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Speaker 1: You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine

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Speaker 1: from News Talks.

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Speaker 2: Edb is on it's still the sports story that everybody

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Speaker 2: is talking about. The search for a new All Blacks

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Speaker 2: coach is underway with New Zealand Rugby parting ways with

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Speaker 2: Scott Robertson after two years. How has this development been

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Speaker 2: received in elite rugby coaching circles. Well, it's great pleasure

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Speaker 2: to welcome into the show former England and two time

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Speaker 2: Wallaby's rugby coach and now for the second time, the

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Speaker 2: head coach of Japan heading into the Rugby World Cup

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Speaker 2: next year, Eddie Jones. Eddie, thanks for joining us on

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Speaker 2: Weekend Sport. How big a surprise was it to you

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Speaker 2: to hear of Scott robertson sacking ten days ago?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 4: Look, you know, I think any coach two years in

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Speaker 4: an international career to get sacked with a record that

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Speaker 4: he's got or he accremated is a huge surprise man.

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Speaker 4: And as you know, we don't know all the details,

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Speaker 4: but it's a hard one to fathom.

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Speaker 2: You mentioned the record, they're seventy four percent. He wins

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Speaker 2: three out of every four test matches. Does that indicate

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Speaker 2: to you that this obviously goes beyond the results on

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Speaker 2: the field.

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Speaker 3: It has to be, mate, it has to be And

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Speaker 3: I think, yeah, they've been. They've been the thing that

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Speaker 3: I don't like about this, mate.

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Speaker 4: They've been pretty happy to share certain things, but they're

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Speaker 4: not happy to share the real reason he's been sacked.

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Speaker 4: I think, you know, if they want to lead reports

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Speaker 4: Island and do all that sort of business behind the scene,

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Speaker 4: they shouldn't been up time and say right, these are

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Speaker 4: the reasons we're sacking.

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Speaker 2: I heard you speaking on the Rugby Unity podcast and

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Speaker 2: really enjoyed your thoughts there. How did you assess the

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Speaker 2: rugby that the All Blacks played under Scott robertson these

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Speaker 2: last two years.

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Speaker 3: Look, you know, if I'm really honest, I think, which

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Speaker 3: I try to be. I think New Zealand's been coming

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Speaker 3: off for a while, mate, you know, I.

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Speaker 4: Think there's still a really good team. Well, I think,

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Speaker 4: you know, since probably twenty nineteen. I think there's been

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Speaker 4: a general decline in the New Zealand rugby and I

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Speaker 4: think part of it is is the talent coming through,

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Speaker 4: and I think it's also the adjustment for the way

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Speaker 4: the game's winning played now.

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Speaker 3: It's definitely gone into a more power contest, and we've seen.

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Speaker 4: The game evolved from having all out of play, you know,

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Speaker 4: to maybe forty minutes now to up to sixty minutes.

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Speaker 4: So it's really suiting the power team and New Zealand's

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Speaker 4: always been the team.

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Speaker 3: That's like continuity in their game. And I think that,

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Speaker 3: you know, the last period of time has been a

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Speaker 3: bit of a struggle for him to get it right.

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Speaker 2: So you believe the All Blacks are still in decline.

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Speaker 4: Look, yeah, the client's are interesting word, mate, You know,

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Speaker 4: when you're winning it. They were winning at eighty percent

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Speaker 4: worth and the most dominant team in the world from

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Speaker 4: twenty eleven to two thousand and ninety eight, so that's.

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Speaker 3: A fair sting.

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Speaker 4: And I think whenever you've had that clear period of dominance,

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Speaker 4: sometimes the next group of players coming through, the gap

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Speaker 4: between the players you've had and the players coming through

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Speaker 4: is there. And sometimes the younger guys because the team's

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Speaker 4: struggling a bit, take a little bit longer to reach

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Speaker 4: their potential, which is maybe happening at the moment.

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Speaker 3: And there's also I think.

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Speaker 4: The coming of the Warriors as definitely the tattent in

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Speaker 4: New Zealand.

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Speaker 2: Interesting point. I know that's been talked about a lot,

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Speaker 2: the preference for a lot of young players who like

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Speaker 2: the oval ball to go to rugby leage rather than rugby.

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Speaker 2: You believe that's also effect to here historically anyway.

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Speaker 4: I think I think it never used to be a

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Speaker 4: factor in New Zealm. If you're a kid growing up,

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Speaker 4: on thing you wanted to do is play for the

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Speaker 4: All Blacks, right, And.

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Speaker 3: Now there's generation change.

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Speaker 4: People generally want things a bit quicker than they than

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Speaker 4: they did before.

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Speaker 3: And I think the Warriors.

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Speaker 4: Have become a great option for young kids. They can see,

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Speaker 4: they can be famous, they can be rich. It creates

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Speaker 4: a lot of media stories now and I think for

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Speaker 4: some kids maybe that's become as good an option for

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Speaker 4: them as playing for the All Blacks, which I think, yeah,

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Speaker 4: is something that's gonna the New Zealand's going to have

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Speaker 4: to address very seriously.

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Speaker 3: If you look at Australia, I don't.

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Speaker 4: Think Australia address that ever, took that problem as seriously

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Speaker 4: as they should have. And we've seen the decline in

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Speaker 4: Australian Arabia and I think you Zoan.

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Speaker 3: Is potentially facing that. I'm not saying it's dead and I.

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Speaker 4: Think it's it's maybe coming, and I think it's something

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Speaker 4: that needs to be looked at me.

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Speaker 2: Another subject you addressed on on Rugby Unity your podcast

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Speaker 2: was the end of season reviews. How much stock should

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Speaker 2: rugby bosses put in anonymous reviews of this type?

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Speaker 3: Well, i'll tell you what to see over the sea.

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Speaker 4: Everyone's got performance directors now they make a.

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Speaker 3: Living out of out of viewing other people's themes.

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Speaker 4: That that performance director should know it should be regularly

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Speaker 4: evaluating the environment in in feedback on to the coach,

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Speaker 4: because you give a coach a team and you think

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Speaker 4: he's the right person to coach the tee, right, and

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Speaker 4: that person then doesn't suddenly become.

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Speaker 3: A bad cag right, Very rare that happens. So of

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Speaker 3: course you've got to do in the season evaluation.

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Speaker 4: But the evaluation should be continuous all the time and

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Speaker 4: they should be support given in the coach if there's

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Speaker 4: areas to address.

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Speaker 3: I as Wayne Smith said, you know is I think

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Speaker 3: you speak.

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Speaker 4: To anyone in world Rudney and Wayne Smith is the

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Speaker 4: acknowledged as one of the most knowledgeable, sincere, generous person and.

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Speaker 3: The comments that he made about about.

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Speaker 4: Scott Robinson, I thought were absolutely spot on the problems,

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Speaker 4: get them sort of help him sort it out.

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Speaker 2: Why sacking The phrase player pow has been thrown around

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Speaker 2: a lot too, idiot. Have you seen an increase in

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Speaker 2: the influence of senior players in particular and elite teams?

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Speaker 3: Now, I reckon it's lesh mate. I can remember I

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Speaker 3: got my first coaching job right on the back of

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Speaker 3: play a power I've met that.

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Speaker 4: I can remember leaving Grigan, Lark and Kafa in the

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Speaker 4: airport at in Sydney and they did the actual interview

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Speaker 4: for the job, right, And that's the ones who made

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Speaker 4: decision the point views of Rumby's cap. So yeah, I

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Speaker 4: think there's always been player power, and I think player

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Speaker 4: power is so important.

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Speaker 3: What I don't like, mate.

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Speaker 4: Is if it's done through a survey that is generally anonymous,

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Speaker 4: And I think all those sort of things should be

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Speaker 4: sort of out during the course of the season.

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Speaker 3: And I think the involvement of the players is massively.

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Speaker 4: Important in rugby because it's a players game rugby. You know,

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Speaker 4: we don't have any intervention during the game as a coach,

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Speaker 4: so the players have got to run the game.

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Speaker 3: So I think it's really important that the players are

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Speaker 3: involved and heavily involved.

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Speaker 4: But you know, as I said, I don't like this

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Speaker 4: survey consituation.

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Speaker 2: You've also made a comparison with Manchester United, who had

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Speaker 2: that carried to prolonged success under Sir Alex Ferguson. Haven't

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Speaker 2: been able to replicate it since you can see some

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Speaker 2: parallels with the All accent and Manchester United.

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Speaker 4: Well, I see, you know, no one's spoken much about

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Speaker 4: the effect of silver Lake in this situation.

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Speaker 3: I'm not saying silver Lake were involved in the decision.

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Speaker 4: But the commercialization of the All Blacks puts pressure on

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Speaker 4: the two, you know, and I saw it with Manchester.

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Speaker 3: United, but they signed Ronaldo.

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Speaker 4: One week before the season, they'd already done their preseason

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Speaker 4: and then the cachat to put in a completely new

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Speaker 4: attack system on.

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Speaker 3: The back of the Now they're doing a sign because

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Speaker 3: he was obviously going to sell a lot of a

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Speaker 3: lot of shirts.

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Speaker 4: For them, And for a company that's that's now maybe

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Speaker 4: more worried about profit than winning, that can become a factor.

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Speaker 4: And has that been looked into in New Zealand Rugby

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Speaker 4: the effect of silver Lap.

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Speaker 2: Are you interested in the All Blacks head coaching role.

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Speaker 3: No, not at all, not at all. Well, you know,

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Speaker 3: I I love I've always loved New Zealand rugby.

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Speaker 5: I think you know from Australia growing up, you know

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Speaker 5: that was that was who we looked at. We we

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Speaker 5: set our standards on beating New Zealand and yeah, there's

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Speaker 5: pretty good New Zealands.

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Speaker 4: Is that job?

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Speaker 3: And I think you need someone who's in New Zealander there.

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Speaker 3: I certainly don't think you need a foreign coach.

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Speaker 2: Well, we've enjoyed this foreign coaches analysis, Adie. Thanks so

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Speaker 2: much for joining us across New Zealand. Good mate, Cheers mate,

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Speaker 2: No cheers to you too. Any any Jones there, I'm

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Speaker 2: not sure where he is. Sounds like he's in a

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Speaker 2: Sunday market or something. I think we could pick up

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Speaker 2: on what he was saying. Now, good to get the

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Speaker 2: thoughts of of any giant.

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Speaker 1: For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Fine, listen live

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Speaker 1: to news Talks it be weekends from midday, or follow

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