1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:01,680 Speaker 1: On the huddle with us this evening we have Tris 2 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:04,040 Speaker 1: Sharson of Shearson Willis pr and Jack Tame host Q 3 00:00:04,120 --> 00:00:06,400 Speaker 1: and A and Saturday Mornings on NEWSTALKSZB. Hello you two. 4 00:00:07,400 --> 00:00:08,360 Speaker 2: Hello Trish. 5 00:00:08,400 --> 00:00:10,200 Speaker 1: That energy plans underwhelming, isn't it? 6 00:00:11,520 --> 00:00:18,320 Speaker 3: Oh? I was thinking I heard you mentioned Fraser winner 7 00:00:18,360 --> 00:00:22,160 Speaker 3: a recently and I was reflecting on the opening line 8 00:00:22,400 --> 00:00:24,040 Speaker 3: of one of the lines that he had in his 9 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:28,000 Speaker 3: piece that appeared in the Herald on this and you know, 10 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:33,199 Speaker 3: the statement was that power crises end political careers and 11 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:37,400 Speaker 3: that every politician in New Zealand should be worried about 12 00:00:37,560 --> 00:00:41,239 Speaker 3: keeping the lights on. And I think, you know, the 13 00:00:41,360 --> 00:00:44,599 Speaker 3: difficulty is when you look at the politics of this, 14 00:00:44,960 --> 00:00:50,479 Speaker 3: it feels to me like another potentially lowest common denominator 15 00:00:50,600 --> 00:00:55,520 Speaker 3: outcome because of the tension of the National Party being 16 00:00:55,640 --> 00:01:00,640 Speaker 3: caught between act on one side, who wants to advertise 17 00:01:00,960 --> 00:01:04,680 Speaker 3: the lot in Electricity and New Zealand First on the 18 00:01:04,720 --> 00:01:10,679 Speaker 3: other side, who want to nationalize the lot. So we've 19 00:01:10,920 --> 00:01:13,400 Speaker 3: ended up with a lot of sort of huffing and 20 00:01:13,440 --> 00:01:18,240 Speaker 3: puffing for several months, but nothing really to come out 21 00:01:18,280 --> 00:01:22,640 Speaker 3: of it. And certainly, you know, from from what I 22 00:01:22,720 --> 00:01:27,160 Speaker 3: can see, there is no there's certainly no immediate relief 23 00:01:27,200 --> 00:01:28,839 Speaker 3: to power prices. 24 00:01:29,680 --> 00:01:32,720 Speaker 1: But yeah, carry on, carry on, I'm just. 25 00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:33,080 Speaker 2: Going to say. 26 00:01:33,120 --> 00:01:36,920 Speaker 3: But the other thing to remember is that, in my 27 00:01:37,120 --> 00:01:39,720 Speaker 3: view in New Zealand, in the last sort of five 28 00:01:39,800 --> 00:01:43,600 Speaker 3: or six years, we have fallen into a simplistic trap 29 00:01:43,880 --> 00:01:51,040 Speaker 3: of shouting about structural separation as the as the fix 30 00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:56,240 Speaker 3: to everything. And in this case, there is no evidence 31 00:01:56,360 --> 00:01:59,440 Speaker 3: that that that I can see that the government could 32 00:01:59,480 --> 00:02:03,840 Speaker 3: rely on on if it went down such a sort 33 00:02:03,840 --> 00:02:06,720 Speaker 3: of nuclear option path. There is no evidence to say 34 00:02:06,800 --> 00:02:10,600 Speaker 3: that that in fact would bring power prices down. 35 00:02:10,760 --> 00:02:12,560 Speaker 1: No, I agree with you, Jack, What do you make 36 00:02:12,600 --> 00:02:13,079 Speaker 1: of the whole thing? 37 00:02:13,919 --> 00:02:17,560 Speaker 2: Well, my question is, can either of you name any 38 00:02:18,040 --> 00:02:21,280 Speaker 2: any person with skin in the game, or any group 39 00:02:21,520 --> 00:02:23,519 Speaker 2: that's happy about this? Just seems to me like the 40 00:02:24,200 --> 00:02:26,359 Speaker 2: universal feedback today has been that. 41 00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:33,440 Speaker 1: The gent tailors are stoked, and as are shareholders who 42 00:02:33,440 --> 00:02:35,000 Speaker 1: are happy that the shares went. 43 00:02:34,880 --> 00:02:38,600 Speaker 2: Up fair point, fair point. But certainly the major major 44 00:02:38,800 --> 00:02:42,680 Speaker 2: energy users unhappy. The business groups aren't happy, the unions 45 00:02:42,720 --> 00:02:45,160 Speaker 2: aren't happy. I'm not happy looking at my power bill. 46 00:02:45,200 --> 00:02:49,440 Speaker 2: I mean, it does seem like, at least from the 47 00:02:49,520 --> 00:02:51,360 Speaker 2: changes of announced to day, that there are not going 48 00:02:51,400 --> 00:02:54,639 Speaker 2: to be really significant changes to the cost of electricity 49 00:02:54,680 --> 00:02:58,720 Speaker 2: anytime sometimes, anytime soon. It's pretty obvious. I think that 50 00:02:59,480 --> 00:03:02,200 Speaker 2: we need to find some sort of way to massively 51 00:03:02,240 --> 00:03:05,480 Speaker 2: incentivize generation in a way that it hasn't been generated 52 00:03:05,760 --> 00:03:08,320 Speaker 2: for a long time. Successive governments, I would iag, you've 53 00:03:08,360 --> 00:03:10,760 Speaker 2: been responsible for that. I don't think this is going 54 00:03:10,800 --> 00:03:14,680 Speaker 2: to majorly shift the dial. And I think they're running 55 00:03:14,680 --> 00:03:17,880 Speaker 2: a bit of a delicate political game here, because if 56 00:03:17,880 --> 00:03:19,880 Speaker 2: you look at this, you look at the you know, 57 00:03:20,200 --> 00:03:23,639 Speaker 2: the changes announced by supermarket. Will it's ask the supermarket 58 00:03:23,680 --> 00:03:26,440 Speaker 2: study that kind of thing. If the economy is still 59 00:03:26,480 --> 00:03:29,000 Speaker 2: in a really tough place in eight or ten months time, 60 00:03:29,040 --> 00:03:31,280 Speaker 2: people are feeling the cost of living in a big 61 00:03:31,320 --> 00:03:33,800 Speaker 2: way going into another winter, They'll be looking at the 62 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:35,560 Speaker 2: government and say, hang on, what did you do to 63 00:03:35,640 --> 00:03:38,000 Speaker 2: help me on two of the biggest things that affect 64 00:03:38,040 --> 00:03:40,880 Speaker 2: my cost of living energy prices and food prices. I 65 00:03:40,920 --> 00:03:44,000 Speaker 2: think there is, you know, the potential for some political 66 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:47,440 Speaker 2: vulnerability there. So it's interesting to see, well, Will. 67 00:03:47,360 --> 00:03:53,520 Speaker 3: There's no doubt that one of the outcomes from today's 68 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:58,400 Speaker 3: announcement is that it is really given or really short 69 00:03:58,520 --> 00:04:01,160 Speaker 3: up what I think will be a big election plank 70 00:04:01,200 --> 00:04:04,680 Speaker 3: for New Zealand First next year, you know, and you've 71 00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:09,560 Speaker 3: already heard Shane Jones coming out and sort of talking 72 00:04:10,640 --> 00:04:13,840 Speaker 3: words to that effect. But you know, imagine we're in 73 00:04:14,520 --> 00:04:18,520 Speaker 3: winter next year heading into the election. Things aren't going 74 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:22,719 Speaker 3: well and we've got a dry winter and we're worried 75 00:04:22,720 --> 00:04:25,480 Speaker 3: about keeping the lights on, let alone paying for the power. 76 00:04:26,120 --> 00:04:29,320 Speaker 3: You know, New Zealand First are going to be all over. 77 00:04:29,080 --> 00:04:31,039 Speaker 1: This, Trish. We're going to have a dry winter next winter, 78 00:04:31,080 --> 00:04:36,440 Speaker 1: aren't we? Well I'm not from No No, but we are. 79 00:04:36,640 --> 00:04:37,320 Speaker 1: Why aren't we? 80 00:04:37,960 --> 00:04:42,719 Speaker 3: My powers are? I can't I can't predict that, but no, 81 00:04:42,800 --> 00:04:43,000 Speaker 3: but I. 82 00:04:43,480 --> 00:04:45,360 Speaker 1: Listen to it. Here here my thinking on this at 83 00:04:45,360 --> 00:04:49,120 Speaker 1: the moment. We have had below average snowfall, right, and 84 00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:51,719 Speaker 1: so what happens is that it melts over summer, but 85 00:04:51,720 --> 00:04:53,640 Speaker 1: there's not that much to the hydro dams aren't that 86 00:04:53,680 --> 00:04:56,080 Speaker 1: full next year, So that means we are going we 87 00:04:56,560 --> 00:04:59,719 Speaker 1: like next year might be really hairy. And to your point, Trish, 88 00:05:00,040 --> 00:05:02,039 Speaker 1: actually to Jack's point as well, we're going to go 89 00:05:02,040 --> 00:05:03,760 Speaker 1: into it. We're going to have a stink old winter 90 00:05:03,839 --> 00:05:06,040 Speaker 1: again with all of these mills closing down because the 91 00:05:06,440 --> 00:05:08,400 Speaker 1: energy prices are high and we're going to turn around 92 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:11,160 Speaker 1: and go yeah, and so when Simon announced that thing 93 00:05:11,240 --> 00:05:13,560 Speaker 1: last October, it didn't do anything. What are you guys 94 00:05:13,560 --> 00:05:15,200 Speaker 1: actually doing? Isn't that what's going to happen? 95 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:19,720 Speaker 3: Well? And isn't this? Isn't this the big problem that 96 00:05:19,880 --> 00:05:22,960 Speaker 3: it's hard for New Zealanders to get their head around 97 00:05:23,040 --> 00:05:26,479 Speaker 3: because we are constantly told we are living in a 98 00:05:26,520 --> 00:05:31,160 Speaker 3: country with all of these amazing benefits, including that we 99 00:05:31,279 --> 00:05:36,200 Speaker 3: have all of this renewable energy, and yet we are 100 00:05:36,240 --> 00:05:39,159 Speaker 3: having to deal with the risk that we can't keep 101 00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:42,440 Speaker 3: the lights on through through a winter. And so I 102 00:05:42,760 --> 00:05:46,560 Speaker 3: think for most people that's where this whole issue just 103 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:47,599 Speaker 3: doesn't stat totally. 104 00:05:47,760 --> 00:05:51,480 Speaker 1: Now, Jack, you are my resident climate lovey, So how 105 00:05:51,560 --> 00:05:53,400 Speaker 1: I got to test this with you to just sense 106 00:05:53,520 --> 00:05:54,280 Speaker 1: check with you on this? 107 00:05:55,040 --> 00:05:58,320 Speaker 2: Yeah? You are how much Loda? Yeah? 108 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:00,279 Speaker 3: Giving me an Jack? 109 00:06:00,320 --> 00:06:03,400 Speaker 1: And this chee Jack or now you're now you're turning 110 00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:05,720 Speaker 1: into hypocrite hate No, but listen, how would you how 111 00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:07,960 Speaker 1: much would you flip out if they took electricity out 112 00:06:07,960 --> 00:06:09,960 Speaker 1: of the ets to make it cheap before us? 113 00:06:12,279 --> 00:06:17,200 Speaker 2: I wouldn't be happy about it at all because I think, Yeah, 114 00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:19,560 Speaker 2: I mean, I think the ETS has other problems. 115 00:06:19,920 --> 00:06:21,840 Speaker 1: But then when your power bill came down by I 116 00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:25,080 Speaker 1: don't Let's say your power bill comes down by twenty percent, 117 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:26,480 Speaker 1: fifteen percent. Would you be happy then? 118 00:06:27,200 --> 00:06:28,840 Speaker 2: Yeah? Oh well, I'm sure I would be. I'm sure 119 00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:30,599 Speaker 2: I'd be happy with the with the short term benefit, 120 00:06:30,680 --> 00:06:32,680 Speaker 2: no doubt, But I mean I'd be much happier in 121 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:39,599 Speaker 2: the spirit of a cleaner emissions profile. We massively, massively 122 00:06:39,640 --> 00:06:42,320 Speaker 2: invested in other renewable But Jack, you're. 123 00:06:42,160 --> 00:06:43,520 Speaker 1: Failing to understand the problem. 124 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:45,960 Speaker 2: The problem one line, Give me one line as a 125 00:06:45,960 --> 00:06:48,400 Speaker 2: resident climate lover, and then do you know that the 126 00:06:48,480 --> 00:06:51,640 Speaker 2: world at the moment solar is now so cheap that 127 00:06:51,680 --> 00:06:54,960 Speaker 2: the world is putting on the equivalent and generation capacity 128 00:06:54,960 --> 00:06:58,680 Speaker 2: of Musicaland's entire generation capacity every five and a bit 129 00:06:58,839 --> 00:07:01,200 Speaker 2: days in solarle. 130 00:07:00,760 --> 00:07:03,600 Speaker 1: Our problem is not the renewable stuff every five days. 131 00:07:04,040 --> 00:07:06,720 Speaker 1: Our problem is not renewable. Our problem is firm in capacity, 132 00:07:06,880 --> 00:07:08,720 Speaker 1: which is colon gas. That's our problem. 133 00:07:09,720 --> 00:07:14,520 Speaker 2: That's a problem. But that is no, that's that's for 134 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:17,440 Speaker 2: an energy security perspective, but from but from a getting 135 00:07:17,440 --> 00:07:20,000 Speaker 2: your powerable down perspective, you just need to be generating farm. 136 00:07:20,680 --> 00:07:23,240 Speaker 1: No, it is also your power no, it's also your 137 00:07:23,280 --> 00:07:26,720 Speaker 1: power bill problem. Is it absolutely is? No, it is 138 00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:29,960 Speaker 1: it is your power I have been proven to be 139 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:32,760 Speaker 1: technologically in it today. Do you use your phone to 140 00:07:32,840 --> 00:07:33,520 Speaker 1: pay for things? 141 00:07:34,440 --> 00:07:35,880 Speaker 2: Yeah? Do you not? 142 00:07:36,360 --> 00:07:38,920 Speaker 1: No? No? How long have you been doing this? 143 00:07:39,880 --> 00:07:41,160 Speaker 3: What you don't use? Like? 144 00:07:41,280 --> 00:07:44,160 Speaker 2: You don't have Apple? No? Well? 145 00:07:44,200 --> 00:07:45,559 Speaker 1: Like is that the thing when you put the credit 146 00:07:45,560 --> 00:07:46,720 Speaker 1: card on the phone and then you tap it on 147 00:07:46,760 --> 00:07:47,679 Speaker 1: the f poss machine? 148 00:07:48,080 --> 00:07:49,600 Speaker 2: Do you use the physical critic? 149 00:07:50,040 --> 00:07:53,280 Speaker 1: Yes? No, don't tell me you do this as well. 150 00:07:54,280 --> 00:07:57,240 Speaker 3: I'm surprised you're not Morse coding out the show hither? 151 00:08:01,160 --> 00:08:02,679 Speaker 2: Okay? Are you for real? 152 00:08:03,080 --> 00:08:03,280 Speaker 3: Yes? 153 00:08:03,560 --> 00:08:06,080 Speaker 1: I was shocked, Trish. I was reading today in the 154 00:08:06,120 --> 00:08:08,680 Speaker 1: British papers that fifty percent of the UK adults are 155 00:08:08,680 --> 00:08:10,760 Speaker 1: doing this and in my age bracket is like fifty 156 00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:13,240 Speaker 1: nine and I don't do it and I'm shocked. 157 00:08:14,320 --> 00:08:15,480 Speaker 3: Hey, you need to get that. 158 00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:19,200 Speaker 2: Under you're so enthusiastic about oil and gas. 159 00:08:19,360 --> 00:08:24,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, because can't how I get Okay? All right, guys, 160 00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:26,239 Speaker 1: I feel like it's going to be my task tonight. 161 00:08:26,320 --> 00:08:26,480 Speaker 2: Jack. 162 00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:27,880 Speaker 1: Can you come over and help me with the police. 163 00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:29,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, you could do this. You know. I hate to 164 00:08:29,640 --> 00:08:31,080 Speaker 2: break it to you, but you know the government's got 165 00:08:31,080 --> 00:08:33,760 Speaker 2: some big plans about digital driver's life as well. You 166 00:08:33,840 --> 00:08:35,880 Speaker 2: know it's long you're going to be able to live 167 00:08:35,920 --> 00:08:38,240 Speaker 2: your life with nothing more than that phone in your pocket. 168 00:08:38,320 --> 00:08:40,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, my watch on my wrist, Trish, have you you 169 00:08:40,559 --> 00:08:41,080 Speaker 1: know what here? 170 00:08:41,120 --> 00:08:44,120 Speaker 3: They just go on pop online tonight and sign up 171 00:08:44,120 --> 00:08:45,880 Speaker 3: for one of the senior net classes. 172 00:08:49,080 --> 00:08:51,679 Speaker 1: L Tri, you're a hideous person. Have you got any 173 00:08:51,720 --> 00:08:53,720 Speaker 1: of the Nigel Latter books? Trish? Did you raise your 174 00:08:53,720 --> 00:08:56,080 Speaker 1: son on any of them? 175 00:08:56,520 --> 00:09:00,840 Speaker 3: I have to admit this. I adopted a read nothing 176 00:09:00,920 --> 00:09:05,320 Speaker 3: approach through my entire parenting career, including when I was pregnant, 177 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:11,040 Speaker 3: and I found that a very useful approach because you 178 00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:18,040 Speaker 3: couldn't ever think you were doing anything wrong. But having 179 00:09:18,400 --> 00:09:23,480 Speaker 3: watched some of Nigel's programs, what I really loved about him, 180 00:09:23,480 --> 00:09:26,920 Speaker 3: and I think this is tough to get right, but 181 00:09:27,040 --> 00:09:34,599 Speaker 3: he managed to spire confidence and positivity to parents and 182 00:09:35,040 --> 00:09:38,240 Speaker 3: others and what they were doing without coming across as 183 00:09:38,280 --> 00:09:41,439 Speaker 3: being pious. And maybe that was one of my aversions 184 00:09:41,480 --> 00:09:45,040 Speaker 3: to reading books on these matters, because often they make 185 00:09:45,120 --> 00:09:47,679 Speaker 3: you feel like you're doing everything wrong. And I'm quite 186 00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:50,560 Speaker 3: a sort of a practical person who thinks I'm quite capable, 187 00:09:50,600 --> 00:09:53,360 Speaker 3: but I thought in the way he managed to communicate 188 00:09:53,400 --> 00:09:57,200 Speaker 3: this stuff, it was pretty pretty clever and amazing. 189 00:09:57,960 --> 00:09:59,720 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's a fair point. Jack. Did you 190 00:09:59,720 --> 00:10:01,200 Speaker 1: ever he would have interviewed him, wouldn't you? 191 00:10:02,400 --> 00:10:02,480 Speaker 2: Do? 192 00:10:02,480 --> 00:10:02,680 Speaker 3: You know? 193 00:10:02,720 --> 00:10:05,000 Speaker 2: I actually haven't, And I'm actually sad to say I 194 00:10:05,160 --> 00:10:07,360 Speaker 2: was scheduled to interview him. I was actually she dul 195 00:10:07,440 --> 00:10:09,760 Speaker 2: to interview him tomorrow, and a couple of weeks ago 196 00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:12,640 Speaker 2: the interview got pushed back, and yeah, I was going 197 00:10:12,720 --> 00:10:14,280 Speaker 2: to be talking to him about his new books. So 198 00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:17,240 Speaker 2: it was really really sad to see the news today. 199 00:10:17,320 --> 00:10:19,959 Speaker 2: I just think he I think I always think it's 200 00:10:20,000 --> 00:10:24,760 Speaker 2: remarkable when people are successful in one field and then 201 00:10:24,840 --> 00:10:26,960 Speaker 2: part way through their life, you know, like kind of 202 00:10:27,360 --> 00:10:30,480 Speaker 2: into middle age, they have this massive shift and move 203 00:10:30,480 --> 00:10:33,760 Speaker 2: into a completely barely related field. And I just think, 204 00:10:34,160 --> 00:10:37,720 Speaker 2: you know, it kind of spoke so much about his 205 00:10:37,800 --> 00:10:41,120 Speaker 2: communicative capacity that he was able to bring his field 206 00:10:41,120 --> 00:10:45,559 Speaker 2: of expertise expertise to the matters both VARA's books and 207 00:10:45,960 --> 00:10:48,959 Speaker 2: via TV like he was a very very skillful TV 208 00:10:49,080 --> 00:10:51,840 Speaker 2: presenter and someone who hadn't had much experience in it. 209 00:10:51,880 --> 00:10:54,080 Speaker 2: And Yeah, I just think it's kind of rare that 210 00:10:54,120 --> 00:10:56,400 Speaker 2: you come across you know, talents like that where people 211 00:10:56,800 --> 00:10:59,480 Speaker 2: can have expertise in one field and then come into 212 00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:02,320 Speaker 2: a kind of show show a pony businesslike television and 213 00:11:02,679 --> 00:11:05,120 Speaker 2: excel as well, and clearly he did. So Yeah we 214 00:11:05,240 --> 00:11:05,520 Speaker 2: am there. 215 00:11:05,760 --> 00:11:07,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you very much, guys, appreciate it and thanks 216 00:11:07,840 --> 00:11:11,000 Speaker 1: for the advice on the cell phone tri Sharson, Jack taym. 217 00:11:11,800 --> 00:11:14,960 Speaker 1: For more from Heather Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to 218 00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:18,079 Speaker 1: news Talks. It'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow 219 00:11:18,120 --> 00:11:19,840 Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio.