Speaker 1: Kilda. I'm Georgina Campbell in for Chelsea Daniels and this
Speaker 1: is the Front Page, a daily podcast presented by The
Speaker 1: New Zealand Herald. The year's biggest land deal has Wellington
Speaker 1: a flutter, with rumors Sir Peter Jackson could be building
Speaker 1: his long awaited movie museum. Interests associated with the Lord
Speaker 1: of the Rings director have spent one hundred and five
Speaker 1: million dollars buying a large piece of land near the
Speaker 1: city's airport in Lyle Bay. So why the secrecy and
Speaker 1: could Jackson's vision be finally brought to life? Today on
Speaker 1: the Front Page, we're joined by a business desk markets
Speaker 1: reporter Gregor Thompson to discuss the famous filmmaker's latest property
Speaker 1: acquisition and what his plans might be for Wellington. Let's
Speaker 1: start with the land at south. Where is it and
Speaker 1: what does it look like?
Speaker 2: So it's a big block of land in the Wellington
Speaker 2: suburb of Rongatai and Lyle Bay on the southern end
Speaker 2: of the suburb. It's in between the airport retail space
Speaker 2: and a big Bunnings warehouse just west of the Wellington Airport.
Speaker 1: How has this land prime land? It's very close to
Speaker 1: the waterfront. How has that land come to be sold?
Speaker 2: Just so you know, I haven't talked to anybody directly
Speaker 2: related in the sale. That's their choice, not mine. I've
Speaker 2: been trying very hard. But what we do know from
Speaker 2: triangulating kind of previous reporting, looking at the company's register
Speaker 2: and you know, looking at property records, the land in
Speaker 2: question was formerly under a leasehole arrangement between Wellington property
Speaker 2: developer called Prime Properties and the Wellington International Airport. Now
Speaker 2: it's a bit kind of complicated and esoteric, but basically,
Speaker 2: under a leasehold arrangement, which is a form of ownership,
Speaker 2: there is a freehold interest which means that you own
Speaker 2: the land, and then there is a leasehold interest mean
Speaker 2: that you're entitled to lease out the land, and the
Speaker 2: lease holdy interest in this case as the airport was
Speaker 2: paying money to the freehold interests in order to have
Speaker 2: the right to lease out the land. That's not that interesting.
Speaker 2: But what is interesting is that now if you look
Speaker 2: at the property records, a company called lb HC, so
Speaker 2: we think that means Lalo Bay Holding Company, which is
Speaker 2: directed by Sir Peter Jackson and Dame fran Welsh, the filmmakers.
Speaker 2: Now they have both interests in the land, so now
Speaker 2: they only have a freehold. So we think what's happened
Speaker 2: and we'll actually what the property records say is that
Speaker 2: they have paid one hundred and four million dollars for
Speaker 2: twelve properties in Lao Bay and now they both have
Speaker 2: complete freehold ownership over the property.
Speaker 1: And they also purchased land there last year.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so some reporting from our esteemed colleagues at The Herald,
Speaker 2: actually Matt Nippett managed to reveal last year that they
Speaker 2: had bought sections or just south of the sections that
Speaker 2: were recently reported to have been sold, and that was
Speaker 2: for about thirty five million dollars. So that takes the
Speaker 2: entire cost of all of these two blocks of land
Speaker 2: to one hundred and forty million dollars.
Speaker 3: The Jackson case is just so particularly fascinating because he's
Speaker 3: a world class billionaire and artistic talent, and his real
Speaker 3: estate purchases, particularly and Miramar, are not solely driven by profit.
Speaker 3: He's not able to rent these churches out. It's a
Speaker 3: very old school sort of feudal vibe almost about the thing.
Speaker 1: Should we be concerned about that at all?
Speaker 3: Well, as long as it's in the open, you know,
Speaker 3: Jackson hasn't broken any laws, but definitely worth keeping an eye.
Speaker 1: This recent purchase. They paid well over the RV, right.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so if you add up the rating valuation of
Speaker 2: all the properties in this block that they've just purchased,
Speaker 2: it comes in at about forty million dollars below what
Speaker 2: they've paid. So, yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1: I mean, why would somebody pay so much money for
Speaker 1: a piece of land, you know, like that's quite a
Speaker 1: significant amount over the RV.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, just remember the RVs aren't perfect, I guess.
Speaker 2: But at the same time, I think it indicates that
Speaker 2: the person who has bought the land, Jackson and Walsh
Speaker 2: or the people, probably have some big plans for it.
Speaker 2: In order, I mean, in order to pay that much money,
Speaker 2: I think, yeah, you have to be willing to do
Speaker 2: quite a.
Speaker 1: Lot to it. The Wellington rumor mill has gone into
Speaker 1: overdrive about this land sale, so many people are talking
Speaker 1: about it. What is it about this deal that kind
Speaker 1: of sparks that sort of interest?
Speaker 2: The Wellington gossip stars have aligned on this one. So
Speaker 2: at the moment, Wellingtonians are very obsessed with development, and
Speaker 2: this is an infamously unproductive piece of brown field real
Speaker 2: estate that hasn't been used for a long time. There's
Speaker 2: obviously that it's right in the middle of a suburb
Speaker 2: that is being pegged for having capacity to be developed
Speaker 2: in the wrongion, Lal Bay. And then I think the
Speaker 2: other thing, which is probably the most important aspect of
Speaker 2: this is Jackson and Walsh associated to it. Now. They're
Speaker 2: both very private people, which I think means that whatever
Speaker 2: they do Gune is quite a lot of speculation. But
Speaker 2: then the other thing is that a lot of Wellingtonians
Speaker 2: who are home proud are home proud about things that
Speaker 2: they've been attached to. So Lord of the Rings, you know,
Speaker 2: there's been some really good exhibitions that they've both done,
Speaker 2: So yeah, I guess there's basically he's a high profile
Speaker 2: figure in the city.
Speaker 1: So considering that secrecy and that they are so private,
Speaker 1: what has it been like trying to get at the
Speaker 1: truth or find out what's going on here? What have
Speaker 1: people said when you've tried to talk to them about this?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 2: I think it's actually quite a funny reporting story found
Speaker 2: out about this because my friend who goes to the
Speaker 2: gym City Fitness on this lot of land, was complaining
Speaker 2: because he found out that Peter Jackson had bought the site,
Speaker 2: and it was unlikely that the gym would live much longer.
Speaker 2: Considering that, I don't know if Peter Jackson wants to
Speaker 2: just have a gym on his land. I kind of
Speaker 2: started out from there, thinking, oh, how can I get
Speaker 2: at this story. I rang a couple of real estate agents,
Speaker 2: you know. One of them confirmed to me off the
Speaker 2: record that it had taken place. So then I started
Speaker 2: looking at property records. I worked out that Prime Properties
Speaker 2: Property Development Company had the freehold share. So I rang
Speaker 2: up the owner. He wouldn't respond. I rang up one
Speaker 2: of his staff, he wouldn't respond. I actually rang them
Speaker 2: both several times. If you're listening to this, sorry about that.
Speaker 2: And then I know that the leasehold land was owned
Speaker 2: by the way Introon International Airport. So I rang the
Speaker 2: one Inton International Airport. I didn't want to have anything
Speaker 2: to do with me. The airport's owned two thirds by
Speaker 2: infan Till I rang them, they didn't want anything to
Speaker 2: do with me. I went to the Infant too AGM
Speaker 2: and raised it with their investor relations guy, who again
Speaker 2: just kind of referred me to the airport. And I
Speaker 2: was like, oh, well, who owns the other share. Lingon
Speaker 2: City Council owns one third of it, so I tried
Speaker 2: to get in contact with the council and tried to
Speaker 2: persuade them by telling them it was of public interest,
Speaker 2: which they didn't buy so they denied to comment. Tory
Speaker 2: Farno as well also mayor to not comment. But at
Speaker 2: that stage my reporting was a bit troule because I coudn't
Speaker 2: find anybody to confirm it. I also obviously tried to
Speaker 2: call Jackson and fran Walsh's company, wing Nut Films. I
Speaker 2: did get through to them, but they declined to comment.
Speaker 2: So at this stage it's kind of in this position
Speaker 2: where I hadn't confirmed it, but the lack of confirmation
Speaker 2: from a whole bunch of people that I knew were
Speaker 2: associated with it meant that there was definitely something going
Speaker 2: on here. So then it turned into a process of elimination.
Speaker 2: And after that I got in contact with Eastern Ward
Speaker 2: Councilor Tim Brown, who luckily for me, was also a
Speaker 2: former board member and chair of the Wellington International Airport
Speaker 2: and he is actually quite familiar with this leasehold land
Speaker 2: and what had been done and not done to it
Speaker 2: over the last twenty odd years. And he confirmed to
Speaker 2: me that there were three major projects that had been considered.
Speaker 2: One of them was a kmart. I actually ended up
Speaker 2: getting the resource consents for that, but that obviously didn't
Speaker 2: come to fruition. And the other one was Concert was
Speaker 2: going to move the bus depot to there, and about
Speaker 2: a week prior to my starting reporting on this that
Speaker 2: had been announced it had moved to Mirrama. So then
Speaker 2: I actually rang up the Wellington Regional Council and ask
Speaker 2: Councilor Thomas Nash if the reason that the bus depo
Speaker 2: had moved to Miramars because Peter Jackson had bought it,
Speaker 2: and then he declined to comment. I mean, I guess
Speaker 2: all of this is a bit of a roundabout way
Speaker 2: of saying that it was very difficult to report on
Speaker 2: and nobody wants.
Speaker 3: To talk about it.
Speaker 1: And then, of course, a couple of weeks after your
Speaker 1: story was published, the property records kind of were updated
Speaker 1: and confirmed that you were indeed barking up the right tree.
Speaker 1: I think the reason this deal has attracted so much
Speaker 1: public attention is because there's also speculation that it could
Speaker 1: be the site for Wellington's long awaited movie museum. What
Speaker 1: do you know about that potential plan.
Speaker 2: Yeah, a bit of an open secret in Wellington that
Speaker 2: Jackson and Walsh want to film museum. They've got an
Speaker 2: enormous election that I think actually you know more about
Speaker 2: I do Georgina of different movie props and that sort
Speaker 2: of stuff. And there was an attempt to put it
Speaker 2: into the Taquina Convention Center on Wellington's waterfront or just
Speaker 2: behind it in twenty seventeen, but as far as I remember,
Speaker 2: those talks soured with the council and then that fell through.
Speaker 2: I guess people have always known that Jackson wanted to
Speaker 2: build a museum. The question was really where, And you
Speaker 2: know there's the big Chlley Bay site in the eastern
Speaker 2: suburbs and they had previously ruled out that the museum
Speaker 2: was going to be there, So we do know that
Speaker 2: he wants to build one. And then the other thing
Speaker 2: I think, which is quite probably suggestive, is that I
Speaker 2: talked to Counselor Tim Brown and when he was with
Speaker 2: the Wellington Airport they were in talks for a long
Speaker 2: time about a potential museum. So there was at one
Speaker 2: stage a plan to build it on top of where
Speaker 2: the car park is, I'm told, and then another plan
Speaker 2: was to build it in the site that Peter Jackson
Speaker 2: has just bought. So, you know, we can't confirm absolutely
Speaker 2: one hundred percent that this will be the site of
Speaker 2: a museum, because Jackson and Welsh haven't said that them.
Speaker 2: But I think there are a couple of strong, pretty
Speaker 2: strong indications, so that's slightly the case.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And as you say, there was that previous plan
Speaker 1: to include the movie museum as part of Tarkina, the
Speaker 1: Council's convention center. Essentially, that ideas sort of soured because,
Speaker 1: as former Mayor Justin Lester puts it, things were just
Speaker 1: taking too long, and he says they couldn't get more
Speaker 1: detailed designs from Sir Peter Jackson and Dame fran Welsh,
Speaker 1: and they couldn't keep pushing out the construction timelines. But
Speaker 1: the thing about that plan is that it does offer
Speaker 1: a bit of insight into what a movie museum could
Speaker 1: look like and what it could bring to Wellington. So
Speaker 1: Council documents from the time say that the museum would
Speaker 1: attract three hundred and fifty thousand visitors annually, create two
Speaker 1: hundred and fifty eight jobs, and generate twenty eight point
Speaker 1: two million dollars in new spending each year.
Speaker 4: Wellington is in line for a multimillion a movie museum
Speaker 4: that back is a calling Disneyland. The museum will feature
Speaker 4: thousands of Hollywood set pieces, props and models, including the
Speaker 4: Chitty Chitty Bang Bang car and miniatures from King Kong.
Speaker 4: Valgueing reports the complex is expected to give the region's
Speaker 4: economy a multimillion dollar boost.
Speaker 1: It was touted as a must see visitor attraction. Then
Speaker 1: Chairwoman of Tourism New Zealand, Kerry Prendigar said, apart from Tapapa,
Speaker 1: Wellington doesn't really have any of those sorts of attractions.
Speaker 1: And then of course there is his film collection and
Speaker 1: one of the exciting things that we know is in
Speaker 1: that collection that I think appeals to a lot of
Speaker 1: people is the Chitty Chitty Bang Bang car. But also
Speaker 1: the Council Documents said that the sort of exhibitions that
Speaker 1: we could expect to see in the film museum would
Speaker 1: span wetter groups, award winning Hollywood scale productions, some of
Speaker 1: their earlier homegrown movies. Is thousands of designs, props, models
Speaker 1: and pieces that would all be featured. So some pretty
Speaker 1: cool stuff in the summary, I think, but back to
Speaker 1: the land sale at South Korea. Is this a significant addition,
Speaker 1: would you say, to Peter Jackson's property portfolio in Wellington,
Speaker 1: because he already owns quite a lot of land, doesn't he.
Speaker 2: It's by any metric, a pretty big pass of land,
Speaker 2: particularly in suburb just on the edge of the middle
Speaker 2: of our capital city. So two point seven hectares is
Speaker 2: rough estimate of all of the land he owns there now,
Speaker 2: which yeah, I think is a pretty substantial property holding.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: And the other thing is that this particular purchase has
Speaker 1: topped the list as New Zealand's largest purchase this year.
Speaker 1: CBRE recently released its transition monitor and this single sale
Speaker 1: comprised about seventy percent of the total value of development
Speaker 1: site and land transactions, So a big deal in its
Speaker 1: own right. But as you pointed out, Peter Jackson and
Speaker 1: fran Welsh have recently purchased at Shalli Bayland, which they've
Speaker 1: ruled out for the movie museum, and their plans there
Speaker 1: are really to restore it, to become a reserve, to
Speaker 1: bring nature back. And if you go out there at
Speaker 1: the moment, the Chocolate Fish Cafe has reopened and it's
Speaker 1: so popular that it's almost impossible to get a table
Speaker 1: if you're there on a sunny Saturday morning, and then
Speaker 1: there is a lot of fencing up around the site
Speaker 1: as they do replanting, and you know they've selen some
Speaker 1: grass and things like that. But you know, Challie Bay
Speaker 1: and this property at Lyle Bay significant sites, along with
Speaker 1: the other land that the couple owned. Do you think
Speaker 1: this is a good thing for locals to have Sir
Speaker 1: Petter Jackson investing in the community as much as he
Speaker 1: does with these building acquisitions, or a developers councils and
Speaker 1: businesses concerned that this person who has accumulated a lot
Speaker 1: of whilst through his success can kind of do whatever
Speaker 1: he likes with these pretty significant sites.
Speaker 2: Whether or not Wellingtonian should be worried about that, I
Speaker 2: guess that's what the question is first, But I don't
Speaker 2: think it's really up to me to decide whether or
Speaker 2: not that's true. But I do see both sides. I
Speaker 2: can understand why people would be worried about perhaps the
Speaker 2: power that Peter Jackson does have to develop and buy
Speaker 2: land and then do what he wants with it. But
Speaker 2: we do live in a country that respects private property
Speaker 2: and that's kind of has entitledment, I suppose, but I
Speaker 2: can understand why people would not want someone to do
Speaker 2: that also have so much ability to do that in
Speaker 2: one certain place. But then the other thing is, you know,
Speaker 2: lots of this stuff. I think, particularly the site that
Speaker 2: we're talking about in Laal Bay has sat relatively underdeveloped
Speaker 2: for the last twenty years. So if you're measuring whatever
Speaker 2: it is that he builds relative to what is there currently,
Speaker 2: it seems quite difficult to me that you would have
Speaker 2: a worse outcome than what is currently the status quo.
Speaker 2: I guess those are the two arguments, and Wellington needs development.
Speaker 2: I know lots of people are really pleased about what
Speaker 2: is effectively kind of a city sugar daddy.
Speaker 1: I mean, I was chatting to Parrot Dog, which has
Speaker 1: a venue out there serving up craft beer, and they
Speaker 1: sort of said, look like anybody who wants to invest
Speaker 1: money in beautifying areas of Wellington and that regeneration they
Speaker 1: were supportive of, and they certainly felt that it was
Speaker 1: pretty cool having Sir Peter Jackson attached to Wellington, caring
Speaker 1: about it and willing to invest in it. But we
Speaker 1: haven't heard from Sir Peter or Dame friend, have we
Speaker 1: They haven't publicly confirmed anything. I mean, when will this
Speaker 1: speculation turn into something concrete?
Speaker 2: Do you think, Well, we know that they own the property,
Speaker 2: we just don't know what they're going to do with it.
Speaker 2: And my short experience in reporting on Jackson and Walsh's
Speaker 2: property holdings, they are not very communicative, so honestly, I
Speaker 2: don't know, but I would imagine that this is now
Speaker 2: in the hands of architects and eventually they will file
Speaker 2: resource consent on whatever they wanting to build. And once
Speaker 2: they do that, some nosey journalists will find out they're
Speaker 2: intending to do unless someone else talks about it before then.
Speaker 2: But yeah, I guess we have to see.
Speaker 1: Hey, thanks so much for joining us, Gregor. That's it
Speaker 1: for this episode of The Front Page. You can read
Speaker 1: more about today's stories and extensive news coverage at inzidherld
Speaker 1: dot co dot nzied. The Front Page is produced by
Speaker 1: Ethan Sills and sound engineer Patti Fox. I'm Georgina Campbell.
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Speaker 1: behind the headlines.