chiefs this season. In the final series 213 00:11:15,093 --> 00:11:16,853 Speaker 4: he got pinged a couple of times. I think it 214 00:11:16,933 --> 00:11:17,573 Speaker 4: was against the Blue. 215 00:11:17,613 --> 00:11:18,653 Speaker 2: Well, he was awful in that Blue. 216 00:11:18,733 --> 00:11:20,293 Speaker 3: His last the last twenty five minutes of the Blue 217 00:11:20,293 --> 00:11:22,453 Speaker 3: I think considered four or five penalties. 218 00:11:22,213 --> 00:11:25,653 Speaker 4: And his penchant for hunting and smashing first fives is great, 219 00:11:25,733 --> 00:11:29,333 Speaker 4: but he very much borders on the line of the 220 00:11:29,413 --> 00:11:34,973 Speaker 4: law with tackle heights and timing. So he needs to 221 00:11:35,053 --> 00:11:37,733 Speaker 4: get that discipline right because there's a real bugbear of 222 00:11:37,933 --> 00:11:40,693 Speaker 4: Scott Robertson as well, and it can cost you test matchic. 223 00:11:40,773 --> 00:11:43,893 Speaker 2: It can and it's not definitely ruled it test well. 224 00:11:43,973 --> 00:11:45,893 Speaker 3: It is definitely ruled at Test level, but that's something 225 00:11:45,893 --> 00:11:47,453 Speaker 3: they watched for at Test level a lot more than 226 00:11:47,493 --> 00:11:49,893 Speaker 3: maybe at Super rugby level. The margins are so thin. 227 00:11:50,253 --> 00:11:52,533 Speaker 3: You give something that's going to be flagged up to 228 00:11:52,573 --> 00:11:54,573 Speaker 3: the TMO, that's red rag to a bull. The TMO 229 00:11:54,693 --> 00:11:57,333 Speaker 3: loves getting involved, they love getting their paycheck out. You 230 00:11:57,413 --> 00:11:58,973 Speaker 3: can't do that at Test level. So he's going to 231 00:11:59,053 --> 00:12:02,053 Speaker 3: have to be right on this week. Let's go through 232 00:12:02,053 --> 00:12:03,853 Speaker 3: the rest of the run on side then, because we've 233 00:12:03,893 --> 00:12:09,653 Speaker 3: talked about the loose fords the front row nowree Taylor Lomax, 234 00:12:09,733 --> 00:12:13,053 Speaker 3: is that perck itself? Yep, same with the locks. So 235 00:12:13,733 --> 00:12:17,653 Speaker 3: let's say Barrett and to provide yeah, okay, we'll skip 236 00:12:17,693 --> 00:12:20,693 Speaker 3: over the loose forwards regard and Barrett nine and ten. 237 00:12:20,973 --> 00:12:24,253 Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't think it's interesting, isn't it that there 238 00:12:24,293 --> 00:12:28,053 Speaker 4: seems to be a bit of a push to generate 239 00:12:28,173 --> 00:12:30,653 Speaker 4: debate about who starts at ten. For me, I don't 240 00:12:30,653 --> 00:12:32,933 Speaker 4: think there's really a question. I don't think there is 241 00:12:32,973 --> 00:12:34,813 Speaker 4: either that question was answered. 242 00:12:34,853 --> 00:12:37,173 Speaker 3: I know Mackenzie had a great testing in Siland last year, 243 00:12:37,733 --> 00:12:40,013 Speaker 3: but if you look at where they ended the year, 244 00:12:41,653 --> 00:12:43,893 Speaker 3: they ended with Boten Bart as their first choice ten. 245 00:12:44,253 --> 00:12:45,693 Speaker 5: And what happened in Super Agbi. 246 00:12:45,933 --> 00:12:51,213 Speaker 4: There was Mackenzie his moments this season, and I think 247 00:12:51,293 --> 00:12:56,853 Speaker 4: he's a more dynamic attacking prospect. Yeah, he really can 248 00:12:57,413 --> 00:13:01,373 Speaker 4: spark a team, but there were some big question marks 249 00:13:01,453 --> 00:13:04,733 Speaker 4: and big games towards the end of the season about 250 00:13:05,253 --> 00:13:09,573 Speaker 4: his ability to imprint himself on the game or game 251 00:13:09,653 --> 00:13:12,973 Speaker 4: manage that that sort of tag still hangs over his head, 252 00:13:12,973 --> 00:13:13,293 Speaker 4: doesn't it. 253 00:13:13,453 --> 00:13:17,253 Speaker 3: It does wings, Caleb Clark, Sevy Reese. That's probably where 254 00:13:17,253 --> 00:13:17,893 Speaker 3: I'm looking at. 255 00:13:18,413 --> 00:13:20,893 Speaker 4: I think so, and I think that we obviously will 256 00:13:21,013 --> 00:13:24,733 Speaker 4: see change there, and I think we will see whether 257 00:13:24,773 --> 00:13:29,093 Speaker 4: it's in a starting or positional shift later in a match. 258 00:13:29,373 --> 00:13:33,133 Speaker 4: Guys like Riquowhani will play spend time on the wing, 259 00:13:33,533 --> 00:13:36,773 Speaker 4: and Ruben Love. I think we will see those guys 260 00:13:36,853 --> 00:13:40,973 Speaker 4: feature there, but I think for a first test all 261 00:13:41,013 --> 00:13:44,133 Speaker 4: Blacks teams generally pretty scratchy to start the year. You're 262 00:13:44,173 --> 00:13:48,733 Speaker 4: bringing different super rugby teams together. Last year, with the 263 00:13:48,773 --> 00:13:52,773 Speaker 4: All Blacks so much change with a complete coaching overhaul, 264 00:13:53,253 --> 00:13:57,333 Speaker 4: the All Blacks were guilty of overloading and they really 265 00:13:57,373 --> 00:13:59,933 Speaker 4: struggled to come together for the first two weeks against England. 266 00:14:00,013 --> 00:14:02,333 Speaker 4: So I think what we'll see the general theme will 267 00:14:02,373 --> 00:14:06,493 Speaker 4: be cohesion and established combinations, and then you'll see some 268 00:14:06,653 --> 00:14:08,133 Speaker 4: changes throughout the series. 269 00:14:08,653 --> 00:14:12,213 Speaker 3: Fall back and then Barrett Jordy that is, and Yuanni 270 00:14:12,253 --> 00:14:14,933 Speaker 3: and midfield. There's been a few whispers around that maybe 271 00:14:14,973 --> 00:14:17,613 Speaker 3: Procter might be the guy to start this week. I 272 00:14:17,693 --> 00:14:22,413 Speaker 3: guess we'll find out Thursday. Would that surprise you whispers? 273 00:14:22,453 --> 00:14:24,373 Speaker 4: I mean nothing to back it up. You know, people 274 00:14:24,453 --> 00:14:29,173 Speaker 4: throw things out and it wouldn't surprise me because Jordie 275 00:14:29,253 --> 00:14:33,453 Speaker 4: and Billy have an established combination. But it would surprise 276 00:14:33,573 --> 00:14:35,253 Speaker 4: me because it's the first test of the year. I 277 00:14:36,173 --> 00:14:38,213 Speaker 4: think the penny has dropped with the All Blacks that 278 00:14:38,293 --> 00:14:41,373 Speaker 4: they need to invest in Procter, give them more game time. 279 00:14:41,853 --> 00:14:45,133 Speaker 4: Didn't use them in the Rugby Championship last year. That 280 00:14:45,333 --> 00:14:48,653 Speaker 4: was a massive oversight, and so we will see him 281 00:14:48,733 --> 00:14:51,653 Speaker 4: start at thirteen in this series, but I do not 282 00:14:51,813 --> 00:14:55,773 Speaker 4: expect it to be this first test the bench Tokyojo. 283 00:14:55,973 --> 00:15:02,373 Speaker 3: You would suspect Norris will come in tight head, reserved, 284 00:15:02,453 --> 00:15:10,733 Speaker 3: tight head, would think the loose forward that we talked 285 00:15:10,733 --> 00:15:11,293 Speaker 3: about a bit. 286 00:15:11,213 --> 00:15:16,853 Speaker 4: Earlier McKenzie, and then maybe maybe a Proctor or a 287 00:15:16,933 --> 00:15:17,493 Speaker 4: Lenna Brown. 288 00:15:18,173 --> 00:15:21,813 Speaker 3: Yeah, with Lennet Brown's fit was the question, I suppose, 289 00:15:22,413 --> 00:15:24,653 Speaker 3: and Procton, who really covers center, doesn't give you a 290 00:15:24,693 --> 00:15:27,573 Speaker 3: lot of versatility and the outside backs, and that's probably 291 00:15:27,773 --> 00:15:29,733 Speaker 3: we got unstuck a little bit in terms of game 292 00:15:29,773 --> 00:15:31,253 Speaker 3: time last year, is that he can only cover that 293 00:15:31,293 --> 00:15:34,653 Speaker 3: one position. Interesting to see where they go. 294 00:15:35,173 --> 00:15:37,253 Speaker 4: Yeah, you're right, Lennard Brown does give you a lot 295 00:15:37,293 --> 00:15:40,093 Speaker 4: more versatility. I was thinking across that back line, you 296 00:15:40,173 --> 00:15:44,053 Speaker 4: don't really have another second five eight option. If Jeordie 297 00:15:44,093 --> 00:15:45,893 Speaker 4: went down, your had belly on the on the bench. 298 00:15:46,493 --> 00:15:48,293 Speaker 3: So would it open the door for a top of 299 00:15:48,333 --> 00:15:49,973 Speaker 3: tab of Nawai potentially to come off the bench for 300 00:15:49,973 --> 00:15:50,413 Speaker 3: a debut. 301 00:15:50,853 --> 00:15:53,573 Speaker 5: Not yet, I think maybe third test for a tub 302 00:15:53,613 --> 00:15:54,253 Speaker 5: of toab naha. 303 00:15:54,413 --> 00:15:57,373 Speaker 3: Okay, all right, A couple of other things just on 304 00:15:57,493 --> 00:15:59,653 Speaker 3: that obviously we mentioned to Mighty Williams out at the top. 305 00:16:00,573 --> 00:16:02,653 Speaker 3: This is becoming a wee bit of a tradition, all 306 00:16:02,733 --> 00:16:06,333 Speaker 3: Blacks players fighting through injury to play a Super Rugby 307 00:16:06,373 --> 00:16:08,773 Speaker 3: final then being out for an extended peer. You think 308 00:16:08,813 --> 00:16:11,613 Speaker 3: Sam Whitelocke in twenty twenty three against the Chiefs played 309 00:16:11,613 --> 00:16:13,893 Speaker 3: eighty minutes on I think it was leg injury again 310 00:16:14,773 --> 00:16:17,173 Speaker 3: and said Kelly's, Kelly's. He said to me after the 311 00:16:17,253 --> 00:16:19,333 Speaker 3: game that the Blacks coaches won't be happy. I don't 312 00:16:19,333 --> 00:16:22,213 Speaker 3: think they were having ready in Foster's book and talked 313 00:16:22,213 --> 00:16:23,853 Speaker 3: to him at the time about it. He missed I 314 00:16:23,893 --> 00:16:25,733 Speaker 3: think the first two tests of that World Cup year. 315 00:16:26,213 --> 00:16:28,813 Speaker 3: Patrick Toyp a lot too slightly different, was expected to 316 00:16:28,853 --> 00:16:32,293 Speaker 3: be out until midway through the All Blacks July series, 317 00:16:32,333 --> 00:16:35,333 Speaker 3: came back early, played in July, but then was ruled 318 00:16:35,333 --> 00:16:37,053 Speaker 3: out with a calf injury a bit later on. They 319 00:16:38,453 --> 00:16:41,373 Speaker 3: excuse me, And now to mighty Williams with that knee 320 00:16:41,373 --> 00:16:43,933 Speaker 3: injury that when knew were back quarter finally played semi 321 00:16:44,013 --> 00:16:47,213 Speaker 3: final from Rey didn't finally played. Now he's out for 322 00:16:47,733 --> 00:16:50,053 Speaker 3: six to eight weeks. Acording to Scott Robertson, it's an 323 00:16:50,053 --> 00:16:50,973 Speaker 3: annual tradition. 324 00:16:51,093 --> 00:16:53,213 Speaker 5: Now there's some real iron, isn't it. 325 00:16:53,293 --> 00:16:58,213 Speaker 4: That Scott Robinson's up today and he's been questioned about 326 00:16:58,253 --> 00:17:00,413 Speaker 4: whether to Mighty Williams should have played in the Super 327 00:17:00,493 --> 00:17:04,213 Speaker 4: ABI final and you can sense the anks there now 328 00:17:04,333 --> 00:17:07,813 Speaker 4: he's all Black coage, but the shoe was on the 329 00:17:07,853 --> 00:17:10,373 Speaker 4: other foot in a big way when he was lording 330 00:17:10,453 --> 00:17:14,613 Speaker 4: Sam Whitelock as a godlike immortal for playing eighty minutes 331 00:17:14,653 --> 00:17:17,693 Speaker 4: on Achilles. That's hanging on by a three in twenty 332 00:17:17,773 --> 00:17:18,173 Speaker 4: twenty three. 333 00:17:18,253 --> 00:17:20,973 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's funny how perspectives changed very very quickly given 334 00:17:21,133 --> 00:17:23,853 Speaker 3: that all Black's job. And you just do not want 335 00:17:23,893 --> 00:17:26,373 Speaker 3: to see players engine or push themselves in Super Rugby 336 00:17:26,453 --> 00:17:27,173 Speaker 3: beyond their limits. 337 00:17:27,333 --> 00:17:27,973 Speaker 5: That's a right look. 338 00:17:29,253 --> 00:17:31,093 Speaker 4: Scarbb has made the point that players want to play 339 00:17:31,893 --> 00:17:37,693 Speaker 4: and I can completely understand that if you have invested 340 00:17:37,813 --> 00:17:40,653 Speaker 4: yourself in a Super Rugby campaign, if you're on the 341 00:17:40,733 --> 00:17:43,333 Speaker 4: cusp and it's a one off game final, of course 342 00:17:43,413 --> 00:17:45,293 Speaker 4: you want to give everything you can to try and 343 00:17:45,653 --> 00:17:48,973 Speaker 4: win a championship for your team. But there is a 344 00:17:49,053 --> 00:17:52,973 Speaker 4: natural conflict that exists there where Tamaty Williams is now 345 00:17:53,053 --> 00:17:55,813 Speaker 4: unavailable for six to eight weeks, is to have surgery 346 00:17:55,893 --> 00:18:00,053 Speaker 4: on that knee, and maybe that wouldn't have been the case. 347 00:18:00,253 --> 00:18:02,653 Speaker 4: Maybe it would have healed without surgery. If he doesn't 348 00:18:02,653 --> 00:18:06,453 Speaker 4: play the final, the All Blacks have some depth there. 349 00:18:06,973 --> 00:18:10,613 Speaker 4: Sam Whitelock's absence wasn't terminal for the All Blacks, but 350 00:18:10,733 --> 00:18:13,653 Speaker 4: there's a question, I guess, of what takes priority, and 351 00:18:14,213 --> 00:18:17,213 Speaker 4: that there is a very real conflict that exists that 352 00:18:17,213 --> 00:18:19,933 Speaker 4: the All Blacks don't have jurisdiction to say you're not playing. 353 00:18:20,253 --> 00:18:23,773 Speaker 4: We should they but they would bloody well. I'd love to, yeah, 354 00:18:23,813 --> 00:18:26,093 Speaker 4: but I don't think they should. And you know, you're 355 00:18:26,093 --> 00:18:27,093 Speaker 4: got to play what's in front of you. 356 00:18:27,133 --> 00:18:28,853 Speaker 3: You can only play if you want to play a 357 00:18:28,893 --> 00:18:31,253 Speaker 3: Super Rugby final and you think you're fit to play 358 00:18:32,053 --> 00:18:33,613 Speaker 3: and you can push yourself through it. Then I think 359 00:18:33,693 --> 00:18:35,133 Speaker 3: I've got no problem with them playing. And if that 360 00:18:35,173 --> 00:18:36,813 Speaker 3: comes at the expense of them missing the All Blacks, 361 00:18:36,853 --> 00:18:39,573 Speaker 3: then good. We've sat too long where the best players 362 00:18:39,573 --> 00:18:42,493 Speaker 3: aren't playing Super Rugby and I have kept themselves either 363 00:18:42,613 --> 00:18:45,333 Speaker 3: medically fresh for the season or you know, in terms 364 00:18:45,373 --> 00:18:48,013 Speaker 3: of reaching the bar of what they're capable of on 365 00:18:48,133 --> 00:18:50,613 Speaker 3: the park, you know, until later in the Super Rugby season. 366 00:18:50,893 --> 00:18:52,573 Speaker 3: I think it's good that we've got players putting Super 367 00:18:52,613 --> 00:18:55,453 Speaker 3: Rugby ahead of international rugby because for so long it's 368 00:18:55,493 --> 00:18:58,853 Speaker 3: been prioritized international rugby. Rest in rotation got to say 369 00:18:58,893 --> 00:19:00,453 Speaker 3: that games. I've got no issue with it. 370 00:19:00,773 --> 00:19:03,973 Speaker 4: I agree, but I'll throw a question at you. Do 371 00:19:04,133 --> 00:19:07,373 Speaker 4: the Crusaders win that Super Rugby title if George Bauer 372 00:19:07,413 --> 00:19:09,293 Speaker 4: starts well. 373 00:19:09,213 --> 00:19:10,893 Speaker 2: To Mighty Williams was a minse in that final. 374 00:19:11,773 --> 00:19:14,093 Speaker 3: Jorde Bow's a handy replacement and he's come obviously the 375 00:19:14,133 --> 00:19:19,773 Speaker 3: All Black squad, I think they probably still do. Fletcher 376 00:19:19,853 --> 00:19:21,893 Speaker 3: Neul was huge on the other side. It sounds like 377 00:19:21,933 --> 00:19:25,093 Speaker 3: he's good to go with spite also playing through an 378 00:19:25,173 --> 00:19:26,933 Speaker 3: injury on the other side of the scrums he had 379 00:19:26,973 --> 00:19:28,413 Speaker 3: two injured props. 380 00:19:29,493 --> 00:19:31,613 Speaker 2: Deal to the Chiefs on that night. They probably still wouldn't. 381 00:19:31,973 --> 00:19:34,053 Speaker 4: It'd be an interesting question to ask to Mighty as well, 382 00:19:35,333 --> 00:19:37,853 Speaker 4: would you do it again knowing that you will miss 383 00:19:38,653 --> 00:19:40,693 Speaker 4: at least three tests for the All Blacks. 384 00:19:40,693 --> 00:19:42,693 Speaker 3: And go back a couple of years. You know, Sam 385 00:19:42,733 --> 00:19:45,373 Speaker 3: Whitelocke that was his last Crusader's game that one. 386 00:19:45,333 --> 00:19:47,493 Speaker 5: So he was important context. 387 00:19:48,453 --> 00:19:50,253 Speaker 3: You know, it was a final and everything like that. 388 00:19:50,453 --> 00:19:52,893 Speaker 3: If it was a round fifteen game and they're out 389 00:19:52,893 --> 00:19:57,013 Speaker 3: of the playoffs. Probably doesn't play it. Yeah, it was 390 00:19:57,053 --> 00:20:00,333 Speaker 3: more the irony today totally. Yeah, And as I say, 391 00:20:00,333 --> 00:20:03,213 Speaker 3: I just read about that chapter in Ian Foster's book 392 00:20:03,213 --> 00:20:05,493 Speaker 3: where it was it was brought up and obviously his 393 00:20:05,653 --> 00:20:08,573 Speaker 3: frustrations as you would have as the All Blacks. Which 394 00:20:09,653 --> 00:20:13,533 Speaker 3: what do we expect from the French this week? It's 395 00:20:13,573 --> 00:20:15,733 Speaker 3: going to be interesting old week. I have seen a 396 00:20:15,813 --> 00:20:20,973 Speaker 3: lot of theories around their team. Sounds like they'll probably 397 00:20:21,013 --> 00:20:23,373 Speaker 3: be an average of about maybe a total of eighty 398 00:20:23,453 --> 00:20:26,493 Speaker 3: two caps in the pack is what I've heard, so 399 00:20:26,533 --> 00:20:29,093 Speaker 3: average about ten caps you know in the pack per player. 400 00:20:30,213 --> 00:20:32,773 Speaker 3: Gl Fku in the back line is probably going to 401 00:20:32,813 --> 00:20:35,693 Speaker 3: contribute about ninety five caps himself roughly off the top 402 00:20:35,693 --> 00:20:37,773 Speaker 3: of my head. There's some players that New Zealanders may 403 00:20:37,773 --> 00:20:40,373 Speaker 3: have heard of in passing and that have been here before, 404 00:20:40,453 --> 00:20:42,253 Speaker 3: all played the All Blacks prior. 405 00:20:42,853 --> 00:20:44,733 Speaker 2: But it's a green French team, isn't it. 406 00:20:45,493 --> 00:20:47,213 Speaker 4: Look let's not get away from the fact that this 407 00:20:47,373 --> 00:20:50,293 Speaker 4: is a second during French team and that's not disrespectful. 408 00:20:50,893 --> 00:20:51,773 Speaker 5: That is fact. 409 00:20:51,973 --> 00:20:54,733 Speaker 3: Well, if the All Blacks had not seen players in 410 00:20:54,773 --> 00:20:57,973 Speaker 3: the Crusaders and Chiefs, you know into the series and 411 00:20:58,293 --> 00:20:59,573 Speaker 3: said I actually will come in for the second. 412 00:20:59,933 --> 00:21:01,133 Speaker 2: Then we would be saying the same thing. 413 00:21:01,213 --> 00:21:04,133 Speaker 4: Yeahred percent. And it's just a few facts. I guess 414 00:21:04,213 --> 00:21:06,013 Speaker 4: that the average age of the squad, there's a thirty 415 00:21:06,053 --> 00:21:09,973 Speaker 4: eight man squad the French twenty five years. The average 416 00:21:10,053 --> 00:21:13,973 Speaker 4: number of caps is nine eighteen. Of the thirty man 417 00:21:14,053 --> 00:21:21,893 Speaker 4: squad almost half uncapped. Of players with eighteen caps or more, 418 00:21:21,893 --> 00:21:26,533 Speaker 4: there's only six of them, and so it's very green. 419 00:21:26,653 --> 00:21:29,733 Speaker 4: And that's not to say that the French haven't built depth, 420 00:21:29,773 --> 00:21:32,973 Speaker 4: that they don't have talents, that they don't have experience 421 00:21:33,053 --> 00:21:35,893 Speaker 4: winning in the Southern hemisphere, that they could not cause 422 00:21:35,933 --> 00:21:38,933 Speaker 4: an upset. But this is not the best of the best. 423 00:21:39,613 --> 00:21:44,053 Speaker 4: But it is interesting because the All Blacks are very 424 00:21:44,133 --> 00:21:47,373 Speaker 4: on edge about the narrative that this is a b 425 00:21:47,533 --> 00:21:52,093 Speaker 4: French team, that they're gonna have their backs to the wall, 426 00:21:52,133 --> 00:21:57,053 Speaker 4: they've got nothing to lose, and that's somehow the media 427 00:21:57,213 --> 00:22:01,213 Speaker 4: is sort of complicit in fueling that narrative and giving 428 00:22:01,293 --> 00:22:03,133 Speaker 4: them another arm to grow. 429 00:22:03,693 --> 00:22:06,253 Speaker 3: So I think our colleagues at the breakdown last night 430 00:22:06,293 --> 00:22:08,693 Speaker 3: company the exact where they use was a disgraceful or 431 00:22:09,853 --> 00:22:13,493 Speaker 3: shambola around the lack of selection around that. 432 00:22:13,613 --> 00:22:14,453 Speaker 2: Do you subscribe to that? 433 00:22:15,773 --> 00:22:18,333 Speaker 5: I think I think it's insulting to. 434 00:22:20,173 --> 00:22:25,493 Speaker 4: Use you to international rugby and and the the concept 435 00:22:25,613 --> 00:22:32,333 Speaker 4: that of nationalism of yeah, let's the reverse. So the 436 00:22:32,373 --> 00:22:34,853 Speaker 4: All Black scot front Paris last year and rolled out 437 00:22:34,893 --> 00:22:39,573 Speaker 4: a second string team. They get beaten, well beaten. That 438 00:22:39,733 --> 00:22:42,933 Speaker 4: damages their brands. But I think the other point is 439 00:22:43,053 --> 00:22:46,413 Speaker 4: this is nothing new for France. They have not not 440 00:22:46,813 --> 00:22:52,733 Speaker 4: invested in this test calendar in terms of the July 441 00:22:52,893 --> 00:22:54,693 Speaker 4: window for some time. It was the same when they 442 00:22:54,693 --> 00:22:58,893 Speaker 4: went to Argentina last year, and there is a clear 443 00:22:58,973 --> 00:23:01,493 Speaker 4: reason for that, and that's because their their top fourteen 444 00:23:01,733 --> 00:23:05,413 Speaker 4: runs so long. The clubs run their their game is 445 00:23:05,893 --> 00:23:11,493 Speaker 4: extremely well supported. You know the scenes from Toulouse, We've 446 00:23:11,573 --> 00:23:15,973 Speaker 4: been there. It's a passionate rugby town that takes priority 447 00:23:16,333 --> 00:23:20,533 Speaker 4: at this summer year. And so the five players from 448 00:23:21,413 --> 00:23:24,173 Speaker 4: that final are meant to be coming out later in 449 00:23:24,213 --> 00:23:27,133 Speaker 4: this series. But it is a great shame, isn't it. 450 00:23:27,453 --> 00:23:30,373 Speaker 4: It takes the wind out of the series. Yeah, the 451 00:23:30,453 --> 00:23:32,773 Speaker 4: game in d Eden's still sold out, so there's massive 452 00:23:32,853 --> 00:23:37,173 Speaker 4: interest in the All Blacks. But I think it doesn't 453 00:23:37,253 --> 00:23:40,293 Speaker 4: change the expectation that the All Blacks will be expected 454 00:23:40,333 --> 00:23:44,013 Speaker 4: to win three nil and win reasonably comfortably when the 455 00:23:44,573 --> 00:23:46,853 Speaker 4: All Blecks have lost their last three tests to Fronts 456 00:23:47,413 --> 00:23:49,413 Speaker 4: and twenty eighteen was the last time they beat them, 457 00:23:49,933 --> 00:23:52,613 Speaker 4: and that was in a similar window. It was June, 458 00:23:53,693 --> 00:23:55,893 Speaker 4: but it was the same sort of concept and they 459 00:23:55,933 --> 00:23:59,973 Speaker 4: won very comfortably. So that that's the sort of expectation 460 00:24:00,133 --> 00:24:02,453 Speaker 4: that's around the series and that's why Scott Robinson and 461 00:24:02,453 --> 00:24:03,173 Speaker 4: the All Blacks are nervous. 462 00:24:03,213 --> 00:24:05,493 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a dangerous expectation to set when you're expected 463 00:24:05,533 --> 00:24:07,493 Speaker 3: to win, as the All Blacks are every time they 464 00:24:07,533 --> 00:24:09,413 Speaker 3: go in the park, but when it's the opposition that's 465 00:24:10,613 --> 00:24:15,893 Speaker 3: a little creaky. I guess there are issues around that. 466 00:24:16,213 --> 00:24:17,653 Speaker 3: This is a French thing that not a lot of 467 00:24:17,653 --> 00:24:19,773 Speaker 3: play people would know about. We know the big names 468 00:24:20,293 --> 00:24:22,053 Speaker 3: French Stop fourteen is not on TV here, we're not 469 00:24:22,133 --> 00:24:24,053 Speaker 3: exposed to it, so there is a real sense of 470 00:24:24,093 --> 00:24:27,253 Speaker 3: the unknown this week. But for the French it's a 471 00:24:27,333 --> 00:24:29,533 Speaker 3: chance to blood a lot of players. They've got tremendous 472 00:24:29,533 --> 00:24:31,533 Speaker 3: depth as it is, they's only going to grow two 473 00:24:31,613 --> 00:24:32,573 Speaker 3: years out from the World Cup. 474 00:24:33,093 --> 00:24:36,093 Speaker 4: Yeah, and there's also no more excuses for the All 475 00:24:36,133 --> 00:24:37,973 Speaker 4: Blacks like yes, coming into July, there are a wee 476 00:24:38,053 --> 00:24:40,733 Speaker 4: bit scratchy, But this is a coaching group that has 477 00:24:40,813 --> 00:24:43,013 Speaker 4: been together largely for the best part of a year. 478 00:24:43,453 --> 00:24:47,053 Speaker 4: They've developed a lot of these combinations well established. Now 479 00:24:47,613 --> 00:24:49,653 Speaker 4: they should be on the same page. They don't have to, 480 00:24:50,893 --> 00:24:53,053 Speaker 4: you know, it's not starting afresh like it was last 481 00:24:53,173 --> 00:24:55,773 Speaker 4: year's They've had the best part of six months to 482 00:24:55,893 --> 00:24:59,453 Speaker 4: review last year and absorb the lessons and map out 483 00:24:59,493 --> 00:25:02,853 Speaker 4: how they want to play their games. So I think 484 00:25:03,533 --> 00:25:06,253 Speaker 4: the expectation on the All Blacks is fully justified. 485 00:25:06,573 --> 00:25:07,213 Speaker 2: I think so too. 486 00:25:07,573 --> 00:25:10,733 Speaker 3: All Blacks team around lunchtime on Thursday, the French naming 487 00:25:10,773 --> 00:25:14,093 Speaker 3: their team Wednesday nights. I believe you can follow it 488 00:25:14,493 --> 00:25:16,733 Speaker 3: on Inzi Herald, Doctor Inzy and all the lattice news 489 00:25:16,813 --> 00:25:18,973 Speaker 3: on News Talks inb as well. We'll take a break 490 00:25:19,093 --> 00:25:21,413 Speaker 3: here on Rugby Direct with Habit Health, then come back 491 00:25:21,453 --> 00:25:22,493 Speaker 3: with the second half after this. 492 00:25:23,373 --> 00:25:27,813 Speaker 1: This is Rugby Direct, a podcast for real rugby fares. 493 00:25:30,173 --> 00:25:33,893 Speaker 2: Every try try and sixty second every tackle tackles. 494 00:25:33,933 --> 00:25:34,773 Speaker 1: Get up again. 495 00:25:37,973 --> 00:25:43,213 Speaker 2: Before I'm not it's Rugby Direct. You're back with Rugby Direct. 496 00:25:43,253 --> 00:25:45,573 Speaker 3: I'm now for the final four four Rugby topics plenty 497 00:25:45,613 --> 00:25:48,213 Speaker 3: to get stuck into The Lions open the Ossie part 498 00:25:48,253 --> 00:25:51,493 Speaker 3: of their tour against the Western Force with a big 499 00:25:51,613 --> 00:25:55,573 Speaker 3: win fifty four points to seven. She was fairly comfortable 500 00:25:56,013 --> 00:25:58,053 Speaker 3: in the second spell. They just ran over the top 501 00:25:58,093 --> 00:25:59,973 Speaker 3: of a Force team they hadn't played in a few weeks. 502 00:26:00,213 --> 00:26:03,853 Speaker 3: We're missing a few people in the Wallabies about what 503 00:26:04,413 --> 00:26:06,093 Speaker 3: we probably expected out of that game. 504 00:26:06,613 --> 00:26:06,893 Speaker 2: It is. 505 00:26:07,013 --> 00:26:12,293 Speaker 4: Yeah, the Force were Australia's worst team and like you say, 506 00:26:12,373 --> 00:26:15,973 Speaker 4: missing their best players. So it's a tune up match 507 00:26:16,053 --> 00:26:18,853 Speaker 4: for the Lions. It's not their full strength team. And 508 00:26:19,613 --> 00:26:21,533 Speaker 4: I looked at some of the stats even in their 509 00:26:21,613 --> 00:26:25,253 Speaker 4: loss to the Pumas and that Lion's team they made 510 00:26:26,453 --> 00:26:29,693 Speaker 4: so many more line breakspak so many more defenders. 511 00:26:29,853 --> 00:26:34,613 Speaker 5: So this is a really good Lions team, it is. 512 00:26:35,413 --> 00:26:37,173 Speaker 3: I think I'd be worried about the miss tackle stat 513 00:26:37,253 --> 00:26:40,693 Speaker 3: from the weekend. I think it was and I don't 514 00:26:40,733 --> 00:26:42,853 Speaker 3: the numbers in front of me, but it was a 515 00:26:42,933 --> 00:26:45,253 Speaker 3: lot for a team that won fifty four points to 516 00:26:45,333 --> 00:26:48,653 Speaker 3: seven they missed. I think it was more than twenty tackles. 517 00:26:49,253 --> 00:26:51,773 Speaker 3: It was a fast game last game, yep. A lot 518 00:26:51,813 --> 00:26:53,773 Speaker 3: of fatigue at the back end, even of the first half. 519 00:26:54,413 --> 00:26:57,333 Speaker 3: Players are blowing a lot of kicking, a lot of running, 520 00:26:58,373 --> 00:27:02,253 Speaker 3: so I'm not overly surprised by that. But yeah, the 521 00:27:02,373 --> 00:27:05,493 Speaker 3: Lions tour is also a hectic schedule, now, isn't it. 522 00:27:05,733 --> 00:27:10,493 Speaker 3: They play the Reds mid week and then the Warratars 523 00:27:10,533 --> 00:27:12,813 Speaker 3: on the weekends and then you know, the first Test 524 00:27:13,173 --> 00:27:14,773 Speaker 3: in a couple of weeks. The Wallabies have a tune 525 00:27:14,853 --> 00:27:19,053 Speaker 3: up against Fiji, so it will be in an engrossing series. 526 00:27:19,133 --> 00:27:22,333 Speaker 3: But look, let's be honest, if you paint the picture 527 00:27:22,373 --> 00:27:28,453 Speaker 3: of this series, there's every expectation rightfully, so that line 528 00:27:28,453 --> 00:27:31,533 Speaker 3: should win three nil. The Wallabies have made great improvements 529 00:27:31,613 --> 00:27:35,413 Speaker 3: under Joe Schmitt, but they are still very much developing 530 00:27:35,573 --> 00:27:38,133 Speaker 3: into that where this is the best of the best 531 00:27:38,373 --> 00:27:44,573 Speaker 3: of Europe, France and Italy excluded. You know, Ireland's England's 532 00:27:45,853 --> 00:27:48,533 Speaker 3: Finn Russell's in great form. I think there's one or 533 00:27:48,573 --> 00:27:52,413 Speaker 3: two Welshmen have managed to crack the squad. Thomas Williams 534 00:27:52,493 --> 00:27:55,173 Speaker 3: might be on his way home, so I'm got anyone 535 00:27:55,293 --> 00:27:59,173 Speaker 3: left actually, But look, it is a very good lines team. 536 00:27:59,293 --> 00:28:01,133 Speaker 3: What do you think do you think they'll win three nil? 537 00:28:02,293 --> 00:28:05,653 Speaker 3: They're expected to, as you said, If the Wallabies don't 538 00:28:05,693 --> 00:28:08,053 Speaker 3: win the first Test in Brisbane. It will be three 539 00:28:08,133 --> 00:28:10,693 Speaker 3: nil because the lines will get better and better, and 540 00:28:10,773 --> 00:28:15,773 Speaker 3: we've seen that in recent tours I think, so if 541 00:28:15,813 --> 00:28:17,453 Speaker 3: you had to pin me down, I'd say they will 542 00:28:17,493 --> 00:28:18,813 Speaker 3: win three now all right, it's. 543 00:28:18,693 --> 00:28:19,053 Speaker 2: Two to one. 544 00:28:20,213 --> 00:28:22,053 Speaker 3: Topic number two in multi All Black surge and their 545 00:28:22,093 --> 00:28:25,613 Speaker 3: second spell against Japan fairly comfortable in the end. It 546 00:28:25,693 --> 00:28:27,573 Speaker 3: was a tight first spell, played in a bit of 547 00:28:27,613 --> 00:28:31,253 Speaker 3: heats over in Japan, but just ultimately too good the 548 00:28:31,333 --> 00:28:33,853 Speaker 3: Maldi All Blacks. For a team that only flew out 549 00:28:33,933 --> 00:28:38,053 Speaker 3: on the Wednesday Langdon into Tokyo that night and then 550 00:28:38,093 --> 00:28:40,173 Speaker 3: played on Saturday, not too bad in terms of the 551 00:28:40,213 --> 00:28:40,973 Speaker 3: score they ran up. 552 00:28:41,533 --> 00:28:43,493 Speaker 4: I think they had a bit of unfinished business this team. 553 00:28:43,493 --> 00:28:48,013 Speaker 4: They lost one game out in Japan last time. Ecklam 554 00:28:48,213 --> 00:28:52,053 Speaker 4: mentioned that postmatch that sort of stuck in the kraps, 555 00:28:52,773 --> 00:28:54,853 Speaker 4: so I think that would have been part of their motivation. 556 00:28:55,053 --> 00:28:57,813 Speaker 4: And it's an interesting series, isn't it. You get the 557 00:28:57,893 --> 00:29:01,053 Speaker 4: feeling like I'm not. I don't want to undermine the 558 00:29:01,253 --> 00:29:04,093 Speaker 4: Maldi team because it does. It has steeped in history, 559 00:29:04,213 --> 00:29:09,733 Speaker 4: but from I don't know, it's not something you put 560 00:29:09,773 --> 00:29:12,733 Speaker 4: on a pedestal. If you think about the previous some 561 00:29:12,853 --> 00:29:14,813 Speaker 4: of the itineries that the Mouldi All Blacks have had 562 00:29:14,813 --> 00:29:17,173 Speaker 4: when they've played the Lions, played England, when they've come 563 00:29:17,253 --> 00:29:18,253 Speaker 4: out to tour New Zealand. 564 00:29:19,293 --> 00:29:19,693 Speaker 5: New Zealand. 565 00:29:19,733 --> 00:29:23,933 Speaker 4: Raby has this memorandum of understanding of Japan and clearly 566 00:29:23,973 --> 00:29:26,173 Speaker 4: there's stipulations about how many games they have to play 567 00:29:26,213 --> 00:29:29,333 Speaker 4: each year over there, and it does feel like the 568 00:29:29,453 --> 00:29:32,773 Speaker 4: Mouldy All Blacks and the All Blacks fifteen a fulfilling 569 00:29:32,813 --> 00:29:33,813 Speaker 4: a lot of those commitments. 570 00:29:34,493 --> 00:29:40,173 Speaker 3: It does, and I don't know whether that's the right 571 00:29:40,533 --> 00:29:43,373 Speaker 3: thing for the Moldy All Blacks to be treated that way, 572 00:29:43,413 --> 00:29:45,933 Speaker 3: but I also don't see a path to them getting 573 00:29:45,973 --> 00:29:48,973 Speaker 3: more games. You know, the test calendar is so congested 574 00:29:49,133 --> 00:29:52,693 Speaker 3: as it is. It really is only those times of 575 00:29:52,773 --> 00:29:55,853 Speaker 3: the year when you know the calendar when the Lions 576 00:29:55,853 --> 00:29:58,533 Speaker 3: are coming in and they can potentially play games against 577 00:29:58,573 --> 00:30:01,893 Speaker 3: them or these sort of series. You got Scotland obviously 578 00:30:01,973 --> 00:30:03,413 Speaker 3: in fang Ada over the weekend. It's going to be 579 00:30:03,453 --> 00:30:07,133 Speaker 3: second string Scotland. They're keeping their international team active while 580 00:30:07,173 --> 00:30:10,213 Speaker 3: the lines are going on. Those seem to be the 581 00:30:10,293 --> 00:30:13,533 Speaker 3: opportunities and even you know, I think that they obviously 582 00:30:13,533 --> 00:30:18,173 Speaker 3: played Ireland twenty twenty two in that series, which was great, 583 00:30:19,093 --> 00:30:21,893 Speaker 3: But for next year those go as well, those three 584 00:30:21,973 --> 00:30:25,573 Speaker 3: ties series, there will be any of those opportunities. So 585 00:30:26,133 --> 00:30:28,373 Speaker 3: it feels like it's been a little bit marginalized the 586 00:30:28,453 --> 00:30:30,893 Speaker 3: Muldi All Blacks. But also don't see where on the 587 00:30:30,973 --> 00:30:34,293 Speaker 3: calendar you could fit players in or fit a team 588 00:30:34,373 --> 00:30:38,613 Speaker 3: in and play regular international fixtures against top teams. 589 00:30:38,973 --> 00:30:43,293 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's bloody tough, isn't it to uphold the prestige 590 00:30:43,373 --> 00:30:46,253 Speaker 4: of that team because I've got vivid memories. I think 591 00:30:46,293 --> 00:30:49,013 Speaker 4: it was that John o' gibbs who led the muldy 592 00:30:49,053 --> 00:30:51,693 Speaker 4: All Blacks to victory of the Lions, and just the 593 00:30:52,413 --> 00:30:55,533 Speaker 4: emotion and the scenes and the passion and the pride 594 00:30:55,533 --> 00:30:57,093 Speaker 4: around those sort of results. 595 00:30:57,253 --> 00:30:57,813 Speaker 5: I'm pretty sure. 596 00:30:57,813 --> 00:30:59,973 Speaker 4: Did they beat England down in New Zealand as well? Yep, 597 00:31:00,693 --> 00:31:03,933 Speaker 4: so some massive results, you know, And wouldn't it be 598 00:31:04,013 --> 00:31:06,333 Speaker 4: great to see them play the spring Box or the Wallabies, 599 00:31:06,373 --> 00:31:12,973 Speaker 4: But that's but fanciful in the current climate. So it's 600 00:31:13,053 --> 00:31:17,293 Speaker 4: important to maintain that team. But the context and the 601 00:31:17,373 --> 00:31:20,093 Speaker 4: relevance of going to Japan and playing a couple of 602 00:31:20,133 --> 00:31:24,533 Speaker 4: one off games, it doesn't necessarily wit the appetite. 603 00:31:24,773 --> 00:31:26,533 Speaker 3: You'll be interesting to see in twenty thirty when the 604 00:31:26,653 --> 00:31:28,853 Speaker 3: Sutifrakan too comes here whether there is an opportunity to 605 00:31:28,893 --> 00:31:31,093 Speaker 3: play the Moldy All Blacks, so whether it's you know, 606 00:31:31,253 --> 00:31:35,653 Speaker 3: only the Super Rugby teams, that'll be fascinating, but it's 607 00:31:35,653 --> 00:31:38,213 Speaker 3: hard to see them getting much of an increase program 608 00:31:38,853 --> 00:31:39,413 Speaker 3: to this point. 609 00:31:39,613 --> 00:31:40,253 Speaker 2: Topic number three. 610 00:31:40,293 --> 00:31:41,813 Speaker 3: We touched on this a little bit last week when 611 00:31:41,813 --> 00:31:44,293 Speaker 3: we did our Super Rugby Final rap and also the 612 00:31:44,373 --> 00:31:46,693 Speaker 3: All Black squad. But chance now to just rate CLAYD 613 00:31:46,733 --> 00:31:49,533 Speaker 3: mcmillon's tenure. I think he's off this week to begin 614 00:31:49,613 --> 00:31:51,693 Speaker 3: a new life in Munster. How would you write his 615 00:31:51,773 --> 00:31:53,733 Speaker 3: time in charge of the Chiefs also the Mouldi All 616 00:31:53,773 --> 00:31:56,933 Speaker 3: Blacks as well. He's been a plenty. He's been pretty 617 00:31:56,933 --> 00:31:59,013 Speaker 3: good servants in New Zealand rugby and I'm sure it 618 00:31:59,093 --> 00:31:59,813 Speaker 3: would be more to come. 619 00:32:00,213 --> 00:32:02,573 Speaker 4: Yeah, All Blacks fifteen as well. So very much in 620 00:32:02,693 --> 00:32:06,173 Speaker 4: that high performance on the cusp of the All Blacks 621 00:32:06,933 --> 00:32:09,933 Speaker 4: five year, ten year with the Chiefs. I think in 622 00:32:10,133 --> 00:32:13,573 Speaker 4: the cold lighted day in the media aftermath of losing 623 00:32:13,933 --> 00:32:18,453 Speaker 4: a fourth final and how disappointing that is for those 624 00:32:18,693 --> 00:32:22,213 Speaker 4: in Chiefs country, it's easy to forget where he started 625 00:32:22,653 --> 00:32:26,493 Speaker 4: coming in as an interim coach Warren Gatlin going to 626 00:32:26,813 --> 00:32:29,733 Speaker 4: coach the Lions in South Africa was only ever meant 627 00:32:29,773 --> 00:32:34,613 Speaker 4: to be a six month tenure and the Chiefs were 628 00:32:34,653 --> 00:32:38,493 Speaker 4: in a real bad place. They went on to match 629 00:32:38,613 --> 00:32:41,853 Speaker 4: their worst ever losing streaker. I think it was eleven 630 00:32:41,973 --> 00:32:45,813 Speaker 4: matches with McMillan. I think he presided over two of 631 00:32:45,893 --> 00:32:50,253 Speaker 4: those and then really turned it around. And he did 632 00:32:50,333 --> 00:32:53,373 Speaker 4: that by drilling down into their culture, by getting by in. 633 00:32:53,653 --> 00:32:55,533 Speaker 4: He promoted a lot of players to the All Blacks 634 00:32:55,893 --> 00:32:59,653 Speaker 4: in that time as well, and brought through a number 635 00:32:59,693 --> 00:33:00,533 Speaker 4: of different coaches. 636 00:33:03,173 --> 00:33:04,373 Speaker 5: I'd give him eight out of ten. 637 00:33:04,573 --> 00:33:09,533 Speaker 4: I think those finals there's clearly something that he would 638 00:33:09,573 --> 00:33:13,413 Speaker 4: reflect on and something he would maybe missing in the 639 00:33:13,493 --> 00:33:17,893 Speaker 4: tool belt. The inability to get over that hump, that 640 00:33:18,013 --> 00:33:22,013 Speaker 4: mental hurd or whatever it is to not deliver a 641 00:33:22,093 --> 00:33:24,853 Speaker 4: championship having been that their most consistent team in the 642 00:33:24,933 --> 00:33:29,813 Speaker 4: last three years will great him. But I really hope 643 00:33:29,813 --> 00:33:32,733 Speaker 4: he goes to Monster and has a real impact at 644 00:33:32,773 --> 00:33:36,173 Speaker 4: a club that will have big expectations but has a 645 00:33:36,253 --> 00:33:41,573 Speaker 4: similar sort of investment in the pride and their history 646 00:33:41,613 --> 00:33:43,613 Speaker 4: and all those sorts of things. And been exposed to 647 00:33:43,653 --> 00:33:47,293 Speaker 4: different styles and players I think will only benefit him. 648 00:33:47,653 --> 00:33:48,493 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it will too. 649 00:33:48,813 --> 00:33:50,173 Speaker 3: I'll go to give him seven and a half out 650 00:33:50,213 --> 00:33:53,173 Speaker 3: of ten, probably doctor point till half a point for 651 00:33:53,533 --> 00:33:55,893 Speaker 3: those lost finals. But he's been great for the Chiefs, 652 00:33:56,693 --> 00:33:59,533 Speaker 3: has instilled a real culture in them that had probably 653 00:33:59,653 --> 00:34:02,453 Speaker 3: been missing since the day of Rainy Days and Wayne 654 00:34:02,533 --> 00:34:04,933 Speaker 3: Smith that sort of was there, but then it's sort 655 00:34:04,973 --> 00:34:07,533 Speaker 3: of unraveled and they've been closed. But he got them 656 00:34:07,573 --> 00:34:10,533 Speaker 3: back to the you know, the top table in terms 657 00:34:10,533 --> 00:34:14,293 Speaker 3: of New Zealand Super Rugby sides. And yeah, that final defeat, 658 00:34:14,573 --> 00:34:17,453 Speaker 3: four of them will stick with them, and the fact 659 00:34:17,493 --> 00:34:20,213 Speaker 3: that they all lost in different ways. It wasn't just 660 00:34:20,333 --> 00:34:23,213 Speaker 3: one thing that can signed them to defeat. That was 661 00:34:23,253 --> 00:34:26,853 Speaker 3: probably an easy fix twenty twenty one in Super Abiot 662 00:34:27,173 --> 00:34:31,053 Speaker 3: or twenty three in the Super Rugby final against the Crusaders. 663 00:34:31,093 --> 00:34:33,453 Speaker 3: You know they didn't concede a point when they had 664 00:34:33,493 --> 00:34:35,093 Speaker 3: fifteen players in the park and said at all their 665 00:34:35,093 --> 00:34:37,373 Speaker 3: points while they were down to fourteen men, got blown 666 00:34:37,453 --> 00:34:39,253 Speaker 3: up by the Blues last year, lost and arm wrestled 667 00:34:39,253 --> 00:34:42,973 Speaker 3: against the Crusaders. So in a weird way, he's lost 668 00:34:43,053 --> 00:34:45,773 Speaker 3: in different ways and that might actually gnaw at him 669 00:34:45,773 --> 00:34:47,613 Speaker 3: a little bit more that it's not one thing, easy 670 00:34:47,693 --> 00:34:50,053 Speaker 3: fix sort of scenario. It's been a number of things. 671 00:34:50,133 --> 00:34:51,853 Speaker 3: But he's a very good coach and I think promising 672 00:34:51,893 --> 00:34:53,613 Speaker 3: in the New Zealand set up. If we look at 673 00:34:53,613 --> 00:34:55,933 Speaker 3: a World Cup cycle away or maybe two from here 674 00:34:56,013 --> 00:34:57,453 Speaker 3: on inwards, I'm sure he's going to be back in 675 00:34:57,453 --> 00:35:00,293 Speaker 3: All Blacks contention, especially if his monster tenure goes well. 676 00:35:00,773 --> 00:35:02,813 Speaker 4: Yeah, and interesting just to watch that from a five. 677 00:35:03,613 --> 00:35:07,373 Speaker 4: Rob Penny spent two years I think at a Munster. 678 00:35:07,853 --> 00:35:12,013 Speaker 4: Dave Rennie went to Glasgow, Scott Robin not Scott Robertson, 679 00:35:12,293 --> 00:35:13,293 Speaker 4: Todd Blackhead. 680 00:35:12,933 --> 00:35:13,733 Speaker 5: It was it Edinburgh. 681 00:35:14,133 --> 00:35:17,893 Speaker 4: So there's a long list of New Zealand coaches. Pat 682 00:35:17,973 --> 00:35:23,333 Speaker 4: lamb as he took Connock to It wasn't the USC, 683 00:35:23,533 --> 00:35:28,573 Speaker 4: then it was some other previous iteration. Twelve I think 684 00:35:28,613 --> 00:35:29,853 Speaker 4: it used to be a Pro twelve it was and 685 00:35:29,933 --> 00:35:33,773 Speaker 4: then he went on to Prostal. So if you can 686 00:35:34,293 --> 00:35:37,853 Speaker 4: make an impact then I think that could potentially be 687 00:35:37,973 --> 00:35:40,733 Speaker 4: very much a stepping stone to international rugby, whether that's 688 00:35:40,773 --> 00:35:43,093 Speaker 4: what the All Blacks or another team. 689 00:35:43,293 --> 00:35:44,973 Speaker 2: It could well be topic number four. 690 00:35:45,093 --> 00:35:47,453 Speaker 3: Sorry you broke last week alongside one of our colleagues 691 00:35:47,493 --> 00:35:50,733 Speaker 3: here at the heralds kennemc namara more on a pacificate 692 00:35:50,813 --> 00:35:55,013 Speaker 3: and the funding saga look at an important story obviously 693 00:35:55,133 --> 00:35:57,973 Speaker 3: around where some of the funding's coming and come in 694 00:35:58,213 --> 00:36:00,653 Speaker 3: and is going and where it's going to for next year. 695 00:36:00,813 --> 00:36:03,493 Speaker 2: I guess in a pure rugby sense we look. 696 00:36:03,413 --> 00:36:06,973 Speaker 3: At it and go Moana's future is under a bit 697 00:36:07,013 --> 00:36:09,213 Speaker 3: of a cloud, would it be fair to say on. 698 00:36:09,293 --> 00:36:11,493 Speaker 5: A knife edge? Yeah, all. 699 00:36:12,893 --> 00:36:17,493 Speaker 4: Revenue streams compromised or under threats. And I guess if 700 00:36:17,493 --> 00:36:19,093 Speaker 4: you've broaden it out like you say to a rugby 701 00:36:19,133 --> 00:36:22,093 Speaker 4: Contextas as a team that had its most successful year 702 00:36:22,133 --> 00:36:26,773 Speaker 4: in history, lurid Arde Severe won six matches, knocked off 703 00:36:26,813 --> 00:36:32,613 Speaker 4: four of the five New Zealand teams, cultivated or generated, 704 00:36:32,693 --> 00:36:37,613 Speaker 4: brought in more social media followed, was than the other 705 00:36:37,693 --> 00:36:40,813 Speaker 4: New Zealand teams and the Super Rugby account combined, so 706 00:36:41,453 --> 00:36:43,533 Speaker 4: you know, real engagements. 707 00:36:44,813 --> 00:36:45,013 Speaker 1: There. 708 00:36:45,213 --> 00:36:52,693 Speaker 4: But yet money matters, and from everything from their broadcast 709 00:36:52,773 --> 00:36:57,573 Speaker 4: funding to their skyfront a Jersey to World Rugby to 710 00:36:57,973 --> 00:37:01,973 Speaker 4: their backers, the Pacific Medical Association is now under the 711 00:37:02,013 --> 00:37:06,293 Speaker 4: spotlight and it would be horrenous, wouldn't it if this 712 00:37:06,413 --> 00:37:08,053 Speaker 4: team didn't survive. I think there's a lot of good 713 00:37:08,093 --> 00:37:11,413 Speaker 4: will and a lot of parties need to come together 714 00:37:11,533 --> 00:37:13,693 Speaker 4: to get them over the line. But it is also 715 00:37:13,773 --> 00:37:16,693 Speaker 4: a continuation of what we've seen in Australia with the 716 00:37:16,773 --> 00:37:20,493 Speaker 4: Melbourne Rebels and that the Brumby has been bailed out 717 00:37:20,533 --> 00:37:24,893 Speaker 4: by Rugby Australia and the Hurricanes losing two million dollars 718 00:37:25,013 --> 00:37:27,413 Speaker 4: in recent times and having to tap up investors for 719 00:37:27,973 --> 00:37:29,093 Speaker 4: another million dollars. 720 00:37:29,893 --> 00:37:31,053 Speaker 5: So super Rugby. 721 00:37:31,093 --> 00:37:33,693 Speaker 4: It costs about twelve to thirteen million to run a 722 00:37:33,733 --> 00:37:39,013 Speaker 4: club and it is proving really difficult for Mauana to 723 00:37:39,093 --> 00:37:41,653 Speaker 4: find that money. Do you think we'll be on the 724 00:37:41,693 --> 00:37:45,293 Speaker 4: start line next year? I think they will, but it's 725 00:37:46,493 --> 00:37:50,413 Speaker 4: not just next year. It's been sustainable because it's one 726 00:37:50,493 --> 00:37:54,293 Speaker 4: thing to get a Nani laal Marpi or a Nadi 727 00:37:54,333 --> 00:37:57,653 Speaker 4: Severe to come over. That's a positive step, but then 728 00:37:57,893 --> 00:38:04,133 Speaker 4: it's finding backers who will stick and who have viable 729 00:38:04,173 --> 00:38:10,933 Speaker 4: funding streams. It's challenging because is not a profitable business. 730 00:38:11,453 --> 00:38:15,213 Speaker 3: And they're still pushing on with making signings, announcing players, 731 00:38:15,253 --> 00:38:18,493 Speaker 3: you know Smisi to portay Law recommitting for another couple 732 00:38:18,573 --> 00:38:21,173 Speaker 3: of years. So they're barreling on as as business as usual, 733 00:38:21,253 --> 00:38:24,373 Speaker 3: But we've got this clouding hanging over them and it's 734 00:38:24,413 --> 00:38:26,373 Speaker 3: going to come to a head at some point it is. 735 00:38:26,413 --> 00:38:29,453 Speaker 4: And I think it's certainly before the end of the year. 736 00:38:30,573 --> 00:38:35,693 Speaker 4: You can't have that uncertainty and jeopardy hanging over a 737 00:38:35,773 --> 00:38:39,453 Speaker 4: competition with drawers need to be finalized and players futures 738 00:38:39,973 --> 00:38:43,893 Speaker 4: and all the rest of it. But you just have 739 00:38:44,013 --> 00:38:46,533 Speaker 4: to look at the broadcast deal that New zeal Rugby 740 00:38:46,573 --> 00:38:48,893 Speaker 4: and skygaing to stitch together. It's going to be a reduction, 741 00:38:49,413 --> 00:38:53,293 Speaker 4: So there goes you know, the overall pool is shrunk 742 00:38:53,493 --> 00:38:57,733 Speaker 4: for the eleven teams. So where the world rugby are 743 00:38:57,733 --> 00:39:02,493 Speaker 4: asked to stump up some cash? Maybe Rugby Australia, but yeah, 744 00:39:02,853 --> 00:39:06,973 Speaker 4: the pacifica Medical Association brought Winer last year. They've lost 745 00:39:07,533 --> 00:39:11,373 Speaker 4: over half their very you so where do they go to? 746 00:39:11,693 --> 00:39:12,933 Speaker 5: Are they in it for the long haul? 747 00:39:13,013 --> 00:39:15,573 Speaker 4: Does somebody else need to come and can other investors 748 00:39:15,613 --> 00:39:18,173 Speaker 4: be found? Should the team be based in New Zealand 749 00:39:18,293 --> 00:39:20,493 Speaker 4: so they have to move offshore. There's a lot of 750 00:39:20,973 --> 00:39:22,493 Speaker 4: big questions to be worked through. 751 00:39:22,973 --> 00:39:25,413 Speaker 3: Indeed, they're aspecting of different big questions. We didn't get 752 00:39:25,453 --> 00:39:28,773 Speaker 3: any response on you know, good suit plays cheese roll 753 00:39:28,853 --> 00:39:31,053 Speaker 3: place ineed and our listeners didn't quite come to the 754 00:39:31,093 --> 00:39:31,733 Speaker 3: party on that one. 755 00:39:31,973 --> 00:39:35,013 Speaker 4: No, you might have to hit up our Dunedin local 756 00:39:35,093 --> 00:39:38,493 Speaker 4: Paul Cully, he might know some spot for a bit 757 00:39:38,533 --> 00:39:40,973 Speaker 4: of west We get our colders and then you know, 758 00:39:41,133 --> 00:39:43,133 Speaker 4: you look at the temperature and you're a Southerner man. 759 00:39:43,213 --> 00:39:44,733 Speaker 3: No, but you look at the temperature and you go, 760 00:39:44,933 --> 00:39:46,853 Speaker 3: I can handle that. But you've actually got to incorporate 761 00:39:46,893 --> 00:39:49,613 Speaker 3: the windshill which actually you sort of deducts about fifteen 762 00:39:49,653 --> 00:39:52,453 Speaker 3: degrees off the temperature that it's listed as. 763 00:39:53,053 --> 00:39:55,893 Speaker 5: Cash in your Southern CARDA. Don't tell Ethan the group, 764 00:39:56,213 --> 00:39:58,373 Speaker 5: you won't be welcome anyway. 765 00:39:58,413 --> 00:39:59,533 Speaker 2: That's probably a good place to end it. 766 00:39:59,653 --> 00:40:02,253 Speaker 3: That'll do it for Rugby Directs with our friends and 767 00:40:02,293 --> 00:40:04,733 Speaker 3: habitat tackling or your aches and pains, resport on work 768 00:40:04,733 --> 00:40:05,013 Speaker 3: and thanks. 769 00:40:05,013 --> 00:40:08,293 Speaker 2: The last of Bars English back for another edition next week. 770 00:40:08,453 --> 00:40:08,853 Speaker 2: Catch them 771 00:40:13,053 --> 00:40:15,573 Speaker 1: For more from News Talks at b Listen live on 772 00:40:15,773 --> 00:40:18,693 Speaker 1: air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever 773 00:40:18,773 --> 00:40:21,333 Speaker 1: you go with our podcasts on iHeartRadio.