Speaker 1: The ZiTm Podcast Network.
Speaker 2: I just was so completely terrified in that moment, but
Speaker 2: I just remember instantly having this feeling of oh, I'm
Speaker 2: going to die here. Now I look back on it
Speaker 2: in a completely different way, where I'm lying you were
Speaker 2: trying to do things in a world that wasn't really
Speaker 2: built for you.
Speaker 3: Hey, guys, welcome to another episode of Hope Is Real
Speaker 3: the podcast. The podcast designed to help you feel a
Speaker 3: little less alone, a bit more inspired, and.
Speaker 4: Of course, as always a lot more hopeful.
Speaker 3: Now this is my final interview episode of the season.
Speaker 3: I've got one more episode coming up next week, which
Speaker 3: Isn't Asked Me Anything.
Speaker 4: Submit your questions. We're going to be answering a whole
Speaker 4: lot of them.
Speaker 3: But this episode, I have one of my favorite humans
Speaker 3: on this planet, and I don't say that lightly. If
Speaker 3: you live in New Zealand, even if maybe live in Australia,
Speaker 3: you might know who this person is. Brie Thomas l
Speaker 3: She is from the Bri and Clint Show on ZiTm,
Speaker 3: the Drive show.
Speaker 4: You may ener honestly Britishish Island.
Speaker 3: She has recently just released a book called Unapologetically Me.
Speaker 3: Bree's story is I don't even really know how to
Speaker 3: explain it. Honestly, you're just gonna have to listen to it.
Speaker 3: She has gone through some crazy things and has come
Speaker 3: out the other side and has chosen to speak about
Speaker 3: this so that other people don't feel so alone. And
Speaker 3: I will, as always put it a bit of a
Speaker 3: trigger warning. On this episode. We do talk about the
Speaker 3: specific trauma that is involved with it, which is around
Speaker 3: a home invasion, which is a very traumatic home invasion,
Speaker 3: which does go into detail. But if at any point
Speaker 3: in time you feel like you need to take a
Speaker 3: break or anything like that, as always, you can pause this,
Speaker 3: you can come back to it, you can choose some
Speaker 3: We'll come back to it as well.
Speaker 4: That's okay.
Speaker 3: Breach out for help if you need it, contact your
Speaker 3: local helplines, talk to friends and family members. If anything
Speaker 3: in this episode comes up and you feel like you
Speaker 3: want to chat, that's okay.
Speaker 4: But Bri and her incredible story as coming up right
Speaker 4: after this. Brie, welcome to Hope, as were all the podcast.
Speaker 1: I feel honored, Jazz, I feel.
Speaker 4: Honored that you're here.
Speaker 3: This is I was thinking about it when I was
Speaker 3: driving in to do this. I don't know how many
Speaker 3: years I've been doing interviews on your show for I
Speaker 3: think every season of this podcast. I've come on and chatted.
Speaker 3: I've managed to dig up a photo of I think
Speaker 3: when I think it was before the first but the
Speaker 3: first podcast episode came out, and it would have been
Speaker 3: maybe when a book came out or something of you
Speaker 3: guys before we were actually friends. So we've been doing
Speaker 3: I don't know how many interviews.
Speaker 2: Don't don't out me on how old I am and
Speaker 2: how long I've been doing radio, but yes, we've knownly
Speaker 2: done it for a long time.
Speaker 1: In it will be seven years at the end of
Speaker 1: this year. Wow.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know what it would have been Girl on
Speaker 3: the Bridge when the movie came out. I think I
Speaker 3: did a and I think that'll be on Oh my Goodness.
Speaker 3: For those who don't know or if you're not from
Speaker 3: New Zealand, Brie is the one of the drive hosts
Speaker 3: from the print Print.
Speaker 4: Show Short at the Branklin.
Speaker 3: Show on zid in which also this is part of
Speaker 3: the zitim podcast network.
Speaker 4: But you have just had a book.
Speaker 3: Come out which I been read in a day, which,
Speaker 3: first of all, to anyone who knows me, knows I
Speaker 3: don't do that. Did you binge read in a whole day. Yeah,
Speaker 3: Like I literally said, I did not put it down.
Speaker 3: I could not put it down, and I knew, being
Speaker 3: honest with me, one hundred my friends ask my housemates,
Speaker 3: I missed the shoe as well.
Speaker 4: I'm pretty sure you did.
Speaker 1: You send me such a lot.
Speaker 3: It was like, this was insane, and now my housemates
Speaker 3: are all reading it as well.
Speaker 4: And after I read it, like like I said, i'd.
Speaker 3: Kind of I've known you for a long time, I know,
Speaker 3: but some pieces of your story and I've wanted you
Speaker 3: to come on this podcast for a while, but you
Speaker 3: hadn't really talked about a lot of this stuff publicly
Speaker 3: before this.
Speaker 4: Book kind of came out into the world.
Speaker 3: And I do want to get to there, but I
Speaker 3: would love to just kind of go literally right back
Speaker 3: to the start.
Speaker 4: What was life like growing up for you?
Speaker 2: Life was amazing as a kid, Like I grew up
Speaker 2: on an apple orchard farm kid.
Speaker 1: I don't think I wore shoes till I was like five.
Speaker 2: It was just, yeah, an incredible childhood, Like I had
Speaker 2: have amazing parents and we just had this really kind
Speaker 2: of I lived in a bubble really like country kids
Speaker 2: we live in a very naive bubble and yeah, it
Speaker 2: was awesome, like, played a lot of sport, loved school,
Speaker 2: loved everything until obviously.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I talk about it in the book.
Speaker 2: A really traumatic event that happened to me when I
Speaker 2: was nine years old, and I feel like from that
Speaker 2: day it set me on a different path. And you know,
Speaker 2: that bubble was definitely burst and yeah, changed my life forever.
Speaker 3: I still remember the exact moment where we were when
Speaker 3: you first told me about what had happened when you
Speaker 3: were nine, and we were I was driving you home
Speaker 3: from it, went to the comedy show, and then we
Speaker 3: went to an after party together, and then I was
Speaker 3: driving that's right. Yeah, And I remember it because I
Speaker 3: remember being in the car with you and you started
Speaker 3: talking about this, but at the same time you were
Speaker 3: also like, I mean, it's not as bad as and
Speaker 3: I was.
Speaker 4: Like, Brie, but it was so like to the fact,
Speaker 4: I still.
Speaker 3: Remember like every aspect of that conversation because what you
Speaker 3: went through and then reading it kind of and the book,
Speaker 3: it just was so it's so insane.
Speaker 4: Can you tell people who haven't read the book? Ye, yeah,
Speaker 4: what happened when you and I?
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I was home from school because I was
Speaker 2: sick at the time, and my mum, me and my
Speaker 2: brother we went into town to visit my nan. So
Speaker 2: we lived on the outskirts of town, so like about
Speaker 2: fifteen minutes outside of Stanthorpe where I lived, where I lived,
Speaker 2: and we went to visit my nan, who lived in
Speaker 2: the township.
Speaker 1: And it was just a.
Speaker 2: Normal day visiting my nan. And I remember I was
Speaker 2: sitting at the kitchen table and there was a knock
Speaker 2: at the door. And in a country town, you know,
Speaker 2: people pop over ask for a cup of sugar, That's
Speaker 2: what it's really like. And my Nan made her way
Speaker 2: to the front door, and I just remember immediately knowing
Speaker 2: that something wasn't right, and it's a feeling that you
Speaker 2: never want to get where it takes over your entire body.
Speaker 2: And I remember hearing these voices of these two men
Speaker 2: who pushed their way inside and they were holding my
Speaker 2: nan at knife point. And I mean, as a kid
Speaker 2: growing up in the country, I had never experienced anything
Speaker 2: like that, never seen anything like that, never heard about
Speaker 2: anything like that. But I just remember instantly having this
Speaker 2: feeling of, oh, I'm going to die here, and as
Speaker 2: a nine year old, like I just was so completely
Speaker 2: terrified in that moment, and I just remember I kept
Speaker 2: looking at my mum and my Nan, who was so
Speaker 2: harm and I think it was because I was in
Speaker 2: the room and they didn't want to panic me more.
Speaker 2: And it was at one point where one of the
Speaker 2: guys started ransacking the house and they were they were addicts,
Speaker 2: looking for a quick buck, looking for whatever they could get.
Speaker 1: That's what they were doing. And so one was ransacking
Speaker 1: the house.
Speaker 2: And it was at that point that the other one
Speaker 2: who had sat my Nan down at that point, became
Speaker 2: really angry because he was asking my mum for the
Speaker 2: keys to our car that was parked out the front,
Speaker 2: and my mum stood up and handed over her purse
Speaker 2: and he pulls out this banking bag because obviously we
Speaker 2: had a business and my mum had just done the
Speaker 2: banking that day. It's like a calico banking bag. And
Speaker 2: he's like, you're fucking with me, Like this is bullshit.
Speaker 2: And it was at that point where he threatened to
Speaker 2: take me and kidnap me, and all I remember is
Speaker 2: looking at my mom, just completely terrified, and I remember
Speaker 2: her saying to him in that moment, you can do
Speaker 2: whatever you want to do.
Speaker 1: Just don't hurt my daughter and take me with you.
Speaker 1: I will go. And oh it makes me, it makes
Speaker 1: me like I can.
Speaker 2: I still remember how I felt, I still remember how
Speaker 2: they smelt like. I just remember everything about that moment,
Speaker 2: and I truly saw how much my mom would give
Speaker 2: up for me, which was her own life, you know,
Speaker 2: and from that day, like, I've never been the same
Speaker 2: and my childhood, you know, was never the same from
Speaker 2: that moment.
Speaker 3: If you could say anything to those mean, what would
Speaker 3: you say?
Speaker 2: I would I don't know if i'd want to say
Speaker 2: anything to them, but I think I'd just be like,
Speaker 2: do you understand what your actions and what your decisions
Speaker 2: you made on those days, how they affected people? Because
Speaker 2: I don't think people really realize sometimes the lasting effects
Speaker 2: you can have on another person. But from that day,
Speaker 2: my mom, my, Nan and I were changed forever.
Speaker 3: I was I'm gonna cry again, but I was crying
Speaker 3: when I was reading it in the book because I
Speaker 3: again knowing you and also knowing kind of everything else
Speaker 3: in the book and context of all the stuff that
Speaker 3: you went through, but then knowing the person that you are.
Speaker 3: And this is why I think I said in the
Speaker 3: message to you but the way that you show up
Speaker 3: for people, in the way that there is every every
Speaker 3: excuse for you to have not become the person that
Speaker 3: you are from that like that and everything else that
Speaker 3: you've been through is like it's reckon horrific and like
Speaker 3: you said, it changes a person. But you are like
Speaker 3: one of the most loyal people. You Like you were
Speaker 3: there for me when my world was flipping upside down,
Speaker 3: Like you're the friend that shows up, and I think
Speaker 3: that's just such a testament to your I'm.
Speaker 4: Going at a ball as well.
Speaker 3: No, but it has because I remember I did a
Speaker 3: video a while ago that was talking about the fact
Speaker 3: that everyone says, like, oh, your trauma made you stronger,
Speaker 3: but your trauma traumatized you, and in your case, it
Speaker 3: literally changed your entire life. And what made you stronger
Speaker 3: was you and whatever you did between nine and now,
Speaker 3: every day that you had to get up and face
Speaker 3: it and live with those panicked feelings and things like,
Speaker 3: you've just become one of the most phenomenal people that
Speaker 3: I know.
Speaker 1: Thank you.
Speaker 4: Not because of that, but despite that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's honestly one of the nicest things someone has
Speaker 2: ever said about me.
Speaker 1: It's it's a funny thing.
Speaker 2: So someone asked me the other day because obviously this
Speaker 2: book has opened a lot of conversations, which I'm ready
Speaker 2: to have those conversations now, and I'm really proud of
Speaker 2: myself that I've been able to be vulnerable enough to
Speaker 2: open those doors. But someone asked me, and they said,
Speaker 2: what do you think or how do you think you
Speaker 2: would be.
Speaker 1: If that didn't happen to you?
Speaker 2: And it's something that I'd never thought about before, Like
Speaker 2: would I have anxious thoughts? Would I have panic attacks?
Speaker 2: Would I have become the person that I am today.
Speaker 2: It's such a weird thing to think about and something that, yeah,
Speaker 2: I've never really thought about that before. It's kind of
Speaker 2: hard to think about, to be honest, because I feel like,
Speaker 2: you know, those two men stole my childhood in a
Speaker 2: lot of ways and stole that feeling of lightness, you know,
Speaker 2: that I don't think I've ever had since that day.
Speaker 3: Well, I think they didn't just steal your childhood, that
Speaker 3: they stole your peace. This is something that didn't just
Speaker 3: affect you in your childhood years, and it's so it's
Speaker 3: so hard to know. And I've actually been having a
Speaker 3: similar conversation with my therapist. At the moment, we've been
Speaker 3: going back through my early child protection files together, and
Speaker 3: a lot of the stuff in there from when I
Speaker 3: was like three, and that same thing of like I
Speaker 3: wonder the person that I could have been if this
Speaker 3: not happened. But I was speaking at a conference a
Speaker 3: while ago and I got asked to speak on resilience,
Speaker 3: and I feel like resilience is a word that we
Speaker 3: just hear constantly all the time, and I was like,
Speaker 3: I want to do something different with this, and I
Speaker 3: ended up finding a definition that it wasn't talking about humans,
Speaker 3: but it was talking about objects, And the definition of
Speaker 3: resilience and objects is to be able to return back
Speaker 3: to original form. And thinking about that in this context
Speaker 3: of what your life could have been without that, I
Speaker 3: think almost the journey of your adult life and through
Speaker 3: your teen years has been trying to get back to
Speaker 3: that original form, that kid who.
Speaker 4: Was happy, who was carefree.
Speaker 3: Like that's the journey, and that's the part that even
Speaker 3: you know for me as well, of like getting back
Speaker 3: to the happy, bubbly girl that was once described in
Speaker 3: those files. Resilience isn't just about facing through the storm
Speaker 3: and now I have to work you know about how
Speaker 3: do you kind of restore what once was?
Speaker 2: That's such an interesting definition and like as you were saying,
Speaker 2: and I was like, oh my god, it's so because
Speaker 2: you know what, I feel like, there's and you'd be
Speaker 2: the same.
Speaker 1: There's those parts of me that I still have.
Speaker 2: But then I feel like it's quite amazed sometimes to
Speaker 2: get back to there. And so I feel like, you know,
Speaker 2: if those traumatic events didn't happen, would it just be
Speaker 2: more of a straight shot maze to be able to
Speaker 2: get and unlock those parts of yourself, you know, those
Speaker 2: the bubbly, happy light parts yourself, Like, would it just
Speaker 2: be easier to get back there? Whereas now you have
Speaker 2: these barriers or these you know, walls where you have
Speaker 2: to figure it out more and it takes time.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it takes a lot of time.
Speaker 3: And it's also like, when stuff like that happens, there's
Speaker 3: so many different aspects of your life that has affected
Speaker 3: your trust in people. The PTSD of it. I don't
Speaker 3: did you ever get diagnosed with PTSD.
Speaker 1: It's interesting.
Speaker 2: I went to a psychologist once, this was quite a
Speaker 2: few years ago, who I told, like, I talked to
Speaker 2: him about, you know, that event in my life and
Speaker 2: I was like, you know, I feel like I could
Speaker 2: have PTSD, Like I don't obviously, I'm not an expert.
Speaker 2: I'm not really sure, but and he kind of looked
Speaker 2: at me and said, you know, I don't know if
Speaker 2: that's right.
Speaker 1: I don't know if this is connected with this.
Speaker 2: And from that moment I kind of just shut it
Speaker 2: down and was like, oh, well, he says that it
Speaker 2: wouldn't be the case.
Speaker 1: But it's interesting.
Speaker 2: A friend of mine who has a psychology degree read
Speaker 2: my book and she knows me very well, and she
Speaker 2: goes for him to say that there's no chance of
Speaker 2: you having PTSD is mind blowing to me, you know. Yeah,
Speaker 2: And so that's something, yeah, that I've also taken from
Speaker 2: this process and hopefully we'll find out more in the
Speaker 2: future about.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, it would one hundred percent makes sense
Speaker 3: purely for the fact that you can still me with
Speaker 3: the smell of them and like their voice and all
Speaker 3: that kind of stuff, Like so much of that is
Speaker 3: related and I don't know if this has happened, you know,
Speaker 3: I really kind of hope that you never have to
Speaker 3: run into the smell of that again. But that's a
Speaker 3: lot of the stuff with those kind of traumatic events.
Speaker 3: I did a bunch of exposure therapy for mine. So
Speaker 3: one of the things that I couldn't handle was sunflowers,
Speaker 3: which sounds really stupid, but for me, one of the
Speaker 3: things that happened when I was super young, one of
Speaker 3: the assaults from someone within my household was in a
Speaker 3: sunflower shed, and so I remember seeing the sunflowers and then.
Speaker 4: I would have this like visceral reaction to some.
Speaker 3: Flowers when I see them out and that was just
Speaker 3: the brain being like just auto associating it. Or if
Speaker 3: you walk past someone in a mall and you smell
Speaker 3: the smell of those people, immediately you're back there and
Speaker 3: being able to remember a lot of those things as
Speaker 3: things that especially like the fact that that psychologist would
Speaker 3: be like, oh, nothing's related, like nuts, Like it's you're
Speaker 3: nine years old, You're being threatened to be kidnapped by
Speaker 3: these people who are holding a knife to your nanna.
Speaker 4: How did this How did this situation like resolve?
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was I think, like thinking back on it
Speaker 2: now and I can remember every single thing that happened.
Speaker 2: It was it was in this moment where my mum
Speaker 2: was pleading with this guy that she would go with
Speaker 2: him to the bank. She would do whatever he wanted
Speaker 2: as long as he didn't take me. And it was
Speaker 2: at that point that the other guy came back into
Speaker 2: the situation from ransacking the house, and thank god, he
Speaker 2: had a more level headed thought where he was like,
Speaker 2: we don't want to do that, Let's leave these people,
Speaker 2: and he calmed the other guy down, thank god. And
Speaker 2: I know this is like so ridiculous, but I'm so
Speaker 2: grateful for that person him in that moment where he, yeah,
Speaker 2: pretty much shut down that situation and they left.
Speaker 4: Did at any point.
Speaker 3: So the guy, the one that was threatening to do that,
Speaker 3: he was one that's holding the knife to your yes, nansa.
Speaker 1: Did he attend to mine?
Speaker 4: He held it to ye.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: At that point, he'd sat my hand down, and I remember,
Speaker 2: because I was quite a scorny kid, like I was
Speaker 2: quite a little scorny nine year old, and I remember
Speaker 2: my feet just being able to touch the ground because
Speaker 2: he was holding me with one arm and then kind
Speaker 2: of had this knife so pressed up against my throat
Speaker 2: that it was basically like I couldn't speak because it
Speaker 2: was there was so much pressure, and he obviously wasn't
Speaker 2: in his right mind. Like and you could tell that
Speaker 2: where everything he was saying, he wasn't thinking properly. And
Speaker 2: it was so interesting because after that happened, like the
Speaker 2: events that unfolded afterwards, like I had to go as
Speaker 2: a part of the court proceedings, I had to go
Speaker 2: to a child psychologist and they had to assess me
Speaker 2: and deem weather it had had lasting effects on me,
Speaker 2: And I remember my mum never told me, like she
Speaker 2: just kind of you know, she tried to shelter me
Speaker 2: as much as she could. But obviously over the years
Speaker 2: we've talked about stuff where she has been like, you know,
Speaker 2: the report from that child psychologist was that you definitely
Speaker 2: had lasting effects.
Speaker 4: Did you ever look at that report?
Speaker 1: I've never seen it.
Speaker 4: You know you can, Yeah, I don't know if you should,
Speaker 4: but you can.
Speaker 1: Yeah. It would be interesting and maybe something I'll do
Speaker 1: in the future.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's I only asked because eggin going through all
Speaker 3: the files with my psychologist at the moment, there's an
Speaker 3: interview with me from when I was three years old
Speaker 3: that's in there and they kind of document it word
Speaker 3: for word, which is insane, But also what made.
Speaker 1: You decide to do that?
Speaker 2: Where you were like I want to open up those
Speaker 2: files from obviously the darkest time in your life and
Speaker 2: work through those What gave you the courage to be
Speaker 2: able to be like, I'm ready to do that?
Speaker 3: I think that to be honest, I started to get
Speaker 3: a lot more kind of PTSD symptoms that were starting
Speaker 3: to come back up again, and there was some of
Speaker 3: it there, especially from the earlier years that I have
Speaker 3: blacked out completely and also just don't really understand because
Speaker 3: it was so missy like, and so I just was like,
Speaker 3: I'm sick of this controlling my life and my relationships,
Speaker 3: and like I'm still so afraid of people being close
Speaker 3: to me.
Speaker 4: And I don't want this to control me anymore.
Speaker 3: And so I basically just sat down with my theory
Speaker 3: and I was like, I want to I want to
Speaker 3: do this now. Yeah, And so yeah, it was literally
Speaker 3: it was only last week that we went through and
Speaker 3: like read everything together, and I just like sat there
Speaker 3: balling my eyes out, just as I was, you know,
Speaker 3: because there's a lot of like there's a lot there's
Speaker 3: a lot in there, and there's a lot of kind
Speaker 3: of still confusion because there's you know, three different men
Speaker 3: that are named from three to four years old, but
Speaker 3: it just it's going to still be a process to
Speaker 3: go through. But it's just that feeling of like, no,
Speaker 3: screw you, this is not going to control me anymore.
Speaker 3: And I think for a really long time I had
Speaker 3: just managed to push it aside so much.
Speaker 4: I'd done like a lot of.
Speaker 1: What so many of us do.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, And you'll take parts and work on certain
Speaker 2: cards and then keep other parts kind of you know,
Speaker 2: pushed away.
Speaker 3: And then you but sometimes you don't realize that stuff's
Speaker 3: still there until something sparks it. So like for me,
Speaker 3: it was I remember when I was doing Dancing with
Speaker 3: the Stars and we did our very first rehearsal and
Speaker 3: I had to put my hand on my dance partner,
Speaker 3: Brad's chest, and I freaked out like I couldn't do that,
Speaker 3: and I was like, what the heck? And that was
Speaker 3: something for me that I then had this memory of
Speaker 3: from And you know, so there's just a whole bunch
Speaker 3: of things. And I've done a lot of stuff on
Speaker 3: my like kind of later childhood, but the earlier stuff
Speaker 3: I've never touched.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I'm so proud of you.
Speaker 2: That's so amazing, like to be able to say you
Speaker 2: know what, I'm not going to let this control me anymore,
Speaker 2: and I'm going to face all this stuff and have
Speaker 2: the courage to open all these parts of my life
Speaker 2: that I've pushed down because it's not going to control
Speaker 2: me anymore. And that's such a powerful thing. Jazz.
Speaker 4: I mean, you've just done the same thing with this book.
Speaker 3: Like I remember coming to your house because your dog
Speaker 3: was sick at the time and you being like this
Speaker 3: is like you're freaking out.
Speaker 1: It's terrifying.
Speaker 3: It is terrifying, and I like, the writing process is hard,
Speaker 3: and you're having to confront everything, the fact that you
Speaker 3: chose to do that, and you really lay it all
Speaker 3: bear in this book.
Speaker 4: You're literally like hear it.
Speaker 1: See even that makes me anxious, Like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: I really did you did?
Speaker 3: But but like it's just one I mean, I couldn't
Speaker 3: put it down because first of all, I felt like
Speaker 3: I was reading a freaking episode of Law and Order,
Speaker 3: Like I.
Speaker 1: Was like, what the hell?
Speaker 3: But also like it's just the way that you articulators
Speaker 3: is phenomenal and you really kind of get drawn into
Speaker 3: too who you are.
Speaker 4: But I know that that process is not easy.
Speaker 3: What was the writing process like for you having to
Speaker 3: revisit that because you've basically done a form of exposure
Speaker 3: therapy yourself by writing about it in detail.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're so right, and as you would know, you've
Speaker 2: written like a thousand books.
Speaker 1: I think you were the first person I asked for
Speaker 1: for advice. I was like, how do you do this?
Speaker 1: And you've been just so amazing. Yeah, it was horrible
Speaker 1: in parts, horrible.
Speaker 3: I also remember at one point you saying, I don't
Speaker 3: really have anything to write about.
Speaker 4: Bree Thomas Town.
Speaker 2: It's obviously me writting from my past jazz, you know,
Speaker 2: or just me thinking that, yeah, what I have to
Speaker 2: say isn't that important, which you know, I've struggled with
Speaker 2: self confidence my whole life. But I think in the
Speaker 2: process of everything, like I found it really difficult. Like,
Speaker 2: don't get me wrong, Like it was one of the
Speaker 2: hardest things I've ever done, partly because of the concentration
Speaker 2: it takes and how difficult it is, but secondly, yeah,
Speaker 2: bringing up every piece of you know, every piece of
Speaker 2: your dark past, like the good, the bad, and the ugly,
Speaker 2: every piece of dirty laundry Undie's included, and writing it
Speaker 2: down on a page.
Speaker 1: Where as you're writing it.
Speaker 2: You're like, people are going to read this, Like there's
Speaker 2: stuff in there that is funny, but I'm super embarrassed
Speaker 2: about it. There's stuff in there that I think is
Speaker 2: so raw that only the very very closest people to
Speaker 2: me no, And I think getting your head around the
Speaker 2: fact that it's going to be out there for anyone
Speaker 2: to consume, like is really difficult. But my reason for
Speaker 2: writing the book like never waivered during the whole process
Speaker 2: where I was like, I need to be this honest,
Speaker 2: I need to be this vulnerable because I want to
Speaker 2: help someone else.
Speaker 1: I want.
Speaker 2: At least one person, hopefully a few more, because it
Speaker 2: did take a long time to read it and to
Speaker 2: just feel understood.
Speaker 1: You know. What's the response been, Like, it's been amazing,
Speaker 1: Like it's such a crazy.
Speaker 2: Thing, like in the world we live in today, like
Speaker 2: where people can connect with you, you know, and you
Speaker 2: can have conversations with people that you don't know, and
Speaker 2: just the response I get from people just saying you've
Speaker 2: made me feel like so seen and I feel heard
Speaker 2: and understood, and those messages make everything worth it. All
Speaker 2: those anxious thoughts, the sleepless nights that.
Speaker 1: I continue to have.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that connection with people has made everything worth it.
Speaker 3: It's the hardest thing putting yourself out there to not
Speaker 3: only face the stuff that happened to you, but then
Speaker 3: to literally write it out word for word and have
Speaker 3: people read it. Is not something a lot of people do,
Speaker 3: and it takes a cramped under strength and courage and bravery.
Speaker 3: And I know that I've seen this to you before,
Speaker 3: but the fact that so many people are gonna find
Speaker 3: so much hope and strength and be seen because of
Speaker 3: your ability to do that and your story is so like,
Speaker 3: it's so wild in so many ways, not just what
Speaker 3: happen when you were nying, but kind of everything else
Speaker 3: that you wrote.
Speaker 4: About in their book.
Speaker 3: There's so much that people won't relate to my story,
Speaker 3: but people relate to yours. People won't late to like
Speaker 3: Macro found it like these everyone's story matters.
Speaker 1: You know. What do you find that?
Speaker 2: I think when it comes down to like, people who
Speaker 2: have been there are able to truly understand. And I
Speaker 2: feel like that's one thing that I'm so grateful for.
Speaker 2: Like all of the bad stuff, you know, especially that
Speaker 2: moment and all the panic attacks and anxious thoughts that
Speaker 2: I've had over the years. One of the best things
Speaker 2: that has come from it for me is I'm able
Speaker 2: to help people close to me that if they're going
Speaker 2: through a similar thing. I've talked people out, like down
Speaker 2: from panic attacks. I've been there to be able to
Speaker 2: know what they need to hear or to give them
Speaker 2: what they need. And that's something I don't think I
Speaker 2: would have unless I have lived it and been through
Speaker 2: it myself. And it's something that I'm so grateful for
Speaker 2: and would never want to change about myself. And I
Speaker 2: feel like you're the same.
Speaker 3: I think you know it's so true, and I think
Speaker 3: that that's probably why definitely, and that in that time
Speaker 3: that I was like.
Speaker 4: Yeah, here it all is, I come here, and you
Speaker 4: were like, but I.
Speaker 3: Also knew that you weren't going to like, well, I
Speaker 3: don't know if you were for about I knew that
Speaker 3: you wouldn't like freak out and jump to worst k
Speaker 3: or like you know, like as whereas a lot of
Speaker 3: people can if they don't understand that.
Speaker 4: Sometimes it's just like it's just a lot.
Speaker 3: And I feel like we've we've kind of shared a
Speaker 3: lot of those kind of different moments. I remember you
Speaker 3: getting your ADHD diagnosis was.
Speaker 1: Which I talk about in the book an I was like,
Speaker 1: I got.
Speaker 4: I got a name mentioned there. I felt very special. No,
Speaker 4: I again I for.
Speaker 3: Some reason, those are the These are the two moments
Speaker 3: I specifically remember with you. One was in the car
Speaker 3: hearing that story about the breaking, and then the second
Speaker 3: was being in the Xenim office and you came in
Speaker 3: and you were like, I think someone said I possibly
Speaker 3: potentially have Adhdeah And I was like.
Speaker 1: The look on your face where I was like, and
Speaker 1: you think.
Speaker 3: So, I meant listen, well, okay, for what was it
Speaker 3: that made you think initially that like, what was it
Speaker 3: that made this conversation come up that you were like, oh,
Speaker 3: is this is this potentially a thing?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Like it's so I love thinking back on it now
Speaker 2: and how oblivious I was, because I'd never had the
Speaker 2: thought where I was like, oh, maybe I've got adhd
Speaker 2: and maybe that's why I've always felt a bit out
Speaker 2: of place and things have been a bit harder for me.
Speaker 2: But it was my producer, Ellie, who worked on The
Speaker 2: Brian Clint Show for a number of years, and we're
Speaker 2: like family when you work in a radio show like that,
Speaker 2: and our show's always tight knit because there's not many
Speaker 2: of us, and her and I just from the day
Speaker 2: I met her, we connected.
Speaker 1: And I always say this to people, I'm like.
Speaker 2: Everyone, you know, sometimes I meet people and I'm like,
Speaker 2: they're lovely people, They're not my people. And sometimes I'll
Speaker 2: meet people and I'll be like my people. Like when
Speaker 2: I met you, I was like my people.
Speaker 3: I think we initially connected because we were standing in
Speaker 3: the corner of an event one time because we were
Speaker 3: both into.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I was like, can I stand here with you?
Speaker 4: We just stood there and then we became friends essence.
Speaker 2: And I was like, do you feel comfortable uncomfortable at events?
Speaker 2: And you're like yeah, And I was like, do you
Speaker 2: want to stand in the corner this whole time?
Speaker 1: And You're like yeah. Now at every event, I'm like, I.
Speaker 4: Literally do the same thing. Goes stand in the corner, yeah.
Speaker 1: And just to feel comfortable and like safe.
Speaker 2: But yeah, she and she was one of my people
Speaker 2: where I was like, oh, I just connect with this person,
Speaker 2: Like there's just something where we're so similar in so
Speaker 2: many ways and anyway, we were so close over the
Speaker 2: time she worked on the show and then she left
Speaker 2: to go do amazing things and she got opportunities. And
Speaker 2: it was probably maybe a year and a half or
Speaker 2: even two years after she'd left the show, and we'd
Speaker 2: still kept in touch and with still friends. But I
Speaker 2: remember I get this phone call from her and she
Speaker 2: was like, how are you blah blah blah, and I
Speaker 2: was like, what's happening with you? And she was like, oh,
Speaker 2: I've just been diagnosed with ADHD. And I was like, oh, amazing,
Speaker 2: Like how do you feel about that? And she's like, yeah, no,
Speaker 2: it's been really good and I've been working through the process.
Speaker 2: She's like, I've actually called to be like, maybe you
Speaker 2: should go and look into this, because you know how
Speaker 2: you and I are real similar. And she has a
Speaker 2: degree in psychology and she loves she people and understanding people.
Speaker 2: And I was like, oh, well, she thinks that I
Speaker 2: should go get checked. Maybe I should go look into this.
Speaker 2: And in true ADHD form, it took me a year
Speaker 2: and finally I think I was ready because I think
Speaker 2: deep down from that moment I started doing my own
Speaker 2: research and started thinking about things in a different way,
Speaker 2: and I think I probably knew, but going through that
Speaker 2: process where the first initial assessment was with this beautiful
Speaker 2: woman who I talk about in the book.
Speaker 1: It was over zoom because it was still all.
Speaker 2: COVID times, and she just said something to me like,
Speaker 2: we went through, you know, obviously the process, which is
Speaker 2: quite a lengthy thing, where I talked to her about
Speaker 2: my childhood and all the rest of it.
Speaker 1: And at the end of it she said to me, she's.
Speaker 2: Like, well, look, I'm ninety nine point nine to nine
Speaker 2: percent sure that I can say to you that you
Speaker 2: have ADHD.
Speaker 1: And she's like, I know, I just want to say.
Speaker 2: You know, hearing about you, know, your life and what
Speaker 2: you've been through, I'm just so proud of you. And
Speaker 2: she's like, look at how look at you and how
Speaker 2: well you've done and you've battled you know, hope.
Speaker 3: And it was right, don't cry, await me cry, because
Speaker 3: that's everything that I would want to let that that
Speaker 3: articulates everything. Then yeah, I think of you and that
Speaker 3: as well, like, oh, I'm not crying.
Speaker 1: I'm not crying. I'm not crying.
Speaker 2: But it was it was such an amazing moment from
Speaker 2: this woman who I just met in the zoom for
Speaker 2: the past two hours, and she was just kind of like,
Speaker 2: you know, I wish you had been through this process earlier,
Speaker 2: and you could have understood yourself more and it would
Speaker 2: have made things easier for you. And God, it's been amazing,
Speaker 2: like getting that diagnosis, and since then, I've done my
Speaker 2: own research and it's just given me this whole new
Speaker 2: outlook on my entire life and who I am as
Speaker 2: a person, you know, and it's allowed me to be
Speaker 2: kinder to myself.
Speaker 1: I degrieve the old.
Speaker 2: Version of me, like who I thought I was this
Speaker 2: kind of you know, person who never fit in and
Speaker 2: struggle their way through and was a bit hopeless at
Speaker 2: times and lazy and all the rest of it.
Speaker 1: But now I.
Speaker 2: Look back on it in a completely different way where
Speaker 2: I'm like, fuck, good on you for pushing and struggling
Speaker 2: when you were trying to do things in a world
Speaker 2: that wasn't really built for you.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I oh man, I remember that that same feeling
Speaker 3: when I got diagnosed and being like all of these
Speaker 3: things that I thought were just wrong with who I am,
Speaker 3: it's just a disorder.
Speaker 4: Literally, disorder literally And I like, I.
Speaker 3: I know that I, as someone with ADHD struggled a
Speaker 3: lot with even relationships and friendships because they're out of sight,
Speaker 3: out of mind for.
Speaker 4: A lot of people, does I still do? Yeah.
Speaker 3: It doesn't just exist for objects, but people, if they're
Speaker 3: not in your everyday world, it's so much harder. And
Speaker 3: I remember being like, oh my gosh, it's not just
Speaker 3: that I'm not just a terrible friend, Like, it's actually
Speaker 3: really hard for me to stay and that's why I
Speaker 3: have I don't know how many unread text messages on
Speaker 3: my phone?
Speaker 1: Don't look at mine? Should we compare? Yeah? We should? Okay, Yeah,
Speaker 1: how many do you have?
Speaker 4: Text messages?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Text messages.
Speaker 4: Oh, actually, mine's not too bad of text right now.
Speaker 4: My emails are terrible.
Speaker 1: What do you Okay, do text and then we'll do emails.
Speaker 3: Fifty two text four hundred and forty that's insane. Okay, emails,
Speaker 3: what do you got?
Speaker 1: Wait?
Speaker 3: Where's my How do I find my my thing?
Speaker 1: Doesn't it should just be up?
Speaker 4: Okay?
Speaker 3: Oh no, I have two different apps, so I've got
Speaker 3: Gmail and then my other one. But my other one
Speaker 3: is thirty nine thousand, seven hundred and eighty five and
Speaker 3: my Gmail was eleven two hundred and forty one.
Speaker 1: Mine's like two up, so you win the emails.
Speaker 3: I think my tics have been reo because I usually
Speaker 3: in the hundreds, but they must have been maybe when.
Speaker 2: I got you're so in demand though, like the amount
Speaker 2: of people that would be sending you emails offering you this,
Speaker 2: oh come and do this jazz or whereas obviously the
Speaker 2: people who are closest to you have your number.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and so you're better at that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, my emails. I can't believe.
Speaker 2: Email like i'd have thought today, Like I will just
Speaker 2: have random thoughts that pop into my mind where I'm like,
Speaker 2: remember that email you read like two weeks ago, you
Speaker 2: probably should apply to that.
Speaker 1: And like just and I was just like, oh, that's right. Yeah,
Speaker 1: does that happen to you.
Speaker 4: All the time, all the time? And then I just
Speaker 4: have it.
Speaker 3: Then I'll have a day of like I'm going to
Speaker 3: reply to everything, and then the next day I'm like,
Speaker 3: no other.
Speaker 4: Will reply again, and I'm gonna reply again, and.
Speaker 3: Then that's another two weeks because like when you reply everyone,
Speaker 3: but you don't just do it at once like you
Speaker 3: do like one person, you do. You do a bulk
Speaker 3: reply to all of the things you've avoided for the last.
Speaker 1: That's exactly how I function.
Speaker 4: And my manager always makes fun of me.
Speaker 1: He's like, oh yeah, but one of those days.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that literally the same here even for the podcast,
Speaker 3: like the hy producers and Sam who works here, He'll
Speaker 3: always know when I've taken my meds because he'll be like,
Speaker 3: she's just sent me like twelve emails and all of
Speaker 3: the things that we've been needing her to do for
Speaker 3: so long, Like, I'm so sorry, I just took my meads.
Speaker 1: I'm hyper focusing. Now are you on?
Speaker 4: Are you on medication for you already?
Speaker 2: No, so not at the moment, like and like I've
Speaker 2: spoken to you because you've been so amazing and given
Speaker 2: me advice. And when I was first going through that process,
Speaker 2: so I tried one type of medication and I gave
Speaker 2: it a go, and I feel like it wasn't really
Speaker 2: doing what I wanted it to do and wasn't serving
Speaker 2: me or making things easier. So I was like, I'll
Speaker 2: just put that to the side for now, but definitely
Speaker 2: doesn't mean that I won't try another one in the
Speaker 2: future or you know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I definitely, I think.
Speaker 1: Because you tried how many of you tried Now.
Speaker 3: I've tried three different ones now, so the first one
Speaker 3: didn't work for me at all. The second one, I
Speaker 3: thought at the time was because I was focusing and
Speaker 3: I was doing all the things about man.
Speaker 4: The side effects were wild like that.
Speaker 3: I think I was the most hydrated I've ever been
Speaker 3: in my entire life, because I would just be glugging
Speaker 3: back like really doesn't lead as a water every day
Speaker 3: and then the crash was insane. But I also found
Speaker 3: that on the last ones I also struggled to hold
Speaker 3: a conversation and that kind of thing as well, whereas
Speaker 3: the ones that I've just been put on. So my
Speaker 3: psychiatrist was kind of going through all the different options
Speaker 3: and he was like, this is one where these other
Speaker 3: ones don't work. This is what people can use, and
Speaker 3: it has been a game changer. Like literally, the only
Speaker 3: thing that it's really doing is quietening my brain and
Speaker 3: then just kind of evening out that sounds nice my mood,
Speaker 3: and that's kind of it. It's not making me do
Speaker 3: the super hyper focus.
Speaker 4: It's not like we're.
Speaker 1: Giving you that verse.
Speaker 4: Yeah, no, I don't.
Speaker 3: I don't because it's I take it three times a day,
Speaker 3: right this one.
Speaker 4: It's some smaller doses.
Speaker 3: So it's been like for me, I'm like, oh my gosh,
Speaker 3: and this is the first time I've taken ADHD meets
Speaker 3: consistently because the last time I wouldn't because I didn't
Speaker 3: like how I felt on it.
Speaker 4: But then I'll be like, oh, my laundry.
Speaker 3: Is run out and I've started using bikini bottoms is underwear,
Speaker 3: Like I need to focus, I need to focus on
Speaker 3: different things. But yeah, it's such a like and for
Speaker 3: each person it's different. Like I know that especially for you,
Speaker 3: you're in a creative job where your ADHD has served
Speaker 3: you well so much superpower. No, literally most of my
Speaker 3: career is like my ADHD. I'll give credit to it
Speaker 3: because it's like two am Like all of our big
Speaker 3: creative ideas that we've had for voices will come at
Speaker 3: to Amgen, Like literally two days ago we came out
Speaker 3: with our kind of next. I'm really excited for it.
Speaker 3: I think it's one of my favorite creative things I've
Speaker 3: come up with. I was standing in the shower and
Speaker 3: I literally had music on, so I had my phone
Speaker 3: like on the other side, and I grabbed my phone.
Speaker 4: I just start voice recording over to Gin and I'm like.
Speaker 3: Here's the idea, like in the middle of it, because
Speaker 3: at that time I didn't have my I hadn't taken
Speaker 3: my morning mids.
Speaker 4: Yet, but it literally is like it's a superpower.
Speaker 3: And they say that people with ADHD don't just think
Speaker 3: outside the box, they create an entire new one. And
Speaker 3: that's why there's so many people that are super successful
Speaker 3: with ADHD. And once they begin to understand that's what
Speaker 3: it is, and they can leverage that and not just
Speaker 3: think they're a terrible person and like a useless and
Speaker 3: lazy and like all of that kind of thing. Like
Speaker 3: I remember with voice a few years ago before I
Speaker 3: had this diagnosis, we had these two big campaigns that
Speaker 3: were running at the same time, and me and Jen
Speaker 3: could not be more polar opposite. And she was in
Speaker 3: charge of one. I was in charge of the other.
Speaker 3: For her one, she had to like book flights for
Speaker 3: like a whole bunch of people coordinate all these things,
Speaker 3: were booking out a movie theater. She like, her to
Speaker 3: do list was insane. I had to buy post it notes.
Speaker 3: Guess what I forgot to do by post it notes?
Speaker 3: She had to buy the post it notes, And I
Speaker 3: remember her being like what they had, like why one tiny?
Speaker 3: Or she'd like be like sending me forms and like
Speaker 3: why the heat can't you sign it? And then once
Speaker 3: I got the diagnosis, it was like, oh, this makes
Speaker 3: this makes so much sense, and.
Speaker 4: I'm like, I'm so so I'm trying my best, but
Speaker 4: I just like fault.
Speaker 1: I'd like bright is why I know?
Speaker 4: And it's so.
Speaker 3: But also having ADHD mimics a lot of other symptoms
Speaker 3: from other illnesses, so a lot of the times people
Speaker 3: can get misdiagnosed as well, and I think, yeah, this
Speaker 3: is why kind of doing circling back around to the
Speaker 3: question around PTSD, I know that for me when I
Speaker 3: was a teenager, I ended up getting diagnosed with originally
Speaker 3: with BPG, which is borderline personality disorder, but it was
Speaker 3: really they were kind of like, uh, you don't.
Speaker 4: Really fit when they're just shove you.
Speaker 3: Yes, there was the easiest thing for them to do,
Speaker 3: which was annoying because as well they're label of that
Speaker 3: on your hospital files. It's the most misunderstood. It's just
Speaker 3: labeled as attention seeking. And then as I got older
Speaker 3: and had a rediagnose and like no jazz. You have
Speaker 3: ADHD and PTSD and those two things combined, especially because
Speaker 3: of the ADHD if you have the hyperfixation on things
Speaker 3: as well, and you get stuck in the with the
Speaker 3: trauma side of it and the flashbacks and that physical feeling.
Speaker 3: Because you think the same way you can get hyper
Speaker 3: focused on like tasks and you know that kind of thing,
Speaker 3: or hobbies.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you can get hyperfixed, hyper focused.
Speaker 3: On trauma, and it can sometimes mimic symptoms of other things.
Speaker 1: I feel like I should be paying you for the system.
Speaker 2: I feel like everything you're saying, I'm just kind of like, yeah, yeah, amazing, Yeah,
Speaker 2: I totally understand that.
Speaker 3: I mean, it took me so long to when when
Speaker 3: I heard that from my psychiatrist psychologist, and I was like,
Speaker 3: oh my gosh, like this because for me, I was
Speaker 3: the impulsivity was the reason that they gave me the
Speaker 3: BPD thing that it was like, No, what it was
Speaker 3: was that there was this trauma response and then I
Speaker 3: would mull on it for so long and I would
Speaker 3: have physical flashbacks for it, and my ADHD bought in
Speaker 3: my impulsiveness, which then I was like, I.
Speaker 4: Need to get out of this now.
Speaker 3: Yeah right, And so that's what it was for me.
Speaker 3: And obviously that kind of shows up differently for other people.
Speaker 1: And that makes so much sense now that you're saying it.
Speaker 2: But how freakin hard and long has it been for
Speaker 2: you to get to that, My God, where you're like, yeah,
Speaker 2: that makes so much sense.
Speaker 3: So much sense, and it's been able to, like you said,
Speaker 3: have just been able to have so much grace for
Speaker 3: yourself and like I remember again my therapist saying, like Jazz,
Speaker 3: you did the best with the situation that you were
Speaker 3: in at the time. Like I think there's you can
Speaker 3: be so angry at yourself, like how you respond and
Speaker 3: like why am I not just over this? Or why
Speaker 3: am I still dealing with us? Why am I swimming
Speaker 3: these panic attacks?
Speaker 4: Why am I?
Speaker 3: You know?
Speaker 1: But it's like I still get angry at myself to
Speaker 1: this day, did.
Speaker 3: You like when you If you do that again, I
Speaker 3: want you to pull up a photo of nine year
Speaker 3: old Bree. Yeah, look at the girl that was living
Speaker 3: in that situation and that went through that She did
Speaker 3: the best that she freaking could in that time and
Speaker 3: developed those coping mechanisms, those things that you now would
Speaker 3: do to even guard yourself. That's just nine year old
Speaker 3: Bree who needed to protect yourself. Oh, that's something that
Speaker 3: I've had to do. There's actually there's a photo of
Speaker 3: younger me in my bag that I carry around as
Speaker 3: that reminder because I would get so angry at myself.
Speaker 4: Of like why do I do this? Why do I
Speaker 4: push people away?
Speaker 3: Why am I? And it's like this is stuff that
Speaker 3: this kid just was trying to protect herself and that
Speaker 3: for me is has really helped.
Speaker 4: Like it doesn't make it.
Speaker 3: Go away, but it gives yourself so much more grace
Speaker 3: as to the responses and that it makes sense and
Speaker 3: that everything and that everything that you do, like the
Speaker 3: response is the thoughts, all of it. It makes sense.
Speaker 3: It's just how and why it makes sense. But yeah,
Speaker 3: that was a game changer.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I just wanted to say as well,
Speaker 2: because it's so interesting, like, and I love that you're
Speaker 2: so open about like I've tried three different types of
Speaker 2: medication and this one didn't work, and this is how
Speaker 2: this one made me feel. I think it's so important
Speaker 2: and I feel like this fits with not just ADHD medication,
Speaker 2: but you know, antidepressants or like so many things that
Speaker 2: it can be a real journey to find something that.
Speaker 1: Works for you.
Speaker 2: And it's so easy to get disheartened when you just
Speaker 2: want something that just works and that's it, and it's
Speaker 2: the miracle pill, and but it just isn't like that,
Speaker 2: and I feel like I didn't cover that as much
Speaker 2: as what I wanted to in my book where I'm
Speaker 2: not on medication right now, But that doesn't mean I
Speaker 2: don't believe it's the best thing for certain people. But
Speaker 2: I just think it's such a real journey and you
Speaker 2: just need to be as focused as you can be
Speaker 2: that if something's not working for you, then you can
Speaker 2: try something else. Like we're lucky enough to live in
Speaker 2: a country where we're able to do that, and especially
Speaker 2: with like we're talking about before this started, like the
Speaker 2: new laws that are coming in where the government is
Speaker 2: going to pay for ADHD medications and like that's amazing and.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and that also getting rid of the special authority,
Speaker 3: the renewal process.
Speaker 4: It's huge because that's.
Speaker 1: And it's something you were so vocal about.
Speaker 3: Yes, and also because I didn't know about it, and
Speaker 3: I remember, I think it was one of the first
Speaker 3: things I told you, because it took me off guard
Speaker 3: when it happened that I went to go pick up.
Speaker 4: My script and they were like, sorry, you're panicked.
Speaker 3: You literally can't get it, Like you need to go
Speaker 3: get it renewed again, and I was like, what do
Speaker 3: you mean and they're like, this is the process every
Speaker 3: two years and the reason.
Speaker 1: Depend on this medication. You can't just do that to people.
Speaker 3: Why are we having to prove over two years that
Speaker 3: we still have ADHD yes, still.
Speaker 4: Have this lifelong thing. No one else is doing that.
Speaker 2: It's not a for right now diagnose, you know. It's
Speaker 2: not like oh you got God, but here's a pill
Speaker 2: gets rid of it.
Speaker 4: It's like four five hundred dollars for a psychiatrist console.
Speaker 3: And there was no way that I could get into
Speaker 3: either for this. But like my GP and I did
Speaker 3: this video and about watching it, yeah, which at the
Speaker 3: time I was like, oh, and I know, like some
Speaker 3: people will be like, oh there's always so much drama
Speaker 3: going on.
Speaker 4: It's because I share the stuff that goes on.
Speaker 1: It's because you care and you're the voice for so
Speaker 1: many like you know.
Speaker 3: But in that moment, I remember, I was panic. I
Speaker 3: just pulled my phone out and was like screw it.
Speaker 3: But yeah, so they finally have done this now where
Speaker 3: you don't have to.
Speaker 4: Get that special authority to get it.
Speaker 3: But I do think what you're saying is so important
Speaker 3: around like what even when I did my story about
Speaker 3: changing meds, like one thing is going.
Speaker 4: To work for me, that's not going to work for
Speaker 4: other people.
Speaker 3: And exactly, not even just with meds, with like talk therapy,
Speaker 3: I've done, like I've done exposure therapy and.
Speaker 1: That could work for you, but not for someone else exactly.
Speaker 3: And now I'm doing EMD mark because I definitely prefer
Speaker 3: they're over exposure therapy.
Speaker 4: And yeah, you know, there's so many different things.
Speaker 3: And I think when you do give one thing and
Speaker 3: go and if it doesn't work, you can and get disheartened,
Speaker 3: and it.
Speaker 1: Can be really disheartening.
Speaker 2: Like and throughout the years, I've been on an up
Speaker 2: and down process and like riding the roller coaster, you know,
Speaker 2: where I'll be like, oh, that didn't work, and I'll
Speaker 2: put it away for a bit, and then I'll try
Speaker 2: something else, and then I'll be like, that didn't work.
Speaker 3: I actually remember, and we can cut out if you
Speaker 3: don't want to talk about it, but I remember after
Speaker 3: you had seen a psychologist or a professional that you
Speaker 3: were like, this isn't going to work, and then you
Speaker 3: just didn't see anyone because you were so afraid of
Speaker 3: something had happened, and which we don't have to go into.
Speaker 2: But it's in the book, is it. Yeah, it's not
Speaker 2: it is, Yeah, it's in the book. Yeah, it'd be
Speaker 2: hard for you because you'd be like, did.
Speaker 1: She tell me that?
Speaker 3: I know that's what I'm trying to because I feel
Speaker 3: like we were walking your dogs across again. For some reason,
Speaker 3: I'm such a visual we're walking your dogs across a field.
Speaker 3: We were talking about psychologists and then trying to find
Speaker 3: and being like, Okay, just because this one person didn't work,
Speaker 3: doesn't mean exactly one else won't work exactly.
Speaker 2: And I truly believe that because I read a thing
Speaker 2: where someone mentioned that part of the book where I
Speaker 2: talk about how, you know, I've tried a lot over
Speaker 2: the years, and I've never felt anything that's truly clicked yet.
Speaker 2: But I truly believe it's just a process and a
Speaker 2: journey where you have to find the right person to
Speaker 2: talk to or the right medication. Like there is stuff
Speaker 2: out there that can help everyone. But I just want
Speaker 2: to make people like hear me when I say that,
Speaker 2: I truly believe that even though I may have not
Speaker 2: found the right things right for me, doesn't mean I've
Speaker 2: stopped trying like I will continue to, like, you know,
Speaker 2: figure myself out and try this or do that.
Speaker 1: You know, that's.
Speaker 2: The whole process of life, right is figuring it out.
Speaker 1: That's all. That's what we're all trying to do. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: but yeah, you're right that Yeah.
Speaker 2: So he pretty much caused a panic attack in his
Speaker 2: in what a session I went to. And it was
Speaker 2: from that day where I was just kind of like,
Speaker 2: I'm never going to go back to talk to anyone
Speaker 2: ever again because it was so traumatic for me, which
Speaker 2: thank god I had you because you talked me around
Speaker 2: and was like wow. And so I've since moved on
Speaker 2: from there. I'm like, yeah, of course I want to
Speaker 2: go talk to someone, you know, because it helps.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: It also can be a proactive thing rather than reactive
Speaker 3: as well, which as why I'm such a big advocate
Speaker 3: for therapy and like talking to someone. And obviously there's
Speaker 3: heaps of things around accessibility to that and stuff as well,
Speaker 3: which we one hundred percent acknowledge. But if you do
Speaker 3: have the ability to, it's so important to.
Speaker 1: When is that going to change?
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, bloody change.
Speaker 1: Lucky we've got people like you fighting.
Speaker 3: I also think it's important there's so many people that
Speaker 3: are fighting for it, and I think that well often
Speaker 3: gets lost in the media narrative, especially here in an
Speaker 3: altered or in New Zealand, and especially you know around
Speaker 3: the world as well.
Speaker 4: But here we all we hear about constantly is this
Speaker 4: broken system.
Speaker 3: And we can acknowledge, yes, the system is broken, but
Speaker 3: please don't be discouraged at the thousands upon thousands upon
Speaker 3: thousands of people that are on the front line that
Speaker 3: are doing everything they can to change that care. It's
Speaker 3: not one person trying to save it. It's not like
Speaker 3: that's not the case. There are so many people.
Speaker 1: And your voices are getting louder, which is amazing.
Speaker 4: Oh man.
Speaker 3: But I'm just like all the counselors and you know,
Speaker 3: the nerve everyone who's really doing everything that they can.
Speaker 4: Teachers like taking the brunt of a lot of this
Speaker 4: as well.
Speaker 3: Yeah, people care, and I think that the message of
Speaker 3: you know, about how how broken the system is a
Speaker 3: lot of the time you can it causes so much
Speaker 3: hopelessness that people don't reach out. But I just want
Speaker 3: people to know that, you know, people do really care
Speaker 3: in this so many people.
Speaker 1: There's so many people that care.
Speaker 2: They like so many, and I feel like it's growing,
Speaker 2: like you know, and it's it is getting better.
Speaker 1: It's just a slow process.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I ask this question to everyone that comes on this podcast,
Speaker 3: and I want to ask it to you as well.
Speaker 4: You are the last interview for.
Speaker 3: The season, which I am so frickin honored to be
Speaker 3: able to have you on. And like I said, I
Speaker 3: have wanted to have you on for a while, I
Speaker 3: just never wanted to push you to talk publicly about
Speaker 3: stuff that at that point you weren't talking publicly about it,
Speaker 3: and then.
Speaker 1: You just went.
Speaker 4: It is more than a slow fie.
Speaker 1: You should just put it all out it.
Speaker 3: You have gone through, literally Helen back in your life.
Speaker 3: There's been so much that has happened, and you can
Speaker 3: everyone else can read all about the rest of that
Speaker 3: in your book. Unapologetically me with the uncrossed out. Please
Speaker 3: go get this book. It's literally it's I just it's phenomenal.
Speaker 3: I love it, and it's I mean, I don't want
Speaker 3: to say I love it, but I love the way
Speaker 3: that you've managed to articulate the strength that has shown through.
Speaker 4: All of that.
Speaker 3: Taking all of that in consideration, everything you've written about
Speaker 3: in this book, everything that you've been through. What does
Speaker 3: the word hope mean to you?
Speaker 2: Wow, that's such a good question. I think what does
Speaker 2: the word hope mean for me?
Speaker 1: I think.
Speaker 2: Hope is what everything is centered around. You know, Hope
Speaker 2: for me is the thing that makes me keep going.
Speaker 2: It's the thing that gets me up in the morning,
Speaker 2: that drives, that drives my passion for things. That, yeah,
Speaker 2: makes everything makes sense because without that, you know, I
Speaker 2: feel like nothing else matters.
Speaker 1: Hope is the driver.
Speaker 4: You know that.
Speaker 2: Things can always get better, you can always help other people,
Speaker 2: you can always make your dreams come true.
Speaker 1: That's what hope is. It's at the center of everything
Speaker 1: I love.
Speaker 4: That's that's so good.
Speaker 3: And I also think, like just looking at you and
Speaker 3: knowing everything that you've been through and the.
Speaker 4: Fact that you've shared the story, you are.
Speaker 3: The definition of hope as well, that people can read
Speaker 3: this and they can see, actually, there's hope for me,
Speaker 3: Like there's things I've gone through these you know, whatever
Speaker 3: it may be, the situations may be different, but the
Speaker 3: feelings can be the same. And Yeah, you are hope
Speaker 3: as well. And I know that there are going to
Speaker 3: be so many people that have already been impacted by
Speaker 3: your book and your story and there's going to be
Speaker 3: so many more to come. How can people that are
Speaker 3: listening to this and maybe if especially if you're not
Speaker 3: from New Zealand who might not know you?
Speaker 4: Yeah? How can they? I don't want to say find.
Speaker 3: You because that's talkers done with that, that's becoming illegal
Speaker 3: in New Zealand.
Speaker 4: How can they follow you?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: They can follow me on socials at Bree Thomas l
Speaker 2: with no age.
Speaker 3: You get some great hilarious content. Oh my goodness.
Speaker 2: I do love to post some funny stuff with my mum.
Speaker 2: That's so so funny.
Speaker 3: I love Mama and I but also even hearing this
Speaker 3: story as well, I'm like, we must protect Mama die
Speaker 3: at all costs, at all.
Speaker 2: She is just my favorite human in the whole world. Yeah,
Speaker 2: but yeah, follow me on socials you can. I've recorded
Speaker 2: an audio book if you're not into reading, like I
Speaker 2: can't read that well because my concentration just goes. So
Speaker 2: there's an audiobook. It's on Kindle and yeah, you can
Speaker 2: order it online if you're overseas as well. So I
Speaker 2: just want to say I'm so proud of you, Jazz,
Speaker 2: the person you are and for doing this podcast and
Speaker 2: just everything you do to help other people for me,
Speaker 2: Like I want to add on to my answer, you
Speaker 2: are hope for so many people you know, and I
Speaker 2: don't think you really stop to think about that all
Speaker 2: too often because you're so busy and you're just always
Speaker 2: on the go and thinking about others.
Speaker 1: But you are hope. And I just love you so much,
Speaker 1: and thank you for your time.
Speaker 4: I love you. And now we're going to stop before
Speaker 4: I start crying again.
Speaker 2: I'm a going to hug, so came in a hug
Speaker 2: for ten minutes.
Speaker 3: Well that you have it, guys, thank you so much
Speaker 3: for staying and for listening to this episode. And like
Speaker 3: I've said at the beginning, and I always say, if
Speaker 3: anything in this episode that's been talked about has brought
Speaker 3: anything up for you feel like you need to talk
Speaker 3: to someone, then please remember and know that the bravest
Speaker 3: thing that you can do right now is to talk
Speaker 3: to someone, is to ask for help, whether that's from
Speaker 3: a friend, a family member, or if you don't know
Speaker 3: who to talk to, then if you live in Altaiola
Speaker 3: here you can call or text one seven three seven
Speaker 3: at any time to talk to a trained counselor, or
Speaker 3: if you live overseas. Go to dub dubdub dot the
Speaker 3: Voices of Hope dot org for a list of international helplines.
Speaker 3: Remember that no matter what it is that you're facing,
Speaker 3: no matter what it is that you're going through, that
Speaker 3: in all things, hope is real and change as possible.