1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:05,360 Speaker 1: Now laser weapons, nuclear ballistic missiles, giant underwater drones. They 2 00:00:05,360 --> 00:00:07,520 Speaker 1: are among the weapons that have been unveiled at China's 3 00:00:07,520 --> 00:00:08,760 Speaker 1: big military parade today. 4 00:00:09,480 --> 00:00:10,560 Speaker 2: Pull them off. 5 00:00:13,320 --> 00:00:16,760 Speaker 1: Sounds cool like. Fifty thousand guests attended Tianaman Square, including 6 00:00:16,760 --> 00:00:20,760 Speaker 1: twenty six world leaders, and we've seen China's Shujiping. Russia 7 00:00:20,760 --> 00:00:23,720 Speaker 1: is Vladimir Putin and North Koreas Kim Jong Un together 8 00:00:23,760 --> 00:00:26,480 Speaker 1: for the first time, and geopolitical analyst Jeffrey Miller. 9 00:00:26,280 --> 00:00:29,040 Speaker 2: Is with us. Now, how Jeffrey, good afternoon. 10 00:00:29,120 --> 00:00:30,720 Speaker 1: Are you impressed with all the weaponry? 11 00:00:32,040 --> 00:00:34,559 Speaker 2: Oh? It is a real showcase, isn't it these military 12 00:00:34,560 --> 00:00:37,559 Speaker 2: parades that you get out of the likes of Russia 13 00:00:37,680 --> 00:00:41,400 Speaker 2: or China? Now, you know, in terms of the symbolism, 14 00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:45,280 Speaker 2: in terms of the military hardware that's being put on 15 00:00:45,400 --> 00:00:49,280 Speaker 2: show here, it is quite something to watch. And it's 16 00:00:49,560 --> 00:00:53,040 Speaker 2: either an impressive show of military mit or terrifying, I guess, 17 00:00:53,080 --> 00:00:55,960 Speaker 2: depending on what side of the fence you sit on, 18 00:00:56,600 --> 00:00:59,360 Speaker 2: but it is certainly something worth watching. And those clips 19 00:00:59,400 --> 00:01:02,120 Speaker 2: will of course go around the globe on television screens, 20 00:01:02,520 --> 00:01:05,080 Speaker 2: and that was the aim of the plan really was 21 00:01:05,120 --> 00:01:08,039 Speaker 2: to show off what China has to offer. In terms 22 00:01:08,080 --> 00:01:09,080 Speaker 2: of its military strength. 23 00:01:09,600 --> 00:01:11,640 Speaker 1: Is there anything that the Americans will see there that 24 00:01:11,680 --> 00:01:13,600 Speaker 1: they didn't already know that the Chinese had. 25 00:01:15,040 --> 00:01:19,240 Speaker 2: No. I don't very much that anyone is overly surprised 26 00:01:19,280 --> 00:01:23,680 Speaker 2: at what China has in the stockpile. There was a 27 00:01:23,720 --> 00:01:26,679 Speaker 2: new type of intercontinental ballistic missile. I had a look 28 00:01:26,680 --> 00:01:29,880 Speaker 2: at the coverage from the Australian newspaper and they're hyping 29 00:01:29,880 --> 00:01:32,319 Speaker 2: that up, saying it could reach Australia. Well years in theory, 30 00:01:32,600 --> 00:01:35,360 Speaker 2: lots of things can do lots of things all around 31 00:01:35,360 --> 00:01:37,640 Speaker 2: the world, and we've known that for decades. The nuclear 32 00:01:37,640 --> 00:01:41,480 Speaker 2: stock piles that both the United States and other great 33 00:01:41,520 --> 00:01:44,000 Speaker 2: powers have can destroy the world many times over. None 34 00:01:44,040 --> 00:01:47,200 Speaker 2: of that's new in a sense, but it is something 35 00:01:47,319 --> 00:01:50,360 Speaker 2: to see it all and being paraded in front of 36 00:01:50,920 --> 00:01:54,720 Speaker 2: all these guests who have come, particularly from the Global South, 37 00:01:54,760 --> 00:01:57,560 Speaker 2: and that's I guess what is particularly interesting about this 38 00:01:57,640 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 2: year's parade versus the one, say ten years ago, where 39 00:02:00,320 --> 00:02:03,120 Speaker 2: you actually had quite a few Western leaders and Western 40 00:02:03,960 --> 00:02:08,200 Speaker 2: representatives there. This time around, the guest list, in terms 41 00:02:08,200 --> 00:02:10,240 Speaker 2: of the heads of state and heads of government was 42 00:02:10,400 --> 00:02:15,400 Speaker 2: very much landed towards the Global South and leaders in 43 00:02:15,440 --> 00:02:19,360 Speaker 2: Asia Africa, Central Asia, former Soviet republics that were very 44 00:02:19,400 --> 00:02:20,320 Speaker 2: heavily represented. 45 00:02:20,760 --> 00:02:22,919 Speaker 1: Why did they not invite anybody from our government? 46 00:02:24,440 --> 00:02:25,959 Speaker 2: Well, I think this week has been all about the 47 00:02:26,000 --> 00:02:29,400 Speaker 2: Global South. For China, their assistant Foreign Minister when they 48 00:02:29,400 --> 00:02:32,840 Speaker 2: were announcing the events, both the summit of the Shanghai 49 00:02:32,880 --> 00:02:37,520 Speaker 2: Cooperation Organization in Jianjin, which is a port city in 50 00:02:37,520 --> 00:02:41,359 Speaker 2: the north of China, and the events today, the Assistant 51 00:02:41,360 --> 00:02:45,040 Speaker 2: Foreign Ministers said, the Global South is reshaping the world landscape. 52 00:02:45,160 --> 00:02:48,000 Speaker 2: And I think that's really what the messaging has been 53 00:02:48,040 --> 00:02:51,160 Speaker 2: about this week. It's been about that unity of course 54 00:02:51,200 --> 00:02:55,000 Speaker 2: with Vladimir Putin, with Ninandramodi who was at that SEO summit, 55 00:02:55,760 --> 00:02:58,399 Speaker 2: and of course Kim Jong En from the Supreme Leader 56 00:02:58,400 --> 00:03:02,160 Speaker 2: from North Korea and all the other Global South leaders. 57 00:03:02,280 --> 00:03:04,600 Speaker 2: And some of these leaders are coming from countries that 58 00:03:05,160 --> 00:03:07,640 Speaker 2: New Zealand is on good terms with. If you think 59 00:03:07,639 --> 00:03:11,560 Speaker 2: of the President of Vietnam, for example, or the Prime 60 00:03:11,600 --> 00:03:15,400 Speaker 2: Minister of Malaysia there there today. So these are countries 61 00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:18,680 Speaker 2: and as Ian in Southeast Asia. Christopher Luxon has visited 62 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:22,560 Speaker 2: both Malaysia and Vietnam are quite recently, so they're not 63 00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:25,480 Speaker 2: all countries that New Zealand would see is beyond the 64 00:03:25,520 --> 00:03:28,680 Speaker 2: pale in a sense. Some of them are quite good 65 00:03:28,720 --> 00:03:31,240 Speaker 2: friends of where the world is a complex place. 66 00:03:31,360 --> 00:03:33,720 Speaker 1: What I want to know is leaving leaving for example, 67 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:36,280 Speaker 1: Luxon and Albanesi and so on off. The guest list 68 00:03:36,400 --> 00:03:38,200 Speaker 1: is designed to send a message, isn't it, which is 69 00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:41,880 Speaker 1: in a China shaped world, you are not our friends. 70 00:03:43,560 --> 00:03:45,760 Speaker 2: I don't know whether it's as strong or as black 71 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:53,400 Speaker 2: and white as that, but not Luxon. Well, would Christopher 72 00:03:53,440 --> 00:03:55,640 Speaker 2: Luxen be at the top of the list for an 73 00:03:55,680 --> 00:03:58,200 Speaker 2: event like this. I mean, you've only got so many 74 00:03:58,200 --> 00:04:00,440 Speaker 2: seats that you can have there, and so many you 75 00:04:00,440 --> 00:04:01,080 Speaker 2: can put there. 76 00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:03,280 Speaker 1: On the minister he's a current prime minister, and then 77 00:04:03,280 --> 00:04:05,960 Speaker 1: you've got two former prime ministers there. Surely he would 78 00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:06,880 Speaker 1: eclipse them, wouldn't he. 79 00:04:08,080 --> 00:04:10,640 Speaker 2: Well, Look, I think Helen Clark and John Key probably 80 00:04:10,640 --> 00:04:14,000 Speaker 2: acquitted themselves quite well today and I'm sure they up 81 00:04:14,040 --> 00:04:17,520 Speaker 2: held New Zealand's representation at that an official level. They 82 00:04:17,560 --> 00:04:20,479 Speaker 2: were there representing New Zealand, if not the government. That 83 00:04:20,600 --> 00:04:23,240 Speaker 2: was being done by New Zealand's representatives at the embassy 84 00:04:24,120 --> 00:04:26,919 Speaker 2: in Beijing. But look, I think it's really important to 85 00:04:26,960 --> 00:04:30,520 Speaker 2: engage with China and if an invitation had been sent 86 00:04:30,720 --> 00:04:34,279 Speaker 2: to Christopher Luxe, and I think he should have accepted it. 87 00:04:34,320 --> 00:04:36,120 Speaker 2: But in the fact, in the end he wasn't. He 88 00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:39,360 Speaker 2: wasn't invited, So that question didn't really need to be 89 00:04:39,760 --> 00:04:42,640 Speaker 2: answered in a sense. But I think it's really important 90 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:47,360 Speaker 2: to engage. We need that dialogue and diplomacy and Jijingping 91 00:04:47,480 --> 00:04:50,480 Speaker 2: today he made that contrast, he said peace or war, 92 00:04:50,640 --> 00:04:54,279 Speaker 2: dialogue or confrontation. There was all that military hardware and 93 00:04:54,279 --> 00:04:56,680 Speaker 2: then there are eighty thousand doves that were released into 94 00:04:56,720 --> 00:04:59,279 Speaker 2: the air, and he's putting out the choices there for 95 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:01,920 Speaker 2: the world. And I think in the end, the world 96 00:05:01,920 --> 00:05:04,000 Speaker 2: would be a lot better if we had more peace 97 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:07,000 Speaker 2: and less war. So I think you're in the end. 98 00:05:07,040 --> 00:05:09,400 Speaker 2: It's going to take everyone's efforts to achieve that, but 99 00:05:09,680 --> 00:05:12,040 Speaker 2: you're shining. Look if we don't have peace, look here's 100 00:05:12,040 --> 00:05:16,359 Speaker 2: the alternative and parading all of this military hardware past Tiananmen. 101 00:05:15,920 --> 00:05:19,440 Speaker 1: Square, Jeffrey, I really appreciate you expertise. Thank you, Jeffrey Miller, 102 00:05:19,520 --> 00:05:24,200 Speaker 1: Geopolitical Analyst. For more from Heather Duplessy, Allen Drive, listen 103 00:05:24,320 --> 00:05:27,360 Speaker 1: live to news Talks. It'd be from four pm weekdays, 104 00:05:27,480 --> 00:05:29,680 Speaker 1: or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio