1 00:00:00,440 --> 00:00:01,000 Speaker 1: Heller due. 2 00:00:01,600 --> 00:00:03,760 Speaker 2: First of all, though, a worrying stat has emerged from 3 00:00:03,760 --> 00:00:07,280 Speaker 2: the latest Taxpayers Union Curier poll, which is at fourteen 4 00:00:07,400 --> 00:00:09,920 Speaker 2: percent of people, one in seven of us agree that 5 00:00:10,000 --> 00:00:12,600 Speaker 2: New Zealanders may have to resort to violence to get 6 00:00:12,600 --> 00:00:15,280 Speaker 2: the country back on track. Now. The sentiment was strongest 7 00:00:15,280 --> 00:00:18,760 Speaker 2: among ACT Party supporters and Maldi Party supporters. Catherine Della 8 00:00:18,840 --> 00:00:22,120 Speaker 2: Hunt is a former MP and she's with us now, Hi, Catherine. 9 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:22,520 Speaker 1: Hi there? 10 00:00:22,680 --> 00:00:24,040 Speaker 2: Sure does this worry you? 11 00:00:25,600 --> 00:00:28,479 Speaker 1: Well? The country has got a lot of violence in 12 00:00:28,480 --> 00:00:31,840 Speaker 1: it already, so of course it worries me. What worries 13 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:34,400 Speaker 1: me is like one in three women experienced domestic violence 14 00:00:34,440 --> 00:00:38,000 Speaker 1: in this country and we've had a shooting of fifty 15 00:00:38,040 --> 00:00:42,560 Speaker 1: one people, and so clearly that we're resorting to violence 16 00:00:42,560 --> 00:00:45,159 Speaker 1: as part of our daily lives. And I am interested 17 00:00:45,159 --> 00:00:47,280 Speaker 1: in the poll though, because it's like, why would people 18 00:00:47,560 --> 00:00:50,279 Speaker 1: Why are the ACT supporters thinking this when they've got 19 00:00:50,320 --> 00:00:53,440 Speaker 1: the Deputy Prime Minister as their leader, they've got access 20 00:00:53,440 --> 00:00:55,640 Speaker 1: to power, and why do they think we need violence 21 00:00:55,640 --> 00:00:58,920 Speaker 1: to get back on track. Presumably they've got people in 22 00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:01,440 Speaker 1: power who are suppose is the getting us back on track? 23 00:01:01,800 --> 00:01:05,080 Speaker 1: But I think it's I think it's the sign of deepening, 24 00:01:05,440 --> 00:01:09,440 Speaker 1: deepening inequality right now, that some people are really really 25 00:01:09,480 --> 00:01:13,680 Speaker 1: frustrated and feel really excluded from our society in terms 26 00:01:13,680 --> 00:01:16,840 Speaker 1: of it of the things in life that actually make 27 00:01:16,880 --> 00:01:19,000 Speaker 1: you feel part of that society. And so some of 28 00:01:19,040 --> 00:01:22,600 Speaker 1: those people might be feeling frustrated. But the question to 29 00:01:22,680 --> 00:01:27,000 Speaker 1: me is not, you know, is this what's what is 30 00:01:27,040 --> 00:01:29,640 Speaker 1: the cause of this? What are the causes for why 31 00:01:29,720 --> 00:01:32,960 Speaker 1: different people in different sectors of society? People are different 32 00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:36,720 Speaker 1: as the two you've mentioned, should feel that somehow violence 33 00:01:37,080 --> 00:01:38,560 Speaker 1: is going to which we already have a lot of, 34 00:01:38,680 --> 00:01:40,760 Speaker 1: is going to solve anything, and that we need to 35 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:44,280 Speaker 1: dig into that because it really worries me even asking 36 00:01:44,319 --> 00:01:47,520 Speaker 1: that the whole question actually worries me because it's so 37 00:01:48,920 --> 00:01:51,559 Speaker 1: you know, it's so good or bad. So I find 38 00:01:51,600 --> 00:01:54,840 Speaker 1: polls and referendums often ask questions and you get answers 39 00:01:54,840 --> 00:01:57,880 Speaker 1: that seem really terrible. But actually if you dig deeper, 40 00:01:57,920 --> 00:02:01,520 Speaker 1: people have quite nuanced views. But many people are feeling 41 00:02:01,800 --> 00:02:04,160 Speaker 1: it's okay to say that now. Is that to do 42 00:02:04,280 --> 00:02:06,400 Speaker 1: with the Trump effect, that it's okay to talk about 43 00:02:06,480 --> 00:02:09,200 Speaker 1: violence now? And given that you know, Donald Trump is 44 00:02:09,360 --> 00:02:16,959 Speaker 1: taking his own citizens, is this encouraging people to think violence. 45 00:02:12,680 --> 00:02:18,360 Speaker 2: Is something right. So after the Charlie Kirk murder, somebody 46 00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:21,640 Speaker 2: who I know said to me, well, Charlie Kirk shouldn't 47 00:02:21,639 --> 00:02:23,080 Speaker 2: have said what he said and then he wouldn't have 48 00:02:23,080 --> 00:02:25,320 Speaker 2: got shot. It was kind of asking for it, is 49 00:02:25,320 --> 00:02:27,119 Speaker 2: what somebody said. And it feels to me like there's 50 00:02:27,120 --> 00:02:28,680 Speaker 2: a little bit of that going on, Like if you 51 00:02:28,800 --> 00:02:32,280 Speaker 2: say something that others consider to be so inflammatory or 52 00:02:32,320 --> 00:02:36,520 Speaker 2: so incendiary, then you're asking for the violence. Do you 53 00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:36,799 Speaker 2: see that? 54 00:02:36,880 --> 00:02:40,800 Speaker 1: Don't know. I've experienced violent threats all my life. If 55 00:02:40,880 --> 00:02:43,280 Speaker 1: I if I, as a woman, say things that are challenging, 56 00:02:43,520 --> 00:02:45,600 Speaker 1: I've had men threaten me with violence. I don't think 57 00:02:45,639 --> 00:02:49,400 Speaker 1: it's new. I think it's just being validated by leadership. 58 00:02:49,800 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 1: So I think it's unacceptable to shoot somebody. 59 00:02:56,600 --> 00:02:58,880 Speaker 2: What if it's the effect of social media right. 60 00:02:58,800 --> 00:03:00,840 Speaker 1: In that it's won't be helping. 61 00:03:01,360 --> 00:03:03,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, Like, as you say, this is not new, It's 62 00:03:03,600 --> 00:03:05,600 Speaker 2: been going on for a long time. But maybe what 63 00:03:05,639 --> 00:03:07,880 Speaker 2: we're seeing is that if you retreat far enough into 64 00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:10,880 Speaker 2: your own echo chamber and you get your views endorsed 65 00:03:10,880 --> 00:03:13,160 Speaker 2: by other people, you may actually go so far down 66 00:03:13,160 --> 00:03:15,560 Speaker 2: that particular rabbit hole. Whatever it is you think it's 67 00:03:15,560 --> 00:03:18,240 Speaker 2: okay to become violent because of how strongly how wrong 68 00:03:18,320 --> 00:03:20,960 Speaker 2: the other person is. Could that be part of the explanation. 69 00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:25,240 Speaker 1: I don't know. I think I think polarize and threatening 70 00:03:25,280 --> 00:03:27,800 Speaker 1: behavior has always been there. I think social media is 71 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:30,760 Speaker 1: making it worse and people. I think if you look at, say, 72 00:03:30,800 --> 00:03:33,720 Speaker 1: for example, the group of infols, the group of young 73 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:37,760 Speaker 1: males who believe they're entitled to women's bodies and who 74 00:03:37,800 --> 00:03:40,960 Speaker 1: believe that they can take be violent towards women to 75 00:03:41,000 --> 00:03:43,520 Speaker 1: get what they want, I think it's rape culture in 76 00:03:43,560 --> 00:03:46,200 Speaker 1: another form, and I think it's very worrying, and it's 77 00:03:46,480 --> 00:03:49,760 Speaker 1: and it is maximized through the Internet. So it's easy 78 00:03:49,800 --> 00:03:53,800 Speaker 1: to blame the internet, but it's definitely very very scary 79 00:03:53,880 --> 00:03:57,920 Speaker 1: when people lose touch with their with other people and 80 00:03:57,960 --> 00:04:02,040 Speaker 1: lose their relationships in society, but resorts to watching things 81 00:04:02,040 --> 00:04:05,200 Speaker 1: of the internet that that validates that kind of violence. 82 00:04:05,480 --> 00:04:07,840 Speaker 1: I mean, I mean the whole thing and what happened 83 00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:10,280 Speaker 1: in America and what is happening in America is society 84 00:04:10,320 --> 00:04:13,720 Speaker 1: and meltdown and it's it's really disturbing to watch it. 85 00:04:13,760 --> 00:04:17,240 Speaker 1: And the amount of violence against immigrants which is validated 86 00:04:17,240 --> 00:04:19,880 Speaker 1: by the government is not helping. So you've got this. 87 00:04:20,040 --> 00:04:22,280 Speaker 1: There's not only are people on the internet in rooms 88 00:04:22,400 --> 00:04:25,760 Speaker 1: kind of fucking up violence ideas, but there's also states 89 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:29,600 Speaker 1: that are advocating for violent solutions. And I think that's really, 90 00:04:29,600 --> 00:04:31,800 Speaker 1: really scary. And I can't say that our history makes 91 00:04:31,839 --> 00:04:35,039 Speaker 1: me feel confident that we are we have we have 92 00:04:35,279 --> 00:04:39,000 Speaker 1: underpendings and violence. This country was colonized and built on violence. 93 00:04:39,160 --> 00:04:42,720 Speaker 1: The trauma of that our historical process is still with us. 94 00:04:43,040 --> 00:04:45,760 Speaker 1: And then you get the Internet kind of making it worse. 95 00:04:46,240 --> 00:04:50,039 Speaker 1: So yeah, it is. It is. It's important to ask 96 00:04:50,080 --> 00:04:52,360 Speaker 1: the question if you're going to have a conversation about violence, 97 00:04:52,400 --> 00:04:54,840 Speaker 1: you have to go to cause and not just the 98 00:04:55,200 --> 00:04:57,960 Speaker 1: kind of click date of statistics. What is the cause 99 00:04:58,279 --> 00:05:00,599 Speaker 1: of people talking like this? It's not just a stitch. 100 00:05:01,040 --> 00:05:02,480 Speaker 2: Catherine as good to talk to you. Thank you very much, 101 00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:04,000 Speaker 2: Catherine Della Hunting, former MP. 102 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:08,160 Speaker 1: For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to 103 00:05:08,279 --> 00:05:11,320 Speaker 1: News Talks it B from four pm weekdays, or follow 104 00:05:11,320 --> 00:05:13,120 Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio.