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Speaker 1: On the huddle with me this evening. We got Clear

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Speaker 1: Delord journalist and Jack Tame host a Q and A

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Speaker 1: in Saturday mornings. Hello you too, Hello there, Gilda Claire.

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Speaker 1: Were you surprised by the cut in the ocr I.

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Speaker 2: Didn't know whether it would have happen or not, because

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Speaker 2: I listened to everybody, and who knows. I mean, the

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Speaker 2: pundits seem to be evenly split. But I do know

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Speaker 2: that there are lots of small businesses particularly and people

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Speaker 2: with mortgages utterly relieved that it's heading in the right direct.

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Speaker 1: Reason I ask you that is because it feels like

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Speaker 1: it goes against Adrian's personality, right, because he's so he

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Speaker 1: I mean, I just say it. He's egotistical, right, And

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Speaker 1: this is an admission of an error. So I was

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Speaker 1: really surprised he did it.

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Speaker 2: Well, you know, you can only keep digging so far. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: and you have to just stop. And I don't follow

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Speaker 2: Adrian or as closely as you do or Jack, but

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Speaker 2: it does seem that he's had to reverse gear and

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Speaker 2: about time.

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Speaker 1: And for that, Jack, he actually deserves a massive bouquet,

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Speaker 1: doesn't he.

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Speaker 3: Well, yeah, I just feel like with all of the

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Speaker 3: decisions I want to reserve judgment another six or twelve

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Speaker 3: months until we see the full scale of the impacts.

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Speaker 3: And this is the problem I I mean, of course,

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Speaker 3: as a mortgage holder, I am relieved to see the

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Speaker 3: ocr heading in a more favorable direction. It's going to

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Speaker 3: take away while until we kind of see the full

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Speaker 3: impact of that. But you know, there were some pretty

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Speaker 3: gloomy news in that, you know in the MPs today

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Speaker 3: as well, potentially another different recession, unemployment higher than it

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Speaker 3: was previously going to be. So yeah, as pleased as

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Speaker 3: I am it's seeing the ICR at five point two

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Speaker 3: five as opposed to five point five, I'm not exactly

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Speaker 3: having a massive party to celebrate tonight, Claire.

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Speaker 1: I reckon it's going to change the mood just a

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Speaker 1: little bit, just because we know now it's in one direction.

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Speaker 2: Well, you'd have to hope it would, because it's actually

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Speaker 2: quite gloomy out there, it really is, and for some

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Speaker 2: businesses particularly it's not just Auckland, but that's where we

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Speaker 2: happen to be. It's too late. They hung on as

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Speaker 2: long as they could and it's got much and we've

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Speaker 2: seen a lot of closures lately of businesses that would

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Speaker 2: have probably you know, wanted to wait another week but couldn't.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, Jack, Yeah, you say, you say, we know it's

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Speaker 3: heading in one direction, and I just I I hope

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Speaker 3: you're right.

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Speaker 1: Did you get out of the wrong side of bed today?

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Speaker 1: Did you decide? No?

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Speaker 3: No?

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Speaker 2: No.

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Speaker 3: The only reason I'm saying.

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Speaker 1: That is that three hours, Jack, look go back and.

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Speaker 3: Look at the NPS from May Like. The thing I

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Speaker 3: found really hard of the Reserve Bank is, at least

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Speaker 3: to my untrained eye, it does feel like they've kind

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Speaker 3: of lurched in their position over the last.

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Speaker 1: Couple of idiots, Jack, and everybody could see that we

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Speaker 1: were way more stuff. But you can't. You can't. We're

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Speaker 1: in recession for a third time. Go Jack.

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Speaker 3: Sorry, I think I think it would be extremely unlikely

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Speaker 3: and certainly unpopular. All I'm saying is that history has

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Speaker 3: taught me anything. The Reserve Bank, at least to my eye,

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Speaker 3: has lurched in its position like quite recently, and I

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Speaker 3: wouldn't be one hundred percent confident that they wouldn't do

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Speaker 3: it again. That being said, given things are so gloomy

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Speaker 3: right now, Yes, I certainly feel that the weight of

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Speaker 3: likelihood is on a track for us to see you're

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Speaker 3: going to.

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Speaker 1: Have just got a little shandy this evening, Jack, just

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Speaker 1: like a half bear.

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Speaker 3: I'm just I'm not trying to get too excited just yet, Okay.

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Speaker 3: I mean, if you're taking one hundred and fifty basis

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Speaker 3: points out of it, maybe I'd be celebrating a little hard, Claire.

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Speaker 2: I was just going to say, you know, there's been

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Speaker 2: a real attempt by Adrian order to try and make

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Speaker 2: this more cheerful. Yeah, because he said, for example, that

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Speaker 2: it's always dark as before the dawn. Yeah, it's not.

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Speaker 2: That is so wrong, is it not? It is completely wrong.

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Speaker 2: It's always darkest at midnight. And you know, I mean

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Speaker 2: he's clearly trying to makes all feel better. Yes, but

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Speaker 2: that is probably you know, just note to Adrian.

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Speaker 1: Yep. Fair enough. All right, let's take a break, we'll

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Speaker 1: come back. We'll talk about what's going on in health

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Speaker 1: New Zealand and all the other stuff today. Right, you're

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Speaker 1: back with a huddle, Jack Tayman Claid, Lord Jack, Margie

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Speaker 1: up has gone, isn't she?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? It doesn't look great deal. Pretty extraordinary actually to

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Speaker 3: see this kind of level of disconnect between a chair

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Speaker 3: and a CEO like this or commissioner and a CEO

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Speaker 3: rather Yeah, I mean you certainly, you know it speaks

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Speaker 3: to what is obviously like a massive level of disconnection

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Speaker 3: and discontent within Health New Zealand. But I just can't see,

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Speaker 3: given the public nature of this down and their relationship,

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Speaker 3: how that's going to continue.

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Speaker 1: I can't see that she can stay Claire because she

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Speaker 1: must have signed off on those plans to cut five

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Speaker 1: hundred doctors in fifteen hundred nurses, and that is just

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Speaker 1: impossible to comprehend.

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Speaker 2: I don't know that. We don't know that, and I

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Speaker 2: think Lester Levy has poured quite a bit of petrel

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Speaker 2: on to the fire here, and so I'm not so

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Speaker 2: sure Marjorie Oprah is for the hydrump. I do think

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Speaker 2: that what we're seeing is a level of self created

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Speaker 2: chaos within health.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I mean the government has set up said about these reforms.

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Speaker 2: They're doing them so fast, they're stripping out so much

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Speaker 2: so quickly, that this is like a very severe case

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Speaker 2: of speed wobbles, possibly taking out some of the controls,

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Speaker 2: the checks, balances, the handbrakes that you know Winston has

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Speaker 2: referred to in terms of what he did with the

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Speaker 2: previous government in some policies and so something gets through,

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Speaker 2: slips through, and playing it all up publicly is what

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Speaker 2: you would normally not do. You would normally just go

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Speaker 2: and crack heads together. But you know, if the behind

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Speaker 2: the scenes that is but you know, you just think,

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Speaker 2: if you want to get very fast results, you're taking

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Speaker 2: some risks along the way. This is our biggest company, effectively,

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Speaker 2: the whole station sage. Margie Upper as CEO of this

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Speaker 2: has seen god knows how many changes in the time

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Speaker 2: she's been in that job. And I'm not in any

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Speaker 2: way glossing over that paper causing some you know, absolute consternation.

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Speaker 2: I'm not sure the way to handle it though, is

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Speaker 2: to go raging publicly, because there aren't layers of people

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Speaker 2: if she leaves, for example, there are not layers of

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Speaker 2: people left to come up who are as steeped in it.

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Speaker 2: So I think finanally, if they should try.

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Speaker 1: Better to get If you do not believe that that

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Speaker 1: was really happening what was being proposed. Five hundred doctors gone,

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Speaker 1: fifteen hundred nurs has gone, then what do you think

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Speaker 1: the point of that proposal was? Was it an act

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Speaker 1: of resistance? I don't know.

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Speaker 2: In not as less to Levy. He's conceded that yes,

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Speaker 2: but he has also said it was an analogy put

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Speaker 2: together by some finance people who are famously not well

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Speaker 2: known for you know, sort of tact diplomacy necessarily communication skills,

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Speaker 2: or looking at the political fallout. So this is now

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Speaker 2: really highly political as it is very political, and it's

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Speaker 2: going to take I think, getting together with the Minister

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Speaker 2: sorting out lines of accountability. But right now I don't

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Speaker 2: think the losing Margie Alpha would be the best outcome.

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Speaker 3: Oh interesting, I agree with Clear on that point. I

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Speaker 3: just think the relationship thing is just so problematic right,

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Speaker 3: as Clear says, if you if you think about Health

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Speaker 3: New Zealand as our as our largest company, and think

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Speaker 3: about it in those terms, and to see this kind

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Speaker 3: of you know, these two public positions out of Marjiappa

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Speaker 3: and that of Lesta Levy being so kind of publicly opposed,

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Speaker 3: or at the very least the Commission taking such a

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Speaker 3: strong position publicly supposedly against Marjiapa, I mean, that's this

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Speaker 3: deeply unusual. Yeah, and and and surely isn't at all

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Speaker 3: beneficial to the overall organization. It seems extraordinary that these

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Speaker 3: kind of things wouldn't be happening.

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Speaker 1: So Jackie, you're saying there's a difference between what should

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Speaker 1: happen and what is going to happen. What should happen

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Speaker 1: is maybe in your mind she retains the job. What's

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Speaker 1: going to happen is she's going to go.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. I think I think this is the sort of

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Speaker 3: thing that probably needs to go to a minister, and

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Speaker 3: given given the public nature of it, and a minister

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Speaker 3: actually needs to intervene, and as clear he has sought

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Speaker 3: out some really clear lines of not only of communication,

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Speaker 3: but of you know, of responsibility. So you don't actually

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Speaker 3: have these you don't have these two very senior people

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Speaker 3: seemingly working you know, pulling pulling a different direction or

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Speaker 3: working to different ends.

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Speaker 1: Clear, Does somebody need to write to Wellington Council and

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Speaker 1: tell them there's a cost of living crisis going on? Probably?

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Speaker 2: I mean you only go to Wellington, you know, and

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Speaker 2: walk a couple of blocks and you see water pouring

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Speaker 2: up out of the football being wasted. The bicycle wreck

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Speaker 2: seems to be a bit of a Rolls Royce. You

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Speaker 2: don't need a Rolls Royce. If you've got lots of bikes,

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Speaker 2: you can just have a little you know rack, small rack.

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Speaker 1: Those outside Fryburg Pool they've got those meatal racks. You

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Speaker 1: just pop your bike on their chain. It's through the

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Speaker 1: thing done, no problem. There are trees.

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Speaker 2: You can use them in times of surplus. Yes, you

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Speaker 2: have all of these, and it looks neat and tidy,

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Speaker 2: and it's all very state of the art. And you

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Speaker 2: see them in other places. Other places are wealthier than

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Speaker 2: we are right now as a country. We're actually not

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Speaker 2: in cities, major cities are not doing much.

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Speaker 3: Jack.

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Speaker 1: I'm getting a lot of texts saying that these fancy

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Speaker 1: bike racks are all up and down the country, including Auckland.

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Speaker 1: Have you got that? Have you been because you're a

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Speaker 1: bike boy, have you been.

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Speaker 3: Using I'm a very keen cyclist and I cannot say

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Speaker 3: that I've used them. And as a very keen cyclist,

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Speaker 3: I've got to say this kind of thing really annoys

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Speaker 3: me because I think it's a waste of money. Like

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Speaker 3: it doesn't It doesn't do those of us who like cycling.

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Speaker 3: It doesn't do our cause any good to see this

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Speaker 3: kind of profligate spending. As you say, you can just

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Speaker 3: put up a bar, that's that easy, Like how extensive

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Speaker 3: can honestly be to put a steel bar in the

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Speaker 3: ground for us to lock up to the bike. I

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Speaker 3: don't care if my bike is standing up right, or

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Speaker 3: if it's on the side or whatever. I just want

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Speaker 3: to be able to lock it for something. And it's

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Speaker 3: so frustrating to see this kind of thing being financed,

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Speaker 3: like you say, in the middle of the cost of

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Speaker 3: a living crisis, because it just attracts criticism from people

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Speaker 3: who say we shouldn't be putting any money into cycling

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Speaker 3: infrastructure too right.

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Speaker 1: I just want to make it clear this is not

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Speaker 1: a cycling problem, this is a Wellington City Council problem. Jack,

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Speaker 1: Thank you so much appreciated. Jack Tame, host of Q

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Speaker 1: and A and Knows the Saturday Mornings and Clear to

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Speaker 1: Lord Journalist For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive.

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Speaker 3: Listen live to news talks it'd be from four pm weekdays,

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