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Speaker 1: You're listening to the Resident build Up podcast with Peter

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Speaker 1: Wolfcamp from News Talks at Bay.

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Speaker 2: And the grass is overgrown in the yard, even when

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Speaker 2: the dog.

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Speaker 3: Is too old to borrow.

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Speaker 4: And when you're sitting at the table trying to have to.

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Speaker 5: Start, I have scissor home, even when we leave a

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Speaker 5: band gone, even when you're there alone, a home. House

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Speaker 5: is a home, even when those ghost even.

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Speaker 2: When you got around from the ones you love your most,

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Speaker 2: you scream those broken plaints feeling from the wood locals

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Speaker 2: whisper when they're going to leave, the.

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Speaker 5: Neighbor the house, even when wilban, even when you're in there. Loone.

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Speaker 3: Well, a very good morning, and welcome along to news

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Speaker 3: Talk set Bes a resident builder on Sunday with me

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Speaker 3: Peter wolf Camp, the resident builder, looking forward to your calls,

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Speaker 3: your conversation this morning around all things building and construction.

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Speaker 3: So I trust you've had a good week. I think

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Speaker 3: that sense that well, I had that sense that maybe

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Speaker 3: we had had a very mild winter, escape the worst

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Speaker 3: of it, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera, and a bit of a

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Speaker 3: reality check. Pretty miserable all day yesterday and certainly not

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Speaker 3: that much more pleasant this morning. So the markets are

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Speaker 3: off by the way, that's where probably I would have

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Speaker 3: been heading anyway, That's beside the point. Good morning, welcome along.

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Speaker 3: It is an opportunity for you to talk about all

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Speaker 3: things construction, whether it's a project that is underway and

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Speaker 3: going well not going well. I mean, I've got a

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Speaker 3: call from a mate who you know, we often just

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Speaker 3: call talk about, you know, challenges and the job, those

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Speaker 3: sorts of things. Friday afternoon, that's not a good time

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Speaker 3: to get a call from anyone to go, hey, look,

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Speaker 3: just wondering what the best way forward in this particular

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Speaker 3: situation was. So if you need to chat about a

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Speaker 3: project that you've got on, you can do so by

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Speaker 3: calling eight hundred eighty ten eighty. You can text through

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Speaker 3: nine two nine two, and you can email Pete at

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Speaker 3: NEWSTALKZB dot co dot m Z. Yesterday was again I said,

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Speaker 3: it was a fairly miserable all day, and I set

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Speaker 3: out in the afternoon to spend a little bit of

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Speaker 3: productive time in the workshop and then realize that in

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Speaker 3: order to do what I intended to do, I needed

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Speaker 3: to keep going in and out of the workshop. I

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Speaker 3: needed to get gear out of the back of the Masda,

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Speaker 3: and I just kind of went to be fair, it's

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Speaker 3: it's miserable and I don't know that I want to

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Speaker 3: get wet. I'm in the shed. I'm not getting a

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Speaker 3: wet in their, but can I be bothered one around?

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Speaker 3: And then as I was tidying up, I found this

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Speaker 3: offcut of color steel, just flat sheet that I'd got

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Speaker 3: from me mate who does flashings, and I, ah, that's right.

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Speaker 3: I was going to make what I call a witch's cap,

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Speaker 3: so just a good old fashioned cowling or cap for

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Speaker 3: event pipe. So I've got one hundred bill vent pipe

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Speaker 3: through a little roof that I built to ventilate the

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Speaker 3: hot air that builds up in a roof. And when

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Speaker 3: I did it, I got the guys, the roof is

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Speaker 3: to flash it, put the penetration through, and I just

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Speaker 3: put a fixed cap on the top, with the attention

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Speaker 3: of either finding which is not that easy, a cowling cap,

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Speaker 3: or having the time to make one. And so then

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Speaker 3: it was like, now, how do I you do these?

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Speaker 3: How do you take a flat sheet of steel, a

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Speaker 3: flat sheet of color steel and turn it into a

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Speaker 3: conical shape, which prompted to be fair A little bit

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Speaker 3: of investigation on YouTube where I found lots of videos

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Speaker 3: about how to make a cone, but not a cap.

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Speaker 3: And then eventually it popped up and it was like, oh,

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Speaker 3: that's right, they're actually really really simple to do. So

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Speaker 3: I got a couple of pieces of paper, compass out,

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Speaker 3: strapped a mark a pen to it, made one out

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Speaker 3: of just as a template, and thought, no, it's going

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Speaker 3: to be slightly too big, made another one, worked out

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Speaker 3: how much I needed to cut, like a segment to

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Speaker 3: cut out, then to wrap it around, transferred that across

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Speaker 3: onto the flat sheet, got the did a dash to

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Speaker 3: the back of the truck, grabbed all of the cutters

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Speaker 3: and bits and pieces that I needed, folded that up,

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Speaker 3: made some little legs on it. Job done. Very productive

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Speaker 3: afternoon in the end, actually, and I was about to

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Speaker 3: abandon ship anyway, stick with it is the key there,

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Speaker 3: there's always a job to do. And then I posted

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Speaker 3: about it yesterday, just a bit of a funny thing online,

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Speaker 3: and someone said, is that a to do it cap?

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Speaker 3: Around to it? Around to it? And I thought, around cap,

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Speaker 3: I've heard of a round to it cap. I should

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Speaker 3: go and have a look. So I did a quick

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Speaker 3: Google search of what's an around to it cap? And

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Speaker 3: of course it's not there's no such thing, but it

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Speaker 3: is though one of those jobs. I'll get round to it.

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Speaker 3: And yes, I did get round to it yesterday and

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Speaker 3: it felt pretty damn good. Oh eight hundred eighty ten eighty.

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Speaker 3: Let's rip into it. If you've got a question of

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Speaker 3: a building nature, and this is a fairly wide field, right.

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Speaker 3: This can be about compliance and can be about projects,

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Speaker 3: It can be about contractors, it can be about regulations,

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Speaker 3: it can be about contracts. Eight hundred eighty ten eighty

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Speaker 3: and we'll have a crack at all of those issues.

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Speaker 3: A very good morning to you, Robert.

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Speaker 6: Oh, good a, Peter, Robert. I've got a project where

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Speaker 6: I want to have a sunroom built attached to the house. Yes,

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Speaker 6: and it's going to be about thirty square meters. Reading

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Speaker 6: the regulations, you definitely need a building consent.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I would say so. And I know that that

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Speaker 3: whole thing around shed you. One of the Building Act

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Speaker 3: has expanded the scope of work that you can do.

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Speaker 3: But I think because this is attached to the building,

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Speaker 3: it's obviously going to be in a sense of habitable space,

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Speaker 3: as in you'll be able to it'll be fully enclosed.

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Speaker 3: Otherwise we'd call it a porch. Then I think, yes,

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Speaker 3: it would require a building consent and also thirty square

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Speaker 3: meters that's going to add you know, a lot of

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Speaker 3: footprint to the property. It's a decent sized roof that's

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Speaker 3: going to go on it. Yep, I would say building consent.

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Speaker 6: Oh yeah, it's funny you mentioned about a porch because

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Speaker 6: a friend of mine says you don't need to get

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Speaker 6: a consent. He used to be in the building industry,

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Speaker 6: always off and it's a porch.

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Speaker 3: Yep.

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Speaker 6: But you know I read about like you know, the

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Speaker 6: council catches onto it, you can get fined, it can ash,

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Speaker 6: you pull it back down. I'd rather just do it

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Speaker 6: the right way and as long as it's straightforward getting

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Speaker 6: the building, because it seems like you're allowed to do it.

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Speaker 6: When I built the house, I built to the maximum

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Speaker 6: thirty five percent of a five hundred and fifty square

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Speaker 6: meter section. But it seems like the last few years

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Speaker 6: you're allowed to add on a bit more.

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Speaker 7: Now.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, i'd agree with you and look to be fair.

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Speaker 3: When we did our extensions, gosh, more than twenty years ago,

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Speaker 3: it was the same thing. You know, I think our

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Speaker 3: permissible site coverage was thirty five percent or thirty seven

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Speaker 3: percent with a bit of discretion. Typically nowadays it's not

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Speaker 3: terribly difficult to get to fifty percent.

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Speaker 6: Right in the middle of the section that's not close

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Speaker 6: to the line or anything. So fine, I wouldn't need

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Speaker 6: to get neighbors permissioned. I live in a private right

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Speaker 6: of way.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's it's fee simple. It's not a cross lease property.

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Speaker 6: No, it's not a cross the way across lease.

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Speaker 3: Then you're I don't think you'll need neighbors permission. It

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Speaker 3: sounds like it's not going to be terribly close to

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Speaker 3: the boundary. But I think you've probably strayed into an

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Speaker 3: area that I feel that we haven't discussed enough at

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Speaker 3: the moment that when you said it should be relatively

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Speaker 3: straightforward to get a building consent, And I would imagine

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Speaker 3: that anyone who's applied for a building consent in the

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Speaker 3: last couple of years probably is listening to the shaking

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Speaker 3: their head, going oh, mate, you don't know the drama

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Speaker 3: that you're in for. And unfortunately, I think the overwhelming

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Speaker 3: sense we have around the process of gaining a building

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Speaker 3: consent is just it's really challenging, seemingly now, if you

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Speaker 3: and your project should be relatively straightforward, right, it's a

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Speaker 3: relatively simple structure, there's an existing building, there, there's no

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Speaker 3: issues around services, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. It

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Speaker 3: should be if it's well drawn, it goes and it

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Speaker 3: gets stamped and you can get underway with it. But

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Speaker 3: I just almost everyone I talk to at the moment

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Speaker 3: talks about the process of getting a building consent is

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Speaker 3: really really challenging for a number of different reasons. Part

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Speaker 3: of that might be, you know that some I would

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Speaker 3: imagine that there's a large number of building consent applications

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Speaker 3: and plans that go into council that are poorly done,

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Speaker 3: and so counsel has to keep asking questions. But in

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Speaker 3: some cases, I think counsel just seems to be able

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Speaker 3: to make what is relatively straightforward incredibly difficult at the moment. Okay,

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Speaker 3: but I don't mean to put you off. I'm just saying,

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Speaker 3: if suddenly you put it in and then it becomes

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Speaker 3: a bit of a drama, don't be surprised.

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Speaker 6: Okay, Yeah, So what's the resource consent? I don't need that.

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Speaker 3: I think it's unlikely that you would need a resource consent.

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Speaker 3: So typically a resource consent is triggered when essentially resource

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Speaker 3: consents part of the Resource Management Act, and it's going, well,

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Speaker 3: if you're going to use a resource and air, water,

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Speaker 3: et cetera, then where you've got to explain how what

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Speaker 3: you do is going to impact on the environment. Now,

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Speaker 3: in your situation, you're going to add thirty square meters

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Speaker 3: of impermeable cover to the property. Is that does that

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Speaker 3: trigger a requirement for a resource consent? Probably not, because

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Speaker 3: you're still well under let's say a fifty percent maximum

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Speaker 3: site coverage that you might be able to have. Are

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Speaker 3: you in a historic zone and you're doing something to

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Speaker 3: a house that's protected by the nineteen forty or pre

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Speaker 3: nineteen forty heritage overlay? Probably not, you know those sorts

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Speaker 3: of things. So I would have thought that very unlikely

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Speaker 3: that you would have had you would need a resource consent.

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Speaker 6: Oh okay, I've just got two more questions. My wife,

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Speaker 6: she actually wants to build it bigger. I said, our

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Speaker 6: thirty square meters that season the regulations? Is there any

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Speaker 6: chart site that counts will prove of you put forward

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Speaker 6: plans for sun room over thirty square meters?

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Speaker 3: I think if you went to over thirty square meters.

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Speaker 3: They just consider it in addition to the property right.

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Speaker 3: And again, if you've got the site coverage and you're

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Speaker 3: not infringing height in relation to boundary, so it's not

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Speaker 3: your intention to build let's say within a meter of

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Speaker 3: your neighbor's boundary, it's not going to be too tall.

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Speaker 3: Then again that should be relatively straightforward.

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Speaker 6: Okay. Then the other thing is materials. I researched a

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Speaker 6: little bit. There's aliminion versus PVC, and straight away I

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Speaker 6: thought I prefer alaminion, but I heard that PVC is

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Speaker 6: a lot stronger, but a bit more costly. And building

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Speaker 6: in Wellington like here, I'm on a high wind zone,

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Speaker 6: I'm on a ridge. Do you know much about the

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Speaker 6: difference between.

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Speaker 3: Seem to see? I mean you PVC has made its

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Speaker 3: way into the market. It's been around for a while,

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Speaker 3: but it's a little bit more mainstream whether or not

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Speaker 3: they would do fabrication for something like because when you

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Speaker 3: say a sunput or a sunroom, are you thinking that

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Speaker 3: the whole thing will come essentially prefabricated, like it's an

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Speaker 3: off site manufacturer. So you do a slab and then

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Speaker 3: the whole thing would come kit setted, let's say, and

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Speaker 3: be installed on site. So you're not talking about you know,

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Speaker 3: conventional construction where you do a slab, you'd frame up

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Speaker 3: some walls, add some windows and a roof to it.

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Speaker 3: You want all of that to be in a sunroom style.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, what I understand? What of research for some companies

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Speaker 6: as pre YEP they and install it. I hear that

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Speaker 6: the PVC I thought it was just completely all PVC,

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Speaker 6: But does it have a metal component inside the PVC

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Speaker 6: to make it stronger?

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Speaker 3: That No, So the actual joinery suite that you're talking about,

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Speaker 3: if it's uPVC, the extrusions are all are the structural elements, right,

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Speaker 3: so you don't need anything else that goes with it.

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Speaker 3: I haven't experienced it where they've used uPVC in a sunroom,

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Speaker 3: like most of the sunrooms that I've seen have typically

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Speaker 3: either been timber or aluminium. But you know, one of

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Speaker 3: the things I guess you've got where you will probably

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Speaker 3: be quite heavily impacted with new building consent rules and

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Speaker 3: new Building Code regulations in terms of energy efficiency, is

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Speaker 3: you're going to be adding a great deal of glazing, right,

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Speaker 3: so the performance of the glazing has got to be

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Speaker 3: very very good in order for you not to in

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Speaker 3: a sense be penalized for putting so much more glass

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Speaker 3: into your building. Right, so you're going to find that

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Speaker 3: the performance standard required of the glazing is going to

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Speaker 3: be quite high in order for you to achieve H

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Speaker 3: one compliance. Okay, yeah, maybe they'll take an attitude that

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Speaker 3: goes because are you going to still have doors between

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Speaker 3: the sunroom and your existing house?

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Speaker 7: Yeah?

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Speaker 6: Currently the house is, it's got sliding doors, it goes

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Speaker 6: out on patio.

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Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, and you want to encompass that patio and

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Speaker 3: create the sunroom there, but your your intention is not

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Speaker 3: to remove those sliding.

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Speaker 6: Doors, not to remove them.

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Speaker 3: Okay, that changes things because essentially what you're adding to

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Speaker 3: the outside isn't going to impact the thermal efficiency of

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Speaker 3: your house because you're keeping your doors there, right, So

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Speaker 3: then you're not going to have to build to as

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Speaker 3: high a standard in terms of thermal efficiency for the

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Speaker 3: sunroom as you will if you were intending to take

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Speaker 3: those doors out and include that space into your house

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Speaker 3: without means of locking it away or.

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Speaker 2: So.

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Speaker 3: That makes it a lot more simple. Worth investigating the

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Speaker 3: uPVC because there may well be some advantages. I'm not

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Speaker 3: aware of anyone who does them a new PVC. Typically

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Speaker 3: they've been always an aluminium worth investigating. Absolutely, yes, good

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Speaker 3: luck with the process. Okay, all the very best, All right,

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Speaker 3: take care, Robert, My pleasure love with them. In fact,

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Speaker 3: talking about glazing, we've got Nick Hardy Jones from Metro

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Speaker 3: Performance Glass joining us at around seven forty five this

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Speaker 3: morning to talk about exactly what we were just discussing

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Speaker 3: there with Robert, the changes to H one of the

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Speaker 3: Building Code. This talks about energy efficiency and thermal performance

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Speaker 3: of our building envelope and obviously because we like to

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Speaker 3: have windows up with a lot of glass and that

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Speaker 3: glass now has to comply. So with a bit of

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Speaker 3: a deep dive into H one compliance and glazing with

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Speaker 3: Nick Hardy Jones from Metro Performance Glass at around seven

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Speaker 3: forty five this morning, we'll take a short break. Francis

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Speaker 3: is waiting for us. We'll come to her in just

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Speaker 3: a moment. If you would like to join us, OH,

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Speaker 3: eight hundred eighty ten eighty is the number to call.

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Speaker 3: We'll have a spear line for you in just a moment.

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Speaker 3: If you'd like to join us, OH, eight hundred eighty

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Speaker 3: ten eighty is the number. To call, just off the

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Speaker 3: back of Robert's comment about going wanting to add a

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Speaker 3: thirty square meter sun room, do I need a consent?

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Speaker 3: I think you probably do for the scale of it,

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Speaker 3: and then okay, well, hopefully that'll be relatively easy and

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Speaker 3: you could probably hear sort of a sharp intake of

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Speaker 3: breath from my point of view or from me going,

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Speaker 3: it's probably not going to be And I tell you what,

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Speaker 3: just a quick opinion on my part. All of this

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Speaker 3: focus at the moment around not so much the h

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Speaker 3: one changes. I love the way in which building is

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Speaker 3: so political at the moment.

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Speaker 8: Right.

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Speaker 3: There's so much discussion and discourse around building, and around

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Speaker 3: regulations and around affordability, and around who controls the process,

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Speaker 3: et cetera, et cetera, and much of it is focused

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Speaker 3: on trying to gain efficiencies by allowing the whole debate

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Speaker 3: around the sixty square meter granny flat thing right, Submissions

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Speaker 3: ended for that would be interesting to see what some

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Speaker 3: of the feedback comes back at in the next couple

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Speaker 3: of weeks and to see what decision the government makes

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Speaker 3: so extending Schedule one of the Act, allowing for more

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Speaker 3: work to be able to be done without necessarily requiring

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Speaker 3: a building consent, all of which is the intention seems

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Speaker 3: to be to make things more affordable, to speed up

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Speaker 3: the process. But I wonder whether the focus is a

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Speaker 3: little bit misguided, that in fact, the focus should be

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Speaker 3: on changing the consenting process and can ultimately changing the

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Speaker 3: joint and several liability from councils. So counsels, I think

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Speaker 3: have a real reluctance to they have such a low

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Speaker 3: risk attitude that they're adding hurdles into the process of

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Speaker 3: getting your building consent because they end up being the

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Speaker 3: only one remaining when the building goes wrong. So maybe

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Speaker 3: it's actually our consenting process and the liability side of

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Speaker 3: it that needs attention, not playing around the edges going

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Speaker 3: oh well, maybe you can do more work without a consent.

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Speaker 3: More on that later. Oh eight hundred and eighty ten

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Speaker 3: eighty is the number to call. Francis a very good morning.

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Speaker 9: Welcome, welcod morning morning. Yes, I'm meaning about a problem

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Speaker 9: in my drive way two meters from the garage door.

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Speaker 9: I had a hole appear in the gravel driveway about

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Speaker 9: the size of a dinner plate. So I rang an

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Speaker 9: engineer in Auckland I know, and we measured it and

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Speaker 9: it goes directly about ninety centimeters in one direction and

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Speaker 9: about forty in another. And he said, put a stick

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Speaker 9: in it and check there was water in that in

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Speaker 9: the hole further in quite a long way in. So

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Speaker 9: he suggested I ring a plumber. I had a plumber

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Speaker 9: come round quite quickly actually, And they've suggested they suspect

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Speaker 9: it's a collapse soak pit in the driveway. Yes, now

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Speaker 9: I don't, and that it would be I'd have to

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Speaker 9: they have to do. They poured water down one of

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Speaker 9: the down pipes in the garret and said, yes, the

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Speaker 9: water is going there, but what do you suggest The

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Speaker 9: engineers suggested that it could be a collapsed very old pipe,

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Speaker 9: you know, from a long time ago. They have said

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Speaker 9: that it to do it correctly. If it is a

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Speaker 9: collapse soak pit, that it's going to cost a considerable

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Speaker 9: amount of money. And I'm wondering if you've got any

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Speaker 9: advice about this.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, sure, yeah. So it's a gravel driveway, so it's

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Speaker 3: not concreted, and it's a couple of meters from the house,

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Speaker 3: and when you pour water down the down pipe you

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Speaker 3: can hear it or see it gurgling at the bottom.

345
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Speaker 3: Of this whole lit.

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Speaker 9: I didn't hear the plumber's heard it.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, on and off? Yeah sure, sure, I think Francis,

348
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Speaker 3: I probably wouldn't describe it as a collapse soakage pit

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Speaker 3: because the way that soakage pits work is there a

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Speaker 3: hole in the ground filled with rubble or with scoria,

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00:20:53,895 --> 00:20:57,655
Speaker 3: and they don't typically collapse. Now, possibly it's a chamber

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Speaker 3: that's collapsed. That might have happened, but I think it's

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Speaker 3: more likely that it's an old drainage pipe that's collapsed

354
00:21:06,055 --> 00:21:10,015
Speaker 3: or jointed, and so water is flowing into there and

355
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Speaker 3: then scouring out all of the fill around it, and

356
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Speaker 3: that's what's caused effectively a sinkhole in your driveway. I

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Speaker 3: would have thought that the people to come and open

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00:21:22,815 --> 00:21:25,255
Speaker 3: all of that up is actually a drain layer. So

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Speaker 3: you'd be looking for an experienced drain layer who would

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Speaker 3: come and excavate the area, find both ends of the pipe,

361
00:21:33,055 --> 00:21:37,735
Speaker 3: remove the part that's collapsed, reconnect them, and then check

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00:21:37,815 --> 00:21:41,695
Speaker 3: that water is flowing to Do you actually have stormwater

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Speaker 3: connection as in stormwater to a council line?

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Speaker 9: No, No, this is Masterton City, Yeah no, it's.

365
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Speaker 10: Everywhere.

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Speaker 3: Okay, then I wonder whether it is like an old

367
00:22:01,215 --> 00:22:04,295
Speaker 3: chamber that has collapsed, in which case, yes, it could

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Speaker 3: be quite expensive to remove the existing one. Add in

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Speaker 3: a new chamber. Maybe go through the process of getting

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Speaker 3: it tested in terms of how much water can go

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Speaker 3: into that chamber, how much it can contain. Hopefully you

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Speaker 3: won't have to do things like investigate the ground conditions

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Speaker 3: to check the suitability for sokage. It does get a

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Speaker 3: little bit complicated after that. I think a drain layer,

375
00:22:29,975 --> 00:22:33,895
Speaker 3: like a local experienced drain layer, would be the person

376
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Speaker 3: to get They'll be the one doing the work. Now,

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Speaker 3: some plumbers are drain layers as well, but not necessarily.

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Speaker 3: So you want a drain layer, not necessarily a plumber, right.

379
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Speaker 9: Well, the the manager of the plumbing firm who does

380
00:22:51,575 --> 00:22:55,615
Speaker 9: do drain lay in they are coming on Monday morning,

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Speaker 9: and I think the city councils coming on Monday morning

382
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Speaker 9: as well, the man from the city council because there's

383
00:23:03,455 --> 00:23:07,215
Speaker 9: no drainage plan for this particular house. It's an old house.

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Speaker 11: Yeah, it's a ninety house.

385
00:23:10,335 --> 00:23:16,255
Speaker 3: Well, without wanting to be overly cautious, who invited the

386
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Speaker 3: council representative?

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Speaker 9: I did? I ran, I ran because it was three

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Speaker 9: thirty on a Friday.

389
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Speaker 3: I understand, and I didn't want this.

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Speaker 9: It's quite close to the house, yes and a half,

391
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Speaker 9: and I didn't want the side of the house clap.

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Speaker 7: Yeah.

393
00:23:38,655 --> 00:23:42,815
Speaker 3: Sure, I understand that. I'm going to put this as

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Speaker 3: delicately as I can. Is there any way to uninvite

395
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Speaker 3: the council inspector.

396
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Speaker 9: I don't know. Probably they just said I'd send someone

397
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Speaker 9: around on Monday.

398
00:24:00,975 --> 00:24:05,175
Speaker 3: Certainly, just make sure that your drainage guy is there

399
00:24:05,295 --> 00:24:08,815
Speaker 3: at the same time as the council inspector, and ideally

400
00:24:08,855 --> 00:24:11,855
Speaker 3: a little bit beforehand. The reason I say this is

401
00:24:12,015 --> 00:24:15,255
Speaker 3: that what I don't want to see happen is that

402
00:24:15,615 --> 00:24:18,375
Speaker 3: council comes along and then they look at it and

403
00:24:18,375 --> 00:24:21,455
Speaker 3: they say, Okay, look, I'm really sorry, Francis, but we're

404
00:24:21,455 --> 00:24:23,615
Speaker 3: going to have to make an official note about this

405
00:24:23,735 --> 00:24:26,735
Speaker 3: on the file. We're going to require you to get

406
00:24:27,455 --> 00:24:30,695
Speaker 3: a building consent to cover the drainage work. We need

407
00:24:30,775 --> 00:24:33,975
Speaker 3: you to upgrade your stormwater connection, et cetera, et cetera,

408
00:24:34,295 --> 00:24:37,255
Speaker 3: and the job becomes a much bigger job than repairing

409
00:24:37,255 --> 00:24:40,855
Speaker 3: a broken pipe. Right, So I'm trying to ensure that

410
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Speaker 3: that doesn't happen. So between you and I as if

411
00:24:46,455 --> 00:24:49,295
Speaker 3: no one was listening, I would probably bring council on

412
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Speaker 3: Monday and say, look, actually the matter is being handled

413
00:24:55,215 --> 00:24:58,215
Speaker 3: by a registered drain layer. There's no need for you

414
00:24:58,255 --> 00:25:00,575
Speaker 3: to come out. Thank you very much for offering to

415
00:25:00,575 --> 00:25:03,415
Speaker 3: come out and try that, and then get your drain

416
00:25:03,495 --> 00:25:05,815
Speaker 3: layer to look at it, see whether they come up

417
00:25:05,815 --> 00:25:09,455
Speaker 3: with a good, practical, sensible solution for you, and then

418
00:25:09,535 --> 00:25:13,455
Speaker 3: go from there. But I think not saying that it

419
00:25:13,455 --> 00:25:17,055
Speaker 3: will get into a much bigger job, but it's I

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Speaker 3: think you can handle this with a suitable contractor.

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Speaker 9: Right, Thank you very much. That was my brother's a

422
00:25:25,655 --> 00:25:30,455
Speaker 9: mechanical engineer, and I rang him and he's done building

423
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Speaker 9: all around the world and he gave me the advice

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Speaker 9: to ring a plumber and drain lab. But I had

425
00:25:36,935 --> 00:25:40,295
Speaker 9: already rang. I rang the council. Yeah, to give a

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Speaker 9: drainage plan. That's all I wanted.

427
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Speaker 3: Yes, here, look, and to be fair, you know a

428
00:25:47,895 --> 00:25:52,295
Speaker 3: lot of old council records, well there was a period

429
00:25:52,335 --> 00:25:54,455
Speaker 3: of time where well you know, you've had to submit

430
00:25:54,495 --> 00:25:57,495
Speaker 3: as built plans for quite a while. So if you

431
00:25:57,535 --> 00:25:59,655
Speaker 3: did want to find out what the council have, you

432
00:25:59,695 --> 00:26:04,895
Speaker 3: could request the property bag and the council file from council,

433
00:26:05,695 --> 00:26:07,615
Speaker 3: they might be to do that for you or get

434
00:26:07,615 --> 00:26:10,175
Speaker 3: the drain layer to do that on your behalf. See

435
00:26:10,175 --> 00:26:12,975
Speaker 3: how you go there, let us know how you get on. Francis.

436
00:26:13,055 --> 00:26:14,415
Speaker 3: I'm always curious with these ones.

437
00:26:14,735 --> 00:26:17,335
Speaker 9: Might chauple of weeks because I've got a few medical

438
00:26:18,575 --> 00:26:19,175
Speaker 9: We'll get back.

439
00:26:19,495 --> 00:26:19,895
Speaker 3: Please do.

440
00:26:20,015 --> 00:26:22,135
Speaker 9: Thank you very very much, lovely to talk to you.

441
00:26:22,455 --> 00:26:29,175
Speaker 3: All the very best, Take care, God bless Francis. I

442
00:26:29,295 --> 00:26:32,335
Speaker 3: will explain my reluctance to have council involved in a moment.

443
00:26:32,535 --> 00:26:35,135
Speaker 3: It is six thirty six eight hundred eighty ten eighty

444
00:26:35,215 --> 00:26:37,135
Speaker 3: is the number to call if you've got a project

445
00:26:37,175 --> 00:26:40,295
Speaker 3: on it gives a call eight hundred eighty ten eighty

446
00:26:40,975 --> 00:26:43,655
Speaker 3: your new books, he'd be quick text before we chat

447
00:26:43,655 --> 00:26:45,895
Speaker 3: with Christine. Hey Pete, I'm a builder in a smaller

448
00:26:46,055 --> 00:26:51,855
Speaker 3: territorial authority, but I build out but build access for tas,

449
00:26:51,895 --> 00:26:56,255
Speaker 3: so he's got access to four territorial authorities local councils. Basically,

450
00:26:56,615 --> 00:26:59,855
Speaker 3: over fourteen years, I've built over five hundred houses and

451
00:26:59,895 --> 00:27:04,095
Speaker 3: the consent process is, as you describe it, an absolute nightmare.

452
00:27:04,175 --> 00:27:06,775
Speaker 3: It becomes a game like a school teacher checking for

453
00:27:06,815 --> 00:27:10,855
Speaker 3: spelling mistakes. They're so scared of what if and looking

454
00:27:10,895 --> 00:27:13,855
Speaker 3: for the elephant that is not in the room, all

455
00:27:13,895 --> 00:27:16,495
Speaker 3: at the cost or frustration of the end user. And

456
00:27:16,535 --> 00:27:18,575
Speaker 3: how or where do you go to complain about their

457
00:27:18,575 --> 00:27:21,295
Speaker 3: pedantic questions. I could write a book on the subject,

458
00:27:21,815 --> 00:27:24,535
Speaker 3: and look, he's you know, even if you try and

459
00:27:24,535 --> 00:27:27,855
Speaker 3: take a more nuanced or balance view, the texture is

460
00:27:28,095 --> 00:27:31,775
Speaker 3: probably right. And you'd have to say, if you've built

461
00:27:31,815 --> 00:27:34,575
Speaker 3: five hundred houses and dealt with five hundred building consents,

462
00:27:34,615 --> 00:27:37,575
Speaker 3: I can imagine you'd have a long list of those questions.

463
00:27:37,695 --> 00:27:40,455
Speaker 3: And you know, I'm always reluctant to be fair to

464
00:27:42,295 --> 00:27:46,655
Speaker 3: you know, poke at councils because it seems like they're

465
00:27:46,855 --> 00:27:49,255
Speaker 3: a big, slow moving target and quite easy to sort

466
00:27:49,255 --> 00:27:51,095
Speaker 3: of put the boot into. And that's not my intention.

467
00:27:52,295 --> 00:27:55,575
Speaker 3: But you also have to listen to the end user,

468
00:27:55,735 --> 00:28:00,895
Speaker 3: ie builders, developers, people involved in the construction sector, and

469
00:28:01,015 --> 00:28:06,055
Speaker 3: listen to their constant frustration at how slow the process is,

470
00:28:06,375 --> 00:28:11,575
Speaker 3: how often pedantic it is, how unable they are to

471
00:28:11,615 --> 00:28:15,095
Speaker 3: get sensible responses to reasonable requests, et cetera, et cetera,

472
00:28:15,175 --> 00:28:18,215
Speaker 3: et cetera, And go all of the government's focus on

473
00:28:18,335 --> 00:28:23,175
Speaker 3: sort of freeing up, or making housing affordability more efficiency,

474
00:28:23,175 --> 00:28:26,975
Speaker 3: et cetera. Is focusing on changing bits of legislation, but

475
00:28:27,175 --> 00:28:30,575
Speaker 3: maybe it should focus on the actual consenting process. And

476
00:28:31,535 --> 00:28:36,975
Speaker 3: for good reason, counsel are extremely reluctant to allow anything

477
00:28:37,015 --> 00:28:39,135
Speaker 3: that might come back and basically bite them in the

478
00:28:39,215 --> 00:28:42,255
Speaker 3: ass to be built because they end up being the

479
00:28:42,295 --> 00:28:45,255
Speaker 3: only one left over when you know the developer has

480
00:28:45,295 --> 00:28:49,335
Speaker 3: gone from being developer twenty twenty two corporation to develop

481
00:28:49,335 --> 00:28:53,735
Speaker 3: a twenty twenty three corporation, when building firms disappear, et cetera,

482
00:28:53,775 --> 00:28:57,415
Speaker 3: et cetera. Now, part of the process of the LBPS

483
00:28:57,495 --> 00:29:00,215
Speaker 3: thing was that it was always individuals, right, so you

484
00:29:00,255 --> 00:29:02,935
Speaker 3: could pursue an individual if I do a record of works,

485
00:29:02,975 --> 00:29:06,255
Speaker 3: it's my number that goes on there, and that's not

486
00:29:06,455 --> 00:29:09,055
Speaker 3: my company. I can fold my company, but I'm still

487
00:29:09,095 --> 00:29:12,935
Speaker 3: personally liable as an LBP. It's still on my license.

488
00:29:14,375 --> 00:29:18,415
Speaker 3: But maybe all of this focus on efficiency and that

489
00:29:18,455 --> 00:29:21,735
Speaker 3: should actually be a focus on liability. This whole thing

490
00:29:21,775 --> 00:29:23,575
Speaker 3: about joint and several. In fact, we're going to have

491
00:29:23,615 --> 00:29:27,655
Speaker 3: Mike Thornton, who's a lawyer specializing and building contract law

492
00:29:28,175 --> 00:29:30,655
Speaker 3: with us again in the next couple of weeks. We

493
00:29:30,655 --> 00:29:33,335
Speaker 3: should talk about joint and several liability and is there

494
00:29:33,375 --> 00:29:37,295
Speaker 3: a better model that perhaps allows more responsibility to be

495
00:29:37,415 --> 00:29:40,575
Speaker 3: taken by the contractors for the quality of the work,

496
00:29:40,695 --> 00:29:44,975
Speaker 3: but backed up by insurance. If you don't have insurance

497
00:29:45,135 --> 00:29:49,855
Speaker 3: public liability insurance, contractor insurance, insurance, etc. Then you won't

498
00:29:49,855 --> 00:29:51,895
Speaker 3: be able to build. You just have to have it

499
00:29:52,015 --> 00:29:55,295
Speaker 3: and then any issues with quality going forward come back

500
00:29:55,335 --> 00:29:59,615
Speaker 3: to the insurer. Seems like a more straightforward and it's

501
00:29:59,735 --> 00:30:01,975
Speaker 3: to be fair. This is how they work overseas in

502
00:30:02,095 --> 00:30:05,015
Speaker 3: a large number of countries that I'm aware of. We

503
00:30:05,015 --> 00:30:07,375
Speaker 3: can talk about that too. Eighty ten eighty is the

504
00:30:07,415 --> 00:30:08,535
Speaker 3: number to call Christine.

505
00:30:08,575 --> 00:30:13,015
Speaker 12: Good morning, Good morning, And that's what I want to

506
00:30:13,015 --> 00:30:13,455
Speaker 12: talk about.

507
00:30:13,455 --> 00:30:15,455
Speaker 11: Consents.

508
00:30:16,455 --> 00:30:20,135
Speaker 12: I'm just getting a job done. At the moment. The

509
00:30:20,295 --> 00:30:24,255
Speaker 12: draftsman has done all the plans that the builder has done,

510
00:30:24,255 --> 00:30:27,495
Speaker 12: It drawn up a thing. Now. The thing what I'm

511
00:30:27,535 --> 00:30:30,855
Speaker 12: doing is I've got about about one hundred year old villa.

512
00:30:31,815 --> 00:30:36,575
Speaker 12: I'm closing in the return verandah and that's going to

513
00:30:36,575 --> 00:30:38,935
Speaker 12: become an en suite to the master droom.

514
00:30:39,055 --> 00:30:39,255
Speaker 8: Yep.

515
00:30:40,415 --> 00:30:44,015
Speaker 12: Now, the draftsman told me that I don't need a

516
00:30:44,015 --> 00:30:48,295
Speaker 12: building consent. I need a plumbing consent. The builder tells

517
00:30:48,375 --> 00:30:51,735
Speaker 12: me I need a building consent, and I said to him, well,

518
00:30:51,775 --> 00:30:56,655
Speaker 12: the draftsman said I didn't. And now these two guys

519
00:30:57,415 --> 00:31:00,695
Speaker 12: have worked together before on my house too, when I

520
00:31:01,215 --> 00:31:03,615
Speaker 12: had completely gutted when I bought it about five or

521
00:31:03,615 --> 00:31:06,175
Speaker 12: six years ago, and the builder was telling me he

522
00:31:06,455 --> 00:31:09,255
Speaker 12: now works with the draftsman because he's a really good guy.

523
00:31:09,295 --> 00:31:10,415
Speaker 12: They've been working.

524
00:31:10,135 --> 00:31:10,895
Speaker 3: All that's great.

525
00:31:11,935 --> 00:31:14,055
Speaker 12: I do not want to go to council and ask

526
00:31:14,135 --> 00:31:17,055
Speaker 12: them what's the situation.

527
00:31:17,775 --> 00:31:21,775
Speaker 3: I would have thought that it definitely requires a building consent, right,

528
00:31:21,935 --> 00:31:25,655
Speaker 3: not just a plumbing consent. And because it's.

529
00:31:25,535 --> 00:31:29,215
Speaker 12: Not going outside the original parameters of the house.

530
00:31:30,415 --> 00:31:37,895
Speaker 3: True, but you are impacting on You're impacting well, it

531
00:31:37,935 --> 00:31:44,415
Speaker 3: impacts on h one because you're you're exterior cladding and

532
00:31:44,455 --> 00:31:49,375
Speaker 3: your exterior envelope changes, right, So it's that's a building issue.

533
00:31:49,575 --> 00:31:55,455
Speaker 12: You're putting away, we're using the original weather boards, we're

534
00:31:55,535 --> 00:31:57,735
Speaker 12: reusing them on the outside of the building.

535
00:31:57,535 --> 00:32:00,255
Speaker 3: Yep, so where they are at the moment you're taking

536
00:32:00,295 --> 00:32:03,375
Speaker 3: them off and flipping them to the outside, but you're

537
00:32:03,375 --> 00:32:06,375
Speaker 3: still installing new joinery. You are changing the envelope, so

538
00:32:06,535 --> 00:32:10,175
Speaker 3: you're changing the footprint of the house. I would have

539
00:32:10,215 --> 00:32:14,495
Speaker 3: thought ninety nine percent sure that that triggers a requirement

540
00:32:14,535 --> 00:32:15,495
Speaker 3: for a building consent.

541
00:32:16,695 --> 00:32:19,095
Speaker 12: That's all right, I just wanted to, you know, to

542
00:32:19,095 --> 00:32:19,695
Speaker 12: get somebody else.

543
00:32:19,895 --> 00:32:22,895
Speaker 3: It would be really interesting to get something in writing

544
00:32:23,015 --> 00:32:26,015
Speaker 3: from the drafts person as to why they felt that

545
00:32:26,055 --> 00:32:29,335
Speaker 3: work could be done without essentially under Schedule one of

546
00:32:29,375 --> 00:32:31,575
Speaker 3: the Building Act, which allows for some building work to

547
00:32:31,615 --> 00:32:36,975
Speaker 3: be done without necessarily requiring a building consent. And also

548
00:32:37,055 --> 00:32:39,655
Speaker 3: what type of shower are you installing? What type of

549
00:32:39,655 --> 00:32:41,255
Speaker 3: shower system do you want to install?

550
00:32:42,495 --> 00:32:45,175
Speaker 12: Oh, just a normal box shower.

551
00:32:44,855 --> 00:32:47,975
Speaker 3: Okay, prefabricated one. You're not going to do waterproofing and tiles?

552
00:32:48,415 --> 00:32:49,135
Speaker 12: No, no, no, no.

553
00:32:49,615 --> 00:32:52,135
Speaker 3: Because often that triggers a requirement for a building consent

554
00:32:52,175 --> 00:32:54,815
Speaker 3: because it's around the waterproofing system that goes into it.

555
00:32:59,655 --> 00:33:04,215
Speaker 3: I would have thought that, because effectively you're increasing the

556
00:33:04,295 --> 00:33:08,055
Speaker 3: habitable space of your house by taking an outdoor space

557
00:33:08,575 --> 00:33:11,935
Speaker 3: i e. The verandah and making that habitable space, that

558
00:33:11,975 --> 00:33:15,415
Speaker 3: would trigger the requirement for a building consent, regardless of

559
00:33:15,455 --> 00:33:19,735
Speaker 3: the amount of space that you're taking. But again, you know,

560
00:33:19,815 --> 00:33:23,895
Speaker 3: if the draft person is convinced that you don't need

561
00:33:23,935 --> 00:33:27,335
Speaker 3: one you'd want him to have, you know, chapter and

562
00:33:27,415 --> 00:33:30,255
Speaker 3: verse here is schedule one of the Act, and here

563
00:33:30,415 --> 00:33:34,295
Speaker 3: is the reasons that you don't and I just can't

564
00:33:34,335 --> 00:33:35,055
Speaker 3: see it somehow.

565
00:33:36,495 --> 00:33:39,135
Speaker 12: No, No, it's just that I was confused. You know,

566
00:33:39,655 --> 00:33:41,175
Speaker 12: I'm not the professional here.

567
00:33:43,695 --> 00:33:45,135
Speaker 3: And I tell you what the other thing. And it

568
00:33:45,695 --> 00:33:47,815
Speaker 3: was a comment from Robert, our first caller as well.

569
00:33:47,815 --> 00:33:51,375
Speaker 3: He said, you know, I just want to make sure

570
00:33:51,375 --> 00:33:53,775
Speaker 3: I get everything done well because I don't want counsel

571
00:33:53,855 --> 00:33:55,735
Speaker 3: to come and inspect it later on. The chances of

572
00:33:55,735 --> 00:33:59,215
Speaker 3: council coming and looking at it very very small. But

573
00:33:59,335 --> 00:34:02,335
Speaker 3: what I've found doing sort of pre purchase inspections for

574
00:34:02,415 --> 00:34:06,375
Speaker 3: people is that often it's the insurer and the bank

575
00:34:06,495 --> 00:34:11,855
Speaker 3: and that that get really really cautious about unconsented work. Right,

576
00:34:11,935 --> 00:34:13,815
Speaker 3: So you know, if you go ahead and do a

577
00:34:13,895 --> 00:34:15,855
Speaker 3: job and you think I don't really need a consent

578
00:34:15,895 --> 00:34:17,975
Speaker 3: so I won't get one, turns out you did need one,

579
00:34:18,295 --> 00:34:20,535
Speaker 3: and then you put the house on the market. Later on,

580
00:34:20,695 --> 00:34:24,455
Speaker 3: someone doing their due diligence on the property may identify

581
00:34:24,495 --> 00:34:27,015
Speaker 3: the fact that that work actually did require a consent.

582
00:34:27,335 --> 00:34:30,055
Speaker 3: Then you don't have one. Then trying to get a

583
00:34:30,535 --> 00:34:34,495
Speaker 3: CoA certificate of acceptance. It's a lot of work. The

584
00:34:34,535 --> 00:34:37,615
Speaker 3: burden of proof now on coas is almost as high

585
00:34:37,615 --> 00:34:41,055
Speaker 3: as a building consent. You are better off just getting

586
00:34:41,095 --> 00:34:43,575
Speaker 3: the building consent. And again this kind of circles back

587
00:34:43,575 --> 00:34:46,055
Speaker 3: to my point, which is maybe we need to look

588
00:34:46,095 --> 00:34:49,255
Speaker 3: at how we do the building consent process to take

589
00:34:49,615 --> 00:34:51,975
Speaker 3: to de risk it from a council point of view

590
00:34:52,015 --> 00:34:54,415
Speaker 3: that allows it to be you know, yours is the

591
00:34:54,455 --> 00:34:55,335
Speaker 3: classic example.

592
00:34:55,415 --> 00:34:55,615
Speaker 10: Right.

593
00:34:56,015 --> 00:34:59,535
Speaker 3: You could go to a designer who's registered. They're an

594
00:34:59,615 --> 00:35:02,735
Speaker 3: LBP obviously and they've got a design license. You're going

595
00:35:02,775 --> 00:35:05,855
Speaker 3: to work with a contractor who's also a licensed building

596
00:35:05,855 --> 00:35:09,855
Speaker 3: practition Your designer should have insurance for their work. Your

597
00:35:10,015 --> 00:35:13,255
Speaker 3: builder should ideally have insurance for their work, although it's

598
00:35:13,255 --> 00:35:17,335
Speaker 3: not mandatory. And you could go ahead and submit to

599
00:35:17,415 --> 00:35:20,415
Speaker 3: counsel a set of plans, essentially saying this is what

600
00:35:20,455 --> 00:35:23,055
Speaker 3: I intend to do, and then go ahead and build it.

601
00:35:23,175 --> 00:35:25,095
Speaker 3: And then if there's a problem with it because you've

602
00:35:25,095 --> 00:35:28,575
Speaker 3: got insurance, and someone says in five years time you've

603
00:35:28,575 --> 00:35:30,495
Speaker 3: sold the house and oh, actually i've got a leak

604
00:35:30,495 --> 00:35:33,055
Speaker 3: in the corner. I wonder if it's poor workmanship. Yes

605
00:35:33,095 --> 00:35:36,815
Speaker 3: it is, Oh well, that's okay because that contractor had

606
00:35:36,895 --> 00:35:39,775
Speaker 3: insurance and I'm going to use the insurance to rectify it.

607
00:35:39,935 --> 00:35:42,175
Speaker 3: Counsel don't have anything to do deal with it. That's

608
00:35:42,415 --> 00:35:44,695
Speaker 3: I wonder whether that's kind of where we should be heading.

609
00:35:45,935 --> 00:35:49,615
Speaker 12: That's not going to make you because you can be saying, oh, well,

610
00:35:49,615 --> 00:35:55,455
Speaker 12: you can have like a shed door or an outdoor room.

611
00:35:55,855 --> 00:35:57,415
Speaker 12: You can build it to such and say, and you

612
00:35:57,415 --> 00:36:00,015
Speaker 12: don't need a building permit, and they're.

613
00:35:59,935 --> 00:36:02,175
Speaker 3: Right there, But then see what happens there is then

614
00:36:02,215 --> 00:36:04,295
Speaker 3: there's a whole lot of ifs and butts. Right, so

615
00:36:04,775 --> 00:36:07,655
Speaker 3: it's not attached to the main house, which yours is

616
00:36:07,655 --> 00:36:09,855
Speaker 3: going to be, it's got to be a certain distance

617
00:36:09,855 --> 00:36:11,855
Speaker 3: from the boundary, it's only to be a certain height.

618
00:36:11,895 --> 00:36:14,695
Speaker 3: It's got to be low risk. Now, what you're doing

619
00:36:14,815 --> 00:36:19,135
Speaker 3: is increasing the footprint of your house, albeit underneath an

620
00:36:19,135 --> 00:36:21,375
Speaker 3: existing roof. But you want to make sure that there's

621
00:36:21,495 --> 00:36:23,855
Speaker 3: insulation in the ceiling, there's going to be insulation in

622
00:36:23,895 --> 00:36:25,535
Speaker 3: the walls. You're going to want to make sure that

623
00:36:25,575 --> 00:36:30,055
Speaker 3: the joinery is right, that by you're not inadvertently doing

624
00:36:30,055 --> 00:36:32,775
Speaker 3: something that's going to impact the rest of your house.

625
00:36:32,855 --> 00:36:35,415
Speaker 3: And that's that whole thing about it being connected. If

626
00:36:35,455 --> 00:36:37,295
Speaker 3: it was a ten square me to sleep out in

627
00:36:37,295 --> 00:36:40,135
Speaker 3: the backyard that if it wasn't great, it's low risk.

628
00:36:40,255 --> 00:36:43,135
Speaker 3: Well that's different, but you know, because it's attached to

629
00:36:43,135 --> 00:36:45,655
Speaker 3: the house. I think. So it'd be interesting to again

630
00:36:45,735 --> 00:36:47,415
Speaker 3: to know how you get on if you go back

631
00:36:47,415 --> 00:36:50,495
Speaker 3: to your designer. But I'm pretty sure that work requires

632
00:36:50,495 --> 00:36:54,255
Speaker 3: a building consent. Yeah, lovely to talk. Thank you very

633
00:36:54,335 --> 00:36:56,655
Speaker 3: much and good luck with the process. Take care bother,

634
00:36:56,735 --> 00:36:58,855
Speaker 3: thank you and New Stalks CB will take a short break.

635
00:36:58,895 --> 00:37:02,455
Speaker 3: It is ten minutes away from seven your Newstalks CB.

636
00:37:02,535 --> 00:37:04,695
Speaker 3: If you've got a question, oh eight hundred eighty ten

637
00:37:04,855 --> 00:37:08,495
Speaker 3: eighty is the number to call. Quick response from a

638
00:37:08,615 --> 00:37:15,535
Speaker 3: regular correspondent who I really appreciate his input, actually, Craig morning. Yes,

639
00:37:15,775 --> 00:37:18,495
Speaker 3: draftsman needs to be an LBP for design yep. And

640
00:37:18,655 --> 00:37:21,455
Speaker 3: yes consent needed for the building work and the plumbing.

641
00:37:21,535 --> 00:37:23,455
Speaker 3: So both the building and the plumbing work. This is

642
00:37:23,815 --> 00:37:29,895
Speaker 3: with regard to Christine's discussion about essentially inclosing a return

643
00:37:30,055 --> 00:37:34,095
Speaker 3: VERANDAH on an existing building on an old villa and

644
00:37:34,175 --> 00:37:39,335
Speaker 3: adding an on suite into that space. Some advice was

645
00:37:39,375 --> 00:37:42,415
Speaker 3: that it didn't require a building consent. My feeling is

646
00:37:42,455 --> 00:37:45,495
Speaker 3: it definitely does, and that's backed up by Craig who

647
00:37:45,535 --> 00:37:48,455
Speaker 3: works in this field as well. So really appreciate that

648
00:37:50,375 --> 00:37:54,735
Speaker 3: council says check LBP. Council says that they need to

649
00:37:54,815 --> 00:37:56,735
Speaker 3: check the LBP. So should we be able to check

650
00:37:56,735 --> 00:38:01,895
Speaker 3: the qualifications of the council staff assessing our application? Possibly

651
00:38:01,975 --> 00:38:07,735
Speaker 3: a little bit unkind But what is the industry doing

652
00:38:07,775 --> 00:38:10,935
Speaker 3: about this building consent nonsense? Don't be scared to answer Pete, Well,

653
00:38:11,455 --> 00:38:17,215
Speaker 3: I hear what you're saying. I think we need controls

654
00:38:17,335 --> 00:38:20,335
Speaker 3: right as my opinion, we need controls over what's built.

655
00:38:20,375 --> 00:38:23,415
Speaker 3: We need to protect the safety of people. We also

656
00:38:23,455 --> 00:38:26,495
Speaker 3: need to protect the investment of people. And I think

657
00:38:26,495 --> 00:38:29,415
Speaker 3: we've got a little bit of a short memory when

658
00:38:29,455 --> 00:38:33,655
Speaker 3: it comes to the impact of bad building performance on

659
00:38:33,895 --> 00:38:39,375
Speaker 3: the lives of Joe public basically. And there's still people

660
00:38:39,655 --> 00:38:43,215
Speaker 3: who have had their lives turned upside down, their financial

661
00:38:43,215 --> 00:38:48,895
Speaker 3: lives in particular turned upside down by leaky buildings, seeing

662
00:38:48,975 --> 00:38:54,575
Speaker 3: their largest asset deteriorate in value with no redress, or

663
00:38:54,655 --> 00:38:58,735
Speaker 3: if there is redress. It's incredibly complicated and takes an

664
00:38:58,855 --> 00:39:03,615
Speaker 3: enormously long time when you know something that they thought

665
00:39:03,695 --> 00:39:05,775
Speaker 3: was going to be their biggest asset in their life

666
00:39:06,375 --> 00:39:10,095
Speaker 3: really starts turning to mush around them. So you know,

667
00:39:10,135 --> 00:39:12,615
Speaker 3: think back to that. That's why we have building controls

668
00:39:12,655 --> 00:39:15,775
Speaker 3: in place. But typically the way it works is that

669
00:39:15,815 --> 00:39:18,815
Speaker 3: all of the responsibility for that building ends up being

670
00:39:18,895 --> 00:39:23,695
Speaker 3: primarily on councils because council are, to quote and often

671
00:39:23,815 --> 00:39:27,895
Speaker 3: use phrase, the last man standing. The developer's gone, the

672
00:39:27,935 --> 00:39:31,335
Speaker 3: builder's gone, the contractors are gone, the companies that supplied

673
00:39:31,335 --> 00:39:34,015
Speaker 3: the product might even have gone, and councils the last

674
00:39:34,015 --> 00:39:35,895
Speaker 3: one standing. And people go, well, you gave it a

675
00:39:35,895 --> 00:39:38,935
Speaker 3: building consent, therefore you're responsible for it. So is there

676
00:39:38,975 --> 00:39:43,055
Speaker 3: a better model? Lots of discussion in that area around

677
00:39:43,695 --> 00:39:48,335
Speaker 3: more extensive use of insurance to manage risk in a sense,

678
00:39:48,455 --> 00:39:53,095
Speaker 3: or to ensure not ensure compliance, but to ensure that

679
00:39:53,135 --> 00:39:55,775
Speaker 3: if something goes wrong, someone's going to be there to

680
00:39:55,775 --> 00:39:58,495
Speaker 3: pick up the pieces, and should that be the insurer. Now,

681
00:39:58,495 --> 00:40:00,735
Speaker 3: there'll be a whole lot of criticism about that, and

682
00:40:00,735 --> 00:40:05,215
Speaker 3: it's putting money into the pockets of multinationals blah blah blah,

683
00:40:05,255 --> 00:40:08,455
Speaker 3: but ultimately it may well be a better way forward.

684
00:40:08,495 --> 00:40:10,455
Speaker 3: So we could talk about that in the next hour

685
00:40:10,455 --> 00:40:12,935
Speaker 3: of the show as well. We've got news sport and

686
00:40:12,975 --> 00:40:14,415
Speaker 3: we're the top of the art. Then we'll come back

687
00:40:14,455 --> 00:40:17,015
Speaker 3: with your calls. Oh eight hundred and eighty ten eight.

688
00:40:17,055 --> 00:40:19,415
Speaker 3: You can call us now back after the news.

689
00:40:20,655 --> 00:40:23,215
Speaker 2: Scared today, build.

690
00:40:23,015 --> 00:40:23,695
Speaker 5: The board.

691
00:40:26,535 --> 00:40:28,375
Speaker 3: Your news talks there be welcome back to the show.

692
00:40:28,535 --> 00:40:31,375
Speaker 3: Oh eight hundred eighty ten eighty is the number to call.

693
00:40:31,415 --> 00:40:33,095
Speaker 3: If you've got a question of the building nature. It

694
00:40:33,095 --> 00:40:37,055
Speaker 3: will rip into it. Lots of texts around councils. We'll

695
00:40:37,055 --> 00:40:39,455
Speaker 3: get into those in just a moment. Pete, good morning

696
00:40:39,495 --> 00:40:41,215
Speaker 3: to you.

697
00:40:41,775 --> 00:40:42,055
Speaker 8: Pete.

698
00:40:42,135 --> 00:40:43,975
Speaker 3: How you doing good.

699
00:40:44,015 --> 00:40:46,455
Speaker 13: I've got a Beasily home. They're pretty stocked staying it.

700
00:40:46,895 --> 00:40:51,655
Speaker 13: I'm just thinking about replacing the a bath. It's yeah,

701
00:40:51,735 --> 00:40:55,415
Speaker 13: replacing the barth the basin and to use it. And

702
00:40:55,455 --> 00:40:58,215
Speaker 13: it's got serotin around and now there's no permanent need

703
00:40:58,295 --> 00:40:59,015
Speaker 13: for them, is there?

704
00:41:00,295 --> 00:41:03,495
Speaker 3: Hang on, you're talking about what if you're going to

705
00:41:03,575 --> 00:41:06,495
Speaker 3: rip out the existing serotone that's around a bath? Is

706
00:41:06,535 --> 00:41:11,055
Speaker 3: a shower over the bath that sort of thing? Yeah, yeah,

707
00:41:11,095 --> 00:41:13,495
Speaker 3: and what do you intend to replace it with.

708
00:41:15,055 --> 00:41:15,495
Speaker 9: The same?

709
00:41:15,895 --> 00:41:20,095
Speaker 3: Okay, then no, that's like for like, there's no requirement

710
00:41:20,135 --> 00:41:22,775
Speaker 3: to get a building consent to do any of that work.

711
00:41:23,855 --> 00:41:27,135
Speaker 13: What about if you I'll get a bit older and

712
00:41:27,175 --> 00:41:28,735
Speaker 13: I say I want to get rid of the bar,

713
00:41:29,575 --> 00:41:33,535
Speaker 13: still use the same plumbing that's there and put a

714
00:41:33,575 --> 00:41:36,775
Speaker 13: shower box and just put a vanity in. But just

715
00:41:36,775 --> 00:41:38,935
Speaker 13: basically getting rid of the bar yep, and putting a

716
00:41:39,375 --> 00:41:40,415
Speaker 13: box and if.

717
00:41:40,335 --> 00:41:43,855
Speaker 3: It's a pre formed shower so tray and liner that

718
00:41:43,975 --> 00:41:46,175
Speaker 3: type of thing. You can also do that without this

719
00:41:46,415 --> 00:41:51,655
Speaker 3: without requiring a building consent. Typically waterproof showers as in

720
00:41:51,815 --> 00:41:54,975
Speaker 3: you know, waterproofing with tiles over it. That's what triggers

721
00:41:55,015 --> 00:41:57,175
Speaker 3: a requirement for a building consent. So if you stay

722
00:41:57,175 --> 00:41:59,095
Speaker 3: away from that, you don't need a building consent.

723
00:42:00,495 --> 00:42:02,455
Speaker 13: That's what it was. Basically the bath plumy be the

724
00:42:02,495 --> 00:42:06,935
Speaker 13: same one am now. So basically the play is a

725
00:42:07,095 --> 00:42:09,135
Speaker 13: big costs on doing plumbing side just going to leave

726
00:42:09,135 --> 00:42:10,055
Speaker 13: all the plumbing the same.

727
00:42:12,255 --> 00:42:14,455
Speaker 3: And to be fair, I did a project like that

728
00:42:14,535 --> 00:42:18,415
Speaker 3: back in twenty twenty, checked all the REGs and absolutely

729
00:42:18,495 --> 00:42:21,135
Speaker 3: I didn't change the footprint. I didn't change the number

730
00:42:21,175 --> 00:42:25,575
Speaker 3: of fittings inside the bathroom. I simply removed like yours.

731
00:42:25,655 --> 00:42:28,295
Speaker 3: It was a nineteen sixties property. I pulled out the

732
00:42:28,335 --> 00:42:32,255
Speaker 3: bath and where the existing plumbing was that's where I

733
00:42:32,295 --> 00:42:36,015
Speaker 3: put in a preform shower, so you know, PVC or

734
00:42:36,055 --> 00:42:40,655
Speaker 3: whatever it is, fiberglass tray and liner and kit set

735
00:42:40,735 --> 00:42:45,295
Speaker 3: doors into the same position. Replaced the toilet, but again

736
00:42:45,415 --> 00:42:47,975
Speaker 3: it already had a sanitary fitting right there. Didn't change

737
00:42:47,975 --> 00:42:51,335
Speaker 3: any of the actual waste pipe, and changed the vanity,

738
00:42:51,415 --> 00:42:53,855
Speaker 3: but the vanity went in pretty much the same position

739
00:42:53,895 --> 00:42:56,135
Speaker 3: as the old one. So none of that requires a

740
00:42:56,135 --> 00:42:59,175
Speaker 3: building consent. Keep records of it because people like to

741
00:42:59,255 --> 00:43:02,415
Speaker 3: see what you did. So you know, if you get

742
00:43:02,455 --> 00:43:04,895
Speaker 3: something from the plumber to say, hey, look I've done

743
00:43:04,935 --> 00:43:07,095
Speaker 3: the work and I certify it. You get something maybe

744
00:43:07,135 --> 00:43:09,895
Speaker 3: from the builder who does the work just saying look

745
00:43:09,935 --> 00:43:13,175
Speaker 3: I've done it in accordance with the code. And then

746
00:43:13,375 --> 00:43:15,855
Speaker 3: if you sell the house later on, someone goes, oh,

747
00:43:15,895 --> 00:43:18,495
Speaker 3: well that's not the original bathroom. Is it done properly?

748
00:43:18,655 --> 00:43:22,015
Speaker 3: You've got a little bit of documentation that says it's

749
00:43:22,015 --> 00:43:31,215
Speaker 3: done correctly. Absolutely, yep, exactly that. Go for it, and

750
00:43:31,295 --> 00:43:38,495
Speaker 3: make sure you add extraction, decent extraction into the Yeah. Excellent,

751
00:43:38,535 --> 00:43:41,295
Speaker 3: all right, all the best, Thanks Pete, Take care Leicester.

752
00:43:41,535 --> 00:43:43,255
Speaker 3: Let's talk about consents.

753
00:43:43,975 --> 00:43:50,135
Speaker 11: Yeah, hey, I haven't see you for a couple of weeks.

754
00:43:50,135 --> 00:43:50,775
Speaker 1: But the.

755
00:43:53,375 --> 00:43:56,855
Speaker 11: Yeah, just taking that process through, and particularly with the

756
00:43:56,895 --> 00:44:02,255
Speaker 11: insurance idea, So you can't insure against the criminal way sure,

757
00:44:02,295 --> 00:44:04,935
Speaker 11: look of the plane. Okay, so who's going to take

758
00:44:05,015 --> 00:44:07,095
Speaker 11: out the insurance? Is the are going to take out

759
00:44:07,135 --> 00:44:10,135
Speaker 11: insurance to get against doing bad work, or as the

760
00:44:10,175 --> 00:44:13,335
Speaker 11: homelownder going to take out insurance against getting a bad builder.

761
00:44:13,975 --> 00:44:16,215
Speaker 3: I think it's got to be the builder has to

762
00:44:16,295 --> 00:44:22,975
Speaker 3: have public liability insurance. Public liability the version of public

763
00:44:23,015 --> 00:44:27,375
Speaker 3: liability that covers the work that they do for let's

764
00:44:27,375 --> 00:44:30,055
Speaker 3: say a period of ten years to them at least.

765
00:44:31,055 --> 00:44:35,095
Speaker 11: Okay, then you've got continuum of insurance, which means they

766
00:44:35,135 --> 00:44:37,695
Speaker 11: can insurance. Now well, actually I'm going to think it

767
00:44:37,735 --> 00:44:42,535
Speaker 11: would more cover under professional indemnity or bad advice.

768
00:44:42,695 --> 00:44:42,855
Speaker 3: Yep.

769
00:44:43,055 --> 00:44:46,655
Speaker 11: Right, So if they do, there's no continuum of insurance.

770
00:44:46,655 --> 00:44:49,015
Speaker 11: If that builder closes down this business and therefore the

771
00:44:49,055 --> 00:44:50,655
Speaker 11: insurance lapses anyway.

772
00:44:50,455 --> 00:44:53,775
Speaker 3: No, there's there's a again, there's not a way around that.

773
00:44:53,775 --> 00:44:55,655
Speaker 3: That's the wrong phrase. So I was talking with someone

774
00:44:55,695 --> 00:44:58,775
Speaker 3: the other day, actually, who's a building survey, right, and

775
00:44:58,855 --> 00:45:03,055
Speaker 3: so as a professional building survey you have to have insurance, right,

776
00:45:03,255 --> 00:45:08,335
Speaker 3: professional insurance and when you return higher. The type of

777
00:45:08,375 --> 00:45:11,775
Speaker 3: policy that you buy is one that will you have

778
00:45:11,855 --> 00:45:14,975
Speaker 3: to continue to pay for that policy for ten years

779
00:45:15,095 --> 00:45:18,095
Speaker 3: after the point of time that you retire. And you

780
00:45:18,135 --> 00:45:21,295
Speaker 3: could do exactly the same with someone who's a licensed

781
00:45:21,295 --> 00:45:24,695
Speaker 3: building practitioner like myself. Now, theoretically in ten years, I'm

782
00:45:24,735 --> 00:45:27,415
Speaker 3: able to get the super right. So if I was

783
00:45:27,455 --> 00:45:31,375
Speaker 3: doing a project today and in seven years time, when

784
00:45:31,375 --> 00:45:34,415
Speaker 3: I reached that age, I've still got three years of

785
00:45:34,455 --> 00:45:38,375
Speaker 3: responsibility for that project. I would buy insurance that has

786
00:45:38,415 --> 00:45:42,335
Speaker 3: a continuity of care of insurance. That means that if

787
00:45:42,375 --> 00:45:44,815
Speaker 3: there was an event after the time that I'd stopped

788
00:45:44,855 --> 00:45:49,135
Speaker 3: working and been licensed as an LBP, there would still

789
00:45:49,175 --> 00:45:51,055
Speaker 3: be insurance cover for the work that I'd done.

790
00:45:52,695 --> 00:45:55,055
Speaker 11: How do I, as a QUS to calculate ten years

791
00:45:55,055 --> 00:45:58,055
Speaker 11: of insurance companies of insurance.

792
00:45:58,655 --> 00:46:00,055
Speaker 3: Well, the insurance company will do that.

793
00:46:01,535 --> 00:46:04,135
Speaker 11: So it's ten years per that house or ten years

794
00:46:04,175 --> 00:46:08,055
Speaker 11: over my business and fault. You see, It's it's a

795
00:46:08,055 --> 00:46:08,615
Speaker 11: difficult one.

796
00:46:08,655 --> 00:46:12,175
Speaker 3: I'm not suggesting that it's you know, I guess what

797
00:46:12,295 --> 00:46:16,975
Speaker 3: we're faced with is a situation where almost everyone and

798
00:46:17,295 --> 00:46:21,655
Speaker 3: I'm really cautious around bagging council right, and I'm very

799
00:46:21,695 --> 00:46:25,575
Speaker 3: aware that there is an enormous amount of complexity around

800
00:46:25,735 --> 00:46:29,615
Speaker 3: public safety and liability and ensuring that we have good

801
00:46:29,655 --> 00:46:33,495
Speaker 3: controls over building. But I think that you have to

802
00:46:33,535 --> 00:46:37,095
Speaker 3: be wilfully naive to say that we have not tied

803
00:46:37,135 --> 00:46:40,175
Speaker 3: ourselves up in knots with the building consent process at

804
00:46:40,175 --> 00:46:44,415
Speaker 3: the moment where it has become so complex, so onerous,

805
00:46:44,775 --> 00:46:47,255
Speaker 3: that people are looking for ways to get around it. Right,

806
00:46:47,295 --> 00:46:51,975
Speaker 3: And so all of this discussion around in some cases

807
00:46:52,015 --> 00:46:55,615
Speaker 3: housing affordability and what you can do without necessarily requiring

808
00:46:55,615 --> 00:47:00,175
Speaker 3: a consent, speeding up the consent process seem that the

809
00:47:01,215 --> 00:47:05,175
Speaker 3: roadblock to all of that seems to be that joined

810
00:47:05,215 --> 00:47:08,855
Speaker 3: in several liability where councils are going to be held responsible. Now,

811
00:47:08,895 --> 00:47:12,815
Speaker 3: if we can free them up from that responsibility by

812
00:47:12,855 --> 00:47:17,855
Speaker 3: substituting it with another form of responsibility eye insurances, then

813
00:47:18,015 --> 00:47:19,895
Speaker 3: isn't that a process that we should look at.

814
00:47:21,295 --> 00:47:25,535
Speaker 11: Okay, I want to raise that one topic, but I yet,

815
00:47:25,615 --> 00:47:30,855
Speaker 11: for many years I've griped about the industry around this topic,

816
00:47:31,175 --> 00:47:35,055
Speaker 11: particularly the involvement, and I'm not the last or first.

817
00:47:36,015 --> 00:47:38,495
Speaker 11: I can remember, going back two decades ago as the

818
00:47:38,535 --> 00:47:42,295
Speaker 11: guy Fox that used to be always in the Certified

819
00:47:42,295 --> 00:47:45,655
Speaker 11: Buildings magazine Wellington and I rustle out in New Ployment.

820
00:47:47,175 --> 00:47:50,215
Speaker 11: I commented about this for years and when I looked

821
00:47:50,255 --> 00:47:53,215
Speaker 11: into it, to me, the industry needs to change the

822
00:47:53,295 --> 00:47:57,535
Speaker 11: model completely, and the two I found it were the

823
00:47:57,575 --> 00:48:01,935
Speaker 11: best with the American model most not every state and

824
00:48:02,335 --> 00:48:06,655
Speaker 11: the Dutch model. And essentially they run charter building contracts.

825
00:48:07,215 --> 00:48:10,295
Speaker 11: So chart building concept. It means that you can only

826
00:48:10,375 --> 00:48:13,735
Speaker 11: do works that peers in the industry are the builders

827
00:48:13,775 --> 00:48:17,895
Speaker 11: recognize you capable of that. The consents can only be

828
00:48:18,135 --> 00:48:21,815
Speaker 11: gathered by a builder. As it stands at the moment,

829
00:48:21,895 --> 00:48:24,415
Speaker 11: your teenage daughter could apply for a consent and get it.

830
00:48:25,415 --> 00:48:29,255
Speaker 11: Architects are continue You're getting consent works that they draw

831
00:48:29,335 --> 00:48:34,295
Speaker 11: that are aren't buildable or affordable, and we have a

832
00:48:34,335 --> 00:48:39,975
Speaker 11: broken indus and excessive costs. I'll tell you my figure

833
00:48:40,175 --> 00:48:43,415
Speaker 11: for free quoting is about fifteen percent of the industry

834
00:48:43,495 --> 00:48:46,735
Speaker 11: revolves around free quoting, and I would say at least

835
00:48:46,735 --> 00:48:49,455
Speaker 11: twelve percent of that is inefficient. In other words, we're

836
00:48:49,495 --> 00:48:52,215
Speaker 11: losing twelve percent or twelve percent of the cost of

837
00:48:52,255 --> 00:48:56,935
Speaker 11: building revolves around the notion of free quoting. So the

838
00:48:56,975 --> 00:48:59,695
Speaker 11: whole thing needs to be looked at. It's broken. I

839
00:48:59,775 --> 00:49:02,135
Speaker 11: don't believe it works at all, and I don't even

840
00:49:02,175 --> 00:49:05,175
Speaker 11: think taking counsel out of the process is going to

841
00:49:05,215 --> 00:49:07,735
Speaker 11: fix it. I think we need a completely new way

842
00:49:07,735 --> 00:49:09,215
Speaker 11: of doing it in deliveries.

843
00:49:10,095 --> 00:49:14,535
Speaker 3: And I think that when the LBP scheme was introduced,

844
00:49:14,695 --> 00:49:16,655
Speaker 3: that might have been part of the vision that they

845
00:49:16,695 --> 00:49:20,295
Speaker 3: had for it. Right, So the whole thing, you know,

846
00:49:20,375 --> 00:49:23,735
Speaker 3: that that shift from or that that move towards saying

847
00:49:23,975 --> 00:49:27,215
Speaker 3: we have restricted building work which can only be done

848
00:49:27,295 --> 00:49:30,535
Speaker 3: or supervised by an LBP. But what we haven't done

849
00:49:30,735 --> 00:49:37,095
Speaker 3: is then made insurance manditory for lbps. And so if I,

850
00:49:37,175 --> 00:49:40,855
Speaker 3: as an LBP do some building work, yeah, theoretically I'm

851
00:49:40,895 --> 00:49:43,175
Speaker 3: responsible for it, but it's I'm only going to be

852
00:49:43,175 --> 00:49:45,855
Speaker 3: held responsible when it goes through a court case, right,

853
00:49:47,335 --> 00:49:50,695
Speaker 3: and there's some judgment. And in the meantime, you know,

854
00:49:50,775 --> 00:49:54,295
Speaker 3: a client is left with poor workmanship that they have

855
00:49:54,375 --> 00:49:56,495
Speaker 3: to struggle with for years and years and years while

856
00:49:56,535 --> 00:49:59,015
Speaker 3: they go through the legal system to try and get redress.

857
00:49:59,455 --> 00:50:03,255
Speaker 3: Whereas you know, what you're saying is in the Netherlands

858
00:50:03,375 --> 00:50:06,495
Speaker 3: and in the United States. I've got some familiarity through

859
00:50:06,655 --> 00:50:09,655
Speaker 3: a maide of mine who's a lawyer who is works

860
00:50:09,655 --> 00:50:12,735
Speaker 3: in Sweden right now. He's an interesting combination of a

861
00:50:12,775 --> 00:50:17,135
Speaker 3: lawyer and a essentially a property developer, so very familiar

862
00:50:17,135 --> 00:50:19,255
Speaker 3: with the hands on side of building, but also he

863
00:50:19,495 --> 00:50:22,175
Speaker 3: has that legal background. And there the whole thing is

864
00:50:22,255 --> 00:50:26,575
Speaker 3: driven or administered by insurance as well. That's the insurer

865
00:50:26,695 --> 00:50:30,535
Speaker 3: takes the risk for the building. The council has some involvement,

866
00:50:30,575 --> 00:50:34,455
Speaker 3: but more as a record keeper, not as the last

867
00:50:34,495 --> 00:50:40,935
Speaker 3: man standing. So you know, there are there are models,

868
00:50:40,935 --> 00:50:42,735
Speaker 3: because I mean, we're not the only country in the world.

869
00:50:42,735 --> 00:50:44,815
Speaker 3: They're not the only you know, first world country in

870
00:50:44,815 --> 00:50:49,295
Speaker 3: the world that's got building consents and regulations around building controls.

871
00:50:49,935 --> 00:50:53,415
Speaker 3: So there probably is a better model, and I agree

872
00:50:53,455 --> 00:50:55,855
Speaker 3: with you. I think that we do need to find

873
00:50:55,895 --> 00:50:58,815
Speaker 3: a better model that says, you know, and especially in

874
00:50:58,815 --> 00:51:00,855
Speaker 3: this this is where like this whole thing around the

875
00:51:00,895 --> 00:51:03,775
Speaker 3: sixty square meter granny flat thing that might not require

876
00:51:03,775 --> 00:51:07,055
Speaker 3: a building consent. What they're they're really saying. I think

877
00:51:07,175 --> 00:51:09,735
Speaker 3: the crux of that is it is so onerous, so

878
00:51:09,815 --> 00:51:12,335
Speaker 3: difficult to get a building consent for that type of work.

879
00:51:12,535 --> 00:51:14,615
Speaker 3: We're going to take it away from the building consent

880
00:51:14,695 --> 00:51:16,615
Speaker 3: and allow you to do it with all of these

881
00:51:16,655 --> 00:51:19,815
Speaker 3: other rules and regulations in place, whereas if there was

882
00:51:19,935 --> 00:51:22,495
Speaker 3: a much more straightforward way of getting consent for these

883
00:51:22,535 --> 00:51:24,695
Speaker 3: sorts of work, you could still get consent for it.

884
00:51:25,095 --> 00:51:28,815
Speaker 3: But because there's not the enduring liability with the council,

885
00:51:28,935 --> 00:51:31,655
Speaker 3: it'll sit with an insurer that will allow counsel to

886
00:51:31,695 --> 00:51:34,495
Speaker 3: process them a lot quicker because they're not being held

887
00:51:34,535 --> 00:51:37,735
Speaker 3: responsible for it ultimately. And look all a text has

888
00:51:37,775 --> 00:51:40,495
Speaker 3: said and here, look, you know, hey, Pete, I think

889
00:51:40,495 --> 00:51:42,655
Speaker 3: of councils like the police. No one wants to know them,

890
00:51:43,335 --> 00:51:45,135
Speaker 3: but when it suits them, they want them to be

891
00:51:45,215 --> 00:51:47,775
Speaker 3: there and they want their help. Unfortunately, you can't have

892
00:51:47,815 --> 00:51:51,935
Speaker 3: it both ways. I understand that comment absolutely, So I'm

893
00:51:51,975 --> 00:51:54,895
Speaker 3: saying that there has to be a way via It's

894
00:51:54,935 --> 00:51:57,375
Speaker 3: going to be insurance, right, and that's going to be

895
00:51:57,615 --> 00:52:01,015
Speaker 3: putting money into the pockets of multinationals. And people get

896
00:52:01,055 --> 00:52:02,695
Speaker 3: all upset about that and all the rest of it.

897
00:52:02,735 --> 00:52:05,015
Speaker 3: But you know, try and convince me of another way

898
00:52:05,055 --> 00:52:08,815
Speaker 3: and I'll listen to it. Good of you to call

899
00:52:08,895 --> 00:52:11,375
Speaker 3: Lester always a pleasure than say in touch take care

900
00:52:11,375 --> 00:52:13,215
Speaker 3: of Oh eight hundred eighty ten eighty is the number

901
00:52:13,255 --> 00:52:15,815
Speaker 3: to call. Take a short break at around seven forty

902
00:52:15,815 --> 00:52:18,095
Speaker 3: five we're going to catch up with Nick Hardy Jones

903
00:52:18,135 --> 00:52:21,655
Speaker 3: from Metro Performance Glass. Lots and lots and lots of

904
00:52:21,695 --> 00:52:25,095
Speaker 3: discussion at the moment around H one about the possibility

905
00:52:25,135 --> 00:52:27,535
Speaker 3: of rolling back H one standards which have only just

906
00:52:27,535 --> 00:52:30,695
Speaker 3: been increased. And obviously, if we're talking about the exterior

907
00:52:30,735 --> 00:52:33,975
Speaker 3: of our building, glazing glass is a big part of that.

908
00:52:34,095 --> 00:52:38,255
Speaker 3: So how do how does glass work with H one?

909
00:52:38,335 --> 00:52:40,535
Speaker 3: We'll have a discussion with Nick Hardy Jones. If you've

910
00:52:40,535 --> 00:52:44,215
Speaker 3: got any specific glazing questions, actually, feel free to flick

911
00:52:44,255 --> 00:52:45,455
Speaker 3: them through and I'll see if we can get to

912
00:52:45,495 --> 00:52:47,735
Speaker 3: those as well if they're relevant. Oh, eight hundred eighty

913
00:52:47,815 --> 00:52:53,455
Speaker 3: ten eighty is the number to call. The couple of

914
00:52:53,575 --> 00:53:00,135
Speaker 3: questions around or no comments really the texts having a

915
00:53:00,175 --> 00:53:06,895
Speaker 3: great time. Actually, gents, with all due respect, we are

916
00:53:06,935 --> 00:53:09,495
Speaker 3: never going to get away with circumventing the council and

917
00:53:09,535 --> 00:53:12,615
Speaker 3: getting a building consent. It's the council process that needs addressing.

918
00:53:12,695 --> 00:53:14,175
Speaker 3: Let's face it, the fact as it could be done

919
00:53:14,175 --> 00:53:15,615
Speaker 3: a whole lot better. They cause a whole lot of

920
00:53:15,615 --> 00:53:18,855
Speaker 3: issues because it's so slow and they're overly pedantic. And

921
00:53:18,895 --> 00:53:22,215
Speaker 3: again I'm not you know, I have some sympathiefic counsel

922
00:53:22,255 --> 00:53:24,935
Speaker 3: as well, in the sense that I think they probably

923
00:53:25,055 --> 00:53:27,815
Speaker 3: end up with a whole lot of building consent applications

924
00:53:27,895 --> 00:53:32,415
Speaker 3: plans landing on their desk that are poorly done, and

925
00:53:32,575 --> 00:53:36,135
Speaker 3: so you know they're sending it back going please explain.

926
00:53:36,455 --> 00:53:39,215
Speaker 3: You haven't included this, You've got no decent evidence for this,

927
00:53:39,375 --> 00:53:43,655
Speaker 3: you haven't proved a compliance pathway. And I suspect that

928
00:53:43,735 --> 00:53:46,495
Speaker 3: a reasonable number of the people that are complaining about

929
00:53:46,495 --> 00:53:50,215
Speaker 3: the building consent process I getting your building consent from

930
00:53:50,295 --> 00:53:54,135
Speaker 3: counsel are complaining without realizing that the quality of what

931
00:53:54,215 --> 00:53:57,735
Speaker 3: they're giving them is rubbish basically, and that's why counsel

932
00:53:57,815 --> 00:54:00,615
Speaker 3: needs to keep asking questions. Flip side to that is

933
00:54:00,815 --> 00:54:05,735
Speaker 3: I am personally aware, as in firstand knowledge of building

934
00:54:05,735 --> 00:54:08,935
Speaker 3: consents that have been submitted where the RFIs have been

935
00:54:09,935 --> 00:54:14,375
Speaker 3: unreasonable and in one case, completely and utterly idiotic. And

936
00:54:14,415 --> 00:54:19,255
Speaker 3: I say that unreservedly, where it just showed an enormous

937
00:54:19,335 --> 00:54:22,175
Speaker 3: lack of knowledge on the part of the person processing

938
00:54:22,215 --> 00:54:26,535
Speaker 3: the building consent application, that they didn't understand some very

939
00:54:26,655 --> 00:54:31,975
Speaker 3: basic elements of either building science or building compliance and

940
00:54:32,095 --> 00:54:37,095
Speaker 3: asked questions about it. I had a response to a

941
00:54:37,095 --> 00:54:41,975
Speaker 3: CCC application at one stage that asked me how I

942
00:54:42,135 --> 00:54:46,535
Speaker 3: had provided ventilation to the subfloor space, and that was

943
00:54:46,775 --> 00:54:51,535
Speaker 3: an RFI to a CCC application. The building had a

944
00:54:51,575 --> 00:54:57,295
Speaker 3: concrete slab. I was very tempted to reply, oldrill some

945
00:54:57,375 --> 00:54:59,575
Speaker 3: holes in the slab and allow airflow, but I thought

946
00:54:59,575 --> 00:55:02,775
Speaker 3: that that would probably be unwise. So, you know, I mean,

947
00:55:02,815 --> 00:55:05,695
Speaker 3: they happen, and people make mistakes, and I get that,

948
00:55:05,775 --> 00:55:08,295
Speaker 3: and they're off and overworked and all the rest of it.

949
00:55:08,375 --> 00:55:12,135
Speaker 3: But it does point to a real some real challenges

950
00:55:12,415 --> 00:55:16,615
Speaker 3: with the building consent process. How does it work if

951
00:55:16,615 --> 00:55:18,935
Speaker 3: the company goes bust before the ten years is up?

952
00:55:19,015 --> 00:55:21,455
Speaker 3: What recall would I have? Is there some insurance, like

953
00:55:21,495 --> 00:55:24,815
Speaker 3: a liability insurance that can respond? Yeah, there are that's

954
00:55:24,855 --> 00:55:27,975
Speaker 3: the thing. You can get insurances that extend beyond the

955
00:55:28,055 --> 00:55:33,415
Speaker 3: life necessarily of the company. There's got to be a solution. Certainly,

956
00:55:34,175 --> 00:55:36,255
Speaker 3: we need to investigate them. Oh eight hundred and eighty

957
00:55:36,335 --> 00:55:39,415
Speaker 3: ten eighty is that number to call? Hello there, Allen,

958
00:55:40,175 --> 00:55:43,455
Speaker 3: Good morning, Good morning. Indeed, is it a good morning

959
00:55:43,455 --> 00:55:45,855
Speaker 3: where you are, because it's pretty damn miserable there to

960
00:55:45,895 --> 00:55:46,295
Speaker 3: be fair?

961
00:55:46,535 --> 00:55:48,295
Speaker 7: Okay, Yeah, well, I think we must have the same

962
00:55:48,335 --> 00:55:48,615
Speaker 7: wead the.

963
00:55:48,615 --> 00:55:56,055
Speaker 3: Format right, at least that's fair and equitable, coequal.

964
00:55:55,575 --> 00:56:01,335
Speaker 7: And what map? Yeah, a question concerning an estimate stroke quote. Yes,

965
00:56:02,135 --> 00:56:05,615
Speaker 7: I'm considering upgrading the heat pump and an established home YEP.

966
00:56:06,095 --> 00:56:11,935
Speaker 7: I visited what I thought was appropriate shop selling such

967
00:56:11,975 --> 00:56:15,295
Speaker 7: things and asked did they have a preferred installer? And

968
00:56:15,335 --> 00:56:19,335
Speaker 7: they've sent me a document with some figures on it,

969
00:56:19,375 --> 00:56:21,815
Speaker 7: and I'm quite happy with the figures, but there's some

970
00:56:21,855 --> 00:56:25,655
Speaker 7: wording in it that I've just needed some clarification. At

971
00:56:25,655 --> 00:56:28,335
Speaker 7: one point on the document they refer to this as

972
00:56:28,335 --> 00:56:32,215
Speaker 7: a quote and they give me a quote number. Further

973
00:56:32,295 --> 00:56:36,015
Speaker 7: on in the document they use the word estimate three times. Yes,

974
00:56:36,815 --> 00:56:41,375
Speaker 7: and they say please pay on the estimate, and this

975
00:56:41,575 --> 00:56:45,175
Speaker 7: estimate is likely to change without notice. Here is an

976
00:56:45,175 --> 00:56:49,775
Speaker 7: omissions accepted, and this estimate is valued, is valid for

977
00:56:49,815 --> 00:56:54,615
Speaker 7: seven days. Now. I'm not terribly familiar with such things,

978
00:56:54,615 --> 00:56:56,215
Speaker 7: but it seems to be that an estimate and a

979
00:56:56,295 --> 00:56:57,695
Speaker 7: quote are two different animals.

980
00:56:57,735 --> 00:57:00,055
Speaker 3: They are, yes, so why are they.

981
00:57:00,135 --> 00:57:02,095
Speaker 7: Using the same word interchangeably?

982
00:57:04,095 --> 00:57:06,175
Speaker 3: Obviously they would have had legal advice and that's how

983
00:57:06,175 --> 00:57:08,615
Speaker 3: they've decided to draw it up. And they'll be covering

984
00:57:08,655 --> 00:57:11,855
Speaker 3: themselves for things like, you know, they obviously haven't been

985
00:57:11,855 --> 00:57:15,015
Speaker 3: out to do a visit to your particular property to

986
00:57:15,135 --> 00:57:17,495
Speaker 3: view it, and maybe they don't have any photographs, and

987
00:57:17,575 --> 00:57:21,535
Speaker 3: so they're making a series of assumptions around. Okay, so

988
00:57:21,735 --> 00:57:23,975
Speaker 3: if we're coming to do a heat pump, we've got

989
00:57:23,975 --> 00:57:26,815
Speaker 3: an outdoor unit, We've got some ducting and some conduit

990
00:57:26,855 --> 00:57:28,575
Speaker 3: that we need to get from the heat pump unit

991
00:57:28,615 --> 00:57:30,575
Speaker 3: to the indoor unit. We need to be able to

992
00:57:30,655 --> 00:57:33,455
Speaker 3: mount that indoor unit on the wall and the right location,

993
00:57:33,695 --> 00:57:36,175
Speaker 3: and we need to find a pathway to connect the two,

994
00:57:36,415 --> 00:57:42,895
Speaker 3: and it's reasonable to assume, let's say that let's say

995
00:57:42,935 --> 00:57:45,655
Speaker 3: the time required to do that is four hours, just

996
00:57:45,695 --> 00:57:48,095
Speaker 3: off the top of my head. Then they get to

997
00:57:48,135 --> 00:57:52,375
Speaker 3: your place and discover, in fact that maybe there's asbestoseness

998
00:57:52,375 --> 00:57:54,375
Speaker 3: of feet. They get to your place and discover that,

999
00:57:55,295 --> 00:57:57,895
Speaker 3: in fact, there's a beam right there, and the pathway

1000
00:57:57,935 --> 00:58:01,295
Speaker 3: that they had they can't do, or that the pathway

1001
00:58:01,295 --> 00:58:03,775
Speaker 3: that they have to find for the condensake pipe that

1002
00:58:03,935 --> 00:58:07,895
Speaker 3: drains from the high wall unit is more challenging and

1003
00:58:08,015 --> 00:58:09,935
Speaker 3: has to go further, and perhaps they have to take

1004
00:58:09,975 --> 00:58:13,895
Speaker 3: off a couple of roof tiles to get access to it, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera.

1005
00:58:14,255 --> 00:58:17,335
Speaker 3: So they will perhaps price the work assuming that it

1006
00:58:17,375 --> 00:58:20,655
Speaker 3: takes four to five hours to install, but if it

1007
00:58:20,735 --> 00:58:23,855
Speaker 3: takes eight hours, then you're paying for that eight hours.

1008
00:58:23,615 --> 00:58:26,295
Speaker 3: That's where I would have thought. They've got that whole

1009
00:58:26,735 --> 00:58:30,255
Speaker 3: changing from quote to estimate. The best way of getting

1010
00:58:30,255 --> 00:58:33,695
Speaker 3: around it is to say, look, I would actually like

1011
00:58:33,735 --> 00:58:36,735
Speaker 3: to firm up that price. Could someone come visit the

1012
00:58:36,775 --> 00:58:40,215
Speaker 3: site and give me a fixed quote for the work?

1013
00:58:41,095 --> 00:58:45,015
Speaker 7: So I responded accordingly. I reviewed the estimate YEP, which

1014
00:58:45,015 --> 00:58:47,535
Speaker 7: your email refers to as a quote, and I would

1015
00:58:47,575 --> 00:58:50,375
Speaker 7: like to meet with the installer on site YEP. That

1016
00:58:50,735 --> 00:58:52,895
Speaker 7: invited them to get back to me perfect and I

1017
00:58:52,935 --> 00:58:55,255
Speaker 7: hope that that can happen within the seven day period.

1018
00:58:56,095 --> 00:58:58,175
Speaker 7: So it sounds like I've done everything right. But it

1019
00:58:58,215 --> 00:59:02,015
Speaker 7: just bothered me that they were using this word interchangeably.

1020
00:59:02,055 --> 00:59:04,375
Speaker 7: And if I just signed on it, paid on it,

1021
00:59:04,415 --> 00:59:08,375
Speaker 7: and sent it back, then I have been committed to

1022
00:59:08,535 --> 00:59:09,335
Speaker 7: goodness knows what.

1023
00:59:09,575 --> 00:59:12,455
Speaker 3: Yes, but you still do have some protection under the

1024
00:59:12,495 --> 00:59:17,255
Speaker 3: Consumer Guarantees Act. So there is a requirement that even

1025
00:59:17,335 --> 00:59:19,935
Speaker 3: with an estimate, the estimate, the final value of the

1026
00:59:19,935 --> 00:59:23,295
Speaker 3: work cannot exceed And I think it's generally twenty percent

1027
00:59:24,055 --> 00:59:27,895
Speaker 3: more than the estimate, so if you know it's And

1028
00:59:28,015 --> 00:59:30,335
Speaker 3: what that does is it prevents someone from saying, let's

1029
00:59:30,335 --> 00:59:32,015
Speaker 3: say I turn up at your place and I want

1030
00:59:32,215 --> 00:59:34,375
Speaker 3: you want to replace the driveway. And I looked and went,

1031
00:59:34,615 --> 00:59:36,815
Speaker 3: oh mate, that'll be five grand. And then I get

1032
00:59:36,815 --> 00:59:38,655
Speaker 3: diggers in and I box it all up and I

1033
00:59:38,695 --> 00:59:40,535
Speaker 3: pull the driveway and da da da da da, and

1034
00:59:40,615 --> 00:59:43,535
Speaker 3: I send you a bill for twelve and you go, well,

1035
00:59:43,535 --> 00:59:45,855
Speaker 3: hang on, hang on. You said the estimate was fine. Yeah,

1036
00:59:45,855 --> 00:59:47,775
Speaker 3: I know, but god it was really expensive, and da

1037
00:59:47,855 --> 00:59:50,335
Speaker 3: da da da, and here's my bill for twelve. Or

1038
00:59:50,335 --> 00:59:52,895
Speaker 3: you could say, hang on, no, you've got to stay

1039
00:59:52,895 --> 00:59:56,855
Speaker 3: within twenty percent of the five grand that you estimated,

1040
00:59:57,295 --> 01:00:01,095
Speaker 3: and therefore I'm only paying this amount or we'll go dispute.

1041
01:00:01,215 --> 01:00:06,095
Speaker 3: So there are still some other controls around ensuring that

1042
01:00:06,095 --> 01:00:08,015
Speaker 3: the work is priced fairly.

1043
01:00:08,975 --> 01:00:09,175
Speaker 11: Well.

1044
01:00:09,495 --> 01:00:12,135
Speaker 7: A good example is a good example, except the onus

1045
01:00:12,215 --> 01:00:15,575
Speaker 7: is on me as the householder, to push back against

1046
01:00:15,575 --> 01:00:20,695
Speaker 7: the yes, yes to have the driveway fit it. And

1047
01:00:21,175 --> 01:00:23,055
Speaker 7: that just adds another string to the bow.

1048
01:00:23,095 --> 01:00:25,815
Speaker 3: As it were, Yeah, I mean it. I suppose what

1049
01:00:25,855 --> 01:00:29,015
Speaker 3: it does say those as householders and as people entering

1050
01:00:29,055 --> 01:00:31,655
Speaker 3: into contracts, we do need to read them, we do

1051
01:00:31,735 --> 01:00:33,975
Speaker 3: need to understand them, and we do reserve the right

1052
01:00:34,015 --> 01:00:36,815
Speaker 3: to challenge them in the same way that you know.

1053
01:00:36,855 --> 01:00:39,015
Speaker 3: There's been a fair amount of discussion, in fact, I've

1054
01:00:39,015 --> 01:00:40,815
Speaker 3: filmed a piece about this the other day, around the

1055
01:00:40,855 --> 01:00:43,735
Speaker 3: requirement to have a written contract for building work over

1056
01:00:43,815 --> 01:00:48,095
Speaker 3: thirty thousand dollars. Now, typically the responsibility for that in

1057
01:00:48,215 --> 01:00:51,895
Speaker 3: law is with the contractor to provide the contract, right,

1058
01:00:52,175 --> 01:00:55,415
Speaker 3: so they have to offer that to the client. There's

1059
01:00:55,455 --> 01:00:58,455
Speaker 3: no obligation on the part of the client to simply

1060
01:00:59,055 --> 01:01:02,295
Speaker 3: accept that contract as it is. They can discuss it,

1061
01:01:02,375 --> 01:01:05,535
Speaker 3: they can amend it, they can perhaps go away and

1062
01:01:05,615 --> 01:01:08,695
Speaker 3: have their own contract prepared by their lawyer and offer

1063
01:01:08,775 --> 01:01:13,855
Speaker 3: that to the contractor. So you know, you can There's

1064
01:01:13,855 --> 01:01:17,055
Speaker 3: got a big discussion and a little bit of robust

1065
01:01:17,215 --> 01:01:21,055
Speaker 3: debate around these things to ensure that both parties needs

1066
01:01:21,055 --> 01:01:24,735
Speaker 3: are met, but it's not weighted in favor of one party,

1067
01:01:24,815 --> 01:01:27,895
Speaker 3: which some of these contracts can be. And if I

1068
01:01:28,055 --> 01:01:30,535
Speaker 3: was you is good. You know, if I'm in business, right,

1069
01:01:30,575 --> 01:01:34,735
Speaker 3: I'm going to protect my interests, right, I want to

1070
01:01:34,735 --> 01:01:38,095
Speaker 3: protect and you want to protect yours. That's right. But

1071
01:01:38,255 --> 01:01:40,855
Speaker 3: you are in a fortunate position in the sense that

1072
01:01:40,895 --> 01:01:44,015
Speaker 3: you have the intellectual ability to understand that work through

1073
01:01:44,055 --> 01:01:47,375
Speaker 3: the complexity and make a reasoned response to it. And

1074
01:01:47,615 --> 01:01:50,055
Speaker 3: I guess in some cases people are not. But you

1075
01:01:50,095 --> 01:01:51,255
Speaker 3: are so good on you.

1076
01:01:51,975 --> 01:01:52,255
Speaker 7: Thank you.

1077
01:01:52,375 --> 01:01:55,455
Speaker 3: Good of you to call take care all the best

1078
01:01:55,495 --> 01:01:57,695
Speaker 3: your news talks. He'd be lots and lots of Texas

1079
01:01:57,815 --> 01:02:00,815
Speaker 3: is great, morning, Pete. Can you tell me the difference

1080
01:02:00,815 --> 01:02:03,455
Speaker 3: between a quote and an estimate? Okay, this is me

1081
01:02:03,575 --> 01:02:06,695
Speaker 3: bush lawyering, and I shouldn't, but I will. So a

1082
01:02:06,775 --> 01:02:10,335
Speaker 3: quote is typically a fixed price. So if I've said

1083
01:02:10,335 --> 01:02:14,495
Speaker 3: to you, like the driveway, You've asked me to replace

1084
01:02:14,535 --> 01:02:17,895
Speaker 3: the driveway, so and you want a quote for that.

1085
01:02:18,055 --> 01:02:20,735
Speaker 3: So I'm going to work out for myself. I'm going

1086
01:02:20,815 --> 01:02:23,375
Speaker 3: to do my own quantity surveying. I'm going to figure

1087
01:02:23,415 --> 01:02:26,015
Speaker 3: out how much is there, how much I have to remove,

1088
01:02:26,055 --> 01:02:28,175
Speaker 3: how much that's going to cost me, how many trucks

1089
01:02:28,215 --> 01:02:30,535
Speaker 3: I need to use. Then I'm going to figure out

1090
01:02:30,535 --> 01:02:32,215
Speaker 3: what it's going to cost me to box it, to

1091
01:02:32,575 --> 01:02:35,135
Speaker 3: lay some mesh in it, what type of concrete I'm

1092
01:02:35,175 --> 01:02:38,495
Speaker 3: going to put in there, what type of finishes required,

1093
01:02:39,335 --> 01:02:41,535
Speaker 3: allow time to strip the boxing. At the end of

1094
01:02:41,535 --> 01:02:44,215
Speaker 3: the job, get a concrete cutter in to do the

1095
01:02:44,255 --> 01:02:46,415
Speaker 3: expansion joints. All of that, right, all of the work

1096
01:02:46,415 --> 01:02:48,935
Speaker 3: involved in that. I'm going to price all of that up,

1097
01:02:48,975 --> 01:02:51,615
Speaker 3: and I'm going to give you a fixed price for

1098
01:02:51,655 --> 01:02:54,375
Speaker 3: that work. Now, if I'm doing a fixed price because

1099
01:02:54,375 --> 01:02:57,535
Speaker 3: it's a quote, then I'm also going to allow a

1100
01:02:57,575 --> 01:03:00,375
Speaker 3: reasonable margin to allow for things that I might not

1101
01:03:00,415 --> 01:03:04,575
Speaker 3: have accepted or expected, or I'm going to tag those out.

1102
01:03:04,815 --> 01:03:08,375
Speaker 3: So if for example, the ground conditions are poor, I

1103
01:03:08,495 --> 01:03:12,415
Speaker 3: might say in my quote, I have allowed this to

1104
01:03:12,495 --> 01:03:15,415
Speaker 3: do this work, but if it's soft, or if there's

1105
01:03:15,455 --> 01:03:17,655
Speaker 3: a requirement, then you're going to pay for that. You

1106
01:03:17,695 --> 01:03:19,575
Speaker 3: can add all of that into the quote, but generally

1107
01:03:19,615 --> 01:03:22,295
Speaker 3: the quote is a fixed price. An estimate is not

1108
01:03:22,775 --> 01:03:25,015
Speaker 3: an estimate. Is I think it will take this much

1109
01:03:25,055 --> 01:03:27,135
Speaker 3: and take that amount of time, et cetera, et cetera.

1110
01:03:27,575 --> 01:03:30,415
Speaker 3: But I'm not absolutely sure, and so the estimate is

1111
01:03:31,015 --> 01:03:34,255
Speaker 3: a reasonable based on a series of reasonable assumptions, and

1112
01:03:34,295 --> 01:03:36,455
Speaker 3: this is what I think it's going to cost. The

1113
01:03:36,495 --> 01:03:40,055
Speaker 3: problem with estimates is that often they are underestimated, and

1114
01:03:40,055 --> 01:03:42,655
Speaker 3: then the client goes, well, hang on, you said five grand.

1115
01:03:42,695 --> 01:03:45,535
Speaker 3: Now you're charging me ten. But there is also now

1116
01:03:45,815 --> 01:03:48,095
Speaker 3: requirements and has been for a long time that estimates

1117
01:03:48,135 --> 01:03:51,495
Speaker 3: need to be within a reasonable amount of the finished work.

1118
01:03:51,575 --> 01:03:54,535
Speaker 3: You can't estimate a job and then it doubles that

1119
01:03:54,775 --> 01:03:57,415
Speaker 3: you shouldn't get paid for that basically, so hopefully that's

1120
01:03:57,455 --> 01:04:02,255
Speaker 3: the difference between estimates and quotes. But quotes can go

1121
01:04:02,335 --> 01:04:05,455
Speaker 3: over as long as you've tagged it. Oh, eight hundred

1122
01:04:05,455 --> 01:04:07,055
Speaker 3: and eighty ten eighty is number to call. We'll take

1123
01:04:07,095 --> 01:04:08,935
Speaker 3: short break the back with Jeff in just a moment,

1124
01:04:09,015 --> 01:04:11,215
Speaker 3: very quick text. Hey Pete, I'm thinking about getting some

1125
01:04:11,295 --> 01:04:13,815
Speaker 3: renovations completed. A friend has said that I need a

1126
01:04:13,935 --> 01:04:16,575
Speaker 3: drafts person draftsman if I want to put in a

1127
01:04:16,615 --> 01:04:20,735
Speaker 3: second toilet and shower. Is that correct? Thanks from Kristen. Yes,

1128
01:04:21,055 --> 01:04:24,935
Speaker 3: your friend is well advised. You will need to You'll

1129
01:04:25,015 --> 01:04:27,535
Speaker 3: need to submit plans. Plans can only be drawn by

1130
01:04:27,535 --> 01:04:30,935
Speaker 3: someone who has an LBP license. Now that might be

1131
01:04:30,975 --> 01:04:34,415
Speaker 3: a drafts person, might be an architect. And the reason

1132
01:04:34,455 --> 01:04:37,255
Speaker 3: that it's going to require a building consent you said

1133
01:04:37,375 --> 01:04:40,095
Speaker 3: you need plans to get a building consent is the

1134
01:04:40,175 --> 01:04:42,975
Speaker 3: key phrase in your text is second toilet and shower.

1135
01:04:43,055 --> 01:04:46,055
Speaker 3: So you're adding the number of sanitary fittings to the house.

1136
01:04:46,095 --> 01:04:49,135
Speaker 3: That triggers requirement for a building consent. So yes, you

1137
01:04:49,215 --> 01:04:52,215
Speaker 3: will need to submit plans to counsel in order to

1138
01:04:52,255 --> 01:04:54,815
Speaker 3: get a building consent for that work. Jeff, A very

1139
01:04:54,855 --> 01:04:58,855
Speaker 3: good morning, not bad, thank you yourself.

1140
01:04:58,895 --> 01:05:03,815
Speaker 4: I've got a question about concrete. I've got a large

1141
01:05:03,855 --> 01:05:09,095
Speaker 4: square area of co founder level right and in the

1142
01:05:09,135 --> 01:05:11,335
Speaker 4: six seasm must have been laid and when they did,

1143
01:05:11,375 --> 01:05:16,735
Speaker 4: it was some boxes, you know, box section okay, yeah,

1144
01:05:16,775 --> 01:05:19,815
Speaker 4: so and over time that the weeds are growing up

1145
01:05:20,055 --> 01:05:22,975
Speaker 4: in between them. Now, yes, So what I've done is

1146
01:05:22,975 --> 01:05:25,495
Speaker 4: that I've dug it out and I'm quite happy. I've

1147
01:05:25,535 --> 01:05:30,255
Speaker 4: put the quick set concrete rabbit set concrete in there

1148
01:05:30,415 --> 01:05:32,455
Speaker 4: and fill that up, and I'm quite happy with that.

1149
01:05:33,135 --> 01:05:35,455
Speaker 4: What I worry about, Peter, is thinking about Peter is

1150
01:05:35,455 --> 01:05:38,095
Speaker 4: that after a period of time, you know, after water

1151
01:05:38,135 --> 01:05:41,135
Speaker 4: blasting and has taken the cement off the top yep.

1152
01:05:41,775 --> 01:05:44,735
Speaker 4: So I'm just wondering, can I tidy it up by

1153
01:05:45,575 --> 01:05:51,735
Speaker 4: sayce hose it all down and sprinkles ordinary cement on

1154
01:05:51,775 --> 01:05:54,975
Speaker 4: it and rubbing and bum would that help?

1155
01:05:55,055 --> 01:05:56,775
Speaker 14: When you then not?

1156
01:05:56,775 --> 01:06:01,095
Speaker 3: Not really? I think I mean you remember that the

1157
01:06:01,175 --> 01:06:06,295
Speaker 3: cement so concrete is basically aggregate, sand and cement, right,

1158
01:06:06,375 --> 01:06:09,815
Speaker 3: and those when they activate, becomes concrete. So there is

1159
01:06:10,055 --> 01:06:13,495
Speaker 3: cement all the way through your concrete. And all you're

1160
01:06:13,495 --> 01:06:15,655
Speaker 3: doing is exposing the surface. And if you want to

1161
01:06:15,655 --> 01:06:20,055
Speaker 3: make that a little bit smoother, let's say, no, just

1162
01:06:20,095 --> 01:06:23,415
Speaker 3: applying cement, it'll it'll look really patchy, it probably won't stick.

1163
01:06:23,535 --> 01:06:26,455
Speaker 3: And I can't think of any any time where I've

1164
01:06:26,495 --> 01:06:28,895
Speaker 3: actually done something like that. Just a quick question. When

1165
01:06:28,975 --> 01:06:30,935
Speaker 3: you say it's in boxes, is it like was it

1166
01:06:31,015 --> 01:06:33,415
Speaker 3: Poorter's pads? And then a gap like one hundred more

1167
01:06:33,415 --> 01:06:34,495
Speaker 3: gap in between them.

1168
01:06:35,295 --> 01:06:40,375
Speaker 4: When they when they obviously it in sections like box sections,

1169
01:06:40,895 --> 01:06:46,775
Speaker 4: Like maybe there's some just because when they take the

1170
01:06:46,815 --> 01:06:51,735
Speaker 4: timber out, they're actually they squares and they've done and squares.

1171
01:06:51,575 --> 01:06:54,855
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, and then right and then you fill those in.

1172
01:06:55,415 --> 01:06:58,655
Speaker 4: Yeah yeah. I just thought, well, is there a way

1173
01:06:58,695 --> 01:06:59,735
Speaker 4: that I could tie it up?

1174
01:07:01,055 --> 01:07:03,175
Speaker 3: Look, if you did want to tidy it up, you know,

1175
01:07:03,215 --> 01:07:06,255
Speaker 3: and you really wanted to be considerably more attractive than

1176
01:07:06,415 --> 01:07:09,615
Speaker 3: it is, I'd actually look at getting someone into do

1177
01:07:09,815 --> 01:07:12,895
Speaker 3: like a surface coating on it so you can actually

1178
01:07:13,015 --> 01:07:16,255
Speaker 3: get stains that that will give it a much more

1179
01:07:16,335 --> 01:07:19,615
Speaker 3: uniform finish, possibly even doing a light grind over it.

1180
01:07:19,615 --> 01:07:21,775
Speaker 3: It's a bit unusual, but it's one way of dealing

1181
01:07:21,775 --> 01:07:24,975
Speaker 3: with it as well. But no, I wouldn't just go

1182
01:07:25,055 --> 01:07:28,255
Speaker 3: around scattering cement on top. I don't. I think it'll

1183
01:07:28,255 --> 01:07:31,815
Speaker 3: get a really patchy finish and it probably won't adhere

1184
01:07:31,895 --> 01:07:34,735
Speaker 3: particularly well. Yeah, I wouldn't. I wouldn't he.

1185
01:07:36,935 --> 01:07:37,375
Speaker 4: Someone in there.

1186
01:07:37,935 --> 01:07:39,855
Speaker 3: Yeah, if you have a look online that you'll find

1187
01:07:39,895 --> 01:07:45,055
Speaker 3: some contractors who do concrete resurfacing and ceiling and if

1188
01:07:45,095 --> 01:07:47,455
Speaker 3: you wanted a more attractive finish, that's often a good

1189
01:07:47,455 --> 01:07:48,135
Speaker 3: way of doing it.

1190
01:07:49,735 --> 01:07:53,175
Speaker 4: Yeah, okay, concrete will finish something.

1191
01:07:53,415 --> 01:07:55,935
Speaker 3: And someone has text and I agree with them. Water

1192
01:07:55,935 --> 01:07:59,415
Speaker 3: blasting concretors and no, no, it destroys the hardest lat Yeah,

1193
01:07:59,495 --> 01:08:02,935
Speaker 3: I see. I love water blasting, I really do so.

1194
01:08:03,375 --> 01:08:06,415
Speaker 3: I think what it is is going too hard and

1195
01:08:06,495 --> 01:08:10,135
Speaker 3: too close. But also, you know, with this sort of thing,

1196
01:08:10,175 --> 01:08:12,655
Speaker 3: you're trying to kill an organic material, so why not

1197
01:08:12,815 --> 01:08:15,135
Speaker 3: use a treatment and that'll mean that you have to

1198
01:08:15,175 --> 01:08:17,575
Speaker 3: do a lot less water blasting. So I'm a big

1199
01:08:17,615 --> 01:08:20,775
Speaker 3: fan of various treatments that you can apply that will

1200
01:08:20,815 --> 01:08:23,055
Speaker 3: activate and then you're rinsing that off with a water

1201
01:08:23,055 --> 01:08:25,575
Speaker 3: blaster and not trying to blast the surface layer off.

1202
01:08:25,775 --> 01:08:27,855
Speaker 3: Oh eight, one hundred and eighty ten eighty quick call

1203
01:08:27,935 --> 01:08:30,495
Speaker 3: from Mary, and then we're going to talk to Nick

1204
01:08:30,495 --> 01:08:33,415
Speaker 3: Cardy Jones about glazing an H one compliance in just

1205
01:08:33,455 --> 01:08:34,655
Speaker 3: a moment. Hello, they're Mary.

1206
01:08:35,815 --> 01:08:39,335
Speaker 15: Oh yes, good morning, Peter Ash. I've been managering you

1207
01:08:39,415 --> 01:08:44,015
Speaker 15: for weeks. Plucked up the carriage this morning about building consents.

1208
01:08:44,695 --> 01:08:48,135
Speaker 15: First off, I'm not whining. I believe in rules and

1209
01:08:48,215 --> 01:08:51,775
Speaker 15: building rules. You know, they're there for a purpose. In

1210
01:08:51,815 --> 01:08:56,695
Speaker 15: my case, I had my husband built a house for

1211
01:08:56,815 --> 01:09:00,775
Speaker 15: us twelve years ago and we extended the gabled end

1212
01:09:00,815 --> 01:09:04,535
Speaker 15: out just over three and a half meters. It was

1213
01:09:04,615 --> 01:09:06,175
Speaker 15: meant to be a nice place to sit in this

1214
01:09:06,615 --> 01:09:08,935
Speaker 15: that we got these to them. We stily wins through

1215
01:09:09,015 --> 01:09:14,135
Speaker 15: there and I decided that we're going to fill the

1216
01:09:14,655 --> 01:09:18,335
Speaker 15: put three walls in there, so no plumbing, no electricity.

1217
01:09:18,695 --> 01:09:22,495
Speaker 15: The roof was already there. I ran the council. I

1218
01:09:22,535 --> 01:09:27,615
Speaker 15: had an architect droughout the plans so I was getting

1219
01:09:27,655 --> 01:09:30,735
Speaker 15: a registered builder to build it for me, so they

1220
01:09:30,815 --> 01:09:33,695
Speaker 15: knew exactly what I wanted to do. We swung the

1221
01:09:35,295 --> 01:09:41,055
Speaker 15: area was three point six by six meters across and

1222
01:09:42,015 --> 01:09:45,055
Speaker 15: it was the cost of the building consense and the

1223
01:09:45,055 --> 01:09:49,295
Speaker 15: inspections that I needed. The first quote was for eight

1224
01:09:49,375 --> 01:09:52,775
Speaker 15: hundred and twelve dollars, so it's quite a specific case.

1225
01:09:53,975 --> 01:09:57,655
Speaker 15: My husband since passed away. But I thought, well, i'd

1226
01:09:58,415 --> 01:10:01,375
Speaker 15: you know, I thought on a pension that was quite

1227
01:10:01,375 --> 01:10:03,535
Speaker 15: a bit of money. I said, was it going to

1228
01:10:03,575 --> 01:10:06,855
Speaker 15: be much much more? And they said, maybe we bit more.

1229
01:10:07,135 --> 01:10:09,975
Speaker 15: I got a bill for another two thousand dollars. I

1230
01:10:10,015 --> 01:10:17,055
Speaker 15: had seven inspections on three walls. Basically we swung the

1231
01:10:17,215 --> 01:10:21,775
Speaker 15: old wall around to you know, to face the west.

1232
01:10:22,335 --> 01:10:26,775
Speaker 15: I had two six windows, a four about a three

1233
01:10:27,135 --> 01:10:29,175
Speaker 15: meter wall put up to give me a way bit

1234
01:10:29,215 --> 01:10:33,655
Speaker 15: of privacy from the road, and just another single door.

1235
01:10:34,375 --> 01:10:36,735
Speaker 15: The thing with the cost of building I had seven

1236
01:10:36,815 --> 01:10:40,375
Speaker 15: inspections on that. I couldn't believe it. I did complain

1237
01:10:40,495 --> 01:10:44,455
Speaker 15: to them why it took so many, because it wasn't

1238
01:10:45,295 --> 01:10:47,055
Speaker 15: you know, there wasn't a lot of work that I

1239
01:10:47,095 --> 01:10:50,015
Speaker 15: could see. Still took over a month to get the

1240
01:10:51,375 --> 01:10:55,855
Speaker 15: consents reviewed. The thing is that the cost of building

1241
01:10:56,015 --> 01:11:02,535
Speaker 15: consents very right across New Zealand. That was almost you know,

1242
01:11:02,735 --> 01:11:06,015
Speaker 15: it was almost half the cost of building a whole

1243
01:11:06,055 --> 01:11:10,015
Speaker 15: house with plumbing, electricity and all the rest. I bent

1244
01:11:10,095 --> 01:11:13,695
Speaker 15: back to the council after work was done. We had

1245
01:11:13,695 --> 01:11:16,575
Speaker 15: one inspector here that didn't even wait for the border.

1246
01:11:17,215 --> 01:11:20,575
Speaker 15: One hundred and sixty nine dollars was for each inspection.

1247
01:11:21,855 --> 01:11:25,695
Speaker 15: They've now gone up to over two hundred dollars and

1248
01:11:25,735 --> 01:11:28,015
Speaker 15: he was telling me what I had to tell the border.

1249
01:11:28,655 --> 01:11:32,575
Speaker 15: So I was absolutely I think it was the unfairness

1250
01:11:32,615 --> 01:11:35,935
Speaker 15: of it. They did ask me what I wanted, and

1251
01:11:36,015 --> 01:11:37,775
Speaker 15: I thought, well, I can't get my money back, but

1252
01:11:37,855 --> 01:11:42,055
Speaker 15: that's actually what I'm wanting. I'm wanting fear costings all

1253
01:11:42,095 --> 01:11:46,695
Speaker 15: over New Zealand. Different trades people have spoken since then,

1254
01:11:46,775 --> 01:11:49,735
Speaker 15: they said it's a nightmare. I went back. I had

1255
01:11:49,735 --> 01:11:53,095
Speaker 15: a meeting with council. They said, the reason they're so

1256
01:11:53,295 --> 01:11:59,295
Speaker 15: pidentic is they're concerned about being taken to court. They

1257
01:11:59,855 --> 01:12:02,535
Speaker 15: if they don't do it. But surely if you've got

1258
01:12:02,575 --> 01:12:06,655
Speaker 15: registered builders, if they have enough insurance company fun to

1259
01:12:06,735 --> 01:12:10,215
Speaker 15: insure the most they've got enough complaints against them, so

1260
01:12:10,335 --> 01:12:13,295
Speaker 15: that would almost be self regulating. If you haven't got

1261
01:12:13,295 --> 01:12:16,095
Speaker 15: a you know, if you haven't got the.

1262
01:12:17,135 --> 01:12:20,215
Speaker 3: And I think Mary, you've summarized it perfectly there and

1263
01:12:20,255 --> 01:12:23,615
Speaker 3: you've identified exactly you know where some of those challenges are.

1264
01:12:23,695 --> 01:12:26,655
Speaker 3: And you know, I'm not pretending that there's simple solutions

1265
01:12:26,655 --> 01:12:29,815
Speaker 3: to this, but what you've said there is perfectly succinct

1266
01:12:29,855 --> 01:12:32,775
Speaker 3: in the sense that work like that done by a

1267
01:12:32,815 --> 01:12:38,535
Speaker 3: license building practitioner with the appropriate insurance sort of removes

1268
01:12:38,615 --> 01:12:42,175
Speaker 3: counsel from the liability side of it or all of

1269
01:12:42,255 --> 01:12:48,335
Speaker 3: the liability and allows things to be to have controls,

1270
01:12:48,375 --> 01:12:52,655
Speaker 3: to have a system in place that will look after

1271
01:12:52,735 --> 01:12:56,695
Speaker 3: any faults later on via insurance and could speed the

1272
01:12:56,735 --> 01:12:58,895
Speaker 3: process up. And I think that's what we should be

1273
01:12:58,895 --> 01:13:01,295
Speaker 3: looking at. I thank you very much for your comments,

1274
01:13:01,375 --> 01:13:04,295
Speaker 3: very wise, all the very best. It is seven forty

1275
01:13:04,335 --> 01:13:06,215
Speaker 3: six here at used Talk Set B. We've got Nick

1276
01:13:06,335 --> 01:13:08,935
Speaker 3: Hardy Jones coming up in just a moment, and it's

1277
01:13:08,975 --> 01:13:11,295
Speaker 3: my pleasure to welcome back to the show now a

1278
01:13:11,455 --> 01:13:14,615
Speaker 3: regular contributor to Cardi Jones from Metro Performance Glass A

1279
01:13:14,695 --> 01:13:15,095
Speaker 3: very good.

1280
01:13:15,015 --> 01:13:16,855
Speaker 10: Morning, Good morning, Peter.

1281
01:13:17,135 --> 01:13:20,735
Speaker 3: Three things now, lots I've never think I don't think

1282
01:13:20,735 --> 01:13:22,615
Speaker 3: I can remember a time where building has been as

1283
01:13:22,655 --> 01:13:26,215
Speaker 3: political as it is. Lots of discussion at the moment

1284
01:13:26,335 --> 01:13:29,495
Speaker 3: around things like you know, changes to H one, which

1285
01:13:29,535 --> 01:13:32,855
Speaker 3: I think is a sector. Everybody you know, knew that

1286
01:13:32,895 --> 01:13:36,175
Speaker 3: it was happening, reworked everything, got ourselves ready and now

1287
01:13:36,215 --> 01:13:38,775
Speaker 3: suddenly there's possibility it's going to be rolled back. But

1288
01:13:40,055 --> 01:13:42,895
Speaker 3: in terms of New Zealand houses, we often love the

1289
01:13:43,015 --> 01:13:45,615
Speaker 3: view and so to get the maximum of the view,

1290
01:13:45,655 --> 01:13:48,175
Speaker 3: we end up with a lot of glass in our houses.

1291
01:13:48,615 --> 01:13:52,735
Speaker 3: So in terms of H one in compliance, how important

1292
01:13:52,935 --> 01:13:54,255
Speaker 3: is the glazing selection?

1293
01:13:54,415 --> 01:13:58,455
Speaker 8: Now, yeah, it really is important. As you're right, the

1294
01:13:58,495 --> 01:14:01,015
Speaker 8: windows are often considered the weakest part of the firmal

1295
01:14:01,015 --> 01:14:04,255
Speaker 8: performance of a home, right and so look there the

1296
01:14:04,295 --> 01:14:06,295
Speaker 8: whole idea and that H one change was to increase

1297
01:14:06,495 --> 01:14:09,455
Speaker 8: the insulation of value and homes to act them more efficient.

1298
01:14:09,775 --> 01:14:12,175
Speaker 8: The glass is critically important to that because it makes

1299
01:14:12,255 --> 01:14:15,135
Speaker 8: up such a big surface area and so you know,

1300
01:14:15,335 --> 01:14:17,975
Speaker 8: using the benefits of technology and low e coating, you

1301
01:14:18,015 --> 01:14:20,535
Speaker 8: can really list that several forms of a home and

1302
01:14:20,575 --> 01:14:22,495
Speaker 8: retain the light coming into your building.

1303
01:14:23,295 --> 01:14:26,015
Speaker 3: So that's a focus where we're looking at our glazing.

1304
01:14:26,055 --> 01:14:30,655
Speaker 3: We're looking at heat loss through heat transfer through glazing,

1305
01:14:31,015 --> 01:14:32,975
Speaker 3: and so we're saying we want to trap that on

1306
01:14:33,055 --> 01:14:35,295
Speaker 3: the inside. And then of course as soon as we

1307
01:14:35,335 --> 01:14:37,535
Speaker 3: start focusing on that, then we get stories like the

1308
01:14:37,535 --> 01:14:41,095
Speaker 3: one and stuff. A couple of months ago, people moved

1309
01:14:41,095 --> 01:14:45,255
Speaker 3: into new townhouses, you know, fully compliant et cetera. Going

1310
01:14:45,455 --> 01:14:50,655
Speaker 3: they are overheating. So can we have both? Can we

1311
01:14:50,735 --> 01:14:53,135
Speaker 3: what is solar or solar control?

1312
01:14:54,335 --> 01:14:56,615
Speaker 8: Yeah, that's a really good point. So the key point

1313
01:14:56,655 --> 01:14:59,735
Speaker 8: there is that the insulation doesn't increase the temperature of

1314
01:14:59,775 --> 01:15:03,295
Speaker 8: the home. Yes, it essentially insulates the home from the

1315
01:15:03,335 --> 01:15:06,215
Speaker 8: temperature from the outside. So the design of it is

1316
01:15:06,455 --> 01:15:11,135
Speaker 8: keep keep a moderately temperate condition inside the home. So

1317
01:15:11,735 --> 01:15:14,695
Speaker 8: if you don't have high performing double glazing and you

1318
01:15:14,775 --> 01:15:17,575
Speaker 8: highly insulate a home, then the solar heat control a

1319
01:15:17,655 --> 01:15:20,815
Speaker 8: sole heat coming into the home can cause homes to

1320
01:15:20,815 --> 01:15:24,095
Speaker 8: become uncomfortable. But there are simple ways you can achieve

1321
01:15:25,295 --> 01:15:28,375
Speaker 8: ways to reduce that. So you can have solar heat

1322
01:15:28,375 --> 01:15:31,255
Speaker 8: control in your double glazing, and that will mean that

1323
01:15:31,375 --> 01:15:33,055
Speaker 8: in the winter you get the benefits of the low

1324
01:15:33,095 --> 01:15:35,535
Speaker 8: e keeping the heating, and then in the summer it

1325
01:15:35,535 --> 01:15:37,855
Speaker 8: gives you some control, so you reduce the amount of

1326
01:15:37,935 --> 01:15:41,335
Speaker 8: solar heat coming into the home and prevent that overheating effect.

1327
01:15:42,135 --> 01:15:44,655
Speaker 3: And if you opt for that, if you add solar

1328
01:15:44,735 --> 01:15:47,935
Speaker 3: control to the double glazing, what you in a sense

1329
01:15:48,015 --> 01:15:51,895
Speaker 3: for go is passive solar gain in winter, but you

1330
01:15:52,895 --> 01:15:54,855
Speaker 3: then don't get it when you don't want it, which

1331
01:15:54,895 --> 01:15:55,655
Speaker 3: is in summer time.

1332
01:15:56,295 --> 01:15:58,415
Speaker 8: That's okay, Yeah, that's exactly right, and that's what we

1333
01:15:58,455 --> 01:16:01,575
Speaker 8: talk about. You know, is there a one piece that

1334
01:16:01,695 --> 01:16:04,095
Speaker 8: fits all? I think really when you're thinking that glazing,

1335
01:16:04,135 --> 01:16:06,855
Speaker 8: it's really about understanding, you know, whilst the orientation of

1336
01:16:06,895 --> 01:16:09,175
Speaker 8: the home, what's the amount of blazing in the home,

1337
01:16:09,615 --> 01:16:14,055
Speaker 8: and you know, for example, east and west facing areas

1338
01:16:14,415 --> 01:16:16,735
Speaker 8: often actually attract a huge amount of solar heat game

1339
01:16:16,815 --> 01:16:20,455
Speaker 8: through a home. So if you've got lots of glazing

1340
01:16:20,495 --> 01:16:24,175
Speaker 8: on the northeast and west, and you've got really really

1341
01:16:24,215 --> 01:16:27,535
Speaker 8: big windows and maybe some quite raltively small leaves, then

1342
01:16:27,615 --> 01:16:30,335
Speaker 8: thinking about solar heat control into your glazing is a

1343
01:16:30,335 --> 01:16:31,335
Speaker 8: really really good thing to do.

1344
01:16:31,735 --> 01:16:31,935
Speaker 5: Yeah.

1345
01:16:31,975 --> 01:16:35,655
Speaker 3: Absolutely, In terms of you know, what you can do

1346
01:16:35,775 --> 01:16:39,335
Speaker 3: around solar control, is there a variety of options?

1347
01:16:40,295 --> 01:16:43,895
Speaker 8: Yeah, there really is. So. Traditionally solar control had been

1348
01:16:43,975 --> 01:16:47,575
Speaker 8: achieved by using tinted or reflective glass. Now you can

1349
01:16:47,655 --> 01:16:50,575
Speaker 8: still do that, but they do also reduce a lot

1350
01:16:50,615 --> 01:16:53,495
Speaker 8: of the light coming into the home. So again with

1351
01:16:53,535 --> 01:16:57,655
Speaker 8: modern technology and modern lowise, you can now have a

1352
01:16:57,735 --> 01:17:00,135
Speaker 8: huge amount of solar controls. We're talking that you can

1353
01:17:00,135 --> 01:17:04,215
Speaker 8: achieve thirty to sixty percent more solar control than a

1354
01:17:04,255 --> 01:17:08,975
Speaker 8: standard double glazed unit and still achieve light transmission of

1355
01:17:09,935 --> 01:17:13,415
Speaker 8: eighty percent. To put that in some context, a tinted

1356
01:17:13,455 --> 01:17:16,815
Speaker 8: glass might reduce your light transmission down to about half

1357
01:17:16,975 --> 01:17:21,615
Speaker 8: about fifty percent. So with modern high end double glazing,

1358
01:17:21,895 --> 01:17:26,055
Speaker 8: you can achieve the solar control, knock out about thirty

1359
01:17:26,055 --> 01:17:28,375
Speaker 8: to sixty percent of that solar heat game, and still

1360
01:17:28,375 --> 01:17:29,935
Speaker 8: have a lot of light coming into the home.

1361
01:17:31,095 --> 01:17:34,575
Speaker 3: And so I suppose it's that horses for courses, isn't

1362
01:17:34,575 --> 01:17:36,655
Speaker 3: it that? You You know, when we're talking about glazing,

1363
01:17:36,695 --> 01:17:40,375
Speaker 3: we need to very much focus on what do I

1364
01:17:40,415 --> 01:17:42,935
Speaker 3: want it to do here and what you might want

1365
01:17:42,975 --> 01:17:45,335
Speaker 3: it to do on thel The south side of a

1366
01:17:45,375 --> 01:17:47,615
Speaker 3: house is quite different to the northern side of a house,

1367
01:17:48,015 --> 01:17:50,535
Speaker 3: and so there's no reason when we're thinking about, you know,

1368
01:17:50,855 --> 01:17:54,415
Speaker 3: exterior glazing, that we change what we've got depending on

1369
01:17:54,455 --> 01:17:54,935
Speaker 3: where it is.

1370
01:17:56,095 --> 01:17:56,295
Speaker 14: Yeah.

1371
01:17:56,335 --> 01:17:59,015
Speaker 8: Absolutely, and I think that, you know, when we're talking

1372
01:17:59,055 --> 01:18:02,015
Speaker 8: about retrofitting older homes, taking out single glazing and going

1373
01:18:02,055 --> 01:18:04,575
Speaker 8: to double glazing, we often had that conversation you put

1374
01:18:04,615 --> 01:18:08,175
Speaker 8: the right glass into the building for acoustics around road

1375
01:18:08,215 --> 01:18:11,655
Speaker 8: noise YEP, or managing solar heat control. And I think

1376
01:18:11,695 --> 01:18:14,135
Speaker 8: we now need to be having that conversation more with

1377
01:18:14,295 --> 01:18:17,095
Speaker 8: new homes, really modeling them to have the right outcomes

1378
01:18:17,095 --> 01:18:17,895
Speaker 8: for the occupants.

1379
01:18:18,135 --> 01:18:21,135
Speaker 3: Yeah, and let's put to rest this notion that somehow

1380
01:18:21,255 --> 01:18:24,375
Speaker 3: insulation in all of its forms, whether it's in wall,

1381
01:18:24,415 --> 01:18:30,535
Speaker 3: ceilings or in glazing, does not contribute completely to overheating.

1382
01:18:29,975 --> 01:18:30,135
Speaker 10: You know.

1383
01:18:30,215 --> 01:18:33,015
Speaker 3: I think it's it's a simplistic sort of view that's

1384
01:18:33,095 --> 01:18:36,095
Speaker 3: started to emerge. Oh, we're putting too much insulation into

1385
01:18:36,135 --> 01:18:39,175
Speaker 3: our houses. That's why they're overheating. That's not why they're overheating.

1386
01:18:39,215 --> 01:18:41,935
Speaker 3: They're overheating because it's poor design or lack of ventilation,

1387
01:18:42,535 --> 01:18:44,615
Speaker 3: not good quality insulation.

1388
01:18:45,935 --> 01:18:48,495
Speaker 8: It's absolutely career, absolutely.

1389
01:18:48,455 --> 01:18:50,855
Speaker 3: Lots of information, and I think it's I think it's

1390
01:18:50,855 --> 01:18:54,975
Speaker 3: really important that people start to think about I suppose

1391
01:18:54,975 --> 01:18:57,975
Speaker 3: some of the complexity, and often we're scared of complexity

1392
01:18:59,055 --> 01:19:01,695
Speaker 3: and it can seem really daunting, but this notion that

1393
01:19:01,735 --> 01:19:04,775
Speaker 3: there's not a one size fits all, especially when it

1394
01:19:04,775 --> 01:19:06,935
Speaker 3: comes to glazing, that you can and get it to

1395
01:19:06,975 --> 01:19:09,735
Speaker 3: do what you need it to do on very very

1396
01:19:09,775 --> 01:19:12,855
Speaker 3: specific locations, for specific needs.

1397
01:19:15,015 --> 01:19:16,895
Speaker 8: Right, then you don't have to have that compromise.

1398
01:19:17,375 --> 01:19:17,575
Speaker 7: Yeah.

1399
01:19:17,615 --> 01:19:20,455
Speaker 3: Absolutely. If people want to find out more, what's the

1400
01:19:20,455 --> 01:19:21,735
Speaker 3: best way of getting in touch.

1401
01:19:22,575 --> 01:19:24,895
Speaker 8: It is, want to get in contact with your local

1402
01:19:24,895 --> 01:19:28,055
Speaker 8: Metro direut contact Metro Performance Class through the website or

1403
01:19:28,095 --> 01:19:28,495
Speaker 8: on the phone.

1404
01:19:28,775 --> 01:19:31,455
Speaker 3: Perfect Nick. Always a pleasure talking with you. Thanks for

1405
01:19:31,455 --> 01:19:34,535
Speaker 3: the advice, Thanks so much, all best you take care, Bob.

1406
01:19:34,615 --> 01:19:37,495
Speaker 3: I think after the break we'll continue with more of

1407
01:19:37,535 --> 01:19:39,695
Speaker 3: your calls if you've got a question. Eight hundred and

1408
01:19:39,735 --> 01:19:42,695
Speaker 3: eighty ten eighty is the number to call. Lots and

1409
01:19:42,735 --> 01:19:48,095
Speaker 3: lots of texts around the building consents and so on,

1410
01:19:48,175 --> 01:19:50,655
Speaker 3: and I like, I'm really really reluctant to put the

1411
01:19:50,655 --> 01:19:53,295
Speaker 3: boot into council. And I think counsel are in an

1412
01:19:53,455 --> 01:19:58,055
Speaker 3: enviewable position where they've been left as being the person responsible,

1413
01:19:58,215 --> 01:20:02,375
Speaker 3: the entity responsible for buildings after the contractors have gone

1414
01:20:02,375 --> 01:20:04,575
Speaker 3: et cetera, et cetera, And so it's not surprising that

1415
01:20:04,575 --> 01:20:06,975
Speaker 3: they've taken a low risk approach. So is there a

1416
01:20:07,015 --> 01:20:12,175
Speaker 3: way of not de risking it but sharing liability when

1417
01:20:12,215 --> 01:20:14,495
Speaker 3: things go wrong? And is insurance the best way to

1418
01:20:14,535 --> 01:20:17,655
Speaker 3: do that? Lots and lots of texts on that as well.

1419
01:20:18,735 --> 01:20:21,215
Speaker 3: So if you'd like to talk about that, we can

1420
01:20:21,255 --> 01:20:24,335
Speaker 3: talk all things building and construction after the break. Remember

1421
01:20:24,375 --> 01:20:27,455
Speaker 3: at eight thirty we've also got a decline pass joining

1422
01:20:27,535 --> 01:20:29,415
Speaker 3: us and we're jumping into the garden with Rid from

1423
01:20:29,415 --> 01:20:29,935
Speaker 3: eight thirty.

1424
01:20:30,655 --> 01:20:36,455
Speaker 5: Ay you traction care shoe.

1425
01:20:37,055 --> 01:20:40,055
Speaker 3: Your news talks they'd be And just going back a

1426
01:20:40,055 --> 01:20:42,815
Speaker 3: little bit the just before the news, we had Nick

1427
01:20:42,815 --> 01:20:46,455
Speaker 3: Cardi Jones from Metro Performance class. I mean, it's funny

1428
01:20:46,455 --> 01:20:50,655
Speaker 3: how the sort of public discussion. I'm genuinely I'm quite

1429
01:20:50,695 --> 01:20:55,095
Speaker 3: intrigued and quite excited about the amount of discourse, let's say,

1430
01:20:55,495 --> 01:21:00,935
Speaker 3: discussion in public circles around buildings and building legislation, building performance,

1431
01:21:02,015 --> 01:21:05,455
Speaker 3: you know, government regulation, et cetera, et cetera, whether it's

1432
01:21:05,535 --> 01:21:09,695
Speaker 3: around the current discussion about sixty square meter buildings potentially

1433
01:21:09,695 --> 01:21:13,655
Speaker 3: being able to be built without necessarily requiring a building consent,

1434
01:21:14,095 --> 01:21:18,135
Speaker 3: whether it's proposed changes to H one standards, so they

1435
01:21:18,335 --> 01:21:22,255
Speaker 3: increased as of November of last year, and then suddenly

1436
01:21:22,455 --> 01:21:25,535
Speaker 3: people are saying, oh, it's added too much cost, it's unaffordable,

1437
01:21:25,775 --> 01:21:28,255
Speaker 3: we need to roll back H one and so on.

1438
01:21:28,935 --> 01:21:32,735
Speaker 3: And then a lot of discussion and comment online and

1439
01:21:32,775 --> 01:21:36,535
Speaker 3: in the media around our houses now because we've started

1440
01:21:36,535 --> 01:21:39,735
Speaker 3: to insulate them really warmly, really well, they're too hot,

1441
01:21:39,815 --> 01:21:42,775
Speaker 3: they're overheating, as if the insulation is to blame for that,

1442
01:21:42,855 --> 01:21:45,735
Speaker 3: which is nonsense, and even I think I read it

1443
01:21:45,735 --> 01:21:48,735
Speaker 3: out a little while ago a brand's response. So this

1444
01:21:48,815 --> 01:21:53,215
Speaker 3: is the Building Research Authority of New Zealand, whose whole

1445
01:21:53,295 --> 01:21:55,735
Speaker 3: job it is is to research these things, and they've

1446
01:21:55,735 --> 01:21:59,335
Speaker 3: made a very clear statement around saying no, added insulation

1447
01:21:59,535 --> 01:22:02,135
Speaker 3: is not the cause of overheating to buildings. So this

1448
01:22:02,295 --> 01:22:05,495
Speaker 3: was a story in the paper probably a month or

1449
01:22:05,535 --> 01:22:07,735
Speaker 3: two ago, when it will sort of the end of summer,

1450
01:22:08,015 --> 01:22:09,815
Speaker 3: people going well, hang on, I've just moved into a

1451
01:22:09,855 --> 01:22:12,615
Speaker 3: brand new townhouse and I'm finding that I'm spending an

1452
01:22:12,735 --> 01:22:15,415
Speaker 3: enormous amount on energy to run the heat pump to

1453
01:22:15,495 --> 01:22:18,655
Speaker 3: cool the house down. The house is too hot. The

1454
01:22:18,695 --> 01:22:21,215
Speaker 3: house is too hot because it's probably to be blunt,

1455
01:22:21,215 --> 01:22:25,575
Speaker 3: poorly designed, rather than it's got good insulation in it.

1456
01:22:26,375 --> 01:22:29,055
Speaker 3: So interesting to discuss that with Nick, but also around

1457
01:22:29,095 --> 01:22:32,495
Speaker 3: that complexity about different glazing styles and I think getting

1458
01:22:32,495 --> 01:22:35,415
Speaker 3: away from this notion that we've always typically had that

1459
01:22:36,255 --> 01:22:37,975
Speaker 3: I mean, back in the day when you had very

1460
01:22:37,975 --> 01:22:41,015
Speaker 3: little choice, there was glass right there, was there was

1461
01:22:41,055 --> 01:22:43,015
Speaker 3: a single piece of glass and you put it in.

1462
01:22:43,175 --> 01:22:45,415
Speaker 3: You might need to put some safety glass in. If

1463
01:22:45,415 --> 01:22:47,575
Speaker 3: it was a big window, you might need to do

1464
01:22:47,615 --> 01:22:49,655
Speaker 3: a laminate, if it was in a bathroom, et cetera,

1465
01:22:49,655 --> 01:22:53,375
Speaker 3: et cetera. But now suddenly there's options for solar control

1466
01:22:53,455 --> 01:22:57,495
Speaker 3: around more insulation to keep heat transferred to a minimum,

1467
01:22:57,535 --> 01:23:00,575
Speaker 3: keep it inside the house, to prevent it from overheating.

1468
01:23:00,935 --> 01:23:04,695
Speaker 3: These ways of doing solar gain. And you might want

1469
01:23:04,775 --> 01:23:07,575
Speaker 3: acoustic performance and you can do that in different windows

1470
01:23:07,655 --> 01:23:12,095
Speaker 3: all way around the house. So I think we need

1471
01:23:12,135 --> 01:23:17,095
Speaker 3: to embrace complexity. We'd like things to be simple, but

1472
01:23:17,175 --> 01:23:21,855
Speaker 3: sometimes they're just not. In buildings. This is the dichotomy

1473
01:23:21,855 --> 01:23:23,975
Speaker 3: I guess of buildings that I really enjoy as well,

1474
01:23:24,015 --> 01:23:28,055
Speaker 3: particularly the discussion about them, is that in a basic sense,

1475
01:23:28,095 --> 01:23:30,535
Speaker 3: our buildings are shelter, right, That's what they're there for.

1476
01:23:32,455 --> 01:23:36,615
Speaker 3: They're the cave that we had when we were cave people,

1477
01:23:37,015 --> 01:23:40,455
Speaker 3: cave men, you know. They're the hut that we might

1478
01:23:40,495 --> 01:23:42,495
Speaker 3: have had in the Middle Ages, those sorts of things,

1479
01:23:42,495 --> 01:23:46,695
Speaker 3: and so they're still shelter today, but they've become far

1480
01:23:46,775 --> 01:23:50,455
Speaker 3: more complex than that as we demand more of them.

1481
01:23:50,935 --> 01:23:53,375
Speaker 3: We don't want to spend an enormous amount of energy

1482
01:23:54,255 --> 01:23:58,375
Speaker 3: either heating our houses in winter because they're poorly built,

1483
01:23:58,735 --> 01:24:02,135
Speaker 3: and all of that heat simply leaks out through the cladding,

1484
01:24:02,175 --> 01:24:04,935
Speaker 3: through the walls, through the ceilings, through the floor. So

1485
01:24:05,735 --> 01:24:08,455
Speaker 3: as a means of getting energy efficiency, we want to

1486
01:24:08,455 --> 01:24:11,855
Speaker 3: make the houses perform better. We want their thermal performance

1487
01:24:11,895 --> 01:24:15,695
Speaker 3: to increase, and that's a complicated thing to do. I

1488
01:24:15,735 --> 01:24:18,935
Speaker 3: saw a set of building, of set of plans about

1489
01:24:18,935 --> 01:24:22,415
Speaker 3: to be submitted for building consent soon, and someone asked

1490
01:24:22,415 --> 01:24:24,375
Speaker 3: me just to sort of cast my eye over it,

1491
01:24:24,415 --> 01:24:26,815
Speaker 3: and the thing that jumped out at me was that

1492
01:24:27,375 --> 01:24:30,575
Speaker 3: the way in which they had put the they'd gone

1493
01:24:30,655 --> 01:24:35,095
Speaker 3: for good quality glazing, good chlority joinery, but they hung

1494
01:24:35,135 --> 01:24:40,655
Speaker 3: it outboard of the insulation line, so, you know, reducing

1495
01:24:40,735 --> 01:24:44,535
Speaker 3: the performance of that simply by a lack of awareness

1496
01:24:44,535 --> 01:24:48,535
Speaker 3: around what is best practice today. So that's where what

1497
01:24:48,655 --> 01:24:52,375
Speaker 3: looks simple can be complex. And it's complex because they

1498
01:24:52,375 --> 01:24:56,175
Speaker 3: are a dynamic situation. Our buildings are dynamic and we

1499
01:24:56,215 --> 01:24:58,495
Speaker 3: need to understand how they perform in order to get

1500
01:24:58,535 --> 01:25:02,935
Speaker 3: the best out of them. So it's that great dichotomy.

1501
01:25:03,295 --> 01:25:06,255
Speaker 3: They're simple at shelter, but they're not because they're comple

1502
01:25:06,535 --> 01:25:10,775
Speaker 3: structures and complex environments with any number of competing forces

1503
01:25:10,815 --> 01:25:13,855
Speaker 3: that we need to be able to manage and control

1504
01:25:14,015 --> 01:25:15,735
Speaker 3: to get the best out of the buildings that we

1505
01:25:15,935 --> 01:25:17,855
Speaker 3: live in. I eight hundred eighty ten eighty is the

1506
01:25:17,895 --> 01:25:19,895
Speaker 3: number to call if you've got a comment that you'd

1507
01:25:19,935 --> 01:25:22,495
Speaker 3: like to make on anything building. I eight hundred eighty

1508
01:25:22,575 --> 01:25:28,055
Speaker 3: ten eighty is the number to call. Actually, someone's oh,

1509
01:25:28,135 --> 01:25:30,975
Speaker 3: I'm just going to grab this text before we earlier.

1510
01:25:31,015 --> 01:25:33,175
Speaker 3: Calling wanting to upgrade their bathroom and place the bath

1511
01:25:33,255 --> 01:25:36,055
Speaker 3: with a shower cup. Won't necessarily have to install ventilation

1512
01:25:37,575 --> 01:25:39,535
Speaker 3: if they cover the top of the cube. Call with

1513
01:25:39,695 --> 01:25:45,975
Speaker 3: a dome, install ventilation. Just put decent ventilation in our

1514
01:25:46,295 --> 01:25:49,615
Speaker 3: My new ventilation expert Storm is going to join us.

1515
01:25:50,055 --> 01:25:52,055
Speaker 3: I've got to set that up sometime the next couple

1516
01:25:52,095 --> 01:25:54,815
Speaker 3: of weeks, so we'll talk all things ventilation. A deep

1517
01:25:54,935 --> 01:25:57,055
Speaker 3: dive into ventilation coming up on the show in the

1518
01:25:57,175 --> 01:25:59,015
Speaker 3: couple of weeks. I eight hundred eighty ten eighty the

1519
01:25:59,095 --> 01:26:03,175
Speaker 3: number to call. Aaron, Good morning to you. Sure see

1520
01:26:03,215 --> 01:26:05,375
Speaker 3: how we gotta I'm well, thank you and yourself.

1521
01:26:06,615 --> 01:26:08,735
Speaker 10: I'm not not too bad on this wet, rainy day.

1522
01:26:08,655 --> 01:26:10,535
Speaker 3: For it's pretty miserable.

1523
01:26:13,655 --> 01:26:15,735
Speaker 10: But you know, we just we just get on and

1524
01:26:15,775 --> 01:26:16,175
Speaker 10: do stuff.

1525
01:26:16,215 --> 01:26:19,975
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think I'd sucked myself into this notion that somehow,

1526
01:26:20,535 --> 01:26:22,615
Speaker 3: you know, winter had passed us by, and that I

1527
01:26:22,655 --> 01:26:25,455
Speaker 3: could see fresh shoots on the plum tree and all

1528
01:26:25,455 --> 01:26:27,375
Speaker 3: the rest of it, Oh goodie, summers on the way.

1529
01:26:27,415 --> 01:26:29,535
Speaker 3: And then I was in the shed yesterday. I think

1530
01:26:29,735 --> 01:26:33,615
Speaker 3: this is miserable. Yeah, that's not what we're talking about.

1531
01:26:34,095 --> 01:26:34,535
Speaker 3: What's up?

1532
01:26:34,735 --> 01:26:38,695
Speaker 10: No, listen, I've yeah, we've got a family beach house

1533
01:26:38,775 --> 01:26:42,055
Speaker 10: over and Caramelo cook speech and being a sleep out

1534
01:26:42,055 --> 01:26:44,015
Speaker 10: at the back like an apartment right now. Got pretty

1535
01:26:44,055 --> 01:26:46,295
Speaker 10: month in the in the in the storms talking about

1536
01:26:46,295 --> 01:26:49,895
Speaker 10: storms and slattered and things like that, and basically everything

1537
01:26:49,935 --> 01:26:53,495
Speaker 10: got paid out and all good. So bringing a builder me.

1538
01:26:53,615 --> 01:26:55,095
Speaker 10: I got four brothers. We're all going to go and

1539
01:26:55,135 --> 01:26:56,895
Speaker 10: get my hand. Get a little dunker's dad sort of

1540
01:26:57,175 --> 01:26:59,455
Speaker 10: early eighties. He's determined to do it, but he's too

1541
01:26:59,455 --> 01:27:01,975
Speaker 10: old to do it anyway. I got a younger brother

1542
01:27:01,975 --> 01:27:05,375
Speaker 10: who's embarrassed and he always likes an argument and an easygoing.

1543
01:27:05,415 --> 01:27:07,575
Speaker 10: All fellas I think need some content to this and

1544
01:27:07,575 --> 01:27:10,495
Speaker 10: that and blah blah blah. Basically we're just replacing like

1545
01:27:10,575 --> 01:27:13,015
Speaker 10: to like you know, just pulling the jib off, replacing

1546
01:27:13,055 --> 01:27:17,135
Speaker 10: that plastom, painting, piling, new shower and new vanity. Nothing

1547
01:27:17,135 --> 01:27:19,935
Speaker 10: more than that. And is there anything that I need

1548
01:27:19,935 --> 01:27:22,535
Speaker 10: to get a PCBC, a goo? Can we do we

1549
01:27:22,615 --> 01:27:23,375
Speaker 10: need to do anything?

1550
01:27:24,455 --> 01:27:30,855
Speaker 3: I think your your barrister mate is wise, I brother,

1551
01:27:31,335 --> 01:27:32,455
Speaker 3: even wiser than.

1552
01:27:34,495 --> 01:27:34,775
Speaker 14: Is that.

1553
01:27:34,935 --> 01:27:38,575
Speaker 3: You're probably on a really fine line. Right. So, for example,

1554
01:27:38,695 --> 01:27:41,775
Speaker 3: if you were to remove that wall lining on an

1555
01:27:41,815 --> 01:27:44,295
Speaker 3: exterior wall and then you go, hey, this is a

1556
01:27:44,295 --> 01:27:47,935
Speaker 3: perfect opportunity to add some insulation that triggers requirement for

1557
01:27:47,975 --> 01:27:50,255
Speaker 3: building consent. If you were just to take the wall

1558
01:27:50,295 --> 01:27:52,935
Speaker 3: lining off and replace it and not add insulation, which

1559
01:27:52,975 --> 01:27:56,215
Speaker 3: would be foolish because it's perfect opportunity, then you could

1560
01:27:56,255 --> 01:27:58,255
Speaker 3: say I don't need I can do that under schedule

1561
01:27:58,295 --> 01:28:00,015
Speaker 3: one of the acts. So yes, there.

1562
01:27:59,895 --> 01:28:03,375
Speaker 10: Are things that apartment at the back's only about five

1563
01:28:03,455 --> 01:28:07,815
Speaker 10: years old anyway, as well boathouse that go turn it's sintilated.

1564
01:28:08,295 --> 01:28:10,815
Speaker 10: So it's all like to like really yep.

1565
01:28:11,175 --> 01:28:14,655
Speaker 3: And I think where people sort of stretch the it's

1566
01:28:14,775 --> 01:28:17,895
Speaker 3: maintenance thing too. It's actually a whole new build. So

1567
01:28:18,015 --> 01:28:21,375
Speaker 3: for example, if you were to remove a section of cladding,

1568
01:28:21,735 --> 01:28:24,415
Speaker 3: you can quantify that as maintenance. If you were to

1569
01:28:24,495 --> 01:28:27,615
Speaker 3: replace all of the exterior cladding, then that would trigger

1570
01:28:27,655 --> 01:28:30,015
Speaker 3: a requirement for a building consent. So I think if

1571
01:28:30,455 --> 01:28:33,975
Speaker 3: if what you're doing is literally like for like, then

1572
01:28:34,015 --> 01:28:36,935
Speaker 3: I think you're probably on reasonably safe grounds. The other

1573
01:28:37,015 --> 01:28:41,135
Speaker 3: thing that's really really important, and I kind of realize

1574
01:28:41,135 --> 01:28:44,375
Speaker 3: that I'm repeating myself. Often even work that is done

1575
01:28:44,375 --> 01:28:47,655
Speaker 3: that doesn't necessarily require a building consent must be done

1576
01:28:47,655 --> 01:28:50,215
Speaker 3: to the building code. So for example, if you were

1577
01:28:50,255 --> 01:28:53,455
Speaker 3: swapping out a window, then the way that it's installed,

1578
01:28:53,495 --> 01:28:56,655
Speaker 3: the way the performance expectations have to be up to

1579
01:28:56,735 --> 01:28:57,575
Speaker 3: building code.

1580
01:28:59,015 --> 01:29:03,175
Speaker 10: If you just keep that safe and sanitaries.

1581
01:29:03,775 --> 01:29:07,015
Speaker 3: Or no safe and stantaries. No, but they do. There

1582
01:29:07,095 --> 01:29:10,775
Speaker 3: is a certificate of acceptance, so a CoA, But the

1583
01:29:10,775 --> 01:29:14,855
Speaker 3: burden of proof to obtain that is almost as high

1584
01:29:14,895 --> 01:29:18,415
Speaker 3: as a building consent now. So and the reason for

1585
01:29:18,495 --> 01:29:21,655
Speaker 3: that is counsels. Basically, you've got sick of people doing

1586
01:29:21,735 --> 01:29:24,015
Speaker 3: work knowing that they should have got a building consent

1587
01:29:24,375 --> 01:29:28,295
Speaker 3: then kind of going oop, sorry, sorry, silly me, Can

1588
01:29:28,295 --> 01:29:31,255
Speaker 3: I have one of those coas please? And they go, oh, actually,

1589
01:29:31,295 --> 01:29:33,455
Speaker 3: you've got to prove that it's compliant and that's that's

1590
01:29:33,535 --> 01:29:35,015
Speaker 3: quite a process.

1591
01:29:35,535 --> 01:29:37,295
Speaker 10: Well, I look forward to going back to my young

1592
01:29:37,335 --> 01:29:39,775
Speaker 10: embarraster brother and telling him he's wrong because people.

1593
01:29:39,615 --> 01:29:46,055
Speaker 3: Well, yes, steady on be sued, but I suspect he

1594
01:29:46,175 --> 01:29:51,975
Speaker 3: is wise but maybe overly cautious. Good luck all this,

1595
01:29:52,335 --> 01:29:57,575
Speaker 3: take care. Well, then your news talks se'd be if

1596
01:29:57,575 --> 01:29:59,375
Speaker 3: I'm not here next week because I've been sued by

1597
01:29:59,415 --> 01:30:02,015
Speaker 3: embarrass you'll understand why. Oh eight one hundred and eighty

1598
01:30:02,095 --> 01:30:05,655
Speaker 3: ten eighty is that number to call? Lots of questions

1599
01:30:05,695 --> 01:30:08,455
Speaker 3: about conced It's lots of text about it. New shower

1600
01:30:08,495 --> 01:30:11,535
Speaker 3: with waterproofing? Does this need building consent? Yes? I believe

1601
01:30:11,575 --> 01:30:14,255
Speaker 3: it does. So if you're doing a tile shower with

1602
01:30:14,375 --> 01:30:18,495
Speaker 3: a waterproof lining underneath it, like a whether it's a

1603
01:30:18,535 --> 01:30:20,735
Speaker 3: peel and stick or a brush on application, if it's

1604
01:30:20,775 --> 01:30:24,095
Speaker 3: a waterproof system that you're installing, yes, that triggers a

1605
01:30:24,135 --> 01:30:27,695
Speaker 3: requirement for a building consent, even if it's not necessarily

1606
01:30:27,775 --> 01:30:31,055
Speaker 3: level entry. So even if you've got if you're not

1607
01:30:31,135 --> 01:30:33,375
Speaker 3: changing the floor, you're building it up and you're putting

1608
01:30:33,415 --> 01:30:37,375
Speaker 3: a hob or a plinth around the edge, that still

1609
01:30:37,415 --> 01:30:40,535
Speaker 3: triggers the requirement for a building consent. As I understand it. Oh,

1610
01:30:40,615 --> 01:30:42,295
Speaker 3: eight hundred and eighty ten eighty, we need to take

1611
01:30:42,295 --> 01:30:45,295
Speaker 3: short break back in a mote. When we're talking tools

1612
01:30:45,335 --> 01:30:48,095
Speaker 3: for working in the garden and the yard, there's one

1613
01:30:48,175 --> 01:30:50,895
Speaker 3: trusted brand that stands out as having the widest range,

1614
01:30:50,895 --> 01:30:54,775
Speaker 3: the most durable products, and importantly, a nationwide chain of

1615
01:30:54,775 --> 01:30:57,975
Speaker 3: retail and server centers. And that includes the fifteen stores

1616
01:30:58,295 --> 01:31:01,775
Speaker 3: right across Auckland. You guessed it, it's Still Shop. In

1617
01:31:01,815 --> 01:31:03,615
Speaker 3: a time when everyone's saying that you need to be

1618
01:31:03,695 --> 01:31:07,535
Speaker 3: careful with your spending, why not buy that last Tools

1619
01:31:07,535 --> 01:31:10,135
Speaker 3: that go the distance, tools that you can actually take

1620
01:31:10,335 --> 01:31:13,455
Speaker 3: somewhere for service down the track. Do the value equation

1621
01:31:13,615 --> 01:31:18,575
Speaker 3: and it becomes abundantly clear. Still is unexpectedly affordable with

1622
01:31:18,695 --> 01:31:22,575
Speaker 3: still petrol chainsaws from just three fifty five, Still line

1623
01:31:22,615 --> 01:31:26,015
Speaker 3: trimmer kits from three hundred and five dollars, Still battery

1624
01:31:26,375 --> 01:31:30,415
Speaker 3: blower kits from just two fifteen. Deal with the experts

1625
01:31:30,495 --> 01:31:33,655
Speaker 3: your local Still shop, check out the Still prices right now,

1626
01:31:33,695 --> 01:31:37,615
Speaker 3: fifteen stores across Auckland and an online shop that never closes.

1627
01:31:37,855 --> 01:31:48,335
Speaker 3: Still Shop, Love your Land news talk, said Bellows. Just

1628
01:31:48,455 --> 01:31:51,735
Speaker 3: all one day. I use the song as a way

1629
01:31:51,735 --> 01:31:53,695
Speaker 3: of introducing people that I might have worked with or

1630
01:31:53,815 --> 01:31:57,095
Speaker 3: encountered during the week that have been outstanding. And I

1631
01:31:57,295 --> 01:32:01,135
Speaker 3: use it today really to mark the passing of a

1632
01:32:01,215 --> 01:32:03,295
Speaker 3: guy that I've had the pleasure in the honor of

1633
01:32:03,295 --> 01:32:06,815
Speaker 3: working with for the last gosh since about two thousand twelve.

1634
01:32:06,855 --> 01:32:11,975
Speaker 3: I first met Clinton Jones, who worked as at Green Gorilla,

1635
01:32:12,935 --> 01:32:15,735
Speaker 3: and when you if you ran Clint and you didn't

1636
01:32:15,735 --> 01:32:18,855
Speaker 3: get him, and you got his answer phone message, it

1637
01:32:18,975 --> 01:32:21,215
Speaker 3: was warm and welcoming and he said, look, I'm probably

1638
01:32:21,255 --> 01:32:24,135
Speaker 3: busy out saving the planet, and that was exactly what

1639
01:32:24,255 --> 01:32:28,815
Speaker 3: he did, and he bought a tremendous passion to his work.

1640
01:32:28,855 --> 01:32:32,095
Speaker 3: He was just a fantastic guy and I'm deeply saddened

1641
01:32:32,135 --> 01:32:36,455
Speaker 3: by his passing. So my condolences to his family and

1642
01:32:36,495 --> 01:32:38,815
Speaker 3: to his kids, and to those people that he worked

1643
01:32:38,855 --> 01:32:41,295
Speaker 3: with and whose lives he touched. He was a remarkable,

1644
01:32:41,335 --> 01:32:44,975
Speaker 3: remarkable man, gone too soon. So Clinton Jones, thanks for

1645
01:32:44,975 --> 01:32:47,415
Speaker 3: the company and your friendship. It's been an absolute pleasure.

1646
01:32:47,855 --> 01:32:50,815
Speaker 3: Your news talks there be and we are talking all

1647
01:32:50,895 --> 01:32:55,415
Speaker 3: things building and construction as well. Ross Greetings, Yeah, good morning.

1648
01:32:56,735 --> 01:32:58,895
Speaker 14: This is just a comment that it's not a criticism,

1649
01:32:58,935 --> 01:33:02,615
Speaker 14: but it is it's a puzzle down there open us

1650
01:33:03,255 --> 01:33:05,775
Speaker 14: in our street, there's the house that's being built, and

1651
01:33:05,975 --> 01:33:10,095
Speaker 14: I'm just blown away is the amount of timber and

1652
01:33:10,455 --> 01:33:13,455
Speaker 14: overkill that has had to go into the construction of

1653
01:33:13,535 --> 01:33:16,135
Speaker 14: that house. And it's no wonder that the cost of

1654
01:33:16,175 --> 01:33:21,735
Speaker 14: construction at the homes in New Zealand is so staggeringly expensive.

1655
01:33:22,415 --> 01:33:27,815
Speaker 14: I was in Canada in another life, and their cost,

1656
01:33:28,015 --> 01:33:30,975
Speaker 14: their construction method. And we're not talking about leaky holmes here.

1657
01:33:31,015 --> 01:33:34,815
Speaker 14: These were fully houses that had bullys and everything else

1658
01:33:35,055 --> 01:33:38,695
Speaker 14: and properly done. There was no These were not plaster homes.

1659
01:33:39,015 --> 01:33:42,095
Speaker 14: But what they did there. All the timber was kiln dried.

1660
01:33:43,655 --> 01:33:45,735
Speaker 14: The studs came in a packet. I think they were

1661
01:33:45,815 --> 01:33:50,495
Speaker 14: ninety four and a half inches and the stud placement

1662
01:33:50,975 --> 01:33:54,975
Speaker 14: were about fifteen inches and you'll have to forgive me

1663
01:33:55,015 --> 01:33:56,695
Speaker 14: for inches sixt inches.

1664
01:33:56,735 --> 01:33:57,735
Speaker 3: I know exactly what you mean.

1665
01:33:58,055 --> 01:34:01,175
Speaker 14: Yep. And on top of that there went a sheet

1666
01:34:01,215 --> 01:34:03,855
Speaker 14: of ply and on the top of it and they

1667
01:34:03,895 --> 01:34:07,655
Speaker 14: were framed up that the trusses came on the back

1668
01:34:07,695 --> 01:34:09,255
Speaker 14: of the truck with a high ad and they were

1669
01:34:09,295 --> 01:34:12,655
Speaker 14: put on. And it used to take us about three

1670
01:34:12,735 --> 01:34:15,215
Speaker 14: weeks or a month to frame up a three bedroom

1671
01:34:15,255 --> 01:34:20,935
Speaker 14: house from the from the pouring the form foundation, and

1672
01:34:21,095 --> 01:34:23,855
Speaker 14: on the outside of the house, on top of the

1673
01:34:23,855 --> 01:34:28,175
Speaker 14: plywood would then go the shrink wrap or the wrap,

1674
01:34:28,215 --> 01:34:30,895
Speaker 14: and on top of that would go the weather boards

1675
01:34:32,655 --> 01:34:35,655
Speaker 14: sid siding where we were siding, and then the house

1676
01:34:35,775 --> 01:34:39,375
Speaker 14: was shut up the inside. The heating was installed and

1677
01:34:39,415 --> 01:34:43,135
Speaker 14: they had to get the moisture content down to something

1678
01:34:43,215 --> 01:34:46,375
Speaker 14: like seven percent and that would take possibly two or

1679
01:34:46,415 --> 01:34:51,175
Speaker 14: three weeks. And after that on the inside would then

1680
01:34:51,255 --> 01:34:53,575
Speaker 14: go the jib board and the class or the wiring

1681
01:34:53,895 --> 01:34:56,135
Speaker 14: for that, and the jib board and so forth. And

1682
01:34:56,295 --> 01:34:57,495
Speaker 14: they didn't have nogs.

1683
01:34:57,575 --> 01:34:58,135
Speaker 10: They did.

1684
01:34:58,495 --> 01:35:01,095
Speaker 14: This house down the road here has got strapping on

1685
01:35:01,215 --> 01:35:06,455
Speaker 14: every stud all the way down to the joists. The

1686
01:35:06,495 --> 01:35:09,175
Speaker 14: amount of nogging and the amount of extra timber and

1687
01:35:09,215 --> 01:35:13,775
Speaker 14: the metal strappings that's inside this house is just absolutely staggering.

1688
01:35:14,215 --> 01:35:16,095
Speaker 3: I'm guessing that it's probably three stories.

1689
01:35:17,135 --> 01:35:21,655
Speaker 14: No, it's a full basement, a flat roof and a

1690
01:35:21,735 --> 01:35:28,415
Speaker 14: single story. And they've had this has been this house

1691
01:35:28,455 --> 01:35:31,975
Speaker 14: has taken about four or five months so far, and

1692
01:35:32,015 --> 01:35:34,535
Speaker 14: they're not even to the stage where they've got the

1693
01:35:35,335 --> 01:35:38,135
Speaker 14: siding of the weather boards or anything on the outside.

1694
01:35:38,255 --> 01:35:41,895
Speaker 14: And no wonder the cost of house construction is and

1695
01:35:41,935 --> 01:35:46,135
Speaker 14: they've had five guys on there just blows me away.

1696
01:35:47,735 --> 01:35:50,615
Speaker 3: I'm beginning to get the impression that you know, it's

1697
01:35:50,815 --> 01:35:53,575
Speaker 3: it's I think what we're starting to see in the

1698
01:35:53,575 --> 01:35:57,895
Speaker 3: housing sector is a real split between I guess what

1699
01:35:57,935 --> 01:36:01,015
Speaker 3: i'd call bespoke builds. Right, So a client goes to

1700
01:36:01,055 --> 01:36:04,695
Speaker 3: an architect, gets a one off design done with all

1701
01:36:04,735 --> 01:36:08,015
Speaker 3: specific engineering, and then finds a contractor to build that.

1702
01:36:08,095 --> 01:36:10,175
Speaker 3: And that sounds like the sort of house that you're built,

1703
01:36:10,255 --> 01:36:13,935
Speaker 3: that you're seeing being built. And then the other end

1704
01:36:14,015 --> 01:36:16,535
Speaker 3: of the spectrum, let's say, and this isn't a value judgment,

1705
01:36:16,695 --> 01:36:21,415
Speaker 3: is houses that are you know, less complex, are designed

1706
01:36:21,495 --> 01:36:24,815
Speaker 3: to be built in a more affordable manner. You know,

1707
01:36:24,975 --> 01:36:28,775
Speaker 3: I mean you I've done them where we'll get you know,

1708
01:36:28,815 --> 01:36:32,335
Speaker 3: from slab, we'll get trusses, we'll get frames up, trustes

1709
01:36:32,375 --> 01:36:35,255
Speaker 3: on and be ready for roofing six seven days later. Right,

1710
01:36:36,735 --> 01:36:41,895
Speaker 3: So you know, we shouldn't confuse the typer house and

1711
01:36:42,135 --> 01:36:44,975
Speaker 3: assume that not all houses are the same. Right to

1712
01:36:44,695 --> 01:36:47,775
Speaker 3: be to be blunt. So I think you're right. I

1713
01:36:47,775 --> 01:36:50,135
Speaker 3: think we're seeing I think what we're going to see

1714
01:36:50,175 --> 01:36:54,455
Speaker 3: is a lot less of that highly complex bespoke building,

1715
01:36:54,535 --> 01:36:56,695
Speaker 3: and it's only going to be a small part of

1716
01:36:56,855 --> 01:37:03,695
Speaker 3: the construction sector and we will see much more around ideally,

1717
01:37:03,855 --> 01:37:07,535
Speaker 3: you know, well developed building methodology that allow full speed

1718
01:37:07,535 --> 01:37:08,255
Speaker 3: and efficiency.

1719
01:37:09,855 --> 01:37:12,575
Speaker 14: Yeah. Well, these homes in Canada, we're middle of the road.

1720
01:37:12,855 --> 01:37:16,535
Speaker 14: They were not home, they were not high in there,

1721
01:37:18,975 --> 01:37:21,175
Speaker 14: and there was explained to me that you only need

1722
01:37:21,535 --> 01:37:23,855
Speaker 14: you don't need nogs in the house when you applywood

1723
01:37:23,855 --> 01:37:24,695
Speaker 14: because it holds it all.

1724
01:37:24,735 --> 01:37:29,695
Speaker 3: To be fair, I was looking at a system the

1725
01:37:29,735 --> 01:37:32,775
Speaker 3: other day where they're building not using nogs because they're

1726
01:37:32,815 --> 01:37:35,215
Speaker 3: using LVL. They're using jframe, right, which is the J

1727
01:37:35,335 --> 01:37:38,455
Speaker 3: and L product, So it's an LVL. It's dimensionally stable,

1728
01:37:38,455 --> 01:37:40,575
Speaker 3: it's really stiff, and you can leave out the nogs

1729
01:37:40,615 --> 01:37:42,775
Speaker 3: if you don't need them. And in some cases we

1730
01:37:42,815 --> 01:37:46,295
Speaker 3: need them for exterior lining or whatever, but in many

1731
01:37:46,295 --> 01:37:48,055
Speaker 3: cases you can do without them. It means you can

1732
01:37:48,055 --> 01:37:51,615
Speaker 3: get more insulation. And you know, so we are starting

1733
01:37:51,615 --> 01:37:55,735
Speaker 3: to see that those ideas coming in, maybe just not

1734
01:37:55,855 --> 01:37:57,415
Speaker 3: quite as quick as we were hoping.

1735
01:37:58,295 --> 01:38:01,695
Speaker 14: Yeah, because there's no way that you under the present system,

1736
01:38:01,735 --> 01:38:03,695
Speaker 14: there's no way did you ever again to take the

1737
01:38:03,695 --> 01:38:07,895
Speaker 14: cost of construct cost of the cost of materials, or

1738
01:38:07,935 --> 01:38:11,815
Speaker 14: the cost of a house out of with the present system,

1739
01:38:11,895 --> 01:38:14,095
Speaker 14: it just doesn't look because you've got the labor at

1740
01:38:14,135 --> 01:38:17,135
Speaker 14: fifty sixty seventy pucks an hour, so the cost of

1741
01:38:17,175 --> 01:38:20,775
Speaker 14: putting those nogs in it's colossal and necessary. I have

1742
01:38:20,775 --> 01:38:21,135
Speaker 14: to say no.

1743
01:38:21,495 --> 01:38:24,375
Speaker 3: But you know, again, I think what you're describing is,

1744
01:38:25,295 --> 01:38:28,055
Speaker 3: you know, one of those sort of I say architecturally

1745
01:38:28,095 --> 01:38:30,935
Speaker 3: designed asn't that's not a derogative term, and it can

1746
01:38:31,015 --> 01:38:35,175
Speaker 3: seem like it is, you know, a bespoke house designed

1747
01:38:35,255 --> 01:38:38,855
Speaker 3: and built specifically for that client wanting to achieve a

1748
01:38:38,855 --> 01:38:41,295
Speaker 3: certain look or a certain performance or whatever, and that's

1749
01:38:41,295 --> 01:38:44,775
Speaker 3: how they're doing it. It's not. It's no longer representative

1750
01:38:44,815 --> 01:38:47,935
Speaker 3: of how we build most houses in New Zealand. Saying that,

1751
01:38:49,655 --> 01:38:51,855
Speaker 3: you know, one of the challenges we've got around insulation

1752
01:38:52,015 --> 01:38:55,175
Speaker 3: is that we're finding through surveys that as much as

1753
01:38:55,215 --> 01:38:57,455
Speaker 3: forty five percent up to forty five percent of our

1754
01:38:57,495 --> 01:39:00,495
Speaker 3: exterior walls is timber framing now, which doesn't leave a

1755
01:39:00,535 --> 01:39:02,735
Speaker 3: lot of space for insulation. So now we've got to

1756
01:39:02,775 --> 01:39:08,135
Speaker 3: think about better solutions for insulation. Yeah, are we excessively

1757
01:39:08,255 --> 01:39:09,775
Speaker 3: braced and all the rest of it, I'm not sure

1758
01:39:09,775 --> 01:39:13,255
Speaker 3: what the answer is there, and I think what you

1759
01:39:13,335 --> 01:39:16,375
Speaker 3: bring to the table, Ross is that you know, we're

1760
01:39:16,415 --> 01:39:18,655
Speaker 3: not the only people in the world building ours is right,

1761
01:39:19,095 --> 01:39:21,815
Speaker 3: and so we tend to get this thing that somehow

1762
01:39:21,975 --> 01:39:24,175
Speaker 3: what we do here is completely unique to us, and

1763
01:39:24,215 --> 01:39:26,655
Speaker 3: it's just not right. There are lots of things that

1764
01:39:26,695 --> 01:39:30,055
Speaker 3: we can learn from overseas. Hopefully we just bring back

1765
01:39:30,095 --> 01:39:33,095
Speaker 3: the good ideas and leave the daft ones behind. But

1766
01:39:33,535 --> 01:39:35,295
Speaker 3: you know, we need to look overseas. We need to

1767
01:39:35,335 --> 01:39:38,935
Speaker 3: look at what they're doing to create efficiencies while not

1768
01:39:39,135 --> 01:39:41,655
Speaker 3: giving up on quality and performance. We're going to jump

1769
01:39:41,695 --> 01:39:44,415
Speaker 3: into the garden with Red Klein passed in just a moment.

1770
01:39:45,975 --> 01:39:47,815
Speaker 3: I just want to read this text from Paul morning.

1771
01:39:47,815 --> 01:39:50,655
Speaker 3: Pete couldn't agree more. Clint was a brilliant team guy

1772
01:39:51,255 --> 01:39:55,295
Speaker 3: who was years ahead and is thinking of how to

1773
01:39:55,335 --> 01:39:58,855
Speaker 3: deal with construction waste and improve the environment. We'll remember

1774
01:39:58,935 --> 01:40:01,735
Speaker 3: him from Paul. You're absolutely right, Paul, thanks for texting that.

1775
01:40:02,055 --> 01:40:04,735
Speaker 3: Clint Jones rest in peace. We are back after the

1776
01:40:04,735 --> 01:40:07,895
Speaker 3: break and we will talking to root climb.

1777
01:40:07,695 --> 01:40:11,215
Speaker 1: Past For more from the Resident Builder with Peter Wolfcamp.

1778
01:40:11,335 --> 01:40:13,975
Speaker 1: Listen live to News Talk z' B on Sunday mornings

1779
01:40:13,975 --> 01:40:16,855
Speaker 1: from six or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio,