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Speaker 1: Australia's just frozen draft bear excise to relieve some pressure

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Speaker 1: on local pubs and can we brewers here are calling

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Speaker 1: for the same to be done. Our excise tax rises

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Speaker 1: automatically every year, as you know if you go to

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Speaker 1: the pub. Well, beer consumption has fallen to the lowest

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Speaker 1: level on record. Tim Ward from Abandoned Breweries with me

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Speaker 1: this morning. Hey, Tim, how are you doing right?

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Speaker 2: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Really good, thank you. So what can you explain to

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Speaker 1: us what the Aussies have done?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? What the Ausies have done is they've put a

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Speaker 2: freeze on excise tax, as you said, to put give

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Speaker 2: relief to breweries. But they've actually gone a step further

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Speaker 2: and they've frozen up to fifty thousand liters for crafts breweries.

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Speaker 1: And so how much are they saving.

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Speaker 2: Well, it's roughly twenty percent of the retail price that

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Speaker 2: you've seen on shelves. So if you're purchasing a product

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Speaker 2: and craft beers in a four to forty more can

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Speaker 2: center around say ten dollars or twelve dollars, that's twenty

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Speaker 2: percent of that is going straight into the government's coffers.

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Speaker 1: Is this twenty sorry? Just craft bear that we're talking

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Speaker 1: about here or all beer.

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Speaker 2: We're talking about all beer. But what the Australians did

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Speaker 2: sometime ago is they provided relief directly to craft brewers,

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Speaker 2: really to give the small guys an opportunity to survive.

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Speaker 2: It's not really a level playing field when you've got

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Speaker 2: you've got large companies with huge efficiencies able to produce

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Speaker 2: product and mass and then sell it at a very

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Speaker 2: very low price, competing with small businesses which have got

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Speaker 2: much higher costs and smaller volumes.

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Speaker 1: How do you separate out who's big who's small? And

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Speaker 1: is the excise not just on alcohol rather than beer

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Speaker 1: or wine or anything specific x.

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Speaker 2: Those taxes alcohol by volume? I think the bigger question

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Speaker 2: is what is the excise tax trying to achieve? And

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Speaker 2: essentially it's an offset to the cost of alcohol harm

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Speaker 2: and garage consumption, and in my opinion, it's a very

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Speaker 2: blunt instrument. There are several other ways to reduce alcohol

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Speaker 2: harm that could be more successful, like what well, there

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Speaker 2: was a recommendation in twenty twelve and the last sellar

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Speaker 2: Licor Act which was ignored, and that's to split the

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Speaker 2: drinking age between off premise and on premise. Essentially off

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Speaker 2: premise would go up to twenty and on premise would

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Speaker 2: stay at eighteen. The sery there is that bars and

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Speaker 2: restaurants are highly regulated environments where start are on hand

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Speaker 2: at all times to check alcohol consumption and individuals, whereas

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Speaker 2: it an off premise an eighteen year old could walk

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Speaker 2: in still in school in school uniform and their connectivity

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Speaker 2: with somebody who's much younger is still there because of

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Speaker 2: their school relationship, whereas a twenty year old is much

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Speaker 2: less likely to buy alcohol.

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Speaker 1: For a young person, is this actually an argument that's

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Speaker 1: a little bit redundant? Now? Young people aren't drinking anywhere

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Speaker 1: near as much as we used to when we were younger,

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Speaker 1: and they're not buying as much alcohol. That's your real problem, and.

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Speaker 2: That probably plays into why it's such a blunt instrument

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Speaker 2: these days. Young people aren't drinking as much alcohol, and

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Speaker 2: the excise tax is really just a massive revenue collection

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Speaker 2: for the government that's too too great for them to ignore.

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Speaker 1: So you actually, what you're saying is they are responsible

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Speaker 1: enough to handle cheaper booze.

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Speaker 2: No, what I'm saying, like the other thing that would

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Speaker 2: help with alcohol halmers and was recommended in twenty twelve

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Speaker 2: in a law Commission report was a minimum drink pricing

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Speaker 2: so that big liquor couldn't gain the efficiencies. They had

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Speaker 2: to set a minimum unit price for alcohol. Let's say retailers,

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Speaker 2: not the big liquor others had to set a minimum

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Speaker 2: drink price, and that would just reduce accessibility to larger

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Speaker 2: quantities to the consumer.

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Speaker 1: Like, I'm on board with what you're saying, and God,

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Speaker 1: I'd love cheaper, cheaper beer at the pub, and craft

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Speaker 1: beer in particular would be lovely. But then is what

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Speaker 1: about any other industry where you have big players who

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Speaker 1: have economies of scale, who can make stuff cheaper versus

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Speaker 1: your smaller guys I mean peck an industry, and you'll

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Speaker 1: find the same problem.

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Speaker 2: I don't think you're ever going to get cheaper bus.

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Speaker 1: I think the.

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Speaker 2: Freezing of the excise tax or a concession for artisan

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Speaker 2: businesses is going to go straight to the back pockets

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Speaker 2: of those small businesses. The price is going to stay

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Speaker 2: relatively the same for the consumer. Small businesses craft wers

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Speaker 2: have struggle for years and they're unable to pass on

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Speaker 2: discounts that they might get from suppliers or from a

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Speaker 2: drop in the excise tax or a freezing excise.

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Speaker 1: Gotcha, yeah, yeah, no, got you a term. Appreciate your

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Speaker 1: update this morning. Thank you, good luck with the mission.

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Speaker 1: Tim Ward, founder and director at Abandoned Breweries. For more

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Speaker 1: from Early Edition with Ryan Bridge, listen live to News

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