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Speaker 1: Ministry of Health's brief on puberty blockers. That's our doctors

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Speaker 1: have been told to take a precautionary approach due to

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Speaker 1: insufficient evidence. This comes as well with the toughest set

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Speaker 1: of rules for prescribing. Now, the University of Auckland pediatric

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Speaker 1: indrochronologist Paul Hoffman is with us. Paul, very good morning

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Speaker 1: to you.

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Speaker 2: Thank you. Mike.

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Speaker 1: Am I correct in saying you were a reviewer of

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Speaker 1: some of this stuff.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I was an external reviewer to just going through

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Speaker 2: it after the initial draft has been made.

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Speaker 1: How many people are actually affected by this in this

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Speaker 1: country versus how many people potentially get exercised about the

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Speaker 1: topic generally.

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Speaker 2: Really good question, and I think one of the frustrations

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Speaker 2: we don't know for sure. There'll be several hundred, probably

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Speaker 2: Mike talking of one hundred and fifteen to one hundred

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Speaker 2: and twenty, but I think these numbers are a lot

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Speaker 2: larger than that and those of huberty blockers, but we

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Speaker 2: don't know for sure, And that is one of the

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Speaker 2: requests I've made is that that FARMAC makes as drug

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Speaker 2: identify for transgender use, so that we can get a

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Speaker 2: good idea of how.

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Speaker 1: Many there are how much evidence, how much of this

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Speaker 1: is evidence based versus theory based, ideologically based.

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Speaker 2: Well, I think that's what's the powers And I think

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Speaker 2: the review very clearly and I think it's a very

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Speaker 2: sensible review. It goes down the road because there, I

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Speaker 2: think if you look at the wider safety, looking at

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Speaker 2: all the kids of which there are one hundreds of

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Speaker 2: hours over the last thirty years been on the drug,

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Speaker 2: it is a very safe, reversible drug. But in terms

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Speaker 2: of its efficacy there's much the data is poor and

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Speaker 2: that just reflects doctors not assuming that's going to work

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Speaker 2: without actually following up and making sure it does.

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Speaker 1: And what are the odds of I mean, how much

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Speaker 1: variation is there because presumably you started on the journey

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Speaker 1: of this with a GP. Is there variation all over

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Speaker 1: the place.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, we've had a right spaced approach and U

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Speaker 2: Zealand as opposed to a more evidence based approach for

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Speaker 2: some time. In other words, it's a person is they

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Speaker 2: feel trans that's the right to have the stradit medication,

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Speaker 2: as opposed it being evidence based justifiable done in a

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Speaker 2: modern display team where there's mental health support and other

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Speaker 2: issue another expertise. And so I think we are going down.

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Speaker 2: What the risk, most of the risk of the world

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Speaker 2: are doing is going down to a more conservative eminence,

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Speaker 2: spased approach with the right round care for these very problecuts.

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Speaker 1: Good all right, Paul, you have a good week. You

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Speaker 1: appreciate it very much. Paul Hopman, a pediatric indo chronologist.

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Speaker 1: For more from The Mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to

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Speaker 1: news talks. It'd be from six am weekdays, or follow

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