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Speaker 1: Good afternoon. As predicted, the government has decided to appoint

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Speaker 1: a Crown observer after all to Wellington Council. The Minister's

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Speaker 1: explained what he's worried about. He's worried about counselors walking

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Speaker 1: out of meetings, counselors confused about decisions, counselors criticizing each

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Speaker 1: other publicly, and the council overcharging rate payers currently as

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Speaker 1: much as seven hundred million dollars over the next ten

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Speaker 1: years for fixing the pipes.

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Speaker 2: Now.

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Speaker 1: Tim Brown is a Wellington City councilor.

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Speaker 2: Hi, Tim, good, how are you.

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Speaker 1: I'm very well, thank you? How are you? What did

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Speaker 1: I tell you? Tim? What did I tell you?

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Speaker 2: I know you're either you're way better connected or you're

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Speaker 2: fable or a seat than I am. Well does I

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Speaker 2: do not see this coming, though, Tim, because I think

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Speaker 2: I misinterpreted. I mean, I think some people are at

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Speaker 2: the council table did, but I think that I personally

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Speaker 2: thought it wasn't necessary, but I realized that basically what

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Speaker 2: the Minister has done is appoint subody to inform him.

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Speaker 2: So you know, there's a lot of rhetoric about the

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Speaker 2: observers going to help us. You arrive at the right decisions.

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Speaker 2: Blah blah blah. But at the end of the day,

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Speaker 2: he's put somebody in the road so that they can

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Speaker 2: go to him and say, hey, saman it's not working

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Speaker 2: to fire these guys and move on. So I hadn't

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Speaker 2: quite thought he needed to have somebody because I thought

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Speaker 2: that ze B would have done a good enough job

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Speaker 2: to keep him reform.

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Speaker 1: So thanks, Tim, thanks for crediting us. No, but I mean,

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Speaker 1: can you see what this is, Tim, Because this is

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Speaker 1: the first step towards commissioners. Right, that person will be

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Speaker 1: appointed as basically a knak to the government. So unless

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Speaker 1: you guys start making sound financial decisions, it gets upgraded

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Speaker 1: to full taking over the whole show.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's exactly right. That is precisely on the money, right,

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Speaker 2: so we won't be having to bet on that one.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Well, explain something to me because I am also

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Speaker 1: now curious about something that Simeon Brown has pointed out here.

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Speaker 1: He's quite concerned about how you guys are funding your

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Speaker 1: pipe fixing. So he says only six percent of the

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Speaker 1: pipe fixing, that sixty six million dollars is coming through

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Speaker 1: debt and the rest over a billion dollars is coming

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Speaker 1: through rates. Why have you struck it like that.

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Speaker 2: The first thing I'd say, just sort of macro level,

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Speaker 2: is that within council you can I sure can probably

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Speaker 2: imagine councilors always wanted their fun things. They always wanted

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Speaker 2: their fun because of course they don't have pits up

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Speaker 2: today's rate players. So there's you know, a massive propensity

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Speaker 2: to want a debt fund if you possibly can. So

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Speaker 2: there's there's definitely no lack of will not me. And

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Speaker 2: I'm saying because I'm an extreme fiscal conservative and I

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Speaker 2: don't believe in council having lots of debt, and I

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Speaker 2: see the whole long term plan exercise being to cut debt,

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Speaker 2: not to increase debt. So it's kind of where that

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Speaker 2: the minister is now saying.

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Speaker 1: But Tim, why this is important is that he, in

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Speaker 1: the wake of the wake of three Waters, has set

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Speaker 1: up a funding program that gives you cheap debt for

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Speaker 1: exactly this.

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Speaker 2: No, but it's a it's not cheap because if you borrow,

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Speaker 2: you know, a million dollars, you do have to repay

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Speaker 2: the million dollars and you have to pay interest on

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Speaker 2: top of a million dollars. So it's you know, it's

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Speaker 2: all there is just cost deferred, it's not a cost avoided.

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Speaker 2: And the reality is that it's very complicated. And as

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Speaker 2: I say that round the council table, there is always

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Speaker 2: enthusiasm debt fund things if possible. So the advice we've

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Speaker 2: received from our offices is that we have to do

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Speaker 2: it this particular way. And there are lots of other

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Speaker 2: actiguating reasons why this particular number, which is plucked out

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Speaker 2: of a much more comp comprehensive piece of financial information,

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Speaker 2: is actually fundamentally incorrect.

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Speaker 1: I'm a bit worried about it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but I's going to say relative City Council is

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Speaker 2: not out there foolishly whacking current rate payers where it

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Speaker 2: could actually be doing it by way of debt and

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Speaker 2: making some future bunch of ratepayers who will have a

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Speaker 2: different bunch of councilors paid. We are definitely not. If

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Speaker 2: you like deferring the use of debt, we're using as

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Speaker 2: much debt as we possibly can and back too much.

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Speaker 1: Are you going to scrap the OLDEMAR project?

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Speaker 2: Well you can be certain that I personally would. I mean,

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Speaker 2: but again, this is where the council wars have to

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Speaker 2: actually slug it out because There are definitely at least

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Speaker 2: half a dozen of us who would happily cab the

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Speaker 2: whole thing tomorrow. But half a dozen doesn't give you

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Speaker 2: a majority. So this is where Tory's trading is going

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Speaker 2: to have to come off. Because, as you know, the

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Speaker 2: Gold and Miner has got two components. It's got the

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Speaker 2: Courtney Place component, which is highly developed and all ready

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Speaker 2: to go almost and then you have the key end

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Speaker 2: and I personally would like to get rid of both

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Speaker 2: parts of it. But some counselors would happily go, Okay,

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Speaker 2: we've got to do something a courty places to sort

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Speaker 2: that out and get rid of the rest. But that's

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Speaker 2: that's the trading which Tory is going to have to organize.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, hey, so next year for the beer once I've

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Speaker 1: had this baby, or come have a beer with you.

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Speaker 2: No, it's champagne. I'm definitely buying here a champagne. You've

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Speaker 2: got two babies, you deserve champagne.

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Speaker 1: You're upgrading it, Tim, Do you know what I can?

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Speaker 1: I can? I mean, I'm worried about your your financial

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Speaker 1: nowse just upgrading me for free. But I'm going to

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Speaker 1: take you up on that. Well, of course, very good

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Speaker 1: point Jim, thank you very much mate. Look after yourself.

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Speaker 1: Tim Brown, Wellington City councilor For more from Hither Duplessy

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