WEBVTT - Why Auckland fires reveal urgent need for more firefighting resources 0:00:05.160 --> 0:00:05.560 Kiyota. 0:00:05.680 --> 0:00:09.000 I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page, a 0:00:09.119 --> 0:00:16.240 daily podcast presented by the New Zealand Herald. A major 0:00:16.360 --> 0:00:20.239 blaze at an Auckland supermarket this week has once again 0:00:20.360 --> 0:00:23.800 highlighted the incredible work of our firefighters. 0:00:24.040 --> 0:00:25.200 More than twenty. 0:00:24.840 --> 0:00:29.720 Appliances and over eighty firefighters spend hours containing the fire 0:00:29.800 --> 0:00:33.839 at the Victoria Park New World in scenes that captivated 0:00:33.880 --> 0:00:37.960 audiences across the country. It's not the first major fire 0:00:38.040 --> 0:00:40.479 the city has seen this year either, and it's unlikely 0:00:40.640 --> 0:00:42.920 to be the last. So what's it like on the 0:00:42.960 --> 0:00:46.519 frontline of these fires? And is our current fleet of 0:00:46.640 --> 0:00:50.440 firefighting appliances up for the job? Today on the Front Page, 0:00:50.479 --> 0:00:55.000 we're joined by New Zealand Professional Firefighters Union Auckland President 0:00:55.080 --> 0:00:59.560 Terry Bird and Auckland local Representative Josh Nichols to get. 0:00:59.360 --> 0:01:02.480 Into what it's really like for our firefighters. 0:01:08.640 --> 0:01:11.880 So, Terry, can you give us an insight into what 0:01:11.959 --> 0:01:14.560 goes into containing a fire like what we saw at 0:01:14.600 --> 0:01:16.040 Victoria Park this week. 0:01:16.400 --> 0:01:20.200 We have a set of predetermined responses, so automatically we 0:01:20.240 --> 0:01:25.000 respond to appliances to an incident. The officers in charge 0:01:25.000 --> 0:01:28.720 responding to the QUR can add additional resources and appliances 0:01:28.920 --> 0:01:31.679 if they think that there is a need, and that 0:01:31.720 --> 0:01:34.520 typically happens, and when they get to the fire, they 0:01:34.760 --> 0:01:38.600 size up the situation and consider adding more resources and 0:01:39.000 --> 0:01:41.280 then attack the fire using the tools that they have. 0:01:41.880 --> 0:01:44.440 Josh, I guess as civilians we kind of see the 0:01:44.440 --> 0:01:48.200 fire from the outside, see the plumes of smoke for Instagram, etc. 0:01:48.560 --> 0:01:51.040 But I imagine on the ground it must be quite 0:01:51.200 --> 0:01:52.200 taxing work. 0:01:52.760 --> 0:01:55.000 Yeah, you know, I think that's a really brittent point 0:01:55.040 --> 0:01:56.560 that you bring up, and I think that's something that 0:01:57.040 --> 0:01:59.440 both me and Terry would like to share that we 0:01:59.440 --> 0:02:01.480 should have gone jil members. You know, right through there's 0:02:01.600 --> 0:02:03.320 there's a there's a big group of people here that 0:02:03.320 --> 0:02:05.080 are involved in the response to one of these fires, 0:02:05.080 --> 0:02:06.760 you know, and it starts with our fire com staff 0:02:06.760 --> 0:02:08.560 in the first instance. You know, they're the people that 0:02:08.639 --> 0:02:10.960 mobilize and dispatch their appliances or the crews to go 0:02:11.000 --> 0:02:12.560 up and respond to the call. And then you know 0:02:12.600 --> 0:02:14.680 the members that are out there on the internet ground. 0:02:14.680 --> 0:02:18.200 You know, these are extremely challenging and arduous conditions and 0:02:18.360 --> 0:02:20.320 you know, these these men and one and they give 0:02:20.360 --> 0:02:22.560 it everything. You know, they come to work. I guess with, 0:02:22.919 --> 0:02:25.240 you know, with a pride, a drive and a high 0:02:25.320 --> 0:02:28.080 level of professionalism to sort of save savable life and 0:02:28.120 --> 0:02:30.360 save buildings. You know, for people of the New Zealand 0:02:30.360 --> 0:02:33.520 communities and all are very prudent. Point is the fact 0:02:33.520 --> 0:02:36.079 that it's it's not effort that's letting us down. It's 0:02:36.400 --> 0:02:38.160 it's the equipment, strategies and support. 0:02:41.400 --> 0:02:42.920 I saw a hell a lot of smoke coming out 0:02:42.919 --> 0:02:45.600 of the roof of the building at a New World 0:02:45.680 --> 0:02:49.399 Victoria Park. We walked in there to do some work 0:02:49.440 --> 0:02:54.720 on a supplier and wellin fifteen minutes have been inside. 0:02:55.120 --> 0:03:01.040 I experienced the fire agil maybe in thisitry for so 0:03:01.080 --> 0:03:02.560 long I just thought it was a drill, but it 0:03:02.600 --> 0:03:06.440 was an actual, real fire alarm and within minutes there 0:03:06.480 --> 0:03:07.359 was smoke valuing out. 0:03:07.360 --> 0:03:16.160 Every week, seeing how many appliances and firefighters responded to 0:03:16.639 --> 0:03:19.440 that fire in Auckland this week. If you were to 0:03:19.440 --> 0:03:22.160 live out in Botany or Pocacoa or somewhere, were you 0:03:22.240 --> 0:03:25.360 ever at risk of not having someone show up at 0:03:25.360 --> 0:03:25.800 your door? 0:03:26.200 --> 0:03:28.160 What are the staff challenges here? 0:03:28.320 --> 0:03:32.119 It's a real challenge for an emergency organization to have 0:03:33.040 --> 0:03:36.440 enough resources to deal with an immediate emergency and then 0:03:36.520 --> 0:03:38.800 to have enough resources to deal with a second or 0:03:38.840 --> 0:03:43.040 potentially third or more. And so there's always been a 0:03:43.040 --> 0:03:45.040 way of balancing that, and we have what we call 0:03:45.160 --> 0:03:48.800 service delivery guidelines, and that we try to make sure 0:03:48.920 --> 0:03:51.640 finds tries to make sure that there is enough resources 0:03:52.120 --> 0:03:54.320 to always be able to meet those guidelines. And those 0:03:54.320 --> 0:03:57.760 guidelines are about how long it takes appliances and crews 0:03:57.800 --> 0:04:02.600 to arrive at any structured fire and probably should include 0:04:02.720 --> 0:04:06.760 any emergency. And that's how they determine. What's happened over 0:04:06.880 --> 0:04:13.000 time is that the resources have become more stretched. It's 0:04:13.080 --> 0:04:16.720 taking us longer to get to calls because of traffic 0:04:16.880 --> 0:04:21.520 congestion and traffic calming devices. We are not meeting those times. 0:04:21.520 --> 0:04:25.599 So it is becoming normal for a fire appliance to 0:04:25.640 --> 0:04:27.080 take longer to get to an emergency. 0:04:27.760 --> 0:04:30.679 And I can imagine, Josh, that every minute and every 0:04:30.760 --> 0:04:34.240 moment counts. So how frustrating is it that there are 0:04:34.279 --> 0:04:35.120 those delays. 0:04:35.520 --> 0:04:37.080 It's really frustrating. And I think, you know, we need 0:04:37.120 --> 0:04:40.359 to understand that a fire doubles and size every thirty seconds. 0:04:40.400 --> 0:04:42.440 You know, someone you have put that into perspective. You know, 0:04:42.800 --> 0:04:44.920 times is of the essence, right, you know, when we're 0:04:44.920 --> 0:04:48.359 having appalled specialist appliances from our fourth largest city into 0:04:48.400 --> 0:04:51.159 our largest city, you know at a two to three 0:04:51.200 --> 0:04:53.920 hour response time, you can kind of see where we 0:04:54.760 --> 0:04:56.680 start to face some of their complexities and then the 0:04:56.760 --> 0:04:58.520 challenges that are then on laid to oc cruise on 0:04:58.560 --> 0:05:01.520 the insidaground officers that are in charge and have to 0:05:01.560 --> 0:05:05.359 make those technical command decisions, you know, with limited tools 0:05:05.360 --> 0:05:06.360 on the toolbox, so to speak. 0:05:06.440 --> 0:05:08.239 Yeah, it just seems like a burden that they really 0:05:08.279 --> 0:05:12.440 don't or shouldn't have to deal with in terms of 0:05:12.480 --> 0:05:15.680 the appliances that we're talking about. I mean, am I 0:05:15.800 --> 0:05:19.400 right to say Terry that Auckland has quite an aging fleet. 0:05:19.800 --> 0:05:23.480 Yeah, it's a nationwide problem that there hasn't been an 0:05:23.560 --> 0:05:29.080 injection of new appliances into the large centers for some time, 0:05:29.320 --> 0:05:32.800 and FENS does face some challenges around that, and it 0:05:32.920 --> 0:05:36.600 is doing a procurement at the moment to replace some 0:05:36.680 --> 0:05:39.479 of the aging aerials, as it is with some of 0:05:39.520 --> 0:05:43.039 our standard fire appliances. I think if we are just 0:05:43.080 --> 0:05:45.440 to highlight, if you go back to the large fire 0:05:45.480 --> 0:05:48.880 we had at the International Convention Center in twenty nineteen, 0:05:49.120 --> 0:05:52.200 one of the recommendations out of that review was that 0:05:52.360 --> 0:05:57.240 FAMES should develop a strategy on aerial appliances. It should 0:05:57.279 --> 0:06:00.640 investigate what kinds we need, how many, and where they 0:06:00.640 --> 0:06:03.080 should be. And so six years later there is a 0:06:03.160 --> 0:06:05.640 draft of that document. I've not seen the draft, but 0:06:05.720 --> 0:06:10.039 I'm going to speculate that it suggests or recommends that 0:06:10.640 --> 0:06:13.680 we should increase our stock of verial appliances and we 0:06:13.800 --> 0:06:17.120 should refresh them more often so that they don't get 0:06:17.240 --> 0:06:20.040 to an old, unreliable age. I would then go, well, 0:06:20.080 --> 0:06:23.360 why hasn't FENS done that if that's what their review 0:06:23.400 --> 0:06:25.880 says that they should do. And now I'm speculating here 0:06:25.960 --> 0:06:28.400 because I don't actually know what the review says. And 0:06:29.040 --> 0:06:33.159 I'll speculate again. Our organization finds has been told to 0:06:33.240 --> 0:06:36.440 save sixty million dollars. It hasn't been told to do 0:06:36.520 --> 0:06:41.080 that because there has been some robust review of how 0:06:41.120 --> 0:06:43.840 we performed. I don't believe anyone has looked at us 0:06:43.880 --> 0:06:46.320 and said, you know, we can still be an effect 0:06:46.320 --> 0:06:48.760 of service if we take this much money off. It's 0:06:48.800 --> 0:06:52.479 been arbitrarily opposed on us by the government and now 0:06:52.720 --> 0:06:56.400 by an emergency I'm speculating again knows that it needs 0:06:56.480 --> 0:06:59.279 to invest in resources, that knows that it needs to 0:06:59.320 --> 0:07:03.400 invest in its personnel, but it can't because it has 0:07:03.600 --> 0:07:07.200 sixty million dollar savings imposed on it and any spinning 0:07:07.240 --> 0:07:09.920 that it did would get the wrath of the minister. 0:07:10.320 --> 0:07:14.680 Yeah, and Josh, Yet we've seen this year two firefighters 0:07:14.720 --> 0:07:18.560 having to be rescued from an aerial appliance while fighting 0:07:18.560 --> 0:07:23.320 a fire because the aerial appliance malfunctioned. You mentioned getting 0:07:23.360 --> 0:07:26.520 the gear and getting the appliance from Hamilton. Is it 0:07:26.600 --> 0:07:30.040 ridiculous in twenty twenty five that we don't have enough 0:07:30.160 --> 0:07:32.960 aerial appliances in our largest city. 0:07:33.120 --> 0:07:35.400 Yeah. I mean, look, I think we're going to understand 0:07:35.400 --> 0:07:37.640 some of the complexities here. So you know, like Kerry's 0:07:37.680 --> 0:07:39.960 highlight of the ICC fire that we had in twenty 0:07:40.040 --> 0:07:44.040 nineteen now and twenty nineteen when that incident came through 0:07:44.160 --> 0:07:47.560 Auckland at that stage was only running one heavy aerial appliance. 0:07:47.680 --> 0:07:51.000 Fast forward six years forward and we're doing the same 0:07:51.120 --> 0:07:55.239 custom and practice with Hamilton's aerial having had a cos 0:07:55.320 --> 0:07:58.240 the day before. It was in for general maintenance and 0:07:58.320 --> 0:08:01.360 routine service. But because we have no fat in the system, 0:08:01.520 --> 0:08:03.760 that truck has to come out of commission. There's no 0:08:03.880 --> 0:08:07.440 relief appliants there to be able to sustain capability. So 0:08:07.480 --> 0:08:09.280 then we're in a mad rush to put it back 0:08:09.280 --> 0:08:11.520 together to then get it on the road to travel 0:08:11.600 --> 0:08:14.320 some two hours up to our largest city to serve 0:08:14.320 --> 0:08:16.080 and support us. And a lot of that comes back 0:08:16.080 --> 0:08:18.200 to we just don't have fat in the system. You know, 0:08:18.240 --> 0:08:21.360 we co share a heavy aerial relief of plants which 0:08:21.400 --> 0:08:24.200 is twenty seven years old. It's currently out of commission 0:08:24.200 --> 0:08:26.040 at the moment of waiting what its future looks like 0:08:26.720 --> 0:08:30.000 with some significant structural rush, you know, and it's seventeen 0:08:30.080 --> 0:08:33.920 years overdue a major rebuilder and infection. So you know, 0:08:33.960 --> 0:08:36.160 these are some of the complexities that we're facing in 0:08:36.200 --> 0:08:38.920 the frustration. That's you know, the reason why we're here 0:08:38.960 --> 0:08:40.000 talking to you today. 0:08:39.920 --> 0:08:41.520 And getting it from Hamilton. 0:08:41.880 --> 0:08:45.720 I mean that is reliant on it not getting turned 0:08:45.760 --> 0:08:47.920 around because it had a road closure as well. 0:08:48.080 --> 0:08:48.240 Well. 0:08:48.280 --> 0:08:50.599 I mean it's not I mean it's road closures, but 0:08:50.640 --> 0:08:52.839 it's also too you know, we're robbing Pete to feed Paul, 0:08:52.840 --> 0:08:56.280 so to speak. You know, that then adds undue stress 0:08:56.280 --> 0:08:58.800 and pressure to the cruise down in Hamilton around their 0:08:58.880 --> 0:09:02.160 tactics and strategy because we've pulled their resource up to 0:09:02.400 --> 0:09:05.679 help us, you know, in twenty twenty five. In frontline operations. 0:09:05.679 --> 0:09:07.480 One we shouldn't be in a position where we're having 0:09:07.520 --> 0:09:09.640 to put trucks back together to respond them. But two, 0:09:09.720 --> 0:09:12.520 we should have enough surge capacity or capability in the 0:09:12.600 --> 0:09:16.920 system to be able to support cities major operational incidents 0:09:17.120 --> 0:09:19.520 and also be able to have fatness system to support 0:09:19.559 --> 0:09:23.280 general service servicing, routine checks, maintenance and the likes. You know, 0:09:23.320 --> 0:09:25.480 we shouldn't be lift in these positions where we're having 0:09:25.559 --> 0:09:27.319 to roll the boss, so to speak. 0:09:27.400 --> 0:09:29.480 I heard on the radio the other day the mayor 0:09:29.520 --> 0:09:32.920 of Hamilton claiming to be their fastest growing city in 0:09:32.960 --> 0:09:36.439 the country, and they also have a twenty seven year 0:09:36.480 --> 0:09:40.760 old aerial appliance, and they have an enormous amount of 0:09:40.840 --> 0:09:44.400 risks in the city that require fire response. And here 0:09:44.440 --> 0:09:46.960 we are using it in upland because we are not 0:09:47.000 --> 0:09:51.000 adequately resourced to look after ourselves. Let's suggest to me 0:09:51.160 --> 0:09:52.400 that the MS is broken. 0:10:01.040 --> 0:10:05.079 Joe Stanley, the NZPF YOUW Boss, was actually on the 0:10:05.080 --> 0:10:08.240 front page back in twenty twenty two talking about the 0:10:08.320 --> 0:10:10.560 lack of appliances. 0:10:10.800 --> 0:10:13.320 As an operation for far. As someone who works on 0:10:13.440 --> 0:10:17.480 a fight truck every day. I am disappointed that the 0:10:17.520 --> 0:10:20.200 money that it's given to the organization doesn't speed on 0:10:20.360 --> 0:10:24.359 responding to those communities' needs. The lack of heavy aerials, 0:10:24.840 --> 0:10:30.160 the parable state of their aging and decrepit pumping fleet 0:10:30.480 --> 0:10:34.360 as just an example of how the money is there, 0:10:34.600 --> 0:10:36.400 but it's not being spent in the right place. 0:10:37.440 --> 0:10:42.679 Are you surprised we're still having these conversations three years later? 0:10:44.440 --> 0:10:47.400 I have to say I'm not surprised. What does surprise me. 0:10:47.480 --> 0:10:50.080 FENS is doing some work towards this, and I acknowledge 0:10:50.120 --> 0:10:52.320 that there are some good people and femes doing some 0:10:52.360 --> 0:10:55.240 good work towards improving our fleet. What we're challenged with 0:10:55.520 --> 0:10:58.199 is a lack of resourcing in those departments and a 0:10:58.280 --> 0:11:01.080 lack of funding, a lack of appetit to spend money 0:11:01.520 --> 0:11:05.480 on additional resources. And who do we have to convince 0:11:05.840 --> 0:11:09.840 that spending additional money to make sure that our fire 0:11:09.880 --> 0:11:13.480 service is modern and prepared for the risks that we 0:11:13.240 --> 0:11:15.880 may need to attend. Who do we need to lobby 0:11:15.920 --> 0:11:19.120 to do that? We need to lobby the purse strings holder. 0:11:19.400 --> 0:11:21.679 Are you guys nervous about the state of things at 0:11:21.720 --> 0:11:23.960 the moment? I don't want to be all doom and gloom, 0:11:24.040 --> 0:11:27.080 But what do you reckon needs to happen for change 0:11:27.520 --> 0:11:28.440 to come about. 0:11:28.600 --> 0:11:31.360 Well, I think it definitely knocks the confidence out of 0:11:31.360 --> 0:11:34.560 our members. You know, you highlight the incident over on 0:11:34.600 --> 0:11:37.080 the shore on the twenty fourth of April, you know, 0:11:37.800 --> 0:11:40.360 it does taken off to the confidence and I think, 0:11:40.400 --> 0:11:42.240 you know, we need to acknowledge that our fire fighters, 0:11:42.280 --> 0:11:43.680 you know, they go to some of the most testing 0:11:43.679 --> 0:11:46.040 and trying conditions you know that you never meet in 0:11:46.080 --> 0:11:48.280 your life, and we want them to be confident. We 0:11:48.320 --> 0:11:50.719 want them to entrust their in their equipment to be 0:11:50.760 --> 0:11:52.600 able to do their job to the best of their ability. 0:11:52.679 --> 0:11:55.000 As for change, well, I think the first step is 0:11:55.040 --> 0:11:59.040 actually delivering on these operational reviews which have given us 0:11:59.080 --> 0:12:02.400 clear LFIS opportunities for improvement. You know, there's one thing 0:12:02.400 --> 0:12:03.880 to be able to talk about it, but then there's 0:12:03.880 --> 0:12:06.280 another thing to be able to have tangible deliverables on it. 0:12:06.360 --> 0:12:08.320 And also, you know, like Terry's talked about with this 0:12:08.480 --> 0:12:11.120 supposed review that was meant to be designed and released 0:12:11.160 --> 0:12:13.439 that we're nobody's seen and still waiting for, is that 0:12:13.520 --> 0:12:15.240 you know, there is a real significant need for an 0:12:15.320 --> 0:12:17.720 enhancement and capability. You know, our city at our city 0:12:17.760 --> 0:12:19.800 is sitting at one point six million people. You know, 0:12:19.880 --> 0:12:23.280 it's dramatically increased for us over the years, and we 0:12:23.360 --> 0:12:26.680 haven't seen an increase in staffing or performance and capability. 0:12:26.720 --> 0:12:29.480 I mean ironically, and Terry could quote to this, as 0:12:29.559 --> 0:12:31.880 you know, in the nineteen eighties we had six heavy 0:12:31.960 --> 0:12:34.720 eeril appliances in the city. We're now down to one 0:12:34.920 --> 0:12:35.840 in twenty twenty five. 0:12:36.000 --> 0:12:38.320 Yeah, I'd like to answer that question as well. Choose seat. 0:12:38.440 --> 0:12:41.760 So I've been a career firefighter. I think it's thirty 0:12:41.800 --> 0:12:45.960 eight years. I've been through a range of reviews and 0:12:46.040 --> 0:12:50.400 changes in this organization, and I personally believe that we 0:12:50.440 --> 0:12:52.400 are possibly in the west condition that we've been in 0:12:52.440 --> 0:12:55.400 my career. And I try to balance that. Is it 0:12:55.440 --> 0:12:57.960 because I know a whole lot more because I'm involved 0:12:58.000 --> 0:13:00.000 in the whole lot of stuff and that's quite notice, 0:13:00.480 --> 0:13:05.280 you know, during other changes, or is it genuinely are 0:13:05.280 --> 0:13:08.680 we really in a crisis environment? And it sort of 0:13:08.720 --> 0:13:11.920 doesn't matter where we are not in a we are 0:13:11.960 --> 0:13:13.599 not in good shape this organization. 0:13:16.240 --> 0:13:20.000 About two years ago, losses involved with this particular incident, 0:13:20.400 --> 0:13:25.360 a house fire that was starting to brew up, and 0:13:25.600 --> 0:13:29.400 so it was still savable. But as soon as hearing 0:13:29.440 --> 0:13:32.880 to go through the door, the pumpound a catastrophic water failure, 0:13:33.000 --> 0:13:36.280 just started dumping water on the brown It was a 0:13:36.400 --> 0:13:40.120 part failure. It was determined from that, and we're up 0:13:40.160 --> 0:13:43.840 with the investigation that it had failed because it had 0:13:43.840 --> 0:13:49.319 never been maintained. So it was the bureaucracy had missed 0:13:49.360 --> 0:13:53.199 the opportunity to make sure that the vehicles were up 0:13:53.240 --> 0:13:54.439 to speck and safe for. 0:13:54.480 --> 0:13:55.000 Us to use. 0:13:59.280 --> 0:14:01.880 Yeah, we keep here about getting more cops on the beat, 0:14:02.160 --> 0:14:04.640 the shortage of medical staff. I mean those hit the 0:14:04.640 --> 0:14:07.200 headlines all the time, and you guys are the third 0:14:07.280 --> 0:14:09.720 part of our emergency services. 0:14:09.960 --> 0:14:13.240 Isn't good enough? Or do you feel left behind? 0:14:13.640 --> 0:14:16.080 I think a really good answer to that is who 0:14:16.160 --> 0:14:20.120 is monitoring the performance of fire an emergency? And I 0:14:20.160 --> 0:14:24.520 would suggest that no one is monitoring their operational performance, 0:14:24.840 --> 0:14:27.760 their preparedness. Again, there are a lot of good people 0:14:27.800 --> 0:14:31.120 doing a lot of good work. But if we respond 0:14:31.160 --> 0:14:33.720 to an incident and our performance is not as good 0:14:33.920 --> 0:14:36.800 as it could be, we don't share that dirty laundry. 0:14:36.920 --> 0:14:40.920 And really, the only organization with a really good insight 0:14:41.280 --> 0:14:44.200 to how far an emergency is performing in the main centers, 0:14:44.520 --> 0:14:48.440 is the NZPF. You people don't necessarily think that we're 0:14:48.480 --> 0:14:52.800 a credible organization to be judging fire an emergency because 0:14:52.800 --> 0:14:55.680 we have conflictal interest, but it's still we are the 0:14:55.720 --> 0:15:00.200 only organization who is waving the flag and saying we 0:15:00.240 --> 0:15:01.640 have some serious problems here. 0:15:01.960 --> 0:15:04.760 Josh, if you got a minister in front of you, 0:15:05.720 --> 0:15:08.160 what would you say to them? What needs to happen 0:15:08.720 --> 0:15:09.640 like yesterday? 0:15:09.880 --> 0:15:11.360 Well, I think it comes down to this, really, you know, 0:15:11.840 --> 0:15:13.720 the New Zealand and public expect us to have the 0:15:14.120 --> 0:15:15.680 you know, for us to have our best day on 0:15:15.720 --> 0:15:17.880 their worst day, and for us to have our best 0:15:17.920 --> 0:15:20.240 day on their worst day. We need to have the 0:15:20.320 --> 0:15:23.000 tools of trade to be effective in their time of need. 0:15:23.240 --> 0:15:23.480 Yeah. 0:15:23.560 --> 0:15:27.320 We we are a workforce that want to do good 0:15:27.320 --> 0:15:30.640 work for our communities and we don't want to be 0:15:30.680 --> 0:15:34.200 making excuses. And I think the question to the minister 0:15:34.400 --> 0:15:38.479 is what level of performance is okay for our community? 0:15:39.320 --> 0:15:42.240 And I think we've already we've already got worse than 0:15:42.240 --> 0:15:46.520 what is okay for many communities around New Zealand, and 0:15:46.960 --> 0:15:51.360 nobody knows that the performance has slowly been degrading and 0:15:51.400 --> 0:15:54.000 that is our problem. We have to have our communities 0:15:54.120 --> 0:15:57.000 know that Feinsi's performance is reducing. 0:15:56.920 --> 0:15:58.600 Terry and Josh thanks for joining us. 0:15:59.040 --> 0:16:00.320 Cre're welcome. 0:16:02.960 --> 0:16:05.880 For a response from fire an emergency New Zealand. 0:16:05.920 --> 0:16:07.560 Have a look in the show notes below. 0:16:09.960 --> 0:16:13.080 That's it for this episode of the Front Page. You 0:16:13.120 --> 0:16:16.920 can read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage 0:16:16.960 --> 0:16:20.960 at enzedherld dot co dot nz. The Front Page is 0:16:21.000 --> 0:16:24.760 produced by Ethan Sills and Richard Martin, who is also 0:16:24.920 --> 0:16:29.560 our sound engineer. I'm Chelsea Daniels. Subscribe to the Front 0:16:29.560 --> 0:16:32.760 Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts 0:16:33.080 --> 0:16:36.880 And tune in tomorrow for another look behind the headlines.