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Speaker 1: Not sure how many times we have to tell the

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Speaker 1: government either this one or the last, but the carbon

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Speaker 1: auctions aren't working. Latest was held yesterday. There was zero bids.

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Speaker 1: In fact, no one even registered. Secondary market currently is

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Speaker 1: it's around fifty eight dollars. Well, the auction price sits

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Speaker 1: at sixty eight, So would you rather pay fifty eight

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Speaker 1: dollars or sixty eight dollars? Anyway? This is their eighth

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Speaker 1: auction to be declined now. Simon Caught is the ACT

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Speaker 1: Party spokesperson non climate change and he's with us Simon morning,

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Speaker 1: Good morning, mate. We wanted Simon Watts on the program,

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Speaker 1: not that we don't love you, but Watts didn't come

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Speaker 1: back to us, do you, Reckon? That's because he's really

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Speaker 1: embarrassed at the moment.

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Speaker 2: I think Simon Wats has got a lot on us plate.

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Speaker 2: Each year's auction has only been one thing.

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Speaker 1: Right, are you in coalition with them or something?

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Speaker 2: Well, the climate spokestres for ACT and of course actors

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Speaker 2: and coalition with national and government. But just coming back

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Speaker 2: to the emissions trading scheme, mate, I mean, I think

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Speaker 2: what we're seeing is that industrial emitters like coal users,

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Speaker 2: for example, have already got enough units in their carbon

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Speaker 2: bank to pay for this year's emissions, and the secondary market,

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Speaker 2: as you pointed out, is working quite well. So if anything,

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Speaker 2: what that would say is that the ets, the carbon

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Speaker 2: market's actually working quite well. Exactly whether or not the

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Speaker 2: government wants to option these kind of credits and do.

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Speaker 1: The government set aside money in their books in some way,

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Speaker 1: shape or form from the collection of funds from the

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Speaker 1: auction that they hold or not, Because there's a couple

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Speaker 1: of billion dollars a year up for grabs if people

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Speaker 1: went and bought them.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think last year it was about five to

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Speaker 2: six hundred million, and while it's not shown on this

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Speaker 2: year's budget, there would be an anticipation of some revenues

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Speaker 2: coming this.

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Speaker 1: Way, which they are.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. So I mean that obviously puts pressure on the

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Speaker 2: government to do the things that it said it would do,

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Speaker 2: which is to find ways to cut spending, because if

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Speaker 2: we don't have the money coming in, then we've got

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Speaker 2: to find other ways to deliver services within the.

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Speaker 1: Budget that we're making far too much. Sensire Simon, do

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Speaker 1: you and I know you're in coalition with them, but

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Speaker 1: does anybody sit around a cabinet table or a committee

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Speaker 1: table and go you realize none of these auctions work

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Speaker 1: and the secondary market actually works fine, and we might

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Speaker 1: like to have a look at that and stop banking

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Speaker 1: money that we're never going to get or words to

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Speaker 1: that effect.

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Speaker 2: Well, I don't know about the cabinet table, but certainly

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Speaker 2: around the water cooler. And when you think about the

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Speaker 2: impact of what the emissions trading scheme actually does at

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Speaker 2: the current price at fifty seven to sixty dollars a ton,

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Speaker 2: what it means is that for every ton of carbon

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Speaker 2: that someone like Genesis emits when they're burning coal huntly

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Speaker 2: this winter, they're going to pay about sixty bucks if

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Speaker 2: they burn a million tons at sixty million dollars, that

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Speaker 2: goes on Kiwi power bills. And that's why one of

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Speaker 2: the things this goverment is focusing on is making more

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Speaker 2: gas available. Because gas only has half the carbon weight

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Speaker 2: and well therefore only attract half the price. We've just

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Speaker 2: got to find more gas so that we can move

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Speaker 2: away from these high carbon fuels.

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Speaker 1: Well said Simon, appreciated time. Simon, who's the X spokesperson,

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Speaker 1: that raised a number of triggering points for me, one

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Speaker 1: of which was the gas band for more from the

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