1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:04,080 Speaker 1: Nicola Willis Finance Minster Hei Nekeler Hi, Nicola, what's our 2 00:00:04,160 --> 00:00:06,160 Speaker 1: government's position on the US bombing. 3 00:00:07,400 --> 00:00:10,680 Speaker 2: Well, we continue to be a strong supporter of the 4 00:00:10,720 --> 00:00:14,040 Speaker 2: international rule based order. At the same time, we've consistently 5 00:00:14,080 --> 00:00:17,720 Speaker 2: opposed Iran's nuclear program along with other countries, and we 6 00:00:18,120 --> 00:00:21,759 Speaker 2: believe that Iran should never possess a nuke. And we've 7 00:00:21,800 --> 00:00:24,959 Speaker 2: acknowledged the US statement to the UN Security Council that 8 00:00:25,160 --> 00:00:28,360 Speaker 2: it was acting in collective self defense consistent with the 9 00:00:28,480 --> 00:00:31,960 Speaker 2: UN Charter. And our position now as we support all 10 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:35,559 Speaker 2: efforts at diplomacy and de escalation, that is good for 11 00:00:35,640 --> 00:00:36,040 Speaker 2: the world. 12 00:00:36,159 --> 00:00:39,000 Speaker 1: Okay, So we're not doing the same as the Australians are. 13 00:00:38,760 --> 00:00:41,360 Speaker 1: They're backing the US bombing. We're not doing that. 14 00:00:42,120 --> 00:00:46,680 Speaker 2: Well. I think Penny Wog's made statements today Obviously the 15 00:00:46,720 --> 00:00:50,879 Speaker 2: basis of her position is similar, and that the Australia 16 00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:55,040 Speaker 2: also like New Zealand, has consistently opposed Iran's nuclear program. 17 00:00:55,360 --> 00:00:59,480 Speaker 2: They are continuing to call for diplomacy and dialogue. They 18 00:00:59,560 --> 00:01:02,640 Speaker 2: too support the real based order. So made me quote 19 00:01:02,680 --> 00:01:03,440 Speaker 2: statement today. 20 00:01:03,680 --> 00:01:05,560 Speaker 1: Let me quote Anthony Albanezi for you. He said the 21 00:01:05,600 --> 00:01:07,880 Speaker 1: world has long agreed Iran cannot be allowed to get 22 00:01:07,920 --> 00:01:11,440 Speaker 1: a nuclear weapon. We support action to prevent that. That 23 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:12,440 Speaker 1: is what this is. 24 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:16,760 Speaker 2: Well backing sure that our Foreign minister will continue to 25 00:01:16,800 --> 00:01:19,480 Speaker 2: make comments in the coming days as the situation developed. 26 00:01:19,520 --> 00:01:21,280 Speaker 1: Okay, so we basically we need more evidence. 27 00:01:21,360 --> 00:01:24,840 Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, I think our Foreign minister is continuing to 28 00:01:25,080 --> 00:01:27,640 Speaker 2: take briefings and observe the situation, and we've made our 29 00:01:27,680 --> 00:01:31,360 Speaker 2: position on a number of principled matters very clear, and 30 00:01:31,400 --> 00:01:34,000 Speaker 2: we will continue to comment in response to events as 31 00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:34,640 Speaker 2: they unfold. 32 00:01:34,800 --> 00:01:36,440 Speaker 1: Do we believe they were trying to make a nuke? 33 00:01:38,480 --> 00:01:41,720 Speaker 2: Well, that is certainly what the US have said, and 34 00:01:42,000 --> 00:01:47,039 Speaker 2: I cannot give you access to any particular information that 35 00:01:47,080 --> 00:01:49,680 Speaker 2: I've received or briefing that I've received on that matter, 36 00:01:49,840 --> 00:01:52,920 Speaker 2: So I can simply say that that was the position 37 00:01:52,960 --> 00:01:53,480 Speaker 2: of the US. 38 00:01:53,560 --> 00:01:56,360 Speaker 1: Okay, if we accept that they were probably, come on, 39 00:01:56,400 --> 00:01:58,200 Speaker 1: I mean, like circumstantially, it looks like they were trying 40 00:01:58,200 --> 00:01:59,720 Speaker 1: to make a nuke, right, and they have a good 41 00:01:59,720 --> 00:02:00,919 Speaker 1: motive to try to make. 42 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:02,640 Speaker 2: They had bunkers under the ground, didn't they, So. 43 00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:06,640 Speaker 1: Of a little c Yeah, and as well as that, 44 00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:08,800 Speaker 1: I mean, you know, a you could prevent this kind 45 00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:10,360 Speaker 1: of thing happening to them, so they have good reason 46 00:02:10,400 --> 00:02:11,800 Speaker 1: to want to make a nuke. Now, if they are 47 00:02:11,840 --> 00:02:14,360 Speaker 1: trying to make a nuke, what other option did we 48 00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:17,000 Speaker 1: Was there another option rather than just bombing them? 49 00:02:18,040 --> 00:02:21,200 Speaker 2: Well, of course, our long standing position has been that 50 00:02:21,240 --> 00:02:26,360 Speaker 2: we support diplomatic efforts rather than military efforts, and wherever 51 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:30,040 Speaker 2: that is possible, that's what we are what we support, 52 00:02:30,520 --> 00:02:33,280 Speaker 2: and countries will make decisions based on when they think 53 00:02:33,280 --> 00:02:36,639 Speaker 2: those diplomatic efforts are no longer working and when threats 54 00:02:36,639 --> 00:02:38,800 Speaker 2: are real. And in this case, the US had viewed 55 00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:41,760 Speaker 2: that there was a real threat and that they needed 56 00:02:41,760 --> 00:02:43,120 Speaker 2: to take action and self defense. 57 00:02:43,720 --> 00:02:46,200 Speaker 1: Hey, so that GDP figure last week was kind of heartening. 58 00:02:46,240 --> 00:02:48,359 Speaker 1: Do you think that we're through the worst of this recession? 59 00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:52,280 Speaker 2: Well, look, I think we were doing very well in 60 00:02:52,320 --> 00:02:54,720 Speaker 2: the first three months of the year. For context, we 61 00:02:55,200 --> 00:02:59,079 Speaker 2: doubled the growth rate that Treasury had forecast and we 62 00:02:59,080 --> 00:03:01,640 Speaker 2: were at zero point eight, whereas Australia was only at 63 00:03:01,720 --> 00:03:03,839 Speaker 2: zero point two in the first three months of the year. 64 00:03:03,919 --> 00:03:07,080 Speaker 2: So we were doing really well. That domestic recovery was underway. 65 00:03:07,240 --> 00:03:10,400 Speaker 2: But I'm acutely conscious that as of April we had 66 00:03:10,400 --> 00:03:15,120 Speaker 2: the US tariffs and that provides real headwinds to New 67 00:03:15,200 --> 00:03:18,000 Speaker 2: Zealand's growth, and what you've seen since then is a 68 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:21,679 Speaker 2: downgrade in confidence in some other activity measures. So my 69 00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:25,320 Speaker 2: message has been, actually, the fundamentals here are really good. 70 00:03:25,440 --> 00:03:28,880 Speaker 2: The recovery has been underway, and the worst thing we 71 00:03:28,919 --> 00:03:31,720 Speaker 2: can do now is all tuck up into our corners, 72 00:03:32,040 --> 00:03:35,520 Speaker 2: put our heads down and not be confident. Actually, yep, 73 00:03:35,560 --> 00:03:37,960 Speaker 2: the world's throwing stuff at us, but this is a 74 00:03:38,000 --> 00:03:40,400 Speaker 2: good place to be doing business and we have every 75 00:03:40,440 --> 00:03:41,480 Speaker 2: reason to keep in bested. 76 00:03:41,560 --> 00:03:43,040 Speaker 1: Is that what you're worried about it? You worried about 77 00:03:43,080 --> 00:03:44,360 Speaker 1: it like a confidence that you're seeing. 78 00:03:45,520 --> 00:03:49,040 Speaker 2: Yes, I always worry that when international events are unfolding 79 00:03:49,080 --> 00:03:51,800 Speaker 2: in the way that they are currently, that just creates uncertainty. 80 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:55,480 Speaker 2: Very naturally, businesses look at that uncertainty and they say, well, 81 00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:58,240 Speaker 2: I'm not sure what that means, and then that in 82 00:03:58,280 --> 00:04:02,120 Speaker 2: itself feeds into a left of activity. I can't change 83 00:04:02,160 --> 00:04:05,120 Speaker 2: that reality. Businesses will make their own decisions. But my 84 00:04:05,240 --> 00:04:08,640 Speaker 2: message is the fundamentals and our economy relative to other 85 00:04:08,680 --> 00:04:12,080 Speaker 2: economies in the world, are looking good. We've had stable inflation, 86 00:04:12,240 --> 00:04:14,480 Speaker 2: interest rates have come down, we've got a pro growth, 87 00:04:14,480 --> 00:04:19,040 Speaker 2: government investments coming in commodity prices are high. Those factors 88 00:04:19,080 --> 00:04:21,599 Speaker 2: continue to be the case. We can't control what the 89 00:04:21,600 --> 00:04:23,880 Speaker 2: world throws at us, but we can control what we 90 00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:24,520 Speaker 2: do here at home. 91 00:04:24,640 --> 00:04:27,200 Speaker 1: Do you worry about stagflation because I see asb is 92 00:04:27,240 --> 00:04:27,880 Speaker 1: worried about it. 93 00:04:29,240 --> 00:04:32,159 Speaker 2: Well, I do worry about the inflationary pressure that could 94 00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:35,279 Speaker 2: occur if there was a spike in oil prices, and 95 00:04:35,360 --> 00:04:38,680 Speaker 2: the challenges that would create for our economy. And I'm 96 00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:41,640 Speaker 2: conscious that, as I said, our economic recovery is only 97 00:04:41,839 --> 00:04:44,800 Speaker 2: just underway. But I am confident that the Reserve Bank 98 00:04:44,839 --> 00:04:48,359 Speaker 2: still has a lot of room to make decisions in 99 00:04:48,400 --> 00:04:51,760 Speaker 2: relation to inflation, and that we've got very sound fiscal 100 00:04:51,839 --> 00:04:55,320 Speaker 2: and economic management here. That means that we've got more 101 00:04:55,400 --> 00:04:58,440 Speaker 2: buffers than some might around the world. 102 00:04:58,560 --> 00:05:01,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, it is kind of happening. Now, Have you got 103 00:05:01,520 --> 00:05:03,560 Speaker 1: yourself across what ACT is trying to do making it 104 00:05:03,600 --> 00:05:05,880 Speaker 1: easier for bosses to fire staff earning one hundred and 105 00:05:05,880 --> 00:05:09,160 Speaker 1: eighty thousand dollars plus. Yes, I have. 106 00:05:09,400 --> 00:05:12,000 Speaker 2: This is a bill that has been introduced as a 107 00:05:12,040 --> 00:05:15,400 Speaker 2: consequence of our coalition agreement with the ACT, and essentially 108 00:05:16,279 --> 00:05:19,760 Speaker 2: what it proposes is an income threshold of one hundred 109 00:05:19,760 --> 00:05:23,120 Speaker 2: and eighty k or more above which you can only 110 00:05:23,200 --> 00:05:26,640 Speaker 2: do a personal grievance if it's for discrimination or harassment 111 00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:29,520 Speaker 2: or one of those grounds, But you can't lodge a 112 00:05:29,560 --> 00:05:33,960 Speaker 2: personal grievance for unjustified dismissal. It's a change that has 113 00:05:34,080 --> 00:05:38,640 Speaker 2: been reportedly pursued in Australia where apparently it's been quite 114 00:05:38,640 --> 00:05:42,080 Speaker 2: effective at supporting open and frank conversations between what are 115 00:05:42,760 --> 00:05:45,120 Speaker 2: highly paid senior employees. 116 00:05:45,160 --> 00:05:46,960 Speaker 1: Are you ok with this? You guys going to support this? 117 00:05:47,040 --> 00:05:51,080 Speaker 2: Are you well? It is obviously supported in that we're 118 00:05:51,200 --> 00:05:54,080 Speaker 2: introducing the legislation that's a cabinet agreement to do that. 119 00:05:54,160 --> 00:05:56,680 Speaker 2: We will, of course, as we always do, pay attention 120 00:05:56,760 --> 00:05:59,920 Speaker 2: to the select committee process. But the intention here is 121 00:06:00,080 --> 00:06:03,320 Speaker 2: to support businesses to be able to move on people 122 00:06:03,320 --> 00:06:04,520 Speaker 2: who are standing in the way. 123 00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:08,479 Speaker 1: Hold on. You guys and the ACT Party are the 124 00:06:08,520 --> 00:06:12,120 Speaker 1: two parties that are the most about ambition in this country. 125 00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:16,080 Speaker 1: Get yourself up, get yourself earning money, be rich, right, 126 00:06:16,320 --> 00:06:20,680 Speaker 1: it's about it's about absolutely. You guys are about celebrating 127 00:06:20,680 --> 00:06:24,520 Speaker 1: people's success. So how come when people start to be successful, 128 00:06:24,560 --> 00:06:26,760 Speaker 1: we go, I'll treat you differently. You can get fired 129 00:06:26,760 --> 00:06:28,320 Speaker 1: more easily. How does that square off. 130 00:06:28,240 --> 00:06:32,520 Speaker 2: You absolutely national as a party of aspiration. Part of 131 00:06:32,560 --> 00:06:36,080 Speaker 2: that is about allowing employers to give workers a go 132 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:41,800 Speaker 2: in a high impact senior position by five earned no, 133 00:06:41,880 --> 00:06:45,400 Speaker 2: but without being concerned that if it doesn't work out, 134 00:06:45,760 --> 00:06:48,400 Speaker 2: there will be a very costly, very disruptive week. 135 00:06:48,440 --> 00:06:49,679 Speaker 1: Give the nineteen day trial. 136 00:06:49,720 --> 00:06:52,839 Speaker 2: What are you talking about, Well, this is about promoting 137 00:06:52,880 --> 00:06:56,240 Speaker 2: people into high impact positions and judging their performance. So 138 00:06:57,600 --> 00:07:00,400 Speaker 2: our view is, yes, we want to see people these 139 00:07:00,440 --> 00:07:02,400 Speaker 2: senior roles. We want to see them performing well in 140 00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:02,920 Speaker 2: these roles. 141 00:07:03,520 --> 00:07:05,320 Speaker 1: Can I put it to you that for a party 142 00:07:05,320 --> 00:07:08,120 Speaker 1: that's about ambition, you're going pretty hard, making it hard, 143 00:07:08,279 --> 00:07:10,960 Speaker 1: making life a lot harder for people on one eighty 144 00:07:11,040 --> 00:07:14,080 Speaker 1: plus than people who aren't. Right, you're taking benefits away 145 00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:16,800 Speaker 1: from them, your income test, your means testing at one 146 00:07:16,880 --> 00:07:19,000 Speaker 1: eighty and now you're saying people can get fired. And 147 00:07:19,080 --> 00:07:21,360 Speaker 1: actually I would have thought those are the very people 148 00:07:21,360 --> 00:07:23,720 Speaker 1: who need to be more sure of their jobs, given 149 00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:25,720 Speaker 1: that they're probably raising families at that level. 150 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:29,320 Speaker 2: Well, of course, most of those people can be very 151 00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:33,840 Speaker 2: confident in their jobs. Actually, what this is about is 152 00:07:34,040 --> 00:07:37,240 Speaker 2: them not being able to claim an unjustified dismissal as 153 00:07:37,280 --> 00:07:40,320 Speaker 2: a personal grievance. It is a very very small group 154 00:07:40,320 --> 00:07:43,360 Speaker 2: of people to whom that applies. If they are mistreated 155 00:07:43,400 --> 00:07:46,800 Speaker 2: in their work because of discrimination or harassment, they still 156 00:07:46,840 --> 00:07:50,680 Speaker 2: have all legal right to raise a personal grievance. And 157 00:07:50,760 --> 00:07:54,000 Speaker 2: at the same time, many of these employees who are 158 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:57,000 Speaker 2: on those high wages are there because they have high 159 00:07:57,040 --> 00:07:59,960 Speaker 2: degrees of skill and experience and are highly employed. 160 00:08:00,440 --> 00:08:03,600 Speaker 1: All right, did you get the price that will carpet 161 00:08:03,640 --> 00:08:05,200 Speaker 1: for us? No? 162 00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:09,920 Speaker 2: I did not, But I have read the same reports 163 00:08:09,960 --> 00:08:13,800 Speaker 2: that you have that it is a Breamworth manufacturer who's 164 00:08:14,240 --> 00:08:17,640 Speaker 2: sealed that deal and it's going to lead to their factory, 165 00:08:17,680 --> 00:08:19,840 Speaker 2: including an wang Annoy operation. 166 00:08:19,960 --> 00:08:21,920 Speaker 1: No, no, no, don't give me the spin. I hear 167 00:08:21,960 --> 00:08:23,480 Speaker 1: your spin. I hear it coming at me. 168 00:08:24,120 --> 00:08:25,040 Speaker 2: That's just the truth. Here. 169 00:08:29,320 --> 00:08:31,120 Speaker 1: Are you going just be honest with me? Are you 170 00:08:31,200 --> 00:08:32,320 Speaker 1: going to get me the price or not? 171 00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:37,480 Speaker 2: I have double checked this, triple jets, this and every 172 00:08:37,600 --> 00:08:41,120 Speaker 2: statement I have made has been verified. Which is the 173 00:08:41,200 --> 00:08:44,600 Speaker 2: price for the new contract is no more than they 174 00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:45,920 Speaker 2: were paying for nylon. 175 00:08:46,440 --> 00:08:49,080 Speaker 1: That's a deal here. That No, no, you can I 176 00:08:49,120 --> 00:08:50,760 Speaker 1: want to know the price per square meter. 177 00:08:50,880 --> 00:08:53,720 Speaker 2: I don't believe you, But did you know the price 178 00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:57,240 Speaker 2: per square meter of the old contract and can you 179 00:08:59,160 --> 00:09:01,560 Speaker 2: all sense but you don't know all the terms and 180 00:09:01,559 --> 00:09:06,680 Speaker 2: conditions of the contract price. Look, I trust that in 181 00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:10,440 Speaker 2: this instance that they can't. No, no, no, I'm not 182 00:09:10,480 --> 00:09:15,120 Speaker 2: providing I'm not providing any evasion. I have absolutely scrutinized this. 183 00:09:15,200 --> 00:09:18,160 Speaker 2: I've said, can I make the claim to all of 184 00:09:18,200 --> 00:09:21,240 Speaker 2: the listeners to news talks B you have this isn't 185 00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:25,439 Speaker 2: actually resulting in a high price, And they've said absolutely. 186 00:09:25,559 --> 00:09:28,840 Speaker 2: In fact, when you look at the overall retenders, they 187 00:09:28,960 --> 00:09:30,960 Speaker 2: are coming in just a little bit cheaper. 188 00:09:31,320 --> 00:09:34,040 Speaker 1: Oh nonsense. I don't believe the contracts. Do you want 189 00:09:34,120 --> 00:09:35,959 Speaker 1: Do you want to come? I can only repeat you. 190 00:09:35,920 --> 00:09:37,360 Speaker 2: The advice I've received. No. 191 00:09:37,480 --> 00:09:39,640 Speaker 1: But the longer this goes on the mid it looks 192 00:09:39,679 --> 00:09:40,120 Speaker 1: you know that. 193 00:09:40,520 --> 00:09:42,240 Speaker 2: No, I'm not going to get into the practice of 194 00:09:42,280 --> 00:09:45,359 Speaker 2: revealing the commercial terms of private contracts. 195 00:09:45,400 --> 00:09:47,640 Speaker 1: I believe, and have you one more chance. I'll give 196 00:09:47,679 --> 00:09:49,280 Speaker 1: you one more chance. N I'll ask you. 197 00:09:49,760 --> 00:09:52,040 Speaker 2: I'm going to keep giving you the benefit of the doubt, too, 198 00:09:52,520 --> 00:09:54,400 Speaker 2: which is that one day you're going to come around 199 00:09:54,400 --> 00:09:58,880 Speaker 2: to the idea that a good contract that delivers wholesome, sustainable, 200 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:02,679 Speaker 2: healthy will to new Zealand houses and supports our sheep 201 00:10:02,720 --> 00:10:06,000 Speaker 2: industry is just a good thing. There's no need to 202 00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:08,200 Speaker 2: pick the eyes out of it. Thank you, just a 203 00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:08,800 Speaker 2: happy day. 204 00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:11,920 Speaker 1: Thank you here that I appreciate your time. As always, 205 00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:16,360 Speaker 1: Nikola Willis, Finance Minister. For more from Heather Duplessy Allen Drive, 206 00:10:16,520 --> 00:10:19,880 Speaker 1: listen live to news talks. It'd be from four pm weekdays, 207 00:10:20,040 --> 00:10:22,240 Speaker 1: or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.