1 00:00:00,840 --> 00:00:04,360 Speaker 1: The huddle with New Zealand Southerby's International Realty Find you're 2 00:00:04,480 --> 00:00:05,160 Speaker 1: one of the kind. 3 00:00:05,600 --> 00:00:07,400 Speaker 2: Huddle with me this evening, Craig Greenny of the Sea, 4 00:00:07,440 --> 00:00:09,840 Speaker 2: to you the economists there and clear the Lord journalist. 5 00:00:09,880 --> 00:00:10,520 Speaker 3: Hello you two. 6 00:00:11,720 --> 00:00:13,319 Speaker 2: Hello hello, Craig. 7 00:00:13,440 --> 00:00:13,520 Speaker 3: So. 8 00:00:13,760 --> 00:00:16,400 Speaker 2: Idea of the day for me is David Seymour pledging 9 00:00:16,440 --> 00:00:18,959 Speaker 2: to cut ministries and ministers. Do you like it or 10 00:00:19,040 --> 00:00:19,480 Speaker 2: hate it? 11 00:00:21,120 --> 00:00:23,599 Speaker 4: I'm a bit indifferent to it towards to be deadly honest. 12 00:00:23,640 --> 00:00:26,120 Speaker 4: Hither it's sort of it doesn't really matter sort of 13 00:00:26,320 --> 00:00:29,000 Speaker 4: how many ministers you have. It's basically what they're doing 14 00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:31,960 Speaker 4: that should count and what the government's doing over all 15 00:00:32,040 --> 00:00:35,240 Speaker 4: that kind. You can have more ministers or fewer ministers's. 16 00:00:34,680 --> 00:00:35,600 Speaker 2: Ministries as well. 17 00:00:35,760 --> 00:00:36,080 Speaker 3: Craig. 18 00:00:36,800 --> 00:00:40,000 Speaker 4: Yeah, again, but you can have more ministries or fewer ministries. 19 00:00:40,040 --> 00:00:42,360 Speaker 4: It's actually are they doing what New Zealand needs? 20 00:00:42,440 --> 00:00:42,680 Speaker 3: Are they? 21 00:00:42,800 --> 00:00:45,280 Speaker 4: Are they delivering the public services that New Zealand needs. 22 00:00:45,479 --> 00:00:48,360 Speaker 4: We've had some departments that have been split into others. 23 00:00:48,360 --> 00:00:50,920 Speaker 4: We've had in the very recent past, we had the 24 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:54,639 Speaker 4: creation of MB which brought several ministries together. It's it's 25 00:00:54,640 --> 00:00:57,080 Speaker 4: actually not a question of how many offices or how 26 00:00:57,080 --> 00:01:00,240 Speaker 4: many ministries there are, it's actually are they wor looking 27 00:01:00,280 --> 00:01:03,080 Speaker 4: well and are they delivering efficiently? And I think right 28 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:04,959 Speaker 4: now that's an arguable point. 29 00:01:05,560 --> 00:01:08,640 Speaker 2: Are you saying, would you argue that they're not delivering efficiently? 30 00:01:09,840 --> 00:01:12,080 Speaker 4: I think there are many ministries that are really suffering 31 00:01:12,120 --> 00:01:16,319 Speaker 4: because they've had they've had essentially back rooms and the 32 00:01:16,319 --> 00:01:19,800 Speaker 4: the the the engine rooms of those organizations stipped out 33 00:01:19,840 --> 00:01:23,000 Speaker 4: of them via cut and so they're really struggling to deliver, 34 00:01:23,240 --> 00:01:26,360 Speaker 4: which we've seen, you know, almost arguably in real time 35 00:01:26,600 --> 00:01:29,399 Speaker 4: with the delivery of the Family Boost program, which couldn't 36 00:01:29,440 --> 00:01:31,560 Speaker 4: be ruled out properly because we had to sort of 37 00:01:32,080 --> 00:01:34,440 Speaker 4: you know, put it together with string in order to 38 00:01:34,440 --> 00:01:36,560 Speaker 4: get it out as quickly as the government demanded. 39 00:01:36,880 --> 00:01:38,080 Speaker 2: Claire, what do you think? 40 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:43,520 Speaker 3: Well? I tend to agree with Craig because I don't 41 00:01:43,600 --> 00:01:45,640 Speaker 3: think I think it's got to look at the what 42 00:01:45,840 --> 00:01:48,920 Speaker 3: what these ministries are achieving. One of the things that 43 00:01:49,000 --> 00:01:54,640 Speaker 3: you do achieve by having portfolios that David Seymour obviously disagrees, 44 00:01:55,000 --> 00:01:59,320 Speaker 3: for example racing which is has you know, his political 45 00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:04,600 Speaker 3: opponent and coalition partner Winston Peters. Thing is you do 46 00:02:04,720 --> 00:02:08,440 Speaker 3: sheet home some political accountability for results in that area. 47 00:02:08,480 --> 00:02:11,040 Speaker 3: You may not have a big office or a big administration, 48 00:02:11,720 --> 00:02:14,720 Speaker 3: but there is accountability and it does go back to 49 00:02:14,720 --> 00:02:18,080 Speaker 3: a very specific minister. I mean you can say that 50 00:02:18,120 --> 00:02:20,400 Speaker 3: too about for example, mental health, which we're going to 51 00:02:20,400 --> 00:02:23,640 Speaker 3: talk about probably Matt Doucy. Not a good outcome, but 52 00:02:23,720 --> 00:02:27,000 Speaker 3: somebody's got to take responsibility. And I do think it's 53 00:02:27,080 --> 00:02:30,200 Speaker 3: quite interesting also that at the moment you'd have to 54 00:02:30,240 --> 00:02:34,360 Speaker 3: say the ACT Party is disproportionately represented with eight ministers 55 00:02:34,800 --> 00:02:38,120 Speaker 3: in our cabinet. When you look at the percentage of 56 00:02:38,160 --> 00:02:41,560 Speaker 3: support it's had a lot of It is political. It's 57 00:02:41,760 --> 00:02:46,960 Speaker 3: giving people positions because everyone's jockeying for influence within our 58 00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:49,040 Speaker 3: MMP governments. 59 00:02:49,160 --> 00:02:52,520 Speaker 2: And so clear that you saw the Hunting and Fishing 60 00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:54,360 Speaker 2: Minister held responsible for anything. 61 00:02:55,680 --> 00:02:57,360 Speaker 3: Look, I did not know we had one. 62 00:02:57,680 --> 00:03:01,440 Speaker 2: What about the South Island Minister? What? At what point 63 00:03:01,440 --> 00:03:03,960 Speaker 2: are we going to call for James Meagher's resignation as 64 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:06,400 Speaker 2: the South Island Minister? What would he have to do wrong? 65 00:03:07,600 --> 00:03:09,240 Speaker 3: Well, I think what he is he's probably got his 66 00:03:09,280 --> 00:03:12,359 Speaker 3: hands for right now because with a bit of luck 67 00:03:12,360 --> 00:03:14,840 Speaker 3: he somehow made it to the South Island which seems 68 00:03:14,919 --> 00:03:15,560 Speaker 3: under siege. 69 00:03:16,560 --> 00:03:20,080 Speaker 2: Mark Mitchell as the Civil Defense minister predominantly dealing with us. 70 00:03:20,760 --> 00:03:24,000 Speaker 3: They can work together nicely and they can cooperate. We 71 00:03:24,400 --> 00:03:27,440 Speaker 3: stop all the elements that are needed. 72 00:03:29,120 --> 00:03:30,760 Speaker 2: We does this end? Why don't we have a minister 73 00:03:30,800 --> 00:03:33,800 Speaker 2: for Otargo, that's. 74 00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:38,320 Speaker 3: Part of the South Island, Heather, I don't think, you know. 75 00:03:38,360 --> 00:03:40,280 Speaker 2: I mean like it's like it could never end, Like 76 00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:43,000 Speaker 2: we could just make ministers for everything, couldn't we. 77 00:03:43,240 --> 00:03:45,480 Speaker 3: You could, And that's what it comes down to. It 78 00:03:45,600 --> 00:03:48,840 Speaker 3: is very political. It is trying to satisfy. 79 00:03:48,960 --> 00:03:52,360 Speaker 2: I just want both to know you haven't and I 80 00:03:52,440 --> 00:03:54,119 Speaker 2: still think that you need to cut a whole bunch 81 00:03:54,160 --> 00:03:57,240 Speaker 2: of them, but you have it. 82 00:03:59,280 --> 00:04:01,440 Speaker 4: I think. I think one of the things you do 83 00:04:01,480 --> 00:04:05,520 Speaker 4: when you create ministries or ministers that aren't normal, regular 84 00:04:05,600 --> 00:04:08,680 Speaker 4: everyday ones, like arguably the minister for the South Island, 85 00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:12,320 Speaker 4: you're helping to demonstrate to the public what are your priorities. Yeah, 86 00:04:12,360 --> 00:04:15,040 Speaker 4: so we had the creation of a chaild poverty minister 87 00:04:15,320 --> 00:04:19,400 Speaker 4: for example. We've had, you know, other ministers who. 88 00:04:19,320 --> 00:04:24,000 Speaker 2: Creates at what cost? Politics? At some point we have 89 00:04:24,120 --> 00:04:27,159 Speaker 2: to stop worrying so much about what the governing policy, 90 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:30,880 Speaker 2: the politics that the governing parties are playing, and think 91 00:04:30,880 --> 00:04:32,960 Speaker 2: about what it is literally costing us in tax pay 92 00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:35,599 Speaker 2: dollars for them to send us signals. You know, I 93 00:04:35,640 --> 00:04:37,320 Speaker 2: don't want to pay for a minister, so they can 94 00:04:37,360 --> 00:04:38,520 Speaker 2: send me their priorities. 95 00:04:38,839 --> 00:04:39,360 Speaker 3: Just do it? 96 00:04:40,120 --> 00:04:40,719 Speaker 2: Is it not only the. 97 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:44,880 Speaker 3: Minister doesn't A minister holding multiple portfolios doesn't have to 98 00:04:44,920 --> 00:04:48,000 Speaker 3: actually cost you that much. And you can see that 99 00:04:48,080 --> 00:04:51,200 Speaker 3: in other countries where they have just as many people 100 00:04:51,279 --> 00:04:53,479 Speaker 3: or as few as we have the diminishing number of 101 00:04:53,480 --> 00:04:56,200 Speaker 3: people we have, and they have maybe twenty ministers and 102 00:04:56,240 --> 00:05:00,120 Speaker 3: they are managing entire countries with fifteen to twenty ministers. 103 00:05:00,400 --> 00:05:03,039 Speaker 3: You can give them all sorts of titles, whatever, but 104 00:05:03,080 --> 00:05:06,320 Speaker 3: the responsibilities are shared out amongst very capable people. 105 00:05:06,320 --> 00:05:07,799 Speaker 2: I see what you mean. Okay, so you have fewer 106 00:05:08,320 --> 00:05:10,360 Speaker 2: bodies wearing more hats. Okay, guys, we'll take a break 107 00:05:10,360 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 2: and come back just to take the huddle with. 108 00:05:13,279 --> 00:05:18,400 Speaker 1: New Zealand Southeby's international realty achieve extraordinary results with unparallel reach. 109 00:05:19,200 --> 00:05:20,880 Speaker 2: By the way, Claire, what did you make of Chloe 110 00:05:20,839 --> 00:05:23,640 Speaker 2: Swarbrick's idea for job of the make work scheme? 111 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:28,120 Speaker 3: Look, the first thing that popped into my head when 112 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:30,080 Speaker 3: I was reading about this, and then listening to was 113 00:05:30,520 --> 00:05:33,680 Speaker 3: think big. I mean, it really is a back to 114 00:05:33,960 --> 00:05:37,720 Speaker 3: the past kind of you know, it evokes the whole 115 00:05:37,760 --> 00:05:42,440 Speaker 3: bilberch eerr of more, you know, picking winners, that sort 116 00:05:42,440 --> 00:05:45,440 Speaker 3: of thing, which hasn't actually been bad for New Zealand 117 00:05:45,440 --> 00:05:50,360 Speaker 3: in some respects, but in the case of this particular policy, 118 00:05:50,440 --> 00:05:53,279 Speaker 3: it is literally half baked at this point because we 119 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:56,320 Speaker 3: don't know how it's going to be funded, and it 120 00:05:56,400 --> 00:06:00,400 Speaker 3: seems to me it will possibly render the Greens are 121 00:06:00,680 --> 00:06:04,279 Speaker 3: unelectable anyway and not being in a position to implement anything. 122 00:06:04,360 --> 00:06:06,560 Speaker 3: I think we really need to push more in the 123 00:06:06,560 --> 00:06:11,720 Speaker 3: direction of a better educated, highly educated if we can workforce, 124 00:06:12,279 --> 00:06:14,560 Speaker 3: and sort of going more down the Singapore route of 125 00:06:15,320 --> 00:06:18,000 Speaker 3: trying to really hann us the brains of a very 126 00:06:18,080 --> 00:06:22,680 Speaker 3: well motivated population while also making the most of our 127 00:06:22,760 --> 00:06:25,960 Speaker 3: actual resources by way of food production for the world. 128 00:06:26,800 --> 00:06:28,800 Speaker 2: I feel, Craig like there will not be much of 129 00:06:28,839 --> 00:06:32,360 Speaker 2: a public appetite for making jobs for people basically subsidizing 130 00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:34,200 Speaker 2: jobs in the modern era. What do you think. 131 00:06:35,120 --> 00:06:37,719 Speaker 4: I don't think they'll be much appetated for just directly 132 00:06:37,760 --> 00:06:41,360 Speaker 4: subsidizing employment. But if you're actually building the things that 133 00:06:41,400 --> 00:06:44,719 Speaker 4: New Zealand needs, you know, as Chloe said, the Infrastructure 134 00:06:44,720 --> 00:06:47,200 Speaker 4: Commission pointed out, we have one hundred and six billion 135 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:51,320 Speaker 4: dollar infrastructure gap and that's just public sector infrastructure gap 136 00:06:51,520 --> 00:06:55,159 Speaker 4: right now. So those are hospitals, schools, roads, everything else 137 00:06:55,160 --> 00:06:58,200 Speaker 4: that should exist and don't because frankly, we haven't paid 138 00:06:58,240 --> 00:07:01,800 Speaker 4: for them. And we do need to build that infrastructure, 139 00:07:01,839 --> 00:07:03,280 Speaker 4: and we need to do it better than we do 140 00:07:03,320 --> 00:07:07,039 Speaker 4: it right now because we're very poor at building and 141 00:07:07,200 --> 00:07:09,200 Speaker 4: if we can find a better means of doing that, 142 00:07:09,600 --> 00:07:11,640 Speaker 4: we absolutely should clear but. 143 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:14,920 Speaker 3: They don't want foreign investment in any of us. And 144 00:07:15,120 --> 00:07:17,240 Speaker 3: you know, there was shades of you know, the bricks 145 00:07:17,240 --> 00:07:21,880 Speaker 3: that was here take back control sort of quote in 146 00:07:21,960 --> 00:07:25,040 Speaker 3: some of the materials that they're released. I mean, I 147 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:27,800 Speaker 3: just don't think we cannot just have a little money 148 00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:30,120 Speaker 3: go around in New Zealand. We don't have the money 149 00:07:30,160 --> 00:07:33,080 Speaker 3: to fund all of these things. We do need to 150 00:07:33,160 --> 00:07:34,600 Speaker 3: encourage them foreign investment. 151 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:36,280 Speaker 4: By the way, crazy, I think we do need to 152 00:07:36,360 --> 00:07:40,320 Speaker 4: encourage crossro Goan No, No, there you go. Okay, I 153 00:07:40,320 --> 00:07:41,680 Speaker 4: was going to say, I think we do need to 154 00:07:41,760 --> 00:07:45,400 Speaker 4: encourage foreign investment. But many of the things that we 155 00:07:45,480 --> 00:07:48,480 Speaker 4: should have been building over the past thirty forty years 156 00:07:48,720 --> 00:07:52,160 Speaker 4: would have just been normal Crown investment, and so I 157 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:54,200 Speaker 4: think that's a that's a case where we do need 158 00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:56,640 Speaker 4: to catch up. The best example of that is actually 159 00:07:56,640 --> 00:08:00,360 Speaker 4: the water infrastructure around New Zealand. So we've got lots 160 00:08:00,360 --> 00:08:03,920 Speaker 4: of free waters infrastructure that needs building. Local authorities are 161 00:08:04,040 --> 00:08:07,400 Speaker 4: often don't have the capacity of the size to do that. 162 00:08:07,800 --> 00:08:09,880 Speaker 4: So if we have a means of helping to grow 163 00:08:09,960 --> 00:08:12,080 Speaker 4: that and deliver it and do it more efficiently, that 164 00:08:12,160 --> 00:08:14,080 Speaker 4: means lower rate bills for everyone and that's got to 165 00:08:14,120 --> 00:08:15,960 Speaker 4: be a benefit to you know, to anyone who owns 166 00:08:15,960 --> 00:08:16,200 Speaker 4: it home. 167 00:08:16,320 --> 00:08:17,880 Speaker 2: Good on you guys, listen has been lovely to chat 168 00:08:17,880 --> 00:08:19,400 Speaker 2: to you. Thank you very much, Craig Rianny Ce to 169 00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:21,120 Speaker 2: you Economist and Clear the Lord Journalist. 170 00:08:21,720 --> 00:08:24,840 Speaker 1: For more from Hither Duplessy Alan Drive, listen live to 171 00:08:24,960 --> 00:08:28,000 Speaker 1: news talks. It'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow 172 00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:29,760 Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio.