Speaker 1: Kiota, m Chelsea Daniels and this is a compilation episode
Speaker 1: of The Front Page, a daily podcast presented by The
Speaker 1: New Zealand Herald. From wars and conflicts to extreme weather events,
Speaker 1: new pandemic threats to cancer coming to Buckingham Palace. We've
Speaker 1: seen it all over the last twelve months, but twenty
Speaker 1: twenty four was truly the year of the election. Over
Speaker 1: sixty countries went to the polls this year, including India, Russia, Mexico,
Speaker 1: France and the UK, meaning more people voted in one
Speaker 1: year than at any other point in human history. But
Speaker 1: the biggest of them was, of course, in the US.
Speaker 1: The road to November's election was more intense than most. First,
Speaker 1: there was an attempted assassination of Donald Trump in July.
Speaker 2: Thousands were there to see him speak. They would witness
Speaker 2: the first assassination attempt of a president in more than
Speaker 2: forty years. He was immediately surrounded by Secret Service, his
Speaker 2: ear bloody. By six thirteen pm, he was rushed off
Speaker 2: the stage.
Speaker 1: That was followed by Joe Biden deciding not to run
Speaker 1: for re election a few weeks later.
Speaker 3: Nothing can come in the way of saving our democracy.
Speaker 2: That includes Pirstal ambition.
Speaker 4: So I've decided the best way forward is to pass
Speaker 4: the torch for a new generation.
Speaker 1: It paved the way for a historic bid for the
Speaker 1: White House by Kamala Harris, the first Black and South
Speaker 1: Asian woman to be nominated by a major party.
Speaker 5: I accept your nomination to be president in the United
Speaker 5: States of America.
Speaker 1: But in the end, it was Trump who made history.
Speaker 1: Re elected after four years out of office, it is.
Speaker 6: Now clear that we've achieved the most incredible political there.
Speaker 7: Look what happened.
Speaker 1: As we look back over the year's biggest events, we
Speaker 1: start in Pennsylvania the day before the election, where Ensid
Speaker 1: Harold Deputy political editor Thomas Coglan spoke to us about
Speaker 1: what he'd seen and heard on the ground from voters.
Speaker 7: Obviously, you know, talking to people that their views changed
Speaker 7: depending on who they're leaning towards. It does seem like
Speaker 7: a lot of Americans have made up their minds already.
Speaker 7: They're too pretty think camp. The Democrats are worried about
Speaker 7: the threat to democracy, of course, and the sort of
Speaker 7: fascistic tendencies of Donald Trump as former chief of staff
Speaker 7: obviously recently the label and the fascist last month. The
Speaker 7: other big concern for them is abortion access and women's
Speaker 7: rights generally. Donald Trump was responsible for appointing the Supreme
Speaker 7: Court justices that were crucial to overturning the Rod versus Wade,
Speaker 7: which allowed many states to implement full or partial abortion vans.
Speaker 7: Kamala Harris's our ads are saying that about one in
Speaker 7: three women in America live under some form of abortion
Speaker 7: van thanks for that Supreme Court decision, and the Democrats
Speaker 7: are saying that Donald Trump would like to extend that nationwide,
Speaker 7: effectively banning an abortion in the entire country. Donald Trump
Speaker 7: is very keen to say that this is not happening,
Speaker 7: but of course some of the surrogates would quite like it,
Speaker 7: or our allies would like it to happen. So that
Speaker 7: is a massive thing with the Democrats talking about, and
Speaker 7: it is something that the Republicans and the Trump campaign
Speaker 7: is very very worried about because overall in the country
Speaker 7: more people support abortion and donor support it. And if
Speaker 7: many people believe that that this is what Trump's intention is,
Speaker 7: and it is likely to swing or to help drive
Speaker 7: voters towards towards Harris. Of course, with Donald Trump, it's
Speaker 7: it's often pretty difficult to know what his intentions are
Speaker 7: on the Trump side of things, they are very angry
Speaker 7: about migration in you know, the Democrats thought of them
Speaker 7: day and I'm happy with the migration situation. There were
Speaker 7: I think about eleven million what you call a legal
Speaker 7: crossings into America under the Biden administration, computed just over
Speaker 7: two million from the Trump era. So so migration, particularly
Speaker 7: legal legal migration, as a mess of issue at the moment.
Speaker 7: Both can't to clam down in it. But Donald Trump
Speaker 7: is promising a pretty pretty serious style expulsion of many
Speaker 7: migrants and really tightening up the security situation and the border.
Speaker 7: On the Trump side of things as well, that there
Speaker 7: is a lot of talk about inflation under the Bison
Speaker 7: years and the use of tariffs ironically, which will be inflationary.
Speaker 7: The use of tariffs to protect manufacturing jobs.
Speaker 1: Trump's re election sparked fears of a global trade war
Speaker 1: and rising costs after he promised on the campaign trail
Speaker 1: that he'll imposed tariffs on numerous countries and products coming
Speaker 1: into the US. To discuss what his election means for
Speaker 1: New Zealand, we spoke with NZ US Council Executive Director
Speaker 1: for you Owner Cooper shortly after the election what's our
Speaker 1: relationship with the United States?
Speaker 8: Like, Well, this is the very good thing is that
Speaker 8: we have an excellent relationship. It's been growing. You know,
Speaker 8: it's strong in terms of trade, and it's strong right
Speaker 8: across the board. And New Zealand worked very well with
Speaker 8: President Trump's first administration, our Foreign Minister Winston Peters. He
Speaker 8: had strong relationships with his counterparts and he was very
Speaker 8: engaged with them. And in fact, I certainly am delighted
Speaker 8: to see that the Prime Minister and Foreign Minister Peters
Speaker 8: were quick to welcome the result last night and congratulate
Speaker 8: President Trump on his victory. I think that's good. So,
Speaker 8: you know, New Zealand's not starting from scratch. We have
Speaker 8: worked with Trump before and we look forward to working
Speaker 8: with him again.
Speaker 1: Well, the New Zealand US trade relationship topped twenty seven
Speaker 1: point five billion in twenty twenty three. That's no small feet, hey,
Speaker 1: And it's getting bigger and bigger every year, isn't it.
Speaker 8: Certainly, as it's now our largest export market, it's valuable,
Speaker 8: it's growing and that's a really good news story. Because
Speaker 8: New Zealand companies who export to the United States, they
Speaker 8: are well known for having high quality innovative products that
Speaker 8: United States consumers want and that US businesses use in
Speaker 8: their manufacturing. So it's a really good news story. We'd
Speaker 8: like to see that continue and we look forward to
Speaker 8: sharing that story with the new administration.
Speaker 1: When it comes to tariffs, though, that's the thing that
Speaker 1: has been a stickler for basically every country.
Speaker 8: In the world.
Speaker 1: When looking at the results and looking at this election,
Speaker 1: we actually don't know anything about them really yet, do
Speaker 1: we No.
Speaker 8: You know, there's not room for a lot of nuance
Speaker 8: in election campaigns, so all we've seen is very high
Speaker 8: level talk about imposing a universal tariff, but we don't
Speaker 8: have any details, and I would caution against speculating about
Speaker 8: the tariff policy until it's more fully formed. Trump won't
Speaker 8: be sworn in until the twentieth of January, so we're
Speaker 8: not going to find out the detail until after that.
Speaker 8: But the policy details do matter, and we'll be looking
Speaker 8: at it very closely once it's known. You know, the
Speaker 8: devil will be in the details. It's clear there will
Speaker 8: be implications for New Zealand, and it's something that we're
Speaker 8: really focused on.
Speaker 1: Political conflict was rife throughout twenty twenty four. France has
Speaker 1: seen four prime ministers this year, as President Emmanuel Macron
Speaker 1: struggles to gain control of an increasingly divided country. In
Speaker 1: South Korea, President yunsuk yol was impeached this month after
Speaker 1: temporarily imposing martial law. Meanwhile, in the Middle East, rebels
Speaker 1: took over Syria as dictator President Bashah al Assad and
Speaker 1: his family fled, bringing hope that over a decade of
Speaker 1: conflict will finally come to an end. And for those
Speaker 1: in Ukraine and Gaza, hope is all they have right now.
Speaker 1: The conflicts in both countries have showed no sign of
Speaker 1: stopping this year, with the world now waiting to see
Speaker 1: how President elects Trump and his cabinet will handle both.
Speaker 1: In February, two years after the conflict in Ukraine started,
Speaker 1: guest host Georgina Campbell spoke with independent journalist Tom March
Speaker 1: from Kiev about the state of the conflict.
Speaker 9: So right now I am back in Kiev, which is
Speaker 9: of course the capital of Ukraine, and it's pretty far.
Speaker 9: It's a couple one hundred kilometers away from any frontline.
Speaker 9: There was obviously a frontline here at the very start
Speaker 9: of the war. But we're going back to about March
Speaker 9: twenty twenty two now nearly two years when the Russians
Speaker 9: tried to make that mad dash for Kiev at the
Speaker 9: very start of the war and they got beaten back
Speaker 9: and sort of retreated with their tale between their legs.
Speaker 9: I have, however, I've been in the ARKive region in
Speaker 9: a near a town called Koopyansk, which is on the
Speaker 9: front line, or very close to the front line, and
Speaker 9: we were working with Ukrainian soldiers who are actually working
Speaker 9: with a unit who pilot drones. Now, for people who
Speaker 9: follow this war closely, they'll know that the two most
Speaker 9: important types of weapons really are. One is artillery, just
Speaker 9: the standard artillery that's been used from the first Second
Speaker 9: World Wars onwards. And drones, both first person view drones,
Speaker 9: which are the ones that you just sort of, you know,
Speaker 9: put a camera on your face and fly and they
Speaker 9: fly them into enemy tanks and vehicles. And this unit
Speaker 9: was using was called vampire drones, which are these slightly
Speaker 9: bigger drones because about thirty thousand bucks, and they strap
Speaker 9: a bunch of grenades, mortar shells, explosives to them, fly
Speaker 9: them over the Russian lines and then they drop them
Speaker 9: all on them. So we spent a night staying with
Speaker 9: their and working with them. But I am, as I said,
Speaker 9: now back in the relative safety.
Speaker 10: Of Kiv, and even in Kiev, you have a curfew.
Speaker 1: Though, yes, so there has been a curfew.
Speaker 9: There's a curfew or in almost every region of Ukraine
Speaker 9: and there's a curfew. It starts at midnight. Everything you know, shops, bars, restaurants, whatever,
Speaker 9: are supposed to close by ten pm.
Speaker 3: Now.
Speaker 9: The unofficial reason for that, more or less is that
Speaker 9: they still like to be able to do stuff at night,
Speaker 9: like you know, move vehicles or military equipment around, and
Speaker 9: they don't really want people on the streets who can
Speaker 9: kind of you know, see what's going on, you know,
Speaker 9: just to kind of keep things a bit more safe
Speaker 9: and secure. Also, you know, if there are explosions throughout
Speaker 9: the night and stuff, it's more helpful to have people
Speaker 9: inside to not have to deal with people outside throng
Speaker 9: the streets or being drunken, disorderly or whatever. It just
Speaker 9: they feel it helps sort of keep order more or less.
Speaker 10: And you've been in Ukraine a lot over the past
Speaker 10: two years.
Speaker 3: How has the mood or the atmosphere changed in that time?
Speaker 9: So I have been here on and off more or
Speaker 9: less since the very very start. I arrived about one
Speaker 9: month before the full scale invasion began, and in that
Speaker 9: time we've sort of we've gone through various sort of
Speaker 9: shifts in the public mood. So at the very start,
Speaker 9: of course, in that first week or two, there was
Speaker 9: just this sort of absolute shock and in some ways
Speaker 9: sort of despair and anger, like how could something like
Speaker 9: this happen in twenty twenty two, one of the biggest
Speaker 9: land invasions in history. And then there was a shot
Speaker 9: that they managed to beat them back from Kiev. Then
Speaker 9: over at least the first year, while you know, everyone
Speaker 9: was very sort of heart wrench and traumatized by the war,
Speaker 9: there was this general sense that things were actually going
Speaker 9: pretty well. The Ukrainians won a series of the sort
Speaker 9: of a three famous victories chasing them out of Kiev,
Speaker 9: then another victory where they kicked them out of the
Speaker 9: Harkiv region, and then a final victory where they retook
Speaker 9: the major city of her Son in the south. So
Speaker 9: about this time last year, there was quite a lot
Speaker 9: of optimism in the air that the war might be
Speaker 9: over soon and that Ukraine might be able to retake
Speaker 9: all of its lost territories.
Speaker 10: Including the ones that were lost.
Speaker 9: In twenty fourteen, like Crimea and the cities of Donyetsk
Speaker 9: and Luhansk. Now the mood and now, I would say,
Speaker 9: is a bit grimmar than it was back this time
Speaker 9: last year. There was a major Ukrainian counter offensive last
Speaker 9: year that was very hyped up that Western allies donated
Speaker 9: a lot of ammunition and tanks and rocket launchers and
Speaker 9: all that sort of stuff for. But it didn't go
Speaker 9: very well. It didn't make much progress, it didn't manage
Speaker 9: to penetrate all the way through the main Russian lines
Speaker 9: of defense. And ever since then, not only did the
Speaker 9: Ukrainians lose a lot of their combat power, but since
Speaker 9: then the Russians managed to regenerate and they've been on
Speaker 9: the offensive again in the East. And not only that,
Speaker 9: there's been the problems with a with Western aid.
Speaker 10: European Union aid was.
Speaker 9: Held up for a long time when Hungary was vetoing it,
Speaker 9: and of course rot wing republicans in the US Congress
Speaker 9: have still are still blocking that sixty billion aid package
Speaker 9: that Ukraine was really sort of counting on and relying
Speaker 9: on to survive throughout twenty twenty.
Speaker 1: Four In April, I spoke with UNICEF AID worker Tess
Speaker 1: Ingram about what it's like on the ground in Gaza,
Speaker 1: including the threats to their lives as they try and
Speaker 1: help the war's most vulnerable.
Speaker 11: I'm in the Gaza Strip in Rafah, and I've traveled
Speaker 11: all across Gaza in the last two weeks that I've
Speaker 11: been here. I've been to Carnunis and Gelbalara in the
Speaker 11: middle area of Gaza, and yesterday i also went to
Speaker 11: the north of Gaza, and through all of those areas
Speaker 11: there's destruction and devastation. It's really clear the six months
Speaker 11: of war and its impact on both the infrastructure and
Speaker 11: the people here in Gaza. Everywhere you look, you can
Speaker 11: see and hear and smell the fighting, and you can
Speaker 11: see it on people's faces too, that they're just exhausted.
Speaker 1: How much contact have you had with locals on the
Speaker 1: ground and what have they been telling you.
Speaker 11: Yeah, every day I talk to people about their experiences here,
Speaker 11: mostly people who have been displaced to the south to Rufa,
Speaker 11: but I've also met people in the other pits of Gaza.
Speaker 11: And look, everybody has a different tragic tale of loss
Speaker 11: and grief, whether it's being injured, being buried, underneath the rubble,
Speaker 11: being displaced six times, losing family members, being malnourished, losing
Speaker 11: a baby. All of these stories are stories that I hear,
Speaker 11: and on top of that tragedy, people are really just
Speaker 11: trying to meet their basic needs of having enough food
Speaker 11: and water and shelter to survive each day.
Speaker 1: Our impression of Northern Gaza is that it's been largely destroyed.
Speaker 1: Like you said, the just complete destruction. Is that a
Speaker 1: fair assessment? And how dangerous are is this part of
Speaker 1: the country now, do you think?
Speaker 11: Yeah, it's a fair assessment. I was shocked by what
Speaker 11: I saw yesterday. It was my first time to North
Speaker 11: Gaza and I had heard just how destroyed it was,
Speaker 11: but seeing it for yourself really brings it home. Thinking
Speaker 11: about where I'm from in Australia and imagining what if
Speaker 11: this was my home and my community, my local shopping center.
Speaker 11: Everything is burnt to the ground, and it does make
Speaker 11: it dangerous because there's explosive remnants of war now in
Speaker 11: and under the rubble. So when people return, there's going
Speaker 11: to have to be a massive effort to try and
Speaker 11: make sure that people are safe from these explosives, but
Speaker 11: also then safe just with the essentials that they need
Speaker 11: to survive because of course food production is decimated. There's
Speaker 11: no clean water, so that we need to be a
Speaker 11: massive lift to bring people back to the north of Gaza.
Speaker 1: A vehicle waiting to enter Northern Gaza was hit with
Speaker 1: live ammunition. I'm aware that UNICEF has raised the incident
Speaker 1: with authorities.
Speaker 4: UNICEF humanitarian aid convoy was hit by Israeli gun fire
Speaker 4: well on its way to Northern Gaza to deliver life
Speaker 4: saving supplies to children. The convoy was part of a
Speaker 4: joint mission of UNICEF and the UN Agency for Palacinian Refugees,
Speaker 4: carrying food, medicine and fuel to feed the sanitation and
Speaker 4: running water systems in Valia in the north of the Strip.
Speaker 1: Chess Am, I right to say that you were in
Speaker 1: that convoy when that happened, and what was it like.
Speaker 11: Yeah, not only was I in that convoy, but I
Speaker 11: was in the car that was hit with the bullets.
Speaker 11: So one hit the bonnet of the car and the
Speaker 11: other two hit the door that I was sitting at,
Speaker 11: one in the window and one in the door. It
Speaker 11: was fast and confusing, and we were making sure in
Speaker 11: that moment that everybody was okay, not just us, but
Speaker 11: the civilians outside as well. And it was a shock
Speaker 11: because we were in a designated holding area where we
Speaker 11: had instructed to wait, and yet this happened to a
Speaker 11: clearly marked un vehicle, which shouldn't happen, even though it's
Speaker 11: a war zone.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, I mean, and after this incident, and of course
Speaker 1: the deadly horrific strike on the World's Central Kitchen just
Speaker 1: the other week, what's the feeling amongst aid workers at
Speaker 1: the moment?
Speaker 12: Frustration?
Speaker 11: I think it's probably the best way to explain it.
Speaker 11: We know that we're in a dangerous environment. We know
Speaker 11: that Gaza is one of the most difficult places in
Speaker 11: the world to do our jobs at the moment, but
Speaker 11: there are systems in place that are meant to protect
Speaker 11: us not working at the moment. It's because they're not
Speaker 11: being respected. We coordinate our missions and we get a
Speaker 11: safety assurance in response, letting us know, yeah, you can
Speaker 11: undertake that mission and it should be safe. And yet
Speaker 11: even on those coordinated missions, we have instances like this
Speaker 11: where we're put in harm's way or like the World
Speaker 11: Central Kitchen colleagues tragically killed. So the systems are broken
Speaker 11: and they urgently need to be repaired.
Speaker 1: Back in February, the deaths of Sydney couple Jesse Baird
Speaker 1: and Luke Davies sent shock waves across Australia that were
Speaker 1: felt here in New Zealand. The pair went missing on
Speaker 1: February nineteenth, and police launched a missing person investigation two
Speaker 1: days later after bloodied clothes and personal items were found
Speaker 1: in a skip A former celebrity blogger turned police officer,
Speaker 1: bo Lemaire Condon eventually handed himself into police in relation
Speaker 1: to the men's deaths. His case is now before the courts,
Speaker 1: though he has yet to enter a plea. In early March,
Speaker 1: we spoke with ABC News reporter Isaac now Routsi, who
Speaker 1: had been at the scene at Bungonia where Jesse and
Speaker 1: Luke's bodies were eventually found.
Speaker 12: On Monday, the nineteenth of February, jessebd and Luke Davies
Speaker 12: went missing and neither of them had been heard from,
Speaker 12: so it was actually two days later on Wednesday, the
Speaker 12: twenty first, where police launched a missing person's investigation and
Speaker 12: notified the homicide squad because blooded clothes and personal items
Speaker 12: were found in a skip bin in Cronola, which is
Speaker 12: a suburb of Sydney known for its beaches and swimming
Speaker 12: pool spots. It's located about thirty kilometers from Paddington, where
Speaker 12: mister Bed lived. This happened around eleven o'clock in the morning,
Speaker 12: and a couple of hours later police found a large
Speaker 12: amount of blood when examining Jesse Bed's home in Paddington.
Speaker 12: Later that afternoon, investigators searched Luke's home, but he wasn't there. Now,
Speaker 12: if we fast forward a couple of days to Friday,
Speaker 12: the twenty third of February, a New South Wales police
Speaker 12: constable bou Lamar Condon hands himself in at a police
Speaker 12: station in the morning. A few hours later, he's charged
Speaker 12: with two counts of murder. Yeppe is in court that
Speaker 12: afternoon and does not apply for bail. And then this,
Speaker 12: you know, for the public opens up a lot of questions.
Speaker 12: Where are the bodies and what happened between Monday, the
Speaker 12: nineteenth of February and Friday the twenty third.
Speaker 1: What do we know about what happened and what kind
Speaker 1: of gaps are we looking at here in terms of
Speaker 1: the timeline of events and what police are actually trying
Speaker 1: to figure out well.
Speaker 12: Police alleged that during the Wednesday, the accused bo Lamark
Speaker 12: Condon and an acquaintance who police have described as an
Speaker 12: innocent agent that's really important, attended a Bungoonia property. And
Speaker 12: Bungo Nei is a small town in the rural New
Speaker 12: South Wales about two hours south of Sydney, and we'll
Speaker 12: talk more about that town a little bit later on.
Speaker 12: But Lamar conton in this acquaintance allegedly bought an angle
Speaker 12: grinder and a padlock from a hardware store before driving
Speaker 12: into the property. Police then allege he cut the padlock
Speaker 12: with the grinder and went into the property with the van,
Speaker 12: which he allegedly hired from Sydney Airport. On the Monday
Speaker 12: that the pair went missing. The acquaintance said that they
Speaker 12: waited at the entrance at the top of the property
Speaker 12: for about half an hour. Police alleged that he placed
Speaker 12: a new padlock on the property's gate before the pairge
Speaker 12: drove back to Sydney later that afternoon, and it was
Speaker 12: around eleven pm that night that police allege Lamar Condon
Speaker 12: bought waits from a department store and returned to the
Speaker 12: rural property during that evening or overnight. Now the next
Speaker 12: day and the first day before he hands himself in
Speaker 12: the Mark Condon allegedly leaves the rural area again in
Speaker 12: the hired white Man returns to Sydney before traveling to
Speaker 12: another acquaintance's home in Newcastle, which is a town just
Speaker 12: over two hours north of Sydney. So's alleged to have
Speaker 12: gone around quite a bit during this time, and that
Speaker 12: night detectives say a third person who was of course
Speaker 12: later identified as bo Lamar Condon may be able to
Speaker 12: assist in their investigation and they raid a home which
Speaker 12: they think could be connected to him. Now the next morning,
Speaker 12: he hands himself into police, but still not known exactly
Speaker 12: where the bodies are. But on that Sunday morning, police
Speaker 12: begin searching a rural property in Bongonia divers scality area
Speaker 12: and dance behind the home. But it wasn't actually until
Speaker 12: four days later after Lamark Conden was charged that police
Speaker 12: were able to get information about where the bodies were located,
Speaker 12: and a couple of hours after speaking to him, found
Speaker 12: human remains in two surf bags along a fence line
Speaker 12: at a second of Mongoania property, which was located about
Speaker 12: twenty minutes away from where they were initially looking.
Speaker 1: This case led to Bungonia, which is actually a pretty
Speaker 1: rural part of New South Wales, so far from Sydney.
Speaker 1: In fact, it's actually closer to Canberra, where you're based.
Speaker 1: What can you tell us about this area.
Speaker 12: Well, Bunganier is a small town in New South Wales.
Speaker 12: It's about one hundred and eighty five kilometers southwest of
Speaker 12: Sydney and about one hundred and sixty six kilometers northeast
Speaker 12: of Camber. It is quite rural. It has a population
Speaker 12: of about three hundred and fifty people. I've actually had
Speaker 12: the opportunity to meet some of the residents under very
Speaker 12: different circumstances a few years ago, when the people that
Speaker 12: I met were really friendly, really warm, So you can
Speaker 12: imagine how much of a shock it would have come
Speaker 12: to the community for such a long stretch of road
Speaker 12: to be close off in the area as a crime.
Speaker 12: Then the road itself where the bodies were found is
Speaker 12: just like many other Australian roads going into small country towns.
Speaker 12: It's got a lot of dense bushland on either side.
Speaker 12: There are a lot of trees, a lot of shrubs.
Speaker 12: There are properties scattered along both sides with farm animals.
Speaker 12: We drove in the evening in the early morning was
Speaker 12: quite dangerous to drive on that road in the early
Speaker 12: and late hours. We nearly hit a few kangaroos. This
Speaker 12: kangaroo scattered all over both sides of the road. And well,
Speaker 12: police believe that one of the properties in Bangodia was
Speaker 12: previously visited by Lamar Condon through a former relationship. So
Speaker 12: at this stage, that's what we know about that link.
Speaker 1: What was the mood like when police and media descended
Speaker 1: on upon that area. I mean, I understand it's not
Speaker 1: exactly a heavily populated part of the country.
Speaker 10: No, it's nice.
Speaker 12: And look when we got there, there was already police
Speaker 12: in some other media on site because by the time
Speaker 12: we had got there, we knew why we were going
Speaker 12: there because there've been bodies found and that's quite eerie
Speaker 12: in itself. So you know where you're going, right, You
Speaker 12: know this is a crime scene. You know it's containing
Speaker 12: two bodies who's police strongly to believe to be the
Speaker 12: bodies of jessebad and Lop Davies. You know there's significant
Speaker 12: public interest in this, and when you're driving down that road,
Speaker 12: you can't help but have all these thoughts about the
Speaker 12: circumstances of the alleged crime and how they're alleged to
Speaker 12: end up there and what were taking place. You can't
Speaker 12: really see anything when you get on the site. The
Speaker 12: crime scene is pourted off a couple of one hundred
Speaker 12: meters away, but you are having all these thoughts and
Speaker 12: you left to imagine what's going I'll give you an
Speaker 12: example about that, right So when we got there, some
Speaker 12: of the members of Jesse Baird's family were visiting the
Speaker 12: site and we saw them leave and drive out the
Speaker 12: area around seven thirty that evening, and you can barely
Speaker 12: just imagine what they would have been thinking on their
Speaker 12: drive on the way to that site while visiting the site.
Speaker 12: You know, all the circumstances leading up to it would
Speaker 12: have just been absolutely horrific for them.
Speaker 1: In April, Sydney was in for another shock when forty
Speaker 1: year old Joel Couchi walked into Westfield Bondai junction armed
Speaker 1: with a knife. His stabbing rampage killed six people and
Speaker 1: injured a further twelve before he was shot dead by
Speaker 1: a police officer. Sydney based ABC News reporter Penny Timms
Speaker 1: joined us at the time to discuss the incident. Those
Speaker 1: images of people standing up to the attacker, they've been
Speaker 1: called heroes, right, and we've all seen the images and
Speaker 1: video online. Can you tell us have we spoken to
Speaker 1: any of those people yet?
Speaker 10: Yeah.
Speaker 3: So, Look, we've heard from some of the people who
Speaker 3: really did stand up to him. They have explained that
Speaker 3: some of them didn't actually know what was happening at
Speaker 3: the time.
Speaker 10: There was a man holding.
Speaker 3: Up a ballard and I heard him speaking to other media,
Speaker 3: not to I haven't personally spoken to him, but he
Speaker 3: had explained how he wasn't even really fully aware of
Speaker 3: what was happening. He just knew that some bad was
Speaker 3: going on and was pretty obvious that this guy was
Speaker 3: the one that were after.
Speaker 10: He was carrying a very large knife, and you know.
Speaker 3: They just explained that, you know, they sort of said
Speaker 3: that he just had this blank look in his eyes
Speaker 3: and that they were just trying to prevent him from
Speaker 3: being able to venture further into the shopping center. He
Speaker 3: was sort of at an area where there were a
Speaker 3: lot of escalators, so it was easy for him to
Speaker 3: get through the different floors, and so people were trying
Speaker 3: to prevent him from using the escalators to contain him
Speaker 3: to where he could be The mother of the nine
Speaker 3: month old baby, as she was very severely attacked. I
Speaker 3: think she knew just how badly she attacked she was,
Speaker 3: and she one of the last things she did was
Speaker 3: sort of thrust her baby over to some men who
Speaker 3: were walking by, saying, please save my baby. And you know,
Speaker 3: those men were sort of saying that it was just
Speaker 3: instinct that they obviously just did what they could. Shopkeepers
Speaker 3: as well, had to just all of a sudden become
Speaker 3: these really important people who could guide I guess, this
Speaker 3: flow situation, this really serious security situation. They all of
Speaker 3: a sudden turned into not just their regular job of
Speaker 3: retail workers and frontline hospitality workers, but also just these
Speaker 3: people who then all of a sudden had to guide
Speaker 3: thousands and thousands of people who were very stressed. We're
Speaker 3: hearing more and more stories of the heroic acts from
Speaker 3: that day, and certainly people who were standing up to
Speaker 3: that man did prevent him from being able to further
Speaker 3: attack people. There was one gentleman, for example, who sort
Speaker 3: of confronted him and sort of just sort of, I guess,
Speaker 3: puffed his chest out a bit to try and prevent
Speaker 3: him from venturing closer to a woman who was trying
Speaker 3: to protect three children. You know, people were obviously panicked,
Speaker 3: but there were definitely people who also stood up to
Speaker 3: him and I think had they not done that, the
Speaker 3: bloodshed would have even been more immense than it was already.
Speaker 1: What do we know about some of those who have
Speaker 1: lost their lives.
Speaker 3: There is the mother of the child. So this is
Speaker 3: a thirty eight year old woman by the name of
Speaker 3: Ashley Good. She is well known in some of the
Speaker 3: football football societies around Australia as well. There was another
Speaker 3: man for as Tahir. He is a Pakistani national. He
Speaker 3: was a security guard at the center and from what
Speaker 3: we understand, it was also his first day of work.
Speaker 3: We understand that he was formerly a refugee and so
Speaker 3: that's just another really horrific story that's come to light.
Speaker 3: There's a twenty five year old woman by the name
Speaker 3: of Dawn Singleton. She's the daughter of an extremely well
Speaker 3: known Australian businessman, John Singleton. She was out shopping for
Speaker 3: her upcoming wedding. Again, just absolute devastation. It was a
Speaker 3: forty seven year old woman by the name of Jade Young.
Speaker 3: She was an architect. She lived in the area and
Speaker 3: she was a local member of one of the local
Speaker 3: surf clubs. We're also hearing that there was a fifty
Speaker 3: five year old woman by the name of the Korea
Speaker 3: Dashia who was from Georgia. So I think think that
Speaker 3: it took a little bit of time just getting in
Speaker 3: contact with her family potentially overseas. She's also has three children.
Speaker 3: Where hearing reports now just come through that the sixth
Speaker 3: victim has been identified. The ABC is still waiting to
Speaker 3: verify her identity, but yeah, we do understand that she
Speaker 3: has now been identified it and we're just waiting to
Speaker 3: confirm that.
Speaker 1: Now police have identified Queensland native Joel Coucy as the
Speaker 1: man responsible for this attack. What do we know so
Speaker 1: far about his history.
Speaker 3: What we know about Joel Councy is that he is
Speaker 3: from Queensland. He was a bit of an itinerant, I guess,
Speaker 3: didn't really have much of a fixed address in either
Speaker 3: of those locations. He originally had grown up just near
Speaker 3: the capital city in Queensland.
Speaker 10: We understand that he had quite.
Speaker 3: A few mental health issues, so he had been treated
Speaker 3: for a mental health condition. We understand when he was
Speaker 3: in his late teens and he had been then referred to.
Speaker 10: A psych high trust.
Speaker 3: What's happened in the ensuing years is something I think
Speaker 3: that will form part of the police investigation. It is
Speaker 3: understood that about a month ago he moved to Sydney,
Speaker 3: he made a series of posts from Sydney, you know,
Speaker 3: just asking if anyone wanted to go surfing. He was
Speaker 3: trying to learn to surf, that sort of thing. It
Speaker 3: is not yet apparent that he had any kind of ideology,
Speaker 3: you know, that he didn't seem to be doing this
Speaker 3: for a particular cause. One thing that will be definitely investigated,
Speaker 3: and there's really starting to come to light now is
Speaker 3: the sheer number of women who have been attacked, and
Speaker 3: a lot of focus is now going into whether or
Speaker 3: not women were purposefully made the target. That is going
Speaker 3: to be difficult given that he's dead, but whether or
Speaker 3: not police are able to piece together anything. I think
Speaker 3: that there's a lot of calls to investigate whether or not,
Speaker 3: you know, his online activity would suggest that he was
Speaker 3: a member of any group, or that he particularly focused
Speaker 3: on any particularly misogyny type of groups. That's definitely the
Speaker 3: police their focus today is definitely trying to hone in
Speaker 3: on that and see what exactly is happening there.
Speaker 6: Police are building a profile of mass murderer Joel Couci.
Speaker 7: Why in April twenty twenty four would an individual act
Speaker 7: in such a horrific manner.
Speaker 6: He was from Tawoomba in southern Queensland. His family they're
Speaker 6: issuing a statement. Our thoughts and prayers are with the
Speaker 6: families and friends of the victims and those still undergoing treatment.
Speaker 6: Joel's actions were truly horrific and we are still trying
Speaker 6: to comprehend what has happened.
Speaker 3: But again, this is a very difficult situation when you
Speaker 3: do also have an aspect of a mental health condition
Speaker 3: which may not have been treated. We also don't understand
Speaker 3: yet what that mental health condition is. But essentially there's
Speaker 3: a lot of difficulty, I guess, in understanding and investigating
Speaker 3: this sort of thing where it isn't as obvious and
Speaker 3: there may be other issues at play here.
Speaker 1: Sticking to Australia, our closest neighbor, in recent years has
Speaker 1: seen a disturbing rise in the number of women being
Speaker 1: killed by an intimate partner. It sparked protests across the
Speaker 1: country that were picked up by women around the world,
Speaker 1: including here in New Zealand. In May, we spoke with
Speaker 1: Australian journalist Ryl Moody, who founded the Australian Femicide Watch
Speaker 1: and the Red Heart Campaign, about the issues facing women.
Speaker 13: To date, I've documented the killing of thirty four women. Obviously,
Speaker 13: not all of them have died as a result of
Speaker 13: domestic or intimate partner violence. My current data shows around
Speaker 13: five women have been killed by a family member, so
Speaker 13: mainly sons but one daughter. Eleven women have been lost
Speaker 13: to alleged acts of violence by current or former partners,
Speaker 13: so we are looking at sixteen domestic violence related deaths
Speaker 13: of the thirty five killings.
Speaker 10: It's probably really.
Speaker 13: Important for me to note here, and this is a
Speaker 13: very common theme regardless of the year and the number
Speaker 13: of deaths. The next highest context of violence is associate violance,
Speaker 13: which is people that the women knew but were outside
Speaker 13: of the familial relationships, so people like neighbors, tenants, colleagues,
Speaker 13: that kind of relationship. So basically what the data shows
Speaker 13: is almost all of the women have died at the
Speaker 13: hands of someone who knew them, and this.
Speaker 1: Isn't a recent phenomenon. It seems like there's outrage every
Speaker 1: so often every few years. You've been reporting on this
Speaker 1: issue for some time. Now, do you feel something as
Speaker 1: different this time round?
Speaker 13: You know what, We've had that question every time this
Speaker 13: kind of really zoned in media focus and somewhat zoned
Speaker 13: in political focus happens. And to be honest, it feels
Speaker 13: exactly the same as it did the last time there
Speaker 13: was this focus, and the time before that, and the
Speaker 13: time before that. Women are really angry about this situation,
Speaker 13: and they're angry.
Speaker 10: About it constantly.
Speaker 13: It just looks like we're angrier than normal because obviously
Speaker 13: there's a lot more focus on the loss of women
Speaker 13: to gendered violence, especially in the wake of the killing
Speaker 13: of five women and one man at bond Di Junction,
Speaker 13: and then there's been a spike in the number of
Speaker 13: killings in April here. But we also know that within
Speaker 13: a week or two, this focus will die down and
Speaker 13: we'll be back to the normal level of indifference from
Speaker 13: many media outlets and also many politicians.
Speaker 1: I find it astonishing every time this comes around, how
Speaker 1: men are surprised what women and girls are taught when
Speaker 1: they grow up, So things like use your nails so
Speaker 1: you get the DNA, don't get in the van, keys
Speaker 1: in between fingers. That's one, don't walk alone, cave your drink.
Speaker 1: I could go on and on. Right, So, why do
Speaker 1: you think that men or people in general find women
Speaker 1: walking out of the house and feeling unsafe? Why do
Speaker 1: they find that so confronting.
Speaker 13: It's kind of a hard question to answer, but I
Speaker 13: think what it comes down to is it's a really
Speaker 13: uncomfortable conversation. It's a really uncomfortable thought to sit with
Speaker 13: that women are afraid of men. I imagine, Look, I'm
Speaker 13: not a man, but I imagine as a man, you're
Speaker 13: hearing these conversations and you're going, but it's not me.
Speaker 13: I'm not that person. I'm not someone they should be
Speaker 13: afraid of. So you know, it probably is for man
Speaker 13: a very hard conversation for them to listen to and
Speaker 13: for them to take part in. And I know this
Speaker 13: from the people who interact with me or try to
Speaker 13: interact with me almost daily. They basically say, not all men,
Speaker 13: and they don't realize what they're saying when they say that.
Speaker 13: Not only do you feel called out, but you feel
Speaker 13: like that level someone else's bad actions are being put
Speaker 13: on your shoulders, and you also feel like you know,
Speaker 13: I'm a good person, and why can't people see this?
Speaker 13: But I think what men don't get about this conversation
Speaker 13: is we're not saying that every man is violent. What
Speaker 13: we're saying is not all men, but almost always a man,
Speaker 13: And gendered violence is a man's problem to fix. It's
Speaker 13: not a woman's problem to fix. Women are picking up
Speaker 13: the pieces, but we can't change male attitudes, and it's
Speaker 13: really unfair to actually put that on us. And when
Speaker 13: I'm talking about male attitudes, I'm not talking about necessarily
Speaker 13: about the violent attitudes. I mean, obviously that needs to change,
Speaker 13: but I'm talking about those little latitudes, the ones where
Speaker 13: men might feel ownership over women, or they might partake
Speaker 13: in sexist jokes, or they might, you know, not hold
Speaker 13: a guy to account when he treats a woman in
Speaker 13: a bad way, or when they just simply don't sit
Speaker 13: down and listen to what we're saying and understand it
Speaker 13: and try to have empathy from our point of.
Speaker 1: View, what has been happening in Australia recently, like the
Speaker 1: rallies across Australia, we've seen some incredible video and footage.
Speaker 1: Thousands have turned out.
Speaker 13: I believe the final accounts for the rallies across Australia,
Speaker 13: and I believe they are about twenty to thirty of them.
Speaker 13: My understanding is that about one hundred thousand people turned up,
Speaker 13: mainly women. Obviously there were a number of men in
Speaker 13: those crowds. I attended the Melbourne rally where about five
Speaker 13: thousand people were. It was quite a respectful, very laid
Speaker 13: back rally.
Speaker 10: The women were.
Speaker 13: They were loud and vocal, but there was no sort
Speaker 13: of physical or any other kind of problems in that group.
Speaker 13: But I did, and I have to really have to
Speaker 13: point out the premiere of Victoria and a number of
Speaker 13: her ministers did attend the rally. They had their photos
Speaker 13: taken with the Melbourne Rally organizers. They were at the
Speaker 13: front of the protest going down the street, right in
Speaker 13: front of the cameras. We got to the rally point
Speaker 13: that had their photos taken there and then they just
Speaker 13: went That was it. That was their entire contribution. Most importantly,
Speaker 13: they didn't stay there to listen to the speakers. And
Speaker 13: all the speakers were chosen because they, you know, they
Speaker 13: were either impacted by violence or they're doing work in
Speaker 13: this sector. Most often as volunteers like myself, so it
Speaker 13: was really actually quite upsetting to see the politicians just
Speaker 13: turn up for the cameras and then go and that
Speaker 13: was their entire contribution for the event.
Speaker 1: That's it for this compilation episode of The Front Page.
Speaker 1: You can read more about the stories featured in this
Speaker 1: episode and extensive news coverage at enziherld, dot co, dot
Speaker 1: and z. The Front Pages produced by Ethan Sills and
Speaker 1: Richard Martin, who is also our sound engineer along with
Speaker 1: Paddy Fox. I'm Chelsea Daniels. Subscribe to The Front Page
Speaker 1: on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts, and tune
Speaker 1: in tomorrow for another compilation episode taking a look back
Speaker 1: at some of the year's biggest stories.