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Speaker 1: Got a small peak into the future. We're a step

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Speaker 1: closer to creating fusion energy that's the power source that

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Speaker 1: fuels the sun, and billions are being pumped into projects

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Speaker 1: all over the world to recreate this. Open Star Technologies

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Speaker 1: has hit a milestone. Their machines turned on and created

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Speaker 1: first Plasma.

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Speaker 2: Now.

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Speaker 1: The CEO and founder Ruttu Matata is with us on

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Speaker 1: this right too. Morning to you modding Mike, Where are

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Speaker 1: we in the grand scheme of things? I mean, you know,

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Speaker 1: for people who that's most of us, don't know what

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Speaker 1: we're talking about here. When you start, where you're at,

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Speaker 1: how far down the track are we?

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Speaker 2: So we've picked up this weird concept called levitated dipole.

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Speaker 2: No one's building these things and so that means that

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Speaker 2: where we start is pretty far behind compared to a

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Speaker 2: lot of other projects that have had those billions of

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Speaker 2: dollars that you talk about spend on them. But by

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Speaker 2: getting first Plasma now we're getting this concept back in

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Speaker 2: the race, and we think it can make a difference

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Speaker 2: much faster than the other approaches.

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Speaker 1: What's your big picture, what's your journey? What are you

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Speaker 1: looking to achieve?

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Speaker 2: Well, we think this is a way of creating clear,

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Speaker 2: abundant energy without CO two or long lived bad waste

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Speaker 2: like this is a way of making sure that everybody's

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Speaker 2: energy bills kind of stay under control. And really, once

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Speaker 2: humanity cracks this, this will probably be the last type

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Speaker 2: of energy we ever need.

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Speaker 1: Right, So where are you in the journey with everybody else?

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Speaker 1: Once somebody cracks it, and they will presumably, does everyone

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Speaker 1: become redundant or you just get in other words, you

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Speaker 1: will become like a power company.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's funny. People always look at us and go, wow,

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Speaker 2: this is really high tech. But actually my dream is

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Speaker 2: just a beaver letterhead on their power bill. It's probably

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Speaker 2: the most basic product in the world these days. Once

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Speaker 2: we once we crack it, I think, you know, people's

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Speaker 2: imaginations are really the limit. You know, what would you

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Speaker 2: do with unlimited energy? You could have a flying car,

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Speaker 2: you can travel to space, do whatever you want.

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Speaker 1: Really, Yeah, that's true. Well I wouldn't mind the lights

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Speaker 1: being on in winter for now. So let's get but real,

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Speaker 1: because that's that's where we are at this country. When

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Speaker 1: you say, when we crack it, will it be cracked?

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Speaker 2: I think it will. But I'll be perfectly honest. The

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Speaker 2: reason I'm building the machine that Open Stars is doing

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Speaker 2: is because personally, I think this is probably the best

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Speaker 2: crack the other devices, they have their challenges, all of

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Speaker 2: these things are worth pursuing, but I wanted to work

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Speaker 2: on a machine that could actually deliver economic power and

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Speaker 2: a timescale that mattered.

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Speaker 1: How come you've come down this track and others haven't.

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Speaker 1: Are you a genius or are you just trying your luck?

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Speaker 2: Look? I am I trying my luck. Look broadly, the

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Speaker 2: fusion community thought that the kind of machine we're building

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Speaker 2: was basically impossible, But if you have a particular insight,

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Speaker 2: you realize that is technolology that makes it possible, and

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Speaker 2: that technology was actually mostly developed here in New Zealand

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Speaker 2: and Wellington in particular. I was just lucky enough to

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Speaker 2: do my PhD in a lab that was working on

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Speaker 2: this kind of stuff, and it was a coincidence of

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Speaker 2: history that you get to see the opportunities like building

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Speaker 2: this kind of levitated dipole machine that we're working on,

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Speaker 2: And so wouldn't I wouldn't say I'm a genius. I

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Speaker 2: was in the right place of the right time.

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Speaker 1: What's the cash burn?

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Speaker 2: The cash burn? So we've raised twenty million m zd

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Speaker 2: to day of that, we've probably spent seventeen to get

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Speaker 2: to where we are since raising our seed round, it's

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Speaker 2: taken us about two years to turn on this machine,

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Speaker 2: a little bit slower than I would have liked, but

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Speaker 2: at the same time, way faster than if we're building

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Speaker 2: something else.

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Speaker 1: Right, I'm reading in the NBR this morning, there's a

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Speaker 1: question mark over where your next machine is going to be.

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Speaker 1: Is it going to be offshore?

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Speaker 2: Look, there are some pretty great reasons to build it offshore.

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Speaker 2: There are just legacy infrastructure the northern hemisphere of the

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Speaker 2: State's Europe. They've been spending decades and there's a whole

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Speaker 2: bunch of infrastructure that we could use that's, you know,

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Speaker 2: not unique to what we do, and so that could

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Speaker 2: save us time and money. But at the same time,

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Speaker 2: building it with in New Zealand, with Kiwi's with the

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Speaker 2: Kiwi attitude, has also saved us a bucket load of

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Speaker 2: time and money. And so there's now this tension that

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Speaker 2: we need to figure out where this next machine is

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Speaker 2: going to be built. And my hope is that we

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Speaker 2: can figure out how to build it here in New Zealand,

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Speaker 2: because I think that's the difference between having a fusion

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Speaker 2: company Open Star versus having a fusion industry, just like

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Speaker 2: what we're seen with space. Once you get one company

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Speaker 2: that actually has traction, you can actually start building an

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Speaker 2: industry around that and actually have New Zealand's prosperity based

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Speaker 2: on technology and engineering, which we're pretty good at and

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Speaker 2: we should keep moving forward with.

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Speaker 1: Couldn't agree more. Go well, well, appreciate it very much.

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Speaker 1: Right to Matida, how interesting is that? I bet you

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Speaker 1: didn't even know it was existing in Wellington. He's sort

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Speaker 1: of like a Peter bick Esk character. For more from

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