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Speaker 1: Ever, du So Treasury has confirmed concerns were raised about

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Speaker 1: former Reserve Bank Governor Adrian Or in his conduct. Last

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Speaker 1: night we talked to the Bank's chair Neil Quiggley about

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Speaker 1: a claim that Adrian Or had sworn in a meeting

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Speaker 1: with Treasury staff and also had sworn in a meeting

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Speaker 1: with Nikola Willis, the Finance Minister. Now, Neil Quiggley wasn't

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Speaker 1: going to tell us a lot about that. Did he

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Speaker 1: swear in a meeting with Treasury on the twenty first effair?

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Speaker 1: I can't comment on that. Why can't you comment on that? Well,

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Speaker 1: because that's a matter of privacy that I don't that.

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Speaker 1: I don't think I should discuss. Pretty same say about

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Speaker 1: the meeting with Nikola? Did he swear in a meeting

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Speaker 1: with the Finance Minister three days later?

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Speaker 2: Well, I've heard that that's been said, but I.

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Speaker 1: Can't comment on that. Weren't you at that meeting?

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Speaker 2: I was at that meeting?

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Speaker 1: Yes, so did he swear? And he can't say anything

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Speaker 1: about the letter that he apparently sent Adrian Did you

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Speaker 1: send him an email saying to him, Hey, here's a

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Speaker 1: whole bunch of specific and concrete alligations against you. About

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Speaker 1: your behavior. Well, see, I can't go into that head.

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Speaker 1: Jeanne Tibtrainy is The Herald's Wellington business editor with us. Hello, Janney, Hey,

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Speaker 1: did he what happened? Tell me, Jane, I'm dying to know.

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Speaker 2: Well, I'm dying to know as well. Today the Treasury

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Speaker 2: was very helpful and it confirmed that Neil Quiggly emailed

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Speaker 2: a Treasury staffer about All's behavior after a meeting that

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Speaker 2: they had on February twenty. So we don't know what

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Speaker 2: exactly about the behavior was raised, but it was obviously

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Speaker 2: bad enough that the Chairman of the Reserve Bank thought

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Speaker 2: that he would email the Treasury staffer. So that is

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Speaker 2: the one bit of fact we know. The interesting thing

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Speaker 2: here is that the Reserve Bank is being very tight

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Speaker 2: lipped about what happened around Adrian Or's resignation. It says

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Speaker 2: it's because it's bound by legalities. You know, it obviously

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Speaker 2: entered into an agreement with Adrian Or when he left.

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Speaker 2: There would have been confidence reality clauses. The Reserve Bank

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Speaker 2: is standing behind those clauses and that's limiting what it

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Speaker 2: can say. The unusual thing, though, is that the Treasury

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Speaker 2: appears willing to potentially release this email to me. So

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Speaker 2: it is unusual that this email can't be released, the

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Speaker 2: one that Neil quickly sent the Treasury staff. It is

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Speaker 2: unusual that that can't be released by the Reserve Bank,

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Speaker 2: but it maybe can be released by the Treasury.

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Speaker 1: But it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out

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Speaker 1: it's because the Reserve Bank is the one bound by

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Speaker 1: the gag order with adrian Or but not Treasury. Right.

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Speaker 2: Yes. So now this is where it gets into some

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Speaker 2: sort of technical thing because the official you know, the

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Speaker 2: official information that captures all of government. So it is

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Speaker 2: you know, I think this is something for the lawyers

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Speaker 2: to figure out. How is it that one agency can

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Speaker 2: say no and the other one might be able to

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Speaker 2: say yes. And so the Reserve Bank has said to me, well,

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Speaker 2: that's legal obligations and different to that of the Treasury.

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Speaker 2: But you know, if the Treasury can in fact release

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Speaker 2: this email, then I have to ask, well, what else

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Speaker 2: can it actually release because myself and a whole bunch

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Speaker 2: of other people made requests of the Reserve Bank and

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Speaker 2: the Treasury around Adrianaal's departure and we were largely stonewalled.

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Speaker 2: So if they released this email, then what else can

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Speaker 2: they release?

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Speaker 1: Well, what else did they not release that they should

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Speaker 1: have released?

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Speaker 2: Well, yes, exactly. This is the thing that we don't know.

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Speaker 1: You know what silly buggers gets you called out in

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Speaker 1: the end day like don't play silly buggers, don't don't

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Speaker 1: This is because this is clearly what's gone on here.

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Speaker 1: Tell me something. Do you think that a gag order

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Speaker 1: that ties the hands of Adrian or and the Reserve

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Speaker 1: Bank also ties the Finance Minister.

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Speaker 2: Well, well, this is a good question because at to

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Speaker 2: date they all seem to be acting in unison. So

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Speaker 2: for example, the day that Adrian all resigned and the

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Speaker 2: following days, my colleagues and I we sent requests under

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Speaker 2: the Official Information Act. I asked specifically Treasury, Reserve Bank,

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Speaker 2: and the Finance Minister's Office the same questions, you know,

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Speaker 2: release information about the circumstances around the resignation. The Reserve

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Speaker 2: Bank came back with a statement summarizing what happened in

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Speaker 2: its view and limited set of documents. The Finance Minister's

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Speaker 2: office also came back with some stuff. For example, that

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Speaker 2: came back with the document that showed that she was

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Speaker 2: briefed on answering questions about if adrian Or yelled at

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Speaker 2: her in a meeting. But largely it seems like that

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Speaker 2: the requests have been dealt with together. So this is

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Speaker 2: the interesting thing, you know, should they have been dealt

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Speaker 2: with separately? So I've actually just I've just made a

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Speaker 2: complaint to the Onbodsman's office. I think this is the

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Speaker 2: on Bodsman is going to.

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Speaker 1: Need to John Allen.

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Speaker 2: It's a new person. I don't know John.

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Speaker 1: I think it might be John Allen. And if it's

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Speaker 1: John Allen, then he doesn't play silly buggers. He should

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Speaker 1: be okay with it. Listen, Janet, answer me this question, though,

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Speaker 1: Should they not have answered given us everything that they

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Speaker 1: possibly could and been as straight up as they possibly

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Speaker 1: could at the start, because then we wouldn't be like,

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Speaker 1: how far are we? This is like four and a

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Speaker 1: half months later and we're still talking about him. Had

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Speaker 1: they not just offloaded everything at the very start, this

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Speaker 1: would be a lot better for them, wouldn't it.

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Speaker 2: Oh for sure? And you know, it arguably would have

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Speaker 2: been better for adrian Or as well. And even if

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Speaker 2: the information wasn't great at the time that made them

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Speaker 2: all look bad in one way or another, it's surely

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Speaker 2: that is better. And you know, the more this goes on,

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Speaker 2: the more we get skeptical and we feel like it's

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Speaker 2: hard to trust what they say, which just isn't good

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Speaker 2: for anyone. You know, I don't want to. I don't

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Speaker 2: want to be that sort of obsessive person who questions,

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Speaker 2: well I am. I know that's driving me.

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Speaker 1: You had I appreciate it. I'm in therewith you two.

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