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Speaker 1: Kielda.

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Speaker 2: I'm Chelsea Daniels and This is the Front Page, a

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Speaker 2: daily podcast presented by the New Zealand Herald. It seems

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Speaker 2: that when one political scandal ends, another one arises to

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Speaker 2: take its place. This week, the Green Party ended the

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Speaker 2: saga that has dominated twenty twenty four for them, with

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Speaker 2: MP Darling Tana formally removed as an MP in the

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Speaker 2: first usage of the walker jumping bill. As Chloe Swarbrick

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Speaker 2: and her party look to the future, it's now National's

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Speaker 2: turn to deal with an unneeded diversion after Minister Andrew

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Speaker 2: Bailey was accused of abusing a member of the public

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Speaker 2: at a business event. But at the same time Deputy

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Speaker 2: Prime Minister Winston Peters has engaged in a war of

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Speaker 2: words with Debutty Moldy and the Labor Party. So to

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Speaker 2: make sense of all the latest political ups and today

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Speaker 2: on the Front Page, we're joined by news Talk zby

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Speaker 2: senior political correspondent Barry Soaper. Let's start with the one

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Speaker 2: scandal that is at least wrapped up. The month's long

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Speaker 2: debacle between the Green Party and their former MP Darlene

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Speaker 2: Taner has ended with the party implementing the Walker jumping

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Speaker 2: bill to kick Taner out of Parliament? Do you think

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Speaker 2: the Green Party will finally be able to move on

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Speaker 2: from a pretty rough year for them?

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Speaker 3: Indeed, and in fact, the Greens haven't handled this very

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Speaker 3: well at all. They should have bitten the bullet right

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Speaker 3: at the beginning and invoked the Walker jumping legislation, even

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Speaker 3: though they were vehemently opposed to it. They ended up

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Speaker 3: using it. So really they had to eat a lot

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Speaker 3: of humble pie in this. And it looked for a

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Speaker 3: while that Darling Tana was in fact controlling the narrative. Indeed,

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Speaker 3: she was going to the courts and using the court

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Speaker 3: system to delay her sacking from Parliament. And there was

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Speaker 3: only one outcome that this could have resulted, and that

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Speaker 3: was her to go. But they mucked around for so

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Speaker 3: long that the Greens looked at one stage quite impotent,

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Speaker 3: whereas Darlei Tana looked as though she had the upper hand.

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Speaker 3: But the thing that I found interesting in this is

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Speaker 3: a couple of points. One is the public has not

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Speaker 3: seen the full report into Darleana and exactly how she

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Speaker 3: exploited Or's party. Two, the exploitation of a migrant, an immigrant,

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Speaker 3: I should say to this country, and so that's one

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Speaker 3: classic point there that they should have basically cleared up

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Speaker 3: from the start, but they didn't, so they've left a

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Speaker 3: big question mark over it. And the second thing is, look,

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Speaker 3: this party, like you said at the beginning, has had

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Speaker 3: a dreadful year. You've got Goldy's Gurriman. She went for

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Speaker 3: a review even though she had pleaded guilty to a

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Speaker 3: shoplifting and the judge at the time said that it

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Speaker 3: was quite deliberative and indeed she went from shop to

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Speaker 3: shop and if you only had to look at the

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Speaker 3: video material to see that it was quite deliberate. And

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Speaker 3: then she pleaded guilty but then wanted her conviction not

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Speaker 3: recorded as one. Well, i'm sorry. You know, she can't

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Speaker 3: be treated any differently from anyone else, and if that

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Speaker 3: impinges on a future legal career, then maybe she should

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Speaker 3: have thought about that before she did the actions that

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Speaker 3: she did. So Yeah, the Greens I think, have come

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Speaker 3: through this quite sullied, but they'll be able to rebuild

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Speaker 3: and they don't seem to have suffered ironically in the

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Speaker 3: opinion polls, which is quite extraordinary.

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Speaker 4: Speaking to One News exclusively today, Darling Tanner reflected on

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Speaker 4: her short and sharp political career. Darling Tanna, as of today,

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Speaker 4: you are no longer a member of Parliament.

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Speaker 5: So yes, I discovered this morning that I am officially

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Speaker 5: a former MP of the fifty fourth Parliament of New

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Speaker 5: Zealand my reaction to that in one part relieved, but

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Speaker 5: mostly just thankful. Had I resigned, that would have been,

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Speaker 5: in one way, in an admission of guilt, and that's

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Speaker 5: not I wasn't guilty.

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Speaker 1: I think it's incredible as well.

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Speaker 2: Throughout all of this Darling Tana news and you know,

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Speaker 2: the whole saga, we've kind of forgotten as a society

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Speaker 2: why it happened in the first place.

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Speaker 1: And that's her husband's bike shop exactly.

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Speaker 3: And yeah, and like I said, we don't know. They

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Speaker 3: haven't term for the public at least across the t's

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Speaker 3: and dotted the eyes because when I'm more aware of

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Speaker 3: exactly what happened than what the executive's summary of the

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Speaker 3: report told us. And don't forget they had a lawyer

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Speaker 3: in for several weeks looking into this, costing not just

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Speaker 3: the taxpayer but the Green Party itself. And of course

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Speaker 3: this has been a very expensive exercise for Darlene Tana

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Speaker 3: as well. Although she's had some good backing from people

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Speaker 3: that claim to be part of the Green Party, so

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Speaker 3: you know, certainly she's got some backing, or she would

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Speaker 3: have to have, because you wouldn't have the money to

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Speaker 3: pay the legal bills that she's embarked on. The second thing, though,

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Speaker 3: to me, is really interesting that you know the case

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Speaker 3: is now before the Court of Appeal. She's appealing the

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Speaker 3: fact that the Greens sacked her in the first place. Well,

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Speaker 3: I was certainly told that the Speaker wouldn't invoke the

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Speaker 3: Wacker jumping legislation until that Court of Appeal case was heard,

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Speaker 3: because you imagine now if the Court of Appeal comes

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Speaker 3: down and says, look, the Greens should not have removed

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Speaker 3: Darlinge Tana from offers, where does that leave the Walker jumping,

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Speaker 3: her dismissal from Parliament and the new person has taken

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Speaker 3: her place. It's a mess.

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Speaker 1: Well, that's a wrap for what the Greens are up to.

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Speaker 2: But thankfully for the press Gallery Barry Nationals Andrew Bailey

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Speaker 2: came in late last week with a new scandal. Can

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Speaker 2: you give us the brief summary of what he is

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Speaker 2: alleged to have done at a recent ministerial visit.

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Speaker 6: Is he saying that he did not tell the worker

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Speaker 6: to f off.

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Speaker 3: I do not believe I said that.

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Speaker 6: Did he call the worker a loser?

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Speaker 7: Yes, I was wrong, but I intended the comments in

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Speaker 7: a lighthearted manner. Unfortunately it has caused hurt an offense,

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Speaker 7: and for that reason I've apologize unreservedly to the individual.

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Speaker 6: Did he hold up the shape of an L on

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Speaker 6: his forehead?

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Speaker 3: Again? Yes? I did.

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Speaker 6: Will the minister be clear with the House what part

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Speaker 6: of the complaint he disputes.

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Speaker 7: I mentioned before that that I did not believe that

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Speaker 7: I swore at the individual, and also that I was

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Speaker 7: not drunk.

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Speaker 6: So had he had any alcohol at the beer garden

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Speaker 6: or the winery he visited that day?

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Speaker 5: No?

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Speaker 6: Is he saying that he visited a beer garden and

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Speaker 6: a winery. But the person fudging the truth about his

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Speaker 6: drinking is the worker.

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Speaker 7: That unrelated You asked me whether I had alcohol, and

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Speaker 7: I said no.

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Speaker 3: Well yes. It was extraordinary really that to think that

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Speaker 3: a cabinet minister would go up to a worker on

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Speaker 3: the shop floor, tell him to take a bottle of

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Speaker 3: wine and f off, and then to the sign of

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Speaker 3: loser on his own forehead.

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Speaker 1: What a high school Bullie.

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Speaker 3: Look, I know Andrew Bailey, and I know I'm relatively well.

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Speaker 3: He's got an extraordinary cv for Parliament. I mean, he's

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Speaker 3: an adventurer, he's an explorer. He's towed sleds to both

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Speaker 3: the North Pole and the South Pole.

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Speaker 1: Is he a good time to enjoy a whiskey with?

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Speaker 3: No, he's never been. I've been in bars with him,

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Speaker 3: but he's never been a man that would overindulge when

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Speaker 3: it comes to liquor. So I think he was naive

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Speaker 3: in that he thought he was cracking a joke, clearly,

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Speaker 3: or he wouldn't have done it. He thought he was

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Speaker 3: cracking a joke, he thought it would be taken on

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Speaker 3: the spirit that he intended it. But look for anyone

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Speaker 3: to be called a loser and being told to if

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Speaker 3: off from his workplaces, probably stretching what humor should be

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Speaker 3: all about. So it's there's nothing humorous in poor old

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Speaker 3: Andrew Bailey at the moment. I've spoken to him a

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Speaker 3: couple of times this week. In fact, the first the

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Speaker 3: first call I made to him, when he answered, I

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Speaker 3: said loser, and I don't think he was terribly amused.

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Speaker 3: But we got over that, and he look, he says

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Speaker 3: that it's the worst period of his political life, and

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Speaker 3: it's not been a terribly long political life. I think

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Speaker 3: he's probably done. His chances for reappointment to cabinet if

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Speaker 3: National wins the next election are not very good at all.

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Speaker 3: So look, there will be consequences in the end. But

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Speaker 3: once Luxon went down the road of supporting him, he

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Speaker 3: was left with nowhere else to go. So Bailey is there,

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Speaker 3: but he'll be there certainly until the next election. And

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Speaker 3: it's tragic in a way because the man does have

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Speaker 3: a lot of promise. He's the Commerce Minister. It's a

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Speaker 3: pretty important and roll. He's very low, low on the

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Speaker 3: rung in cabinet. He was once number three in the

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Speaker 3: lineup for the National Party, but now I was right

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Speaker 3: down at the lowest rung, and he'll be considering himself

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Speaker 3: at the moment. I think quite lucky to be even there.

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Speaker 7: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Well, Prime Minister Christopher Lackson has accepted Bailey's apology but

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Speaker 2: hasn't fired him or stripped him of his portfolios.

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Speaker 1: Do you reckon that's the right move for the Prime minister?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 8: I do.

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Speaker 3: Look, I think genuinely, if you knew Andrew Bailey I mean,

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Speaker 3: it was a goofy thing to do. I don't think

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Speaker 3: he meant any malice by what he did. Nevertheless, you know,

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Speaker 3: you've got to be aware, and the point was made

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Speaker 3: by the Speaker Jerry Brownley this week that you are

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Speaker 3: a cabinet minister twenty four to seven and you cannot

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Speaker 3: indulge in this sort of behavior when you're out at

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Speaker 3: the workplace. I think if he hadn't have been so

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Speaker 3: indistinct with what happened from the beginning, it may not

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Speaker 3: have dragged on as long as it did. I mean

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Speaker 3: the fact that he went back to the person who

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Speaker 3: he offended and invited him for a drink. He was

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Speaker 3: probably being friendly, probably realizing that he had overstepped the

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Speaker 3: mark and wanted to make things good. But look, this

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Speaker 3: person that wrote to all the political parties with his

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Speaker 3: complaint about Andrew Bailey clearly also had something of a

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Speaker 3: political motive as well. He wanted to see Andrew Bailey

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Speaker 3: being dealt to. But I think the Prime Minister made

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Speaker 3: the right decision in not doing so.

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Speaker 2: You know what I would have done if I was

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Speaker 2: that worker, I would have taken that cask of wine

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Speaker 2: and left off.

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Speaker 3: It depends on good the bottle.

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Speaker 1: I'd make sure it's vintage, yes, exactly.

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Speaker 2: And sticking with the government and opposition of course, Deputy

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Speaker 2: PM Winston Peters is perhaps unsurprisingly in a war of

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Speaker 2: words with Departy Maldi. What's the latest back and forth

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Speaker 2: between these two sides of it?

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Speaker 3: Often the Maori Party this week has been outrageous when

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Speaker 3: you look at the comments by Rawui Way to Tea

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Speaker 3: on the raid the police raid on Mongrel moral associates

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Speaker 3: in the Eastern Bay of Plenty in a Polticky in

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Speaker 3: particular as somehow being racist and suggesting that Maldi should

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Speaker 3: have been given a heads up before the raids were

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Speaker 3: made is patently absurd. And what is white to Tea

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Speaker 3: telling us that the Maldi Party support the gangs in

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Speaker 3: this country? Well, you know you'd be perfectly entitled to

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Speaker 3: draw that conclusion from what he's saying.

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Speaker 9: Would the students at the or Marii lessons learn more

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Speaker 9: if they kept their mouths shutt while the teacher was talking?

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Speaker 10: And it's that comment Ti Parti Marti are calling a calculated,

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Speaker 10: blatant racial assault. But Winston Peters argues it was referring

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Speaker 10: to Opposition members interrupting the Education Minister mid question. In

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Speaker 10: response to the comment, Peters said, Tiparty Mary have been

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Speaker 10: so seduced by their own unrightful acquisition of power they

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Speaker 10: cannot tolerate anyone challenging of their unrifled use of it.

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Speaker 3: When it goes to the House. The war of words

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Speaker 3: between Winston Peters and the Maori Party that've been going

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Speaker 3: on since time memorial, since the Maori Party have claimed

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Speaker 3: the number of seats that it has at the moment,

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Speaker 3: so they're more powerful than they have been for a

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Speaker 3: long while, and they make some of the most outrageous statements.

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Speaker 3: Winston stands up to challenge them, and being a moldy

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Speaker 3: he has had an advantage because he can take them

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Speaker 3: on their own game. But of course it's water off

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Speaker 3: a duck's back to this moldy party that makes some

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Speaker 3: of the most inflammatory statements that I've seen in my

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Speaker 3: time around the place.

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Speaker 2: Well, who do you reckon? If they did go outside Barry,

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Speaker 2: who do you reckon?

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Speaker 1: Would have won? Winston Peters or BYTC?

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Speaker 3: Well, I wouldn't, I wouldn't back. Winston Peters is seventy

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Speaker 3: eight years old and when he gets annoyed with people,

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Speaker 3: he's got that favorite saying listen here, sunshine. And I've

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Speaker 3: heard him say that to a number of people. But

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Speaker 3: as Winston himself says, fortunately, he's not an aggressive person.

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Speaker 3: That's physically, maybe not verbally, but or certainly verbally, I

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Speaker 3: should say, but yes, he said he's not an aggressive person.

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Speaker 3: It was bentter And even though Winston Peters said that

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Speaker 3: if they did go outside, y T T would be

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Speaker 3: limping back into the debating chamber, I think probably the

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Speaker 3: reverse would be true.

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Speaker 1: I reckon he was being cheeky. Of course he was,

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Speaker 1: Winston last a bit of cheeky.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And just when he thought it had settled down,

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Speaker 2: Peter's back in the House on Wednesday made allegations about

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Speaker 2: Labour's aischeverro in the House.

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Speaker 3: What did he allege this well, relatives being involved with

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Speaker 3: policy making when she was the Minister of Health.

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Speaker 9: In the last few days, it's come to my attention

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Speaker 9: that a close filter barbe Zebel had been involved with

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Speaker 9: attending meetings, had access to papers, had been advised the

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Speaker 9: Minister on this very topic of the past year without

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Speaker 9: declaring an the contraven of interest that as much Moroderlin.

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Speaker 8: As Vara, the Health Ministry has apologized to Minister Casey

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Speaker 8: Costello for failing to alert her to the fact that

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Speaker 8: one of their team was related to Labour's health spokesperson

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Speaker 8: A Cheverel. Acting Prime Minister Winston Peter's criticized the public

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Speaker 8: servant who works on tobacco control in the House today,

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Speaker 8: accusing her of concealing her conflict of an interest from

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Speaker 8: the minister. But the Ministry says the individual had disclosed

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Speaker 8: the matter and it was the ministry's job to alert

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Speaker 8: the minister. It's apologized for the oversight.

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Speaker 3: The point that Dashaverell made was that you know, we

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Speaker 3: live in a small country and there are times that

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Speaker 3: there are crossovers, maybe with family, and that is true.

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Speaker 3: I mean I can name many cases where families close

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Speaker 3: associates and some people would say, well, maybe there's a

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Speaker 3: bit of a conflict of interest there, but you know,

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Speaker 3: that's the sort of thing that happens in a country

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Speaker 3: this size. Don't forget, we've got the population about the

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Speaker 3: same size as Sydney, so really the Prime Minister is

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Speaker 3: a little more than the Lord Mayor of New Zealand.

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Speaker 2: Do either of these cases feel like something Peters is

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Speaker 2: focusing his attention on getting the boot into the opposite opposition.

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Speaker 2: Is he already in election mode or do you reckon

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Speaker 2: he's just Winston being Winston.

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Speaker 3: Now it's Winston being Winston.

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Speaker 2: Political scandal aren't rare, Barry, obviously, you've been around in

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Speaker 2: the trenches for a while now. It does feel like

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Speaker 2: in the last week most parties have been engaged in

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Speaker 2: scandals that perhaps aren't the best use of their time.

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Speaker 2: Should they be getting their collective acts together and getting

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Speaker 2: on with actually governing.

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Speaker 3: Well, you know, if you look at this particular government legislatively,

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Speaker 3: it's probably been the most active government I think in

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Speaker 3: the first year that I've seen in many a long year,

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Speaker 3: and so a lot of legislation has been passed. It's

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Speaker 3: been controversial. The gloves are off when it comes to

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Speaker 3: the debating chamber, but there's nothing unusual in that. A

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Speaker 3: lot of trivia is being thrown around. But then that's

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Speaker 3: the nature. When you've got a parliament full of people

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Speaker 3: that are adversaries, and they most certainly are ideologically opposed

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Speaker 3: to each other, then you've got to expect a lot

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Speaker 3: of to and fro, and that's what we're seeing at

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Speaker 3: the moment.

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Speaker 2: What's the most outrageous thing you've seen in the debating chamber.

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Speaker 3: Oh goodness, gracious me. Well, you know, being invited outside

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Speaker 3: is not an unusual thing to happen. I mean Trevor

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Speaker 3: Mallard and to Henare who used to be with the

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Speaker 3: New Zealand First Party, they went out into the lobby

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Speaker 3: and had a bit of a slugging match at one stage.

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Speaker 3: So you know, look, Parliament, that should never happen, of course,

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Speaker 3: because Parliament should be above that. But when you look

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Speaker 3: at the way Parliament has developed over the years, it's

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Speaker 3: a very different parliament to the one that I started

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Speaker 3: reporting on back in nineteen eighty. There were many fewer

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Speaker 3: women in the place, and I think the advent that

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Speaker 3: women are now probably on a fifty to fifty basis

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Speaker 3: is a great thing. But the standards have been relaxed

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Speaker 3: like they've never been before. That you know, when you

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Speaker 3: see people, some of them wearing T shirts and sneakers

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Speaker 3: into the debating chamber and dress doesn't always make for

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Speaker 3: good behavior, but there are certain standards that we're imposed

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Speaker 3: on Parliament over many years, and I think those standards

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Speaker 3: have dropped significantly. Although having said that, Jerry brownly runs

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Speaker 3: a quite different parliament to what former speakers have presided over.

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Speaker 3: He's much more casual in his approach, allows much more

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Speaker 3: toing and throwing, and I think given the makeup of

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Speaker 3: this Parliament and given the fractious nature of it, that

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Speaker 3: he's probably the ideal speaker for what we see in

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Speaker 3: the debating chamber.

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Speaker 2: And we've been speaking about all these scandals, Barry and

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Speaker 2: for the sake of fairness, has act done anything scandalous

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Speaker 2: in the past week, because we haven't heard anything about that.

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Speaker 3: While we did we heard about food.

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Speaker 4: Oh the food?

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Speaker 1: Is that the scandal?

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Speaker 3: And whether you can eatail on three dollars?

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Speaker 2: Would you you had a peek at those meals? Would

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Speaker 2: you eat them?

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Speaker 3: They look pretty good? Actually, look when you consider they've

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Speaker 3: I think they've cut and I could be wrong here

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Speaker 3: about one hundred and thirty million dollars off the food bill.

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Speaker 3: I think, you know, they should be applauded for that

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Speaker 3: because Labor when they introduced the food in schools, they

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Speaker 3: were paying what eight to nine dollars a meal? Terribly nutritious.

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Speaker 3: But then should the taxpayer be funding feeding kids at school?

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Speaker 3: And now everyone is fed? Because it seems that those

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Speaker 3: who in fact didn't need to be fed. They were

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Speaker 3: embarrassing those that have to be fed, and I just

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Speaker 3: think the whole thing is absurd. I think what David

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Speaker 3: Seymour has done in that case is very good and

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Speaker 3: he should be applauded for it cutting what would have

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Speaker 3: been wides spread wastage that we saw with these food

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Speaker 3: and schools, but not only that, cutting the costs significantly,

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Speaker 3: and I think the textpayer should be applauding that.

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Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us, Barry.

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Speaker 3: My absolute rear and ut of privilege and pleasure. Chelsea.

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Speaker 2: That's it for this episode of the Front Page. You

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Speaker 2: can read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage

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Speaker 2: at Enst Herald dot co dot nz. The Front Page

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Speaker 2: is produced by Ethan Seals. Dan Goodwin is the sound engineer.

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Speaker 2: I'm Chelsea Daniels. Subscribe to the Front Page on iHeartRadio

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Speaker 2: or wherever you get your podcasts, and tune in on

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Speaker 2: Monday for another look behind the headlines.