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Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from News Talk set B.

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Speaker 1: Follow this and our wide range of podcasts now on

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Speaker 1: iHeart Radio.

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Speaker 2: Take another.

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Speaker 3: Trick. It is out, the test is over.

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Speaker 1: Couldn't smoke?

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Speaker 3: Wows a beauty? It is out and here he goes.

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Speaker 3: This delivery has.

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Speaker 2: In the users to goold.

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Speaker 1: On the front foot with Brian Waddell and Jeremy Cody,

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Speaker 1: powered by News Talks sad B at iHeart Radio.

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Speaker 3: Hello, We're back on the front foot and a top

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Speaker 3: order batting lesson for the New Zealand eighteen and they're

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Speaker 3: epening two matches of the One Day Series in Bangladesh.

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Speaker 3: Top start. What should we expect from this tour? England

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Speaker 3: will trial some new players for the one off Test

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Speaker 3: match with Zimbabwe and Wisdom delivers a telling view of

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Speaker 3: the past year. All that coming up will be joined

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Speaker 3: by Wisdom editor Lawrence Boo a little later on on

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Speaker 3: the front foot, but we are joined as always by

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Speaker 3: Jeremy Katie, who like me, is having a little look

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Speaker 3: at the New Zealand as it's nice to be able

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Speaker 3: to pick it up on the internet. Tough start, They've

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Speaker 3: got a few lessons to learn, but that's the whole

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Speaker 3: point of being in Bangladesh, isn't it learning those lessons?

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Speaker 4: Yeah?

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Speaker 5: They I look, they didn't have a lot of time

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Speaker 5: to get used to some of the things that I

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Speaker 5: think you have to when you go to a place

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Speaker 5: like Bangladesh, heat and pictures and so on. So it

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Speaker 5: wasn't easy easy going at a to play, of course,

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Speaker 5: and then be to watch. I mean, the batting in

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Speaker 5: both games really wasn't what you need to win that

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Speaker 5: level of game. They're playing against a Bangladesh side which

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Speaker 5: most of them have played international cricket before, and certainly

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Speaker 5: in test matches, but you know, in one or other

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Speaker 5: of the other fourmats as well. I thought last night

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Speaker 5: there was only oh, dear, perhaps Rajah was the only

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Speaker 5: one in that side that hadn't played international cricket for Bangladesh.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, and.

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Speaker 5: Then just inconsistencies and learning about and let's hope that's

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Speaker 5: what's happening for the players, learning about how to play

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Speaker 5: in those conditions. So yeah, look, let's wait and see,

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Speaker 5: let's hope we see some improvement throughout the tour.

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Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, there's some good players there and more reflect

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Speaker 3: on that when the tour comes to an end, they've

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Speaker 3: got the three one days, the two of them have

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Speaker 3: been completed so far, and then there's a two four

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Speaker 3: day games, so we will look more closely at that

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Speaker 3: when it is completed. It's an important experience though for

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Speaker 3: a players. Two overseas tours in the off season this

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Speaker 3: way to Bangladesh and then South Africa in June or July.

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Speaker 3: It's rare for the A's to have two overseas tours offseason.

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Speaker 3: High performance coach with the side, Paul Wiseman told us

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Speaker 3: before they left. He realizes how important these tours are

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Speaker 3: for the future development of the players.

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Speaker 2: The goal is to be able to to be able

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Speaker 2: to get to a tours were their home or away

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Speaker 2: in a calendar year. So we had a Nassy tour

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Speaker 2: not long ago in India just before that. Obviously Bangladesh

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Speaker 2: was supposed to be last year as well, but for

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Speaker 2: security reasons that was called we'll postponed until now. So yeah,

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Speaker 2: we got two now and we're looking to have two

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Speaker 2: each year, one preferably in a subcontinent environment. Obviously we

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Speaker 2: have to receive teams back as well, so it may

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Speaker 2: be that there we have an A series at the

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Speaker 2: start or the end of a domestic season back here

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Speaker 2: and then we also try and get over to Australia.

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Speaker 2: I need to get over to Australia as much as

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Speaker 2: we can because you know, the subcontinent was one of

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Speaker 2: the last frontiers and obviously the black Caps clopped that

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Speaker 2: in the way last year were those three Test victories,

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Speaker 2: and obviously we would love to get a similar sort

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Speaker 2: of thing in Australia. So they hasn't even a chieaved before.

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Speaker 2: So by getting these guys over there as well, you

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Speaker 2: know that just when their time comes with the black Caps,

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Speaker 2: they've had those experiences.

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Speaker 3: Yes, well, you can recall the Australian tour last year

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Speaker 3: when New Zealand performed outstandingly, particularly in the first class games,

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Speaker 3: and you've got the same on this occasion. And this

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Speaker 3: is a This is a real challenge for these players,

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Speaker 3: isn't it. Because they've proven themselves domestically here another step

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Speaker 3: up for many of them.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure. These tours for me, they're really exciting

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Speaker 2: ones because not every run on every tour, not even

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Speaker 2: run succeeds or for forms to the standard they want to,

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Speaker 2: but a guarantee by the end of the tour, everyone

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Speaker 2: that's been on that tour, come back a better player,

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Speaker 2: and the experiences that they gain on a tool like

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Speaker 2: this will hold them in great stead for future subcontinent

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Speaker 2: tours with either as or or a little bit of like

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Speaker 2: black Caps. A number of these guys have been to

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Speaker 2: the subcontinent, not too many to Banglades, so just a

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Speaker 2: hell of an experience for them.

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Speaker 3: How important is that specific experience of going to Bangladesh

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Speaker 3: and say rather going to Australia or England or something

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Speaker 3: like that. Is it an extra special, extra challenging to it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's for a number of reasons. It's the conditions

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Speaker 2: are just so foreign to us in New Zealand. For start,

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Speaker 2: the weather, you know, it's obviously it's a hell of

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Speaker 2: a lot harder. It's going to be early mid thirties

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Speaker 2: plus high humidity. It's coming into mon Sceon season. So

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Speaker 2: we've got fingers crossed that that holds off and lets

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Speaker 2: us get on with the tour. So they're going to

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Speaker 2: have to deal with heat, with humidity, and then with

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Speaker 2: very different pictures that we produce here. We kind of

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Speaker 2: simulate a little bit in our marquees. In a couple

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Speaker 2: of games last year we played on pictures that have

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Speaker 2: been used and or been scarified and things like that.

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Speaker 2: But this is this is entirely, entirely new. Obviously, there's

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Speaker 2: different foods, you know, there's different protocols around what you

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Speaker 2: can and can't eat and drink, and and obviously then touring,

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Speaker 2: getting getting to and from the grounds will be heavy

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Speaker 2: security and buses and you know, not being able to

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Speaker 2: go out of hotels and all those sorts of things,

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Speaker 2: having to entertain yourselves. And I think tours like that

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Speaker 2: also bring teams closer together because you're not no one's

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Speaker 2: really scattering off into different places looking at different tourists

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Speaker 2: attractions or mauls or whatever it is. You're going to

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Speaker 2: have to stay close and the type groups. So that's

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Speaker 2: why they tours are usually pretty special.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well that's always been the case for sides going overseas,

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Speaker 3: even top level sides, isn't it in terms of the

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Speaker 3: development and being able to assimilate into the local culture.

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Speaker 3: I look at the side that is going and you know,

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Speaker 3: it must have been a hard side to pick because

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Speaker 3: there are players that we could all put forward who

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Speaker 3: would have had an opportunity. And to finish up with

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Speaker 3: the fifteen, you've got well performed players, a lot of

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Speaker 3: experience there and you know a real opportunity for these

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Speaker 3: guys to show what they're worth.

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Speaker 4: At the top level.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Look, I think the A tours Ondes are the hardest

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Speaker 2: ones to pick out of all because you're not just

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Speaker 2: picking on if you're picking a Black Ops team, primarily

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Speaker 2: nine times out of ten, you're picking a team that

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Speaker 2: you think is going to going to perform the best

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Speaker 2: and get the results that you want. With an A team,

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Speaker 2: there's a real balancing act. There's so many good players

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Speaker 2: that aren't on the side that you can easily make

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Speaker 2: it caseful. And there was a lot of debate around

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Speaker 2: that We've gone for a team that has youth in it,

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Speaker 2: but it's also got some experience which we think will

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Speaker 2: be valuable on that and that experience we believe has

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Speaker 2: still got the capability of playing Black Caps and for

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Speaker 2: a number of years. Players these days are going on,

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Speaker 2: they're a lot fitter, nutrition andcency and all that sort

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Speaker 2: of things, and obviously a drive too. You know, you

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Speaker 2: can earn good money, so players attending to play look

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Speaker 2: after themselves better and play for longer. So you know,

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Speaker 2: you might be thirty one thirty two, but you could

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Speaker 2: have another six years playing international level and you can

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Speaker 2: pay a lot of cricket in that time. So we

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Speaker 2: wanted to reflect obviously performance and domestic cricket and also

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Speaker 2: look at and eye to the future of what we

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Speaker 2: think is our best talent coming through. So it's a

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Speaker 2: real combination of those two things.

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Speaker 3: Of the areas of your expertise. Been bowling has always

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Speaker 3: been a challenge for New Zealand side. Addie Ashop is

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Speaker 3: there and Jadon Lennox. What other spinners have you got

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Speaker 3: within that side because they're relatively inexperienced those two, aren't they?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they are. Look and he's been on a on

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Speaker 2: an nineteen tours is South Africa and he's also played

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Speaker 2: played a couple of games for the black Caps, which

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Speaker 2: is which is awesome. He's obviously hit a couple of

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Speaker 2: a season of injury and or a year off basically

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Speaker 2: was back injury and he's he's his way back in

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Speaker 2: this year. But a real talent. Jaden Lennox has just

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Speaker 2: been one of these great stories. He's sort of battling

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Speaker 2: away in Clavin and Hawke Cup cricket and probably a

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Speaker 2: little bit overweight if you ask them. He went away

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Speaker 2: and got super fit. He's one of the fittest guys

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Speaker 2: on that side. Now he's an absolute enough of your

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Speaker 2: you know, he's a real student of the game. He

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Speaker 2: studies opposition like no one else. He's very very accurate spinner.

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Speaker 2: He's tall left armor and we think that's the sort

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Speaker 2: of spinner that does well in the subcontinent. You don't

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Speaker 2: have to turn in a lot, you've just got a

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Speaker 2: half a bat with accuracy and change the pace and

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Speaker 2: what we think will he will do well over there

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Speaker 2: and has a big future. And then Dean fox Crofts

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Speaker 2: come in. He's sady unfortunately has has an injury which

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Speaker 2: has precluded him from going on this tour. So Dean

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Speaker 2: Foxcroft off spinner from Otaga, has been given him opportunities

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Speaker 2: and all around her which will give us some real

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Speaker 2: depth in our batting. But he's your sort of more

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Speaker 2: traditional up and over type off spinner, so it'll be

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Speaker 2: good to see how he fares over there. And then

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Speaker 2: we've got a couple of guys that are pushing to

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Speaker 2: become more than part time spinners, the Lakes of the

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Speaker 2: Dale Phillips Bowlzes Off. He's a bit like his brother

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Speaker 2: and he's come a long way and a period of time.

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Speaker 2: And Matt Boyle, who bowls sort of quicker leg spinners,

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Speaker 2: who I think more in the white ball game at

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Speaker 2: the moment, but it is developing really nicely and could

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Speaker 2: be could be a real string to his bow. Going

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Speaker 2: for going forward, you talked.

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Speaker 3: About the excitement of these tours and the development of players.

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Speaker 3: It's important for you and the coaching team as well,

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Speaker 3: isn't it. Because New Zealand Cricket are talking about coaching

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Speaker 3: opportunities and this involvement perhaps with the MLC in the

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Speaker 3: United States. You play an important part in these because

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Speaker 3: you have to make sure that these players take their

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Speaker 3: opportunities when they get them.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. Look, it's an amazing opportunity for these guys

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Speaker 2: firstly to be able to well not firstly one, to

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Speaker 2: be able to impress and to be able to impress

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Speaker 2: up to the Black Caps with franchise cricket, you know,

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Speaker 2: sort of growing and growing and obviously now we have

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Speaker 2: a vested interested in franchise cricket with the recent outpose

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Speaker 2: investment into the MLC. A lot of these players are

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Speaker 2: not always available for the black Caps, and I think

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Speaker 2: It's whilst in a perfect world would love to see

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Speaker 2: that not happening as much well I would anyway, what

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Speaker 2: it has done is it's created It's created opportunity in

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Speaker 2: space where players like your Marius and your basses and

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Speaker 2: your kellies and so forth. It just recently had opportunities

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Speaker 2: that they may not have had if those IPL players

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Speaker 2: weren't away. So it's almost like we've got an a

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Speaker 2: orter bangle of this. We've got an A order to

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Speaker 2: South Africa later in the year, but I've also had

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Speaker 2: an A plus experience for those guys that have had

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Speaker 2: those chances to play Pakistan recently and also last year

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Speaker 2: against Pakistan, and I think the previous year against Bangladesh

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Speaker 2: where that same window of IPL happened and the number

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Speaker 2: of our players get give an upgraded experience. So but

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Speaker 2: I've got this opportunity. There's going to be opportunities coming

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Speaker 2: up in the future, you know, the tour of Zimbabwe

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Speaker 2: with tests who knows to who's going to be available

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Speaker 2: for that, and some T twenty opportunities. So guys that

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Speaker 2: take their chances here obviously putting their putting their hands up,

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Speaker 2: which is brilliant, but the main goal of any of

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Speaker 2: these tours is to develop players. We can't there's not

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Speaker 2: always that space that I've just spoken about. When you

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Speaker 2: get the full black Caps quota back and playing in

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Speaker 2: our full strength, then those opportunities aren't available. So we've

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Speaker 2: just got to keep developing these players, growing them so

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Speaker 2: that when they do get their chance, when.

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Speaker 5: Players do.

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Speaker 2: Are away or do retire or whatever, they get their chance,

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Speaker 2: they're ready. And I think that's been a real strength

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Speaker 2: music and cricket over the last eight years or so

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Speaker 2: is that most players when they've come and to the

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Speaker 2: Black Cats for the first time, performed straight away and

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Speaker 2: have performed consistently after that, which hasn't always been the case.

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Speaker 2: So so tours like this are just, you know, they're

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Speaker 2: exactly what we need. And we can't compete with the

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Speaker 2: likes of England and Australia and India that have huge

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Speaker 2: A programs Financially, We just we just can't do it.

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Speaker 2: So I'm really really going to make the most of

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Speaker 2: every chance we do get.

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Speaker 3: Interesting to hear from Wiseman and we'll reflect with him

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Speaker 3: after the two but he makes some pretty important points

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Speaker 3: that you know, have to be covered by the side

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Speaker 3: in terms of learning and developing for the future.

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Speaker 5: He does what you can't disagree with a lot of

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Speaker 5: what he says. The only thing that I do think

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Speaker 5: is that for the A side or a development side,

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Speaker 5: this is a bit of boat, isn't it. This team? Yeah,

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Speaker 5: some times there's this kind of a line of thinking

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Speaker 5: that goes, look, let's have some experience in the team

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Speaker 5: and let's have some newcomers as well, or people with

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Speaker 5: a parent potential and we'll assess them while they're there,

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Speaker 5: you know. And I think that's what they do with

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Speaker 5: the coaching as well, that there's a developmental component not

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Speaker 5: just for the players who are going there, but also

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Speaker 5: for the coaches that are going there. And if you

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Speaker 5: look at those coaches, Bob Carter, who's not that he's

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Speaker 5: not developmental. He's been around the New Zealand cricket for

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Speaker 5: a very long time now. He was at Northampton, he

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Speaker 5: was at Canterbury, is at Wellington, he was at the

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Speaker 5: women's side, he was at World Cups and you'd have

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Speaker 5: to say with mixed success in terms of results. The

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Speaker 5: Paul Wiseman, we've just been speaking to a spin coach

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Speaker 5: and a talent id man works with underage sides, and

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Speaker 5: then there's the new coach, the devel mental part.

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Speaker 2: If you like.

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Speaker 5: Ben mccaord from tim Ru. He played five matches for

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Speaker 5: Canterbury Medium Fast. He was the main coach at Saint

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Speaker 5: Bede's College in Christich. He was with the Canterbury under

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Speaker 5: seventeen and nineteen and he's now been appointed with the

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Speaker 5: Vaults down in Otago as their assistant coach as well.

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Speaker 5: He's a bowling coach, so he's that component this time.

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Speaker 5: And my question would be who's handling the batting? We

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Speaker 5: know to spind coach, we know there's a bowling coach

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Speaker 5: with Ben mccaud who's handling the batting? I guess you'd

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Speaker 5: have to say Bob Carter in that way, or who's

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Speaker 5: or someone else? You know, Game one didn't go so

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Speaker 5: quite so well with the batting and they were chasing

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Speaker 5: a big total in game two. You know, should an

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Speaker 5: a or development side? Should we take our most experienced

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Speaker 5: coaches wads because our high quality coaches, you know, because

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Speaker 5: they're the most important play aren't they for the future

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Speaker 5: likely to need when you go to a place like

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Speaker 5: Bangladesh technical and tactical guidance. I would suspect many of

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Speaker 5: the players, for example, wouldn't see in our team the

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Speaker 5: ball turning in the air as it comes down to them,

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Speaker 5: because in New Zealand our pitchers don't turn too much,

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Speaker 5: and so you don't need to watch the ball closely

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Speaker 5: enough to see which way it's turning, and you don't

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Speaker 5: pick up the length quite so much. Should you play forward?

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Speaker 5: Should you play back? A lot of the guys I

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Speaker 5: watched to play in a bit of a mix between

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Speaker 5: going forward and back, particularly in the second innings where

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Speaker 5: the ball's keeping a bit lower and a lot got bold,

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Speaker 5: didn't they a lot were hurried and it's skiddered through

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Speaker 5: inside edge and so on. So those are things, you know,

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Speaker 5: I think that they need to be coached and if

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Speaker 5: they can come back even knowing something about that, if

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Speaker 5: in doubt push out. Remember those famous old maxims. You know,

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Speaker 5: if you don't get a man in close on the

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Speaker 5: batpad or pad bat in a one day game, so

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Speaker 5: you're not going to be worried about that. So I

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Speaker 5: just think there are things they can learn. They're a

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Speaker 5: bit inconsistent changes of pace for the bowlers and a

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Speaker 5: range of athleticism. I think I saw so things to

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Speaker 5: be learned, and that's what you would expect.

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Speaker 1: To see Brian Waddell, Jeremy Cooney on the front foot.

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Speaker 3: England are making some changes to their Test match side.

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Speaker 3: They're going to bring in a fellow from Essex called

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Speaker 3: Sam Cook, whose name I'd never heard of, but he's

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Speaker 3: been pretty successful. He's twenty seven years of age and

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Speaker 3: he's in the squad for the Test against Zimbabwe being

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Speaker 3: played at trent Bridge. They've got the likes of Chris Wolkes,

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Speaker 3: Mark Wood, Brydon cass Olie Stone all absence Joffra Archer

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Speaker 3: is playing in the IPL, so it's a chance to

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Speaker 3: just have a look at the depth of their side.

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Speaker 3: And you know, England have got a lot of Test

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Speaker 3: match cricket coming up over the next twelve to eighty months.

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Speaker 3: They've got an access series coming and there's plenty for

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Speaker 3: them to prepare for, so they get a chance to

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Speaker 3: look at other players at trent Bridge.

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Speaker 5: Jerry, they do a predictable side, as you say, other

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Speaker 5: than the name Sam Cook, he's a right arm medium

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Speaker 5: fast wadds Essex. Exceptional figures over a period of time

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Speaker 5: since he's played there. You know, he's probably four or

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Speaker 5: five runs better than the nearest in terms of average

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Speaker 5: taking wickets. He takes a wicket about every seven or

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Speaker 5: eight overs. He's a guy that knows what he's doing.

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Speaker 5: But the main point about his selection to me is

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Speaker 5: that it runs against the mantra that this selection panel

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Speaker 5: have been using pace pace, you know, eighty five plus.

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Speaker 5: But we've heard time and time again and I'm not

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Speaker 5: sure whether there we're any other eighty five plus pace

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Speaker 5: candidates for this team or is it actually a little

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Speaker 5: bit more of a softening, a flexibility and approach from

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Speaker 5: mcculor metal and just recognizing this player's new ball skills.

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Speaker 5: He's steady and reliable and he's slightly metronomic. So it's

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Speaker 5: but for me it's a difference if I was a captain,

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Speaker 5: it's a difference. They're not all eighty five plus. He's

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Speaker 5: got some point of difference about him because he hasn't

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Speaker 5: quite got the pace, So I think that's a handy

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Speaker 5: thing to have. Josh Tungu is there as well. He's

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Speaker 5: played for England. He's had a good start to the season,

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Speaker 5: probably the quickest in county cricket at the moment. Atkinson.

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Speaker 5: We know we've had a good year. They've picked four seamers,

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Speaker 5: they'll probably play three. The interesting name for me too,

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Speaker 5: Wads Bashier. Now England have a problem with that, that's

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Speaker 5: a fact. It's becoming a problem. And he is too.

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Speaker 5: He plays for Somerset, that's where his county is and

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Speaker 5: that's where his contractor is. But currently playing for Glamorgan

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Speaker 5: at the moment in the county he's got two wickets

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Speaker 5: for at one hundred and fifty three this season. Somerset

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Speaker 5: don't even seem to want him. If you look at

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Speaker 5: the New Zealand tour he got, and then at the

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Speaker 5: Lions tour that he went on in Aussie and then

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Speaker 5: the start for the year at the county he's playing

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Speaker 5: at Glamorgan. He's got sixteen wickets at seventy one, so

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Speaker 5: it's an interesting one, isn't And he goes for nearly

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Speaker 5: four runs and over, so he leaks runs as a

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Speaker 5: spinner and you cannot do that. You talked about Australia boy,

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Speaker 5: they are going to enjoy playing against Shah Bashir. I

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Speaker 5: think if you leak that many runs, you've got to

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Speaker 5: get wickets and he's not doing that quite at the moment.

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Speaker 5: So he's had more tests than all the other bowlers

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Speaker 5: in that side, so you know, it's an interesting one

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Speaker 5: because they've really only got Rayan Armott who's really learning

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Speaker 5: his trade. He won't probably go on those major tours now.

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Speaker 5: Jack Leach who got hit in Australia last time, and

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Speaker 5: Liam Dawson is another name plays at Hampshire left armor

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Speaker 5: and that needs to be sorted out. That hole is

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Speaker 5: about who are they going to take. They're even talking

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Speaker 5: about not playing a spinner.

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Speaker 1: On the front foot with Waddle and Cony on.

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Speaker 3: The front foot was Brian Model and Jeremy Cony. It's

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Speaker 3: that time of the year when the while it's always

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Speaker 3: been known as the Cricketer's Bible to some extent, but

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Speaker 3: the Wisdom Annual, the Wisdom Almanac comes on the bookshelves,

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Speaker 3: and of course it covers a lot of the game

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Speaker 3: of cricket. I don't know how much time has spent

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Speaker 3: just checking the stats. Who does the proofreading, but a

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Speaker 3: man who can probably help with that as the editor,

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Speaker 3: Lawrence Booth, who joins us on the front foot. And

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Speaker 3: I mean it's a it's a mess of document, doesn't it.

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Speaker 3: There's a hell of a lot there to go on

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Speaker 3: and it's not just you, is.

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Speaker 4: It, Hi, Brian, No, I'd love to claim all the credit.

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Speaker 4: I can't. There are one five hundred and eighty four

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Speaker 4: pages in this year's Wisden, and I'd be I'd be

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Speaker 4: a madman to attempt all that by myself. I have

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Speaker 4: a small but very dedicated team who check the stats.

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Speaker 4: We have a couple of statisticians on the go, so

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Speaker 4: our record section is accurate and up to date. And

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Speaker 4: I mean I proofread every other page apart from the

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Speaker 4: statistical stuff at the back, So I'm you know, me

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Speaker 4: and the team proofread probably about thirteen hundred pages across

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Speaker 4: the course of the year. So it's a huge enterprise.

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Speaker 4: But it's it's a lot of fun.

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Speaker 3: I mean, it would be easy to miss an important

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Speaker 3: statistic to some extent, wouldn't it, because there are so

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Speaker 3: many changing and there are so many things that now

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Speaker 3: people want as a statistic, because it is a game

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Speaker 3: of statistics apart from anything else, isn't it.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean we did. Look, I'd love to say

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Speaker 4: wisdom doesn't make any mistakes. We you know, as soon

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Speaker 4: as we're published, the letters and emails start to dribble

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Speaker 4: in saying excellent, congratulations on another edition of Wisdom, and

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Speaker 4: then the next paragraph always begins. However, commer I noticed

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Speaker 4: on page seven hundred and forty three that and they've

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Speaker 4: spotted some tiny little mistake. You think, how did that

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Speaker 4: get through? But you know, human error is part of it.

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Speaker 4: But no, it's some you know, the record section kind

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Speaker 4: of just needs updating each year effectively. You know, if

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Speaker 4: you pick up Wisdom, you expect to be able to

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Speaker 4: see that Brian Lara has the highest test score or

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Speaker 4: you know, the best bowling figures in test history of

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Speaker 4: Jim Laker, and in nineteen fifty six. Even in the

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Speaker 4: age of the Internet, where those numbers get updated by

430
00:25:01,853 --> 00:25:04,293
Speaker 4: the second, you still expect an annual to have the

431
00:25:04,333 --> 00:25:06,533
Speaker 4: big numbers. So it's a kind of balancing act.

432
00:25:07,213 --> 00:25:09,373
Speaker 3: Yeah, I suppose it's probably easier now because you do

433
00:25:09,493 --> 00:25:12,573
Speaker 3: have computers by which these steps can be kept on

434
00:25:12,693 --> 00:25:17,413
Speaker 3: and just maintained as the magazine or the book does.

435
00:25:17,773 --> 00:25:20,373
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's not. You know, we're not using carrier pigeons

436
00:25:20,453 --> 00:25:23,453
Speaker 4: or fax machines anymore. I mean, I take my hat off.

437
00:25:23,573 --> 00:25:25,173
Speaker 4: I take my hat off. The editors it used to

438
00:25:25,173 --> 00:25:28,173
Speaker 4: have to make changes by facts. I mean, you basically

439
00:25:28,173 --> 00:25:30,093
Speaker 4: had to limit the number of changes you made because

440
00:25:30,093 --> 00:25:33,533
Speaker 4: it became impossible. Now we have proofreading meetings on Skype.

441
00:25:34,373 --> 00:25:37,933
Speaker 4: You know, everything's filed by email. It goes slot straight

442
00:25:37,973 --> 00:25:40,773
Speaker 4: into a content management system. We have a type setter,

443
00:25:41,293 --> 00:25:42,973
Speaker 4: so you know, that side of it is much easier.

444
00:25:43,013 --> 00:25:44,453
Speaker 4: On the other hand, there's a lot more cricket to

445
00:25:44,453 --> 00:25:46,853
Speaker 4: cover than there was even twenty years ago. You know,

446
00:25:46,893 --> 00:25:50,013
Speaker 4: the onset of T twenty has changed the game completely.

447
00:25:50,093 --> 00:25:52,533
Speaker 4: So we're always trying to see what we need to

448
00:25:52,613 --> 00:25:54,933
Speaker 4: cut from wisdom to fit everything in to keep the

449
00:25:54,933 --> 00:25:57,373
Speaker 4: book within about fifteen hundred and sixteen hundred pages.

450
00:25:58,173 --> 00:26:01,293
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, and that's got to be a hard task. Well,

451
00:26:01,333 --> 00:26:04,493
Speaker 3: it's in the public eye and has made a bit

452
00:26:04,533 --> 00:26:08,013
Speaker 3: of a hit with the public for or against a

453
00:26:08,693 --> 00:26:13,413
Speaker 3: because the editor's note, and that's how your comments are

454
00:26:14,453 --> 00:26:19,173
Speaker 3: written down in crick Info. The editor's note has created

455
00:26:19,213 --> 00:26:22,773
Speaker 3: a little bit of controversy. You've had a crack at

456
00:26:22,773 --> 00:26:27,013
Speaker 3: the World Tiest Championship, calling it a shambles masquerading as

457
00:26:27,013 --> 00:26:31,173
Speaker 3: a show piece. You've also been critical of the ICC.

458
00:26:31,933 --> 00:26:35,533
Speaker 3: I must say I don't disagree with you in much

459
00:26:35,533 --> 00:26:37,893
Speaker 3: of what you say, but I'm sure there has been

460
00:26:37,973 --> 00:26:42,413
Speaker 3: some disagreement and some reaction to your comments in terms

461
00:26:42,493 --> 00:26:43,773
Speaker 3: of both events.

462
00:26:44,093 --> 00:26:47,293
Speaker 4: Yes, i'd I'd be surprising if you came up with

463
00:26:47,373 --> 00:26:50,573
Speaker 4: strong statements that everyone agrees with. I mean, I've done

464
00:26:50,613 --> 00:26:52,613
Speaker 4: this job for this is my fourteenth edition now, and

465
00:26:52,653 --> 00:26:56,093
Speaker 4: the role that India play in kind of controlling world

466
00:26:56,133 --> 00:26:58,853
Speaker 4: cricket has been quite a regular theme. It hasn't always

467
00:26:58,853 --> 00:27:02,413
Speaker 4: gone down well. I think this year really the what

468
00:27:02,493 --> 00:27:06,173
Speaker 4: happened at the Champions Trophy in Pakistan slash Dubai, I

469
00:27:06,213 --> 00:27:08,333
Speaker 4: think resonated a bit more with the cricket wider creat

470
00:27:08,413 --> 00:27:13,173
Speaker 4: getting public than previous examples of Indian power had done.

471
00:27:13,253 --> 00:27:14,693
Speaker 4: That the fact that India got to play all their

472
00:27:14,693 --> 00:27:17,213
Speaker 4: games in Dubai and other teams are flying in and out.

473
00:27:17,453 --> 00:27:20,213
Speaker 4: In some cases South Africa had to fly across the

474
00:27:20,293 --> 00:27:22,653
Speaker 4: Dubai just in case they were playing that semi final

475
00:27:23,973 --> 00:27:26,293
Speaker 4: with the possibility of them having to fly back to Pakistan.

476
00:27:26,373 --> 00:27:29,573
Speaker 4: So I accept that the political situation is now even

477
00:27:29,613 --> 00:27:31,733
Speaker 4: more difficult than it was, and I wrote these notes

478
00:27:31,773 --> 00:27:35,973
Speaker 4: because of the situation in Kashmir. But I think over

479
00:27:35,973 --> 00:27:40,093
Speaker 4: the last few years the India have got away with

480
00:27:40,133 --> 00:27:42,253
Speaker 4: more than other countries would I mean, let's say of

481
00:27:42,293 --> 00:27:44,533
Speaker 4: New Zealand had said, sorry, we can't play in Pakistan.

482
00:27:44,613 --> 00:27:47,853
Speaker 4: We insist on playing in Dubai for political reasons. My

483
00:27:47,933 --> 00:27:49,813
Speaker 4: guess is the rest of the world would have said, well, sorry,

484
00:27:49,813 --> 00:27:52,813
Speaker 4: we're holding the tournament without you, because they can't say

485
00:27:52,853 --> 00:27:55,493
Speaker 4: that to India because India controlled the purse strings. And

486
00:27:55,533 --> 00:27:57,933
Speaker 4: that is the problem that world cricket faces. And with

487
00:27:58,053 --> 00:28:02,533
Speaker 4: Jay shar the former Indian Board honorary secretary now Chairman

488
00:28:02,573 --> 00:28:07,493
Speaker 4: of the ICC, Indian now hold every single position of power.

489
00:28:07,533 --> 00:28:10,493
Speaker 4: Really they controy all the game, not just financially but administratively.

490
00:28:11,133 --> 00:28:14,973
Speaker 4: My question really, is a monopoly good for cricket? And

491
00:28:15,013 --> 00:28:17,733
Speaker 4: why don't any of the bigger nations, the so called

492
00:28:17,853 --> 00:28:20,533
Speaker 4: bigger nations England and Australia principally, why don't they push

493
00:28:20,613 --> 00:28:24,533
Speaker 4: back a bit what India are doing. So, yes, that

494
00:28:24,533 --> 00:28:26,733
Speaker 4: doesn't always go down well in India, as you can imagine,

495
00:28:27,733 --> 00:28:30,053
Speaker 4: people take it as an anti Indian rant. It's not.

496
00:28:30,173 --> 00:28:32,133
Speaker 4: It's simply that I want the best for cricket. And

497
00:28:32,453 --> 00:28:34,413
Speaker 4: my question is are India exercising their power with the

498
00:28:34,413 --> 00:28:35,653
Speaker 4: responsibility to.

499
00:28:35,693 --> 00:28:39,173
Speaker 3: A certain extent. You are raising a point that has

500
00:28:39,213 --> 00:28:42,133
Speaker 3: been talked about around the world over a long period

501
00:28:42,173 --> 00:28:46,493
Speaker 3: of time. Some people see it as inevitable that the

502
00:28:46,533 --> 00:28:50,173
Speaker 3: control will stay in India, that the game won't make

503
00:28:50,253 --> 00:28:56,293
Speaker 3: the advances and retain the tiss Cricket the Worldish Championship

504
00:28:56,293 --> 00:28:59,693
Speaker 3: as we've come to know it, because of the dominance

505
00:29:00,053 --> 00:29:03,213
Speaker 3: they have. Do you see it as an inevitability?

506
00:29:03,893 --> 00:29:06,653
Speaker 4: Well at the moment, probably because there's no sign that

507
00:29:06,813 --> 00:29:10,333
Speaker 4: the BCCI want to share a bit more of the wealth.

508
00:29:10,373 --> 00:29:12,293
Speaker 4: I mean. The other point I've made, and I made

509
00:29:12,293 --> 00:29:13,933
Speaker 4: it a couple of years back, or maybe perhaps it

510
00:29:13,973 --> 00:29:17,813
Speaker 4: was last year, was that the ICC redistributed their funds

511
00:29:17,853 --> 00:29:21,213
Speaker 4: so that India's share of the annual part of about

512
00:29:21,213 --> 00:29:23,493
Speaker 4: six hundred million dollars of sort the ICIC get from

513
00:29:23,493 --> 00:29:26,773
Speaker 4: their broadcasting rights grew from about a quarter to nearly

514
00:29:26,813 --> 00:29:29,893
Speaker 4: two fifths. So that's about two hundred and thirty million

515
00:29:30,533 --> 00:29:33,013
Speaker 4: US now, just to give some context for listeners, New

516
00:29:33,173 --> 00:29:38,733
Speaker 4: Zealand's share is something like four point seventy three percent.

517
00:29:38,853 --> 00:29:42,493
Speaker 4: That's twenty eight million. Now that now, if India just

518
00:29:42,533 --> 00:29:44,933
Speaker 4: shared a bit of the two hundred and thirty million

519
00:29:44,973 --> 00:29:47,853
Speaker 4: with nations like New Zealand or West Indies or Sri

520
00:29:47,933 --> 00:29:50,493
Speaker 4: Lanka or South Africa. We might I might feel a

521
00:29:50,493 --> 00:29:53,733
Speaker 4: bit more confident about the future of Test cricket. What's

522
00:29:53,733 --> 00:29:56,213
Speaker 4: happening at the moment is that all these other nations

523
00:29:56,213 --> 00:29:58,533
Speaker 4: are Test cricket is a loss for them. They make

524
00:29:58,573 --> 00:30:01,413
Speaker 4: a financial loss when they host tests, and the game

525
00:30:01,453 --> 00:30:03,453
Speaker 4: will simply die out. We're already seeing plenty of two

526
00:30:03,533 --> 00:30:05,533
Speaker 4: match series. You know, New Zealand play two match series

527
00:30:05,533 --> 00:30:07,173
Speaker 4: a lot of the time. I know in England came

528
00:30:07,173 --> 00:30:09,733
Speaker 4: it's a three match here, is that great? But two

529
00:30:09,813 --> 00:30:12,653
Speaker 4: match here is a annoying, aren't they. You often want

530
00:30:12,653 --> 00:30:14,733
Speaker 4: a third it's sometimes one, or you want to decide

531
00:30:14,733 --> 00:30:16,973
Speaker 4: a two match series are things you hurry through to

532
00:30:16,973 --> 00:30:19,533
Speaker 4: get to the money spinning white ball games. If we

533
00:30:19,573 --> 00:30:22,253
Speaker 4: could find a way of funding test cricket, accept that

534
00:30:22,293 --> 00:30:24,213
Speaker 4: it makes a loss, but that we love it and

535
00:30:24,213 --> 00:30:26,853
Speaker 4: we need it for the richness of cricket's ecosystem. If

536
00:30:26,853 --> 00:30:28,453
Speaker 4: we could find a way of doing that, then I'd

537
00:30:28,453 --> 00:30:31,333
Speaker 4: feel a bit more confident about cricket's future. As it is,

538
00:30:31,333 --> 00:30:33,853
Speaker 4: I think we're heading for a kind of white ball

539
00:30:33,893 --> 00:30:38,133
Speaker 4: dominated calendar. We're already getting there. To be honest, with England,

540
00:30:38,133 --> 00:30:40,973
Speaker 4: India and Australia playing five match tests series against each other,

541
00:30:40,973 --> 00:30:43,533
Speaker 4: which is already they already do it to excess. It's

542
00:30:43,533 --> 00:30:46,493
Speaker 4: already getting a bit dull. It could get even duller

543
00:30:46,733 --> 00:30:48,933
Speaker 4: and that's not good for cricket. It won't be good

544
00:30:48,933 --> 00:30:53,053
Speaker 4: for Indian cricket because Indian cricket needs a diverse world game.

545
00:30:53,093 --> 00:30:55,413
Speaker 4: I think for it to have people to play against

546
00:30:55,413 --> 00:30:58,293
Speaker 4: and for players to populate its own ipl so in

547
00:30:58,293 --> 00:31:00,093
Speaker 4: a way you have to appeal to their self interest.

548
00:31:00,653 --> 00:31:02,693
Speaker 4: But that's not going on at the moment. It's all

549
00:31:02,733 --> 00:31:05,333
Speaker 4: about we generate all the money, therefore we should get

550
00:31:05,333 --> 00:31:05,813
Speaker 4: most of it.

551
00:31:06,853 --> 00:31:09,773
Speaker 3: There's a feeling outside that there's almost a payback for

552
00:31:09,853 --> 00:31:14,173
Speaker 3: the years that ICC lived in London and the NCC

553
00:31:14,333 --> 00:31:18,093
Speaker 3: head control of the game as such, and it's our

554
00:31:18,133 --> 00:31:22,133
Speaker 3: turn now, which I think people understand, but I'm not

555
00:31:22,133 --> 00:31:25,893
Speaker 3: sure that that helps the game develop as it should develop.

556
00:31:26,733 --> 00:31:30,213
Speaker 4: Oh, I totally get the emotional kind of impulse there.

557
00:31:30,293 --> 00:31:32,093
Speaker 4: You know, England and Australia had the veto at the

558
00:31:32,253 --> 00:31:36,093
Speaker 4: ICC till nineteen ninety three and it's an outrageous situation really,

559
00:31:36,613 --> 00:31:38,973
Speaker 4: And I dare say that within and editors in the

560
00:31:39,013 --> 00:31:42,413
Speaker 4: fifties and sixties, weren't calling that situation out because that

561
00:31:42,573 --> 00:31:44,773
Speaker 4: was simply the way the way the world worked as

562
00:31:44,813 --> 00:31:46,373
Speaker 4: far as they were concerned. But if you if you

563
00:31:46,413 --> 00:31:49,413
Speaker 4: take the view that you bullied us, then now it's

564
00:31:49,413 --> 00:31:52,173
Speaker 4: our turn to bully you, then we will never get anywhere.

565
00:31:53,173 --> 00:31:57,013
Speaker 4: We need a collaborative approach really in world cricket, and

566
00:31:57,893 --> 00:32:00,333
Speaker 4: to take to sort of say well it's our turn

567
00:32:00,373 --> 00:32:02,773
Speaker 4: now to rule the roost will simply lead us more

568
00:32:02,813 --> 00:32:05,453
Speaker 4: quickly to a situation where test cricket dies out in

569
00:32:05,493 --> 00:32:06,573
Speaker 4: a lot of a lot of the world.

570
00:32:07,773 --> 00:32:11,973
Speaker 3: Yes, and seeing the resurgence or the emergence of so

571
00:32:12,133 --> 00:32:15,413
Speaker 3: much white ball cricket now in terms of the franchise

572
00:32:15,413 --> 00:32:17,973
Speaker 3: cricket around the world. In New Zealand is getting involved

573
00:32:18,293 --> 00:32:21,813
Speaker 3: in the American competition, so you know that is going

574
00:32:21,853 --> 00:32:25,573
Speaker 3: to be the future rather than some other forms of

575
00:32:25,573 --> 00:32:28,773
Speaker 3: the game. One of the things that we always loved

576
00:32:28,813 --> 00:32:32,813
Speaker 3: about Wisdom was the five Cricketers of the Year and

577
00:32:32,853 --> 00:32:36,573
Speaker 3: it was almost what we looked for when the Wisdom

578
00:32:36,693 --> 00:32:39,413
Speaker 3: came out if a New Zealand name happened to be there,

579
00:32:39,413 --> 00:32:41,973
Speaker 3: and we've had a number of New Zealanders, but I

580
00:32:42,013 --> 00:32:46,293
Speaker 3: think this time we're delighted that the Wisdom Trophy has

581
00:32:46,333 --> 00:32:51,573
Speaker 3: been awarded to a New Zealander. The year's outstanding performance

582
00:32:52,013 --> 00:32:56,013
Speaker 3: went to Mitchell Santner thirteen wickets in the Test match

583
00:32:56,173 --> 00:32:59,653
Speaker 3: at Puna. We loved that Test match. We won at

584
00:32:59,813 --> 00:33:05,773
Speaker 3: three nil. But that obviously features highly with you because

585
00:33:06,773 --> 00:33:10,573
Speaker 3: you would in a year have many, he evinced, many

586
00:33:10,693 --> 00:33:13,733
Speaker 3: moments that you consider for the Worstern Trophy.

587
00:33:15,053 --> 00:33:17,373
Speaker 4: Absolutely, so, I mean this trophy came in, it's in

588
00:33:17,413 --> 00:33:19,293
Speaker 4: its third year now. The Wisdom Trophy used to be

589
00:33:19,373 --> 00:33:21,853
Speaker 4: awarded to the winners of the England West Indies Test Series.

590
00:33:21,893 --> 00:33:25,053
Speaker 4: Then that the boards of those nations changed that trophy

591
00:33:25,093 --> 00:33:27,533
Speaker 4: to the Richards Botham Trophy. So we thought we'd repurpose

592
00:33:27,573 --> 00:33:30,533
Speaker 4: the Wisdom Trophy. Will support Test cricket, will award it

593
00:33:30,573 --> 00:33:32,573
Speaker 4: to the best individual performance by a manor or woman

594
00:33:32,613 --> 00:33:36,333
Speaker 4: in the calendarar at Test level and therefore, you know,

595
00:33:36,413 --> 00:33:38,333
Speaker 4: so you're looking at I think they're over fifty Test

596
00:33:38,333 --> 00:33:40,613
Speaker 4: matches last year, so you've got a lot to choose from.

597
00:33:41,173 --> 00:33:43,693
Speaker 4: It's a great one to win and I just looking

598
00:33:43,733 --> 00:33:47,933
Speaker 4: at Mitchell Santa's performance at poone. So no team had

599
00:33:47,933 --> 00:33:50,693
Speaker 4: won a Test series in India since England in twenty

600
00:33:50,733 --> 00:33:53,813
Speaker 4: twelve thirteen. Not only that no team had drawn a

601
00:33:53,853 --> 00:33:56,373
Speaker 4: Test series, so India had won every single Test series

602
00:33:56,813 --> 00:33:59,773
Speaker 4: since then. New Zealand didn't really arrive with much hope.

603
00:33:59,773 --> 00:34:01,373
Speaker 4: I think it's fair to say I think we assumed

604
00:34:01,373 --> 00:34:04,013
Speaker 4: it would just be another home win for India. Then

605
00:34:04,253 --> 00:34:06,373
Speaker 4: the New Zealand won the first Test, which thought, okay,

606
00:34:06,373 --> 00:34:08,933
Speaker 4: they've got their lucky winner. The way, it's going to

607
00:34:08,973 --> 00:34:11,173
Speaker 4: be two one to India now, and then at poone

608
00:34:11,373 --> 00:34:14,493
Speaker 4: in Santna comes in in spinning conditions. You know, these

609
00:34:14,533 --> 00:34:17,093
Speaker 4: are tailor made for India spinners. That's how they've won

610
00:34:17,173 --> 00:34:19,573
Speaker 4: so many series down the years, and he out bowls

611
00:34:20,053 --> 00:34:23,653
Speaker 4: India spinners in spinning conditions. He takes thirteen for I

612
00:34:23,653 --> 00:34:26,853
Speaker 4: think it was one hundred and fifty seven. Andrew Alderson,

613
00:34:26,853 --> 00:34:29,973
Speaker 4: who wrote the interviewed Mitchell four Wisdom and wrote up

614
00:34:30,053 --> 00:34:34,293
Speaker 4: is the Piece, says it's probably the second best before well,

615
00:34:34,373 --> 00:34:36,813
Speaker 4: the sort of almost the most resonant performance by a

616
00:34:36,893 --> 00:34:40,053
Speaker 4: New Zealand bowler, after Richard Hadley at Brisbane in eighty

617
00:34:40,133 --> 00:34:42,333
Speaker 4: five eighty six when he took fifteen for. You know,

618
00:34:42,493 --> 00:34:45,573
Speaker 4: it's on that kind of a pedestal and don't forget

619
00:34:45,613 --> 00:34:48,613
Speaker 4: that Satna had he'd never taken more than three wickets

620
00:34:48,613 --> 00:34:51,013
Speaker 4: in a Test innings and suddenly he takes six and seven.

621
00:34:51,253 --> 00:34:54,693
Speaker 4: I mean, it's absolutely ludicrous, really, But I tell you

622
00:34:54,733 --> 00:34:57,573
Speaker 4: the performance that came closest to knocking him off that

623
00:34:57,653 --> 00:35:01,293
Speaker 4: perch was Shama Joseph for West Indies at the Gabba

624
00:35:01,453 --> 00:35:03,373
Speaker 4: right at the start of the year when West Indies

625
00:35:03,373 --> 00:35:06,253
Speaker 4: beat Australia by think it was about eight runs and

626
00:35:06,293 --> 00:35:08,173
Speaker 4: he bowled with a broken foot on the last day

627
00:35:08,373 --> 00:35:10,813
Speaker 4: knock them over. A brilliant kind of performance and in

628
00:35:10,813 --> 00:35:12,333
Speaker 4: a way, that was the That would have been the

629
00:35:12,333 --> 00:35:16,373
Speaker 4: emotional pick, but I felt that Santa was the intellectual pick.

630
00:35:16,413 --> 00:35:18,613
Speaker 4: If you like it. It was the brain's ruling the heart.

631
00:35:18,733 --> 00:35:21,613
Speaker 4: It was saying that no, teams don't win in India,

632
00:35:22,053 --> 00:35:24,733
Speaker 4: New Zealand spinners don't out bowl Indian spinners in India,

633
00:35:24,773 --> 00:35:27,133
Speaker 4: and Mitchell Santana has taken thirteen when he's never taken

634
00:35:27,173 --> 00:35:30,133
Speaker 4: more than three. He scored an unbeaten thirty three as well,

635
00:35:30,133 --> 00:35:33,293
Speaker 4: which helped. So to me it was it was almost

636
00:35:33,333 --> 00:35:35,293
Speaker 4: impossible to ignore and delighted to give it.

637
00:35:35,253 --> 00:35:39,533
Speaker 3: To Yeah, I must admit that I was one of

638
00:35:39,533 --> 00:35:43,493
Speaker 3: those who after the build up to that series wasn't

639
00:35:43,493 --> 00:35:45,493
Speaker 3: prepared to give New Zealand a chance of winning one

640
00:35:45,573 --> 00:35:50,053
Speaker 3: little three, So that something I'd take ownership four. And

641
00:35:50,733 --> 00:35:52,533
Speaker 3: it's nice to be able to celebrate it because it's

642
00:35:52,533 --> 00:35:56,893
Speaker 3: been celebrated by Wisdom and that is a significant moment

643
00:35:56,933 --> 00:36:00,013
Speaker 3: that we can all share. The Players of the Year,

644
00:36:00,053 --> 00:36:02,013
Speaker 3: now this is an interesting one, of course, because you

645
00:36:02,053 --> 00:36:04,653
Speaker 3: can never win the five Players of the Year more

646
00:36:04,653 --> 00:36:06,333
Speaker 3: than once, can you?

647
00:36:06,373 --> 00:36:08,893
Speaker 4: No, that's right, So the five Cricketers of the I

648
00:36:08,893 --> 00:36:10,613
Speaker 4: mean some people say it should be called the five

649
00:36:10,653 --> 00:36:14,173
Speaker 4: cricketers of the English Summer because that is the emphasis.

650
00:36:14,213 --> 00:36:16,173
Speaker 4: And as you say, you can't win it more than once,

651
00:36:16,213 --> 00:36:18,733
Speaker 4: so you know you are slightly limited. It makes the

652
00:36:19,173 --> 00:36:23,013
Speaker 4: award slightly quirky. It's not simply the best the leading

653
00:36:23,453 --> 00:36:25,093
Speaker 4: run score of the leading wi could takers. There are

654
00:36:25,133 --> 00:36:27,773
Speaker 4: plenty of awards that do that, so Wisdom, the Wisdom

655
00:36:27,773 --> 00:36:30,133
Speaker 4: Award has always had this slight charm that you've get

656
00:36:30,173 --> 00:36:32,653
Speaker 4: a couple of names that you know, perhaps the outside

657
00:36:32,653 --> 00:36:34,893
Speaker 4: world might not have been that aware of a county

658
00:36:34,893 --> 00:36:39,773
Speaker 4: cricket or so, so that's how it works, right.

659
00:36:39,853 --> 00:36:43,053
Speaker 3: And the other award of significance of course, was the

660
00:36:43,173 --> 00:36:47,613
Speaker 3: leading cricketers of the world. Jesperate Boomra. We probably can't

661
00:36:47,653 --> 00:36:51,093
Speaker 3: find too much argument with that, bearing in mind his

662
00:36:51,373 --> 00:36:54,933
Speaker 3: impact on the international game and what he was able

663
00:36:54,973 --> 00:36:57,973
Speaker 3: to achieve, the strength he was for the Indian side

664
00:36:58,373 --> 00:37:02,453
Speaker 3: and the women's side of the games. Really, Mandana was

665
00:37:02,933 --> 00:37:06,973
Speaker 3: the player. What was her performance above a number of

666
00:37:07,573 --> 00:37:13,133
Speaker 3: very well performed women's players, particularly in Australia and even

667
00:37:13,173 --> 00:37:16,613
Speaker 3: some of the England players over the last twelve month period.

668
00:37:17,973 --> 00:37:20,013
Speaker 4: Yeah, a good question. I think to win that award,

669
00:37:20,093 --> 00:37:22,333
Speaker 4: if you're not Australian, you have to do something pretty special.

670
00:37:22,333 --> 00:37:24,333
Speaker 4: I mean, Australia so far ahead of the pack. I

671
00:37:24,373 --> 00:37:27,293
Speaker 4: know that New Zealand won the World cut, but I

672
00:37:27,373 --> 00:37:29,413
Speaker 4: think over the course of the year you'd probably say

673
00:37:29,453 --> 00:37:34,893
Speaker 4: Australia are the leading women's side. She scored nearly seventeen

674
00:37:34,973 --> 00:37:37,653
Speaker 4: hundred runs in all international cricket. That was a record

675
00:37:38,293 --> 00:37:40,573
Speaker 4: for a woman in a calendar year. And she scored

676
00:37:40,573 --> 00:37:43,413
Speaker 4: four centuries alone in ODI cricket and that was a

677
00:37:43,453 --> 00:37:46,053
Speaker 4: record too. So I think for her to stand out

678
00:37:46,093 --> 00:37:50,973
Speaker 4: among a crowded field of talented players was quite an achievement.

679
00:37:51,413 --> 00:37:55,213
Speaker 3: Yes, And I guess the women's game now is getting

680
00:37:55,533 --> 00:37:59,733
Speaker 3: extended quite significantly, and it was nice to see that

681
00:37:59,933 --> 00:38:02,413
Speaker 3: an english woman got one of your five Cricketers of

682
00:38:02,413 --> 00:38:07,893
Speaker 3: the Year. Sophie Hilston, who's a lovely exponent of lift

683
00:38:08,053 --> 00:38:11,933
Speaker 3: arm spin. She probably spoilt the last twelve months, I

684
00:38:11,973 --> 00:38:15,693
Speaker 3: suppose because of her reaction to a media interview that

685
00:38:16,293 --> 00:38:19,853
Speaker 3: probably had a lot of coverage in England. But she's

686
00:38:20,653 --> 00:38:24,613
Speaker 3: a wonderful spin borers and she really does practice the

687
00:38:24,733 --> 00:38:27,013
Speaker 3: art to almost perfection, doesn't she.

688
00:38:27,653 --> 00:38:30,413
Speaker 4: Yeah, she's beautiful to watch. She doesn't miss a line

689
00:38:30,453 --> 00:38:32,773
Speaker 4: of length, does she? I mean she she forces the

690
00:38:32,813 --> 00:38:35,493
Speaker 4: batters to play at everything. Yes, as you say, it

691
00:38:35,573 --> 00:38:38,493
Speaker 4: was a bad end to the year for England's women

692
00:38:38,533 --> 00:38:41,973
Speaker 4: getting thrashed in Australia. Of course, the award is based,

693
00:38:42,013 --> 00:38:43,893
Speaker 4: as I mentioned earlier, based on the English summer, and

694
00:38:43,933 --> 00:38:46,413
Speaker 4: in the English summer, England won every match they played

695
00:38:46,493 --> 00:38:49,493
Speaker 4: and Eckleston took twenty six wickets an average of nine.

696
00:38:49,653 --> 00:38:51,813
Speaker 4: So it was you know, it's kind of hard to

697
00:38:52,373 --> 00:38:56,333
Speaker 4: overlook what she did. She because she's so accurate and

698
00:38:56,333 --> 00:38:59,133
Speaker 4: she's quite tall. She came to the Wisdom Dinner to

699
00:38:59,173 --> 00:39:01,293
Speaker 4: collect her award and it was just standing next to her.

700
00:39:01,333 --> 00:39:03,693
Speaker 4: I'm not a tall man, but standing next to her

701
00:39:03,733 --> 00:39:06,413
Speaker 4: it was kind of reminded me of what a physical

702
00:39:06,453 --> 00:39:08,893
Speaker 4: presence she is. And she comes down from a great

703
00:39:08,933 --> 00:39:11,733
Speaker 4: height and she gets bounced, natural bounce. She turns it

704
00:39:11,773 --> 00:39:16,333
Speaker 4: a bit and she doesn't miss a trick. So it's

705
00:39:16,333 --> 00:39:18,733
Speaker 4: sort of Chinese water torture in a way. Drip drip,

706
00:39:18,893 --> 00:39:20,733
Speaker 4: and you have to have to have your wits about

707
00:39:20,773 --> 00:39:22,613
Speaker 4: you to survive. You know, even Australians haven't done that

708
00:39:22,613 --> 00:39:25,733
Speaker 4: well against her. So she'd been knocking on the door

709
00:39:25,773 --> 00:39:27,813
Speaker 4: for the Wisdom five for a couple of years. She'd

710
00:39:27,853 --> 00:39:30,173
Speaker 4: been unlucky to miss out, probably for the previous two

711
00:39:30,293 --> 00:39:31,453
Speaker 4: or three years, so it's nice to be able to

712
00:39:31,493 --> 00:39:32,213
Speaker 4: give it to her.

713
00:39:32,293 --> 00:39:35,733
Speaker 3: Finally, how do you feel when it gets to the

714
00:39:35,773 --> 00:39:38,613
Speaker 3: printer and it comes out. Is there a sense of

715
00:39:39,173 --> 00:39:41,693
Speaker 3: relief where you're already starting to think about what's going

716
00:39:41,733 --> 00:39:42,533
Speaker 3: to happen next year?

717
00:39:43,413 --> 00:39:43,653
Speaker 4: Oh?

718
00:39:43,933 --> 00:39:43,973
Speaker 3: No.

719
00:39:44,653 --> 00:39:46,693
Speaker 4: The nice moment is when you kind of pack up

720
00:39:46,693 --> 00:39:48,773
Speaker 4: your bags at the end of the production cycle and

721
00:39:48,973 --> 00:39:51,293
Speaker 4: you say, right, I don't have to think about this

722
00:39:51,333 --> 00:39:54,773
Speaker 4: now for another few weeks until that it's published, and

723
00:39:54,813 --> 00:39:56,653
Speaker 4: I do the rounds of interviews and we have the

724
00:39:57,013 --> 00:39:59,413
Speaker 4: annual launch at Lord's. That's a nice moment. But yes,

725
00:39:59,453 --> 00:40:01,853
Speaker 4: you are already. We have already proof read pages for

726
00:40:01,893 --> 00:40:05,213
Speaker 4: Wisdom twenty twenty six. I did a session yesterday where

727
00:40:05,213 --> 00:40:07,693
Speaker 4: we as a team, we proofread the Champions Trophy together.

728
00:40:08,453 --> 00:40:10,973
Speaker 4: Of course, there's anything that starts from January the first

729
00:40:11,053 --> 00:40:13,653
Speaker 4: onwards goes in the following year's Wisdom, if you see

730
00:40:13,693 --> 00:40:16,693
Speaker 4: what I mean. So even while we're putting to bed

731
00:40:16,973 --> 00:40:21,373
Speaker 4: Wisdom twenty twenty five, I'm commissioning reports and series for

732
00:40:21,413 --> 00:40:24,533
Speaker 4: Wisdom twenty twenty six. So it's NonStop. I mean, there

733
00:40:24,573 --> 00:40:27,893
Speaker 4: are quieter times of year, but it never quite. The

734
00:40:27,973 --> 00:40:29,733
Speaker 4: voice never stops chattering in your head.

735
00:40:30,973 --> 00:40:33,773
Speaker 3: Yeah, you're going to be at your sharpest, don't you.

736
00:40:35,093 --> 00:40:39,693
Speaker 3: It's interesting that he's been so harsh Lawrence Booth in

737
00:40:39,773 --> 00:40:43,013
Speaker 3: terms of his criticism of some aspects of the game.

738
00:40:43,013 --> 00:40:46,373
Speaker 3: But you know, when you're going to make those sorts

739
00:40:46,373 --> 00:40:48,093
Speaker 3: of comments, you're going to have to expect that there'll

740
00:40:48,133 --> 00:40:50,213
Speaker 3: be opposition, and there's been opposition to what he said.

741
00:40:50,253 --> 00:40:53,893
Speaker 3: He understands that. But I think Jerry, the most important

742
00:40:53,973 --> 00:40:58,373
Speaker 3: thing is he has highlighted issues that the game needs

743
00:40:58,413 --> 00:41:02,613
Speaker 3: to talk about and needs to address. Next week he's

744
00:41:02,613 --> 00:41:04,893
Speaker 3: going to join us again to talk about the World

745
00:41:04,973 --> 00:41:09,013
Speaker 3: Test Championship and his views on that, but the the

746
00:41:09,093 --> 00:41:11,893
Speaker 3: running of it at the moment and the distribution of

747
00:41:11,933 --> 00:41:16,013
Speaker 3: funds was another area, as he mentioned, that is in question.

748
00:41:16,973 --> 00:41:21,333
Speaker 5: Yeah, Lawrence Boose has been the editor now for what

749
00:41:21,533 --> 00:41:26,573
Speaker 5: nearly fifteen years of Wisdom, which is regarded in cricket

750
00:41:26,613 --> 00:41:30,773
Speaker 5: as the Bible or if you like, the conscience of cricket,

751
00:41:30,773 --> 00:41:33,613
Speaker 5: and that's where some of the comments you've just made

752
00:41:33,693 --> 00:41:39,693
Speaker 5: sort of fit in. And they hold power particularly to

753
00:41:39,893 --> 00:41:43,493
Speaker 5: account and I have a bit of a sympathy for

754
00:41:43,613 --> 00:41:48,413
Speaker 5: Lawrence's point of view. Maybe that's convenient. I don't know.

755
00:41:48,853 --> 00:41:52,853
Speaker 5: I don't know the small details about what goes on

756
00:41:52,973 --> 00:41:56,653
Speaker 5: in the corridors of power and the ICC. That doesn't

757
00:41:56,693 --> 00:42:00,493
Speaker 5: really interest me, to be honest, Wads. I regard the

758
00:42:00,813 --> 00:42:03,093
Speaker 5: ICC as a bit more no more than a well,

759
00:42:03,293 --> 00:42:06,533
Speaker 5: no more than a men's club. They seem to make

760
00:42:06,573 --> 00:42:10,133
Speaker 5: some decisions about things that don't concern me.

761
00:42:11,293 --> 00:42:12,813
Speaker 1: Are you know?

762
00:42:12,893 --> 00:42:16,493
Speaker 5: When the private equity came along into this game of ours,

763
00:42:16,853 --> 00:42:20,613
Speaker 5: they sat on their hands the ICC, and so the

764
00:42:20,653 --> 00:42:26,453
Speaker 5: space they left and created has been swallowed up, you know,

765
00:42:26,813 --> 00:42:31,373
Speaker 5: and allowed now there are to have fifty three men's

766
00:42:31,373 --> 00:42:38,493
Speaker 5: and women's franchised tournaments around the world, and so we

767
00:42:38,573 --> 00:42:41,253
Speaker 5: get to a point now, in fact, where the nzid

768
00:42:41,533 --> 00:42:47,133
Speaker 5: C are buying part of a franchised team and one

769
00:42:47,213 --> 00:42:51,773
Speaker 5: of those that isn't even really a team yet. So look,

770
00:42:51,853 --> 00:42:55,093
Speaker 5: no one is in charge of test cricket. That's the

771
00:42:55,093 --> 00:42:59,813
Speaker 5: first point, isn't it the ICC, isn't the ECB, isn't

772
00:42:59,853 --> 00:43:04,853
Speaker 5: the BCCI or Australia isn't They're not earning as much

773
00:43:04,933 --> 00:43:10,053
Speaker 5: money as test cricket should. There are tests all round

774
00:43:10,053 --> 00:43:13,933
Speaker 5: the year, played at different places, but you can't watch

775
00:43:14,373 --> 00:43:17,933
Speaker 5: you can't watch them without delving into VPNs and watching

776
00:43:17,973 --> 00:43:21,653
Speaker 5: this and balling people and so on, and the tests

777
00:43:21,653 --> 00:43:24,893
Speaker 5: that you want to because you know, there's no one

778
00:43:25,293 --> 00:43:28,293
Speaker 5: there's nowhere where you can watch on a streaming platform

779
00:43:28,973 --> 00:43:33,093
Speaker 5: that should be organized TV executives. I speak to them

780
00:43:33,093 --> 00:43:36,813
Speaker 5: when I go overseas, and they are really they say

781
00:43:36,853 --> 00:43:40,893
Speaker 5: to me, they're stealing money from cricket boards. You've got

782
00:43:40,973 --> 00:43:45,373
Speaker 5: thirty hours of broadcasts and people come back to watch

783
00:43:45,453 --> 00:43:49,893
Speaker 5: the game day after day and the story of the

784
00:43:49,933 --> 00:43:54,773
Speaker 5: game continually changes. You know, if you're watching golf. You

785
00:43:54,813 --> 00:43:56,773
Speaker 5: know it's only out of two or three, don't you

786
00:43:57,413 --> 00:43:59,813
Speaker 5: three or three of the players, So you turn on

787
00:43:59,933 --> 00:44:01,933
Speaker 5: later on in the afternoon because they're the ones who

788
00:44:01,973 --> 00:44:05,373
Speaker 5: are last on the fourth round, and you watch them

789
00:44:05,373 --> 00:44:08,293
Speaker 5: play cricket. You've got to watch cricket from ball one

790
00:44:08,453 --> 00:44:12,413
Speaker 5: in the day because you know, a key wicket falls

791
00:44:12,733 --> 00:44:17,293
Speaker 5: and changes the story suddenly. And you know when I

792
00:44:17,413 --> 00:44:23,093
Speaker 5: ask people who who runs Test cricket, they say to me, oh,

793
00:44:23,413 --> 00:44:28,533
Speaker 5: that top guy at the ICC. Well, no, they don't.

794
00:44:29,053 --> 00:44:32,653
Speaker 5: Test cricket is bilateral arrangements all around the world between

795
00:44:32,733 --> 00:44:37,573
Speaker 5: cricket boards. So countries talk to countries and arrange for

796
00:44:37,693 --> 00:44:42,613
Speaker 5: themselves and quite often wads. If you're Australia, no we

797
00:44:42,613 --> 00:44:44,893
Speaker 5: don't want to have New Zealand over the time, we're

798
00:44:44,933 --> 00:44:47,693
Speaker 5: getting India. India are coming and we'll make more money there.

799
00:44:47,773 --> 00:44:51,173
Speaker 5: Or we don't want to play Bangladesh. No, that's not

800
00:44:51,213 --> 00:44:54,413
Speaker 5: going to get people along to watch the game, or

801
00:44:54,453 --> 00:44:59,973
Speaker 5: whatever the reasons are. But that's how they arrange bilateral

802
00:45:00,013 --> 00:45:04,333
Speaker 5: test matches. So no one's in charge of the schedule,

803
00:45:05,133 --> 00:45:08,693
Speaker 5: no one's doing the planning, no one's trying to sell

804
00:45:08,733 --> 00:45:14,373
Speaker 5: the overall rights of it. Then they've got this you know,

805
00:45:14,453 --> 00:45:18,613
Speaker 5: Test Championship on top, which is pretty badly flawed. And

806
00:45:19,253 --> 00:45:22,653
Speaker 5: so you know, if no one's running something was, how

807
00:45:22,693 --> 00:45:23,613
Speaker 5: can it be any good.

808
00:45:23,933 --> 00:45:26,853
Speaker 3: Yeah, well there's no plan and we're talking about the

809
00:45:26,853 --> 00:45:29,773
Speaker 3: World Test Championship and we will have a closer look

810
00:45:29,813 --> 00:45:33,733
Speaker 3: at that next week. But yeah, you're right. I mean

811
00:45:34,053 --> 00:45:36,613
Speaker 3: the fact that we can watch the New Zealand a

812
00:45:36,973 --> 00:45:40,213
Speaker 3: playing Bangladesh free of charge. You have to put up

813
00:45:40,253 --> 00:45:42,973
Speaker 3: with some commercials every now and again. You can live

814
00:45:43,013 --> 00:45:45,733
Speaker 3: with that if it doesn't cost you anything, and and

815
00:45:46,173 --> 00:45:48,813
Speaker 3: see that you can see Australian cricket live. But in

816
00:45:48,853 --> 00:45:54,333
Speaker 3: New Zealand you can't see anything live apart from international matches.

817
00:45:54,373 --> 00:45:57,253
Speaker 3: And you know that spreads right throughout the cricket world,

818
00:45:57,293 --> 00:45:59,293
Speaker 3: as you were saying, pretty.

819
00:45:59,053 --> 00:46:04,493
Speaker 5: Much and put behind a paywall, so that cuts out

820
00:46:04,533 --> 00:46:07,613
Speaker 5: a lot of people who may be interested in the game.

821
00:46:07,653 --> 00:46:12,373
Speaker 5: The game should be accessible to everybody everywhere, and the

822
00:46:12,453 --> 00:46:15,333
Speaker 5: sooner it starts to do that, the stronger the game

823
00:46:15,373 --> 00:46:16,533
Speaker 5: will become and it'll grow.

824
00:46:17,253 --> 00:46:19,693
Speaker 3: Well, I think you're going to have to brush up

825
00:46:19,733 --> 00:46:21,773
Speaker 3: your views on the World Test Championship because we had

826
00:46:21,773 --> 00:46:25,253
Speaker 3: to talk about World in the next edition and come

827
00:46:25,333 --> 00:46:27,453
Speaker 3: up with a few ideas because there are people out

828
00:46:27,453 --> 00:46:31,493
Speaker 3: there who still want to see the World Test Championship

829
00:46:32,373 --> 00:46:36,173
Speaker 3: on the Cricket Program and see it with some meaning

830
00:46:36,293 --> 00:46:38,413
Speaker 3: rather than as it is at the moment. We're going

831
00:46:38,453 --> 00:46:41,253
Speaker 3: to see a final between South Africa and Australia, and

832
00:46:41,293 --> 00:46:43,933
Speaker 3: South Africa won't have any home test matches after that

833
00:46:44,133 --> 00:46:46,973
Speaker 3: later the year, so it's a crazy old ship.

834
00:46:47,333 --> 00:46:51,773
Speaker 5: Put your feet up, extraordinary, take it easy, JC, Yeah,

835
00:46:51,853 --> 00:46:54,253
Speaker 5: I shall watch. I'll keep the leg up.

836
00:46:55,093 --> 00:47:03,533
Speaker 3: I keep up and sit and hone in on cricket important.

837
00:47:03,453 --> 00:47:09,493
Speaker 5: All right, good man, take care, be good there, all the.

838
00:47:09,533 --> 00:47:16,293
Speaker 2: Wonder bodies summsening do

839
00:47:18,933 --> 00:47:21,533
Speaker 1: For more from News Talks at b listen live on

840
00:47:21,653 --> 00:47:24,613
Speaker 1: air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever

841
00:47:24,653 --> 00:47:27,253
Speaker 1: you go with our podcasts on iHeartRadio.