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Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from News Talks EDB. Follow

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Speaker 1: this and our Wide Ranger podcasts now on iHeartRadio. Yet

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Speaker 1: inside the Game from every angle. It's Rugby Direct with

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Speaker 1: Elliott Smith powered by News Talks EDB.

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Speaker 2: Welcome into Rugby Direct powered by Excess Solutions, celebrating twenty

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Speaker 2: five years in business. Let's get into it, Liam, don't

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Speaker 2: waste any time. Give us your thoughts. All Blacks and

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Speaker 2: England's the All Blacks third loss of the year. The

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Speaker 2: people want to know what you think.

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Speaker 3: It was a fairly dark day at Twickenham, wasn't it.

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Speaker 3: Elliott's Look for me, this wasn't unexpected. I thought England

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Speaker 3: would win and just on the basis of what we've

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Speaker 3: seen in recent times from the All Blacks. Look, if

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Speaker 3: we deal with the game first and foremost, England came

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Speaker 3: out of the blocks and threw everything at the All Blacks.

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Speaker 3: They did well to whether an early storm, scored two good,

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Speaker 3: were up twelve nil. I thought their line out was

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Speaker 3: really good. They got I think three steals in the

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Speaker 3: first half, but there wasn't a lot else that went right.

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Speaker 3: There was some really poor instances when Boden Barrett's and

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Speaker 3: I'm pretty sure it was Cam Roygard's on the second occasion,

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Speaker 3: which most people have actually missed. Roygard missed touch, so

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Speaker 3: twice the All Blacksmiths touch from penalties. Some of their

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Speaker 3: high ballwork allowed England to come back into the game

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Speaker 3: a couple of George Ford drop goals, and it's even

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Speaker 3: at that point it started to feel like the momentum

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Speaker 3: had turned. And then we had another third quarter fade,

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Speaker 3: the yellow card from Cody Taylor, which I reckon was harsh,

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Speaker 3: but you could argue it was cynical and England just

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Speaker 3: steamrolled the All Blacks from there. They had one tried

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Speaker 3: denied because of an offside from the line outs, and

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Speaker 3: concerning that the nature of those tries I think was

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Speaker 3: a Fraser ding wall that was just all too easy

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Speaker 3: waltzing through the All Blacks defense. Look credit to England.

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Speaker 3: They they performed really well. That They've got a number

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Speaker 3: of different different assets to their game, big strong, full pack.

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Speaker 3: You know, their DNA around the set piece, George Ford

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Speaker 3: was hugely influential. But there's some major, major concerns for

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Speaker 3: the All Black team and unless there's some major changes,

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Speaker 3: I also don't see them improving the only context to

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Speaker 3: that is they can touch on it a little bit

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Speaker 3: later when you give us your thoughts. But just around

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Speaker 3: the players that are missing from that I guess first

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Speaker 3: choice twenty three through injury.

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Speaker 2: Yeah there are. But the All Blacks have always prided

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Speaker 2: themselves on having that next man up mentality and you know,

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Speaker 2: believing that players can create an opportunity if they were

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Speaker 2: to take it. But I thought this was a really

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Speaker 2: poor performance from the All Blacks. I you know, I

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Speaker 2: packed them last week. I thought they were going to

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Speaker 2: win by six, so I thought they had it in

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Speaker 2: them two beat what is a good and improving England side.

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Speaker 2: And you've got to give them their flowers because they

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Speaker 2: were very, very good and perhaps not as limited as

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Speaker 2: many thought they might be. With George Ford at ten.

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Speaker 2: In fact, he was the man for the occasion. He

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Speaker 2: stood up beautifully, I thought, while deserving. I was mad

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Speaker 2: at the match Crown, but from an All Blacks perspective,

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Speaker 2: that was some of the silliest rugby I've seen this

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Speaker 2: team play ever. And we'll focus on the All Blacks.

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Speaker 2: You know, England, we've given them their credit. But this

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Speaker 2: is a New Zealand Rugby podcast, so let's teak. We

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Speaker 2: dig into this All Blacks performance, but you touched on it.

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Speaker 2: Their missing touch twice is unforgivable, and you could argue

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Speaker 2: the twelve mil lead came almost against the run of

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Speaker 2: player a little bit. England dominated the early exchanges. Bill

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Speaker 2: Black's got their first opportunity. We're down at the in

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Speaker 2: the field and all of a sudden they were twelve

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Speaker 2: mi no ol up. But there doesn't seem to be

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Speaker 2: any realization on how to build pressure. And you know,

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Speaker 2: twelve and a up. Yes, England's score again relative soon

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Speaker 2: after that, and the momentum swings back to England, but

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Speaker 2: there's no trying to bank three more points. And you

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Speaker 2: look at the England mindset went from twelve to five

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Speaker 2: down in the four or five minutes will half time

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Speaker 2: to being twelve to eleven behind, and they swung the

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Speaker 2: momentum the All Blacks twelve miller up. You know, if

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Speaker 2: you get to fifteen, n'il start building a few more opportunities. Now,

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Speaker 2: they didn't keep hold of the ball well enough and

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Speaker 2: consolidate those points scoring opportunities well enough, and that left

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Speaker 2: them wide open and vulnerable. So when England scored and

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Speaker 2: England managed to keep scoring and keep that school board

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Speaker 2: pressure going on. It's a real thing. And that's what

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Speaker 2: All Blacks teams used to be able to do really well,

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Speaker 2: was keep that school board pressure tacking over it. This

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Speaker 2: current team doesn't seem to know how to do it.

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Speaker 2: And they were probably lucky to only lose thirty three

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Speaker 2: to nineteen because that trial binils you mentioned would have

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Speaker 2: blinded out with still about twenty five minutes ago. It

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Speaker 2: was already hard to see the All Blacks coming back

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Speaker 2: from that point. Just a really, really poor performance from

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Speaker 2: the All Blacks. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: One of the big concers for me is if you

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Speaker 3: look at the second half in particular, some of the

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Speaker 3: just seem bereft of ideas. On attack. They don't know

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Speaker 3: how to get go forward, they don't know how to

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Speaker 3: create space. They're waiting on individual brilliants to get them

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Speaker 3: out of trouble. They're really static, and what are they

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Speaker 3: doing from an attack?

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Speaker 2: At point it seemed to play like a team on attack.

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Speaker 2: You're right that they're try and wait for that individual

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Speaker 2: moment to spark an attack and get them on the

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Speaker 2: front foot and get them going. Otherwise they go very lateral.

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Speaker 3: It's all flat footed shuffling across the line waiting for

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Speaker 3: somebody to break attack or offload rather than trying to

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Speaker 3: set something up.

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Speaker 2: We saw in the first time and I think they

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Speaker 2: did as well, was when they sort of sucked all

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Speaker 2: the England defenders into the middle of the park and

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Speaker 2: then that created the opportunities for faying on Noku and

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Speaker 2: Cody Taylor on that left edge. But that's a good

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Speaker 2: trick to use twice. But then when you got the

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Speaker 2: ball back and trying to build pressure, it seemed like

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Speaker 2: they were waiting for England to basically give up a

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Speaker 2: penalty also then have an idea of what to do,

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Speaker 2: how to strike from meters fifty to twenty two. Just yeah,

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Speaker 2: that the attacking shape is non existent, I have to

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Speaker 2: say at the moment, and that may sound harsh, but

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Speaker 2: it just feels like there's not enough there to go. Yep,

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Speaker 2: bets and all Blacks attack. We know the way that

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Speaker 2: they want to play, we know this is the style

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Speaker 2: of All Blacks rugby. It doesn't seem to be any

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Speaker 2: style at the moment.

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Speaker 3: No, so attack is one major concern. And then okay,

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Speaker 3: so who's responsible for the attack where you've got your

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Speaker 3: game drivers? First and foremost guys like Boden Barrett, Will

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Speaker 3: Jordan cam Rogal when he was on the pitch, but

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Speaker 3: from a coaching perspective, it's Scott Hansen and so I

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Speaker 3: think there needs to be some real questions asked about

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Speaker 3: what's happening with the All Black attack and why it's

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Speaker 3: not working and it hasn't been working this year. You've

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Speaker 3: got Jason Holland leaving at the end of the year.

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Speaker 3: He's a strike coach. I don't know how much say

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Speaker 3: he's actually had over that, so that's one issue. I

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Speaker 3: think the All Blacks kicked really poorly as well. Boden

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Speaker 3: Barrack I think he got one fifty twenty two. Cam

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Speaker 3: Roygal was hugely influential from the base, raking clearance kicks,

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Speaker 3: saving the All Blacks on a number of occasions, but

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Speaker 3: after he went off, I can't really remember the All

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Speaker 3: Blacks turning England around. Boden Barrack had a dinky little

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Speaker 3: chip for Ardie Severe. He's not the right guy to

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Speaker 3: be putting in a chip for that should be Will Jordan.

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Speaker 3: I'm not sure if that was a mix up of

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Speaker 3: some description, but they were supremely outplayed from a tactical

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Speaker 3: kicking point of view, and then tactically some just bizarre decisions,

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Speaker 3: not replacing a loose ford with the hooker until later

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Speaker 3: when Cody Taylor went off taking a tap kick rather

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Speaker 3: than kicking a goal.

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Speaker 2: And then well you to this touch on that because

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Speaker 2: when they took the tapy go, that's bizarre. But okay,

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Speaker 2: maybe there's a strike play or something set here that

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Speaker 2: they have practiced for on the training field. No, two

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Speaker 2: phases later, they just bombed it downfield.

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Speaker 3: Just an aimless kick in the air. They're never going

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Speaker 3: to get back. And you were just sitting there baffled, like,

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Speaker 3: what was the point in that? Who made that decision

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Speaker 3: and why? So tactically, on field, decision making, leadership, attack,

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Speaker 3: all these things are in the spotlight.

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Speaker 2: They have to be. And you know, the All Black

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Speaker 2: scored nineteen points yesterday. They scored how many in the

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Speaker 2: second spell last week? Eight points. We can talk about

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Speaker 2: the second third quarter fades and it is a big

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Speaker 2: part of the game, but it wasn't the sole reason

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Speaker 2: they lost yesterday. Yes, they went in with a halftime

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Speaker 2: lead and that evaporated pretty quickly, but minutes one to

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Speaker 2: forty were also an issue. And so we're minutes sixty

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Speaker 2: to eighty. It just so happened that they considered the

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Speaker 2: first penalty of the game was yellow card. Cody Taylor

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Speaker 2: goes off, and they tried something different, used to try

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Speaker 2: to go out on the field three or four minutes

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Speaker 2: earlier and warm themselves back up after halftime. That didn't

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Speaker 2: work in the slightest. So it looks like a team

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Speaker 2: that are playing like individuals rather than a team at

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Speaker 2: the moment, and symptomatic of some of their losses this year,

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Speaker 2: the one in Argentina, the one in Wellington against South Africa,

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Speaker 2: as well as that these losses are coming in similar

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Speaker 2: fashion and teams are knowing how to beat the All Blacks.

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Speaker 3: Well, it's a common theme and it's been building. This

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Speaker 3: result has been building because the inconsistencies within games have

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Speaker 3: been there and in many ways results are papered over

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Speaker 3: the cracks. So, yep, the All Blacks finished brilliantly in

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Speaker 3: Chicago three tries. Credit for that twenty minute period where

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Speaker 3: everything clicked and then but for sixty minutes pretty poor.

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Speaker 3: The following week, Damien McKenzie saves their blushes after blowing

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Speaker 3: a seventeen point leads so those massive swings within games

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Speaker 3: that inconce instancies. This isn't a new theme. It's a

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Speaker 3: common thing that's very evident week to week, and they're

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Speaker 3: not solving it.

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Speaker 2: It is. And look previous All Black sides, the great

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Speaker 2: All Black sides, would have these sort of games where

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Speaker 2: they did need to find themselves out of trouble.

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Speaker 3: But you're never going to have everything your own way, right, No.

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Speaker 2: But if you have one of those games in a while,

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Speaker 2: that's understandable when you are basically having those week to

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Speaker 2: week and not being able to dominate the way that

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Speaker 2: All Blacks teams are expected to do and play the

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Speaker 2: way that all Blacks teams are expected to do. You know,

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Speaker 2: you look at the two teams yesterday and it was

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Speaker 2: England who bullied the All Blacks. Now, the All Blacks

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Speaker 2: have built their brand on being the you know, the

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Speaker 2: sharpest team in world rugby, having those attacking instincts, scoring

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Speaker 2: when you know it looked impossible by and large, apart

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Speaker 2: from that to Tripeia in the first Belt, it was

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Speaker 2: England who made the attack look easy rather than the

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Speaker 2: All Blacks. And I think it's a really worrying sign.

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Speaker 3: It is, and I just want to I guess look

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Speaker 3: briefly on the other side of the fence for what

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Speaker 3: this one means for England. Right, So, first win at Twicken'

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Speaker 3: them over the All Blacks in thirteen years, first win

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Speaker 3: over the All Blacks in five years. It's there. It

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Speaker 3: was the second largest and the second most points I've

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Speaker 3: ever scored against the All Blacks. They've now won ten

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Speaker 3: games in a row and they are building. I mentioned

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Speaker 3: pre match that they have much more strength and depth

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Speaker 3: than Ireland and Scotland did. I think that that's very

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Speaker 3: evident by their bench. They are building some real momentum

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Speaker 3: and to paint the picture of these two teams, because

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Speaker 3: it really was going to color the complexion of both

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Speaker 3: side seasons. If you look back to last year England

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Speaker 3: have England lost three tight games to the All Blacks.

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Speaker 3: Last year they have improved significantly, I would argue the

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Speaker 3: All Blacks haven't. And they're basically are they exactly where

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Speaker 3: they are.

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Speaker 2: They could be. They're pretty much stagnant from last year.

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Speaker 2: I mean, they've changed a few players and probably got

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Speaker 2: more selection, is right, but they feel like they have

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Speaker 2: a year on year. No, probably haven't improved and it

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Speaker 2: feels like to an extent, we're back in those days

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Speaker 2: of twenty twenty two where the All Blacks attack was

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Speaker 2: non existent. This is the Irish series in twenty twenty

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Speaker 2: two where yet they had a good game at Eton

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Speaker 2: Park when when things were changed and a few coaches

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Speaker 2: were out through COVID, but otherwise the attacking ship was

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Speaker 2: all over the show. They didn't know the way that

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Speaker 2: wanted to play and that force change and the All

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Speaker 2: Blacks set up. So I think, you know, people will say, oh,

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Speaker 2: you know, the one Island, the one Scotland, but I

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Speaker 2: think this was always going to be the one that

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Speaker 2: this tour was judged on if they got through the

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Speaker 2: first Yeah, the.

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Speaker 3: Whole theme of this tour was conquering the Kingdom winning

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Speaker 3: the Grand Slam.

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Speaker 2: And they were the ones that you know, said that

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Speaker 2: they wanted to do the Grand Slam and join the

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Speaker 2: other teams in history that had done so. So let's

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Speaker 2: park the attack for the moment. The defeat was also poor. Yesterday,

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Speaker 2: Leroy Carter was run over by Oli Lawrence for England's

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Speaker 2: first try. Fraser ding will slice through a gap in

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Speaker 2: the middle of the park that you know shouldn't have

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Speaker 2: been there as well. Work moved from England. But again

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Speaker 2: basics from the All Blacks go missing when they're under

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Speaker 2: pressure underhill scores close to the line. They were batted

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Speaker 2: there defensively wise, you know, again this falls under a

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Speaker 2: little bit of Scott Hansen's remit, but also Tomo d Allison.

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Speaker 2: We're not seeing the All Blacks defense with those renowned

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Speaker 2: you know, you know, turning defense into attack moments or

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Speaker 2: even just being able to defend your line that we

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Speaker 2: have come to correspond with this team over a number

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Speaker 2: of years.

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Speaker 3: Well, the All Blacks were brilliant defensively last week in Edinburgh,

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Speaker 3: they say, multiple tries on their line. It was really

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Speaker 3: heroic stuff. But you can't do that every week. And

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Speaker 3: a team like England, big physical pack, all the momentum

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Speaker 3: eighty one thousand p there, it's incredibly difficult to stop

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Speaker 3: and so some of those tries were really soft. But

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Speaker 3: you can't put yourself under that sort of pressure. You

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Speaker 3: need to put yourself in the right area of the field.

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Speaker 3: You need to build momentum in other ways. So, I

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Speaker 3: mean we've touched on a little bit. Let's really dull

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Speaker 3: into this coaching team. Where are they at I've got

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Speaker 3: real doubts about whether raises the guy right now and

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Speaker 3: if he is going to improve this team. I'm adamant

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Speaker 3: he needs to make changes to his coaching team.

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Speaker 2: Well, there is nothing on the basis of the last

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Speaker 2: two years that would seduce that they are a team

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Speaker 2: capable of winning the twenty twenty seven World Cup as

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Speaker 2: it stands now. Things can change a lot in two years,

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Speaker 2: but you can only go on the evidence that you've

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Speaker 2: been given to this point. And while the All Blacks

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Speaker 2: are supposedly ranked second in the world, and I'm not

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Speaker 2: sure how the rank of the loss use today changes.

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Speaker 3: It, they'll stay at second, But for me, the probably

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Speaker 3: fourth behind South Africa, England and probably France.

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Speaker 2: And those maybe apart from France and look like our

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Speaker 2: team on the rise. Ireland don't know. I don't really

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Speaker 2: take a lot out of that when over Australia yesterday.

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Speaker 2: We'll talk about that a bit later, but it feels

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Speaker 2: like two years in we're not seeing the evidence that

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Speaker 2: this team is building towards the twenty twenty seven will cut.

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Speaker 2: There have been fits and starts and moments here and there,

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Speaker 2: and you know, you wonder whether they've turned a corner. Well,

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Speaker 2: it feels like yesterday they went back around the corner

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Speaker 2: and at a rate of knots. And you don't want

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Speaker 2: to view in isolation too much. And I think that's

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Speaker 2: why looking at a big picture is.

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Speaker 3: It not about being knee jerk either, because the signs

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Speaker 3: that a result like this has been coming.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well we had a result like this in September

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Speaker 2: in Wellington, and then they went and beat Australia, who

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Speaker 2: are on the come down of that line series and

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Speaker 2: beating the spring Boks. Then they go up again and

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Speaker 2: beat Ireland in Chicago and then beat Scotland. But again

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Speaker 2: I go back to this point, You're halfway point for

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Speaker 2: the World Cup. Where's this team at? And it's hard

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Speaker 2: to mount an argument that they could win a quarter final,

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Speaker 2: a semi final and a final consecutively, backing up week

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Speaker 2: to week. So I think there has to be concerns

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Speaker 2: about the coaching team.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. So for me, there's a couple of things that

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Speaker 3: need to happen. My understanding is Robertson, Scott Hansen and

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Speaker 3: Jason rowan a very very tight click and they don't

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Speaker 3: necessarily share information. Well they select the team. I think

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Speaker 3: that needs to be challenged. I think they didn't have

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Speaker 3: attack coach. That seems very evident. And with Jason Holland leaving,

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Speaker 3: I think Scott Robinson said he didn't plan to replace them. Well,

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Speaker 3: I think New Zealand Rugby at the end of this year,

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Speaker 3: with all due respect to Wales, the result of this

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Speaker 3: week in's fiction, unless you all Becks lose, is not like,

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Speaker 3: is not going to alter where things are at Bill

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Speaker 3: Becks will make changes and they should win, but it's

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Speaker 3: not going to change the complexion. So I think New

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Speaker 3: Zealand Rugby needs to have a real hands on look

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Speaker 3: and have a say in that coaching team, and there

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Speaker 3: needs to be some real pointed feedback around that because

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Speaker 3: sitting idle is not an option because on the horizon

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Speaker 3: is that that tour to South Africa and that is

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Speaker 3: going to be incredibly torrid. The Springboks are getting further

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Speaker 3: ahead of everyone and if you don't make change now,

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Speaker 3: that could go really bad.

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Speaker 2: Well, you don't want to look back in a year

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Speaker 2: and go gee, I wish would change something then, because

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Speaker 2: now we're stuck with X Y Z it or stuck

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Speaker 2: in this pattern.

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Speaker 3: There was also always concern around this coaching team about

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Speaker 3: the lack of international experience, and I think that's probably

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Speaker 3: been born out the other The other thing which we

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00:18:01,413 --> 00:18:04,653
Speaker 3: think we know is that you know, Razer doesn't do

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Speaker 3: a lot of hands on coaching, and Scott Hansen is

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Speaker 3: his right hand man, has a lot of say in

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Speaker 3: a lot of things with that big tactics. Yeah, look,

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Speaker 3: that dynamics pretty interesting in itself.

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Speaker 2: That's from the outside and you can do what you

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Speaker 2: want when you're winning. And if that's the system that

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Speaker 2: works for you when and you're putting results on the board,

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Speaker 2: then have at it. Because you know, so has had

346
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Speaker 2: a director of rugby with Russi and Jacques Ederberger was

347
00:18:29,173 --> 00:18:32,133
Speaker 2: coaching for the last four years. Every team and nation

348
00:18:32,253 --> 00:18:34,533
Speaker 2: have their own quirks. And if that's the system that

349
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Speaker 2: you want to go with and it works for you, great,

350
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Speaker 2: If it works. When it doesn't work, that's when it

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Speaker 2: invites questions. And I think I said on the podcast

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Speaker 2: a couple of weeks ago around the division of labor

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Speaker 2: in this coaching cawnp it feels like a lot is

354
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Speaker 2: on a few shoulders, but also lots on you know,

355
00:18:51,613 --> 00:18:54,093
Speaker 2: really phrase that lots on a few shoulders, But is

356
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Speaker 2: it too much on one pair of shoulders and not

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Speaker 2: enough on the next pair of shoulder if you get

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Speaker 2: my drift, and I think it.

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Speaker 3: Needs to be clear directives around who's doing what.

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Speaker 2: That's right and I would suggest that when you are

361
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Speaker 2: struggling to get results like this All Blacks team is

362
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Speaker 2: at the moment three losses this year for last year,

363
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Speaker 2: then you go back to basics. You go back to

364
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Speaker 2: a head coach at a tech coach, a defense coach,

365
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Speaker 2: and you know you can have your micro coroaches like

366
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Speaker 2: a scrum coach, et cetera behind that. You can't sort

367
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Speaker 2: of have a system like this where the division of

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Speaker 2: labor is unclear when you're not getting results. I think

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Speaker 2: that's my opinion on it.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and look, coaches live and die by results. But

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Speaker 3: it's also the way, the manner in which you win,

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Speaker 3: the manner in which you lose. The spring box defeat.

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Speaker 3: This defeats the big swings and blowouts and consistencies that

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Speaker 3: says something's not right and something's not working and something

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Speaker 3: needs to be done about that because if you don't,

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Speaker 3: it festers and it will get worse.

377
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Speaker 2: That's right, and look, this All Blacks brand relies on

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Speaker 2: them winning, And so that also goes and feeds into

379
00:20:02,013 --> 00:20:04,413
Speaker 2: those questions, is that you know, they sell this brand

380
00:20:04,613 --> 00:20:07,373
Speaker 2: and go around the Globe and the Bean to Chicago,

381
00:20:08,013 --> 00:20:10,333
Speaker 2: and with a little bit of help from the Irish

382
00:20:10,373 --> 00:20:13,973
Speaker 2: population in Chicago and Ireland themselves, they go through and

383
00:20:14,893 --> 00:20:16,853
Speaker 2: build this around the globe that they had a lot

384
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Speaker 2: of sponsor events last week in London. Again, that's built

385
00:20:20,693 --> 00:20:23,213
Speaker 2: on a history of winning. When you're not winning, even

386
00:20:23,213 --> 00:20:25,213
Speaker 2: for a season or two, and it starts drying up,

387
00:20:25,653 --> 00:20:27,733
Speaker 2: that's when the sponsors go, was this brand all that's

388
00:20:27,733 --> 00:20:29,453
Speaker 2: cracked up to be? So the All Blacks need to

389
00:20:29,453 --> 00:20:29,813
Speaker 2: be winning?

390
00:20:29,973 --> 00:20:34,013
Speaker 3: Yeah, they do. The only portal mate is you put

391
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Speaker 3: two po Vi Patrick two Polo to Tyre Alomax, Kay, Barrett, Jordi, Barrett,

392
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Speaker 3: Caleb Clark back in that team. And when Roygard plays

393
00:20:42,933 --> 00:20:45,373
Speaker 3: eighty minutes when he went off, that was incredibly telling.

394
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Speaker 3: The All Blacks downward spiral can be intrinsically linked to that.

395
00:20:52,373 --> 00:20:55,853
Speaker 3: It's a much better all Black team. But there's still

396
00:20:55,853 --> 00:20:59,133
Speaker 3: major question marks around who is the long term first

397
00:20:59,133 --> 00:21:03,933
Speaker 3: five who I think Leroy Carter's days are probably numbered

398
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Speaker 3: on the right wing, and I think there's still major

399
00:21:06,653 --> 00:21:08,933
Speaker 3: question marks about the blindside.

400
00:21:09,533 --> 00:21:12,093
Speaker 2: Yep. Well, I don't think Simon Parker has put his

401
00:21:12,173 --> 00:21:15,013
Speaker 2: hand up yesterday. I thought it was the right decision

402
00:21:15,053 --> 00:21:16,573
Speaker 2: potentially to have him come off the bench. It was

403
00:21:16,573 --> 00:21:18,253
Speaker 2: too late for Walls as he did have impacted in

404
00:21:18,333 --> 00:21:18,693
Speaker 2: that game.

405
00:21:19,173 --> 00:21:21,533
Speaker 3: I would have started Wallace. I think they got that

406
00:21:21,573 --> 00:21:22,253
Speaker 3: selection wrong.

407
00:21:23,053 --> 00:21:26,893
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree in hindsight. Leroy Carter defensively was found

408
00:21:26,933 --> 00:21:29,813
Speaker 2: out yesterday. Hasn't had a number of attacking opportunities on

409
00:21:29,853 --> 00:21:32,693
Speaker 2: this tour. Chip and Chase woodwell yesterday on that one

410
00:21:32,733 --> 00:21:36,293
Speaker 2: occasion he did, but again it feels like he's struggling

411
00:21:36,333 --> 00:21:40,453
Speaker 2: to get involved in Test rugby at the moment. And

412
00:21:40,533 --> 00:21:43,413
Speaker 2: I will also look at this team and go they

413
00:21:43,453 --> 00:21:46,453
Speaker 2: were conservative and selection last year and I think that

414
00:21:46,613 --> 00:21:50,413
Speaker 2: is now hamstringing them this year because they're trying to

415
00:21:50,413 --> 00:21:54,293
Speaker 2: expose some players at Test level almost you know, and

416
00:21:54,893 --> 00:21:57,133
Speaker 2: the numbers that I think they had roughly about twenty

417
00:21:57,173 --> 00:22:00,293
Speaker 2: debutants in the last couple of years. But they were

418
00:22:00,333 --> 00:22:05,773
Speaker 2: conservative last year and basically probably didn't expand as much

419
00:22:05,773 --> 00:22:09,333
Speaker 2: as they should have in year one and stunted development.

420
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Speaker 2: And I think they're now playing from behind because you

421
00:22:12,173 --> 00:22:14,413
Speaker 2: could argue, as we touched on before that England and

422
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Speaker 2: now I headed them on a tractory and you're speaking

423
00:22:18,293 --> 00:22:20,093
Speaker 2: to a couple of England rugby riders. They reckon that

424
00:22:20,453 --> 00:22:22,533
Speaker 2: the All Blacks. Sorry that England maybe six to twelve

425
00:22:22,533 --> 00:22:24,493
Speaker 2: months ahead of the All Blacks. I think they're taking

426
00:22:24,493 --> 00:22:27,413
Speaker 2: that leap over the Six Nations this year and beyond.

427
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Speaker 2: And I think the All Blacks now paying the price

428
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Speaker 2: of just being a little bit too conservative last year

429
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Speaker 2: around their selections.

430
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Speaker 3: Yeah, and you look, you can run the risk of

431
00:22:39,573 --> 00:22:42,653
Speaker 3: throwing young players in too early, but I think that

432
00:22:42,853 --> 00:22:46,133
Speaker 3: the All Blacks on the whole have been conservative. Fabian

433
00:22:46,173 --> 00:22:48,093
Speaker 3: Holland was another one who didn't play still because he

434
00:22:48,173 --> 00:22:51,373
Speaker 3: was sick. So Bill Black's basically had six of their

435
00:22:51,533 --> 00:22:54,613
Speaker 3: first choice twenty three out, so that's important context. Look

436
00:22:54,653 --> 00:22:59,173
Speaker 3: next year I want to see back into Super Rugby

437
00:23:00,133 --> 00:23:02,973
Speaker 3: all going well. I think guys like Dylan Pledger and

438
00:23:03,133 --> 00:23:07,453
Speaker 3: Caleb Tongueytowel needs to come into the squads. I think

439
00:23:07,893 --> 00:23:11,333
Speaker 3: it's very evident the drop from cam Roy guards. I

440
00:23:11,373 --> 00:23:14,853
Speaker 3: think they could use some real pace in the outsides.

441
00:23:14,893 --> 00:23:18,253
Speaker 3: Tongueytail not the Finnished product, but I think he deserves

442
00:23:18,253 --> 00:23:21,093
Speaker 3: to be on the spot over over a sevy Reese.

443
00:23:21,013 --> 00:23:22,773
Speaker 2: Yeah, over a severy rees. I mean, I'm not sure

444
00:23:22,813 --> 00:23:25,493
Speaker 2: his defense seeing him at EPC level is any better

445
00:23:25,493 --> 00:23:27,493
Speaker 2: than Leroy Carter's, and I think, you know, he can't

446
00:23:27,773 --> 00:23:29,933
Speaker 2: slip wing solely on defense, but I think it helps

447
00:23:29,973 --> 00:23:32,093
Speaker 2: and I'm not sure there's much of a boost there,

448
00:23:32,133 --> 00:23:33,693
Speaker 2: but I think if he has another good Super Rugby

449
00:23:33,693 --> 00:23:39,373
Speaker 2: campaign with the Hinders, then absolutely worthy of consideration. Yeah,

450
00:23:40,213 --> 00:23:42,413
Speaker 2: it leaves the All Blacks in a vulnerable position.

451
00:23:43,693 --> 00:23:47,293
Speaker 3: I think this raises something about seventy three percent. Seven

452
00:23:47,413 --> 00:23:51,493
Speaker 3: from my maths isn't great, but seven from twenty six

453
00:23:51,653 --> 00:23:52,213
Speaker 3: twenty five.

454
00:23:52,333 --> 00:23:55,813
Speaker 2: Yeah, they've played fourteen last year. They've played twelve year

455
00:23:55,813 --> 00:23:56,613
Speaker 2: in twenty six.

456
00:23:56,493 --> 00:23:58,693
Speaker 3: Years, even losses from twenty six.

457
00:23:58,773 --> 00:24:01,813
Speaker 2: It's not a great record. And there was a lot

458
00:24:01,853 --> 00:24:04,573
Speaker 2: of expectation on Scott Robertson when he came into the

459
00:24:04,653 --> 00:24:07,093
Speaker 2: job that you know things were going to change and

460
00:24:07,133 --> 00:24:08,893
Speaker 2: the All Blacks are going to play a little differently.

461
00:24:10,213 --> 00:24:12,373
Speaker 2: The bizarre thing is that they're not playing like they did.

462
00:24:12,933 --> 00:24:15,893
Speaker 2: His game plan at the Crusaders. You think about the

463
00:24:15,893 --> 00:24:17,933
Speaker 2: way they played the Crusaders is very full dominated and

464
00:24:18,053 --> 00:24:20,213
Speaker 2: Yusus she had Will Jordan popping up in Sevy recent

465
00:24:20,213 --> 00:24:22,653
Speaker 2: those sort of things, and Richie Wonger pulling the strings.

466
00:24:22,693 --> 00:24:25,213
Speaker 2: But they're not playing like that Crusader's team. So I'm

467
00:24:25,253 --> 00:24:28,053
Speaker 2: not sure what's being lost and you can't play like

468
00:24:28,093 --> 00:24:30,053
Speaker 2: you did at Super Rugby versus test Rake. But I'd

469
00:24:30,133 --> 00:24:34,653
Speaker 2: argue that the Crusader's products that they were game plan

470
00:24:34,773 --> 00:24:36,733
Speaker 2: that they were using is more akin to test Rugby

471
00:24:36,813 --> 00:24:38,573
Speaker 2: than whatever the All Blacks are you doing at the moment.

472
00:24:39,733 --> 00:24:42,573
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, maybe I don't know if it necessarily.

473
00:24:42,373 --> 00:24:45,093
Speaker 2: It may not translate, but you know it's a fure dominant.

474
00:24:45,093 --> 00:24:47,173
Speaker 2: You know, they think about how many times they'd bang

475
00:24:47,213 --> 00:24:49,493
Speaker 2: it into the corner. Sam Whitelock would be there, that

476
00:24:49,653 --> 00:24:52,733
Speaker 2: attack really well in the red zone, that finished those opportunities.

477
00:24:52,733 --> 00:24:55,773
Speaker 2: Things that count on defenses to break. We don't see

478
00:24:55,773 --> 00:24:56,933
Speaker 2: that at test rak B at the moment from the

479
00:24:56,973 --> 00:24:57,413
Speaker 2: All Blacks.

480
00:24:57,733 --> 00:25:01,533
Speaker 3: No, and some of the big things we're missing a

481
00:25:01,693 --> 00:25:08,253
Speaker 3: real ruthlessness, accuracy and taking your chances and just clear

482
00:25:08,813 --> 00:25:12,973
Speaker 3: decisive decision making in leadership that you know, there's some

483
00:25:13,013 --> 00:25:16,013
Speaker 3: real flaws around those things that will like you say,

484
00:25:16,013 --> 00:25:20,373
Speaker 3: we used to see those from previous All Black teams.

485
00:25:20,453 --> 00:25:23,213
Speaker 2: They don't do enough with the ball. They're not being

486
00:25:23,293 --> 00:25:25,853
Speaker 2: driven around the park well enough. Now Bone Barrett had

487
00:25:25,853 --> 00:25:28,173
Speaker 2: an injury, a quad injury. Ues today. Did some good

488
00:25:28,173 --> 00:25:30,893
Speaker 2: things in the first twenty minutes, but it sort of

489
00:25:30,933 --> 00:25:32,973
Speaker 2: fell away a bit after that, and you look at

490
00:25:32,973 --> 00:25:35,693
Speaker 2: what George Fool was able to do and just slow

491
00:25:35,733 --> 00:25:37,813
Speaker 2: down the game a little bit even though they were behind.

492
00:25:38,093 --> 00:25:40,493
Speaker 2: Being a couple of drop goals over then increased the

493
00:25:40,493 --> 00:25:41,813
Speaker 2: intent of the after halftime.

494
00:25:41,893 --> 00:25:44,773
Speaker 3: Yeah, but if Boden's not right to the point that

495
00:25:44,853 --> 00:25:48,533
Speaker 3: Cam Roygard and Will Jordan are taking line kicks, do

496
00:25:48,573 --> 00:25:53,173
Speaker 3: you not replace them with Damian McKenzie. So yeah, yeah,

497
00:25:53,213 --> 00:25:55,333
Speaker 3: some strange, strange decisions.

498
00:25:55,333 --> 00:25:59,573
Speaker 2: A couple of feedback moments already from our listeners on

499
00:25:59,613 --> 00:26:02,733
Speaker 2: social media that I'm going to get to on Rugby Direct.

500
00:26:02,813 --> 00:26:06,933
Speaker 2: So this is from Floyd's regular listener who tweeted me, no,

501
00:26:07,053 --> 00:26:09,093
Speaker 2: Scott Robinson didn't get it right. Please spend time on

502
00:26:09,093 --> 00:26:12,413
Speaker 2: the next Rugby Direct discussing one Scott Robinson's long pattern

503
00:26:12,453 --> 00:26:15,693
Speaker 2: of long running pattern of poor selections. I think we've

504
00:26:15,693 --> 00:26:18,973
Speaker 2: touched on that two More importantly, something clearly isn't right

505
00:26:19,013 --> 00:26:20,933
Speaker 2: in camp. What is it? Do you have any response

506
00:26:20,973 --> 00:26:21,253
Speaker 2: on that.

507
00:26:22,293 --> 00:26:24,933
Speaker 3: Well, I think we've touched on what needs to change

508
00:26:24,933 --> 00:26:28,813
Speaker 3: from from a coaching team perspective, and I think it

509
00:26:29,133 --> 00:26:31,573
Speaker 3: does all start at the top.

510
00:26:32,093 --> 00:26:34,053
Speaker 2: From the outside of their here like a happy camp

511
00:26:34,733 --> 00:26:37,693
Speaker 2: that's from the outside. We're not privy to all those

512
00:26:37,893 --> 00:26:41,773
Speaker 2: moments and the time we get with them, you know,

513
00:26:42,173 --> 00:26:44,413
Speaker 2: at the training paddock or at media conferences, So it's

514
00:26:44,413 --> 00:26:47,213
Speaker 2: hard to say, yeah, it seemed like a happy bunch, there'd.

515
00:26:47,013 --> 00:26:49,773
Speaker 3: Be, but there'd be a lot of tension there this week.

516
00:26:49,853 --> 00:26:52,653
Speaker 3: I think players like Ricowani would be very muffed about

517
00:26:52,693 --> 00:26:56,813
Speaker 3: not being picked. I think there's divisions in every team,

518
00:26:56,893 --> 00:27:00,133
Speaker 3: so you're going to have players passed off about not

519
00:27:00,173 --> 00:27:03,853
Speaker 3: being selected in any team right leadership.

520
00:27:03,853 --> 00:27:08,493
Speaker 2: Reportedly, m I l repeatedly rather again on the park yesterday.

521
00:27:08,893 --> 00:27:13,613
Speaker 2: Scott barrett I saw him interestingly talking to Andre Piarti

522
00:27:13,693 --> 00:27:15,693
Speaker 2: before the game about a number of things, and then

523
00:27:16,213 --> 00:27:17,733
Speaker 2: during the game it felt like him and Mara were

524
00:27:17,773 --> 00:27:21,573
Speaker 2: told you were just chipping away and yapping both at

525
00:27:21,573 --> 00:27:24,573
Speaker 2: each other but also at and drat party, trying to

526
00:27:24,613 --> 00:27:28,493
Speaker 2: get decisions across the line. I think it's a natural

527
00:27:28,533 --> 00:27:31,053
Speaker 2: occurrence when the team's losing. To look at the leadership.

528
00:27:31,053 --> 00:27:33,173
Speaker 2: But you know Ardie Save is that in the next

529
00:27:33,173 --> 00:27:34,613
Speaker 2: cab off the rank. I don't think he had one

530
00:27:34,653 --> 00:27:37,453
Speaker 2: of his great Test matches yesterday either. But I would

531
00:27:37,533 --> 00:27:39,333
Speaker 2: say there is a bit of a leadership hole on

532
00:27:39,373 --> 00:27:42,093
Speaker 2: the team at the moment. And you look at the leaders.

533
00:27:42,213 --> 00:27:44,013
Speaker 2: You know, Cody Taylor, where you can argue with it

534
00:27:44,053 --> 00:27:46,213
Speaker 2: was a yellow card or not still put himself in

535
00:27:46,213 --> 00:27:48,493
Speaker 2: that position. It's a player that's played more than one

536
00:27:48,533 --> 00:27:50,693
Speaker 2: hundred Test Bote and Barrett didn't have a great Test match.

537
00:27:50,893 --> 00:27:54,173
Speaker 2: He's the most capped back of all time. You know,

538
00:27:54,173 --> 00:27:57,173
Speaker 2: you can single out a few others as well. But yeah,

539
00:27:57,253 --> 00:27:59,413
Speaker 2: but I would say the leaders aren't probably where they

540
00:27:59,453 --> 00:28:00,533
Speaker 2: need to be in this team currently.

541
00:28:01,533 --> 00:28:03,813
Speaker 3: Yeah. I guess in that match in particular, there's not

542
00:28:05,493 --> 00:28:09,133
Speaker 3: your senior figures aren't stepping up necessary. Peter Luckey, I

543
00:28:09,213 --> 00:28:12,253
Speaker 3: think was the All Black's best performer carried. I think

544
00:28:12,253 --> 00:28:16,093
Speaker 3: he made twenty odd carries. He was highly involved and

545
00:28:16,293 --> 00:28:20,133
Speaker 3: he's twenty two years old. But look, I think when

546
00:28:20,133 --> 00:28:22,573
Speaker 3: we talk about the coaching and that starts at the top,

547
00:28:24,173 --> 00:28:26,453
Speaker 3: the captain has to be questioned as well. And it's

548
00:28:26,493 --> 00:28:30,853
Speaker 3: a perennial question with Scott Barrett because he was probably

549
00:28:30,853 --> 00:28:36,213
Speaker 3: a reluctant All Blacks captain. He's got that relationship with Razor.

550
00:28:37,213 --> 00:28:42,493
Speaker 3: But those on field decisions, you know that we've touched

551
00:28:42,533 --> 00:28:44,773
Speaker 3: on already, do make you question things.

552
00:28:45,493 --> 00:28:48,533
Speaker 2: Let's move on to Dylan's feedback on social media as well.

553
00:28:48,893 --> 00:28:51,653
Speaker 2: Thanks Dylan is always I can't which order these messages

554
00:28:51,693 --> 00:28:54,573
Speaker 2: came in too to read them. The defense is not

555
00:28:54,613 --> 00:28:57,933
Speaker 2: being asked questions at all. On attack, it's all just

556
00:28:57,973 --> 00:29:01,413
Speaker 2: individual brilliance, not playing flat to the line that looks disorganized,

557
00:29:01,413 --> 00:29:03,293
Speaker 2: with numbers not learning into shape. This is the worst

558
00:29:03,333 --> 00:29:06,013
Speaker 2: All Blacks attack I've seen in the last twenty years.

559
00:29:06,253 --> 00:29:10,013
Speaker 2: It's part one agreed, Yeah, Part two Scott Hansen needs

560
00:29:10,053 --> 00:29:12,373
Speaker 2: we moved on as well. There are zero creativity and attack,

561
00:29:12,453 --> 00:29:15,453
Speaker 2: no speed of ball, no fixing defenders, three on two skills,

562
00:29:15,453 --> 00:29:18,013
Speaker 2: decoy runners, lazy and static. What's the deal with the

563
00:29:18,013 --> 00:29:21,173
Speaker 2: reluctance to get the big body smashing around the corner.

564
00:29:21,853 --> 00:29:23,693
Speaker 3: Yeah, we touched on that the attack quite a bit.

565
00:29:24,173 --> 00:29:29,493
Speaker 3: But I agree that the All Blacks, well, their attack

566
00:29:29,733 --> 00:29:33,293
Speaker 3: is very very stagnant, and that's that shuffling. But it's

567
00:29:33,333 --> 00:29:35,733
Speaker 3: also we talked about this. I think on the last

568
00:29:35,733 --> 00:29:40,253
Speaker 3: part about it being highly predictable. Those backdoor plays. Every

569
00:29:40,253 --> 00:29:42,773
Speaker 3: team knows that's coming and the All Blacks aren't getting

570
00:29:42,893 --> 00:29:47,573
Speaker 3: enough go for momentum generally before they go wide. They did.

571
00:29:47,773 --> 00:29:50,853
Speaker 3: There was one set piece move from a scrum where

572
00:29:50,933 --> 00:29:53,133
Speaker 3: Boden Bart put Wall Jordan on the outside and then

573
00:29:53,293 --> 00:29:55,733
Speaker 3: I think fighting a nook who scored in the corner.

574
00:29:57,293 --> 00:30:04,893
Speaker 3: So that's pretty much the only nice attacking creative movement

575
00:30:04,933 --> 00:30:06,773
Speaker 3: that I can remember from the All Blacks in that match.

576
00:30:06,813 --> 00:30:09,013
Speaker 2: Well, you look at the way Scotland attack last week

577
00:30:09,013 --> 00:30:11,373
Speaker 2: against the All Blacks. You look at the way that

578
00:30:11,453 --> 00:30:15,333
Speaker 2: England attacked and they use big ball runners and they

579
00:30:15,333 --> 00:30:17,693
Speaker 2: get over the advantage line. The All Blacks scene reluctant

580
00:30:17,733 --> 00:30:20,613
Speaker 2: to do that, and then they get into a funk

581
00:30:20,653 --> 00:30:25,013
Speaker 2: of playing static across the middle of the park and

582
00:30:25,693 --> 00:30:28,533
Speaker 2: they come from a standing start. As well, it appears

583
00:30:28,653 --> 00:30:31,853
Speaker 2: more often than not whereas it feels like there's always

584
00:30:31,853 --> 00:30:35,053
Speaker 2: bodies in motion, from the way that England attacked yesterday,

585
00:30:35,053 --> 00:30:39,093
Speaker 2: they were South Africa attacked Scotland as well Argentina, it

586
00:30:39,093 --> 00:30:41,013
Speaker 2: feels like there's always bodies in motion. Where it feels

587
00:30:41,013 --> 00:30:44,373
Speaker 2: like the All Blacks just aren't playing that kind of

588
00:30:44,453 --> 00:30:49,293
Speaker 2: rugby at the moment. Any thoughts, Yeah.

589
00:30:49,093 --> 00:30:50,933
Speaker 3: I would like to see them just be more direct

590
00:30:51,253 --> 00:30:52,893
Speaker 3: now and then you'll get a pick and go, but

591
00:30:53,053 --> 00:30:54,693
Speaker 3: I can. I think they can get a lot more

592
00:30:54,733 --> 00:30:57,253
Speaker 3: pay out of that, and that's where I feel guy

593
00:30:57,333 --> 00:31:02,293
Speaker 3: like Wallace to tt Is Poles apart from Assimon Parker

594
00:31:02,333 --> 00:31:05,093
Speaker 3: in terms of what he offers were ball in hands

595
00:31:05,213 --> 00:31:10,813
Speaker 3: and I think park Is probably stronger defensively, but Bill

596
00:31:10,853 --> 00:31:13,933
Speaker 3: Blacks need to be harnessing those ball runners. And as

597
00:31:13,973 --> 00:31:19,013
Speaker 3: evolved as Lucky was England's rush defense, their tag team

598
00:31:19,053 --> 00:31:22,053
Speaker 3: tacklers were very good at shutting the All Blacks down

599
00:31:22,093 --> 00:31:25,213
Speaker 3: and also slowing their breakdown. They got over the ball.

600
00:31:25,573 --> 00:31:28,253
Speaker 3: They had a number of open sides on the park

601
00:31:28,533 --> 00:31:31,933
Speaker 3: throughout their loose Traio Marrow ToJ as well, So I

602
00:31:31,973 --> 00:31:34,893
Speaker 3: think they won the contact, they won the collisions, and

603
00:31:36,133 --> 00:31:38,493
Speaker 3: they Harry Deil Blacks at the breakdown as well.

604
00:31:38,613 --> 00:31:42,133
Speaker 2: They did. You mentioned cam royguard before. I agree, and

605
00:31:42,333 --> 00:31:44,533
Speaker 2: it didn't help the quotes right and played two minutes

606
00:31:44,573 --> 00:31:47,453
Speaker 2: of rage in the last two weeks understandably as well.

607
00:31:47,493 --> 00:31:49,093
Speaker 3: But I think I saw a stat from Jamie wall

608
00:31:49,133 --> 00:31:51,773
Speaker 3: maybe eleven minutes and six weeks or something like that.

609
00:31:51,693 --> 00:31:55,573
Speaker 2: And there's some stat like regards well until yesterday, the

610
00:31:55,653 --> 00:31:57,773
Speaker 2: only loss had had I think was France last year

611
00:31:58,333 --> 00:32:01,213
Speaker 2: under Scott Robertson. And you know he goes off with

612
00:32:01,333 --> 00:32:03,253
Speaker 2: what half an hour ago roughly, and they sell Blacks

613
00:32:03,293 --> 00:32:06,133
Speaker 2: are behind at that point. Who knows reguards out there,

614
00:32:06,213 --> 00:32:08,653
Speaker 2: but you do notice that you do notice that I

615
00:32:08,733 --> 00:32:11,453
Speaker 2: can get ten to twenty meters more with his kicks

616
00:32:11,533 --> 00:32:14,413
Speaker 2: than courtiz rights. So they don't team to have a

617
00:32:14,453 --> 00:32:16,373
Speaker 2: lot of faith with them, and then they are exposed

618
00:32:16,413 --> 00:32:19,973
Speaker 2: yesterday when they had to to bring them on. So

619
00:32:20,013 --> 00:32:22,013
Speaker 2: there are there are a lot of issues.

620
00:32:22,173 --> 00:32:24,573
Speaker 3: You can't you can't rely on one guy can't exactly

621
00:32:24,613 --> 00:32:28,293
Speaker 3: as influential as he is and as he will continue

622
00:32:28,333 --> 00:32:30,933
Speaker 3: to be. It can't be all on a show.

623
00:32:30,973 --> 00:32:33,093
Speaker 2: But at this point, how vitally is now to these

624
00:32:33,133 --> 00:32:34,893
Speaker 2: ten the team's hopes. So you think about when he's

625
00:32:34,893 --> 00:32:38,453
Speaker 2: injured earlier in the year and how they responded to that. Right,

626
00:32:38,533 --> 00:32:40,853
Speaker 2: we'll take a break, come back, let's talk about the

627
00:32:40,893 --> 00:32:42,853
Speaker 2: composition of the team to play Wales this week, what

628
00:32:42,853 --> 00:32:44,253
Speaker 2: we think it might be, and also wrap up the

629
00:32:44,293 --> 00:32:50,733
Speaker 2: rest of the weekend here on Ragby Direct power they

630
00:32:50,853 --> 00:32:56,293
Speaker 2: use You're back with Rugby Direct powered by Exis Solutions.

631
00:32:56,533 --> 00:32:59,493
Speaker 2: It's park England for the time being. And let's talk

632
00:32:59,733 --> 00:33:02,853
Speaker 2: about Wales in Cardiff, which is we were at well,

633
00:33:03,813 --> 00:33:09,053
Speaker 2: that's right, you can at Liam Napier indeed, any critiques

634
00:33:09,053 --> 00:33:13,333
Speaker 2: of that of the Welsh accent? What do they do

635
00:33:13,493 --> 00:33:15,373
Speaker 2: this weekend? We saw the end of year last year.

636
00:33:16,693 --> 00:33:19,333
Speaker 2: Now Wales managed to speak Japan yesterday. But this is

637
00:33:19,333 --> 00:33:21,133
Speaker 2: a test that All Black should win. And do I

638
00:33:21,173 --> 00:33:25,293
Speaker 2: say that should win? Well, how did they approach this

639
00:33:25,373 --> 00:33:28,133
Speaker 2: Test match? Because last year they kept too many bodies

640
00:33:28,133 --> 00:33:31,173
Speaker 2: going right to the end of the season. This year

641
00:33:31,453 --> 00:33:34,013
Speaker 2: that coming off a loss, they can't win a Grand Slam.

642
00:33:34,493 --> 00:33:37,533
Speaker 2: Do they be a little bit more inventive? What was

643
00:33:38,053 --> 00:33:40,973
Speaker 2: you're feeling on a Sunday afternoon as to which way

644
00:33:41,253 --> 00:33:42,013
Speaker 2: your Blacks will go?

645
00:33:42,813 --> 00:33:46,013
Speaker 3: I suspect it will be wholesale changes. I think there

646
00:33:46,053 --> 00:33:48,413
Speaker 3: was an element I'm not making excuses for them, but

647
00:33:49,213 --> 00:33:51,133
Speaker 3: and the elements of that performance last week of the

648
00:33:51,133 --> 00:33:55,173
Speaker 3: All Blacks being a gassed yep, from the previous week

649
00:33:55,213 --> 00:34:01,573
Speaker 3: at Murrayfield, from the year England steamrolled them, and elements

650
00:34:01,573 --> 00:34:04,493
Speaker 3: of that game. So there's a number of injuries. I

651
00:34:04,493 --> 00:34:07,333
Speaker 3: don't think we'll see bon and Barretts, cam Roy guards

652
00:34:07,973 --> 00:34:13,573
Speaker 3: through injury. I think it'll be almost car Blanche a

653
00:34:13,613 --> 00:34:16,013
Speaker 3: whole new team. I think you'll see McKenzie at ten,

654
00:34:16,213 --> 00:34:20,053
Speaker 3: Ruben Love at fullback. Sevu will come onto the wing,

655
00:34:21,093 --> 00:34:27,253
Speaker 3: Riquewani will start somewhere. You'd have to play all the

656
00:34:27,253 --> 00:34:30,413
Speaker 3: guys that haven't featured. Cortes Latma probably starts, with Filet

657
00:34:30,493 --> 00:34:34,413
Speaker 3: Christie on the bench, and there's a number of others

658
00:34:35,013 --> 00:34:38,653
Speaker 3: you know, do see Carrefi probably starts. You can go

659
00:34:38,773 --> 00:34:42,613
Speaker 3: through all the players that we haven't seen, really have

660
00:34:42,693 --> 00:34:42,973
Speaker 3: seen a.

661
00:34:42,933 --> 00:34:46,293
Speaker 2: Lot because it's been a fairly predictable bar a change

662
00:34:46,333 --> 00:34:47,133
Speaker 2: here the team what.

663
00:34:47,973 --> 00:34:50,093
Speaker 3: I sort of touched on the back line largely there.

664
00:34:50,093 --> 00:34:51,693
Speaker 3: What about the full pack, what do they do there?

665
00:34:52,733 --> 00:34:54,893
Speaker 3: Just that replacement front row start.

666
00:34:54,933 --> 00:34:57,693
Speaker 2: They'll probably move them into start and then maybe a

667
00:34:57,733 --> 00:35:02,213
Speaker 2: debut for Tavita Muffalo potentially off the bench, George Bell

668
00:35:02,333 --> 00:35:06,813
Speaker 2: off the bench as well. You'd think locks wise will

669
00:35:06,853 --> 00:35:09,413
Speaker 2: be interesting in Fabian Hains out at Yesterday's had a

670
00:35:09,453 --> 00:35:12,613
Speaker 2: big workload. I don't really see the value in him

671
00:35:12,693 --> 00:35:17,813
Speaker 2: playing necessarily, so maybe Sam Dar Darry starts alongside Josh Lord.

672
00:35:17,893 --> 00:35:20,733
Speaker 2: Josh Lord, who's you lose for Tree? You ran through

673
00:35:20,773 --> 00:35:22,933
Speaker 2: with them? But then do you Scott Barrett didn't play

674
00:35:22,933 --> 00:35:25,853
Speaker 2: the last two weeks essentially, so does Scott Barrett play.

675
00:35:26,453 --> 00:35:29,053
Speaker 3: And he's got most of the Super Rugby season off.

676
00:35:29,133 --> 00:35:32,453
Speaker 2: Yeah, so he had one last season before having a

677
00:35:32,453 --> 00:35:33,133
Speaker 2: bit of a break.

678
00:35:33,213 --> 00:35:36,293
Speaker 3: Potentially. Yeah, I think you'll see do see at seven,

679
00:35:37,453 --> 00:35:48,453
Speaker 3: maybe Wallace start at six, six or eight lucky again potentially, Look,

680
00:35:48,533 --> 00:35:51,813
Speaker 3: Jacobson's gone home. Christian Leo where it could be on

681
00:35:51,853 --> 00:35:55,093
Speaker 3: the bench somewhere he's I saw him he was still

682
00:35:55,133 --> 00:36:00,413
Speaker 3: at Twickenham with that team. So yeah, I think it'll

683
00:36:00,413 --> 00:36:05,053
Speaker 3: be wholesale changes and that will probably make for it'll

684
00:36:05,053 --> 00:36:08,893
Speaker 3: be challenging because there won't be established combinations and any

685
00:36:08,933 --> 00:36:12,933
Speaker 3: time you make but that vast number of changes, you

686
00:36:13,333 --> 00:36:15,693
Speaker 3: tend to get a dip in performance. We saw it.

687
00:36:16,613 --> 00:36:18,453
Speaker 3: The last time we really saw it was in Hamilton

688
00:36:18,533 --> 00:36:19,853
Speaker 3: in the third Test against France.

689
00:36:20,173 --> 00:36:22,253
Speaker 2: Is there a risk, yeah, if they changed too much

690
00:36:22,373 --> 00:36:24,773
Speaker 2: that it could all become a little bit shambollic.

691
00:36:25,293 --> 00:36:29,213
Speaker 3: Yeah, potentially, But you have to give these guys s

692
00:36:29,213 --> 00:36:32,173
Speaker 3: game time. And because of the way that the season's

693
00:36:32,213 --> 00:36:36,853
Speaker 3: panned out. This is the only real chance Razor has

694
00:36:36,893 --> 00:36:37,573
Speaker 3: to do it, isn't it?

695
00:36:37,613 --> 00:36:39,893
Speaker 2: Is there any chance that they put Ruben Love into.

696
00:36:39,733 --> 00:36:42,893
Speaker 3: Ten not to start. He might come in there in

697
00:36:42,933 --> 00:36:45,653
Speaker 3: the back end of the match, but I think Mackenzie

698
00:36:45,693 --> 00:36:47,373
Speaker 3: starts at ten and Ruben at full back.

699
00:36:47,413 --> 00:36:49,573
Speaker 2: Could he have him at ten and Mackenzie at fullback?

700
00:36:49,853 --> 00:36:53,013
Speaker 3: You could, but I just can't see it. They haven't

701
00:36:53,013 --> 00:36:55,053
Speaker 3: played him at all at ten, not even at the

702
00:36:55,053 --> 00:36:58,053
Speaker 3: back end of a match, so that to me suggests

703
00:36:58,053 --> 00:37:00,853
Speaker 3: a lack of faith despite all the public messaging. I

704
00:37:00,933 --> 00:37:03,373
Speaker 3: just can't see them throwing him in to start at ten.

705
00:37:03,533 --> 00:37:04,693
Speaker 3: But it could be wrong.

706
00:37:05,773 --> 00:37:08,333
Speaker 2: It feels like, yeah, it's hard to know how to

707
00:37:08,493 --> 00:37:10,413
Speaker 2: feels like this is a bronze middle match now for

708
00:37:10,493 --> 00:37:13,253
Speaker 2: the All Blacks. Feels like a World Cup. Funnily enough

709
00:37:13,253 --> 00:37:15,053
Speaker 2: twenty nineteen when they lost to England in the semi

710
00:37:15,053 --> 00:37:18,093
Speaker 2: final then had to play Wales for the bronze before

711
00:37:18,093 --> 00:37:20,213
Speaker 2: going home. It feels like this week's a bronze middle

712
00:37:20,213 --> 00:37:24,013
Speaker 2: match when the Grand Slam's not on the line, but

713
00:37:24,053 --> 00:37:25,413
Speaker 2: you still need to get a win out of it.

714
00:37:25,853 --> 00:37:29,933
Speaker 2: Chance to bring in some players for some game time

715
00:37:30,053 --> 00:37:33,333
Speaker 2: to finish the year and they need to keep the

716
00:37:33,333 --> 00:37:35,853
Speaker 2: standards or make the standards high this week or else

717
00:37:35,853 --> 00:37:39,053
Speaker 2: it could be a very very long summer for this

718
00:37:39,093 --> 00:37:40,013
Speaker 2: All Blacks team.

719
00:37:40,333 --> 00:37:43,733
Speaker 3: Here we travel by train today from London to Cardiff.

720
00:37:44,093 --> 00:37:46,253
Speaker 3: Is quite a long old trip, but the All Blacks

721
00:37:46,253 --> 00:37:48,653
Speaker 3: are busting and I suspect that would have been a

722
00:37:48,693 --> 00:37:52,853
Speaker 3: fairly some somber old trip and it will be difficult

723
00:37:53,133 --> 00:37:59,213
Speaker 3: to pick themselves up after blowing the Grand Slam, having

724
00:37:59,853 --> 00:38:04,133
Speaker 3: such a deflating loss to England at Twickenham, so making

725
00:38:04,173 --> 00:38:07,333
Speaker 3: those changes and bringing in some fresh legs as one

726
00:38:07,373 --> 00:38:09,773
Speaker 3: way to pretend shoually counted that right.

727
00:38:09,853 --> 00:38:11,813
Speaker 2: Quick wrap up of some of the other games across

728
00:38:11,853 --> 00:38:15,493
Speaker 2: the weekend, we saw Ireland's comfortably account for Australia, who

729
00:38:15,493 --> 00:38:17,053
Speaker 2: were in the match for a little bit but then

730
00:38:17,813 --> 00:38:21,853
Speaker 2: faded pretty badly late and proceeding speaking of late fades,

731
00:38:22,413 --> 00:38:25,133
Speaker 2: Scotland from twenty one the up as we're recording this

732
00:38:25,173 --> 00:38:29,613
Speaker 2: podcast done and have lost thirty three twenty four to

733
00:38:29,893 --> 00:38:33,973
Speaker 2: Argentina rather stagorc seeds in the Arabian rig studio that

734
00:38:34,013 --> 00:38:37,413
Speaker 2: have been playing out while we've been recording this, and

735
00:38:37,653 --> 00:38:41,013
Speaker 2: South Africa against Italy was a bizarre old match. At

736
00:38:41,013 --> 00:38:43,653
Speaker 2: times we had Franco Moster recarded for a tackle that

737
00:38:44,573 --> 00:38:47,533
Speaker 2: did not appear to be recard for mere look shouldered

738
00:38:47,533 --> 00:38:51,893
Speaker 2: to chest if anything. And again more issues with the

739
00:38:51,973 --> 00:38:55,373
Speaker 2: TMO and the interference there. And these autumn games where

740
00:38:55,493 --> 00:38:58,133
Speaker 2: the referees seem to have just decided to lose the

741
00:38:58,173 --> 00:39:00,653
Speaker 2: plot again. Feels like we're back to twenty twenty three.

742
00:39:00,773 --> 00:39:03,733
Speaker 2: Seems like they cleaned up a little bit earlier in

743
00:39:03,773 --> 00:39:06,653
Speaker 2: the year, they have now just gone backwards. I don't

744
00:39:06,693 --> 00:39:09,253
Speaker 2: know why the foul player review officer can't shady fully

745
00:39:09,293 --> 00:39:12,933
Speaker 2: car full redcard. Excuse me, but enough on that. Yes,

746
00:39:12,933 --> 00:39:17,533
Speaker 2: Africa it's too good forly in the end. And Wales

747
00:39:17,573 --> 00:39:19,893
Speaker 2: the all black Sneks opponent beating Japan. So what stood

748
00:39:19,893 --> 00:39:22,013
Speaker 2: out from those games for you, Lamb.

749
00:39:24,293 --> 00:39:27,453
Speaker 3: Well, let's touch on Wales because that's relevant, isn't it.

750
00:39:28,053 --> 00:39:31,933
Speaker 3: They very nearly lost to Japan at home and Cardiff,

751
00:39:31,973 --> 00:39:36,053
Speaker 3: and that pretty much sums up where the Welsh are

752
00:39:36,053 --> 00:39:39,773
Speaker 3: at at the moments. They they kicked a penalty, didn't

753
00:39:39,773 --> 00:39:42,493
Speaker 3: they basically on full time to win it. And that

754
00:39:42,613 --> 00:39:45,813
Speaker 3: was a real topsy turvy match, Japan scoring Whales scoring.

755
00:39:47,373 --> 00:39:49,533
Speaker 3: So I guess that just puts in context where they

756
00:39:49,533 --> 00:39:53,893
Speaker 3: are at and the expectations around the All Blacks this week.

757
00:39:54,773 --> 00:39:57,213
Speaker 3: Also just to note, the All Blacks fifteen completed the

758
00:39:57,373 --> 00:40:02,013
Speaker 3: unbeaten tour forty five twenty one over Uruguay, So a

759
00:40:02,053 --> 00:40:08,173
Speaker 3: successful tour there for Jamie Joseph Side. I think it's

760
00:40:08,733 --> 00:40:11,133
Speaker 3: a good bounce back win for the Irish, wasn't it.

761
00:40:11,973 --> 00:40:16,093
Speaker 3: France struggled against Fiji and so afgot that was very

762
00:40:16,133 --> 00:40:18,933
Speaker 3: much their second string team. But to again for a

763
00:40:18,973 --> 00:40:22,653
Speaker 3: second week in a row overcome a red cards with

764
00:40:24,293 --> 00:40:27,853
Speaker 3: in this occasion your second string team really does speak

765
00:40:27,893 --> 00:40:33,293
Speaker 3: to their depth, their character and I think just how

766
00:40:33,333 --> 00:40:35,653
Speaker 3: far ahead they are at the moment of everyone it is.

767
00:40:35,813 --> 00:40:39,213
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it's two years after a World Cup

768
00:40:39,213 --> 00:40:41,493
Speaker 2: and things can change, but there's no doubt they're the

769
00:40:41,493 --> 00:40:43,533
Speaker 2: best team in the world right now, and I think

770
00:40:43,533 --> 00:40:49,093
Speaker 2: there's a bit of distance between them and maybe England. Yeah,

771
00:40:49,733 --> 00:40:51,613
Speaker 2: and a lot of things can change over two years,

772
00:40:51,613 --> 00:40:55,333
Speaker 2: you know. The All Blacks and twenty seventeen began to

773
00:40:55,373 --> 00:40:57,453
Speaker 2: go backwards a little bit two years out from a

774
00:40:57,493 --> 00:41:00,133
Speaker 2: World Cup set. I've hit of that junction now where

775
00:41:00,173 --> 00:41:02,093
Speaker 2: things started to go backwards a little bit for the

776
00:41:02,093 --> 00:41:07,133
Speaker 2: All Blacks, but it's hard to see them having a

777
00:41:07,533 --> 00:41:09,853
Speaker 2: drop off enough, you know, ahead of the World Cup.

778
00:41:09,893 --> 00:41:12,173
Speaker 2: I think they'll go in his favorites again two years

779
00:41:12,213 --> 00:41:13,373
Speaker 2: out from the next event.

780
00:41:13,733 --> 00:41:15,653
Speaker 3: It's hard to see that changing, isn't it.

781
00:41:15,653 --> 00:41:19,373
Speaker 2: It is Scotland's tough old evening for them.

782
00:41:19,493 --> 00:41:22,053
Speaker 3: It's a really bad loss for Scotland. Twenty one kneel

783
00:41:22,213 --> 00:41:25,253
Speaker 3: up after what happened last week. They really needed to

784
00:41:26,133 --> 00:41:31,653
Speaker 3: respond and just say hey, we can take yourself and scalp.

785
00:41:33,293 --> 00:41:35,813
Speaker 3: You know, there's a bit about us. We can finish,

786
00:41:35,933 --> 00:41:38,493
Speaker 3: we can close out a match and I've done a

787
00:41:38,493 --> 00:41:39,293
Speaker 3: complete opposite.

788
00:41:39,333 --> 00:41:41,133
Speaker 2: Well, when you came in, I was like Argentine's having

789
00:41:41,173 --> 00:41:43,293
Speaker 2: one of those days. You know, one of those times

790
00:41:43,293 --> 00:41:46,013
Speaker 2: where you know the performance of Argentina are capable of

791
00:41:46,013 --> 00:41:48,133
Speaker 2: when they're at their very best, but you also know

792
00:41:48,173 --> 00:41:52,733
Speaker 2: when they're at there worse they can turn in games

793
00:41:52,773 --> 00:41:55,133
Speaker 2: and basically just not turn up. Well. Appeared like it

794
00:41:55,173 --> 00:41:57,613
Speaker 2: was one of those days. Then Switch gets flipped, some

795
00:41:57,613 --> 00:41:59,893
Speaker 2: good impact from the bench and they go off and

796
00:42:02,133 --> 00:42:04,613
Speaker 2: Scotland at Murrayfield and now gregat town's end. I think

797
00:42:04,613 --> 00:42:07,133
Speaker 2: they got Tonga next weekend to wrap up this window.

798
00:42:07,293 --> 00:42:10,733
Speaker 2: It's now been a less than fruitful window for Gregor

799
00:42:10,853 --> 00:42:13,493
Speaker 2: from what it could have been, you know, ten minutes

800
00:42:13,533 --> 00:42:14,493
Speaker 2: from full time last week.

801
00:42:14,533 --> 00:42:18,133
Speaker 3: For all their promise and enterprise, and they've got some

802
00:42:18,213 --> 00:42:20,533
Speaker 3: great talents in that squad, they don't have a lot

803
00:42:20,573 --> 00:42:23,653
Speaker 3: to show for it. Argentina go on to play England,

804
00:42:23,653 --> 00:42:24,693
Speaker 3: that twick and them, so that'll.

805
00:42:24,533 --> 00:42:25,453
Speaker 2: Be interesting, fascinating.

806
00:42:25,493 --> 00:42:28,413
Speaker 3: Metionis Sunday, Sunday our local time, yes, Monday morning, New

807
00:42:28,493 --> 00:42:28,933
Speaker 3: Zealand time.

808
00:42:28,973 --> 00:42:33,413
Speaker 2: Yeah, it will be fascinating, as will the week here

809
00:42:33,453 --> 00:42:34,293
Speaker 2: in Cardiff.

810
00:42:35,613 --> 00:42:37,813
Speaker 3: Watch them flooding from the valas.

811
00:42:38,213 --> 00:42:41,733
Speaker 2: Again Nat Liam maybe for critiques on that Welsh extent.

812
00:42:42,533 --> 00:42:46,773
Speaker 2: Thanks to Excess Solutions as always for supporting this podcast,

813
00:42:46,893 --> 00:42:48,613
Speaker 2: larst and Bars English, you're putting it together. Will be

814
00:42:48,653 --> 00:42:51,333
Speaker 2: back once the All Blacks team to play Wales is

815
00:42:51,373 --> 00:42:53,413
Speaker 2: revealed later in the week. How close did we get

816
00:42:53,413 --> 00:42:57,293
Speaker 2: with those predictions? We will see you then, every try,

817
00:42:57,573 --> 00:43:01,053
Speaker 2: try ten sixty second, every tackle tackle get up again.

818
00:43:04,133 --> 00:43:04,413
Speaker 2: Thank you.

819
00:43:04,493 --> 00:43:09,213
Speaker 1: Before harm night it's Rumpy dig Ladies talks For more

820
00:43:09,293 --> 00:43:12,573
Speaker 1: from Newstalk st B. Listen live on air or online

821
00:43:12,733 --> 00:43:15,093
Speaker 1: and keep our shows with you wherever you go with

822
00:43:15,213 --> 00:43:17,133
Speaker 1: our podcasts on iHeartRadio,