1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:01,840 Speaker 1: We've got a new clause and the gang law members 2 00:00:01,920 --> 00:00:04,120 Speaker 1: could have patches banned in their own homes. So the 3 00:00:04,200 --> 00:00:07,520 Speaker 1: changes of the Gang's Bill make it illegal for repeater 4 00:00:07,600 --> 00:00:10,360 Speaker 1: fenders to have insignia at their usual place of residence. 5 00:00:10,400 --> 00:00:12,399 Speaker 1: The Law Society's not thrilled about this. They think it's 6 00:00:12,440 --> 00:00:15,000 Speaker 1: been rush. Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith with us Paul Morning, 7 00:00:15,840 --> 00:00:17,720 Speaker 1: A good morning. How are you you say what to 8 00:00:17,760 --> 00:00:18,760 Speaker 1: the law society? 9 00:00:19,920 --> 00:00:22,640 Speaker 2: Oh? Look, I mean the their job to raise issues, 10 00:00:22,680 --> 00:00:24,639 Speaker 2: But we made no apologies for the fact that we 11 00:00:24,680 --> 00:00:27,639 Speaker 2: want to give the police extra tools to deal with 12 00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:31,680 Speaker 2: gang members who are making life miserable for many New Zealanders. 13 00:00:31,680 --> 00:00:34,280 Speaker 2: So we're less worried about the rights of the gang 14 00:00:34,320 --> 00:00:37,080 Speaker 2: members than we are about the rights of ordinary citizens 15 00:00:37,120 --> 00:00:40,120 Speaker 2: to go about without fear and intimidation in their communities. 16 00:00:40,320 --> 00:00:42,960 Speaker 1: Where did the specific bit come from and why so late? 17 00:00:44,360 --> 00:00:46,519 Speaker 2: Well, I mean it was through the Select committee process. 18 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:50,600 Speaker 2: Questions were raised about how do you deal with people 19 00:00:50,600 --> 00:00:55,000 Speaker 2: who just platantly, blatantly disregard the law, And so all 20 00:00:55,000 --> 00:00:58,520 Speaker 2: we're doing is saying that if you are convicted three 21 00:00:58,640 --> 00:01:03,080 Speaker 2: times of wearing the gang patch in public, then there's 22 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:06,160 Speaker 2: an escalating consequence for that, and the consequences that you 23 00:01:06,200 --> 00:01:08,920 Speaker 2: get a band not only in public but in your 24 00:01:08,920 --> 00:01:12,240 Speaker 2: private home and if the police suspect they can go 25 00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:15,080 Speaker 2: and search for it. And so that's just an escalating 26 00:01:15,120 --> 00:01:17,800 Speaker 2: consequences for what we hope will be only a very 27 00:01:17,800 --> 00:01:19,360 Speaker 2: small group of repeat offenders. 28 00:01:19,360 --> 00:01:21,000 Speaker 1: Well I was going to say, how enforceable is it? 29 00:01:22,120 --> 00:01:26,680 Speaker 2: Well, it is very enforceable, and so we're about giving 30 00:01:26,680 --> 00:01:28,400 Speaker 2: the police the tools that they need. And this is 31 00:01:28,440 --> 00:01:31,120 Speaker 2: part of the Boarder context, which is around non dispersal 32 00:01:31,240 --> 00:01:34,040 Speaker 2: orders and breaking up areas of gangs, making it an 33 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:38,000 Speaker 2: aggravating factor dealing with tougher firearms laws. I mean, the 34 00:01:38,040 --> 00:01:41,280 Speaker 2: reality is it's obvious to everybody who's listening that we've 35 00:01:41,319 --> 00:01:43,800 Speaker 2: seen over the last six years big increase in gang 36 00:01:43,920 --> 00:01:47,440 Speaker 2: membership and intimidation. And so we've got to have some 37 00:01:47,520 --> 00:01:49,200 Speaker 2: extra tools to fight back. And that's what we're going 38 00:01:49,240 --> 00:01:49,840 Speaker 2: to give the police. 39 00:01:49,880 --> 00:01:51,760 Speaker 1: In practical terms, I should have asked in a different 40 00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:53,840 Speaker 1: way when I say enforcible. Of course, the laws enforceable, 41 00:01:53,880 --> 00:01:56,360 Speaker 1: But do they have the resource to knock on somebody's 42 00:01:56,400 --> 00:01:58,360 Speaker 1: window and go, haha, I see you in the lounge 43 00:01:58,360 --> 00:02:00,480 Speaker 1: there with a gang patch? Is this just something that 44 00:02:00,520 --> 00:02:02,520 Speaker 1: they can add to the charge sheet at the end 45 00:02:02,520 --> 00:02:03,960 Speaker 1: of the day when they round them up and raid 46 00:02:04,000 --> 00:02:04,440 Speaker 1: their house. 47 00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:09,959 Speaker 2: Well, no, I mean what it's about is giving them, 48 00:02:10,280 --> 00:02:12,680 Speaker 2: the police that option to deal with what we think 49 00:02:12,720 --> 00:02:14,280 Speaker 2: will be a small group of people who say, well, 50 00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:16,360 Speaker 2: stuff you, I'm just going to wear my patch and 51 00:02:16,360 --> 00:02:18,120 Speaker 2: I'll pay my fine and I'll keep on doing it. 52 00:02:18,639 --> 00:02:21,800 Speaker 2: And that would make it would undermine the purpose of 53 00:02:21,800 --> 00:02:24,200 Speaker 2: the bill, and that's why we got that feedback during 54 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:26,359 Speaker 2: a Select committee and so bringing in this extra tool 55 00:02:26,760 --> 00:02:28,800 Speaker 2: to give the police extra powers to deal with that 56 00:02:28,800 --> 00:02:30,399 Speaker 2: small number of repeat offenders. 57 00:02:30,440 --> 00:02:32,480 Speaker 1: Have you been surprised at the amount of pushback you've 58 00:02:32,480 --> 00:02:34,760 Speaker 1: got on this for something that you would think that 59 00:02:34,840 --> 00:02:37,160 Speaker 1: most New Zealanders are on board with, and I think 60 00:02:37,200 --> 00:02:40,239 Speaker 1: they are. There seems to be a coterie of people 61 00:02:40,240 --> 00:02:44,840 Speaker 1: whose life, life's calling appears to be to push back 62 00:02:44,880 --> 00:02:46,040 Speaker 1: on everything you're trying. 63 00:02:48,440 --> 00:02:50,799 Speaker 2: No, I'm not surprised. I mean we have, I think 64 00:02:50,880 --> 00:02:53,679 Speaker 2: labored under a bit of a culture of excuses when 65 00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:58,200 Speaker 2: it comes to law and disorder, where it's everybody else's 66 00:02:58,200 --> 00:03:02,160 Speaker 2: fault for people causing on our streets and violence, and 67 00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:04,720 Speaker 2: we just don't accept that principle. We think people are 68 00:03:04,760 --> 00:03:07,079 Speaker 2: responsible for their actions and they need to be held 69 00:03:07,120 --> 00:03:09,240 Speaker 2: to account and we need to give the police the 70 00:03:09,280 --> 00:03:12,639 Speaker 2: tools to deal with the very small section of society 71 00:03:12,680 --> 00:03:13,640 Speaker 2: that's causing mayhem. 72 00:03:13,720 --> 00:03:15,800 Speaker 1: Good stuff, Paul appreciate it very much for Paul Goldsmith, 73 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:16,840 Speaker 1: who's the Justice Minister. 74 00:03:17,360 --> 00:03:20,240 Speaker 2: For more from The mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to 75 00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:23,440 Speaker 2: news talks that'd be from six am weekdays, or follow 76 00:03:23,480 --> 00:03:25,040 Speaker 2: the podcast on iHeartRadio.