1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:02,840 Speaker 1: And of course with us is Nikola Willis the Finance Minister. 2 00:00:02,880 --> 00:00:07,040 Speaker 1: Hi Nikola, Hi, Ever, are you guys considering a storm 3 00:00:07,160 --> 00:00:07,920 Speaker 1: damage tax? 4 00:00:09,160 --> 00:00:10,480 Speaker 2: No, we're not so. 5 00:00:10,600 --> 00:00:13,440 Speaker 1: Matthew Houston writing that a storm damage tax has been 6 00:00:13,440 --> 00:00:15,160 Speaker 1: temporarily put on hold is what. 7 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:20,239 Speaker 2: He's very confused. So what we have is the Natural 8 00:00:20,280 --> 00:00:24,320 Speaker 2: Hazards Commission. You'll be aware that's the old EQC and 9 00:00:24,640 --> 00:00:28,120 Speaker 2: Home and Contents insurers. At the moment, when you pay 10 00:00:28,120 --> 00:00:30,200 Speaker 2: for your home and contents insurance, there's a small levy. 11 00:00:30,560 --> 00:00:33,920 Speaker 2: So the Natural Hazards Commission. Our government actually made the 12 00:00:34,000 --> 00:00:38,720 Speaker 2: decision to pause a plan to increase that levee by 13 00:00:38,880 --> 00:00:41,440 Speaker 2: a couple of one hundred dollars a year while we were 14 00:00:41,440 --> 00:00:44,839 Speaker 2: looking at what's happening with insurance affordability and uptake. So 15 00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:48,240 Speaker 2: no plan to introduce a new weather tax. 16 00:00:48,520 --> 00:00:51,239 Speaker 1: So the weather tax would be what that tax when 17 00:00:51,240 --> 00:00:52,280 Speaker 1: it's finally brought back in. 18 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:55,520 Speaker 2: Look, you'd have to ask you, Matthew what he's talking about. 19 00:00:55,600 --> 00:00:59,560 Speaker 2: Everyone at the moment, and they have for several years 20 00:00:59,680 --> 00:01:02,080 Speaker 2: pay a small levy to the government when they take 21 00:01:02,080 --> 00:01:05,040 Speaker 2: out Home and Contents insurance, and that's there to cover 22 00:01:05,520 --> 00:01:08,360 Speaker 2: hazardous damage to your land. In your house. 23 00:01:08,480 --> 00:01:14,440 Speaker 1: Okay, the taxes that major banks play pay, you're having 24 00:01:14,440 --> 00:01:16,559 Speaker 1: a look at that. Are you planning on doing something 25 00:01:16,560 --> 00:01:17,160 Speaker 1: in this space? 26 00:01:18,720 --> 00:01:21,560 Speaker 2: Well, what I have been doing, of course, is looking 27 00:01:21,600 --> 00:01:25,240 Speaker 2: at the general rules that apply to our major Australian 28 00:01:25,280 --> 00:01:27,520 Speaker 2: banks to make sure that the rules are all fair. 29 00:01:27,959 --> 00:01:31,800 Speaker 2: One of the areas that ID are currently consulting with 30 00:01:31,840 --> 00:01:36,240 Speaker 2: the major banks on is how they account for their 31 00:01:36,280 --> 00:01:39,520 Speaker 2: profits in New Zealand versus offshore and therefore what tax 32 00:01:39,560 --> 00:01:44,280 Speaker 2: implications that has. It's called branch sharing arrangements. They're in 33 00:01:44,319 --> 00:01:47,199 Speaker 2: consultation with them to understand whether we're doing that fairly 34 00:01:47,319 --> 00:01:50,920 Speaker 2: or not. And that's just basically what you do to 35 00:01:51,040 --> 00:01:53,200 Speaker 2: have good tax law. You make sure that the way 36 00:01:53,280 --> 00:01:55,840 Speaker 2: the tax law is working is that it's working is intended, 37 00:01:55,880 --> 00:01:59,400 Speaker 2: that it's fair, that people aren't avoiding it in ways 38 00:01:59,400 --> 00:02:03,080 Speaker 2: that went weren't presumed they would when the rules wouldn't last. 39 00:02:03,120 --> 00:02:06,080 Speaker 1: Okay, but there is the possibility of adding a levy here, 40 00:02:06,120 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 1: isn't there? 41 00:02:07,800 --> 00:02:11,119 Speaker 2: Well, we have this year, of course, added the deposit 42 00:02:11,200 --> 00:02:15,079 Speaker 2: Compensation Scheme levy, which I mean essentially means that all 43 00:02:15,120 --> 00:02:18,000 Speaker 2: New Zealanders know that up to ten thousand dollars of 44 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:21,320 Speaker 2: your sailings will be covered in the event of a 45 00:02:21,360 --> 00:02:24,280 Speaker 2: major bank failure and everyone's paying a levee for that. 46 00:02:24,280 --> 00:02:26,480 Speaker 2: That was something initiated by the last government that we 47 00:02:26,520 --> 00:02:28,760 Speaker 2: think is good policy, and we're continuing. 48 00:02:28,600 --> 00:02:29,919 Speaker 1: No further levies on banks. 49 00:02:31,440 --> 00:02:34,400 Speaker 2: Well, as you can see by the discussion that I'm having, 50 00:02:34,520 --> 00:02:37,880 Speaker 2: the way that we tax banks is something that I 51 00:02:37,919 --> 00:02:40,520 Speaker 2: think should be always under a view, always looking at 52 00:02:40,560 --> 00:02:42,600 Speaker 2: to make sure that it's fair. But bottom line, for me, 53 00:02:43,160 --> 00:02:45,680 Speaker 2: I want it to be fair on you, the user 54 00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:48,200 Speaker 2: of banking services. I don't want it to be something 55 00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:49,840 Speaker 2: that imposes an extra cost on you. 56 00:02:50,200 --> 00:02:52,080 Speaker 1: So it is possible that there will be a bank levy. 57 00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:56,359 Speaker 2: Well, there already are bank levies. Let banks pay levies 58 00:02:56,400 --> 00:02:59,600 Speaker 2: to the Financial Markets Authority, they pay levees on the 59 00:02:59,639 --> 00:03:03,440 Speaker 2: deposit compensation scheme, and of course they pay tax on 60 00:03:03,480 --> 00:03:06,360 Speaker 2: the profits that they make. And as I FED, I 61 00:03:06,400 --> 00:03:09,960 Speaker 2: have been seeking advice on is all of that looking tidy? 62 00:03:10,040 --> 00:03:11,000 Speaker 2: Is it all looking fair? 63 00:03:12,160 --> 00:03:15,560 Speaker 1: Just rule it in or out right. It's possible if 64 00:03:15,560 --> 00:03:17,040 Speaker 1: you don't rule it because but you know, we play 65 00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:18,480 Speaker 1: this game. But then if you don't rule it out, 66 00:03:18,520 --> 00:03:21,920 Speaker 1: then it means I go banks levy tick she's considering it. 67 00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:25,920 Speaker 2: If I go into the budget ruling things in and out, 68 00:03:26,000 --> 00:03:28,520 Speaker 2: what quickly happens and we went through this together. 69 00:03:28,280 --> 00:03:29,520 Speaker 1: This might pop up in the budget. 70 00:03:30,080 --> 00:03:33,440 Speaker 2: You say, you say, oh, well she ruled that out, 71 00:03:33,440 --> 00:03:35,200 Speaker 2: but then she won't rule that out. So that means 72 00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:37,440 Speaker 2: that that is happening, and it just becomes a deductive 73 00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:39,760 Speaker 2: thing ahead of the budget. I just go into not 74 00:03:39,880 --> 00:03:44,000 Speaker 2: ruling out, not ruling out my just acknowledging range of things. 75 00:03:44,000 --> 00:03:46,240 Speaker 1: Are you aware that on another tax, which is the 76 00:03:46,280 --> 00:03:48,480 Speaker 1: border tax, freightways has a problem and they would like 77 00:03:48,520 --> 00:03:49,480 Speaker 1: a level playing field. 78 00:03:51,520 --> 00:03:53,160 Speaker 2: I am aware of this, and I just want your 79 00:03:53,160 --> 00:03:56,200 Speaker 2: readers to understand your listeners to understand what this is about, 80 00:03:56,400 --> 00:04:00,560 Speaker 2: which is lots of people post COVID started buying things 81 00:04:00,640 --> 00:04:04,640 Speaker 2: from Shine and Timu and online. The challenge with that 82 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:07,520 Speaker 2: is is it costs you, the general tax payer, a 83 00:04:07,520 --> 00:04:09,760 Speaker 2: lot of money at the border. By the time customs 84 00:04:09,760 --> 00:04:12,080 Speaker 2: have done their thing, the Border Protection people have done 85 00:04:12,120 --> 00:04:15,440 Speaker 2: their thing, and it created a massive cost to the 86 00:04:15,480 --> 00:04:18,640 Speaker 2: tax payer. And the principle that Casey Costello, the Minister, 87 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:21,560 Speaker 2: has applied is actually the costs of all of that 88 00:04:21,640 --> 00:04:23,880 Speaker 2: should be borne by the person buying the goods. So 89 00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:27,480 Speaker 2: we should charge the career company's a price that reflects 90 00:04:27,480 --> 00:04:30,320 Speaker 2: how much it actually costs to get those goods, and through. 91 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:32,680 Speaker 1: This it looks pretty fair. That is a perfectly good 92 00:04:32,720 --> 00:04:34,560 Speaker 1: explanation for it. But here's the thing. There's always a 93 00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:37,279 Speaker 1: good explanation for another tax. But we've just talked about 94 00:04:37,320 --> 00:04:40,119 Speaker 1: three taxes that you're considering. That's a lot of tax 95 00:04:40,160 --> 00:04:42,080 Speaker 1: for a government that was not supposed to bring in 96 00:04:42,160 --> 00:04:43,080 Speaker 1: any new taxes. 97 00:04:43,360 --> 00:04:45,760 Speaker 2: Hey, hey, hey, the first one we considered is one 98 00:04:45,760 --> 00:04:50,119 Speaker 2: where I rejected the advice of officials to increase the levey. 99 00:04:50,320 --> 00:04:52,520 Speaker 1: I wasn't counting that. That's the fourth one. We're just 100 00:04:52,520 --> 00:04:53,760 Speaker 1: talking about the three you are doing. 101 00:04:54,680 --> 00:05:00,760 Speaker 2: So you're talking about border tax, gas tax. I think 102 00:05:00,839 --> 00:05:04,200 Speaker 2: every government has two things that should do. The first 103 00:05:04,320 --> 00:05:07,160 Speaker 2: is minimize the new things that you do that will 104 00:05:07,200 --> 00:05:10,400 Speaker 2: create costs for people. The second thing is you should 105 00:05:10,480 --> 00:05:12,520 Speaker 2: ask who should pay that cost. Should it be you, 106 00:05:12,600 --> 00:05:16,000 Speaker 2: the general tax payer from your wages, or is this 107 00:05:16,160 --> 00:05:18,320 Speaker 2: something that should be paid by the people who are 108 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:19,279 Speaker 2: actually benefits. 109 00:05:19,279 --> 00:05:21,680 Speaker 1: Which I love if when you put up the tax 110 00:05:21,720 --> 00:05:24,400 Speaker 1: on the people, the user pays you reduce my taxes. 111 00:05:25,160 --> 00:05:27,520 Speaker 2: But you don't, well, I think We need to come 112 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:29,440 Speaker 2: at it this way, which is before you put any 113 00:05:29,600 --> 00:05:33,039 Speaker 2: user pays on or increase the user pays, first ask 114 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:36,200 Speaker 2: yourself the question does this really need to be done? 115 00:05:36,320 --> 00:05:40,200 Speaker 2: And is it being done as efficiently as possible? And 116 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:44,080 Speaker 2: those are two questions our government always asks and we're very. 117 00:05:43,960 --> 00:05:46,160 Speaker 1: Clear about that. Now, Chippy and the Labor Party are 118 00:05:46,160 --> 00:05:48,440 Speaker 1: stirring trouble, as you well know about the India FTA. 119 00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:50,280 Speaker 1: So what can you tell us about this business that 120 00:05:50,320 --> 00:05:52,600 Speaker 1: if we don't put the private investment into India within 121 00:05:52,640 --> 00:05:55,360 Speaker 1: the next fifteen years, they may well pull market access. 122 00:05:56,200 --> 00:05:58,880 Speaker 2: Well, look, what I understand from Minister maclay is that 123 00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:02,400 Speaker 2: there is a really strong aspiration in the Free Trade 124 00:06:02,440 --> 00:06:07,039 Speaker 2: Agreement to promote in investment, but it doesn't guarantee a 125 00:06:07,080 --> 00:06:10,120 Speaker 2: specific amount of money and that that's not what the 126 00:06:10,200 --> 00:06:12,680 Speaker 2: agreement is saying. What it's saying is let's both agree 127 00:06:12,760 --> 00:06:16,719 Speaker 2: to promote significant levels of investment in our respective countries. 128 00:06:16,800 --> 00:06:20,600 Speaker 2: Let's put some aspirational targets out there, but it doesn't 129 00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:23,960 Speaker 2: seek to hold governments accountable for ensuring that bottom line is. 130 00:06:23,920 --> 00:06:26,760 Speaker 1: Okay, So when Chippy says that the Indian government is 131 00:06:26,800 --> 00:06:29,880 Speaker 1: telling its people that if we don't invest adequately, they 132 00:06:29,920 --> 00:06:32,360 Speaker 1: will pull market access and that's in the agreement. He's 133 00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:34,120 Speaker 1: talking rubbish. 134 00:06:34,200 --> 00:06:36,880 Speaker 2: Well, you'd have to ask Chris Hopkins about that. 135 00:06:37,640 --> 00:06:39,679 Speaker 1: I have to ask you because you guys have actually 136 00:06:39,760 --> 00:06:40,800 Speaker 1: seen the documents. 137 00:06:41,800 --> 00:06:45,240 Speaker 2: Well, and I'm telling you specifically that the documents do 138 00:06:45,360 --> 00:06:48,760 Speaker 2: not guarantee a specific amount of money. They have an 139 00:06:48,800 --> 00:06:51,919 Speaker 2: obligation that we promote a certain level of investment, and 140 00:06:51,960 --> 00:06:54,120 Speaker 2: of course there's a difference between those two. Thanks. 141 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:56,080 Speaker 1: Now, listen, what did you make of the Milford boss 142 00:06:56,080 --> 00:06:58,120 Speaker 1: saying that the superage needs to go to seventy two 143 00:06:58,200 --> 00:07:00,800 Speaker 1: or seventy three? Quick smart Well. 144 00:07:00,680 --> 00:07:02,560 Speaker 2: I thought that was a bit over the top, to 145 00:07:02,600 --> 00:07:06,360 Speaker 2: be honest, I do, as we've discussed before, I think 146 00:07:06,600 --> 00:07:09,880 Speaker 2: there is a discussion about how we ensure universal superannuation 147 00:07:10,080 --> 00:07:13,200 Speaker 2: is sustainable into the future. I do think there's a 148 00:07:13,240 --> 00:07:17,160 Speaker 2: proper conversation about the growing role for keyw Saver National 149 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:21,960 Speaker 2: has promoted in the past gradually increasing the superage by 150 00:07:22,120 --> 00:07:24,360 Speaker 2: up to a couple of years, but I haven't heard 151 00:07:24,400 --> 00:07:28,440 Speaker 2: anyone suggest seventy three anytime other than Milford. 152 00:07:29,120 --> 00:07:31,320 Speaker 1: Nicola, Thanks very much, as always, appreciate your time on 153 00:07:31,320 --> 00:07:35,200 Speaker 1: a Monday. That's Nicola Willis, Finance Minister. For more from 154 00:07:35,280 --> 00:07:38,520 Speaker 1: Heather Duplessy Allen Drive, Listen live to news talks. It'd 155 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:41,760 Speaker 1: be from four pm weekdays, or follow the podcast on 156 00:07:41,840 --> 00:07:42,679 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio