1 00:00:06,667 --> 00:00:10,467 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine 2 00:00:10,707 --> 00:00:11,787 Speaker 1: from newstalk ZEDB. 3 00:00:12,787 --> 00:00:16,947 Speaker 2: James, as always have provided some incredibly thrilling moments of 4 00:00:16,987 --> 00:00:19,427 Speaker 2: tension and excitement. You look at the TV coverage, it's 5 00:00:19,427 --> 00:00:23,747 Speaker 2: all about slow motion replays, athletes with joy and pain 6 00:00:23,827 --> 00:00:26,147 Speaker 2: on their faces, shots of fans in the stands roaring 7 00:00:26,187 --> 00:00:29,507 Speaker 2: with happiness or sometimes with despair. The Olympics for most 8 00:00:29,547 --> 00:00:32,867 Speaker 2: of us, are about emotion, but really that is for us, 9 00:00:32,907 --> 00:00:36,907 Speaker 2: the fans. So how challenging are pinnacle events for coaches 10 00:00:36,907 --> 00:00:40,707 Speaker 2: and athletes as they try to manage the emotion of 11 00:00:40,747 --> 00:00:44,267 Speaker 2: these occasions. Coaching Guruwayne Goldsmith joins us when you sent 12 00:00:44,307 --> 00:00:47,427 Speaker 2: me a great line on this. If you don't control 13 00:00:47,467 --> 00:00:50,227 Speaker 2: the emotion of the moment, the emotion of the moment 14 00:00:50,587 --> 00:00:54,827 Speaker 2: will control you. So how do athletes and coaches best 15 00:00:54,947 --> 00:00:57,067 Speaker 2: control the emotion of the moment. 16 00:00:58,267 --> 00:01:03,387 Speaker 3: Well, it's the same as everything, pointy. It's practicing and rehearsing, 17 00:01:03,547 --> 00:01:08,667 Speaker 3: training in difficult and challenging situations and to expect that 18 00:01:08,667 --> 00:01:12,827 Speaker 3: that's the environment that you're heading into. And I think 19 00:01:13,107 --> 00:01:15,027 Speaker 3: there was a great line during the week talking to 20 00:01:15,027 --> 00:01:17,867 Speaker 3: one I'm a coaching buddies from the village during the 21 00:01:17,867 --> 00:01:20,307 Speaker 3: week he said, you know, the thing about the Olympics 22 00:01:20,467 --> 00:01:24,267 Speaker 3: is it's the Olympics. But what do you mean by that? 23 00:01:24,427 --> 00:01:28,667 Speaker 3: Was it's such a unique environment and it's all based 24 00:01:28,747 --> 00:01:32,027 Speaker 3: on let's get people excited, let's get the fans engaged 25 00:01:32,107 --> 00:01:35,547 Speaker 3: with watching, let's get more bites on social media and 26 00:01:35,587 --> 00:01:38,827 Speaker 3: all that's driven by emotion. But then when you're standing 27 00:01:38,827 --> 00:01:41,467 Speaker 3: behind the blocks or when you're running out the play seventh, 28 00:01:41,587 --> 00:01:44,867 Speaker 3: it's how do I manage my emotion because I don't 29 00:01:44,907 --> 00:01:46,907 Speaker 3: want to be excited, and I don't want to be stressed, 30 00:01:47,307 --> 00:01:48,947 Speaker 3: and I don't want to be angry, and I don't 31 00:01:48,947 --> 00:01:51,227 Speaker 3: want to be overthinking. I just want to do the 32 00:01:51,387 --> 00:01:54,667 Speaker 3: job that I've trained to do. I feel like it's 33 00:01:54,667 --> 00:01:57,107 Speaker 3: almost the opposite. It's at the opposite end of the spectrum. 34 00:01:57,147 --> 00:01:59,787 Speaker 3: It's those get the fans excited and the parents excited, 35 00:01:59,827 --> 00:02:03,747 Speaker 3: and there's schools excited. Let's get everybody excited and pumped 36 00:02:03,747 --> 00:02:06,827 Speaker 3: and revved up for the athletes, and which is it's 37 00:02:06,867 --> 00:02:08,507 Speaker 3: completely the opposite. 38 00:02:08,667 --> 00:02:11,067 Speaker 2: So it's really, I guess, preparing yourself for what you're 39 00:02:11,107 --> 00:02:14,587 Speaker 2: about to face. So in that regard, Wayne should training 40 00:02:14,667 --> 00:02:18,747 Speaker 2: and preparing for the Olympics be as hard, as stressful, 41 00:02:18,987 --> 00:02:22,467 Speaker 2: as challenging, if not more so than you expect the 42 00:02:22,467 --> 00:02:23,467 Speaker 2: event itself to be. 43 00:02:24,867 --> 00:02:28,387 Speaker 3: Look, and it's an interesting discussion to have party because 44 00:02:28,667 --> 00:02:30,787 Speaker 3: I think a lot of people when you talk like this, 45 00:02:31,627 --> 00:02:34,267 Speaker 3: they misinterpret and say, oh, your meaning, We've got to be, 46 00:02:34,347 --> 00:02:37,347 Speaker 3: you know, ruthless and hard, like you know the classic 47 00:02:37,387 --> 00:02:40,747 Speaker 3: coaches of the nineteen seventies standing and yelling and screaming 48 00:02:40,787 --> 00:02:44,267 Speaker 3: and barking at people. That's not it at all. What 49 00:02:44,307 --> 00:02:46,107 Speaker 3: it is is saying, look, we're going to go into 50 00:02:46,187 --> 00:02:49,627 Speaker 3: an environment which is going to be mentally really difficult, 51 00:02:49,627 --> 00:02:54,467 Speaker 3: emotionally challenging, physically beyond anything that we've experienced in our lives. 52 00:02:55,187 --> 00:02:59,707 Speaker 3: We can't rely on wishing, hoping, prayer and luck. With 53 00:02:59,787 --> 00:03:03,467 Speaker 3: no disrespect to people with faith, we can't rely on 54 00:03:03,547 --> 00:03:05,827 Speaker 3: those things to get us across the line. So what 55 00:03:05,907 --> 00:03:09,867 Speaker 3: I find people will go to national championships in New 56 00:03:09,987 --> 00:03:13,387 Speaker 3: Zealand and I'll say, look, we'll train about ninety five 57 00:03:13,507 --> 00:03:16,667 Speaker 3: percent ninety eight percent of what we know we're going 58 00:03:16,707 --> 00:03:18,387 Speaker 3: to have to do when we get there, and then 59 00:03:18,427 --> 00:03:21,707 Speaker 3: when we get there, what I call the sport fairy 60 00:03:21,827 --> 00:03:26,667 Speaker 3: arrives and sprinkles ferry dust, and all of a sudden, miraculously, magically, 61 00:03:27,187 --> 00:03:29,987 Speaker 3: that extra two to five percent will just appear as 62 00:03:30,027 --> 00:03:33,227 Speaker 3: if sprinkled by ferry dust. And there is no Olympic ferry. 63 00:03:33,347 --> 00:03:36,667 Speaker 3: There is no magical force that turns up on the 64 00:03:36,707 --> 00:03:40,067 Speaker 3: day and says, okay, you've only prepared ninety eight percent 65 00:03:40,107 --> 00:03:43,387 Speaker 3: of this environment. You're going to be given. You're going 66 00:03:43,427 --> 00:03:46,947 Speaker 3: to find somehow these extra two to five percent because 67 00:03:46,987 --> 00:03:49,667 Speaker 3: you're a lucky person. We don't rely on those as 68 00:03:49,707 --> 00:03:54,067 Speaker 3: winning strategies. So in effect, and it was explaining to 69 00:03:54,067 --> 00:03:56,867 Speaker 3: me a long time ago a very very good successful coach, 70 00:03:57,347 --> 00:04:00,547 Speaker 3: he said, the majority of people train at a level 71 00:04:00,827 --> 00:04:04,307 Speaker 3: below the Olympic Games, and then wish and hope and 72 00:04:04,387 --> 00:04:07,347 Speaker 3: pray and like candles and do all those things that 73 00:04:07,387 --> 00:04:10,387 Speaker 3: they hope will give them the answer they want. The 74 00:04:10,427 --> 00:04:13,267 Speaker 3: one who win train and prepare at one hundred and 75 00:04:13,347 --> 00:04:16,787 Speaker 3: two percent. And these figures are obviously just arbitrary, but 76 00:04:16,827 --> 00:04:19,267 Speaker 3: to illustrate the point, he said, they train at a 77 00:04:19,347 --> 00:04:23,387 Speaker 3: level above the level they'll expect when they go into 78 00:04:23,427 --> 00:04:26,707 Speaker 3: the games, and in effect, they drop into the games, 79 00:04:26,707 --> 00:04:30,587 Speaker 3: they drop down into the environment, and the experienced coaches 80 00:04:30,587 --> 00:04:34,227 Speaker 3: and athletes get it the first time, is rarely understand that. 81 00:04:35,027 --> 00:04:38,267 Speaker 2: So in that regard them when you are preparing. Can 82 00:04:38,347 --> 00:04:43,427 Speaker 2: a coach provide an environment where athletes can be disappointed, 83 00:04:43,747 --> 00:04:47,467 Speaker 2: can be nervous, can be stressed, and therefore learn how 84 00:04:47,467 --> 00:04:50,427 Speaker 2: to manage their emotions once they get to a competition. 85 00:04:50,507 --> 00:04:51,947 Speaker 2: Can you replicate that in training? 86 00:04:53,027 --> 00:04:55,387 Speaker 3: It's more difficult with the Olympics than it is with 87 00:04:55,467 --> 00:04:58,467 Speaker 3: anything else, because, as my buddy said, the problem with 88 00:04:58,507 --> 00:05:00,827 Speaker 3: the Olympics, he said it to the Olympics, and there 89 00:05:00,867 --> 00:05:04,827 Speaker 3: isn't a lot like it. But you can teach the principles. 90 00:05:05,267 --> 00:05:08,627 Speaker 3: So quite often say, working with young athletes, one of 91 00:05:08,667 --> 00:05:11,107 Speaker 3: the principles will do is take them to a competition 92 00:05:11,707 --> 00:05:14,587 Speaker 3: where it's going to be nearly impossible for them to lose, 93 00:05:14,987 --> 00:05:17,947 Speaker 3: where to win it's going to be very, very difficult. 94 00:05:18,027 --> 00:05:20,627 Speaker 3: So they might be fourteen or fifteen, and they may 95 00:05:20,747 --> 00:05:23,667 Speaker 3: race against sixteen seventeen year old kids a little bit 96 00:05:23,707 --> 00:05:27,507 Speaker 3: older that are a lot better. And even though the 97 00:05:27,627 --> 00:05:30,547 Speaker 3: physical performance you go, well, they couldn't beat those kids, 98 00:05:31,107 --> 00:05:34,467 Speaker 3: but you work with them on dealing with managing and 99 00:05:34,547 --> 00:05:37,787 Speaker 3: learning from how they feel. So they might come back 100 00:05:37,827 --> 00:05:39,747 Speaker 3: and say, oh, man, I got beaten by eight meters. There. 101 00:05:40,387 --> 00:05:43,547 Speaker 3: You know those guys danced around me in that seventh tournament. 102 00:05:43,867 --> 00:05:45,587 Speaker 3: They say, okay, how did you feel about it? Oh? 103 00:05:45,627 --> 00:05:49,307 Speaker 3: I felt angry, I felt stressed, and I felt disappointed 104 00:05:49,347 --> 00:05:51,427 Speaker 3: for us. Okay, now, how can we manage that? How 105 00:05:51,427 --> 00:05:53,827 Speaker 3: can I give you the tools? How can I teach 106 00:05:53,827 --> 00:05:58,627 Speaker 3: you the skills to deal with frustration and emotion and difficulty. 107 00:05:58,787 --> 00:06:01,547 Speaker 3: And because as you know, and we've talked about this 108 00:06:01,587 --> 00:06:06,427 Speaker 3: before about moving on in football codes, is that what 109 00:06:06,467 --> 00:06:10,027 Speaker 3: we know is that if you don't manage that emotion. 110 00:06:10,507 --> 00:06:12,827 Speaker 3: So if you're in a sevens, as a classic example, 111 00:06:13,147 --> 00:06:15,707 Speaker 3: a try scored against you because you've had a defensive 112 00:06:15,787 --> 00:06:20,387 Speaker 3: lap a lapse. If the emotions like frustration and anger 113 00:06:20,467 --> 00:06:23,547 Speaker 3: and disappointment of those things are still there, you might 114 00:06:23,627 --> 00:06:26,987 Speaker 3: let in another try because not only have you had 115 00:06:27,027 --> 00:06:30,787 Speaker 3: a defensive lap laps, your emotions are now managing your 116 00:06:30,827 --> 00:06:34,987 Speaker 3: performance to the point where it's highly likely it's going 117 00:06:35,067 --> 00:06:37,307 Speaker 3: to happen again. And you've only going to watch NRL 118 00:06:37,387 --> 00:06:39,987 Speaker 3: and Super Rugby a few rounds to see that. If 119 00:06:40,027 --> 00:06:42,147 Speaker 3: they see a player that's dropped the ball, drop the 120 00:06:42,187 --> 00:06:44,427 Speaker 3: high ball, that's who they pepper for the rest of 121 00:06:44,467 --> 00:06:47,827 Speaker 3: the game because they're going hang on. Not only do 122 00:06:47,947 --> 00:06:51,587 Speaker 3: they miss that ball, chances are they're still carrying the 123 00:06:51,707 --> 00:06:55,387 Speaker 3: negative emotions that have risen from making that mistake. Maybe 124 00:06:55,427 --> 00:06:59,347 Speaker 3: we can do it again and really capitalize. So, you know, 125 00:06:59,467 --> 00:07:03,227 Speaker 3: even at a relatively young age teenagers, and of course 126 00:07:03,547 --> 00:07:05,947 Speaker 3: goes without saying we do this ethically, we do it 127 00:07:05,987 --> 00:07:10,427 Speaker 3: safe to teach lessons about how can they learn to 128 00:07:10,587 --> 00:07:13,347 Speaker 3: manage the emotions they're feeling so that when they get 129 00:07:13,387 --> 00:07:16,387 Speaker 3: to a big crunch moment like in Olympic Games, they've 130 00:07:16,387 --> 00:07:20,827 Speaker 3: had years and years of going through and experiencing emotion 131 00:07:21,387 --> 00:07:24,947 Speaker 3: and managing them and still continuing to do their job. 132 00:07:25,027 --> 00:07:27,707 Speaker 3: And Tony, in fact, when people ask me, what's mental toughness, 133 00:07:27,747 --> 00:07:31,467 Speaker 3: so I say, mental toughness is your ability to continue 134 00:07:31,507 --> 00:07:34,387 Speaker 3: to do the job that you've trained to do, no 135 00:07:34,387 --> 00:07:37,027 Speaker 3: matter what happens to you or what's happening around you 136 00:07:37,627 --> 00:07:41,067 Speaker 3: in competition. Because that's the crunch. That's where we're trying 137 00:07:41,107 --> 00:07:41,507 Speaker 3: to get to. 138 00:07:42,067 --> 00:07:45,667 Speaker 2: Incredible device. The enormity of these events, as you've said, 139 00:07:45,707 --> 00:07:47,827 Speaker 2: the Olympics, the problem with the Olympics is that they're 140 00:07:47,907 --> 00:07:50,627 Speaker 2: the Olympics. There they're a pinnacle for many of the 141 00:07:50,667 --> 00:07:55,467 Speaker 2: athletes there. I'd imagine that could be overwhelming but also motivational. 142 00:07:55,707 --> 00:07:58,187 Speaker 2: Is there any way to tippet in favor of the 143 00:07:58,307 --> 00:08:01,067 Speaker 2: latter apart from some of the stuff you've already talked about. 144 00:08:01,467 --> 00:08:06,707 Speaker 3: Oh, but that's a wonderful question. The God, I don't 145 00:08:06,747 --> 00:08:09,667 Speaker 3: have the converse, the obverse, the reverse. I don't do 146 00:08:09,787 --> 00:08:14,427 Speaker 3: versus that. It's it's the opposite to that is learning 147 00:08:14,467 --> 00:08:17,747 Speaker 3: to manage. First of all, I can manage negativity and 148 00:08:17,787 --> 00:08:23,227 Speaker 3: frustration and anger and expectation, all those things. The other 149 00:08:23,307 --> 00:08:26,147 Speaker 3: side is is to look at it and go, this 150 00:08:26,227 --> 00:08:29,707 Speaker 3: is my environment. I've trained for this environment. I love 151 00:08:29,827 --> 00:08:33,387 Speaker 3: this environment. I get excited about this environment. You know. 152 00:08:33,467 --> 00:08:36,147 Speaker 3: And I've met a lot of athletes over the years 153 00:08:36,347 --> 00:08:41,227 Speaker 3: who look at big competitions with dread pointing because it's like, oh, 154 00:08:41,347 --> 00:08:43,747 Speaker 3: you know, it's all on the line and it's going 155 00:08:43,827 --> 00:08:46,107 Speaker 3: to be tough. And they look at and I've met 156 00:08:46,267 --> 00:08:49,667 Speaker 3: shesked as many, particularly the successful ones, and go, man, 157 00:08:49,747 --> 00:08:52,587 Speaker 3: I don't wait, let's go, let's go. Let's get into 158 00:08:52,587 --> 00:08:54,787 Speaker 3: the Olympics. Let's get into the village. I want to 159 00:08:54,787 --> 00:08:57,427 Speaker 3: get into that environment for the I want to feel 160 00:08:57,467 --> 00:09:01,187 Speaker 3: the emotion and some people thrive and feed off it. 161 00:09:01,387 --> 00:09:05,907 Speaker 3: They they drag the energy from the crowd particularly, and 162 00:09:06,547 --> 00:09:10,107 Speaker 3: they all love it. And that comes down to preparation. 163 00:09:10,347 --> 00:09:12,747 Speaker 3: I know when I talk to kids and I say, 164 00:09:12,907 --> 00:09:15,707 Speaker 3: have you ever gone into an exam feeling really stressed 165 00:09:16,027 --> 00:09:18,027 Speaker 3: and really worried? And I say, yes, we have. Wayne, 166 00:09:18,067 --> 00:09:20,587 Speaker 3: I'd say, why were you stressed and worried? And I 167 00:09:20,587 --> 00:09:23,187 Speaker 3: said because I didn't do enough study. And I said, 168 00:09:23,267 --> 00:09:26,547 Speaker 3: right now, take that into your sport. The main reason 169 00:09:27,027 --> 00:09:30,747 Speaker 3: that you're feeling stressed and you're not excited and invigorated 170 00:09:30,787 --> 00:09:34,667 Speaker 3: by the environment is you haven't done the preparation. Because 171 00:09:34,707 --> 00:09:38,027 Speaker 3: I promise you, if you walk into an environment and go, man, 172 00:09:38,067 --> 00:09:40,667 Speaker 3: I am ready, there's nothing I could have done better 173 00:09:40,667 --> 00:09:43,667 Speaker 3: with my eating, my sleeping, my training, my gym work, 174 00:09:43,747 --> 00:09:48,187 Speaker 3: my hydration, there's nothing I could do better. It becomes 175 00:09:48,227 --> 00:09:52,907 Speaker 3: an exciting, a wonderful moment. If you're walking in going oh, yeah, 176 00:09:52,987 --> 00:09:55,067 Speaker 3: I know, maybe I didn't do this and I didn't 177 00:09:55,067 --> 00:09:58,627 Speaker 3: come from that, and there's holes everywhere, then you quite 178 00:09:58,747 --> 00:10:02,307 Speaker 3: rightly get a little bit nervous and stressed and frustrated. 179 00:10:02,347 --> 00:10:04,227 Speaker 3: And that's when you've really got to have the management 180 00:10:04,267 --> 00:10:05,827 Speaker 3: tools to deal with those emotions. 181 00:10:06,427 --> 00:10:09,387 Speaker 2: Always such an education listening to your Wayne, Thanks for 182 00:10:09,427 --> 00:10:12,307 Speaker 2: taking the time. As always. Let's catch up again next 183 00:10:12,307 --> 00:10:14,667 Speaker 2: weekend as the Olympics come to a close. I'm sure 184 00:10:14,667 --> 00:10:17,227 Speaker 2: there'll be more lessons for you to impart to us. 185 00:10:17,507 --> 00:10:19,347 Speaker 3: Well, I'm going to force myself now to go and 186 00:10:19,387 --> 00:10:21,907 Speaker 3: walk along Evan's Head beach and have a coffee and 187 00:10:22,147 --> 00:10:23,827 Speaker 3: baking an egg roll at the end, Pony say, but 188 00:10:23,827 --> 00:10:25,387 Speaker 3: it's a tough on. Someone's got to do it. 189 00:10:26,307 --> 00:10:28,507 Speaker 2: Good on you, Wayne, and catch you again soon, say 190 00:10:28,547 --> 00:10:31,547 Speaker 2: on mate, fake Bobby, that's my goldspitt Offer a bacon 191 00:10:31,627 --> 00:10:32,587 Speaker 2: roll on the cup of coffee. 192 00:10:32,987 --> 00:10:33,267 Speaker 3: Love it. 193 00:10:33,747 --> 00:10:37,267 Speaker 2: If you want to read more of Wayne's amazing wisdom, 194 00:10:37,587 --> 00:10:41,947 Speaker 2: his website is WG coaching dot com. WG coaching dot com. 195 00:10:41,987 --> 00:10:44,867 Speaker 2: He's also across social media Wayne Goldsmith. 196 00:10:45,507 --> 00:10:48,707 Speaker 1: For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Fine, listen live 197 00:10:48,787 --> 00:10:52,187 Speaker 1: to news Talks edb weekends from midday, or follow the 198 00:10:52,267 --> 00:10:53,707 Speaker 1: podcast on iHeartRadio.