Speaker 1: Cure. I'm Susie nordquiston for Chelsea Daniels and this is
Speaker 1: the Front Page, a daily podcast presented by the New
Speaker 1: Zealand Herald. Feral or roaming dogs have been causing concern
Speaker 1: in remote parts of New Zealand for years, but now
Speaker 1: things are getting so bad trampers have been told they
Speaker 1: risk being attacked if they walk alone. It's prompted calls
Speaker 1: for drastic action to be taken to curb the issue.
Speaker 1: But what tools do we have at our disposal to
Speaker 1: manage the problem and how has it gotten so bad?
Speaker 1: Today on the Front Page, we're joined by New Zealand
Speaker 1: Herald Premium Content Development Deputy editor Hannah Brown, who has
Speaker 1: been looking into this issue. Hannah, just how bad has
Speaker 1: our feral dog problem become?
Speaker 2: Well, it kind of in twenty twenty one. I talked
Speaker 2: to a farmer last week who said he and his
Speaker 2: two neighbors between them have shot ninety dogs since twenty
Speaker 2: twenty one. That included five in the last two months.
Speaker 2: So in twenty twenty one there was a big push
Speaker 2: to eradicate them and a whole bunch was shot. And
Speaker 2: so now you could say there's a ragtag bunch of
Speaker 2: dogs still out there by the sounds of it.
Speaker 1: And many of us will remember the issues with the
Speaker 1: giant pack of dogs and the Far North from about
Speaker 1: twenty twenty one. And what areas of New Zealand are
Speaker 1: we seeing these wild dogs and how difficult are they
Speaker 1: to track down?
Speaker 2: Well, it seems like the worst problems in the Far
Speaker 2: North around Tippaki region, but we've also seen them further
Speaker 2: down in Northland round Fangad. There's been some in the
Speaker 2: central North Island to Udawda and Taranaki and the South Island.
Speaker 2: So it basically sounds like any remote region can suffer
Speaker 2: from this.
Speaker 1: What sort of problem do these dogs pose to farmland?
Speaker 2: Well, you know that worst problem In twenty twenty one
Speaker 2: you had one farmer lose one hundred and twenty stock
Speaker 2: and so yeah, it can be a major problem. And
Speaker 2: the farmers that seem to have the most problem with
Speaker 2: this kind of thing tend to be the ones who
Speaker 2: border on dockland or forestry land. So you know, these
Speaker 2: dogs can run one hundred kilometers a day, so they're like,
Speaker 2: you know, they're in these big tracts of public land
Speaker 2: or forestry land. And if you have a farm next
Speaker 2: to that, then you can be a target.
Speaker 3: One of the.
Speaker 4: Farmers we were talking to who's lost a lot of stock.
Speaker 4: It's been going on on is properly for thirty years,
Speaker 4: but I'll bet it's been going on for a lot
Speaker 4: longer than that. There's a huge economic impact for farmers.
Speaker 4: We've spoken to farmers. We've just given up on raising
Speaker 4: sheep because there's no point. They just get killed. So
Speaker 4: it's switched over the cattle.
Speaker 1: Okay, And it's not just farmers, right. What advice has
Speaker 1: been issued to trampers and hikers walking through the bush?
Speaker 2: Yeah, there have been quite a few reports over the
Speaker 2: years from trampers that they've spotted dogs. Several I think
Speaker 2: five dock tracks have been closed in the last few years.
Speaker 2: While there's been a sweep by hunters to try and
Speaker 2: track down these dogs. There haven't been any attacks by
Speaker 2: dogs on trampers. But people are being told in the
Speaker 2: far North around you know, the out door track, they're
Speaker 2: being told to have a stick if a dog is
Speaker 2: not aggressive, go around it, and to travel in pairs.
Speaker 1: And what about wildlife? What's the risk there?
Speaker 3: Oh?
Speaker 2: This has been I mean, this is one of the
Speaker 2: things that upsets people the most. Since twenty eighteen, there
Speaker 2: have been eighty nine kiwi known to be killed by dogs,
Speaker 2: another thirty five more dead kiwi likely to have been
Speaker 2: killed by dogs, and of course that doesn't include the
Speaker 2: dogs we don't know about.
Speaker 1: So yeah, really tragic.
Speaker 2: And also not just kiwi, but penguins, seal pups, rare snails,
Speaker 2: all sorts of wildlife.
Speaker 1: And what could happen to wildlife like kiwi if this
Speaker 1: problem persists.
Speaker 2: Well, a single dog can kill lots of kiwi in
Speaker 2: one night, so you know that's really of concern.
Speaker 1: And if a pet dog gets violence, we love blaming
Speaker 1: the owner. Is there any one personal group that can
Speaker 1: be blamed for this problem getting so out of hand? Well,
Speaker 1: I mean it looks like if you track this back,
Speaker 1: the much bigger problem is domestic dogs not being well
Speaker 1: looked after. Full domestic dogs were well looked after, we
Speaker 1: wouldn't have a feral dog problem.
Speaker 2: So you know, there have been eighty six dog attacks
Speaker 2: on kids in Auckland since only April, so you know
Speaker 2: there were calls in this story, you know, by farmers
Speaker 2: for there to be a licensing system for dot So
Speaker 2: you know, I think it is something that people are
Speaker 2: starting to realize if we're not going to look after
Speaker 2: our domestic dogs properly, we're going to have these problems.
Speaker 3: We need fu L dinners who are not being responsible
Speaker 3: to really step up and make sure that they're looking
Speaker 3: after their animals. And right now, our most expensive registration
Speaker 3: is only one hundred and thirty two dollars per in them.
Speaker 3: The cheapest right now is about eighty dollars. Man, if
Speaker 3: you want to have a dog, you bloody look after
Speaker 3: your dog. You make sure it's well treated. Please make
Speaker 3: sure that it's got its vaccinations that you get at
Speaker 3: d SXT and everything.
Speaker 1: What have officials said about this problem? Are they aware
Speaker 1: of just how bad it has become?
Speaker 5: Well?
Speaker 2: I spoke in depth to Mayreen Hardybirch, who's the regional
Speaker 2: manager for DOC in the Far North. She's got thirty
Speaker 2: years of experience and was amazing on this topic, and
Speaker 2: she said that she's had conversations with MPI with the SPCA.
Speaker 2: The SPC told me that they are quite concerned about
Speaker 2: feral dogs and they've been lobbying MPI on various aspects
Speaker 2: of this problem for years. And I've got an Official
Speaker 2: Information Act request in with MPI. I did make a
Speaker 2: couple of requests for an interview with them and I
Speaker 2: didn't get a response in time, but I'm still hoping
Speaker 2: to get that interview.
Speaker 1: You touched on the possibility of licensing dog owners. What
Speaker 1: are some other solutions that are being proposed to tackle this?
Speaker 2: Well, this is a super tricky topic, both politically and
Speaker 2: for those at the grassroots on the ground dealing with
Speaker 2: this problem.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: Marine Hardy Birch, the dock regional manager in the Far North.
Speaker 2: She didn't have any easy answers. She said that the
Speaker 2: legal options available are shooting the dogs, which is what
Speaker 2: is currently happening. So doc hires sharpshoe basically hunters to
Speaker 2: kill the dogs when they become aware of them in
Speaker 2: the bush, and farmers are allowed to kill the dogs
Speaker 2: on their own property if they're threatening them of their animals,
Speaker 2: so that's what's happening at the moment. You can also
Speaker 2: trap them, however, these dogs are just so clever they're
Speaker 2: not going to go for that most of the time.
Speaker 2: So those are the two options available at the moment.
Speaker 2: Marine Hardy Birch said that it might be getting to
Speaker 2: the point in New Zealand where we need to look
Speaker 2: at some options, such as Australia has they use toxins
Speaker 2: and poisons. She was kind of at pains to point
Speaker 2: out that where you know, everybody cares about these being
Speaker 2: humane options, are there even options that are humane enough?
Speaker 2: SPCA is asking the same question. It's very unclear.
Speaker 5: Yeah, they had no fear or human they it was
Speaker 5: either me or the dog. It's only time before before
Speaker 5: they'll come out and get some little kid and plan
Speaker 5: on the g NS or a tourist walker.
Speaker 1: And you had a conversation with Doc recently about what
Speaker 1: they are doing to tackle this problem in the Far
Speaker 1: and North. What did they say at the moment.
Speaker 2: They're doing a sweep of the Far North ahead of
Speaker 2: the tramping season with those hunters, so they're going through
Speaker 2: all those really large tracts of bush and forestry land
Speaker 2: just to flush out any dogs ahead of the tramping
Speaker 2: season to keep people safe.
Speaker 1: What does the law say about poisoning feral dogs. Definitely
Speaker 1: no poisoning of feral dogs. It's not lawful in New Zealand,
Speaker 1: it's lawful in Australia. If anything of that nature was
Speaker 1: going to be tested here, it would need some political
Speaker 1: will it would need a lot of groups to get
Speaker 1: together and collaborate on that. That would be the.
Speaker 2: SPCA, doc MPI, and we're miles away from that at
Speaker 2: the moment.
Speaker 1: And I understand some farmers are taking matters into their
Speaker 1: own hands when it comes to the issue of wild dogs.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they've had to be really creative. I mean when
Speaker 2: this issue really blew up in twenty twenty one, you know,
Speaker 2: it was a huge community effort to support the farmers
Speaker 2: who were getting their stock killed at night by these dogs.
Speaker 2: So you had volunteers from around those far North communities
Speaker 2: helping those farmers. They did all sorts of things. They
Speaker 2: put a dog in heat in a cage to attract
Speaker 2: feral dogs onto the farm where they.
Speaker 1: Could be shot.
Speaker 2: They caught a feral dog and they called her a
Speaker 2: Judas dog. They were putting a electric collar on her
Speaker 2: and hoping she'd go running with a pack that would
Speaker 2: enable them to find the pack. Unfortunately, she went off
Speaker 2: and lived by herself, so it didn't work. So yeah,
Speaker 2: the farmers are the ones who have had to come
Speaker 2: up with the most creative solutions because they're the ones
Speaker 2: with the animals being killed on them farm.
Speaker 6: When you like knights out in the cold and the wet,
Speaker 6: looking through thermal imaging cameras and scopes. This one was
Speaker 6: stalking my sister when she shot it, and that one
Speaker 6: was caught amongst my Stop.
Speaker 1: Hannah, you said that one dog owner wants authorities to
Speaker 1: take some pretty drastic action. Can you tell us a
Speaker 1: bit more about that. Yeah.
Speaker 2: One of the farmers I spoke to in the Far North,
Speaker 2: John Nilson. He suggested that domestic dog owners should be licensed,
Speaker 2: and that there should be different levels of licensing depending
Speaker 2: on whether you want to breed dogs. He considered them
Speaker 2: like firearms in the sense that they need to be regulated.
Speaker 1: And if we stand back and do nothing about this problem,
Speaker 1: what could happen?
Speaker 2: In your view, well, I guess we are looking at
Speaker 2: damage to wildlife and more sightings of dogs in the
Speaker 2: wild and potential for attack, although that hasn't happened yet.
Speaker 2: The tramper could be attacked and more wildlife could be
Speaker 2: damaged and killed. And I guess it's an issue where
Speaker 2: we have to balance off the needs of farmers, the
Speaker 2: needs of wildlife, the needs of trampers, and the needs
Speaker 2: of the dogs themselves, because of course, you know, we
Speaker 2: want them to be living a good life too.
Speaker 1: How quickly do we need to get on top of
Speaker 1: this issue.
Speaker 2: Well, Doc's doing it sweet right now. I think they're
Speaker 2: doing their best to get on top of it very quickly.
Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us, Hannah. That's it for this episode
Speaker 1: of the Front Page. You can read more about today's
Speaker 1: stories and extensive news coverage at zet here al dot
Speaker 1: co dot endzet The Front Page is produced by Ethan Sills.
Speaker 1: Patty Fox is a sound engineer. I'm Susie Nordquist. Subscribe
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