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Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from News Talks EDB. Follow

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Speaker 1: this and our Wide Ranger podcast now on iHeartRadio, Strike

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Speaker 1: down the Middle.

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Speaker 2: Try try these pocket.

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Speaker 1: Inside the game from every angle. It's Rugby Direct with

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Speaker 1: Elliot Smith and Liam Napier powered by News Talks EDB.

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Speaker 2: Welcome into Rugby Direct powered by Habit Health, tackling all

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Speaker 2: your aches and pains from sports and work back for

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Speaker 2: another week after a few days extra to dissect and

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Speaker 2: digest the round that was in Super Rugby. But first

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Speaker 2: and foremost big welcome back to Liam Napier after Magic Round,

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Speaker 2: et cetera.

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Speaker 3: Have you recovered I have needed fixture days to recover

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Speaker 3: and rumor has it Ellie you need a future days

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Speaker 3: to recover from that Crusader's defeat.

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Speaker 2: Dear idea, We'll get to that in just a second.

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Speaker 2: Speaking of Magic Round, I guess Super runs the mirror

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Speaker 2: to that. What did you take away from that experience

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Speaker 2: apart from you know, a few healthy jugs of four X?

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Speaker 4: I'm sure yes. Look it is a fantastic event.

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Speaker 3: The Brisbane Wider Brisbane City do it brilliantly and it's

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Speaker 3: a perfect setting for Super Round, Magic Round, whatever it

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Speaker 3: is you've got Cackson Street. They're a good a two

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Speaker 3: minute walk from sun Stadium, which is the best viewing

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Speaker 3: venue in Australasia for rugby and rugby league. And they're

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Speaker 3: just very fluid with it. You can come and go

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Speaker 3: from the stadium as you want, watch one game, leave,

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Speaker 3: come back, go to the pub and they do.

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Speaker 4: It really well.

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Speaker 3: So before a Warriors game they have a designated bar

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Speaker 3: where all the you know Warriors fans go. They roll

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Speaker 3: out former players Mark Tukey, Kevin Campion and the like.

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Speaker 3: So it's just a really well run events. Lots of

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Speaker 3: punters come in from New Zealand's, lots of expats kiwis

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Speaker 3: and yeah, it really does.

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Speaker 4: Set the bar for that sort of concept.

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Speaker 3: And it's been a success in Brisbane for a long

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Speaker 3: time and it's staying there for the foreseeable future. And

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Speaker 3: yeah I went three years ago, went back this year

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Speaker 3: and will needs another year to recover. But yeah, I

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Speaker 3: would encourage anyone to get amongst that and look super

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Speaker 3: around hasn't worked, has it? For Super Rugby? At the

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Speaker 3: Plunking in Melbourne? Purely from a financial perspective, didn't work,

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Speaker 3: So let's make it work somewhere yeah.

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Speaker 2: And I've just been in christ Church for the weekend

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Speaker 2: and I can tell from my people on the ground

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Speaker 2: there that the drums are beating very loudly that they'll

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Speaker 2: host super Round in twenty twenty six. Nothing confirmed as yet,

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Speaker 2: I should add, but the drums are being This room

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Speaker 2: has been around obviously, new stadium coming next year, but

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Speaker 2: it's going to be completed by April. The theory being

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Speaker 2: that maybe they open it with a Crusaders Game of

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Speaker 2: the Week prior and then the week after that or

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Speaker 2: two weeks after that, whatever it might be, super Round,

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Speaker 2: Maybe it's over a long weekends ends that weekend, whatever

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Speaker 2: it might be, and you have it to I guess

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Speaker 2: Christen the new stadium, which will be pretty special.

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Speaker 3: It would, and it makes a lot of sense on

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Speaker 3: the face of it in terms of the proximity of

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Speaker 3: the stadium to the city short walk and you're back

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Speaker 3: in the heart of the city, bars, restaurants, whatever it

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Speaker 3: may be. Yeah, and I'd encourage Rugby to have that

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Speaker 3: flexibility to allow people to come and go and what

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Speaker 3: a venue that that is going to be for Chrush.

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Speaker 3: That's gonna really you put it on the map and

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Speaker 3: indore brilliance and yeah, you know it'll be hopefully great

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Speaker 3: to see the Crusaders rebound from another disappointing campaign.

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Speaker 2: Right before we get into that, Black Ferns on the

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Speaker 2: weekend kicking off their World Cup year thirty eight twelve

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Speaker 2: winners over Australia. Fairly comprehensive and not everything we went

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Speaker 2: to plan. But I thought for our first hit out

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Speaker 2: of the calendary year, it was pretty good. Braxton sorrens

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Speaker 2: and McGee makes her deburg gets a couple of tries

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Speaker 2: for me. I mean, I think it was the obvious

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Speaker 2: choice anyway, but she has to be the starting fullback,

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Speaker 2: first choice for this team. Some good signs for the

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Speaker 2: Black Funds, but plenty to work on as they face

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Speaker 2: bag a challenges, including Canada this weekend, who beat them

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Speaker 2: last year in the mirror competition.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, probably expected a wee bit more from the Black fans,

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Speaker 3: but as you say, it is their first hit out,

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Speaker 3: so rusters to be expected. Tougher challenges await. But what

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Speaker 3: a story Braxton Sirenson McGee is coming from outside the

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Speaker 3: Blue squad really debut Super Rugby season and saw her

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Speaker 3: talking postmatch about how easy it was stepping into the

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Speaker 3: Black Ferns because there's a number of Blues players in

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Speaker 3: that team. But also so I guess the level of

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Speaker 3: competitiveness and competition. She looks born for that arena, doesn't

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Speaker 3: she a young woman with the world at her feet,

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Speaker 3: great talents and her feet on the ground as well.

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Speaker 3: But yeah, the Black Ferns, it's a starting point, isn't it.

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Speaker 4: And it's a massive year for them, so they'll build.

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Speaker 3: And I know they had Wayne Smith in a couple

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Speaker 3: of weeks ago, so good to see the Professor still

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Speaker 3: keeping his hands in the mix there because he was

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Speaker 3: such an influential figure in the last World Cup.

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Speaker 2: Trump that's right, and I'm sure he's imparted all sorts

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Speaker 2: of wisdom and knowledge into that camp. But interesting to

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Speaker 2: see how they integrate the Sevens players from this weekend

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Speaker 2: that have now arrived in camp in christ to head

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Speaker 2: of that game against Canada Georgia and Miller recy Pouldy Lane,

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Speaker 2: Stacy Wackets. That's going to be fascinating to see how

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Speaker 2: Alan Bunting begins to integrate those players into the mix

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Speaker 2: who haven't played a lot of fifteens in recent times.

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Speaker 2: But as I say, start for the start for the

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Speaker 2: Black Ferns, big games and bigger challenges to come right.

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Speaker 2: I've put her off for too long. Crusaders Chiefs Saturday night,

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Speaker 2: I went down and called this game for gold Sport

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Speaker 2: and Nightheart Radio. Crusaders lead nineteen three in about the

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Speaker 2: thirty ninth minutes, and from the inn it just unraveled

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Speaker 2: at a rate of knots and you could feel the

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Speaker 2: momentum turning even before halftime when and Modey Nadawa scored

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Speaker 2: that try gob By to nineteen ten. At the break,

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Speaker 2: the Chiefs went in with their tails up and they

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Speaker 2: hadn't been able to play a lot of rugby. I

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Speaker 2: felt to that point the Crusaders had defended well forced

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Speaker 2: Eras and the Crusaders had scored some tries of their own.

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Speaker 2: But just after halftime, the Chiefs soaked up all that position.

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Speaker 2: They didn't allow the Crusaders to get an inch innet

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Speaker 2: opening fifteen twenty minutes. It felt like the second spell

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Speaker 2: and they took the game away from them. And that

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Speaker 2: was there's bigger the momentum switches I can see in

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Speaker 2: the game. The Crusaders went out of sight, but they

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Speaker 2: unraveled really really quickly. What did you make of that game, Lem.

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Speaker 4: There's a lot to unpack there.

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Speaker 3: I think at nineteen three the score probably wasn't reflective

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Speaker 3: of the contest. The Chiefs had a lot of chances,

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Speaker 3: made a few mistakes, the Crusaders took theirs, and there

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Speaker 3: was a couple of things that swung that game. Will

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Speaker 3: Jordan's absence was massive, and you shouldn't be reliant on

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Speaker 3: one player alone, but it's clear in his absence just

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Speaker 3: how much of an effect he's had on that team

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Speaker 3: this year. Didn't play last year, He's played every game

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Speaker 3: this year and he's been huge for their attack and

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Speaker 3: helping guide some young tens. I thought it was a

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Speaker 3: stark contrast, and it's not solely fair in any way

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Speaker 3: to pin the loss on him, But Rivers Rayhanna his

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Speaker 3: performance compared to the Highnders when everything was going the

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Speaker 3: Crusader's way, they had the front football, they're rolling and

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Speaker 3: he had an arm tier rides. But when in the

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Speaker 3: second half, in particular, when the Chiefs pat got a

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Speaker 3: role on, You've got Someersoni, Takyajol coming off the bench,

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Speaker 3: some of Penny Female as well. Wallace a Titi massive

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Speaker 3: performance in his first start of the year.

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Speaker 4: Jeez. That's some power.

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Speaker 3: That they have, and when they get a roll on,

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Speaker 3: they're incredibly difficult to stop. They scored thirty two unanswered points.

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Speaker 3: The Crusaders really didn't have any answers, couldn't swing that

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Speaker 3: momentum that you talk about. And one of the chief

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Speaker 3: strengths is not just that power, but their ability to

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Speaker 3: play second phase. Their big men use the ball, they

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Speaker 3: create space and when they give Damien McKenzie that platform,

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Speaker 3: he is lethal. That the little switch move to come

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Speaker 3: back and score that try. That was a real dagger

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Speaker 3: blow and it was a real statement from the Chiefs

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Speaker 3: because let's not forget they came off a loss to

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Speaker 3: the Hurricanes and CLAYT McMillan savvy move to turn the

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Speaker 3: music off in the sheds and make his team listen

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Speaker 3: to the Hurricanes' brilliant team song. It must be said,

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Speaker 3: stew on that loss, jump on that just fishing out there.

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Speaker 3: It's due on that loss, and he got the desired reactions.

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Speaker 3: So big statement performance from the Chiefs, and while they

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Speaker 3: have a buy, it does put them in the box

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Speaker 3: seat to finish first and have home advantage for the playoffs.

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Speaker 2: It does one of The telling statistics for me was

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Speaker 2: the Crusader actually had more percent position in the second

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Speaker 2: spell than the first, which it didn't really feel like.

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Speaker 5: They had.

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Speaker 2: Fifty two percent in the second spell can be to

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Speaker 2: thirty nine in the first spell. The second half, though

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Speaker 2: they spent just thirty six percent time in Chiefs territory,

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Speaker 2: the Chiefs had sixty four percent. They couldn't plain the

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Speaker 2: right areas of the park, and that's on rivers, Rayhanna.

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Speaker 2: It's on their game drivers to get them out of trouble,

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Speaker 2: and they were just a little bit at sea. Couple

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Speaker 2: of por chosen kicks from David h Villi Noah Hootham

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Speaker 2: at times put them on the back foot and the

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Speaker 2: Chiefs took full advantage. And I think it was a

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Speaker 2: reminder to the Crusaders how not fine the margins can be.

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Speaker 2: But you you just got to be on when you

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Speaker 2: play a team like the Chiefs, is that you nineteen

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Speaker 2: three up. You might have a bit of an advantage

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Speaker 2: in your pocket, but that can be whittled away really quickly,

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Speaker 2: and that momentum can swing wildly, and it swung wildly

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Speaker 2: in favor of the Chiefs. And to not score a

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Speaker 2: second a point in the second spell was really damning,

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Speaker 2: I thought for the Crusaders.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, big time, and the Crusaders in their past two games,

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Speaker 3: I think they've made something like four hundred and eighty

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Speaker 3: eight tackles and that's a credit to them, but it's

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Speaker 3: also not sustainable. You're not going to win a competition

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Speaker 3: taking that much fatigue. So the kicking game does need

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Speaker 3: to improve because that was punished big time leader Leroy Carter.

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Speaker 4: What a breakout try.

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Speaker 3: The Chiefs are lethal on the counter attack, as they showed,

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Speaker 3: and yeah it is on those game drivers, particularly guys

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Speaker 3: like David Hevilly, who's a senior figure in that back line.

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Speaker 3: I thought Quintupia outperformed heavily in a.

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Speaker 4: Not an all black trial.

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Speaker 3: But those sort of matchups what Scott Robinson, the selectors

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Speaker 3: will set up and take notice of. No hope them

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Speaker 3: has been very good for the Crusaders this year, but

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Speaker 3: a couple of costly kicks from him and yeah, you've

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Speaker 3: just got to be better. You've got to be more astute,

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Speaker 3: more accurate. And it was quite staggering, wasn't it to

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Speaker 3: watch that unfold? You were there, there must have been

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Speaker 3: a real dim of silence come over that crowd, A

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Speaker 3: bit of bewilderment in the second half.

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Speaker 2: Well there was yeah, nineteen ten up at halftime. Game

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Speaker 2: wasn't done by any stretch of the imagination. But just

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Speaker 2: when the chief scored those two quick tries to set

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Speaker 2: up the first spell, I sorry early in the second

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Speaker 2: spell to level the game then go aheads, it felt

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Speaker 2: like the year had been sucked out of the stadium.

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Speaker 2: And even at that point, ten minutes into the second spell,

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Speaker 2: it felt like, even though the Crusaders were I can't

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Speaker 2: read the exact score line, but not far behind on

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Speaker 2: the school board, it felt like it was a long

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Speaker 2: way back. That whatever the lead was made well have

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Speaker 2: been fifteen points at that stage. Because the momentum had

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Speaker 2: changed so wildly. It was actually hard to see the

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Speaker 2: Crusaders getting back into the contest, and they never did.

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Speaker 2: The Chiefs played extremely well. I thought Wallace the titi

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Speaker 2: was outstanding. I think it was twenty two carries, one

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Speaker 2: hundred and thirteen meters he scored that great try.

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Speaker 3: What power and strength and knowledge of where he was

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Speaker 3: in relation to the tri line.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, and that try the Chiefs scored where they

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Speaker 2: basically went from inside their own half and just plotted

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Speaker 2: their way up the field. I thought was great. Chiefs

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Speaker 2: Rugby and Damian McKenzie back as well. He'd missed the

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Speaker 2: last couple of weeks the Force and the Hurricanes loss

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Speaker 2: with that injury that was fairly minor hand injury, but

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Speaker 2: just his ability to stand up after halftime, I thought,

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Speaker 2: and direct this team around the paddock I thought was expert.

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Speaker 2: And this is the kind of performance when you look

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Speaker 2: at Super Rugby title victories that can really propel you forward.

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Speaker 3: It can, and the Chiefs have to a degree, you

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Speaker 3: had the Crusader's number in recent years. Obviously the Crusaders

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Speaker 3: went to Hamilton and got the one that mattered in

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Speaker 3: the final, but the Chiefs and round robin play have

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Speaker 3: had a lot of success against the Crusaders.

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Speaker 4: If we take a step back and.

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Speaker 3: Look at this in the context of the year, a

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Speaker 3: loss like this, particularly at home, can have deep psychological scars.

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Speaker 3: Do you still believe the Crusaders can win the title

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Speaker 3: this year?

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Speaker 2: I think they can, but they're clearly second favorite, we

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Speaker 2: even third favorite perhaps for the title. Now obvious they've

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Speaker 2: slipped the third behind the Brumbies. They have to go

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Speaker 2: visit the Brumbies in the final round. That the Wartas

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Speaker 2: away this weekend, which has not been a happy hunting

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Speaker 2: ground for them. Even in the Scott robertson ero of

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Speaker 2: the Crusaders, they dropped a couple of games over there.

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Speaker 2: I think he's the only Australian team that scrolls and

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Speaker 2: lost to his entire tenure for recoll rightly. And they've

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Speaker 2: got the Highlanders in the middle of that at home,

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Speaker 2: a game they should win, So in theory they can

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Speaker 2: win all three of those games. And they've got more

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Speaker 2: games on the table compared to the Chiefs and the Brumbies,

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Speaker 2: so in theory they could still finish top. That home

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Speaker 2: advantage could be key coming to the playoffs if they can

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Speaker 2: run the table from here. But the thing with that

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Speaker 2: kind of lost like that, it just brings those doubts

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Speaker 2: into your mind. And they've got to rebound this week

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Speaker 2: against the Warritas. If it was one off game in

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Speaker 2: Hamilton or in christ Church. I think they could still

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Speaker 2: go up there and beat the Chiefs. They did it

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Speaker 2: last year when they were atrocious. They beat the Chiefs

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Speaker 2: in Hamilton, so I think the last five games heading

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Speaker 2: into that one on the weekend had been five and

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Speaker 2: five split between those two. The Chiefs hadn't had a

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Speaker 2: lot of success in christ Church in recent times, but

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Speaker 2: I think a one off game they can still win,

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Speaker 2: but they need Will Jordan back and the good news

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Speaker 2: is out of that it sounds like he's perhaps two

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Speaker 2: or three weeks away from returning, which is a lot

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Speaker 2: better than maybe people had feared.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I would go as far to say if Will

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Speaker 3: Jordan was gone for the year, that's the Crusader's not done,

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Speaker 3: obviously being the playoffs and could well make the final.

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Speaker 3: But he has been so influential for them this year

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Speaker 3: and it does sound like he'll be back for the playoffs,

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Speaker 3: So you're looking maybe three four weeks, which is great

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Speaker 3: news for the Crusaders and the All Blacks because nobody

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Speaker 3: is in cooey of in terms of form fullbacks. So

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Speaker 3: very interesting to see how they navigate the last three

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Speaker 3: weeks without them, because it's not an easy stretch.

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Speaker 4: As you point out.

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Speaker 2: Let's go back to Friday Night and the Blues beat

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Speaker 2: in the Fiji and drew a thirty four to five

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Speaker 2: in Suva, and look, I don't really what to say

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Speaker 2: about this game other than that the Blues continued their

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Speaker 2: march and their improvement for the Drawer were really disappointing,

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Speaker 2: and it's hard to know what we learned about the Blues.

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Speaker 2: And I've said this in a couple of weeks in

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Speaker 2: a row now around that because the Blues are banked wins.

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Speaker 2: But again this week AGA's more Wana. There'll be a

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Speaker 2: test for them. They've got the Waratahs after the by

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Speaker 2: final round. But again I don't know what we learned

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Speaker 2: about the Blues because I didn't feel like the drawer

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Speaker 2: fired a shot. Now, whether that was because the Blues

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Speaker 2: were so good, whether the Drawer just didn't turn up,

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Speaker 2: I don't really know. Obviously, the Drawer had that horrible

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Speaker 2: news before the game around one of the former sevens

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Speaker 2: players passing away in a tragic car crash. So it's

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Speaker 2: hard to know what to take out of it. What

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Speaker 2: did you take out of that Blues game.

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Speaker 3: I think it showed you can't write the Blues off.

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Speaker 3: They will be in the playoffs and no one will

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Speaker 3: want to play them. They are still very limited in

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Speaker 3: the way that they approach the game, but they have

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Speaker 3: recaptured the authenticity their DNA of Verncotterer and it is

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Speaker 3: very effective when it's done well and it's set peace strength,

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Speaker 3: it's direct, it's powerful the outside back see very limited ball.

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Speaker 3: Boden Barrett's playing very well and he is reveling in

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Speaker 3: that sort of game plan because a lot rests on

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Speaker 3: his shoulders to direct a lot of that. But I

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Speaker 3: agree with you that you can't take too much out

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Speaker 3: of that. The Dria have been very poor this year,

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Speaker 3: even at home, and they rocked by that news pre match.

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Speaker 4: But the Blues did what they have had to do.

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Speaker 3: It was methodical and it was largely impressive, and I

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Speaker 3: think they'll get a few bodies back in the coming weeks.

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Speaker 5: Kate.

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Speaker 3: You put Caleb Clark and Mark Tala back in that team.

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Speaker 3: Stephen Petefetter perhaps in the next couple of weeks as well.

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Speaker 3: Nobody's going to want to play them in the playoffs,

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Speaker 3: even if it's even if the Blues are away from home.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it was clinical from the Blues and those conditions

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Speaker 2: can be tricky, even at night in Fiji. But they

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Speaker 2: rolled their sleeves up, got the job done, left with

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Speaker 2: the five points and I think Vancotta will be pretty

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Speaker 2: pleased with what he saw at Anton. Signa coming off

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Speaker 2: with an injury. But apart from that, I think it

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Speaker 2: was a case of job done for the Blues and

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Speaker 2: they've got an eight down turn around as they played

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Speaker 2: more onea Pacifica this week which in the context of

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Speaker 2: both of their campaigns, the Blues and Fifth Majana on

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Speaker 2: the outside of the Plows at the moment looking in

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Speaker 2: big game at North Harbor Stadium this weekend.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, Blues did it fairly easy in the first local

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Speaker 3: derby with Moana, but I think it will be a

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Speaker 3: different prospect going to Albany. Moana's played well this year

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Speaker 3: there and Ardi and co. Will have a bit of

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Speaker 3: confidence after beating the Landers, so yeah, it'll be a

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Speaker 3: pretty special occasion. You'd think over the Bridge in I

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Speaker 3: guess a bit of a neutral venue in some respects.

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Speaker 2: That's right, So interesting ploth makes at the moment, isn't it.

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Speaker 2: Chiefs out on top on forty one points, Brumbies and

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Speaker 2: second thirty nine, the Crusaders on thirty seven. Crusaders with

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Speaker 2: three games to play, the Chiefs and Brumby's with just

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Speaker 2: two reads in fourth on thirty two, Blues and fifth

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Speaker 2: on twenty seven. Hurricanes in Sex on twenty six Mowana

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Speaker 2: twenty four, Wartars twenty two, Force twenty two, and I

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Speaker 2: think we can roll that behind us and draw certainly

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Speaker 2: making the Plovs. Where do you see the Plovs over

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Speaker 2: the last next couple of weeks? Can anyone Mowana Warritars

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Speaker 2: make their way in on the basis of what we're

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Speaker 2: looking at.

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Speaker 3: No, I think the top six stays as it is.

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Speaker 3: It's just a matter of who finishes where.

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Speaker 2: Chiefs as it was standing, we play the Hurricanes first up.

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Speaker 2: Brumbies have played the Blues Crusaders. I think the Crusaders

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Speaker 2: might be quite happy about that if they play the

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Speaker 2: Reds first week.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I think you would be happy with that. But

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Speaker 3: you want to play the Cane train. They're just coming

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Speaker 3: in some form.

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Speaker 2: Well we'll see about that. Kenna hollow as well.

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Speaker 3: Gone for the year for the year, Yeah, big blow

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Speaker 3: that because he was really starting to hum. But the

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00:19:36,373 --> 00:19:38,493
Speaker 3: Hurricanes have found some form and it's on the back

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Speaker 3: of Riley Higgins and Billy Procter coming into the midfield.

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Speaker 3: Ruben Love going to number ten. He was very good

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Speaker 3: prior to the Buyer and their win over the Chiefs,

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Speaker 3: and I think actually signaled that's his future and longer

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Speaker 3: term as a real prospect of the All Blacks for ten?

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Speaker 2: What implications does this have for the All Blacks? And again,

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Speaker 2: I guess if Ruben Love's at ten, for someone like

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Speaker 2: Stephen Peter Fett to say, do you include Ruben Love

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Speaker 2: as a ten and All Blacks? Does it give you

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Speaker 2: some free to take another player elsewhere? If you've got

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Speaker 2: Ruben Love, I mean he could play ten, he approplay

385
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Speaker 2: right wing, you can play fullback. But would you select

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Speaker 2: them as a ten option in that squad right now?

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Speaker 3: I think he should play ten for the Canes and

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Speaker 3: then be versatile for the All Blacks. I don't think

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Speaker 3: he needs to be pigeonholed as a ten. Look around

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Speaker 3: the world Thomas Farramos, Damien Willimpson and closer to home,

391
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Speaker 3: Bowden Bart, Damien McKenzie, the all interchange between ten and fifteen,

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Speaker 3: and I think Ruben can do that for you know,

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Speaker 3: the next couple of years. Ideally, I think I would

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Speaker 3: like to see him at ten for the Canes for

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Speaker 3: the foreseeable future. But for the All Blacks I think

396
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Speaker 3: obviously you've got Bowden and Damien and Richard Wong a

397
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Speaker 3: coming back next year, so he's not really going to

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Speaker 3: get a looking and that's the same case for Stephen Petefetter.

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Speaker 3: So I can see a scenario where Stephen Peterfetter gets

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Speaker 3: a bit fed up and goes to Japan, and maybe

401
00:21:06,293 --> 00:21:10,933
Speaker 3: you're looking at post World Cup reubend Love becoming a

402
00:21:10,973 --> 00:21:13,613
Speaker 3: real prospect team for the All Blacks. That gives him

403
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Speaker 3: a couple of years to develop, to mature, to have

404
00:21:16,413 --> 00:21:20,613
Speaker 3: time in the saddle, to learn through experience. But he

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00:21:20,693 --> 00:21:24,173
Speaker 3: is of the consummate professional. He works really hard behind

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Speaker 3: the scenes. He's been mentored by TJ. Petinara. He's only

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Speaker 3: twenty four years old, he's resigned to twenty twenty eights.

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Speaker 4: He's got a big future.

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Speaker 2: He certainly does that All Black squads are obviously to

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Speaker 2: be named next month. That'll do us. The first half

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Speaker 2: of the Rugby Direct podcast with our friends at Habit Health,

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Speaker 2: tackling all your aches and pains from sports and work

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Speaker 2: back with the final four, our Tipping and Bryce team

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Speaker 2: joining the pod as well recently retired Blues player on

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Speaker 2: the way.

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Speaker 1: This is Rugby Direct, a podcast for real rugby fans.

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Speaker 2: Every try try as sixty second, every tackle tackle, Get

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Speaker 2: up again, afore.

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Speaker 1: Haf time it's Rugby Direct Ladies.

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Speaker 2: And one Welcome back to Rugby Direct, pound by Habit

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Speaker 2: Health tackling all your inks and pains from sport and work.

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Speaker 2: Second half of the podcast, Price team retired Blues midfielder

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Speaker 2: on the way as well. Time though for the final

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Speaker 2: four four rugby topics Liam and I debate them Let's

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Speaker 2: get into Themre's plenty around This week Liam and the

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Speaker 2: New Zealand under twenties winning the Under twenty edition of

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Speaker 2: the Rugby Championship, beating South Africa forty eight forty five

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Speaker 2: in the final draw against Australia. First up big win

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Speaker 2: against Argentina and then wrapping it up with a win

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Speaker 2: over South Africa, promising signs that. I guess it's hard

431
00:22:45,173 --> 00:22:47,493
Speaker 2: to tell. The World Cup itself is coming up later

432
00:22:47,533 --> 00:22:49,653
Speaker 2: in the year. But to go and beat a South

433
00:22:49,693 --> 00:22:52,613
Speaker 2: African team on South African soil, putting forty eight points

434
00:22:52,613 --> 00:22:55,853
Speaker 2: on I saw the highlights of this, I should say,

435
00:22:56,253 --> 00:22:59,413
Speaker 2: pretty entertaining stuff. Defense might be a work on before

436
00:22:59,453 --> 00:23:00,813
Speaker 2: the World Cup itself.

437
00:23:01,453 --> 00:23:04,013
Speaker 3: Yeah, very high scoring match, wasn't it? Defense optional to

438
00:23:04,053 --> 00:23:06,933
Speaker 3: a degree? But like you say, to go to South

439
00:23:06,933 --> 00:23:09,573
Speaker 3: Africa and get that win and I think defend the

440
00:23:09,653 --> 00:23:13,293
Speaker 3: title in terms of the rugby championship concept. And it

441
00:23:13,413 --> 00:23:16,573
Speaker 3: is great that this concept has been brought back because

442
00:23:16,613 --> 00:23:19,533
Speaker 3: I think you did see the under twenties, particularly in

443
00:23:19,573 --> 00:23:22,813
Speaker 3: New Zealand, fall away compared to the Northern Hemisphere who

444
00:23:22,893 --> 00:23:27,533
Speaker 3: had their six Nations edition. So I'm always a wee

445
00:23:27,573 --> 00:23:32,333
Speaker 3: bit weary about how much these results translate in terms

446
00:23:32,533 --> 00:23:36,613
Speaker 3: of senior men's rugby, but it is a good indication

447
00:23:36,733 --> 00:23:39,333
Speaker 3: and there are some very promising players in that team,

448
00:23:39,573 --> 00:23:43,933
Speaker 3: likes of Dylan Pledger half back I think he signed

449
00:23:43,933 --> 00:23:46,133
Speaker 3: to the Highlanders, looks the goods and a number of

450
00:23:46,213 --> 00:23:49,333
Speaker 3: other guys in that mix. So they'll take a lot

451
00:23:49,333 --> 00:23:52,293
Speaker 3: of conference from that, and yeah, let's hope they can

452
00:23:52,413 --> 00:23:54,213
Speaker 3: bring home the Under twenties World Cup.

453
00:23:54,333 --> 00:23:57,973
Speaker 2: Fingers crossed top number two. The Lions squad British Nish

454
00:23:58,013 --> 00:24:03,213
Speaker 2: line squad announced last week. Marotoji the captain. I mean,

455
00:24:03,293 --> 00:24:08,373
Speaker 2: I guess fairly predictable, Henry Pollock, who was having a

456
00:24:08,373 --> 00:24:10,693
Speaker 2: great young career at this stage, and I guess still

457
00:24:10,733 --> 00:24:14,013
Speaker 2: an unproving quantity at test level. But Andy Farrells punted

458
00:24:14,053 --> 00:24:16,653
Speaker 2: someone like him, very very young, very very raw, and

459
00:24:16,813 --> 00:24:19,213
Speaker 2: he may well may well be the making of him

460
00:24:19,493 --> 00:24:21,773
Speaker 2: in terms of his career by going on this line sto,

461
00:24:21,773 --> 00:24:23,693
Speaker 2: he's going to be carrying around the mascot, I'm sure,

462
00:24:23,733 --> 00:24:26,253
Speaker 2: and being in charge of that. So it's convenestioning there

463
00:24:26,253 --> 00:24:29,813
Speaker 2: how he progresses, but by and large relatory, predictable apart

464
00:24:29,853 --> 00:24:32,853
Speaker 2: from one name and that was the injuring news that

465
00:24:32,933 --> 00:24:36,093
Speaker 2: developed what forty eight hours or thereabouts before the squad

466
00:24:36,173 --> 00:24:38,613
Speaker 2: was named, and a big blow not having Kaitlin Doris there.

467
00:24:38,653 --> 00:24:39,773
Speaker 2: What was your reaction to that team?

468
00:24:40,093 --> 00:24:43,853
Speaker 3: Yeah, massive blow losing Doris. He has been one of

469
00:24:43,853 --> 00:24:46,533
Speaker 3: the form loose forwards and will rugby for a number

470
00:24:46,573 --> 00:24:49,613
Speaker 3: of years now. I think Maro probably would have been captain,

471
00:24:49,693 --> 00:24:54,293
Speaker 3: but Doris was certainly a strong candidate for that. Pollock

472
00:24:55,013 --> 00:24:59,253
Speaker 3: one headline inclusion Finn Smith another from Northampton. The team

473
00:24:59,293 --> 00:25:03,173
Speaker 3: that went to Dublin and upset. I won't call them

474
00:25:03,253 --> 00:25:05,573
Speaker 3: Jordy Barrett's leinster because he's only there for.

475
00:25:05,533 --> 00:25:07,853
Speaker 2: Six months off the bench as well of that game.

476
00:25:07,853 --> 00:25:12,213
Speaker 3: Shocking election call that was Leo Cullen's been roasted for that,

477
00:25:12,853 --> 00:25:16,893
Speaker 3: but yeah, I think a reflection of form and also combinations.

478
00:25:16,933 --> 00:25:21,533
Speaker 3: I think there's fifteen Irishmen in that squad twelve Englishman,

479
00:25:21,613 --> 00:25:25,933
Speaker 3: eight Scotts and two Welsh. So that does reflect the

480
00:25:25,973 --> 00:25:28,813
Speaker 3: balance of power I think in those home nations, and

481
00:25:29,453 --> 00:25:32,093
Speaker 3: there is a lot of combinations that Andy Farrell and

482
00:25:32,293 --> 00:25:36,133
Speaker 3: his coaching team can turn to. But it does really

483
00:25:36,813 --> 00:25:41,333
Speaker 3: spark enthusiasm for that tour. The Lions tours magic. Aren't

484
00:25:41,373 --> 00:25:44,533
Speaker 3: they touring fans and Australia. It's going to really put

485
00:25:44,573 --> 00:25:48,813
Speaker 3: rugby on the map. Give me an early prediction.

486
00:25:50,093 --> 00:25:52,093
Speaker 2: I think the Lines win two one. I know there's

487
00:25:52,093 --> 00:25:53,813
Speaker 2: been a little bit of hyph about the Wallabyes and

488
00:25:54,133 --> 00:25:57,413
Speaker 2: their improvements. Yes they have improved, but I still think

489
00:25:57,453 --> 00:25:59,813
Speaker 2: the Lions when they come together will be too good

490
00:25:59,813 --> 00:26:02,493
Speaker 2: to test. I think the Wallabies will snag one. Ideally,

491
00:26:02,653 --> 00:26:04,213
Speaker 2: you know it's one all heading into the final game

492
00:26:04,253 --> 00:26:05,293
Speaker 2: we get a cracking decider.

493
00:26:05,853 --> 00:26:07,733
Speaker 4: Yeah, I agree. I think the Lions have a really

494
00:26:07,773 --> 00:26:08,253
Speaker 4: good leading.

495
00:26:09,013 --> 00:26:13,053
Speaker 3: They play Argentina and then they have that match against

496
00:26:13,053 --> 00:26:15,653
Speaker 3: the ANZAC combined New Zealand an Australia team as well

497
00:26:15,693 --> 00:26:19,093
Speaker 3: as Super Rugby, so they're not going to be coming

498
00:26:19,133 --> 00:26:19,613
Speaker 3: in colds.

499
00:26:19,773 --> 00:26:20,213
Speaker 4: They play.

500
00:26:20,253 --> 00:26:22,253
Speaker 3: The first Test is in sun Court, which is a

501
00:26:22,253 --> 00:26:24,133
Speaker 3: traditional stronghold for the Wallabies.

502
00:26:24,453 --> 00:26:24,813
Speaker 5: I agree.

503
00:26:24,813 --> 00:26:26,613
Speaker 3: I think they'll get what the Wallabies will get snagged

504
00:26:26,613 --> 00:26:31,173
Speaker 3: one test, but the balance of the Lions squad, the depth,

505
00:26:33,293 --> 00:26:34,933
Speaker 3: it's a strong coaching team.

506
00:26:35,413 --> 00:26:36,733
Speaker 4: I think the lines get it done.

507
00:26:37,653 --> 00:26:40,613
Speaker 2: Top of number three in the final four. An exclusive

508
00:26:40,693 --> 00:26:43,893
Speaker 2: from friend Christy Dorian, friend of the podcast last week's

509
00:26:43,893 --> 00:26:47,973
Speaker 2: deducing that the Western Seaward of the United States has

510
00:26:47,973 --> 00:26:50,973
Speaker 2: been lined up as a twelfth home for a super

511
00:26:51,053 --> 00:26:54,933
Speaker 2: rugby team and then the twenty thirty Nations Cup potentially

512
00:26:55,053 --> 00:26:57,893
Speaker 2: final but potentially being held in New York. I guess

513
00:26:57,933 --> 00:27:00,453
Speaker 2: on a super rugby front, Liam, what do you make

514
00:27:00,533 --> 00:27:00,893
Speaker 2: of that?

515
00:27:01,493 --> 00:27:07,613
Speaker 3: No? Thanks, yeah, Look, I fully understand and appreciate the

516
00:27:07,733 --> 00:27:11,653
Speaker 3: financial of the States. If you crack one percent of

517
00:27:11,653 --> 00:27:17,173
Speaker 3: that market, got your maid. And that's why the Rugby

518
00:27:17,173 --> 00:27:19,173
Speaker 3: World Cup will be held there. That's why the All

519
00:27:19,173 --> 00:27:22,653
Speaker 3: Blacks will play on in Chicago there and they've played Fiji,

520
00:27:23,173 --> 00:27:26,213
Speaker 3: and why other nations are going there. The state that

521
00:27:26,293 --> 00:27:30,093
Speaker 3: the NRL has taken their opening weekends at to Vegas.

522
00:27:30,133 --> 00:27:36,853
Speaker 3: So it's very attractive financially, but the rugby depth is

523
00:27:36,893 --> 00:27:40,613
Speaker 3: not there, and a startup team makes me very anxious,

524
00:27:40,693 --> 00:27:43,093
Speaker 3: very nervous. We've seen the pitfalls of that. With Super

525
00:27:43,173 --> 00:27:46,493
Speaker 3: Rugby in the past, it's just finding its feats. It's

526
00:27:46,493 --> 00:27:49,253
Speaker 3: been a brilliant competition this year. I don't want to

527
00:27:49,253 --> 00:27:50,013
Speaker 3: see the mess with that.

528
00:27:50,533 --> 00:27:53,173
Speaker 2: I don't either. I don't think this is what the

529
00:27:53,213 --> 00:27:57,053
Speaker 2: public is crying out for. And they talk about putting

530
00:27:57,093 --> 00:28:00,733
Speaker 2: fan first and fans centric everything like that. No one,

531
00:28:01,373 --> 00:28:03,933
Speaker 2: apart from maybe a few rugby fans in America, are

532
00:28:03,933 --> 00:28:07,373
Speaker 2: crying out for a US Super Rugby team.

533
00:28:07,733 --> 00:28:08,933
Speaker 5: I would prefer to.

534
00:28:08,893 --> 00:28:11,093
Speaker 2: See the return of the Hawaidis, which brings its own

535
00:28:11,133 --> 00:28:14,093
Speaker 2: logistical complications, but at least you can probably guarantee there

536
00:28:14,333 --> 00:28:16,413
Speaker 2: from the get go they are going to be competitive

537
00:28:16,453 --> 00:28:19,653
Speaker 2: and going to bring some rugby value to the competition.

538
00:28:19,733 --> 00:28:22,693
Speaker 2: I just do not see what value this American thing has.

539
00:28:22,853 --> 00:28:26,293
Speaker 2: And they're desperate strymake at work, because there are reports

540
00:28:26,813 --> 00:28:29,773
Speaker 2: week or two back that they were considering flipping the

541
00:28:29,813 --> 00:28:33,333
Speaker 2: World Cups around from the twenty thirty one, which is

542
00:28:33,373 --> 00:28:35,333
Speaker 2: when they're supposed to the Men's Rugby World Cup, to

543
00:28:35,373 --> 00:28:38,733
Speaker 2: twenty thirty five, and putting the United Kingdom in Ireland

544
00:28:38,773 --> 00:28:41,573
Speaker 2: in for twenty thirty one. That's not going to happen,

545
00:28:41,613 --> 00:28:43,413
Speaker 2: but they're desperate to make it work, but no one

546
00:28:43,413 --> 00:28:45,333
Speaker 2: seems to really know the answer, so they're throwing shit

547
00:28:45,413 --> 00:28:47,573
Speaker 2: at a wall and going, oh, super Rugby team work

548
00:28:47,573 --> 00:28:49,573
Speaker 2: a Nation's Cup final. I don't really care about the

549
00:28:49,613 --> 00:28:52,053
Speaker 2: Nation's Cup final. That's fine, I can abide with that.

550
00:28:52,133 --> 00:28:56,013
Speaker 2: But the Super Rugby team is a long term investment.

551
00:28:56,333 --> 00:28:58,373
Speaker 2: We've just got Super ud back to a point where

552
00:28:58,413 --> 00:29:00,773
Speaker 2: it can build from the last thing it needs is

553
00:29:00,813 --> 00:29:04,773
Speaker 2: having you know, the La guilteenies or someone back in

554
00:29:04,773 --> 00:29:07,253
Speaker 2: the comp and pulling it down again. And you've got

555
00:29:07,333 --> 00:29:09,253
Speaker 2: eighty yearal blowouts every time you go and play in

556
00:29:09,333 --> 00:29:11,773
Speaker 2: La or wherever it might be. I just think this

557
00:29:11,853 --> 00:29:14,013
Speaker 2: is a misstep. They're desperate to make America work, but

558
00:29:14,053 --> 00:29:17,013
Speaker 2: no one's really knowing, not sure how it can actually work.

559
00:29:17,373 --> 00:29:20,133
Speaker 3: Super Raby doesn't need to be a sacrificial lamb for

560
00:29:20,293 --> 00:29:24,133
Speaker 3: those World Cups. And yeah, there are grave concerns for

561
00:29:25,333 --> 00:29:28,333
Speaker 3: the Men's World Cup in particular and the interest that's

562
00:29:28,373 --> 00:29:32,893
Speaker 3: going to generate and the revenue needed to fund particularly

563
00:29:33,053 --> 00:29:35,933
Speaker 3: Tier two nations, but that's not Super Rugby's problem.

564
00:29:36,013 --> 00:29:37,253
Speaker 4: That's World Rugby's problem.

565
00:29:37,653 --> 00:29:45,333
Speaker 3: And yeah, you can't manufacture a team overnight, and there

566
00:29:45,333 --> 00:29:48,133
Speaker 3: aren't direct flights to Argentina, there are to the west

567
00:29:48,133 --> 00:29:50,653
Speaker 3: coast of the States, so that makes sense. But from

568
00:29:50,893 --> 00:29:55,653
Speaker 3: a competitiveness point of view, when this year's competition has

569
00:29:55,693 --> 00:30:02,413
Speaker 3: been engaging the jeopardies there, Australia's stepped up, there's been upsets.

570
00:30:02,653 --> 00:30:07,453
Speaker 3: It's everything you want from a competition. Don't take that

571
00:30:07,533 --> 00:30:09,773
Speaker 3: away just as it's finding its feet.

572
00:30:09,973 --> 00:30:12,373
Speaker 2: That's right. I think we're an ingredients on that one topic.

573
00:30:12,493 --> 00:30:14,813
Speaker 2: Number four. In New Zealand rugby post a nineteen point

574
00:30:14,813 --> 00:30:19,973
Speaker 2: five million dollar losses but record levels of revenue. This

575
00:30:20,013 --> 00:30:23,133
Speaker 2: probably came is not really a surprise, but you know

576
00:30:23,173 --> 00:30:25,853
Speaker 2: it's a flashing figure up in lights.

577
00:30:25,893 --> 00:30:25,973
Speaker 5: Is it?

578
00:30:26,133 --> 00:30:30,573
Speaker 2: Nineteen point five million dollar loss? Not a good scenario

579
00:30:30,613 --> 00:30:32,693
Speaker 2: of New Zealand rugby? Who I think it posted three

580
00:30:32,733 --> 00:30:38,013
Speaker 2: consecutive losses in a row. Now we know the money's

581
00:30:38,013 --> 00:30:41,413
Speaker 2: coming in, it's where it's going, is the question mark.

582
00:30:42,053 --> 00:30:44,133
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's a bit to unpack here. Some of that

583
00:30:44,213 --> 00:30:51,733
Speaker 3: loss is due to the Enios sponsorship and they pulled

584
00:30:51,813 --> 00:30:55,613
Speaker 3: money out of the States and lost on the currency

585
00:30:56,293 --> 00:30:59,493
Speaker 3: the timing of that. But it is concerning and one

586
00:30:59,493 --> 00:31:02,253
Speaker 3: of the concerns is the massive investment that they made

587
00:31:02,333 --> 00:31:06,253
Speaker 3: in New Zealand Rugby plus the platform itself. I think

588
00:31:06,293 --> 00:31:08,813
Speaker 3: something like eleven million dollars has gone to that over

589
00:31:08,853 --> 00:31:11,533
Speaker 3: the past two and a half years, maybe even more,

590
00:31:11,933 --> 00:31:15,813
Speaker 3: and I would argue haven't seen a return on that investment.

591
00:31:15,893 --> 00:31:20,093
Speaker 3: So the other concern is money going out the door

592
00:31:20,173 --> 00:31:24,133
Speaker 3: to Silver Lake and the percentages that the players and

593
00:31:24,413 --> 00:31:29,173
Speaker 3: the provincial unions take. Those figures aren't sustainable and like

594
00:31:29,213 --> 00:31:32,253
Speaker 3: you say, when you're bringing in record revenue, you should

595
00:31:32,253 --> 00:31:35,213
Speaker 3: be in a better state. So there's going to be

596
00:31:35,253 --> 00:31:37,693
Speaker 3: a bit of a come to Jesus moment in the

597
00:31:37,733 --> 00:31:40,853
Speaker 3: near future for New Zealand rugby arounds where their money

598
00:31:40,853 --> 00:31:45,693
Speaker 3: goes because they're still spending more than they earn essentially members.

599
00:31:45,733 --> 00:31:49,453
Speaker 2: Last time you logged into insit up plus the World Cup,

600
00:31:50,613 --> 00:31:55,533
Speaker 2: so what's that two years? It's Look, we are coming

601
00:31:55,533 --> 00:31:57,533
Speaker 2: from a different perspective than a fan. We're coming through

602
00:31:57,733 --> 00:32:01,453
Speaker 2: as broadcasters and journalists into it. But I just don't

603
00:32:01,493 --> 00:32:05,413
Speaker 2: see the value proposition there for fans. I guess it's

604
00:32:05,413 --> 00:32:07,533
Speaker 2: being modeled on the Premier League sort of things. You've

605
00:32:07,533 --> 00:32:10,773
Speaker 2: got me United TV and then Liverpool Plus and all

606
00:32:10,773 --> 00:32:13,413
Speaker 2: those sort of things, and they pump out a lot

607
00:32:13,413 --> 00:32:16,693
Speaker 2: of content and you feel connected to the club and

608
00:32:17,173 --> 00:32:18,773
Speaker 2: there's a real fandom that I just don't know that

609
00:32:18,773 --> 00:32:23,093
Speaker 2: New Zealand Rugby has that same proposition as a Premier

610
00:32:23,133 --> 00:32:27,733
Speaker 2: League club or the connection there, And that's always going

611
00:32:27,773 --> 00:32:30,653
Speaker 2: to be the issue for getting sign ups and getting

612
00:32:30,693 --> 00:32:33,213
Speaker 2: people logging in and watching these things, is that there's

613
00:32:33,253 --> 00:32:36,733
Speaker 2: no real three to sixty five day days a year,

614
00:32:37,333 --> 00:32:39,053
Speaker 2: twenty four to seven connection like you do with a

615
00:32:39,053 --> 00:32:40,573
Speaker 2: Premier League club and that sort of fandom.

616
00:32:40,653 --> 00:32:44,053
Speaker 3: You're not really driving traffic on a regular basis, and

617
00:32:44,413 --> 00:32:46,413
Speaker 3: I think the only real way to do that is

618
00:32:46,453 --> 00:32:51,773
Speaker 3: if they were streaming live games and packaging content around that,

619
00:32:51,813 --> 00:32:56,773
Speaker 3: whether that be shows or news or those sorts of

620
00:32:56,853 --> 00:32:59,693
Speaker 3: things need to complement it because what they are currently

621
00:32:59,733 --> 00:33:02,173
Speaker 3: producing is not going to bring in the audience.

622
00:33:02,173 --> 00:33:04,453
Speaker 2: That's right, and live games well, then money comes from

623
00:33:04,453 --> 00:33:08,053
Speaker 2: broadcasting rights, so a lot of the money. So they're

624
00:33:08,053 --> 00:33:10,133
Speaker 2: not going to put these games up for free. Whatever

625
00:33:10,173 --> 00:33:12,813
Speaker 2: it might be. It's stuck putting a rock and a

626
00:33:12,813 --> 00:33:14,253
Speaker 2: hard plays. I just don't know where it goes to,

627
00:33:14,613 --> 00:33:16,773
Speaker 2: and that's going to be the fascinating thing. Maybe in

628
00:33:16,813 --> 00:33:22,013
Speaker 2: the new visual broadcast deal, there's no NPC on Sky

629
00:33:22,253 --> 00:33:23,973
Speaker 2: or design or whoever picks up the rights and maybe

630
00:33:24,053 --> 00:33:26,413
Speaker 2: ends it up. Plus can broadcast in partnership with some

631
00:33:26,453 --> 00:33:28,413
Speaker 2: of these unions and you get a bit of go

632
00:33:28,533 --> 00:33:31,373
Speaker 2: forward there. That's maybe an avenue down the track, but

633
00:33:31,573 --> 00:33:34,013
Speaker 2: at the moment it feels like it's treading water.

634
00:33:34,853 --> 00:33:35,053
Speaker 5: Yeah.

635
00:33:35,093 --> 00:33:39,533
Speaker 3: I think whether it's NPC or New Zealand, MALDI or

636
00:33:39,893 --> 00:33:42,373
Speaker 3: or Blacks fifteen or something, I think there needs to

637
00:33:42,373 --> 00:33:46,613
Speaker 3: be some form of live component or something to drive

638
00:33:47,773 --> 00:33:51,213
Speaker 3: greater audiences, because otherwise it's not going to get off

639
00:33:51,253 --> 00:33:51,613
Speaker 3: the ground.

640
00:33:52,013 --> 00:33:54,573
Speaker 2: Let's get into our tipping in. Look a shopping week

641
00:33:54,613 --> 00:33:56,333
Speaker 2: for you. Nick Neuly put in the tips for you

642
00:33:57,093 --> 00:34:00,933
Speaker 2: word with Nicole, the drawer, the Tars, the Crusaders. There

643
00:34:00,973 --> 00:34:03,853
Speaker 2: might have been some noop. You can go listen back

644
00:34:03,893 --> 00:34:06,573
Speaker 2: and stitch up to fit the Brumbies though, So you

645
00:34:06,653 --> 00:34:09,413
Speaker 2: did get one that week, thirty five points and a

646
00:34:09,453 --> 00:34:13,053
Speaker 2: half year on, I picked all four, so that's good news. Blues, Reds, Chiefs, Brumbies.

647
00:34:13,213 --> 00:34:15,213
Speaker 2: So I've got a forty three and a half score

648
00:34:15,413 --> 00:34:16,533
Speaker 2: at eight point lead.

649
00:34:16,773 --> 00:34:17,013
Speaker 4: Lucky.

650
00:34:17,053 --> 00:34:21,173
Speaker 3: The Crusaders are timing their tank, so I'll be catching

651
00:34:21,253 --> 00:34:21,853
Speaker 3: up soon enough.

652
00:34:21,893 --> 00:34:25,333
Speaker 2: Friday night, the Hurricanes do the Highlanders derail the cane

653
00:34:25,333 --> 00:34:27,013
Speaker 2: train at sky Stadium.

654
00:34:27,413 --> 00:34:28,053
Speaker 4: No they did not.

655
00:34:28,133 --> 00:34:31,653
Speaker 3: I think even now resident Highland as man Paul Cully

656
00:34:31,973 --> 00:34:34,133
Speaker 3: might have even given up way with the white flag,

657
00:34:34,253 --> 00:34:35,813
Speaker 3: given up hope for this one.

658
00:34:35,973 --> 00:34:38,573
Speaker 2: I think it's hard to see the Highlanders winning that.

659
00:34:38,613 --> 00:34:42,013
Speaker 2: I'm going to Hurricanes Waratars Crusaders nine to thirty five

660
00:34:42,133 --> 00:34:45,973
Speaker 2: in Sydney, both teams missing their first choice fullbacks. Joseph

661
00:34:45,973 --> 00:34:47,773
Speaker 2: of course, I saw Elite you out for the war Retars,

662
00:34:48,013 --> 00:34:52,133
Speaker 2: will Jordan out for the Crusaders. Crusaders haven't done too

663
00:34:52,133 --> 00:34:54,973
Speaker 2: well in Sydney in recent times. Do they bounce back?

664
00:34:55,573 --> 00:34:59,173
Speaker 3: Look, I've always liked the Tars Elliott, but I am

665
00:34:59,213 --> 00:35:00,813
Speaker 3: gonna tip the Crusaders.

666
00:35:00,933 --> 00:35:03,253
Speaker 2: I am as well. I picked the Blues are task.

667
00:35:03,253 --> 00:35:04,933
Speaker 2: I think it will be I think it will be tight.

668
00:35:05,373 --> 00:35:06,893
Speaker 2: I think it will be to it was tight last year.

669
00:35:07,093 --> 00:35:10,613
Speaker 2: They blew it after the siren with the the conversion

670
00:35:10,613 --> 00:35:13,413
Speaker 2: of where it was Fiji and drew hosting the Force

671
00:35:13,573 --> 00:35:18,333
Speaker 2: on Saturday afternoon. The Drawer seems to have had a

672
00:35:18,333 --> 00:35:21,253
Speaker 2: real run of home games in recent times, and they

673
00:35:21,293 --> 00:35:24,333
Speaker 2: will entertain the Force at Churchill Park in Lataka.

674
00:35:24,973 --> 00:35:29,533
Speaker 3: I think the Drawer because it's in Lawatoka afternoon game

675
00:35:30,293 --> 00:35:33,373
Speaker 3: and they just have to produce something at some point,

676
00:35:33,453 --> 00:35:33,973
Speaker 3: don't there.

677
00:35:33,813 --> 00:35:36,573
Speaker 2: They do match around from the new Zalm perspective. Anyway,

678
00:35:36,613 --> 00:35:39,533
Speaker 2: mo Waa Pacifica against the Blues five ye seven, Big

679
00:35:39,573 --> 00:35:44,573
Speaker 2: playoff implications at North Harbor Stadium, the home of Mowana Pacifica.

680
00:35:45,373 --> 00:35:47,213
Speaker 2: Brie will be going on before the game.

681
00:35:48,093 --> 00:35:49,813
Speaker 3: It will be happening and the Blues are going to

682
00:35:49,813 --> 00:35:51,333
Speaker 3: crash the party unfortunately American.

683
00:35:51,413 --> 00:35:54,973
Speaker 2: I'm going to go Majana for an upset to get

684
00:35:55,013 --> 00:35:59,453
Speaker 2: the playoff mix rolling again and Brumbies and Reds around

685
00:35:59,533 --> 00:36:02,333
Speaker 2: us out for around fourteen on Saturday nights.

686
00:36:02,573 --> 00:36:03,733
Speaker 4: I'll go to Brums at home.

687
00:36:05,733 --> 00:36:07,853
Speaker 2: I'm going to go the Reds for an upset Liz Kis.

688
00:36:08,413 --> 00:36:12,573
Speaker 2: Because we trust Kiss, we trust MVP Medal voting time.

689
00:36:13,733 --> 00:36:15,253
Speaker 2: I'll remind you the lead artist save he has a

690
00:36:15,293 --> 00:36:17,773
Speaker 2: six point buffer. Indeed he does in the official Super

691
00:36:17,813 --> 00:36:21,253
Speaker 2: Rugby's medal standings as well. Boden Baron on thirteen, Will

692
00:36:21,333 --> 00:36:23,893
Speaker 2: Jordan on nine your three two ones Limb.

693
00:36:24,333 --> 00:36:26,533
Speaker 4: I'm going to go Wallace to Tt Elliott's.

694
00:36:26,573 --> 00:36:29,813
Speaker 3: He was very very impressive in his first start with

695
00:36:29,853 --> 00:36:31,893
Speaker 3: there for the Chiefs, Hoskins the two too. I think

696
00:36:31,933 --> 00:36:34,733
Speaker 3: he's starting to really build in some form that that

697
00:36:34,773 --> 00:36:39,093
Speaker 3: Blues loose Ford trio, Dolden Popo Leese Yes starting to

698
00:36:39,093 --> 00:36:42,453
Speaker 3: come to the four as well. And Quenter Payer I

699
00:36:42,493 --> 00:36:46,613
Speaker 3: mentioned earlier. I think he uppointed David Havilli, so he's

700
00:36:46,613 --> 00:36:50,173
Speaker 3: had a breakout season. I think it's been three years

701
00:36:50,213 --> 00:36:53,093
Speaker 3: since he played for the All Blacks and as it

702
00:36:53,133 --> 00:36:54,813
Speaker 3: stands with events on Leonard Brown aw the MIXX, he

703
00:36:54,893 --> 00:36:55,853
Speaker 3: bear my ole Black squad.

704
00:36:56,213 --> 00:36:59,053
Speaker 2: Well, there you go, that's a bit call. We need

705
00:36:59,093 --> 00:37:01,493
Speaker 2: to do our All Blacks squad at some point as well,

706
00:37:01,493 --> 00:37:03,293
Speaker 2: do it in the coming weeks before we wrap up

707
00:37:03,293 --> 00:37:05,813
Speaker 2: things though. Great pleasure to be joined on rugby derick

708
00:37:05,853 --> 00:37:09,933
Speaker 2: by Bryce Heem Blues midfield who announced it retirement a

709
00:37:09,933 --> 00:37:13,373
Speaker 2: couple of weeks ago from the professional game, had any

710
00:37:13,453 --> 00:37:15,733
Speaker 2: number of clubs. He played forty two games for the

711
00:37:15,773 --> 00:37:17,893
Speaker 2: Blues in the end, but started his career at Auckland

712
00:37:17,933 --> 00:37:21,133
Speaker 2: in the NPC, then played for Northland Tasman, had a

713
00:37:21,173 --> 00:37:23,493
Speaker 2: stint with the Chiefs, back to Auckland after that the

714
00:37:23,533 --> 00:37:26,413
Speaker 2: Worcester Warriors too long, then to the Blues for that

715
00:37:26,453 --> 00:37:29,133
Speaker 2: forty two game stint rounded out his career with Auckland,

716
00:37:29,213 --> 00:37:31,013
Speaker 2: had a stint with the New Zealand seven side. As all,

717
00:37:31,053 --> 00:37:33,933
Speaker 2: Bryce Heam has done it all and we chatted with

718
00:37:34,013 --> 00:37:36,453
Speaker 2: him Bryce team big welcome to rug pea direct thanks

719
00:37:36,453 --> 00:37:38,373
Speaker 2: for coming in, no, thank you for having me. Happy

720
00:37:38,373 --> 00:37:40,733
Speaker 2: to be here. Well a few days or a week

721
00:37:40,853 --> 00:37:43,133
Speaker 2: or so since you announced your retirement to Cappy in

722
00:37:43,173 --> 00:37:46,133
Speaker 2: your decision and enjoying retired life.

723
00:37:46,613 --> 00:37:49,693
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, you know, it was a I guess, tough

724
00:37:49,693 --> 00:37:52,173
Speaker 5: decision to come to. In the end, my hand was

725
00:37:52,253 --> 00:37:56,813
Speaker 5: kind of forced, no pun intended for the rest of injury.

726
00:37:57,493 --> 00:38:01,373
Speaker 5: But yeah, enjoying retirement, gone into mortgage broking and enjoying

727
00:38:01,373 --> 00:38:04,213
Speaker 5: the new gig, enjoy not waking up sore every morning.

728
00:38:04,773 --> 00:38:08,213
Speaker 5: And yeah, yeah it's been good so far. Nice.

729
00:38:08,933 --> 00:38:14,573
Speaker 3: I think you had fourteen years, three countries, seven teams.

730
00:38:14,253 --> 00:38:15,933
Speaker 3: You've got got around.

731
00:38:19,293 --> 00:38:20,373
Speaker 5: Thanks for putting it so kind.

732
00:38:23,453 --> 00:38:27,773
Speaker 4: It's obviously hard to boil that down. But what are

733
00:38:29,373 --> 00:38:31,933
Speaker 4: are you general reflections of your career?

734
00:38:34,013 --> 00:38:38,053
Speaker 5: Yeah, I guess, yes, somewhat of a journeyman, but I

735
00:38:38,973 --> 00:38:41,813
Speaker 5: don't look back on the career with any regrets of

736
00:38:41,853 --> 00:38:45,413
Speaker 5: you know, staying in one place and because yeah, the

737
00:38:45,693 --> 00:38:50,333
Speaker 5: people I got to meet were amazing, especially you know

738
00:38:50,453 --> 00:38:55,453
Speaker 5: overseas as well, a lot of foreigners as well, and

739
00:38:55,493 --> 00:38:59,413
Speaker 5: you know, like minded people coming together to in a

740
00:38:59,533 --> 00:39:01,973
Speaker 5: foreign space and then you know, having that in common

741
00:39:02,013 --> 00:39:06,613
Speaker 5: and you know, I guess developing some pretty special relationships

742
00:39:06,693 --> 00:39:09,733
Speaker 5: is pretty cool stuff that you wouldn't get if you

743
00:39:09,813 --> 00:39:13,213
Speaker 5: just stayed in New Zealand. And then you know, getting

744
00:39:13,253 --> 00:39:17,373
Speaker 5: to fully immerse yourself into different cultures as well, which

745
00:39:17,413 --> 00:39:19,213
Speaker 5: is which is pretty special and something that me and

746
00:39:19,293 --> 00:39:24,093
Speaker 5: my wife always wanted to go and do. But yeah,

747
00:39:24,173 --> 00:39:26,013
Speaker 5: it's taken me all over the show of my career

748
00:39:26,093 --> 00:39:28,253
Speaker 5: and yeah, I've got no regrets when I look back

749
00:39:28,293 --> 00:39:28,733
Speaker 5: on it now.

750
00:39:29,733 --> 00:39:33,013
Speaker 4: Yeah, obviously New Zealand, France and England.

751
00:39:33,893 --> 00:39:35,733
Speaker 3: I want to I see about France in particular because

752
00:39:35,773 --> 00:39:39,933
Speaker 3: it is a very different rugby experience, particularly with the

753
00:39:39,973 --> 00:39:42,173
Speaker 3: you know, like the ownership model and you're at too

754
00:39:42,173 --> 00:39:44,213
Speaker 3: long with what's his name?

755
00:39:45,293 --> 00:39:48,333
Speaker 4: Probably yeah, but that pronunciation, but.

756
00:39:50,253 --> 00:39:54,253
Speaker 3: Either but yeah, I'm not sure if you there when

757
00:39:54,293 --> 00:39:58,453
Speaker 3: Jewels was there, but just you know, if you compare

758
00:39:58,453 --> 00:40:00,933
Speaker 3: it to New Zealand, and we do have private investment,

759
00:40:00,973 --> 00:40:03,893
Speaker 3: but it's very hands off. But when you've got one

760
00:40:03,893 --> 00:40:08,773
Speaker 3: owner quite demanding, come in the sheds and barat players publicly.

761
00:40:08,813 --> 00:40:13,853
Speaker 3: Sometimes what's the environment like and how different is it

762
00:40:14,093 --> 00:40:19,053
Speaker 3: both stylistically and in terms of having a hands on owner.

763
00:40:20,733 --> 00:40:24,733
Speaker 5: I guess for me, when I came into Toulon, Mourad

764
00:40:24,853 --> 00:40:26,413
Speaker 5: was sort of on the way out and there was

765
00:40:26,413 --> 00:40:29,013
Speaker 5: a new owner coming in and so I didn't get

766
00:40:29,053 --> 00:40:33,413
Speaker 5: to I guess really experience everything. I guess that the

767
00:40:35,013 --> 00:40:39,373
Speaker 5: that was advertised about Maurad, especially everything that happened with Jewels,

768
00:40:39,413 --> 00:40:41,853
Speaker 5: and when I got there, Jewels was still there. Mauraud

769
00:40:41,973 --> 00:40:43,453
Speaker 5: was on the way out, so it all sort of

770
00:40:43,933 --> 00:40:46,453
Speaker 5: died down by the time I got there. Then with

771
00:40:46,533 --> 00:40:51,853
Speaker 5: the new owner, he was amazing. I had a great

772
00:40:51,893 --> 00:40:55,853
Speaker 5: experience there, and I think when I look back at it,

773
00:40:55,973 --> 00:40:58,573
Speaker 5: we were pretty lucky that he did come on board

774
00:40:59,093 --> 00:41:03,493
Speaker 5: with COVID and everything that came up, because a lot

775
00:41:03,493 --> 00:41:07,213
Speaker 5: of clubs went under or when getting paid and things

776
00:41:07,213 --> 00:41:10,293
Speaker 5: like that, whereas he, you know, he honored the contracts

777
00:41:10,333 --> 00:41:13,853
Speaker 5: and and kept paying us and there was that was huge.

778
00:41:14,733 --> 00:41:18,213
Speaker 5: And yeah, I would put the house on it there

779
00:41:18,253 --> 00:41:19,613
Speaker 5: if Miratus saw there, they wouldn't.

780
00:41:21,213 --> 00:41:22,933
Speaker 2: How did that move come about? Because you're at Worcester

781
00:41:23,013 --> 00:41:25,053
Speaker 2: at the time and then went across to Toulon.

782
00:41:25,333 --> 00:41:30,013
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, yeah, So I had done about four and

783
00:41:30,053 --> 00:41:32,893
Speaker 5: a bit years in England and and loved my time there,

784
00:41:33,453 --> 00:41:37,133
Speaker 5: loved the club. You know, we went that successful on

785
00:41:37,173 --> 00:41:39,533
Speaker 5: the field, but off the field, we we got after

786
00:41:39,613 --> 00:41:42,573
Speaker 5: it and we had a lot of fun and and

787
00:41:42,653 --> 00:41:45,253
Speaker 5: you know, met some great people, made some great mates,

788
00:41:45,333 --> 00:41:47,653
Speaker 5: and I think we were just ready for a change.

789
00:41:49,333 --> 00:41:52,893
Speaker 5: And we've always wanted to try and learn a new

790
00:41:53,013 --> 00:41:56,693
Speaker 5: language and and go into a different a different culture.

791
00:41:56,813 --> 00:41:59,573
Speaker 5: And you know, France was always quite appealing to us,

792
00:41:59,613 --> 00:42:02,333
Speaker 5: and there was an opportunity to go there and play

793
00:42:02,453 --> 00:42:05,253
Speaker 5: rugby and you know, and and some good money and

794
00:42:05,253 --> 00:42:08,293
Speaker 5: and you know, enjoy a different lifestyle. We were all

795
00:42:09,173 --> 00:42:12,813
Speaker 5: all up for it. So something came across across my table,

796
00:42:12,853 --> 00:42:15,733
Speaker 5: and yeah, we jumped at it. It was awesome. It

797
00:42:15,813 --> 00:42:20,213
Speaker 5: was awesome. You know, forty five minutes from Sentrepez on

798
00:42:20,333 --> 00:42:23,093
Speaker 5: the in the south coast of France. It doesn't doesn't

799
00:42:23,133 --> 00:42:23,813
Speaker 5: get better.

800
00:42:23,733 --> 00:42:26,213
Speaker 4: Yet, it sounds right, how good?

801
00:42:28,493 --> 00:42:32,573
Speaker 3: Fourteen years it's a it's a lifetime in many respects.

802
00:42:32,653 --> 00:42:33,453
Speaker 4: You know, you grow up.

803
00:42:33,333 --> 00:42:37,973
Speaker 3: From a boy to a man, you travel with the world,

804
00:42:38,413 --> 00:42:42,053
Speaker 3: you start a family, what are some of your big

805
00:42:42,253 --> 00:42:47,093
Speaker 3: lessons big takeaways from that time? And I guess life

806
00:42:47,133 --> 00:42:50,573
Speaker 3: in the spotlight, because growing up in the spotlight is

807
00:42:50,653 --> 00:42:53,573
Speaker 3: not easy for everyone. You know, you make a lot

808
00:42:53,573 --> 00:42:55,933
Speaker 3: of mistakes. Well, some people make mistakes. We all no

809
00:42:55,933 --> 00:42:58,533
Speaker 3: one's perfect. What what what would be some of your

810
00:42:58,933 --> 00:43:03,573
Speaker 3: big lessons big takeaways from from I guess life around Rugby.

811
00:43:05,373 --> 00:43:07,253
Speaker 5: No. I guess I was lucky in the censor as

812
00:43:07,293 --> 00:43:11,093
Speaker 5: I wasn't like and such a big spot as to

813
00:43:11,173 --> 00:43:13,013
Speaker 5: some other guys. You know that they're a lot, a

814
00:43:13,013 --> 00:43:17,013
Speaker 5: lot more successful anti Eureko's and and people like that,

815
00:43:17,053 --> 00:43:21,573
Speaker 5: for example. But I think the best thing you can

816
00:43:21,613 --> 00:43:25,173
Speaker 5: do in that sort of environment, especially right if you

817
00:43:25,253 --> 00:43:28,133
Speaker 5: are a global superstar, is such a young age. Then

818
00:43:28,573 --> 00:43:31,533
Speaker 5: that support network around you is probably the biggest thing,

819
00:43:33,173 --> 00:43:36,813
Speaker 5: because yeah, you got young, young shoulders and the young

820
00:43:36,853 --> 00:43:41,493
Speaker 5: head on them, right, and there's there's just so much

821
00:43:41,493 --> 00:43:44,493
Speaker 5: that you don't know. There's so much that's unknown, and

822
00:43:44,933 --> 00:43:48,613
Speaker 5: you need one a good agent, I think, to help

823
00:43:48,653 --> 00:43:53,573
Speaker 5: you out, help navigate contracts, decisions, all that sort of stuff.

824
00:43:53,613 --> 00:43:58,213
Speaker 5: And then good good family, good friends around you as well.

825
00:43:58,333 --> 00:44:00,613
Speaker 5: That's probably the biggest biggest thing for me and I was.

826
00:44:00,733 --> 00:44:04,453
Speaker 5: I was very fortunate in that department with my agent

827
00:44:04,493 --> 00:44:07,293
Speaker 5: and Dan Kane and and then with my family and

828
00:44:07,293 --> 00:44:12,613
Speaker 5: my partner as well, So that would be the biggest

829
00:44:12,653 --> 00:44:19,973
Speaker 5: one for sure. And I guess try not to get

830
00:44:20,573 --> 00:44:22,493
Speaker 5: caught up in the hype of it all, if that

831
00:44:22,573 --> 00:44:28,493
Speaker 5: makes sense. I constantly had to remind myself why I

832
00:44:28,493 --> 00:44:31,173
Speaker 5: I wanted to do this and why I loved playing rugby,

833
00:44:31,213 --> 00:44:33,533
Speaker 5: And it always comes back to their grassroots footy. You know,

834
00:44:33,533 --> 00:44:36,173
Speaker 5: you're playing with mates, you enjoy beer after the game,

835
00:44:36,253 --> 00:44:39,413
Speaker 5: and you're all about trying to win something together and

836
00:44:40,533 --> 00:44:43,973
Speaker 5: enjoying each other's company. And sometimes it's easy to get

837
00:44:43,973 --> 00:44:50,053
Speaker 5: caught up into maybe like the politics of footy and yeah,

838
00:44:50,093 --> 00:44:53,533
Speaker 5: and forget sort of why you started playing. And I

839
00:44:53,653 --> 00:44:57,253
Speaker 5: think that goes to everybody as well, you know, coaches included,

840
00:44:57,413 --> 00:45:01,973
Speaker 5: not just players. And yeah, from the start, I always

841
00:45:01,973 --> 00:45:03,973
Speaker 5: told myself, lif if it came to it and you

842
00:45:04,173 --> 00:45:06,813
Speaker 5: started to not enjoy the footy, then it was time

843
00:45:06,853 --> 00:45:08,453
Speaker 5: to walk away. So I always made sure that I

844
00:45:08,973 --> 00:45:12,373
Speaker 5: enjoyed my craft, enjoyed going to work every day, and enjoyed,

845
00:45:12,893 --> 00:45:15,533
Speaker 5: you know, putting in the hard yards as well for

846
00:45:15,613 --> 00:45:16,173
Speaker 5: the team.

847
00:45:16,373 --> 00:45:17,613
Speaker 2: If we get back to the start of your career.

848
00:45:17,653 --> 00:45:19,213
Speaker 2: You played a bit for the New Zealand seven So

849
00:45:19,213 --> 00:45:21,013
Speaker 2: I was that on the radar when you first got

850
00:45:21,013 --> 00:45:22,933
Speaker 2: into professional rugby or was it do you get the

851
00:45:22,973 --> 00:45:25,973
Speaker 2: shoulder tap from Titch? Did you wanted to play sevens?

852
00:45:27,053 --> 00:45:29,373
Speaker 5: No? I guess I'd always wanted to just do fifteens.

853
00:45:30,133 --> 00:45:32,333
Speaker 5: Sevens never never really crossed my mind. I guess I

854
00:45:32,373 --> 00:45:35,613
Speaker 5: always watched it, you know, and so many legend of

855
00:45:35,613 --> 00:45:39,813
Speaker 5: the game have gone through the avenue. It wasn't until

856
00:45:40,253 --> 00:45:44,013
Speaker 5: I think I played my first game against the New

857
00:45:44,133 --> 00:45:46,813
Speaker 5: Zealand Barbarian Oh no, for the New Zealand Barbarians against

858
00:45:46,973 --> 00:45:49,613
Speaker 5: New Zealand Maldi. And it was pretty much after that

859
00:45:49,653 --> 00:45:52,853
Speaker 5: game that Titch gave me a call and said, do

860
00:45:52,853 --> 00:45:55,893
Speaker 5: you want to come over? Come over go. I never

861
00:45:56,013 --> 00:45:59,853
Speaker 5: thought about it. I jumped at the opportunity and GZL

862
00:45:59,893 --> 00:46:01,933
Speaker 5: was an awakening. What is this?

863
00:46:02,093 --> 00:46:05,213
Speaker 2: What were training sessions of the famous as his training sessions?

864
00:46:05,213 --> 00:46:06,813
Speaker 2: You know how much he'd put the players through? What

865
00:46:06,813 --> 00:46:09,013
Speaker 2: would they like render us?

866
00:46:10,333 --> 00:46:13,493
Speaker 5: You know? But as bad as they were, then they

867
00:46:13,933 --> 00:46:18,653
Speaker 5: they make you resilient. Yeah, you can never be broken

868
00:46:20,373 --> 00:46:24,853
Speaker 5: mentally after after you endure a camp with touch for sure.

869
00:46:25,133 --> 00:46:28,373
Speaker 2: But fifteen's was yourmate goal because you finished sevens went

870
00:46:28,413 --> 00:46:28,933
Speaker 2: to the Chiefs.

871
00:46:28,973 --> 00:46:31,373
Speaker 5: Is that right? Yeah, Yeah, that's right. Yeah, And I

872
00:46:31,373 --> 00:46:34,093
Speaker 5: guess I always wanted to go traveling as well. I

873
00:46:34,093 --> 00:46:38,413
Speaker 5: always wanted to go live overseas, and I guess in

874
00:46:38,493 --> 00:46:42,013
Speaker 5: terms of playing footy overseas, sevens isn't really something you can,

875
00:46:42,653 --> 00:46:45,293
Speaker 5: I guess, make a career out of unless you get

876
00:46:45,293 --> 00:46:47,013
Speaker 5: to travel with New Zealand Sevens and whatnot. But it's

877
00:46:47,053 --> 00:46:49,053
Speaker 5: not the same when you know, you get to fully

878
00:46:49,453 --> 00:46:53,013
Speaker 5: immerse yourself into another culture and live there. And so

879
00:46:53,173 --> 00:46:55,013
Speaker 5: I guess that was probably one of the main drivers.

880
00:46:55,813 --> 00:47:00,093
Speaker 5: And yeah, when when it did come about, yeah we're

881
00:47:00,293 --> 00:47:01,333
Speaker 5: we're all ready to go.

882
00:47:01,373 --> 00:47:04,853
Speaker 3: It was pretty exciting, one hundred percent sure on this.

883
00:47:04,973 --> 00:47:07,533
Speaker 3: But watch you, sir, they still around.

884
00:47:08,453 --> 00:47:11,053
Speaker 5: They are just about to make a comeback, right. I'm

885
00:47:11,053 --> 00:47:14,773
Speaker 5: not too sure what division it is, but yeah, things

886
00:47:15,613 --> 00:47:17,933
Speaker 5: back on the move too. You had to come back

887
00:47:17,973 --> 00:47:19,013
Speaker 5: into footy.

888
00:47:19,173 --> 00:47:22,613
Speaker 3: Yeah right, so they collapsed and potentially coming back. So

889
00:47:23,653 --> 00:47:28,173
Speaker 3: obviously you spent time there, what did you stay in

890
00:47:28,213 --> 00:47:31,893
Speaker 3: touch with people? You know during that time? And I

891
00:47:31,893 --> 00:47:34,093
Speaker 3: guess it is a pretty challenging climate for rugby They're

892
00:47:34,093 --> 00:47:37,773
Speaker 3: not alone with Wasps, you know, Glamour Club in England

893
00:47:37,773 --> 00:47:41,453
Speaker 3: going under and other clubs around the world. So what

894
00:47:41,493 --> 00:47:44,533
Speaker 3: was it like for people you knew and having been

895
00:47:44,533 --> 00:47:46,373
Speaker 3: in at a club like that to watch a club

896
00:47:46,453 --> 00:47:47,533
Speaker 3: go through that experience.

897
00:47:48,053 --> 00:47:50,253
Speaker 5: Yeah, it was pretty It was pretty sad, to be honest,

898
00:47:50,293 --> 00:47:55,133
Speaker 5: because mainly for that community as well, like rugby was

899
00:47:55,173 --> 00:47:57,773
Speaker 5: so big to the town of What's you know, you'd

900
00:47:57,773 --> 00:48:01,173
Speaker 5: get twelve to fifteen thousand every game and for that

901
00:48:01,333 --> 00:48:04,293
Speaker 5: just to disappear for them would have been heartbreaking because

902
00:48:04,293 --> 00:48:06,813
Speaker 5: there were such loyal fans. And then in terms of

903
00:48:06,813 --> 00:48:12,293
Speaker 5: the players, a lot of them came out okay there,

904
00:48:12,573 --> 00:48:14,533
Speaker 5: you know, there were decent enough players and they've got

905
00:48:14,533 --> 00:48:16,933
Speaker 5: contracts elsewhere. A lot of them went to Bath. A

906
00:48:16,933 --> 00:48:20,773
Speaker 5: lot of my close mates went to Bath. But then

907
00:48:21,373 --> 00:48:24,173
Speaker 5: a lot of other guys ended up just just going

908
00:48:24,453 --> 00:48:28,733
Speaker 5: and starting there the next next job, the next venture,

909
00:48:28,813 --> 00:48:34,213
Speaker 5: I guess, which was yeah, pretty gutting after especially if

910
00:48:34,253 --> 00:48:35,813
Speaker 5: you're a young kid and you've worked so hard and

911
00:48:35,853 --> 00:48:38,493
Speaker 5: gone through the academy and you've promised all these different

912
00:48:38,493 --> 00:48:40,173
Speaker 5: things and then all of a sudden it just comes

913
00:48:40,173 --> 00:48:44,693
Speaker 5: to an end. Yeah, it was pretty Yeah, just sad,

914
00:48:44,733 --> 00:48:48,013
Speaker 5: I guess, because yeah, like I say, you work hard

915
00:48:48,013 --> 00:48:50,213
Speaker 5: for something and then it's just taken from you and

916
00:48:50,293 --> 00:48:53,013
Speaker 5: it's completely outequate or your control.

917
00:48:53,253 --> 00:48:55,373
Speaker 3: Yeah, I guess we can feel a bit insulated from

918
00:48:55,413 --> 00:48:58,453
Speaker 3: it here, but you look around the world with wasps

919
00:48:58,453 --> 00:49:03,293
Speaker 3: and wacestern Melbourne Rebels and the States, it's a lot

920
00:49:03,293 --> 00:49:06,573
Speaker 3: more common these days, so pretty hard to watch on talking.

921
00:49:06,653 --> 00:49:08,013
Speaker 4: I've talked to Brad Shields.

922
00:49:07,653 --> 00:49:11,133
Speaker 3: About has experience as well, and yeah, a lot of

923
00:49:11,173 --> 00:49:14,213
Speaker 3: those guys got left in the lurch, so not good to.

924
00:49:14,133 --> 00:49:18,733
Speaker 5: See, no no, And then I guess it becomes a

925
00:49:18,733 --> 00:49:22,373
Speaker 5: flooded market too, and then so then yeah, it becomes

926
00:49:22,373 --> 00:49:26,773
Speaker 5: a lot harder for everyone to get jobs playing footy.

927
00:49:26,813 --> 00:49:31,613
Speaker 5: And I think a lot they were renegotiating contracts. We're

928
00:49:31,613 --> 00:49:33,933
Speaker 5: getting a lot less than what they were, you know

929
00:49:34,013 --> 00:49:37,773
Speaker 5: originally on just because they could get you know, whoever

930
00:49:37,813 --> 00:49:41,133
Speaker 5: it might be for a lower prices. Does the job

931
00:49:41,253 --> 00:49:43,613
Speaker 5: just as good.

932
00:49:42,733 --> 00:49:45,893
Speaker 2: When you came back to New Zealand, were you expecting

933
00:49:46,013 --> 00:49:48,613
Speaker 2: to play rugby and New Zealand again because you left

934
00:49:48,653 --> 00:49:50,613
Speaker 2: too long for family reasons came back to New Zealand.

935
00:49:50,653 --> 00:49:52,093
Speaker 2: Was it always on the agenda that you wanted to

936
00:49:52,093 --> 00:49:54,573
Speaker 2: play in New Zealand again and play for whether at

937
00:49:54,653 --> 00:49:55,733
Speaker 2: NPC or Super or.

938
00:49:56,493 --> 00:50:00,813
Speaker 5: Yeah, I guess I well, I actually I think once

939
00:50:00,893 --> 00:50:04,093
Speaker 5: I was in France, I was like, Okay, let's you know,

940
00:50:04,173 --> 00:50:06,013
Speaker 5: it's going to be a good life here. Let's let's

941
00:50:06,053 --> 00:50:08,453
Speaker 5: just finish up here. And that was the plan. But

942
00:50:08,493 --> 00:50:12,053
Speaker 5: then yeah, my old man got lung cancer and so

943
00:50:12,053 --> 00:50:15,733
Speaker 5: so wow, there's no point hanging around because you know,

944
00:50:15,773 --> 00:50:18,573
Speaker 5: it's just never know what's going to happen with lung cans,

945
00:50:18,613 --> 00:50:21,013
Speaker 5: even though it was only stage three at that stage,

946
00:50:21,013 --> 00:50:24,253
Speaker 5: and it's just yah, a no brainer to come home.

947
00:50:24,493 --> 00:50:27,013
Speaker 5: And so when I left, I didn't have a contract

948
00:50:27,053 --> 00:50:29,853
Speaker 5: to come back to. I was just like, I'm just

949
00:50:29,853 --> 00:50:31,653
Speaker 5: going to get home and I'll figure it out. Yeah.

950
00:50:31,693 --> 00:50:36,173
Speaker 5: And I was lucky enough to have a good relationship

951
00:50:36,213 --> 00:50:38,773
Speaker 5: with with Lea McDonald and I messaged him and I

952
00:50:38,813 --> 00:50:40,893
Speaker 5: was just like, hey, mate, I'm coming back to New Zealand.

953
00:50:43,173 --> 00:50:45,013
Speaker 5: I'll be around if you need him one to jump

954
00:50:45,053 --> 00:50:49,493
Speaker 5: in for trainings or whatever. And then yeah, he was like, oh,

955
00:50:49,813 --> 00:50:54,693
Speaker 5: Jim might have a spot. I was like, oh jezus bloody. Also,

956
00:50:55,213 --> 00:50:57,693
Speaker 5: because as it worked out there, I was lucky that

957
00:50:57,733 --> 00:51:01,693
Speaker 5: I had a MiQ spot which was horrendous as well.

958
00:51:01,693 --> 00:51:04,133
Speaker 5: We did two weeks in a small little hotel room

959
00:51:04,173 --> 00:51:07,173
Speaker 5: with my twenty month old little girl. It was like,

960
00:51:07,213 --> 00:51:12,133
Speaker 5: oh yeah, it was terrible. Felt like a prisoner. You'd

961
00:51:12,173 --> 00:51:15,333
Speaker 5: get let out for for some yard time and go

962
00:51:15,413 --> 00:51:19,213
Speaker 5: walk around unitech and in a paddock which was which

963
00:51:19,253 --> 00:51:24,573
Speaker 5: was so weird. Yeah, back into the cage. Yeah yeah. Yeah.

964
00:51:24,693 --> 00:51:26,213
Speaker 5: The only good thing was you didn't have to cook

965
00:51:27,333 --> 00:51:31,293
Speaker 5: meals delivered, so yeah, that that that was what happened.

966
00:51:31,653 --> 00:51:36,333
Speaker 5: I think it was choc o'batas from Argentina. Yeah, he

967
00:51:36,453 --> 00:51:38,093
Speaker 5: was meant to come over but he couldn't get it

968
00:51:38,093 --> 00:51:40,973
Speaker 5: in my Q spot and then so I probably owe

969
00:51:41,013 --> 00:51:47,333
Speaker 5: him a few beers. Yeah. Yeah, that was a little

970
00:51:47,373 --> 00:51:51,613
Speaker 5: mailbik for um for sure. So yeah, it all sort

971
00:51:51,613 --> 00:51:54,853
Speaker 5: of just worked out my clockwork in the end. But yeah,

972
00:51:54,893 --> 00:51:57,733
Speaker 5: when I left, I had no idea what was going

973
00:51:57,773 --> 00:51:58,093
Speaker 5: to happen.

974
00:51:58,133 --> 00:51:59,573
Speaker 2: To be honest, how do you look back at that

975
00:51:59,573 --> 00:52:02,573
Speaker 2: Blues experience because you came back obviously with it, not

976
00:52:02,613 --> 00:52:05,733
Speaker 2: knowing you'd be playing again to effectively becoming their first

977
00:52:05,773 --> 00:52:08,733
Speaker 2: choice in the midfield, you know, and you rose at

978
00:52:08,773 --> 00:52:10,253
Speaker 2: the ranks really quickly. How do you look back at that,

979
00:52:10,373 --> 00:52:11,613
Speaker 2: I guess that stage of your career.

980
00:52:13,333 --> 00:52:16,133
Speaker 5: Yeah, I guess I'm pretty pretty proud of it, to

981
00:52:16,133 --> 00:52:18,933
Speaker 5: be honest. I guess when I left New Zealand, I

982
00:52:18,973 --> 00:52:23,093
Speaker 5: only had a year of super under me, and I

983
00:52:23,093 --> 00:52:25,613
Speaker 5: guess while I was away, I always sort of wondered

984
00:52:25,613 --> 00:52:27,853
Speaker 5: if I could keep up with the pace of the

985
00:52:27,853 --> 00:52:31,613
Speaker 5: game back here and still compete with the boys back here,

986
00:52:31,653 --> 00:52:35,933
Speaker 5: And I guess after doing it, I'm yeah, I'm happy

987
00:52:35,973 --> 00:52:38,013
Speaker 5: that I got that opportunity and the way that everything

988
00:52:38,053 --> 00:52:41,293
Speaker 5: worked out to come back and finish at home in

989
00:52:41,373 --> 00:52:44,773
Speaker 5: Auckland around friends and family and just to sort of,

990
00:52:44,773 --> 00:52:46,533
Speaker 5: I guess, get that monkey off my back in a

991
00:52:46,533 --> 00:52:51,733
Speaker 5: way as well. And yeah, and then winning a title

992
00:52:52,093 --> 00:52:57,333
Speaker 5: pretty very awesome and get chills now just thinking about it.

993
00:52:57,413 --> 00:52:59,133
Speaker 5: So yeah, awesome.

994
00:52:59,253 --> 00:53:03,013
Speaker 2: Did you feel you're close to All Black selection in

995
00:53:03,053 --> 00:53:05,133
Speaker 2: twenty twenty three at all, because it felt like you're

996
00:53:05,133 --> 00:53:07,413
Speaker 2: playing some outstanding rugby that year and there was all

997
00:53:07,453 --> 00:53:10,213
Speaker 2: sorts of questions at the it's midfield. Did you feel

998
00:53:10,253 --> 00:53:14,933
Speaker 2: like you were in the mix? U? No, No, not really.

999
00:53:15,013 --> 00:53:17,813
Speaker 5: I think I always knew that my my age was

1000
00:53:17,853 --> 00:53:20,053
Speaker 5: always going to play against me, no matter how well,

1001
00:53:20,093 --> 00:53:23,893
Speaker 5: I played, and I get that, you know, I guess

1002
00:53:23,933 --> 00:53:26,893
Speaker 5: I had my chance to hang around and try and

1003
00:53:27,093 --> 00:53:31,853
Speaker 5: make All Blacks and whatnot, and I chose to go overseas. So,

1004
00:53:32,973 --> 00:53:36,053
Speaker 5: you know, as much as I loved the hype around

1005
00:53:36,053 --> 00:53:38,173
Speaker 5: it and you know, and hearing people say such nice

1006
00:53:38,173 --> 00:53:39,853
Speaker 5: things about me, I said, always knew in the back

1007
00:53:39,893 --> 00:53:42,373
Speaker 5: of my mind that it was probably never gonna happen.

1008
00:53:43,773 --> 00:53:45,453
Speaker 3: You didn't play for the All Blacks fifteen though, that

1009
00:53:45,453 --> 00:53:48,253
Speaker 3: that would have been you did, right, Yeah, yeah, yeah,

1010
00:53:48,853 --> 00:53:49,613
Speaker 3: A nice experience.

1011
00:53:49,853 --> 00:53:53,213
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, that was awesome to wear, you know, another

1012
00:53:53,453 --> 00:53:57,973
Speaker 5: black jersey and you'd go away and travel as I

1013
00:53:57,973 --> 00:54:01,773
Speaker 5: think I was the oldest player about seven years or something,

1014
00:54:01,853 --> 00:54:05,373
Speaker 5: but I was happy to be there. And I think

1015
00:54:05,413 --> 00:54:09,373
Speaker 5: I i Leon again for that one as well, maybe

1016
00:54:09,413 --> 00:54:11,533
Speaker 5: just to bring an old head along just to I

1017
00:54:11,573 --> 00:54:16,853
Speaker 5: don't know, get the young boys and.

1018
00:54:15,573 --> 00:54:21,413
Speaker 3: Get them homework, talk us through the Blues title because

1019
00:54:23,133 --> 00:54:28,813
Speaker 3: it was a ride was twenty years and yeah, you know,

1020
00:54:28,973 --> 00:54:32,533
Speaker 3: think twenty one year. Leon came in and certainly improved

1021
00:54:32,573 --> 00:54:36,373
Speaker 3: the team drastically, and then Vyn comes in and wins

1022
00:54:36,373 --> 00:54:39,813
Speaker 3: it in his first year. But just the culbination of

1023
00:54:40,453 --> 00:54:44,573
Speaker 3: leading up to that winning the title, the celebrations, the

1024
00:54:44,733 --> 00:54:47,773
Speaker 3: monkey off the back, what what was that like?

1025
00:54:48,773 --> 00:54:51,973
Speaker 5: Yeah? Yeah, So I came back in twenty one and

1026
00:54:52,253 --> 00:54:55,693
Speaker 5: I think we won the Trans Tasman that year, and

1027
00:54:56,093 --> 00:54:58,613
Speaker 5: I think for everyone, like it was awesome to win something,

1028
00:54:58,653 --> 00:55:03,453
Speaker 5: but it didn't feel like a championship, I guess, and

1029
00:55:03,573 --> 00:55:06,173
Speaker 5: it seemed like no one else counted that as well.

1030
00:55:08,373 --> 00:55:09,533
Speaker 4: As fans.

1031
00:55:10,413 --> 00:55:19,213
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, yeah, prime example. But yeah, and then I

1032
00:55:19,253 --> 00:55:24,213
Speaker 5: guess to continue form and to keep competing well as

1033
00:55:24,253 --> 00:55:29,093
Speaker 5: a team. We knew we were thereabouts and what we

1034
00:55:29,173 --> 00:55:31,253
Speaker 5: needed to do, but then for whatever reason, just kept

1035
00:55:31,253 --> 00:55:33,573
Speaker 5: falling short. And yeah, like you say, Leon was a

1036
00:55:33,613 --> 00:55:36,293
Speaker 5: big part of getting the team to to where it was,

1037
00:55:36,453 --> 00:55:38,853
Speaker 5: and then then came in and just perfected a few

1038
00:55:38,893 --> 00:55:42,133
Speaker 5: things here and there with a different, different mindset, I guess,

1039
00:55:42,213 --> 00:55:46,733
Speaker 5: which got us across the line. And yeah, to keep

1040
00:55:46,773 --> 00:55:50,253
Speaker 5: falling shorter, bloody kept hurting, especially that year where we

1041
00:55:50,453 --> 00:55:54,533
Speaker 5: pretty much went undefeated, and then to get pummeled in

1042
00:55:54,573 --> 00:55:59,533
Speaker 5: the final was pretty hard because I don't think any

1043
00:55:59,573 --> 00:56:01,693
Speaker 5: of us in that team thought we were going to lose.

1044
00:56:03,173 --> 00:56:06,693
Speaker 5: And then, yeah, the Crusaders just kept tipping us over

1045
00:56:06,773 --> 00:56:12,413
Speaker 5: and you'd be happy as punishing. What lessons did you

1046
00:56:12,453 --> 00:56:15,053
Speaker 5: take then from from twenty two and twenty three when

1047
00:56:15,453 --> 00:56:18,213
Speaker 5: you did fall short as a team into twenty four

1048
00:56:18,253 --> 00:56:20,173
Speaker 5: with the valuable lessons about what it meant to play

1049
00:56:20,453 --> 00:56:23,333
Speaker 5: finals footy or semi final footy that you could put

1050
00:56:23,413 --> 00:56:26,453
Speaker 5: into that campaign that eventually came. Right. Yeah, I guess

1051
00:56:27,093 --> 00:56:32,053
Speaker 5: that the what's happened before counts for nothing, you know,

1052
00:56:32,173 --> 00:56:38,093
Speaker 5: and whatever was done then needs to be intensified, you know,

1053
00:56:38,173 --> 00:56:42,493
Speaker 5: by a thousand to get the job done. You can

1054
00:56:42,533 --> 00:56:44,853
Speaker 5: never write another team off and just expect that it's

1055
00:56:44,893 --> 00:56:48,893
Speaker 5: going to go the way that it did before. And

1056
00:56:48,973 --> 00:56:51,893
Speaker 5: I guess that's sort of what happened last year as well.

1057
00:56:52,053 --> 00:56:57,253
Speaker 5: We knew that we were never there through the season.

1058
00:56:57,253 --> 00:56:59,813
Speaker 5: You know. It took us, I guess, to all the

1059
00:56:59,813 --> 00:57:02,853
Speaker 5: playoffs to really figure out our game and how we

1060
00:57:02,893 --> 00:57:07,613
Speaker 5: were going to play it and what teams really struggled with,

1061
00:57:07,933 --> 00:57:12,053
Speaker 5: and to perfect it in the final was amazing, you know,

1062
00:57:12,213 --> 00:57:14,813
Speaker 5: And granted, you know, the Chiefs were pretty banged up

1063
00:57:14,813 --> 00:57:17,773
Speaker 5: from their semi final, but still it was a pretty

1064
00:57:17,773 --> 00:57:21,373
Speaker 5: convincing win. And I don't think there was a player

1065
00:57:21,373 --> 00:57:23,773
Speaker 5: on that field that didn't play well for our team.

1066
00:57:24,093 --> 00:57:27,213
Speaker 5: Everyone just knew their role, nailed it, and I guess

1067
00:57:27,253 --> 00:57:29,413
Speaker 5: that was a difference in the end, everyone just nailing

1068
00:57:29,413 --> 00:57:32,253
Speaker 5: their role inside and out.

1069
00:57:32,293 --> 00:57:34,813
Speaker 2: Really, do you feel there are parallels to the season

1070
00:57:34,853 --> 00:57:37,053
Speaker 2: because there has been the Blues best season so far,

1071
00:57:37,133 --> 00:57:38,933
Speaker 2: But as it stands, with a couple of two or

1072
00:57:38,933 --> 00:57:42,133
Speaker 2: three weeks to go, they're right in the playoff mix

1073
00:57:42,173 --> 00:57:45,613
Speaker 2: again despite probably not hitting their straps yet over the

1074
00:57:45,613 --> 00:57:48,213
Speaker 2: course of the season. Do you feel that this campaign

1075
00:57:48,293 --> 00:57:49,853
Speaker 2: might be able to be similar to last year?

1076
00:57:49,973 --> 00:57:53,453
Speaker 5: Yeah, well, they've given themselves a chance, right, and yeah,

1077
00:57:53,573 --> 00:57:57,213
Speaker 5: it hasn't not by any means, been a pretty season.

1078
00:57:58,773 --> 00:58:01,893
Speaker 5: But then, like I just said, playoffs is a different beast, right,

1079
00:58:02,493 --> 00:58:05,813
Speaker 5: They've still got a two more games before the playoffs

1080
00:58:06,173 --> 00:58:09,493
Speaker 5: to really nail everything else. It looks like, you know,

1081
00:58:09,573 --> 00:58:11,893
Speaker 5: things are staying to come together. You know they've been

1082
00:58:13,293 --> 00:58:16,333
Speaker 5: They've had horrific injuries all through the team throughout the

1083
00:58:16,333 --> 00:58:21,773
Speaker 5: season and to try and get like a consistent twenty

1084
00:58:21,813 --> 00:58:25,413
Speaker 5: three together it has been quite quite difficult. But at

1085
00:58:25,413 --> 00:58:26,813
Speaker 5: the same time, it's been awesome to see some of

1086
00:58:26,813 --> 00:58:29,453
Speaker 5: the young boys come through and do really well and

1087
00:58:29,453 --> 00:58:31,733
Speaker 5: put their hand up So you know that only does

1088
00:58:31,853 --> 00:58:34,013
Speaker 5: wonders for a club as well, especially when you're going

1089
00:58:34,013 --> 00:58:37,213
Speaker 5: into playoffs and you need everyone in the team. So yeah,

1090
00:58:37,253 --> 00:58:40,053
Speaker 5: I've got big hopes for them, and it looks like

1091
00:58:40,093 --> 00:58:42,973
Speaker 5: things are staying to come together. So let's hope that,

1092
00:58:43,053 --> 00:58:44,333
Speaker 5: you know, it could be a back to back, but

1093
00:58:44,413 --> 00:58:45,013
Speaker 5: we'll see.

1094
00:58:46,173 --> 00:58:48,093
Speaker 3: Can you give us a bit of an insight, take

1095
00:58:48,173 --> 00:58:51,373
Speaker 3: us inside the sheds, you know what it is like

1096
00:58:51,413 --> 00:58:53,773
Speaker 3: to win a title, particularly when it's been that long,

1097
00:58:53,813 --> 00:58:56,693
Speaker 3: when there's players in that team, coaches that have managers

1098
00:58:56,733 --> 00:58:58,573
Speaker 3: that have been there through it all, you know, Friby

1099
00:58:58,613 --> 00:59:02,293
Speaker 3: and the like, and what did it mean to you?

1100
00:59:02,373 --> 00:59:05,973
Speaker 3: And we did at rank and all the next few

1101
00:59:06,053 --> 00:59:06,613
Speaker 3: days like.

1102
00:59:09,333 --> 00:59:12,133
Speaker 5: Oh yeah, I guess it's up there, you know, at

1103
00:59:12,133 --> 00:59:17,533
Speaker 5: the top for me in terms of achievements in my career. Emotionally,

1104
00:59:17,573 --> 00:59:20,573
Speaker 5: it was awesome to do it for everyone like you mentioned,

1105
00:59:20,573 --> 00:59:22,853
Speaker 5: you know, Richard Frye, our manager has been there for

1106
00:59:22,933 --> 00:59:27,893
Speaker 5: I think this is eleventh year, and all those other boys,

1107
00:59:27,933 --> 00:59:33,093
Speaker 5: you know, Rico one hundred odd games, Paddy Akira, all

1108
00:59:33,133 --> 00:59:35,013
Speaker 5: those boys that have been there for so long, and

1109
00:59:35,053 --> 00:59:38,773
Speaker 5: I guess especially in the hardy years as well, where

1110
00:59:39,413 --> 00:59:42,733
Speaker 5: you know they they weren't nearly as good as what

1111
00:59:42,773 --> 00:59:45,933
Speaker 5: they were when Leon came through, and they've done all

1112
00:59:45,973 --> 00:59:48,413
Speaker 5: those hard yards and so to finally have something to

1113
00:59:48,453 --> 00:59:50,333
Speaker 5: show for it, it was awesome to be able to

1114
00:59:50,333 --> 00:59:52,453
Speaker 5: give to them, to give to the club and mainly

1115
00:59:52,493 --> 00:59:54,573
Speaker 5: the fans as well. I reckon those ones that have

1116
00:59:54,653 --> 00:59:58,533
Speaker 5: been loyal with us over there twenty one year drought

1117
00:59:58,733 --> 01:00:05,293
Speaker 5: and finally get it back. It was amazing. The celebrations

1118
01:00:05,293 --> 01:00:08,293
Speaker 5: were unbelievable. I think everyone just felt like a huge relief.

1119
01:00:12,173 --> 01:00:15,693
Speaker 5: The aftermath, I won't go into too much. I don't

1120
01:00:15,693 --> 01:00:17,413
Speaker 5: that I could remember too much either.

1121
01:00:19,133 --> 01:00:27,253
Speaker 3: The Highlands party at Tony Brown's party recoas maybe.

1122
01:00:25,173 --> 01:00:25,693
Speaker 5: Like that.

1123
01:00:27,213 --> 01:00:29,333
Speaker 2: You weren't playing at the time, but obviously it was

1124
01:00:29,333 --> 01:00:32,573
Speaker 2: your last Blues game. So is it special in the

1125
01:00:32,573 --> 01:00:35,333
Speaker 2: way that that was the last time you wore the Blues?

1126
01:00:35,413 --> 01:00:37,733
Speaker 2: Juicy on a Parker is winning a championship?

1127
01:00:38,053 --> 01:00:40,213
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, yeah, one hundred percent. I guess you know,

1128
01:00:40,213 --> 01:00:46,453
Speaker 5: you couldn't have written the narrative any better really, And then,

1129
01:00:46,533 --> 01:00:52,493
Speaker 5: funny enough, my last game total was Upper Northland at

1130
01:00:52,493 --> 01:00:54,053
Speaker 5: the tunny Fow and that's where I played my first

1131
01:00:54,093 --> 01:00:56,493
Speaker 5: one against New Zealand Maldic So that was pretty cool. Cool,

1132
01:00:57,413 --> 01:00:59,973
Speaker 5: But you had to finish with the championship. It was

1133
01:00:59,973 --> 01:01:03,093
Speaker 5: a massive Yeah one d you can look back at

1134
01:01:03,133 --> 01:01:03,773
Speaker 5: it and be happy.

1135
01:01:04,373 --> 01:01:07,373
Speaker 2: The hands was always you're hoping to get back out

1136
01:01:07,373 --> 01:01:09,213
Speaker 2: this year or just did you know?

1137
01:01:09,733 --> 01:01:14,333
Speaker 5: Or I sort of knew, like there was so much

1138
01:01:14,533 --> 01:01:17,973
Speaker 5: uncertainty around it. I guess, so meeting with the specialists

1139
01:01:18,213 --> 01:01:22,413
Speaker 5: the surgery that was required, there was no guarantees that

1140
01:01:22,413 --> 01:01:25,613
Speaker 5: it was going to be successful. They had a pretty

1141
01:01:25,653 --> 01:01:29,933
Speaker 5: low success rate. And then during NBC, I was trying

1142
01:01:29,933 --> 01:01:32,813
Speaker 5: to keep playing, and I was on having to take

1143
01:01:32,853 --> 01:01:36,573
Speaker 5: painkillers for training for games, and I had the seroid

1144
01:01:36,573 --> 01:01:39,573
Speaker 5: injection as well, and still having to take painkillers, and

1145
01:01:39,573 --> 01:01:43,293
Speaker 5: I say, oh, this, this just isn't really a way

1146
01:01:43,333 --> 01:01:49,213
Speaker 5: to live. And yeah, I guess maybe if I hadn't

1147
01:01:49,213 --> 01:01:52,013
Speaker 5: won that title, it might have tried to push a

1148
01:01:52,053 --> 01:01:56,533
Speaker 5: bit harder to try and get back. Maybe that's hard

1149
01:01:56,533 --> 01:02:02,933
Speaker 5: to say, No, it's hindsighted, yes, but sorry, where was

1150
01:02:02,973 --> 01:02:07,533
Speaker 5: I the the risk? Yeah, I guess just didn't you

1151
01:02:07,733 --> 01:02:11,133
Speaker 5: have any s into around my ability to come back

1152
01:02:11,173 --> 01:02:14,053
Speaker 5: and play, and the quality of life just wasn't there.

1153
01:02:14,093 --> 01:02:16,253
Speaker 5: And so in the end, I guess it was kind

1154
01:02:16,253 --> 01:02:22,813
Speaker 5: of an easy decision because, yeah, young kids and all that.

1155
01:02:23,053 --> 01:02:24,973
Speaker 5: So I've got to think about them as well and

1156
01:02:25,013 --> 01:02:28,133
Speaker 5: put them first. And it's nice now not to be

1157
01:02:28,173 --> 01:02:30,493
Speaker 5: sore every day, and you can play with them the

1158
01:02:30,493 --> 01:02:33,533
Speaker 5: way that I've always wanted to and with less aches

1159
01:02:33,573 --> 01:02:36,413
Speaker 5: and pains, So that's always good as well being.

1160
01:02:37,013 --> 01:02:42,933
Speaker 3: If we talk post career transition, it can be scary

1161
01:02:42,973 --> 01:02:47,893
Speaker 3: intimidating because it's not just the playing and the camaraderie

1162
01:02:47,973 --> 01:02:50,373
Speaker 3: that you lose, but there's a lot of wrap around

1163
01:02:50,413 --> 01:02:53,013
Speaker 3: support for a rugby player, whether it be nutrition or

1164
01:02:53,573 --> 01:02:59,893
Speaker 3: you know, gym. Everything's organized from a travel perspective. And

1165
01:02:59,933 --> 01:03:04,493
Speaker 3: then the taps turned off almost overnight, Right, So how's

1166
01:03:04,533 --> 01:03:05,213
Speaker 3: that been for you?

1167
01:03:05,293 --> 01:03:06,333
Speaker 4: How have you navigated it?

1168
01:03:06,373 --> 01:03:09,693
Speaker 3: And how long we planning your post career transition?

1169
01:03:12,413 --> 01:03:15,453
Speaker 5: Yeah, I guess I had been. I sort of always

1170
01:03:15,533 --> 01:03:17,413
Speaker 5: knew that I needed to do something or have something

1171
01:03:17,413 --> 01:03:19,733
Speaker 5: in the pipeline for when rugby came to an end,

1172
01:03:20,173 --> 01:03:21,773
Speaker 5: and I guess I didn't really know what I wanted

1173
01:03:21,773 --> 01:03:23,333
Speaker 5: to do until I came back to New Zealand and

1174
01:03:23,373 --> 01:03:26,533
Speaker 5: after meeting with a few people. I always had always

1175
01:03:26,573 --> 01:03:31,253
Speaker 5: been interested in property, but didn't have enough money to

1176
01:03:31,293 --> 01:03:36,093
Speaker 5: be a developer. Yeah, especially an awkward so that was

1177
01:03:36,173 --> 01:03:39,813
Speaker 5: ruled out pretty quickly. I didn't want to do real

1178
01:03:39,893 --> 01:03:44,173
Speaker 5: estate because I wanted to have weekends back after fourteen

1179
01:03:44,253 --> 01:03:46,293
Speaker 5: years of not having any for a while. There's a

1180
01:03:46,293 --> 01:03:49,493
Speaker 5: long time. And then I met a few people that

1181
01:03:49,533 --> 01:03:53,973
Speaker 5: were in the finance industry doing mortgage broking, and you know,

1182
01:03:54,013 --> 01:03:56,333
Speaker 5: they sort of painted the picture to me, and I

1183
01:03:56,373 --> 01:03:57,973
Speaker 5: really liked the sound of it. You know, the ability

1184
01:03:58,053 --> 01:04:02,973
Speaker 5: to have been able to help people get into first homes.

1185
01:04:03,533 --> 01:04:06,013
Speaker 5: You know, if they get into trouble with debt, you

1186
01:04:06,053 --> 01:04:10,493
Speaker 5: can help them consolidate back into their home if they

1187
01:04:10,573 --> 01:04:14,093
Speaker 5: need it, and all just like these different ways that

1188
01:04:14,133 --> 01:04:17,933
Speaker 5: you can, I guess, help help people. And that was

1189
01:04:17,973 --> 01:04:22,093
Speaker 5: a big, big motivator for me. And then also I

1190
01:04:22,093 --> 01:04:25,533
Speaker 5: guess my time being away overseas whenever I was trying

1191
01:04:25,533 --> 01:04:28,893
Speaker 5: to buy a property back here, just so far out

1192
01:04:28,933 --> 01:04:30,413
Speaker 5: of the loop when you're not living in the country,

1193
01:04:30,453 --> 01:04:32,293
Speaker 5: and then I guess, yeah, I thought that could be

1194
01:04:32,333 --> 01:04:37,253
Speaker 5: a cool, a cool way to help the other boys

1195
01:04:37,253 --> 01:04:40,613
Speaker 5: that are living overseas and if they needn't help, I'm here,

1196
01:04:40,653 --> 01:04:42,853
Speaker 5: I've been through it and sort of help people learn

1197
01:04:42,853 --> 01:04:46,493
Speaker 5: from my mistakes that I had made in my property journey.

1198
01:04:47,453 --> 01:04:50,213
Speaker 5: So that was a big part of the career choice

1199
01:04:50,213 --> 01:04:55,653
Speaker 5: after footy. The transition is pretty scary, Like you say,

1200
01:04:55,693 --> 01:04:57,533
Speaker 5: you know, everything's sort of provided for you, and then

1201
01:04:57,533 --> 01:05:01,133
Speaker 5: the TAP's just turned off, and it's still scary now,

1202
01:05:01,213 --> 01:05:04,653
Speaker 5: even though you know I'm in the job and things

1203
01:05:04,653 --> 01:05:07,493
Speaker 5: are going well and I'm enjoying it, it's still yeah,

1204
01:05:07,493 --> 01:05:08,173
Speaker 5: it's STI pretty nerve.

1205
01:05:09,773 --> 01:05:12,773
Speaker 3: It's a big, big changer at fourteen years and then

1206
01:05:12,853 --> 01:05:13,373
Speaker 3: then it's.

1207
01:05:13,213 --> 01:05:18,333
Speaker 5: Gone, yeah, yeah, one hundred. But also the Blues have

1208
01:05:18,413 --> 01:05:21,973
Speaker 5: been really really supportive as well. You know, they've tried

1209
01:05:22,013 --> 01:05:25,013
Speaker 5: to introduce me to different people to help grow a

1210
01:05:25,053 --> 01:05:29,413
Speaker 5: network and talk to different people about you know, their

1211
01:05:29,453 --> 01:05:33,333
Speaker 5: learnings from their business adventures and and all all that

1212
01:05:33,373 --> 01:05:37,573
Speaker 5: sort of stuff. So it's they haven't just left me

1213
01:05:37,613 --> 01:05:40,133
Speaker 5: in the dark and said goodbye, you know, though they're yeah,

1214
01:05:40,213 --> 01:05:42,933
Speaker 5: they're they're always there to to pick up the phone

1215
01:05:42,933 --> 01:05:47,413
Speaker 5: and call and help. So they've been amazing in the transition.

1216
01:05:48,093 --> 01:05:50,293
Speaker 5: So the tap you know, is still dripping a little,

1217
01:05:50,493 --> 01:05:51,133
Speaker 5: which is great.

1218
01:05:52,693 --> 01:05:55,213
Speaker 2: You the kind of person that wants to put your

1219
01:05:55,253 --> 01:05:58,053
Speaker 2: hand in coaching or media or anything like that, and

1220
01:05:58,053 --> 01:06:00,413
Speaker 2: in terms of rugby or are you happy to draw

1221
01:06:00,453 --> 01:06:02,173
Speaker 2: a line under it and you're playing careers.

1222
01:06:03,693 --> 01:06:06,693
Speaker 5: I don't know if i'd ever go into try and

1223
01:06:06,693 --> 01:06:13,453
Speaker 5: go professional coaching. I think I've seen the guys you know,

1224
01:06:13,493 --> 01:06:15,653
Speaker 5: and it's it's a full time job. You take it

1225
01:06:15,653 --> 01:06:19,773
Speaker 5: home with you, it's it's never ending, and I think

1226
01:06:19,813 --> 01:06:23,413
Speaker 5: I'd enjoy having the breakaway from it completely. I'd love

1227
01:06:23,453 --> 01:06:26,493
Speaker 5: to be able to give back to the community at

1228
01:06:26,533 --> 01:06:29,333
Speaker 5: some stage, the rugby community, whether that's going back to

1229
01:06:29,373 --> 01:06:32,733
Speaker 5: club and coaching there or helping out around the local

1230
01:06:32,773 --> 01:06:35,453
Speaker 5: rugby club or something like that. That'd be awesome. But yeah,

1231
01:06:35,453 --> 01:06:37,613
Speaker 5: in terms of a professional scense, I don't. I don't

1232
01:06:37,653 --> 01:06:42,133
Speaker 5: think that's me. But I still try to stay connected

1233
01:06:42,133 --> 01:06:43,533
Speaker 5: with all the boys, go on and every now and

1234
01:06:43,613 --> 01:06:47,413
Speaker 5: again and say hi, and it's awesome to have the

1235
01:06:47,813 --> 01:06:51,453
Speaker 5: connection still because yeah, like you said, Liam, there would

1236
01:06:51,493 --> 01:06:54,053
Speaker 5: be the biggest part that you miss is that camaraderie

1237
01:06:54,093 --> 01:06:56,653
Speaker 5: and you know, all the friendships that you've made and

1238
01:06:56,653 --> 01:06:59,813
Speaker 5: all the stuff you've been through as well. But yeah,

1239
01:06:59,813 --> 01:07:03,773
Speaker 5: there's I don't think there's a future for coaching for

1240
01:07:03,933 --> 01:07:04,493
Speaker 5: me anyway.

1241
01:07:05,293 --> 01:07:07,373
Speaker 2: We've got a few final ones to finish up on.

1242
01:07:08,693 --> 01:07:10,853
Speaker 2: Who would you label the best coach you played under

1243
01:07:11,013 --> 01:07:12,813
Speaker 2: professional amateur whatever it might be.

1244
01:07:14,413 --> 01:07:21,693
Speaker 5: Um ooh, I think my time in the Chiefs was

1245
01:07:21,733 --> 01:07:26,013
Speaker 5: pretty pretty awesome. You know, that was my first super

1246
01:07:26,053 --> 01:07:29,053
Speaker 5: rugby team, and they taught me a lot. In terms

1247
01:07:29,053 --> 01:07:32,933
Speaker 5: of Dave Rennie and Wayne Smith. You know, I guess

1248
01:07:33,253 --> 01:07:35,893
Speaker 5: everyone's got amazing things to say about Wayne Smith, and

1249
01:07:36,253 --> 01:07:38,053
Speaker 5: I agree with every one of them, because yeah, he

1250
01:07:38,053 --> 01:07:41,453
Speaker 5: has a different a different beast. Really, the way he

1251
01:07:41,453 --> 01:07:45,093
Speaker 5: thinks about the game and the way he approaches it

1252
01:07:45,213 --> 01:07:47,613
Speaker 5: to get you to think about it as well is

1253
01:07:47,613 --> 01:07:50,293
Speaker 5: pretty special. So yeah, I learned a lot there and

1254
01:07:50,333 --> 01:07:52,813
Speaker 5: I think that helped put me in good stead for

1255
01:07:52,813 --> 01:07:53,853
Speaker 5: the rest of my career.

1256
01:07:56,253 --> 01:08:01,293
Speaker 3: Double banger hair our favorite teammate and will go hardest opponent.

1257
01:08:02,373 --> 01:08:13,853
Speaker 5: Oh, hardest opponent. I'd probably go Joshua toosover Man just

1258
01:08:14,133 --> 01:08:19,933
Speaker 5: raw power, unbelievable skill. Yeah, but then like you can't

1259
01:08:19,973 --> 01:08:26,893
Speaker 5: be angry at him because he's the nicest guy. Yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly. Yeah,

1260
01:08:26,973 --> 01:08:29,973
Speaker 5: he'd be up there so hard to tackle, so strong,

1261
01:08:31,693 --> 01:08:34,613
Speaker 5: and you know he can beat you so many different ways.

1262
01:08:34,893 --> 01:08:37,573
Speaker 5: You know, step here, you can run straight through if

1263
01:08:37,573 --> 01:08:38,213
Speaker 5: you want.

1264
01:08:39,173 --> 01:08:43,093
Speaker 3: You played fallback, wing, center, reckon, you can play loose

1265
01:08:43,133 --> 01:08:43,693
Speaker 3: forward as well.

1266
01:08:46,213 --> 01:08:49,533
Speaker 5: Maybe not the same way that Josh or Bodier do.

1267
01:08:53,853 --> 01:09:00,693
Speaker 5: Favorite player that I've played with, teammate, favorite teammate. Oh geez,

1268
01:09:02,413 --> 01:09:06,813
Speaker 5: that's hopefully none of them listening really put me on

1269
01:09:06,853 --> 01:09:07,253
Speaker 5: the spot.

1270
01:09:08,533 --> 01:09:09,453
Speaker 4: You can have two if you like.

1271
01:09:10,533 --> 01:09:15,333
Speaker 5: I think I think I'll go with Angus Tarvel's up there.

1272
01:09:15,573 --> 01:09:19,733
Speaker 5: You know, he's he's been awesome for me since coming

1273
01:09:19,733 --> 01:09:21,493
Speaker 5: home and since he came to the Blues, you know,

1274
01:09:21,573 --> 01:09:23,853
Speaker 5: because I guess we're similar age, so it's nice having

1275
01:09:23,853 --> 01:09:26,653
Speaker 5: someone that's in the same space of life with you.

1276
01:09:27,253 --> 01:09:28,933
Speaker 5: And then he's just awesome to have around the team.

1277
01:09:28,933 --> 01:09:32,213
Speaker 5: You know, he's always happy, he's good at motivating the boys,

1278
01:09:33,333 --> 01:09:35,293
Speaker 5: and it's always keen to have a laugh, which I

1279
01:09:35,333 --> 01:09:38,773
Speaker 5: really enjoy as well. We don't take ourselves too seriously,

1280
01:09:39,373 --> 01:09:44,573
Speaker 5: and neither does Angus, you know. And yeah, yeah, Angus Tarvel.

1281
01:09:44,653 --> 01:09:46,693
Speaker 5: There you go, mate.

1282
01:09:47,253 --> 01:09:50,133
Speaker 2: And finally, we're two and a half years out, but

1283
01:09:50,373 --> 01:09:52,373
Speaker 2: give us a prediction for the twenty twenty seven Rugby

1284
01:09:52,373 --> 01:09:53,973
Speaker 2: World Cup. Who do you think wins it?

1285
01:09:54,813 --> 01:10:00,133
Speaker 5: Oh? Tough, tough. I'd like to think the All Blacks do.

1286
01:10:01,773 --> 01:10:04,053
Speaker 5: But then I don't think you can write off the

1287
01:10:04,213 --> 01:10:08,973
Speaker 5: likes of France and having played with some of those boys,

1288
01:10:10,573 --> 01:10:13,893
Speaker 5: you know. I like what I see. They're quite similar

1289
01:10:13,973 --> 01:10:16,173
Speaker 5: to South Africa in that respect as well, like big

1290
01:10:16,213 --> 01:10:20,213
Speaker 5: forward pack and very skilful packs. So yeah, if it's

1291
01:10:20,253 --> 01:10:21,933
Speaker 5: not the Abs or lock in France.

1292
01:10:22,213 --> 01:10:24,733
Speaker 2: Nice Well, Bryce, I really appreciate you coming in and

1293
01:10:24,773 --> 01:10:27,093
Speaker 2: having a chat with us. Best luck with the post

1294
01:10:27,133 --> 01:10:29,413
Speaker 2: retirement career and congratulations on a great career.

1295
01:10:29,573 --> 01:10:31,453
Speaker 5: Yeah, thank you very much, thank you for having me on.

1296
01:10:31,693 --> 01:10:33,893
Speaker 3: Yeah, thanks, look forward to seeing you down in the

1297
01:10:33,933 --> 01:10:36,373
Speaker 3: local Auckland club breg we Seene in a couple of years.

1298
01:10:36,733 --> 01:10:39,933
Speaker 5: Yeah yeah, yeah, coaching head on, maybe carrying some.

1299
01:10:39,853 --> 01:10:45,093
Speaker 4: Waters right afterwards, a few snags.

1300
01:10:44,693 --> 01:10:45,853
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, exactly.

1301
01:10:46,293 --> 01:10:48,853
Speaker 2: It's good to catch up with Bryce. He's got a

1302
01:10:48,853 --> 01:10:51,013
Speaker 2: few jerseys, I'm sure in the Cup doesn't.

1303
01:10:51,493 --> 01:10:55,453
Speaker 3: He does Commonwealth Games silver medal and lots of jerseys

1304
01:10:55,493 --> 01:10:59,133
Speaker 3: and plenty of fans and a very popular member of

1305
01:10:59,133 --> 01:11:01,533
Speaker 3: the Blues. I think they called him uncle and cardor

1306
01:11:02,293 --> 01:11:05,373
Speaker 3: towards it towards the end there. So yeah, I know

1307
01:11:06,773 --> 01:11:09,253
Speaker 3: some of our friends and colleagues. He's had a lot

1308
01:11:09,293 --> 01:11:11,373
Speaker 3: of hype around hem hive, so great to chat to him.

1309
01:11:11,453 --> 01:11:13,253
Speaker 2: Yeah, well you mentioned that he didn't think you in

1310
01:11:13,253 --> 01:11:14,493
Speaker 2: the back of his mind he was in the All

1311
01:11:14,533 --> 01:11:17,293
Speaker 2: Blacks mix, but twenty twenty three in particular is playing

1312
01:11:17,333 --> 01:11:20,213
Speaker 2: some very very good rugby. I don't know if he

1313
01:11:20,293 --> 01:11:22,613
Speaker 2: was ever, you know, the All Blacks fifteen, maybe he

1314
01:11:22,613 --> 01:11:25,213
Speaker 2: could have made the All Blacks, but great tales nonethelessons

1315
01:11:25,213 --> 01:11:27,933
Speaker 2: Great to have Bryce on the podcast with us first week.

1316
01:11:27,933 --> 01:11:31,293
Speaker 2: More interviews on the way here on Rugby Direct and

1317
01:11:31,293 --> 01:11:33,293
Speaker 2: that'll do us for another week. Great to have you

1318
01:11:33,333 --> 01:11:35,453
Speaker 2: back on board, Liam, and thanks to as always to

1319
01:11:35,613 --> 01:11:38,013
Speaker 2: Last and Bars English were producing and Friends a Habit

1320
01:11:38,053 --> 01:11:40,533
Speaker 2: health tackling all your aches and pains from sports and work.

1321
01:11:44,693 --> 01:11:47,373
Speaker 1: For more from news talks ed B Listen live on

1322
01:11:47,413 --> 01:11:50,373
Speaker 1: air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever

1323
01:11:50,453 --> 01:11:53,013
Speaker 1: you go with our podcast on iHeartRadio