1 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:09,280 Speaker 1: Cyta. I'm Susie Nordquitzt and for Chelsea Daniels. And this 2 00:00:09,480 --> 00:00:12,799 Speaker 1: is the Front Page, a daily podcast presented by Benny 3 00:00:12,880 --> 00:00:19,480 Speaker 1: Zealand Herald. The pressure of the cost of living crunch 4 00:00:19,520 --> 00:00:21,800 Speaker 1: has been felt by most of us for a few 5 00:00:21,960 --> 00:00:25,239 Speaker 1: years now. Many of us hope that the more we earn, 6 00:00:25,280 --> 00:00:28,520 Speaker 1: the less we have to worry about bills, unexpected costs 7 00:00:28,840 --> 00:00:31,960 Speaker 1: and living week to week. This week, though, Wellington Mayor 8 00:00:32,040 --> 00:00:35,040 Speaker 1: Tory Farno revealed she's had to sell her car in 9 00:00:35,159 --> 00:00:39,560 Speaker 1: order to help pay her bills. So if Amia on 10 00:00:39,640 --> 00:00:42,360 Speaker 1: a salary of just under one hundred and ninety thousand 11 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:45,160 Speaker 1: dollars a year is finding it tough, can you really 12 00:00:45,240 --> 00:00:48,680 Speaker 1: earn enough to avoid financial pressure? Today on the Front Page, 13 00:00:48,720 --> 00:00:52,160 Speaker 1: we're joined by Katie Wesney, head strategic coach. It enable 14 00:00:52,280 --> 00:00:59,720 Speaker 1: me to discuss how to tackle the cost of living Katie. 15 00:00:59,760 --> 00:01:03,240 Speaker 1: When did a six figure income suddenly become not enough? 16 00:01:03,520 --> 00:01:07,760 Speaker 2: There is so much pressure at the moment economically for people. 17 00:01:07,920 --> 00:01:10,240 Speaker 2: Interest rates are higher than they have been for a 18 00:01:10,480 --> 00:01:15,280 Speaker 2: very long time, inflation, we have an incredible amount of 19 00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:19,480 Speaker 2: pressure from a cash flow perspective. If I'm really honest 20 00:01:19,480 --> 00:01:24,720 Speaker 2: with you, though, This is not a new problem and 21 00:01:24,800 --> 00:01:30,160 Speaker 2: I think that often in New Zealand, the thing we 22 00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:36,280 Speaker 2: think that will fix our personal financial situation is that 23 00:01:36,640 --> 00:01:40,960 Speaker 2: we need to earn more money. And in all reality, 24 00:01:41,080 --> 00:01:43,000 Speaker 2: the more that we earn, the more that we spend, 25 00:01:43,319 --> 00:01:47,960 Speaker 2: and the more we disconnect from our finances. And I 26 00:01:48,000 --> 00:01:52,400 Speaker 2: think the average household income of I think it's about 27 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:55,400 Speaker 2: one hundred and thirty thousand in New Zealand at the moment, 28 00:01:56,080 --> 00:01:59,760 Speaker 2: means that some households will really struggle in terms of 29 00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:03,720 Speaker 2: level of debt they have their lifestyle, and others will 30 00:02:03,720 --> 00:02:07,640 Speaker 2: be very comfortable being able to invest, et cetera. So 31 00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:12,240 Speaker 2: it's horses for courses in terms of personal situation. 32 00:02:12,840 --> 00:02:15,800 Speaker 1: Speaking to the lifestyle creep, is there an element of 33 00:02:15,800 --> 00:02:18,320 Speaker 1: people falling into a trap of feeling like they have 34 00:02:18,440 --> 00:02:21,080 Speaker 1: to keep up with the jones is? And if so, 35 00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:22,200 Speaker 1: what would you say to them? 36 00:02:22,400 --> 00:02:24,600 Speaker 2: To be honest, that's the basis of capitalism. Again, the 37 00:02:24,639 --> 00:02:26,880 Speaker 2: more that you earn, the more that you spend. And 38 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:30,000 Speaker 2: it is not what you earn get through your head, 39 00:02:30,040 --> 00:02:33,080 Speaker 2: it's what's left over. And there is a balance to 40 00:02:33,120 --> 00:02:36,600 Speaker 2: be had of living a great life, but you have 41 00:02:36,680 --> 00:02:40,480 Speaker 2: to balance that with making progress otherwise, often you feel 42 00:02:40,520 --> 00:02:45,639 Speaker 2: like you are just maintaining a system, and that is exhausting. 43 00:02:46,080 --> 00:02:50,200 Speaker 2: And I see lots of examples every day in terms 44 00:02:50,240 --> 00:02:54,239 Speaker 2: of the clients that I see who are very clever, 45 00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:59,799 Speaker 2: They are earning much more than average, but that is 46 00:03:00,160 --> 00:03:04,520 Speaker 2: not translating to the financial press that they know that 47 00:03:04,560 --> 00:03:09,200 Speaker 2: they deserve, and there's often a sense of almost shame 48 00:03:09,960 --> 00:03:13,400 Speaker 2: around that. And I actually think it's really brave to 49 00:03:13,520 --> 00:03:17,200 Speaker 2: acknowledge that you have an issue, and it's about calling 50 00:03:17,280 --> 00:03:19,920 Speaker 2: out what do I do about said issue? 51 00:03:20,040 --> 00:03:22,919 Speaker 1: Could you single out a particular worst case kind of 52 00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:24,639 Speaker 1: scenario that you're seeing at the moment. 53 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:27,640 Speaker 2: There's lots of studies and it all gives you the 54 00:03:27,680 --> 00:03:31,880 Speaker 2: same kind of metrics and information. I was reading the 55 00:03:31,919 --> 00:03:34,960 Speaker 2: other day that fifty six percent of kiwis worry about 56 00:03:35,000 --> 00:03:39,400 Speaker 2: money daily or weekly. So I think my key messages 57 00:03:39,480 --> 00:03:42,840 Speaker 2: if you are worried, you are certainly not alone. But 58 00:03:43,000 --> 00:03:46,240 Speaker 2: worrying doesn't solve anything. It's well, what are the actions 59 00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:50,040 Speaker 2: or strategies that can put in place to be better 60 00:03:50,280 --> 00:03:53,400 Speaker 2: and do better. I think that stats from the Financial 61 00:03:53,440 --> 00:03:59,920 Speaker 2: Services Council financial Resilience indexed in April, and fascinatingly, I 62 00:04:00,200 --> 00:04:02,880 Speaker 2: think This is shocking. Forty two percent of US have 63 00:04:03,040 --> 00:04:06,280 Speaker 2: credit card did and thirty one percent of us have 64 00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:08,360 Speaker 2: buy now Pay later did it? 65 00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:15,040 Speaker 3: So seventy percent of New Zealanders are worrying about money daily, weekly, 66 00:04:15,120 --> 00:04:17,760 Speaker 3: or monthly. That's pretty alarming. You know how many people 67 00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:19,680 Speaker 3: are going to bed at night going can I pay 68 00:04:19,720 --> 00:04:22,640 Speaker 3: my credit card bill? Can I make my mortgage repayment? 69 00:04:22,839 --> 00:04:24,560 Speaker 3: Do I need to make trade offs? Are there any 70 00:04:24,640 --> 00:04:27,040 Speaker 3: things that I need to do? What are people most 71 00:04:27,080 --> 00:04:32,080 Speaker 3: concerned about? Inflation is nuts? Eighty nine percent are really 72 00:04:32,120 --> 00:04:35,680 Speaker 3: concerned about inflation in twenty twenty four, interest rates not 73 00:04:35,760 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 3: far behind about seventy five percent, and house prices. You 74 00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:43,920 Speaker 3: can start to see that cooling. 75 00:04:45,760 --> 00:04:49,560 Speaker 2: I can give you a client example. Lovely clients that 76 00:04:49,640 --> 00:04:54,000 Speaker 2: I saw this week. They have a household income double 77 00:04:54,080 --> 00:04:58,599 Speaker 2: that or more than double that average household income. So 78 00:04:58,720 --> 00:05:02,480 Speaker 2: their income household was three hundred and fifty k, so 79 00:05:02,720 --> 00:05:07,560 Speaker 2: working incredibly long hours, very clever people. But in the 80 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:11,000 Speaker 2: same breath, they have one home with a one point 81 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:15,680 Speaker 2: one million mortgage and at seven percent interest, that means 82 00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:20,160 Speaker 2: eighty eight thousand is just gone per year on one 83 00:05:20,279 --> 00:05:25,160 Speaker 2: line item. In terms of that accommodation piece, and when 84 00:05:25,200 --> 00:05:28,479 Speaker 2: they came to see me, we really feel like we 85 00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:32,640 Speaker 2: shouldn't be in the situation that we are, Katie. We 86 00:05:32,680 --> 00:05:37,600 Speaker 2: are honestly living paycheck to paycheck. We just don't know 87 00:05:37,920 --> 00:05:41,440 Speaker 2: where we're going wrong, and really hard to say that, 88 00:05:41,600 --> 00:05:45,240 Speaker 2: really brave to come along. They have to have a plan, 89 00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:48,240 Speaker 2: and they have to have a better structure and a 90 00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:52,560 Speaker 2: system in place from a cash flow perspective that sets 91 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:55,400 Speaker 2: them up for success in the future, so they're not 92 00:05:55,560 --> 00:06:00,239 Speaker 2: reliant on the uncontrollable often of having to earn more 93 00:06:00,360 --> 00:06:03,960 Speaker 2: or pedal faster, because often you feel like you're just 94 00:06:03,960 --> 00:06:06,920 Speaker 2: a hamster in a well. You know you're peddling really fast, 95 00:06:06,920 --> 00:06:09,159 Speaker 2: but the system has got so big that you're just 96 00:06:09,279 --> 00:06:10,279 Speaker 2: not getting ahead. 97 00:06:10,680 --> 00:06:12,359 Speaker 1: Is that what a lot of people are feeling like 98 00:06:12,480 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 1: at the moment, that they are hamsters on a wheel? 99 00:06:15,040 --> 00:06:18,599 Speaker 2: Unequivocally but really interesting because I get I think you 100 00:06:18,680 --> 00:06:22,760 Speaker 2: get to a spot that there's always been enough money 101 00:06:22,800 --> 00:06:26,240 Speaker 2: coming in that you haven't really had to think terribly 102 00:06:26,320 --> 00:06:31,040 Speaker 2: hard around what you do, and with all due respect, 103 00:06:31,120 --> 00:06:36,000 Speaker 2: most people get comfortably inefficient in that they aren't doing 104 00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:39,159 Speaker 2: what needs to be done. Things are a little bit loose, 105 00:06:39,640 --> 00:06:42,960 Speaker 2: so they end up paying more interest back to the bank, 106 00:06:43,080 --> 00:06:46,400 Speaker 2: and we have really profitable banks in New Zealand in 107 00:06:46,480 --> 00:06:50,440 Speaker 2: terms of interest rates and fees. And you get what 108 00:06:50,480 --> 00:06:55,200 Speaker 2: you focus on. And if you are focused on doing better, 109 00:06:55,720 --> 00:06:59,279 Speaker 2: there are rules around all of this. You understand them, 110 00:06:59,360 --> 00:07:01,640 Speaker 2: you execute on them, and then you do better. 111 00:07:02,360 --> 00:07:05,480 Speaker 1: Okay, where were those high income earners you spoke about 112 00:07:05,480 --> 00:07:07,040 Speaker 1: going wrong with their finances? 113 00:07:07,520 --> 00:07:10,640 Speaker 2: They're just spending everything they earn. It's that lifestyle creep 114 00:07:10,880 --> 00:07:16,120 Speaker 2: that they've bought a house that felt doable from a 115 00:07:16,160 --> 00:07:19,560 Speaker 2: mortgage perspective when rates were two three percent less so 116 00:07:19,640 --> 00:07:24,040 Speaker 2: at seven so they've over extended themselves. They are buying 117 00:07:24,640 --> 00:07:29,200 Speaker 2: more expensive cars than they should, and I think there 118 00:07:29,280 --> 00:07:32,400 Speaker 2: is grace in reading that some people are getting to 119 00:07:32,440 --> 00:07:35,280 Speaker 2: the point where they're like, Oh, do I really need 120 00:07:35,600 --> 00:07:40,520 Speaker 2: that car? Can I sell that car and alleviate a 121 00:07:40,520 --> 00:07:43,000 Speaker 2: bit of pressure build in a little bit of a 122 00:07:43,040 --> 00:07:47,600 Speaker 2: buffer in my situation, because that is absolutely critical, getting 123 00:07:47,640 --> 00:07:52,640 Speaker 2: that really strong foundation in terms of being able to 124 00:07:52,680 --> 00:07:55,760 Speaker 2: call upon reserves if something goes wrong, because things will 125 00:07:55,800 --> 00:07:58,280 Speaker 2: always go wrong, and I think we're naive to think 126 00:07:58,360 --> 00:08:02,400 Speaker 2: that it wouldn't. There's a really interesting stat that I read, 127 00:08:02,520 --> 00:08:05,560 Speaker 2: what is it over two million New Zealanders and not 128 00:08:05,680 --> 00:08:08,920 Speaker 2: prepared for loss of income of the main income earner, 129 00:08:09,480 --> 00:08:13,800 Speaker 2: which actually scares me, that stat And that's the first 130 00:08:13,880 --> 00:08:17,160 Speaker 2: piece we put in place for our clients is to 131 00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:20,160 Speaker 2: make sure they have that really strong foundation in terms 132 00:08:20,240 --> 00:08:22,360 Speaker 2: of resilience. So they have a buffet that they can 133 00:08:22,440 --> 00:08:24,600 Speaker 2: draw upon. Do you know what that might not even 134 00:08:24,640 --> 00:08:28,120 Speaker 2: necessarily be savings. If they have a mortgage, that might 135 00:08:28,160 --> 00:08:31,160 Speaker 2: be a line of credit available to them, so if 136 00:08:31,200 --> 00:08:35,440 Speaker 2: anything goes wrong, they can hold their line and their 137 00:08:35,440 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 2: hand is never forced. And I think that's really important 138 00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:42,880 Speaker 2: in terms of that foundation piece of that strong plan 139 00:08:43,200 --> 00:08:44,080 Speaker 2: into the future. 140 00:08:55,000 --> 00:08:59,080 Speaker 1: You spoke before about people having flashy cars than they need. 141 00:08:59,320 --> 00:09:01,480 Speaker 1: I'm not saying too had to flash a car then 142 00:09:01,520 --> 00:09:03,640 Speaker 1: she needed. But are you surprised to hear that she 143 00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:07,040 Speaker 1: had to sell her car despite her high salary and 144 00:09:07,120 --> 00:09:09,000 Speaker 1: having one lotto two decades ago. 145 00:09:09,400 --> 00:09:12,800 Speaker 2: No, I'm not surprised at all, to be honest, And 146 00:09:13,280 --> 00:09:16,480 Speaker 2: I say, good honor for acknowledging that, you know, if 147 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:19,880 Speaker 2: you find yourself maybe in a little hole, and obviously 148 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:23,000 Speaker 2: we don't know the backstory, well good on her for 149 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:25,920 Speaker 2: looking at her position and saying, well, how do I 150 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:29,480 Speaker 2: free up cash flow, How can I be more purposeful? 151 00:09:29,679 --> 00:09:32,480 Speaker 2: In my mind, cars a depreciable asset. They get you 152 00:09:32,520 --> 00:09:35,000 Speaker 2: from A to B. But for some people they're important. 153 00:09:35,280 --> 00:09:39,120 Speaker 2: But you live below your means and that's a non negotiable, 154 00:09:39,320 --> 00:09:41,959 Speaker 2: and sometimes you can get a little carried away. Things 155 00:09:42,000 --> 00:09:45,640 Speaker 2: can change and you focus on the controllables. And if 156 00:09:45,640 --> 00:09:47,760 Speaker 2: you are looking at getting a little bit leaner, well 157 00:09:47,960 --> 00:09:50,439 Speaker 2: good on them for looking at that and doing that. 158 00:09:50,920 --> 00:09:54,560 Speaker 1: What are people increasingly going without? That might surprise some. 159 00:09:55,040 --> 00:10:01,560 Speaker 2: It worries me often that the first thing people sometimes 160 00:10:01,679 --> 00:10:09,000 Speaker 2: go and cut is that insurance protection, which does worry 161 00:10:09,080 --> 00:10:13,000 Speaker 2: me because again futures promised to no one and it 162 00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:18,160 Speaker 2: can just leave you really exposed. In my experience, from 163 00:10:18,200 --> 00:10:26,000 Speaker 2: an inefficiency perspective, often you can find money elsewhere, more accessible, 164 00:10:26,240 --> 00:10:30,120 Speaker 2: with less risk to cut back on, to make a 165 00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:34,280 Speaker 2: real difference. Again, coming back to what we know to 166 00:10:34,320 --> 00:10:37,520 Speaker 2: be true in New Zealand, we frit are about fifteen 167 00:10:37,679 --> 00:10:41,600 Speaker 2: percent of our net income, a little bit of overspending, 168 00:10:41,720 --> 00:10:44,079 Speaker 2: a lot of pain, too much interest to the bank. 169 00:10:44,280 --> 00:10:47,840 Speaker 2: So that fretter piece or inefficiency is where I look 170 00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:53,160 Speaker 2: at first for my clients versus exposing them to more risk. 171 00:10:53,440 --> 00:10:56,200 Speaker 2: Than they really need to if they lost their job, 172 00:10:56,320 --> 00:11:00,680 Speaker 2: for example, if something happened in terms of natural weather events. 173 00:11:00,679 --> 00:11:02,800 Speaker 2: I mean it's a very rocky road in New Zealand 174 00:11:03,280 --> 00:11:07,800 Speaker 2: just in terms of risk. So again I would be 175 00:11:07,880 --> 00:11:12,680 Speaker 2: looking and suggesting that people look first at that almost 176 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:16,400 Speaker 2: lazy money that can so easily slip through the cracks, 177 00:11:16,840 --> 00:11:20,400 Speaker 2: spending too much on food, often a little bit of 178 00:11:20,679 --> 00:11:26,880 Speaker 2: entertainment piece looking at subscriptions, etc. Ay of itself seems minuscule, 179 00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:30,480 Speaker 2: but it all adds up and you think fifty you 180 00:11:30,520 --> 00:11:34,400 Speaker 2: do the math. Fifteen percent of your net income generally 181 00:11:35,160 --> 00:11:39,640 Speaker 2: is not used to give any more benefit in terms 182 00:11:39,679 --> 00:11:43,320 Speaker 2: of enjoying life. If you find that and put that 183 00:11:43,360 --> 00:11:47,440 Speaker 2: to better use, your whole financial trajectory shifts in effect. 184 00:11:48,040 --> 00:11:50,560 Speaker 2: And I think often the focus has been on that 185 00:11:50,760 --> 00:11:55,520 Speaker 2: income side, but actually living a purposeful life certainly not 186 00:11:55,800 --> 00:11:58,679 Speaker 2: living a miserable life. There's always a balance to be had, 187 00:11:59,040 --> 00:12:05,000 Speaker 2: but again finding those in efficiencies around mortgage, around cost 188 00:12:05,080 --> 00:12:09,520 Speaker 2: load that can make a huge difference in terms of 189 00:12:09,720 --> 00:12:13,080 Speaker 2: financial momentum and where you land longer term from a 190 00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:14,760 Speaker 2: wealth creation perspective. 191 00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:19,840 Speaker 4: That there have been periods when I considered dropping health 192 00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:22,600 Speaker 4: insurance because I seem to be living a pretty healthy 193 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:25,040 Speaker 4: life and not really needing to make any claim. But 194 00:12:25,280 --> 00:12:29,040 Speaker 4: this is the interesting thing. As my health insurance got 195 00:12:29,080 --> 00:12:33,560 Speaker 4: more expensive as I got older, the value of great 196 00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:36,959 Speaker 4: health outcomes from the treatments that I or my partner 197 00:12:37,120 --> 00:12:42,320 Speaker 4: had outweighed the additional cost. It's a funny ottle game 198 00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:45,079 Speaker 4: health insurance. But I'm so glad that we kept at it. 199 00:12:47,679 --> 00:12:50,760 Speaker 1: Do you think budgeting being taught in schools could help 200 00:12:50,880 --> 00:12:53,360 Speaker 1: address some of these issues that you're seeing? 201 00:12:53,559 --> 00:12:58,520 Speaker 2: Unequivocally, unequivocally, it's a really good start. I think though 202 00:12:59,080 --> 00:13:02,680 Speaker 2: we have a response ability. I have three children as 203 00:13:02,880 --> 00:13:09,760 Speaker 2: parents to role model that behavioral element ourselves. It's a 204 00:13:09,800 --> 00:13:13,160 Speaker 2: really important pillar for all of my clients who have children, 205 00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:17,920 Speaker 2: that we are creating financially independent children and how you 206 00:13:17,960 --> 00:13:20,440 Speaker 2: do that while you sort yourself out and they do 207 00:13:20,520 --> 00:13:25,320 Speaker 2: what you do in effect from a behavioral perspective, and 208 00:13:25,360 --> 00:13:28,720 Speaker 2: that budgeting piece, I call it a spending plan, but 209 00:13:29,480 --> 00:13:32,600 Speaker 2: that cash flow and getting that right that is the 210 00:13:32,640 --> 00:13:37,160 Speaker 2: engine room of what comes next. And that budgeting piece. 211 00:13:37,240 --> 00:13:39,920 Speaker 2: It's a really good first step. But you've got to 212 00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:44,040 Speaker 2: also layer that with a strategy. Knowing that people can't 213 00:13:44,080 --> 00:13:47,520 Speaker 2: save themselves to wealth. It's what they do with what's 214 00:13:47,600 --> 00:13:50,560 Speaker 2: left over. But you've got to have something left over 215 00:13:50,679 --> 00:13:51,400 Speaker 2: to start with. 216 00:13:51,840 --> 00:13:55,040 Speaker 1: Certainly, is it a case of if your parents were 217 00:13:55,080 --> 00:13:57,439 Speaker 1: bad with money, you were likely to be bad at 218 00:13:57,440 --> 00:13:58,800 Speaker 1: handling money yourself. 219 00:13:59,160 --> 00:14:04,040 Speaker 2: It's definitely aallenge because generally speaking, we start learning about 220 00:14:04,120 --> 00:14:09,560 Speaker 2: money from the age of three and you replicate the 221 00:14:09,559 --> 00:14:13,040 Speaker 2: behaviors that you see. But all is not lost though, 222 00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:16,200 Speaker 2: and what I know to be true from all of 223 00:14:16,240 --> 00:14:19,200 Speaker 2: my clients who I see again, what they've done in 224 00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:21,520 Speaker 2: the past is no indication of what they can do 225 00:14:21,600 --> 00:14:25,320 Speaker 2: in the future. But again it's making sure that they 226 00:14:25,440 --> 00:14:29,240 Speaker 2: have a better structure and that really strong foundation. I 227 00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:32,080 Speaker 2: don't use credit cards. Make sure they have a really 228 00:14:32,160 --> 00:14:35,080 Speaker 2: good goal, make sure they're being efficient, so they have 229 00:14:35,160 --> 00:14:39,040 Speaker 2: a really good bank account structure, and they've got goals 230 00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:43,160 Speaker 2: to clear a mortgage, to look at where they need 231 00:14:43,200 --> 00:14:46,480 Speaker 2: to be in retirement, and that we're tracking to be 232 00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:51,040 Speaker 2: where we need to. That really makes a difference. And again, 233 00:14:51,360 --> 00:14:54,400 Speaker 2: if our children are watching us on that journey, they're 234 00:14:54,440 --> 00:14:57,000 Speaker 2: going to be better off. And I know for my 235 00:14:57,160 --> 00:15:01,360 Speaker 2: kiddies again twelve fourteen and sixt it's going to be 236 00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:04,520 Speaker 2: harder for them. They have to hit the ground running, 237 00:15:04,760 --> 00:15:07,880 Speaker 2: and we have a duty of care to make sure 238 00:15:08,040 --> 00:15:11,280 Speaker 2: that they know what needs to be done and if 239 00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:15,040 Speaker 2: they're doing that by watching us as well. But yeah, great, 240 00:15:15,200 --> 00:15:16,920 Speaker 2: great start in schools, certainly. 241 00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:20,240 Speaker 1: And just finally you spoke to the amount of credit 242 00:15:20,280 --> 00:15:23,040 Speaker 1: card debt that we have. Should we be cutting our 243 00:15:23,040 --> 00:15:24,720 Speaker 1: credit cards up and throwing them away? 244 00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:30,000 Speaker 2: Yes? Please, yes, please? And I can get then arguments 245 00:15:30,160 --> 00:15:35,080 Speaker 2: around this point. But we know from a behavioral economics perspective, 246 00:15:35,200 --> 00:15:38,800 Speaker 2: people spend about fifteen percent more than they would otherwise 247 00:15:38,920 --> 00:15:42,200 Speaker 2: by using credit cards, just because it's a less transparent 248 00:15:42,280 --> 00:15:45,000 Speaker 2: form of payment. You know, you can have I paid 249 00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:47,800 Speaker 2: who knows who cares? You never quite know where you're at. 250 00:15:48,040 --> 00:15:51,160 Speaker 2: You always do better when you work in the constraints 251 00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:51,760 Speaker 2: of what you have. 252 00:15:52,280 --> 00:15:55,600 Speaker 1: Certainly, that's a really interesting stat Is there anything else 253 00:15:55,720 --> 00:15:57,480 Speaker 1: you'd like to add before we wrap up? 254 00:15:57,640 --> 00:16:03,760 Speaker 2: I would really encourage people if they are struggling, and 255 00:16:04,600 --> 00:16:06,680 Speaker 2: it's just not an adding up. You know, you feel 256 00:16:06,680 --> 00:16:09,840 Speaker 2: like you know you're a good salary. You are certainly 257 00:16:09,920 --> 00:16:14,000 Speaker 2: not alone, but understand where you're at, even if it's 258 00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:16,680 Speaker 2: going through your bank statements for the last you know, 259 00:16:16,720 --> 00:16:19,280 Speaker 2: a few months, cash in, cash out, what's left over. 260 00:16:19,680 --> 00:16:22,760 Speaker 2: If you're going backwards or holding your ground, I think 261 00:16:22,760 --> 00:16:26,080 Speaker 2: that's unacceptable. You need to be looking at leavers to 262 00:16:26,160 --> 00:16:29,600 Speaker 2: do better. And if it's all too hard, please reach 263 00:16:29,640 --> 00:16:33,720 Speaker 2: out for support, speak to a qualified financial advisor. They're 264 00:16:33,760 --> 00:16:37,960 Speaker 2: there to help. And it's a crying shame. I personally 265 00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:41,320 Speaker 2: think that only twenty percent of New Zealanders take professional 266 00:16:41,440 --> 00:16:45,040 Speaker 2: financial advice because when they do, that is stronger and again, 267 00:16:45,240 --> 00:16:49,800 Speaker 2: they understand the rules and they make sure how hard 268 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:53,280 Speaker 2: they work, they make the financial progress they deserve. And 269 00:16:53,280 --> 00:16:55,240 Speaker 2: that's what we lean into going forward. 270 00:16:55,840 --> 00:17:04,320 Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us, Katie. That's it for this episode 271 00:17:04,320 --> 00:17:06,919 Speaker 1: of the Front Page. You can read more about today's 272 00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:11,440 Speaker 1: stories and extensive news coverage at zherld dot co dot enzet. 273 00:17:11,920 --> 00:17:15,240 Speaker 1: The Front Page is produced by Ethan Sills. Patty Fox 274 00:17:15,359 --> 00:17:18,879 Speaker 1: is a sound engineer. I'm Susie Nordquist. Subscribe to the 275 00:17:18,920 --> 00:17:22,280 Speaker 1: Front Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts, 276 00:17:22,600 --> 00:17:25,800 Speaker 1: and tune in on Monday for another look behind the headlines.