1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:02,400 Speaker 1: Politics Wednesday. Mark Mitchell and Ginny Anderson are both well, 2 00:00:02,440 --> 00:00:10,719 Speaker 1: that's good morning lady Mike. Now Mark Mark Mark, Yeah, 3 00:00:11,039 --> 00:00:13,000 Speaker 1: the pain level that you're feeling at the moment, is 4 00:00:13,039 --> 00:00:15,440 Speaker 1: it still there? Because the reported was first of all 5 00:00:16,200 --> 00:00:18,439 Speaker 1: was Andrew Saville. This is Ginny if you don't know this, 6 00:00:18,440 --> 00:00:19,959 Speaker 1: this is the rugby of the weekend. So we're at 7 00:00:20,000 --> 00:00:23,320 Speaker 1: a charity rugby event in Russell. Andrew Savill, the sports 8 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:26,960 Speaker 1: reporters there. Mark's there. The claim from Andrew Saville was 9 00:00:27,040 --> 00:00:30,560 Speaker 1: you made one tackle, put your back out and walked off. 10 00:00:31,280 --> 00:00:35,680 Speaker 2: True, there's half a truth in that. Look, No, it 11 00:00:35,720 --> 00:00:38,400 Speaker 2: wasn't me. He got me mixed up with Jonesy. Jonesy 12 00:00:38,680 --> 00:00:41,400 Speaker 2: went out after the first ruck. But my first teainger 13 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:44,040 Speaker 2: was with Tane Randall. You always come away feeling that, 14 00:00:44,920 --> 00:00:47,000 Speaker 2: But no, I stayed on. I played about probably twenty 15 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:49,240 Speaker 2: twenty five minutes. It was a great game. Huge shout 16 00:00:49,240 --> 00:00:51,280 Speaker 2: out to Ricky Jane from the Juke of my Broman. 17 00:00:51,560 --> 00:00:53,440 Speaker 2: They were the driving force behind this. It was a 18 00:00:53,479 --> 00:00:56,680 Speaker 2: fantastic weekend for Northland and you know we just want 19 00:00:56,680 --> 00:00:57,200 Speaker 2: to do it again. 20 00:00:57,320 --> 00:00:58,240 Speaker 1: Did you pull up all right? 21 00:00:59,760 --> 00:01:01,400 Speaker 2: Yeah? I did? I mean I was told that if 22 00:01:01,440 --> 00:01:04,080 Speaker 2: I played, I wasn't allowed to complain about injuries, right, 23 00:01:04,840 --> 00:01:06,720 Speaker 2: So but yes, no I did. The ribs are a 24 00:01:06,760 --> 00:01:08,200 Speaker 2: little bit, particularly betther than that. 25 00:01:08,280 --> 00:01:09,560 Speaker 1: I'm fine, Well are you fit? 26 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:09,840 Speaker 3: Are you? 27 00:01:10,200 --> 00:01:12,360 Speaker 1: I looked at those people, Let's be honest back, and 28 00:01:12,400 --> 00:01:15,119 Speaker 1: I'm not being sexist about that. There's some pretty fat out. 29 00:01:14,959 --> 00:01:15,680 Speaker 3: Of fit looking at you. 30 00:01:15,840 --> 00:01:18,160 Speaker 1: I mean, honestly, there were some people there that shouldn't 31 00:01:18,160 --> 00:01:21,759 Speaker 1: be doing physical exercise and at a certain age. 32 00:01:21,800 --> 00:01:24,199 Speaker 2: Isn't it like you can include me in that break? 33 00:01:24,280 --> 00:01:27,240 Speaker 2: Don't worry about that. I know that I've a fitness 34 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:29,560 Speaker 2: but look, it was it was actually a really good game. 35 00:01:29,600 --> 00:01:31,480 Speaker 2: We had quite a few weeks all picks in there, 36 00:01:32,800 --> 00:01:35,240 Speaker 2: and the crowd seemed to really enjoy it, and of 37 00:01:35,280 --> 00:01:37,560 Speaker 2: course the hometown heroes had a good one, so that 38 00:01:37,680 --> 00:01:38,039 Speaker 2: was great. 39 00:01:38,280 --> 00:01:41,160 Speaker 1: Okay, cool, Now serious matters cost her. He's on his 40 00:01:41,240 --> 00:01:42,679 Speaker 1: way out. Did you get rid of them at last? 41 00:01:42,760 --> 00:01:47,360 Speaker 2: Or not? No? No, I just think that he's He 42 00:01:47,440 --> 00:01:49,840 Speaker 2: and I had a conversation that will remain confidential and 43 00:01:50,840 --> 00:01:53,000 Speaker 2: out of respect for him, but he's clearly come out 44 00:01:53,000 --> 00:01:56,280 Speaker 2: and indicated that he won't be sending seeking an extension 45 00:01:56,280 --> 00:01:58,600 Speaker 2: on his term, which finishes in April next year. 46 00:01:58,720 --> 00:01:59,800 Speaker 1: Fair enough, Ginny or not? 47 00:02:01,480 --> 00:02:02,480 Speaker 3: Sorry I couldn't catch your back. 48 00:02:02,680 --> 00:02:05,800 Speaker 1: Fair enough or not that cost is going well. 49 00:02:05,840 --> 00:02:08,000 Speaker 3: I don't think they made a good match. They have 50 00:02:08,120 --> 00:02:13,000 Speaker 3: different different perspectives on how to resolve Lauren or in 51 00:02:13,040 --> 00:02:15,960 Speaker 3: New Zealand. I think they work together as best they could, 52 00:02:16,080 --> 00:02:19,200 Speaker 3: but fundamentally they come from quite different points of view 53 00:02:19,320 --> 00:02:20,800 Speaker 3: and so I think it was always going to be 54 00:02:20,840 --> 00:02:21,560 Speaker 3: a tough match. 55 00:02:21,840 --> 00:02:23,920 Speaker 1: Would you still defend him as a police commissioner? I 56 00:02:23,919 --> 00:02:26,200 Speaker 1: mean it wasn't your appointment. It was a dourn slash nash. 57 00:02:26,320 --> 00:02:28,240 Speaker 1: You came in afterwards, But did you see at the 58 00:02:28,240 --> 00:02:29,840 Speaker 1: time as a solid appointment or not. 59 00:02:30,840 --> 00:02:32,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, he's a smart guy and he had the best 60 00:02:32,760 --> 00:02:36,040 Speaker 3: interests of New Zealand at heart, and things like Refrain 61 00:02:36,120 --> 00:02:38,200 Speaker 3: that he wanted to see in place would have set 62 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:40,520 Speaker 3: the police up for another ten years. For shame that 63 00:02:40,560 --> 00:02:42,400 Speaker 3: he wasn't able to achieve that right. 64 00:02:42,840 --> 00:02:44,960 Speaker 1: Talk to me, try and keep this as a political 65 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:48,160 Speaker 1: as possible. And this is health and this is the 66 00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:50,320 Speaker 1: layers in management and all the problems in health at 67 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:53,360 Speaker 1: the moment. But what Luxon said on Monday about not 68 00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:57,840 Speaker 1: having an understanding or getting an understanding of numbers, expenditure, 69 00:02:58,320 --> 00:03:01,520 Speaker 1: line of sight on an astonishing amount of money. Can 70 00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:04,320 Speaker 1: you understand that or explain how the public service gets 71 00:03:04,360 --> 00:03:06,760 Speaker 1: that jerry manned backward and hopeless? 72 00:03:11,760 --> 00:03:16,840 Speaker 3: First look, I think they've had to come cling that. 73 00:03:16,840 --> 00:03:19,120 Speaker 3: That's what they've said is not true. There's not fourteen 74 00:03:19,200 --> 00:03:20,959 Speaker 3: layers they're including. 75 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:24,680 Speaker 1: Uh, forget to fourteen, twelve, eleven or whatever. It is 76 00:03:24,919 --> 00:03:28,320 Speaker 1: the fact that it's a mess. It's an indisputable mess. 77 00:03:28,360 --> 00:03:30,280 Speaker 1: How does it become a mess like that? 78 00:03:30,800 --> 00:03:35,760 Speaker 3: Well, you had multiple different dhvs across New Zealand that 79 00:03:35,880 --> 00:03:38,240 Speaker 3: really were a mess. You had different standards of healthcare 80 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:40,800 Speaker 3: and different parts of New Zealand because you had a 81 00:03:40,840 --> 00:03:43,560 Speaker 3: regionally based system, and to bring it under one and 82 00:03:43,600 --> 00:03:46,480 Speaker 3: try and have consistency so no matter where someone gets 83 00:03:46,520 --> 00:03:49,360 Speaker 3: cancer they get the same level of treatment. That has 84 00:03:49,440 --> 00:03:53,480 Speaker 3: to be brought together. And that's what the reforms that 85 00:03:53,480 --> 00:03:55,680 Speaker 3: that we did that were Underwagh and in place. And 86 00:03:55,720 --> 00:03:57,600 Speaker 3: it's a real shame that some of that work is 87 00:03:57,640 --> 00:04:01,120 Speaker 3: being unpicked and the problem is they haven't funded it. 88 00:04:01,440 --> 00:04:03,480 Speaker 3: If you want to talk about what's what's a mess? 89 00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:07,360 Speaker 3: A meiss is putting a hiring freeze on doctors and 90 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:09,520 Speaker 3: they're not being enough doctors in New Zealand. 91 00:04:09,600 --> 00:04:13,840 Speaker 1: That's thirty billion dollars. How much more do you want? 92 00:04:15,800 --> 00:04:19,200 Speaker 3: We have had record numbers of immigration and most people 93 00:04:19,200 --> 00:04:22,120 Speaker 3: have come into New Zealand and New Zealand's history over 94 00:04:22,160 --> 00:04:25,640 Speaker 3: the last year, and we are trying to provide services 95 00:04:25,640 --> 00:04:29,680 Speaker 3: to more people with the same amount of funding when 96 00:04:29,760 --> 00:04:32,880 Speaker 3: they're coming in. And this is what's putting massive pressure 97 00:04:32,920 --> 00:04:35,800 Speaker 3: on our health system. It was just coming to terms 98 00:04:36,000 --> 00:04:38,720 Speaker 3: worth getting through a global pandemic and then we've got 99 00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:42,640 Speaker 3: slammed with additional people who require services and so how 100 00:04:42,680 --> 00:04:45,719 Speaker 3: you do that is a difficult solution. But cutting the 101 00:04:45,720 --> 00:04:46,919 Speaker 3: budget is not the answer. 102 00:04:47,120 --> 00:04:48,359 Speaker 1: Mark your side of the health story. 103 00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:51,360 Speaker 2: So I just think that Labor created a bohemoth. I 104 00:04:51,400 --> 00:04:55,240 Speaker 2: think labor's good at creating bureaucracy. There's massive layers of 105 00:04:55,279 --> 00:04:58,760 Speaker 2: management and their nationals comes in and has to recalibrate 106 00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:01,039 Speaker 2: and get services and the best backing up to the 107 00:05:01,040 --> 00:05:02,960 Speaker 2: front lines. Lab they don't know how to deliver the 108 00:05:02,960 --> 00:05:06,520 Speaker 2: services to people. When you look at the caucus, they 109 00:05:06,520 --> 00:05:08,960 Speaker 2: don't have anyone you've actually had to do that real off, 110 00:05:09,560 --> 00:05:12,000 Speaker 2: so you know this is and now we're having to 111 00:05:12,080 --> 00:05:14,480 Speaker 2: unrevel it all and it's difficult, and right, we're just 112 00:05:14,520 --> 00:05:15,240 Speaker 2: getting on with it. 113 00:05:15,600 --> 00:05:17,680 Speaker 1: Jinny, Listen to this. This is lux and working you 114 00:05:17,720 --> 00:05:20,880 Speaker 1: through the fourteen layers. Listen that a patient it interacts 115 00:05:20,920 --> 00:05:23,839 Speaker 1: with a team member. A team member reports the team supervisor, 116 00:05:23,839 --> 00:05:25,120 Speaker 1: who reports the team leader. 117 00:05:25,440 --> 00:05:28,039 Speaker 4: The team leader reports to the assistant manager. The assistant 118 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:30,520 Speaker 4: manager reports to the manager, who reports the service manager, 119 00:05:30,760 --> 00:05:33,359 Speaker 4: who then reports to the general manager. The general manager 120 00:05:33,440 --> 00:05:35,000 Speaker 4: might be asking who do they report to? Will they 121 00:05:35,000 --> 00:05:37,480 Speaker 4: report to the group director of operations, and of course 122 00:05:37,480 --> 00:05:40,480 Speaker 4: they report to the regional director, the national director, eventually 123 00:05:40,480 --> 00:05:42,680 Speaker 4: the chief of staff, then the chief executive, and of 124 00:05:42,680 --> 00:05:44,200 Speaker 4: course they report to the chair on the board. 125 00:05:44,400 --> 00:05:45,159 Speaker 1: Can you defend that? 126 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:48,039 Speaker 3: I can certain that they should have funded it in 127 00:05:48,080 --> 00:05:49,840 Speaker 3: March when the knew it ran out of money, and 128 00:05:49,880 --> 00:05:51,919 Speaker 3: that would be a better thing than giving technicap to 129 00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:52,800 Speaker 3: the tobacco lobby. 130 00:05:53,000 --> 00:05:56,880 Speaker 1: So you so you're still arguing that more money is required, 131 00:05:57,040 --> 00:05:59,839 Speaker 1: even when you've got that line that lineup. 132 00:06:00,839 --> 00:06:02,320 Speaker 3: I think you need to look at how the health 133 00:06:02,360 --> 00:06:04,120 Speaker 3: system works. And if you're going to do it in 134 00:06:04,120 --> 00:06:06,760 Speaker 3: one minute and question time, then it's a joke. So 135 00:06:06,880 --> 00:06:10,320 Speaker 3: there's complexities. But the point is that there's no doctors 136 00:06:10,320 --> 00:06:12,440 Speaker 3: in the Hut Valley because of the cuts, and we 137 00:06:12,520 --> 00:06:15,120 Speaker 3: have people queuing up for a Tali health session who 138 00:06:15,160 --> 00:06:16,080 Speaker 3: need medical attention. 139 00:06:16,440 --> 00:06:16,920 Speaker 2: You can last. 140 00:06:19,920 --> 00:06:22,480 Speaker 1: Isn't the answer to that, though, Ginny. Fewer managers and 141 00:06:22,560 --> 00:06:24,640 Speaker 1: more actual doctors and Nurse's. 142 00:06:24,400 --> 00:06:28,119 Speaker 3: Right, Let's let's see how they do with that, because 143 00:06:28,200 --> 00:06:31,039 Speaker 3: with less money and trying to cut services, it's the 144 00:06:31,120 --> 00:06:34,039 Speaker 3: front line because you need people in place to be 145 00:06:34,080 --> 00:06:37,400 Speaker 3: able to put that support and if you want doctors operating, 146 00:06:37,480 --> 00:06:40,039 Speaker 3: and you're going to cut all that away and cutting 147 00:06:40,400 --> 00:06:43,760 Speaker 3: up to two thousand jobs already in health, Let's see 148 00:06:43,760 --> 00:06:48,200 Speaker 3: how they go, because I have that the frontline is 149 00:06:48,240 --> 00:06:49,520 Speaker 3: not going to be done. But he used to run 150 00:06:49,520 --> 00:06:51,880 Speaker 3: an airline. I'm sure you're doing a great job of 151 00:06:52,000 --> 00:06:53,520 Speaker 3: reforming at health. 152 00:06:54,320 --> 00:06:56,440 Speaker 2: That's right, that's right. He has running the line and 153 00:06:56,480 --> 00:06:57,720 Speaker 2: he understandings. 154 00:06:57,520 --> 00:06:59,839 Speaker 3: Into the ground three times for a wail out. 155 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:03,159 Speaker 2: And he understands the responsibility customers that actually had to deliver, 156 00:07:03,480 --> 00:07:06,440 Speaker 2: and he just laid out and articulated very well. Layers 157 00:07:06,440 --> 00:07:09,360 Speaker 2: and layers and layers of managers. We'd rather have doctors 158 00:07:09,400 --> 00:07:10,400 Speaker 2: and nurses on the front. 159 00:07:10,240 --> 00:07:12,000 Speaker 3: Lne look to get them back go and get the 160 00:07:12,040 --> 00:07:13,000 Speaker 3: doctors there because. 161 00:07:12,840 --> 00:07:15,160 Speaker 2: They're allways well well and you want to vest more 162 00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:18,320 Speaker 2: money into more managers, which is exactly Labour's approach was 163 00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:21,480 Speaker 2: exactly why we find ourselves in the current position that 164 00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:22,200 Speaker 2: we do as a country. 165 00:07:22,320 --> 00:07:25,080 Speaker 1: Quick comment mark on emergency response. I'm reading a report 166 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:27,120 Speaker 1: yesterday and I can't, for the life of me remember 167 00:07:27,160 --> 00:07:30,320 Speaker 1: what it was called. But back when late twenty fourteen 168 00:07:30,360 --> 00:07:32,960 Speaker 1: they were going to have some sort of group Victoria 169 00:07:33,040 --> 00:07:36,000 Speaker 1: and Australia's got it, they never got around to it. 170 00:07:36,440 --> 00:07:39,640 Speaker 1: Local agencies didn't want to share information. The upshot is 171 00:07:39,720 --> 00:07:42,120 Speaker 1: that they are claiming in Hawks Bay that I Gabriel 172 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:44,640 Speaker 1: happened again, there would be no difference in response because 173 00:07:44,760 --> 00:07:48,400 Speaker 1: basically emergency response can't get their act together. Is that true? 174 00:07:49,200 --> 00:07:50,880 Speaker 2: No, I don't agree with it. Since I've been in 175 00:07:50,960 --> 00:07:54,000 Speaker 2: Ministers in the last seven months, I've had four local 176 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:57,680 Speaker 2: states of emergency. We've had we've had floods, we've had fires, 177 00:07:57,720 --> 00:08:00,920 Speaker 2: we've had earthquakes, we've had space whether, we've had CrowdStrike 178 00:08:01,000 --> 00:08:04,040 Speaker 2: and no one's waiting. I received a report from Siderior 179 00:08:04,080 --> 00:08:05,640 Speaker 2: Matter Prie in terms of the work that we need 180 00:08:05,680 --> 00:08:08,000 Speaker 2: to do to make our system more resilient, but no 181 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:10,720 Speaker 2: one's waiting for that. And I've been on the ground 182 00:08:10,760 --> 00:08:13,480 Speaker 2: at every single one of those and the response has 183 00:08:13,480 --> 00:08:17,080 Speaker 2: been outstanding. So no, we've got amazing people that do 184 00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:19,760 Speaker 2: this work. We need to get the legislation done and 185 00:08:19,800 --> 00:08:23,160 Speaker 2: that will codefine support the entire ecosystem in terms of 186 00:08:23,160 --> 00:08:26,320 Speaker 2: how we respond. But there's been really good progress made 187 00:08:26,360 --> 00:08:29,280 Speaker 2: over the last seven months, certainly, you know. That's what 188 00:08:29,320 --> 00:08:32,839 Speaker 2: I'm sing seen right from the mayors and the chief 189 00:08:32,840 --> 00:08:37,000 Speaker 2: executives right through the whole emergency management sort of sector. 190 00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:39,360 Speaker 2: Everyone is working really well together, all right. 191 00:08:39,360 --> 00:08:42,160 Speaker 1: I'm encouraging to hear make appreciate time, Jinny Anders, appreciate 192 00:08:42,200 --> 00:08:43,880 Speaker 1: yours as well. Politics Wednesday. 193 00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:47,199 Speaker 2: For more from the Mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to 194 00:08:47,360 --> 00:08:50,440 Speaker 2: news talks there'd be from six am weekdays, or follow 195 00:08:50,440 --> 00:08:51,959 Speaker 2: the podcast on iHeartRadio.