1 00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:07,760 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Business of Tech, brought to you by 2 00:00:07,880 --> 00:00:11,840 Speaker 1: Two Degrees, the podcast where we examine the tech related trends, 3 00:00:12,000 --> 00:00:17,320 Speaker 1: challenges and opportunities shaping New Zealand's business landscape. I'm your host, 4 00:00:17,400 --> 00:00:20,439 Speaker 1: Peter Griffin, and today we're diving into insights from the 5 00:00:20,600 --> 00:00:25,800 Speaker 1: sixth annual Two Degrees Shaping Business Study, exploring what's top 6 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:29,400 Speaker 1: of mind for New Zealand businesses right now. This year's 7 00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:33,560 Speaker 1: study lands at quite a pivotal moment. After years of uncertainty, 8 00:00:34,040 --> 00:00:38,120 Speaker 1: business optimism has jumped to its highest level since the 9 00:00:38,240 --> 00:00:43,040 Speaker 1: research began. More KEII companies are thriving rather than just surviving, 10 00:00:43,440 --> 00:00:47,080 Speaker 1: according to the research, which surveyed over five hundred business 11 00:00:47,080 --> 00:00:51,360 Speaker 1: decision makers, and over half of businesses anticipate revenue growth 12 00:00:51,560 --> 00:00:55,200 Speaker 1: in the coming year. There's a clear focus on productivity, 13 00:00:55,560 --> 00:01:00,240 Speaker 1: innovation and harnessing digital tools like AI to get ahead, 14 00:01:00,560 --> 00:01:04,680 Speaker 1: but it's not all smooth sailing. Rising costs, sluggish customer 15 00:01:04,800 --> 00:01:09,000 Speaker 1: demand and the ongoing pressure to upskill and digitize remain 16 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:12,600 Speaker 1: front of mind. The big question how in New Zealand's 17 00:01:12,760 --> 00:01:16,839 Speaker 1: business leaders planning to turn this optimism into real world 18 00:01:16,880 --> 00:01:19,600 Speaker 1: results and what support do they need to get there 19 00:01:19,880 --> 00:01:22,320 Speaker 1: to explore what's top of mind for New Zealand businesses 20 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:25,600 Speaker 1: right now. I'm joined this episode by Mark Callender and 21 00:01:25,720 --> 00:01:29,720 Speaker 1: Steve Yerkovich. Mark is the CEO of Two Degrees, the 22 00:01:29,800 --> 00:01:32,880 Speaker 1: driving force behind the study, and a champion for business 23 00:01:32,880 --> 00:01:37,880 Speaker 1: connectivity and innovation. Steve is the chief executive of Kiwibank, 24 00:01:38,000 --> 00:01:41,200 Speaker 1: with a front row seat to the financial realities and 25 00:01:41,280 --> 00:01:45,720 Speaker 1: ambitions of Kiwi businesses nationwide. We'll explore what's fueling this 26 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:50,200 Speaker 1: newfound optimism, how businesses are tackling cost pressures, the evolving 27 00:01:50,280 --> 00:01:53,880 Speaker 1: role of AI and digital skills, the new investment boost, 28 00:01:54,120 --> 00:01:57,720 Speaker 1: tax incentive, and what the government and business community can 29 00:01:57,760 --> 00:02:00,920 Speaker 1: do to ensure this momentum isn't lost. Whether you're a 30 00:02:00,920 --> 00:02:04,520 Speaker 1: startup founder, a seasoned CEO, or just passionate about the 31 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:07,360 Speaker 1: future of New Zealand inc. This episode is your essential 32 00:02:07,440 --> 00:02:10,880 Speaker 1: guide to the business mode of twenty twenty five and 33 00:02:10,919 --> 00:02:15,280 Speaker 1: the strategies shaping are collective future. So let's get started. 34 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:29,520 Speaker 1: Mike and Steve. Welcome to the Business of Tech. How 35 00:02:29,560 --> 00:02:29,959 Speaker 1: are you doing? 36 00:02:30,560 --> 00:02:32,720 Speaker 2: Really good? Thanks Bena, good, Thanks Penner. 37 00:02:32,840 --> 00:02:36,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, so we just got off stage really good event 38 00:02:36,040 --> 00:02:40,520 Speaker 1: here at endzed me the launch off the Shaping Business Study, 39 00:02:40,560 --> 00:02:44,280 Speaker 1: which is in its sixth iteration. Now, this is around 40 00:02:44,520 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 1: five hundred business decision makers that you have been surveying 41 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:52,200 Speaker 1: every year. So that's over three and a half thousand 42 00:02:52,280 --> 00:02:55,359 Speaker 1: people that you've surveyed and some pretty high times as well. 43 00:02:55,400 --> 00:02:58,880 Speaker 1: It really kicked off around the near twenty twenty COVID times. 44 00:02:58,919 --> 00:03:02,119 Speaker 2: So was it just before was it the first one? Yeah, 45 00:03:02,160 --> 00:03:02,840 Speaker 2: it was just before. 46 00:03:02,960 --> 00:03:06,600 Speaker 3: And the original intent behind the study originally was to 47 00:03:07,120 --> 00:03:10,440 Speaker 3: kind of understand how business were surviving post COVID, So 48 00:03:10,480 --> 00:03:14,000 Speaker 3: that was the original nucleus behind it, and then obviously 49 00:03:14,280 --> 00:03:16,560 Speaker 3: we've since continued to invest in it to develop a 50 00:03:16,639 --> 00:03:18,200 Speaker 3: longitudal study which has been great. 51 00:03:18,360 --> 00:03:21,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, And the headline really is that increase in optimism 52 00:03:21,600 --> 00:03:25,520 Speaker 1: that you've identified, which is the strongest since the study began. 53 00:03:26,280 --> 00:03:30,720 Speaker 1: So there's a sense that we're pulling out of some 54 00:03:30,800 --> 00:03:32,080 Speaker 1: pretty dark times. 55 00:03:32,200 --> 00:03:33,359 Speaker 2: We've turned a corner. 56 00:03:33,440 --> 00:03:36,200 Speaker 1: There are lots of challenges identified, but maybe let's start 57 00:03:36,200 --> 00:03:38,720 Speaker 1: with some of the headline stuff that sort of underpends 58 00:03:38,760 --> 00:03:42,400 Speaker 1: that optimism. There's more more growth anticipated, there's more appetite 59 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:45,040 Speaker 1: for investment, particularly in technology and AI. 60 00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:49,360 Speaker 3: Yeah, so the optimism, and again some people have been 61 00:03:49,400 --> 00:03:50,520 Speaker 3: surprised at the optimism. 62 00:03:50,720 --> 00:03:51,480 Speaker 2: I'm personally not. 63 00:03:52,520 --> 00:03:55,360 Speaker 3: The terminology you know, survived to twenty five was coined 64 00:03:55,400 --> 00:03:57,160 Speaker 3: at the end of last year. You know, we're now 65 00:03:57,280 --> 00:04:01,440 Speaker 3: midway through twenty twenty five and I think, you know, 66 00:04:01,520 --> 00:04:05,360 Speaker 3: things are looking up. You know, as the survey outlined, 67 00:04:05,400 --> 00:04:08,160 Speaker 3: forty five percent of businesses are feeling more optimistic than. 68 00:04:08,080 --> 00:04:09,080 Speaker 2: They did last year. 69 00:04:09,720 --> 00:04:12,160 Speaker 3: Again, last year is a pretty tough year, so it's 70 00:04:12,160 --> 00:04:14,360 Speaker 3: no surprise to see that bounce. I think what's more 71 00:04:14,440 --> 00:04:17,440 Speaker 3: encouraging is a lot of those businesses deem themselves to 72 00:04:17,440 --> 00:04:20,000 Speaker 3: be more productive. Many of them have launched a new 73 00:04:20,000 --> 00:04:22,840 Speaker 3: product or service in the last twelve months, and again 74 00:04:23,200 --> 00:04:25,920 Speaker 3: off the back of that, you know, the intention around 75 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:30,360 Speaker 3: investing in business development, sales and marketing is also increasing. 76 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:33,720 Speaker 3: So some really positive indicators in terms of the way 77 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:36,640 Speaker 3: businesses are feeling, and I think it's a great outlook 78 00:04:36,680 --> 00:04:39,160 Speaker 3: to moving from surviving to thriving towards the second half 79 00:04:39,160 --> 00:04:39,599 Speaker 3: of this year. 80 00:04:39,760 --> 00:04:42,680 Speaker 1: Has to reflected in your own business two degrees, have 81 00:04:42,760 --> 00:04:46,400 Speaker 1: you been thriving in the last year launching new products 82 00:04:46,400 --> 00:04:47,400 Speaker 1: and services as well? 83 00:04:47,800 --> 00:04:50,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, so we've been really busy. We're not immune to 84 00:04:50,800 --> 00:04:54,920 Speaker 3: some of the challenges like lower household spending. The backdrop 85 00:04:54,960 --> 00:04:58,760 Speaker 3: of that is we also see incredible growth across you know, 86 00:04:58,839 --> 00:05:01,960 Speaker 3: certain astics of our business. So as large enterprise and 87 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:05,720 Speaker 3: government sectors have looked to save money, you know, as 88 00:05:05,720 --> 00:05:08,479 Speaker 3: a value provider, that's where two Degrees steps up really strongly. 89 00:05:09,040 --> 00:05:12,600 Speaker 3: They see us as an opportunity to use our productivity 90 00:05:12,600 --> 00:05:14,880 Speaker 3: tools such as flex or to save the money through 91 00:05:14,880 --> 00:05:17,880 Speaker 3: the telecommunication spend to reinvest in that in other areas 92 00:05:17,880 --> 00:05:20,960 Speaker 3: of the business such as AI and other growth initiatives. 93 00:05:21,000 --> 00:05:24,679 Speaker 3: So we are thriving again. We've got a great brand, 94 00:05:24,680 --> 00:05:26,640 Speaker 3: we've got really good momentum in the market. We're three 95 00:05:26,720 --> 00:05:28,720 Speaker 3: years into the merge now, which is coming to an end. 96 00:05:29,279 --> 00:05:31,440 Speaker 3: So we're in a really strong position, which is great 97 00:05:31,440 --> 00:05:32,679 Speaker 3: for two Degrees. 98 00:05:32,720 --> 00:05:37,400 Speaker 1: In the wider team and Steve at Kiwibank, there's a 99 00:05:37,440 --> 00:05:39,760 Speaker 1: lot of talk, for instance, in the primary sector we 100 00:05:39,839 --> 00:05:43,520 Speaker 1: just had field days. It was an optimistic tone there. 101 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:46,920 Speaker 1: Farmers are out looking at investing again and plant we've 102 00:05:46,960 --> 00:05:50,640 Speaker 1: got investment boost that was announced in the budget. Interest 103 00:05:50,680 --> 00:05:53,960 Speaker 1: in your perspective, what you're seeing from a banking perspective, 104 00:05:54,360 --> 00:05:59,320 Speaker 1: appetite for taking out loans to invest in business what 105 00:05:59,360 --> 00:05:59,880 Speaker 1: are you seeing. 106 00:06:00,360 --> 00:06:02,279 Speaker 4: Well, I think, you know, the Agrey market's in a 107 00:06:02,279 --> 00:06:03,840 Speaker 4: pretty good spot. You know, you've got a very very 108 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:06,600 Speaker 4: strong milk price you've got you know, and we're a small, 109 00:06:06,600 --> 00:06:09,680 Speaker 4: open economy, so when we're moving stuff to other countries, 110 00:06:09,760 --> 00:06:12,800 Speaker 4: you know, we naturally benefit. Interest costs for their borrowing 111 00:06:12,839 --> 00:06:15,240 Speaker 4: will be down pretty significantly, you know, two three hundred 112 00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:18,320 Speaker 4: basis points or two or three percent for most customers. 113 00:06:18,400 --> 00:06:20,000 Speaker 4: So that's you know, that's good news for them. 114 00:06:20,839 --> 00:06:21,880 Speaker 2: What I think. 115 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:24,640 Speaker 4: The Boost scheme that helps people is when they're on 116 00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:26,800 Speaker 4: the cusp of deciding whether they're going to invest or not, 117 00:06:27,279 --> 00:06:29,240 Speaker 4: it gives them a little bit more of an incentive 118 00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:32,280 Speaker 4: knowing that the you know, the payback, that extra twenty 119 00:06:32,279 --> 00:06:35,159 Speaker 4: percent deductibility might be the difference between doing it or not. 120 00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:38,120 Speaker 4: You know, they'll have a business plan, they'll be thinking 121 00:06:38,120 --> 00:06:39,960 Speaker 4: about what they want to do. That might be the 122 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:42,080 Speaker 4: thing that gets it across the line. And I think 123 00:06:42,120 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 4: when confidence has been pretty fragile for a while, those 124 00:06:45,960 --> 00:06:48,039 Speaker 4: are the sorts of things that sort of add up 125 00:06:48,080 --> 00:06:50,680 Speaker 4: to people wanting to take the initiative. We've been in 126 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:53,760 Speaker 4: a bit of a unique position because even though we're 127 00:06:53,760 --> 00:06:57,240 Speaker 4: the fifth biggest player in a market that's obviously dominated 128 00:06:57,240 --> 00:07:01,120 Speaker 4: by offshore own banks, we've been the fastest growing and 129 00:07:01,160 --> 00:07:03,640 Speaker 4: so a sense of enthusiasm and getting out and talking 130 00:07:03,640 --> 00:07:05,680 Speaker 4: to customers about you know, what do you want to do, 131 00:07:05,720 --> 00:07:09,200 Speaker 4: what do you want to achieve? Is pretty infectious actually, 132 00:07:09,200 --> 00:07:11,800 Speaker 4: and I think it's not a complicated strategy by any sense, 133 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:14,720 Speaker 4: but a bit of enthusiasm from the bank are around 134 00:07:15,240 --> 00:07:17,040 Speaker 4: what's your goals, what's your dreams? Where do you see 135 00:07:17,080 --> 00:07:19,960 Speaker 4: the opportunities? How might you think about automation, how might 136 00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:23,120 Speaker 4: you think about investment, how might you think about productivity? 137 00:07:23,120 --> 00:07:25,600 Speaker 4: And those sorts of things and investing in that. The 138 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:27,920 Speaker 4: good thing I think about the technology set we're seeing 139 00:07:27,920 --> 00:07:31,400 Speaker 4: at the moment is that the payback is much shorter 140 00:07:31,520 --> 00:07:34,000 Speaker 4: term and you can sort of see the jobs that 141 00:07:34,120 --> 00:07:37,760 Speaker 4: could be maybe tackled by than technology. You know, if 142 00:07:37,760 --> 00:07:40,360 Speaker 4: you think about health and safety with robotics and automation 143 00:07:40,520 --> 00:07:44,400 Speaker 4: and logistics, much safer, don't make mistakes, don't have a 144 00:07:44,440 --> 00:07:47,000 Speaker 4: bad day on the showroom floor or in the warehouse. 145 00:07:47,440 --> 00:07:50,000 Speaker 4: So those sorts of things, you know, obviously offer great 146 00:07:50,040 --> 00:07:52,680 Speaker 4: payback if you're willing to make the investment up front, 147 00:07:52,920 --> 00:07:55,600 Speaker 4: and it's what it's really aimed at, isn't it. It's 148 00:07:55,680 --> 00:07:58,920 Speaker 4: the advanced technology that's really going to increase productivity for 149 00:07:58,960 --> 00:08:02,680 Speaker 4: your business or your competitiveness. I mean, it's it's applicable 150 00:08:02,680 --> 00:08:06,720 Speaker 4: to uts and other things as well. But what advice 151 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:11,080 Speaker 4: are you able to give to your customers about the 152 00:08:11,160 --> 00:08:15,280 Speaker 4: types of technologies they should be investing in you as 153 00:08:15,280 --> 00:08:19,160 Speaker 4: a as a sort of driver off innovation in this country. Yeah, 154 00:08:19,240 --> 00:08:21,080 Speaker 4: I mean, I think there's a few things that strike me. 155 00:08:21,200 --> 00:08:23,360 Speaker 4: I mean there are some absolute poster sholds, whether you 156 00:08:23,440 --> 00:08:25,320 Speaker 4: know that be Rocket Lab or one of our own. 157 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:26,840 Speaker 2: Customers down Aerospace. 158 00:08:27,320 --> 00:08:32,240 Speaker 4: You know, you know, driving affordability for space is you know, 159 00:08:32,559 --> 00:08:35,960 Speaker 4: huge opportunity. But people can be a bit overwhelmed by 160 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:38,240 Speaker 4: that fact. They sort of think, oh, my business is 161 00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:40,040 Speaker 4: not like that, you know, it's not heavy on tech. 162 00:08:40,520 --> 00:08:43,000 Speaker 4: But actually almost every business has got an opportunity to 163 00:08:43,040 --> 00:08:45,520 Speaker 4: move things forward. And so, you know, when I think 164 00:08:45,520 --> 00:08:47,680 Speaker 4: about it, the number one thing I'd say is be 165 00:08:47,880 --> 00:08:52,600 Speaker 4: curious and just start getting involved in using it. Kind 166 00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:54,679 Speaker 4: of get over yourself if you're worried about, oh, I'm 167 00:08:54,679 --> 00:08:57,040 Speaker 4: not a tech person, I'm not a digital person. You know, 168 00:08:57,080 --> 00:09:00,599 Speaker 4: what we're seeing here is the ability for techechnology to 169 00:09:00,640 --> 00:09:03,480 Speaker 4: do jobs that are you know, repeatable processes. If you've 170 00:09:03,520 --> 00:09:07,280 Speaker 4: got decent documentation, can see the tech really tackling those jobs. 171 00:09:07,320 --> 00:09:10,960 Speaker 4: And so there is a full spectrum of jobs that 172 00:09:11,000 --> 00:09:14,320 Speaker 4: can be tackled by the tech. But their curiosity and 173 00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:16,600 Speaker 4: wanting to get involved and really giving it a crack 174 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:19,400 Speaker 4: to understand it, or buddying up with another business that 175 00:09:19,480 --> 00:09:21,599 Speaker 4: might be a little bit further ahead, or leaning on 176 00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:24,520 Speaker 4: a provider like two Degrees to help you get an 177 00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:27,960 Speaker 4: understanding of what's available and learning by doing. 178 00:09:27,840 --> 00:09:29,000 Speaker 2: Is the number one thing I'd say. 179 00:09:29,120 --> 00:09:32,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, that was an interesting thing Mike in the study 180 00:09:32,480 --> 00:09:36,400 Speaker 1: around digital skills and a sense of confidence there that 181 00:09:36,440 --> 00:09:39,280 Speaker 1: businesses feel are quite well prepared, they have the skills 182 00:09:39,600 --> 00:09:43,559 Speaker 1: needed for the transformation that the business needs to go through. 183 00:09:43,840 --> 00:09:46,320 Speaker 1: You know, talk to a lot of businesses, education providers, 184 00:09:46,360 --> 00:09:49,040 Speaker 1: government don't get that sense of confidence there, but when 185 00:09:49,040 --> 00:09:51,400 Speaker 1: they assess themselves they go, yep, we've got it covered. 186 00:09:51,440 --> 00:09:52,319 Speaker 1: What's your sense. 187 00:09:53,160 --> 00:09:54,920 Speaker 3: Yeah, So again, I think the really interesting thing with 188 00:09:55,040 --> 00:09:57,680 Speaker 3: AI is is it actually can be used by the 189 00:09:57,679 --> 00:09:59,360 Speaker 3: man on the street a little and on the street 190 00:10:00,640 --> 00:10:03,640 Speaker 3: the fear factor shouldn't be there. It's such an easy 191 00:10:03,679 --> 00:10:07,199 Speaker 3: tool to pick up trial error and play with. So 192 00:10:07,679 --> 00:10:11,800 Speaker 3: from a technology inspective, AI, you know, we just encourage 193 00:10:11,960 --> 00:10:15,920 Speaker 3: everyone to be curious with a technology. I mentioned before 194 00:10:15,960 --> 00:10:18,640 Speaker 3: that you know, small business in particular. You know, you 195 00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:21,320 Speaker 3: used to the analogies of the small business owner being 196 00:10:21,360 --> 00:10:24,680 Speaker 3: the IT manager and the HR manager. You know, AI 197 00:10:24,800 --> 00:10:27,280 Speaker 3: is a phenomenal tool and a very cost effective tool 198 00:10:27,320 --> 00:10:30,360 Speaker 3: for taking that burden away from a small business. The 199 00:10:30,440 --> 00:10:32,079 Speaker 3: really interesting thing that I think came out of the 200 00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:35,920 Speaker 3: Shaping Business study that we did this year was the 201 00:10:36,559 --> 00:10:40,839 Speaker 3: focus on increased spend on AI as a productivity tool 202 00:10:40,880 --> 00:10:43,160 Speaker 3: as opposed to employing people. Yeah, all right, so that 203 00:10:43,280 --> 00:10:45,920 Speaker 3: is a big trend. It's been talked about for a 204 00:10:45,960 --> 00:10:48,480 Speaker 3: long time. Again, we don't look at AI as a 205 00:10:48,480 --> 00:10:50,880 Speaker 3: people replacement. We look at it as a business enhancement. 206 00:10:51,400 --> 00:10:53,920 Speaker 3: You get natural productivity through that. But it's really interesting 207 00:10:53,920 --> 00:10:56,640 Speaker 3: to see that that, you know, that flavor is now 208 00:10:56,720 --> 00:10:57,680 Speaker 3: coming through the study. 209 00:10:58,000 --> 00:11:00,720 Speaker 1: It's so interesting because Tells Truth has just said they 210 00:11:00,760 --> 00:11:03,040 Speaker 1: expect to have a smaller workforce in five years to 211 00:11:03,080 --> 00:11:06,560 Speaker 1: im BT whatever it's called now similar sort of things. 212 00:11:06,559 --> 00:11:08,960 Speaker 1: So we're starting the narrative starting to shift from it 213 00:11:09,080 --> 00:11:11,680 Speaker 1: sort of it will work in tandem with you to 214 00:11:11,800 --> 00:11:15,120 Speaker 1: Actually there will be a reduction in overall headcount in 215 00:11:15,160 --> 00:11:18,680 Speaker 1: some organizations, but the people who remain will have much 216 00:11:18,720 --> 00:11:20,240 Speaker 1: more fulfilling jobs. 217 00:11:20,559 --> 00:11:21,120 Speaker 2: And it's the. 218 00:11:21,440 --> 00:11:23,800 Speaker 3: Type of roles that will be confected, so it should 219 00:11:23,920 --> 00:11:26,000 Speaker 3: enhance a lot of roles. It should enhance a lot 220 00:11:26,040 --> 00:11:28,720 Speaker 3: of businesses. There will naturally be some roles that won't 221 00:11:28,720 --> 00:11:30,440 Speaker 3: be around in five years time as a result of it. 222 00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:33,640 Speaker 3: We talked a lot around the education with AI. So 223 00:11:33,679 --> 00:11:36,600 Speaker 3: if you want an organization to embrace embrace AI to 224 00:11:36,640 --> 00:11:41,199 Speaker 3: be more highly productive and more innovative, you can't start 225 00:11:41,240 --> 00:11:44,400 Speaker 3: with we're going to take head count out. So you've 226 00:11:44,400 --> 00:11:46,880 Speaker 3: got to get the settings and the incentives right to 227 00:11:46,920 --> 00:11:49,440 Speaker 3: embrace new technology. And again that's the journey we're on 228 00:11:49,480 --> 00:11:52,120 Speaker 3: at two degrees. And we looked on embedded and kind 229 00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:53,679 Speaker 3: of all of our tools and all of our behaviors 230 00:11:53,720 --> 00:11:56,440 Speaker 3: across the businesses as much around behavior and education changes. 231 00:11:57,240 --> 00:12:00,280 Speaker 3: We put the technology into our call centers, did all 232 00:12:00,280 --> 00:12:03,080 Speaker 3: the call translation and did all the summary note codes, 233 00:12:03,880 --> 00:12:05,880 Speaker 3: but at the end of the call, everyone was reviewing all. 234 00:12:05,760 --> 00:12:06,360 Speaker 2: The note codes. 235 00:12:07,720 --> 00:12:09,600 Speaker 3: So you have to create the right behaviors and the 236 00:12:09,600 --> 00:12:12,800 Speaker 3: cultural settings to get the gains out of any technology. 237 00:12:13,080 --> 00:12:15,840 Speaker 1: You've both been in North America recently looking at the 238 00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:19,240 Speaker 1: rise of agentic AI. So this is moving from the 239 00:12:19,320 --> 00:12:22,160 Speaker 1: likes of Chat GP, This is moving from the likes 240 00:12:22,200 --> 00:12:26,480 Speaker 1: of Chat, GPT and copilot, which is actually according to study, 241 00:12:26,520 --> 00:12:29,640 Speaker 1: thirty two percent of businesses are using from seventeen percent 242 00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:32,520 Speaker 1: in the previous year. So that's good. This stuff is accessible, 243 00:12:32,559 --> 00:12:35,720 Speaker 1: it's relatively cheap. But the next wave is so called 244 00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:40,600 Speaker 1: agentic AI. Steve took us through that transition from these 245 00:12:40,600 --> 00:12:46,120 Speaker 1: sort of information based generative systems through AI that actually 246 00:12:46,200 --> 00:12:47,959 Speaker 1: can make decisions on your behalf. 247 00:12:48,440 --> 00:12:51,080 Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean what really struck me was, as I 248 00:12:51,200 --> 00:12:55,360 Speaker 4: mentioned earlier when we were having the breakfast, was what 249 00:12:55,440 --> 00:12:58,079 Speaker 4: really struck me was the speed. So four or five 250 00:12:58,120 --> 00:13:00,000 Speaker 4: months ago, I was with a group of chief excs 251 00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:05,120 Speaker 4: X through our partner Visa, and they were showcasing you 252 00:13:05,160 --> 00:13:08,520 Speaker 4: know what they were basically calling, you know, the the 253 00:13:08,640 --> 00:13:12,760 Speaker 4: dawn of agentic commerce. And to be fair, that was 254 00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:14,920 Speaker 4: the first time i'd heard the term, not the first 255 00:13:14,960 --> 00:13:16,880 Speaker 4: time i'd heard about agents, not the first time i'd 256 00:13:16,880 --> 00:13:20,520 Speaker 4: heard about you know, large language models or large research 257 00:13:20,559 --> 00:13:23,920 Speaker 4: models doing jobs. But roll that forward five months and 258 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:27,880 Speaker 4: arriving in San Francisco. You know, billboards talking about the 259 00:13:27,920 --> 00:13:31,520 Speaker 4: lowest cost, low code agents to help your business thrive. 260 00:13:32,240 --> 00:13:34,400 Speaker 4: And so one thing I'd say, you know, I'm not 261 00:13:34,400 --> 00:13:37,160 Speaker 4: an advertising expert, but when people start putting up billboards 262 00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:40,600 Speaker 4: above the line to showcase what they've got to sell, 263 00:13:41,160 --> 00:13:44,400 Speaker 4: that's moved really fast. And that was the real thing 264 00:13:44,440 --> 00:13:46,520 Speaker 4: that struck me that it had gone from sort of 265 00:13:46,960 --> 00:13:51,360 Speaker 4: interesting idea, let to showcase it to actually massive companies 266 00:13:51,400 --> 00:13:54,640 Speaker 4: like Salesforce, you know, talking to them, you know, some 267 00:13:54,679 --> 00:13:56,960 Speaker 4: of the largest and most valuable market cap companies in 268 00:13:57,000 --> 00:13:59,200 Speaker 4: the world, saying you know, here are the jobs that 269 00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:02,920 Speaker 4: are being tackled by these agents, and mark touched on 270 00:14:02,960 --> 00:14:04,640 Speaker 4: in the breakfast as well as you know, it's very 271 00:14:04,760 --> 00:14:07,880 Speaker 4: likely you'll see a suite of agents because the cost 272 00:14:07,920 --> 00:14:10,800 Speaker 4: of the agents doing the work can be optimized by 273 00:14:11,160 --> 00:14:13,720 Speaker 4: very specialist agents doing a particular part of the job. 274 00:14:14,120 --> 00:14:15,719 Speaker 4: So you can see, just like you're do in your 275 00:14:15,720 --> 00:14:18,319 Speaker 4: own workplace. Now, you know, you might need three or 276 00:14:18,320 --> 00:14:20,400 Speaker 4: four people that are experts in areas to come back 277 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:22,800 Speaker 4: to give you the answer you're after, because, like most 278 00:14:22,920 --> 00:14:26,400 Speaker 4: decent problems, not one person can solve them. So seeing 279 00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:28,760 Speaker 4: the agents being able to gather the policy, seeing them 280 00:14:28,760 --> 00:14:30,760 Speaker 4: be able to understand the trend, seeing them be able 281 00:14:30,760 --> 00:14:34,080 Speaker 4: to action what the plan looks like, you know, document it, 282 00:14:34,520 --> 00:14:37,040 Speaker 4: follow it up, explore things that might not be documented 283 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:39,480 Speaker 4: as it sort of blows your mind when you think 284 00:14:39,480 --> 00:14:41,920 Speaker 4: about the number of things across your organization where people 285 00:14:41,960 --> 00:14:44,840 Speaker 4: are grinding away to try and find the latest version 286 00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:47,880 Speaker 4: of something or produce something, or the hours that go 287 00:14:47,960 --> 00:14:51,560 Speaker 4: into producing PowerPoint decks and those sorts of things where 288 00:14:51,800 --> 00:14:54,080 Speaker 4: that time could be spent on much more interesting, more 289 00:14:54,120 --> 00:14:58,240 Speaker 4: complex problems than producing that stuff. So that feels like 290 00:14:58,280 --> 00:14:59,400 Speaker 4: a really big shift to me. 291 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:02,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, at QUI Bankers, is that where you are sort 292 00:15:02,880 --> 00:15:04,960 Speaker 1: of at with your own use of AI at the 293 00:15:04,960 --> 00:15:08,120 Speaker 1: moment that real productivity play or are you starting to 294 00:15:08,160 --> 00:15:13,160 Speaker 1: experiment with AI for financial services for dispensing financial advice 295 00:15:13,200 --> 00:15:13,640 Speaker 1: for instance? 296 00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 4: Here, No, we're not in the robo advice, that's what 297 00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:17,920 Speaker 4: it's normally described at. What we are at is we've 298 00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:20,360 Speaker 4: seen huge gains and we've got an international award much 299 00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:22,040 Speaker 4: like Mark talked on in the call center, which is 300 00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:24,120 Speaker 4: in our business banking center. So if you think about 301 00:15:24,720 --> 00:15:26,960 Speaker 4: tens of thousands of small business owners that have a 302 00:15:27,000 --> 00:15:29,040 Speaker 4: lot of stuff that they need doing, don't have a 303 00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:31,840 Speaker 4: lot of spare time bringing into our contact center to 304 00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:33,840 Speaker 4: talk to our business bankers about the job that they 305 00:15:33,880 --> 00:15:37,480 Speaker 4: need fixing. The technology platform we use is able to 306 00:15:37,560 --> 00:15:40,680 Speaker 4: understand what the question is that people are really trying 307 00:15:40,680 --> 00:15:43,560 Speaker 4: to solve, because often customers will explain an issue but 308 00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:46,400 Speaker 4: it's not really the problem they're trying to solve. But 309 00:15:46,520 --> 00:15:49,080 Speaker 4: being able to understand what that sentiment is and route 310 00:15:49,080 --> 00:15:50,920 Speaker 4: them to the right bank or at the right time 311 00:15:51,400 --> 00:15:54,200 Speaker 4: saved us heaps and heaps of time. And I think 312 00:15:54,200 --> 00:15:57,600 Speaker 4: about this technology being grateful team and grateful customer. So 313 00:15:57,640 --> 00:15:59,520 Speaker 4: the bank has got the right call at the right 314 00:15:59,560 --> 00:16:02,120 Speaker 4: time and less agitated when they had to answer the question. 315 00:16:02,480 --> 00:16:05,920 Speaker 4: They've also got better information and able to push back 316 00:16:06,200 --> 00:16:09,360 Speaker 4: and give better answers. So we're really at the early 317 00:16:09,480 --> 00:16:14,320 Speaker 4: edge of utilizing the vendor AI. So our lending platform 318 00:16:14,400 --> 00:16:17,000 Speaker 4: is one of the world leading lending platforms that will 319 00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:19,480 Speaker 4: make a credit decision for you. So it's a job 320 00:16:19,520 --> 00:16:21,600 Speaker 4: that's been done in the bank, but if you think 321 00:16:21,640 --> 00:16:23,960 Speaker 4: about an agent doing that job, you know they always 322 00:16:23,960 --> 00:16:25,600 Speaker 4: get it right. They don't have a bad day at 323 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:28,160 Speaker 4: the office. They're not feeling tired or grumpy. They're always 324 00:16:28,240 --> 00:16:30,040 Speaker 4: doing that job. And so if you can tune that, 325 00:16:30,840 --> 00:16:33,400 Speaker 4: you can get big benefits. But we are not out 326 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:36,080 Speaker 4: doing experiments or proof of concepts. We are much more 327 00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:38,400 Speaker 4: about a pathway to production. How do we get that 328 00:16:38,440 --> 00:16:41,800 Speaker 4: to help our customers and help our team. So we're 329 00:16:42,040 --> 00:16:44,760 Speaker 4: absolutely not at the cutting edge of that, but I've 330 00:16:44,800 --> 00:16:46,640 Speaker 4: never been more convinced that we need to go faster. 331 00:16:46,920 --> 00:16:49,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, and you're a big proponent of open banking, and 332 00:16:49,640 --> 00:16:52,240 Speaker 1: I see great thing you've done. You've waived the fees 333 00:16:52,280 --> 00:16:56,440 Speaker 1: on API interactions that third parties will have to share 334 00:16:56,640 --> 00:16:59,880 Speaker 1: customer data. So I guess some of those companies will 335 00:16:59,880 --> 00:17:04,480 Speaker 1: be adopting AI. I guess that's innovative, but also some 336 00:17:04,640 --> 00:17:06,720 Speaker 1: risk involved in that. You're not taking the risk with 337 00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:09,639 Speaker 1: your own customers, but their data might be going to 338 00:17:10,359 --> 00:17:12,280 Speaker 1: startups that are a bit more aggressive on AI. 339 00:17:12,560 --> 00:17:14,600 Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean that's right, But I mean I think 340 00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:17,320 Speaker 4: what's the counterfactual to that is, Oh, we should charge 341 00:17:17,320 --> 00:17:20,720 Speaker 4: people for their own data. We should prevent the competition, 342 00:17:20,920 --> 00:17:23,679 Speaker 4: we should pretend that we've got all the answers, and 343 00:17:23,720 --> 00:17:25,840 Speaker 4: you know, you look around the financial services world, or 344 00:17:25,880 --> 00:17:28,639 Speaker 4: the telco world or whatever it's. You know, there's no 345 00:17:28,720 --> 00:17:31,840 Speaker 4: one company that fixes all problems, and I think by 346 00:17:31,880 --> 00:17:34,080 Speaker 4: opening it up and embracing it, it'll make us better. 347 00:17:34,400 --> 00:17:35,960 Speaker 4: You know, we'll have to run faster and there'll be 348 00:17:36,000 --> 00:17:37,800 Speaker 4: a few times where we're not up to speed, and 349 00:17:38,520 --> 00:17:40,359 Speaker 4: that's the market. We should learn from that, we should 350 00:17:40,359 --> 00:17:43,000 Speaker 4: respond to it, and we should be better. And you know, 351 00:17:43,119 --> 00:17:45,040 Speaker 4: we want to grow. So if we want to grow 352 00:17:45,520 --> 00:17:48,520 Speaker 4: and you're a small bank at the last stop before Antarctica, 353 00:17:48,920 --> 00:17:51,359 Speaker 4: then you've got a partner with people and you can't 354 00:17:51,359 --> 00:17:52,000 Speaker 4: do it all yourself. 355 00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:55,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, Mike, it's obviously not all about AI. That was 356 00:17:55,720 --> 00:17:58,040 Speaker 1: actually sort of a little bit down the list of 357 00:17:58,080 --> 00:18:00,600 Speaker 1: priorities in terms of when it comes to growth in 358 00:18:00,640 --> 00:18:04,600 Speaker 1: what businesses are interested in investing in. Websites are actually almost 359 00:18:04,680 --> 00:18:07,320 Speaker 1: top of the list, and sales and marketing, So it's 360 00:18:07,359 --> 00:18:11,800 Speaker 1: those sort of traditional things that when businesses are looking 361 00:18:11,800 --> 00:18:15,120 Speaker 1: towards growing again and bringing in more revenue, it's those 362 00:18:15,160 --> 00:18:16,960 Speaker 1: basic things that they're looking to invest in. 363 00:18:17,000 --> 00:18:18,800 Speaker 2: Now, Yeah, one hundred percent. 364 00:18:19,160 --> 00:18:22,439 Speaker 3: Again, it'll be a reflection again of the small business 365 00:18:22,800 --> 00:18:25,639 Speaker 3: and meeting business that we've captured in the survey. But 366 00:18:25,880 --> 00:18:28,000 Speaker 3: the study certainly shows if you come back to my 367 00:18:28,040 --> 00:18:30,960 Speaker 3: earlier point around you know, more than half of the 368 00:18:31,000 --> 00:18:33,000 Speaker 3: business of launching your product or service in the last 369 00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:36,000 Speaker 3: twelve months. Launching the product or service is one thing, 370 00:18:36,040 --> 00:18:38,680 Speaker 3: but how do you get customer eyeballs on it? How 371 00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:40,600 Speaker 3: do you sell it? How do you make money? And 372 00:18:40,640 --> 00:18:42,600 Speaker 3: that's where I think you've seen the back to basics 373 00:18:42,600 --> 00:18:45,960 Speaker 3: when it comes to traditional sales and marketing, social media, 374 00:18:46,560 --> 00:18:49,320 Speaker 3: website development and getting it out there. I would add 375 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:52,240 Speaker 3: that to Steve's point, the AIS and all of those 376 00:18:52,240 --> 00:18:57,679 Speaker 3: ecosystems as well. So even a small business creating a website. 377 00:18:57,119 --> 00:18:59,439 Speaker 1: Agentic it just does it in seconds. 378 00:18:59,560 --> 00:19:01,800 Speaker 3: Yeah, and I use you know, I've talked about a 379 00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:04,640 Speaker 3: AI a lot. I've moved on from you know, twelve 380 00:19:04,720 --> 00:19:07,400 Speaker 3: months ago. AI been one of the tools you have 381 00:19:07,560 --> 00:19:10,399 Speaker 3: to run and use in your business to being the 382 00:19:10,400 --> 00:19:13,280 Speaker 3: tool that is the center of your business. Steve Grade 383 00:19:13,280 --> 00:19:15,560 Speaker 3: a great example of the you know, the HR person. 384 00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:20,280 Speaker 3: I've seen again a demo of an AGENTIC HR onboarding person. 385 00:19:20,720 --> 00:19:23,040 Speaker 3: So when a new employee starts, you know, you've got 386 00:19:23,040 --> 00:19:26,200 Speaker 3: the natural things like, you know, the policies, the contracts, 387 00:19:26,200 --> 00:19:30,280 Speaker 3: et cetera. But the agenda AI agent can create an 388 00:19:30,280 --> 00:19:32,399 Speaker 3: it help just stick it for your laptop, for your 389 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:37,240 Speaker 3: mobile phone, organize the meetings, send to your induction materials. 390 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:42,760 Speaker 3: So again that's enhancing the onboarding experience for new employees 391 00:19:42,920 --> 00:19:44,680 Speaker 3: and younger talent. You want to create in a world 392 00:19:44,680 --> 00:19:47,159 Speaker 3: that they live in. So again it's getting that balance 393 00:19:47,240 --> 00:19:49,520 Speaker 3: right between you know, doing the basics well from a 394 00:19:49,560 --> 00:19:52,480 Speaker 3: technology perspective, but also embracing the future of AI. 395 00:19:52,520 --> 00:19:54,720 Speaker 2: And I think as. 396 00:19:54,680 --> 00:19:58,359 Speaker 3: Leaders of businesses, it's it's very early in the hype curve, 397 00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:01,200 Speaker 3: but you need that vision and you need that leadership 398 00:20:01,200 --> 00:20:03,440 Speaker 3: that Steve talks about to make sure that our business 399 00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:05,280 Speaker 3: is going to thrive in the long term. I think 400 00:20:05,320 --> 00:20:09,320 Speaker 3: the biggest threat to our businesses is a pure AI startup. Yeah, 401 00:20:09,480 --> 00:20:12,280 Speaker 3: we're embracing it and building it into legacy. You got 402 00:20:12,280 --> 00:20:14,320 Speaker 3: to think around what does what does the new bank 403 00:20:14,359 --> 00:20:16,280 Speaker 3: look like or the new telco look like? In five 404 00:20:16,359 --> 00:20:20,080 Speaker 3: years it'll be an AI bank called Yeah. So you 405 00:20:20,560 --> 00:20:21,720 Speaker 3: can't ignore the technology. 406 00:20:21,840 --> 00:20:25,119 Speaker 1: And that's why you see the billboards and San Francisco 407 00:20:25,320 --> 00:20:30,320 Speaker 1: all about AI because they're genuinely building AI centric organizations 408 00:20:30,359 --> 00:20:32,080 Speaker 1: over there. We're bolting it on here at the moment, 409 00:20:32,119 --> 00:20:34,399 Speaker 1: but that's the transition we all have to go on 410 00:20:34,440 --> 00:20:35,600 Speaker 1: to be competitive as well. 411 00:20:36,359 --> 00:20:39,520 Speaker 3: And if you think around talent and getting the people 412 00:20:39,560 --> 00:20:42,920 Speaker 3: we want in our organizations, if you don't have the tools, 413 00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:46,919 Speaker 3: the platforms, the mindset, I'll go to an AI startup 414 00:20:46,920 --> 00:20:49,360 Speaker 3: because that's the language they used to in the world 415 00:20:49,359 --> 00:20:49,919 Speaker 3: they want to live in. 416 00:20:50,119 --> 00:20:52,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, just on the talent. That is one of the 417 00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:57,199 Speaker 1: barriers to growth, and that is finding really highly skilled people. 418 00:20:58,240 --> 00:21:00,399 Speaker 1: Although when it comes to digital skills, had a lot 419 00:21:00,400 --> 00:21:04,280 Speaker 1: of the self reporting from these businesses is that they 420 00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:06,560 Speaker 1: feel they've got it covered. What's your sort of stands, 421 00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:11,280 Speaker 1: both in your organizations hiring people. What's it like out 422 00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:13,440 Speaker 1: there at the moment getting the right sort of talent, 423 00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:16,400 Speaker 1: particularly in those highly skilled tech related areas. 424 00:21:16,920 --> 00:21:18,440 Speaker 2: I would actually say it's improved a lot. 425 00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:21,400 Speaker 3: Again, if you look back twelve to eighteen months, the 426 00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:26,840 Speaker 3: employment market was very tough. You had challenge is finding 427 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:30,800 Speaker 3: the right talent, the cost of that talent and everything 428 00:21:30,800 --> 00:21:34,080 Speaker 3: in between. Now we have a I think we have 429 00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:36,960 Speaker 3: a market where again if you position your business properly, 430 00:21:37,520 --> 00:21:40,800 Speaker 3: and again it comes back to if you're wanting to 431 00:21:40,840 --> 00:21:45,080 Speaker 3: get great young technology and talent in your business. They 432 00:21:45,200 --> 00:21:47,520 Speaker 3: want to hear an AI story when they hear me 433 00:21:47,600 --> 00:21:49,600 Speaker 3: talk about my business and my team talk about their business. 434 00:21:50,560 --> 00:21:54,119 Speaker 3: So again i would describe the market is easier to 435 00:21:54,119 --> 00:21:56,680 Speaker 3: get the talent we need, but that doesn't remove the 436 00:21:56,720 --> 00:21:58,679 Speaker 3: onus on us to make sure that the environment's right 437 00:21:58,680 --> 00:21:59,399 Speaker 3: when they get there. 438 00:22:00,280 --> 00:22:03,640 Speaker 4: Yeah, i'd absolutely echo marx comments. A couple of things 439 00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:07,480 Speaker 4: I'd add. One is, for most existing businesses, you've still 440 00:22:07,480 --> 00:22:09,639 Speaker 4: got that challenge that Mark talked upon, which is the 441 00:22:09,800 --> 00:22:13,199 Speaker 4: transition from the heritage systems to the new. So you 442 00:22:13,280 --> 00:22:15,600 Speaker 4: still need an engaged team that's willing to work on 443 00:22:15,720 --> 00:22:18,639 Speaker 4: the current state or the historical state and into the 444 00:22:18,680 --> 00:22:23,320 Speaker 4: new state. So holding on to decent talent that's helping 445 00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:25,520 Speaker 4: us get off that old stack and onto a new 446 00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:30,399 Speaker 4: capability is quite a conundrum, right, because you really value 447 00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:32,400 Speaker 4: those people when you need them, but you also got 448 00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:34,480 Speaker 4: to understand that they want to be future ready as well. 449 00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:36,639 Speaker 4: They don't want to be the last one working on 450 00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:38,399 Speaker 4: the old system when everyone else has moved to the 451 00:22:38,440 --> 00:22:42,360 Speaker 4: new system, so you know there's rotation and making sure 452 00:22:42,359 --> 00:22:44,920 Speaker 4: that you're insenting people in the right way. I'm also 453 00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:47,800 Speaker 4: super encouraged by the idea that people will come into 454 00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:51,239 Speaker 4: those technology jobs without having to have had to do 455 00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:55,080 Speaker 4: five ten years of coding. You know, you will see 456 00:22:55,320 --> 00:22:58,879 Speaker 4: the technology being able to create huge amounts of the code. 457 00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:02,680 Speaker 4: So people are creative people that are got a vision 458 00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:05,600 Speaker 4: for what could be achieved, but maybe not the traditional education. 459 00:23:06,320 --> 00:23:08,399 Speaker 4: I think the technology can be a real game changer 460 00:23:08,400 --> 00:23:10,680 Speaker 4: for them. And we talk a lot about the digital divide, 461 00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:13,600 Speaker 4: but I'm very hopeful that, you know, particularly when you 462 00:23:13,640 --> 00:23:16,960 Speaker 4: think about the multicultural cities in New Zealand like Auckland, 463 00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:21,720 Speaker 4: that the creativity, the flair, you know, that will be 464 00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:24,520 Speaker 4: a big step up and when using these tools rather 465 00:23:24,560 --> 00:23:27,800 Speaker 4: than having a traditional education that's been advantaged by where 466 00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:30,040 Speaker 4: you've been or your access and those sorts of things. 467 00:23:30,040 --> 00:23:33,600 Speaker 4: So I'm actually quite positive that there can be a 468 00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:35,679 Speaker 4: leap frog for people to jump into roles. 469 00:23:36,119 --> 00:23:36,320 Speaker 3: You know. 470 00:23:36,359 --> 00:23:37,840 Speaker 4: And if you think about a small business owner that 471 00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:40,000 Speaker 4: you know would have been overwhelmed by the idea of 472 00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:44,119 Speaker 4: organizing an agency to create a website and you know, 473 00:23:44,160 --> 00:23:46,000 Speaker 4: all of the kind of jargon that came with it 474 00:23:46,080 --> 00:23:48,439 Speaker 4: and all of the mystique to being able to create 475 00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:50,920 Speaker 4: something where you know, you're trying to explain what your 476 00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:53,800 Speaker 4: business does in your community and why you think should 477 00:23:53,800 --> 00:23:55,960 Speaker 4: be people with you business owners will be good at that. 478 00:23:56,440 --> 00:23:58,240 Speaker 4: The rest of it will the technology or sort of 479 00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:00,000 Speaker 4: mask that complexity of hope in the future. 480 00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:03,439 Speaker 1: Yeah, Like in the wake of COVID, they did Digital Boost, 481 00:24:03,440 --> 00:24:06,080 Speaker 1: which was a whole scheme to try and very quickly 482 00:24:06,080 --> 00:24:10,520 Speaker 1: get a lot of small businesses online and using Shopify 483 00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:13,600 Speaker 1: and things like that to at least keep trading through lockdowns. 484 00:24:13,960 --> 00:24:16,440 Speaker 1: That scheme has wound down, but you almost don't need 485 00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:20,400 Speaker 1: it anymore because in the agentic world. I used replet 486 00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:24,119 Speaker 1: recently to rebuild my entire website and poured overall the 487 00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:25,040 Speaker 1: content content. 488 00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:25,200 Speaker 3: You know. 489 00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:26,960 Speaker 1: It costs about the same or a little bit more 490 00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:30,639 Speaker 1: than a WordPress website, but it was done literally. 491 00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:31,800 Speaker 2: In a day. Yeah. 492 00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:33,720 Speaker 4: I mean that's a huge advantage, right. That allows you 493 00:24:33,760 --> 00:24:37,800 Speaker 4: to work on the getting interesting stories, to build rapport 494 00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:40,560 Speaker 4: with people, to understand the trends, not be their grinding 495 00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:42,480 Speaker 4: to get a new website up, which is a necessary 496 00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:45,040 Speaker 4: evil but not something you probably feel like is a 497 00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:47,560 Speaker 4: massive differentiator for you. And I think that's why when 498 00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:50,280 Speaker 4: Mark was talking about people revisiting the sort of foundations 499 00:24:50,320 --> 00:24:53,440 Speaker 4: like a decent website like you know, moving from conversation 500 00:24:53,560 --> 00:24:56,399 Speaker 4: to close, all those sorts of things. I think as 501 00:24:56,440 --> 00:24:59,640 Speaker 4: people see what better looks like, hopefully they're chuning themselves 502 00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:01,360 Speaker 4: and say, you know, I have to do better than 503 00:25:01,359 --> 00:25:03,800 Speaker 4: this because you know, all things being equal, am I 504 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:05,880 Speaker 4: paying a much enough for search optimization? 505 00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:06,600 Speaker 3: You know? 506 00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:08,960 Speaker 4: Am I showing up in these right places for people 507 00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:11,320 Speaker 4: when they're making these decisions? And I think, you know, 508 00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:13,920 Speaker 4: for those that are listening, you know, just to experiment 509 00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:14,920 Speaker 4: a little bit with you know. 510 00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:15,480 Speaker 2: You pick your tool. 511 00:25:15,480 --> 00:25:18,680 Speaker 4: But for one I use as perplexity, going too perplexity 512 00:25:18,720 --> 00:25:20,760 Speaker 4: and ask it to give you I'm going to Wellington 513 00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,880 Speaker 4: for three days, you know, give me accommodations and places 514 00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:26,560 Speaker 4: to eat out and interesting things to do. The answer 515 00:25:26,600 --> 00:25:28,760 Speaker 4: you get back is so much richer and so much 516 00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:32,040 Speaker 4: more contextual than Google. With all due respect to Google, 517 00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:35,760 Speaker 4: will be you know, a list of paid ads telling 518 00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:37,600 Speaker 4: you about you know, you can stay here, you can 519 00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:40,040 Speaker 4: do this now. Obviously they're trying to tweak with Gemini 520 00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:42,200 Speaker 4: and give a little bit more context to the ads 521 00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:45,040 Speaker 4: that they're serving. But it's a very different world where 522 00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:48,200 Speaker 4: you can get back and itinery that tells you interesting 523 00:25:48,280 --> 00:25:50,119 Speaker 4: things to do. You can tune it for your budget. 524 00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:52,040 Speaker 4: You can do all those things if that's the one 525 00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:54,640 Speaker 4: thing you try. For me, that was a massive eye 526 00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:57,480 Speaker 4: opener around the richness and the context that it can 527 00:25:57,480 --> 00:26:01,960 Speaker 4: be generated through really simple prompting, really simple conversation, which 528 00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:04,720 Speaker 4: is actually, you know, I've got a medium budget. That's 529 00:26:04,720 --> 00:26:06,199 Speaker 4: the sort of language you can use and it will 530 00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:08,520 Speaker 4: tune back a really good answer for you, and that's 531 00:26:08,600 --> 00:26:09,160 Speaker 4: a game changer. 532 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:11,399 Speaker 1: The flip side of that as a business, and I 533 00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:16,240 Speaker 1: think this explains some of the growth and investment and websites, 534 00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:18,720 Speaker 1: is you need to optimize your content to end up 535 00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:22,800 Speaker 1: in that perplexity result or in AI overviews on Google. 536 00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:26,520 Speaker 1: You have to give more explanatory information Q and as 537 00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:29,399 Speaker 1: things that the algorithm is going to pick up and go. 538 00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:33,600 Speaker 1: This is actually useful information, experiential stuff. That's why I 539 00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:36,840 Speaker 1: redd it is so popular for training these models, because 540 00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:40,800 Speaker 1: there's lots of people giving advice, so that's a big factor. 541 00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:44,159 Speaker 1: Even down in this part of the world. Mark the 542 00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:46,760 Speaker 1: study has always been a good barometer off some of 543 00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:50,399 Speaker 1: the macro stuff, and I guess the optimism reflects the 544 00:26:50,440 --> 00:26:54,280 Speaker 1: lower interest rates and the lower inflation. However, there are 545 00:26:54,400 --> 00:27:00,160 Speaker 1: some challenges remaining particularly around sluggish demand and cost and 546 00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:02,920 Speaker 1: you know the majority of businesses are going to put 547 00:27:02,920 --> 00:27:05,600 Speaker 1: their prices up in the next year. The most common 548 00:27:06,080 --> 00:27:08,560 Speaker 1: increase will be in the eleven to twenty percent band, 549 00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:11,119 Speaker 1: although you know a fair chunk of them nearly a 550 00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:14,520 Speaker 1: quarter sead potentially forty percent or above. I thought we 551 00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:17,960 Speaker 1: were sort of over those big, chunky price increases, but 552 00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:18,480 Speaker 1: it seems not. 553 00:27:19,400 --> 00:27:24,879 Speaker 3: Yeah, So the study essentially says there will be fewer 554 00:27:24,920 --> 00:27:27,880 Speaker 3: but larger increases. And if I look at the backdrop 555 00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:31,600 Speaker 3: of the last twelve months, even from my own business perspective, 556 00:27:31,600 --> 00:27:34,040 Speaker 3: of my own personal perspective, you've just got to look 557 00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:37,000 Speaker 3: at sectors such as the electricity sector where there have 558 00:27:37,080 --> 00:27:40,960 Speaker 3: been you know, significant price increases. You know, to the 559 00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:43,920 Speaker 3: extent that impacts their householder is one thing, But when 560 00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:49,720 Speaker 3: you have businesses turning off production or reducing and exporters competitiveness, 561 00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:53,359 Speaker 3: I think there are some areas where when New Zealand 562 00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:55,240 Speaker 3: does have to have a good hard look at kind 563 00:27:55,280 --> 00:27:58,200 Speaker 3: of the settings. We have to make sure that those 564 00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:00,280 Speaker 3: price increases don't have been going forward. 565 00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:03,359 Speaker 2: So inflation of pressures are there, they are real. 566 00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:07,840 Speaker 3: And again it's how as a small meeting business, you 567 00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:12,520 Speaker 3: can navigate that and like I said, try and trying 568 00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:16,080 Speaker 3: to absorb some of the cost increases where you can. 569 00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:19,680 Speaker 3: But to a point Steve made down says earlier, it's 570 00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:23,720 Speaker 3: around not always been about price, and it was encouraging 571 00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:26,679 Speaker 3: to hear you know what customers experience when they go 572 00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:28,920 Speaker 3: to kiwibank. It's a different type of service. They're getting 573 00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:33,840 Speaker 3: something better. That's really encouraging, stuff that pushes things beyond price. 574 00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:36,560 Speaker 1: Now and again, yeah, maybe expand on that of it, Steve, 575 00:28:36,600 --> 00:28:37,640 Speaker 1: that was a really good point you made. 576 00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:38,160 Speaker 2: Yeah. 577 00:28:38,200 --> 00:28:40,320 Speaker 4: I mean when you think about what people really value, 578 00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:42,400 Speaker 4: and that's his customers, not what we think they value, 579 00:28:42,440 --> 00:28:44,720 Speaker 4: but what they say they value is they value know me, 580 00:28:45,080 --> 00:28:47,880 Speaker 4: understand me, offer me products that are timely and relevant. 581 00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:50,880 Speaker 4: So you tell me what's going on and then get 582 00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:53,480 Speaker 4: me fast decisions and so. And then the fifth one 583 00:28:53,560 --> 00:28:56,960 Speaker 4: is price. And so what I always sort of say, 584 00:28:57,000 --> 00:29:00,960 Speaker 4: you know, prices an issue, it's not that issue. So 585 00:29:01,080 --> 00:29:03,160 Speaker 4: then I think it is about Okay, so what do 586 00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:06,160 Speaker 4: those customers really want to know? Which is most people 587 00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:08,840 Speaker 4: will say when they're shifting from one band to another, 588 00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:11,720 Speaker 4: is particularly in businesses. I felt like I was just 589 00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:15,720 Speaker 4: a number my relationship. Managers are turning over all the time. 590 00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:18,560 Speaker 4: They don't really understand my business. All those sorts of 591 00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:21,680 Speaker 4: things can be helped by the tech, but the enthusiasm 592 00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:23,440 Speaker 4: of the team member to show up and you know, 593 00:29:23,680 --> 00:29:25,960 Speaker 4: and have her excited about trying to win your business 594 00:29:26,120 --> 00:29:28,880 Speaker 4: goes a long way. Because I always think about business 595 00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:32,000 Speaker 4: owners and people that are leading businesses. You lay awake 596 00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:34,520 Speaker 4: at night worrying about what's going on. Can I win 597 00:29:34,560 --> 00:29:37,280 Speaker 4: a customer, lose a customer? Can I find the right people? 598 00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:37,600 Speaker 2: You know? 599 00:29:37,640 --> 00:29:39,960 Speaker 4: Is that project going properly? And then to have a 600 00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:42,240 Speaker 4: big key service provider like a bank turn up and 601 00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:45,160 Speaker 4: just treat you like another number is very jarring. And 602 00:29:45,240 --> 00:29:49,280 Speaker 4: so what Mark was saying before about the fundamentals being done, well, 603 00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:52,800 Speaker 4: I am still a massive fan of those, and enthusiasm 604 00:29:52,840 --> 00:29:55,800 Speaker 4: goes a long way. Understanding your customers goes a long way. 605 00:29:56,000 --> 00:29:58,920 Speaker 4: We all pay, you know, a bit more for things 606 00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:01,480 Speaker 4: that we value. So if the customer can think about 607 00:30:02,560 --> 00:30:04,720 Speaker 4: am I getting value from this provider and what I 608 00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:06,520 Speaker 4: want to know about it, whether it be that they're 609 00:30:07,040 --> 00:30:09,640 Speaker 4: fighting for fear and wanting to change things like two degrees, 610 00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:12,320 Speaker 4: or you know, they're a new Zealand owned business which 611 00:30:12,360 --> 00:30:14,360 Speaker 4: is trying to help them rather than Australian owned business. 612 00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:15,800 Speaker 2: You know, we've got to make that real. 613 00:30:15,840 --> 00:30:18,200 Speaker 4: It's got to mean something, not just be enough to 614 00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:20,560 Speaker 4: rely on that. Oh they'll come to us because we've 615 00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:22,000 Speaker 4: got a good, decent strap line or whatever. 616 00:30:22,360 --> 00:30:25,360 Speaker 3: A good real example from a Turtoris perspective. We you know, 617 00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:27,240 Speaker 3: we like to think of ourselves as a software company 618 00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:30,600 Speaker 3: and not a sut telling communications company. We've built a 619 00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:33,719 Speaker 3: productivity tool called Flex and it's a you know, it's 620 00:30:33,760 --> 00:30:36,600 Speaker 3: a phenomenal tool that automates as much as we can 621 00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:39,800 Speaker 3: for an end user. So a really simple example, if 622 00:30:39,840 --> 00:30:43,120 Speaker 3: you're a business with twenty or thirty staff and you've 623 00:30:43,120 --> 00:30:45,400 Speaker 3: got a new starter, you want to order a new phone, 624 00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:49,960 Speaker 3: or port a number or turn on international roaming. You 625 00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:51,560 Speaker 3: don't have to speak to us to do that anymore. 626 00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:53,840 Speaker 3: We're there if you need us. We've built the tools 627 00:30:53,840 --> 00:30:55,800 Speaker 3: and the software for you to do it yourself. So 628 00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:59,120 Speaker 3: that's where we push productivity back to the businesses to 629 00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:00,920 Speaker 3: make a difference and give them time back in their 630 00:31:01,000 --> 00:31:04,960 Speaker 3: day versus the traditional model of getting frustrated and trying 631 00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:06,040 Speaker 3: to deal with the human on the other end. 632 00:31:06,080 --> 00:31:07,280 Speaker 2: Of the phone. Yeah. Great. 633 00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:11,400 Speaker 1: Just finally, guys, there's a section in the report looking 634 00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:14,680 Speaker 1: at what can and should the government be doing to 635 00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:19,680 Speaker 1: promote these things productivity growth in the economy. So you know, 636 00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:24,320 Speaker 1: the industry wanted, according to the businesses surveyed, wanted some 637 00:31:25,320 --> 00:31:27,360 Speaker 1: tax incentives. They seem to have got that in the 638 00:31:27,360 --> 00:31:30,840 Speaker 1: budget and investment boost. The R and D tax and 639 00:31:30,880 --> 00:31:32,440 Speaker 1: center is there. It's good to see R and D. 640 00:31:32,760 --> 00:31:35,880 Speaker 1: Appetite to invest in R and D is up as well. 641 00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:40,280 Speaker 1: That's in the report, particularly among the bigger businesses. So 642 00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:42,840 Speaker 1: have we got the settings right? Has the government done enough? 643 00:31:42,880 --> 00:31:45,680 Speaker 1: Do you think the Prime Minister this week is in 644 00:31:45,760 --> 00:31:49,280 Speaker 1: China hustling going for growth as he has been in India. 645 00:31:49,720 --> 00:31:52,480 Speaker 1: The primary sect the milk prices are up again, so 646 00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:56,320 Speaker 1: they're going to expect bigger payouts in the next year. 647 00:31:56,840 --> 00:32:00,880 Speaker 1: Are we doing enough? Has the government done enough? The 648 00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:04,080 Speaker 1: government's doing something which is good. So again, if you're 649 00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:06,560 Speaker 1: a small to medium business, cash flow is just critical. 650 00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:11,000 Speaker 1: So you know, tax relief and tax benefits is certainly 651 00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:13,280 Speaker 1: something that we see as a common theme amongst small 652 00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:16,880 Speaker 1: to medium business. So the you know, the recent announcements 653 00:32:18,160 --> 00:32:20,400 Speaker 1: for that person that was potentially on the fence around 654 00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:22,840 Speaker 1: making an investment to putting some money back into the economy. 655 00:32:23,560 --> 00:32:26,360 Speaker 1: It's a good step in the right direction. I think again, 656 00:32:26,560 --> 00:32:28,880 Speaker 1: all businesses out there will at this point in time 657 00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:32,560 Speaker 1: say they need more. But that's always the conundrum. It's 658 00:32:32,560 --> 00:32:34,360 Speaker 1: a big one, six billion dollars. It's going to cost 659 00:32:34,440 --> 00:32:36,480 Speaker 1: investment boosts. Steve, what do you think it's going to 660 00:32:36,680 --> 00:32:38,800 Speaker 1: have a good return on investment? Yeah, I mean I 661 00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:40,280 Speaker 1: think it's it's a positive step. 662 00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:42,880 Speaker 4: I mean my view, and Mark's probably got much more 663 00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:45,760 Speaker 4: visibility to this than I have in a lot of ways. 664 00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:48,240 Speaker 4: But you know, I think that the ask of government 665 00:32:48,280 --> 00:32:50,680 Speaker 4: is to get the big settings right. And so if 666 00:32:50,720 --> 00:32:54,560 Speaker 4: you think about why electricity is spiky because it's been 667 00:32:54,600 --> 00:32:57,560 Speaker 4: difficult to invest in long term and so you know, 668 00:32:57,640 --> 00:32:59,800 Speaker 4: if you are switching on and off, whether you can 669 00:32:59,840 --> 00:33:00,880 Speaker 4: do gas exploration. 670 00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:02,640 Speaker 2: When investors are. 671 00:33:02,520 --> 00:33:05,040 Speaker 4: Looking around the world where they want to invest, the 672 00:33:05,080 --> 00:33:07,680 Speaker 4: fact that things can change on in a very short 673 00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:12,120 Speaker 4: cycle is difficult. And so I think cross party around 674 00:33:12,120 --> 00:33:15,400 Speaker 4: some of the larger infrastructure and creating an environment where 675 00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:19,840 Speaker 4: big investors with lots of capital and deep pockets see 676 00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:22,240 Speaker 4: New Zealand as a place that's stable to invest in 677 00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:25,080 Speaker 4: is the things that shift things. It's going to be 678 00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:29,240 Speaker 4: a huge demand for data centers in hyperscale capability. Have 679 00:33:29,320 --> 00:33:32,240 Speaker 4: we got the settings right for it making sure that 680 00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:34,240 Speaker 4: this is the number one place that they want to come. 681 00:33:34,600 --> 00:33:36,360 Speaker 4: Can we give them the access to the power and 682 00:33:36,440 --> 00:33:38,400 Speaker 4: water and things that they need? You know, those are 683 00:33:38,440 --> 00:33:41,760 Speaker 4: the things that they're enablers. Smaller medium businesses will get 684 00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:43,520 Speaker 4: on with doing their stuff every single day. I think 685 00:33:43,560 --> 00:33:45,440 Speaker 4: the business of government is to try and get those 686 00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:48,400 Speaker 4: big settings right. It's difficult when there's three year terms 687 00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:50,600 Speaker 4: and it's difficult when you can't agree on the big things. 688 00:33:50,640 --> 00:33:54,400 Speaker 4: And so hopefully we see parties start to look into 689 00:33:54,440 --> 00:33:56,960 Speaker 4: those big shifts that we need in health and infrastructure 690 00:33:57,000 --> 00:33:59,240 Speaker 4: and say we're going to take a longer term view 691 00:33:59,320 --> 00:34:01,960 Speaker 4: because actually everyone benefits and regardless of which side of 692 00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:04,120 Speaker 4: the earlier on, we're better off when we make those 693 00:34:04,120 --> 00:34:04,719 Speaker 4: big shifts. 694 00:34:04,840 --> 00:34:06,120 Speaker 3: And we've been doing a lot of work with the 695 00:34:06,240 --> 00:34:09,319 Speaker 3: Chamber of Commerce in Auckland obviously around how can we 696 00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:12,400 Speaker 3: make Auckland a tech hub all right? Now, again you 697 00:34:12,440 --> 00:34:15,360 Speaker 3: come back to fundamental settings you've got to have in 698 00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:17,719 Speaker 3: an environment. You've got to have connectivity. You've got to 699 00:34:17,760 --> 00:34:20,560 Speaker 3: have technology, it's got to be cost effective, so you 700 00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:24,160 Speaker 3: have to get the settings right to meet our ambition 701 00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:27,880 Speaker 3: to lift wages in this country, to get foreign investment 702 00:34:27,960 --> 00:34:30,720 Speaker 3: in So all of those factors need to be solved 703 00:34:30,719 --> 00:34:35,080 Speaker 3: with time. But again it's a it's a spans political systems, 704 00:34:35,120 --> 00:34:37,360 Speaker 3: it's a you know, it's a multi decade view that 705 00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:40,520 Speaker 3: I think we need to take as a country. But 706 00:34:40,600 --> 00:34:42,160 Speaker 3: if we get it right, you know, the opportunity is 707 00:34:42,160 --> 00:34:43,120 Speaker 3: areen us. 708 00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:52,160 Speaker 1: That's a wrap for this special episode of the Business 709 00:34:52,239 --> 00:34:55,319 Speaker 1: of Tech. A huge thank you to our panelists Mark 710 00:34:55,440 --> 00:34:58,920 Speaker 1: Calendar and Steve Yerkovic for their insights and their candor. 711 00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:03,000 Speaker 1: Twenty five Shaping Business Study paints a picture of the 712 00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:07,719 Speaker 1: business community that's optimistic, ambitious, and ready to innovate, but 713 00:35:07,760 --> 00:35:11,359 Speaker 1: also clear eyed about the challenges ahead. If you found 714 00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:15,040 Speaker 1: today's discussion valuable, register to download the twenty twenty five 715 00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:18,760 Speaker 1: Shaping Business Study using the link in the episode description. 716 00:35:19,120 --> 00:35:21,879 Speaker 1: Subscribe to the Business of Tech for more conversations at 717 00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:25,680 Speaker 1: the intersection of tech and business on iHeartRadio or your 718 00:35:25,680 --> 00:35:28,680 Speaker 1: favorite podcast app. Thanks to two Degrees for carrying on 719 00:35:28,719 --> 00:35:31,960 Speaker 1: this important longitudinal study and for their ongoing support of 720 00:35:32,040 --> 00:35:35,759 Speaker 1: the podcast over the last one hundred and four episodes, 721 00:35:36,040 --> 00:35:39,560 Speaker 1: and finally thanks to you for listening. Here's to a productive, 722 00:35:39,800 --> 00:35:44,240 Speaker 1: innovative and optimistic year ahead for New Zealand business. Kakataana