Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from News Talk sad B.
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Speaker 2: Take it on the Patrick. It is out, the Test
Speaker 2: is over. Goodn't dismay from us.
Speaker 3: A beauty, it is out and here he goes.
Speaker 4: This delivery has in many years of.
Speaker 2: The Bold.
Speaker 1: On the Front Foot where Brian Waddell and Jeremy Cody,
Speaker 1: powered by News Talks head b at iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2: On the Front Foot. In what a week we can
Speaker 2: celebrate the emphatic Treadbridge's Test and the remarkable series when
Speaker 2: from One Mill Down at Lords, the bizarre events in
Speaker 2: the England Temp, the departure of Stokes is McCollum's job safe.
Speaker 2: We'll be talking to former England past ball of Stephen
Speaker 2: Finn about the Test and the series. Also commentator Simon
Speaker 2: Mann from the BBC and a few thoughts from Peter Holland,
Speaker 2: along with Jeremy Coney as ever basking in the euphoria
Speaker 2: of Test cricket success and Jerry, I know it was
Speaker 2: a while ago, but you've experienced the same sort of
Speaker 2: thing as a New Zealand player and I guess it's
Speaker 2: a special moment when you win a series, particularly against England,
Speaker 2: because England and Australia were the real challenges we always faced,
Speaker 2: weren't they?
Speaker 4: They were, and I think we always looked wads when
Speaker 4: I was playing back to England to look at how
Speaker 4: we played, how we should play test cricket. If you
Speaker 4: look at the players that went that way, where did
Speaker 4: they go? They didn't go to Australia to day. They
Speaker 4: headed to England and that's where I think we committed
Speaker 4: and felt that we would learn the game well. So
Speaker 4: they kind of took a feeling of being a parent,
Speaker 4: if you like. And it's nice too. It's nice to
Speaker 4: sort of beat the old people sometime, if I can
Speaker 4: put it that way, there's a certain pleasure. I remember
Speaker 4: as asking me just after the game, well what do
Speaker 4: you think about this, Jeremy and the team beat? I said,
Speaker 4: Can I just say? First of all, as a player,
Speaker 4: you want to make your new you know your country's team,
Speaker 4: and then you want to win a Test match with
Speaker 4: your country and you're in the team, and then you
Speaker 4: want to win a series. And there's only one thing
Speaker 4: after there is you want to beat England. Yeah, and
Speaker 4: we love beating you. And that was the end of
Speaker 4: the interview.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we go, and I could imagine you enjoying it
Speaker 2: because we've had a few tough times in the BBC
Speaker 2: box over the period of time, and we only have
Speaker 2: to reach twenty nineteen and we're not going to go
Speaker 2: any further than that before we review the test. I
Speaker 2: just wonder what happened between you and me and our
Speaker 2: guests last week. Daniel Norcross, he sort of during the
Speaker 2: commentary he took well the person out of you basically.
Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't know if you heard.
Speaker 5: Him, No, I didn't.
Speaker 4: He was very good, was he What was he trying
Speaker 4: to do?
Speaker 5: What was he telling?
Speaker 2: He was just trying. He was just imitating you speaking
Speaker 2: all right, yeah, mimicking you and and the pauses and
Speaker 2: and and the way you use words, and it was
Speaker 2: very clever. I must admit I had a bit of
Speaker 2: a laugh and I thought, well, I'll just bring it
Speaker 2: up just to check and see whether we're upset a
Speaker 2: himore or whether he was just having fun. He seems
Speaker 2: like a fun man.
Speaker 4: I think probably what happened once there was a one
Speaker 4: of the lunch times, you know how Jonathan Agne on
Speaker 4: a Saturday or something. I interviews somebody for about an hour. Yeah,
Speaker 4: and this particular guest was someone who was exactly that,
Speaker 4: a mimic and he's also doing cats and he's also
Speaker 4: doing all sorts of other shows, clever man, and he
Speaker 4: had to he had to talk about they were doing
Speaker 4: something on splitting Image apparently at this chap and he
Speaker 4: was had to mimic Just Cinder, a dern of all people,
Speaker 4: and he chose me as the voice to be not Regicinda,
Speaker 4: but I think a sheep, and so there he was.
Speaker 4: So he asked me to go in at the same time,
Speaker 4: and we were there, the three of us, and the guy.
Speaker 4: Did you know he had a crack at being me.
Speaker 4: I listened to it and I thought, oh, maybe my
Speaker 4: brother so but nevertheless, I know I've heard that Daniel
Speaker 4: is rather good and slightly better at it.
Speaker 2: Yes, well, there's there's a lot. Of course. There was
Speaker 2: a guy called Peter Brackley. I think he was also
Speaker 2: very good at doing the mooking. But you know, it
Speaker 2: just adds to the fun of what you're at. And
Speaker 2: I'm glad you took it nictually, Jerry, and I'm sure
Speaker 2: you would have made a very good Just Cinder.
Speaker 5: Or a sheet.
Speaker 2: Yeah right, we'll review the Test match in a moment
Speaker 2: and as I say, later on we'll be talking to
Speaker 2: Simon Mann and also Stephen Finn. But just before we do, Jerry,
Speaker 2: let's hear from Rob Walter, who in a very quiet,
Speaker 2: matter of fact way reacts to the team performance and
Speaker 2: the success in the key moments through the Test series.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 7: I think every win or loss will go down to,
Speaker 7: you know, winning or losing key moments in the game.
Speaker 7: And obviously in Test cricket they look a little bit
Speaker 7: different to the shorter format of the game and sometimes
Speaker 7: and it doesn't equate to run. Look, you know, Glenn
Speaker 7: Phillip's dealing with Josh ra Arch and Atova spell, you
Speaker 7: know where he just refused to take the ball on,
Speaker 7: spend most of his time on his back and you know,
Speaker 7: just just making the decision and understanding that that was
Speaker 7: what was required for him in that moment in order
Speaker 7: for the team to find its way in the game
Speaker 7: and find its way into a position of strength. I
Speaker 7: think there were a lot of those that, you know,
Speaker 7: that went on throughout the Test series and it's obvious
Speaker 7: because we wouldn't have won the series if we didn't
Speaker 7: win those little moments. But but the little moments are
Speaker 7: not always runs and wickets. The little moments are often
Speaker 7: mindset and an illustration of the team's culture and the
Speaker 7: teams together us around what they're trying to achieve. So
Speaker 7: for me, you know, Glenn's that moment in time was
Speaker 7: one obviously Darryl and Rutchan's partnership, but then Daryl batting
Speaker 7: the way that he batted, understanding what was required from him,
Speaker 7: shifting the gears, you know, towards the end with the tail.
Speaker 6: We had even a guy like Carl.
Speaker 7: Jamerson, you know, get hit on the head three times
Speaker 7: and still keep going, you know, to score you know
Speaker 7: the runs that he scored, you know, so you have
Speaker 7: little things like that. You know, Ben Sears gets hit
Speaker 7: on his bowling hand twice, he goes back into bat
Speaker 7: with Darryl Darrell gets his hundred, we get to score
Speaker 7: three to seventy odd but he still then goes back
Speaker 7: and balls and gets the wicked have Ben Duckett, you know,
Speaker 7: willow Row guests that I bowled with a split finger.
Speaker 6: I didn't know how he was going to hold the
Speaker 6: cricket ball.
Speaker 7: But he runs any balls three overs you know, it
Speaker 7: didn't necessarily are quite equate to any wickets, but what
Speaker 7: it did do is it showed the rest of the
Speaker 7: team the hunger you know, to do something, you know,
Speaker 7: to go beyond when when the team needs you to
Speaker 7: do that. So, I mean, I could rattle off moments.
Speaker 7: Tom Blundell standing up to stump is the moment, you
Speaker 7: know again, And so yeah, little things like that that
Speaker 7: happened in the three Test match series is there's probably
Speaker 7: twenty of them, but they're all great to reflect on
Speaker 7: and to share as a team.
Speaker 2: And just finally, what sort of emphasis as a team
Speaker 2: and as a coach did you put on what appeared
Speaker 2: to this part of the world anyway some disarray within
Speaker 2: the English set up after the Lord's Test when they
Speaker 2: had their issues there and then it seemed to carry
Speaker 2: on right the way through. Was that part of your
Speaker 2: mindset as a coach or do you just get on
Speaker 2: with your own job?
Speaker 7: I know, I mean again, we had such a simple plan.
Speaker 6: And that was never going to change.
Speaker 7: In fact, after the first Test and after losing in
Speaker 7: the first Test, it probably reaffirmed that you know, if
Speaker 7: we did it well, it would put us in a
Speaker 7: good position and then obviously their own issues in their
Speaker 7: camps started to develop, but nothing changed in terms of
Speaker 7: the way we were trying to play. Ultimately, we just
Speaker 7: acknowledged that they were going to have to deal with,
Speaker 7: you know, with certain issues where it was going to
Speaker 7: make them weak or stronger.
Speaker 6: You know, that remains to be seen.
Speaker 7: Often guys come into teams them as adversity and stand
Speaker 7: up and do well.
Speaker 6: You know, so I don't think you can.
Speaker 7: I've played against many different teams who have thrived under
Speaker 7: you know, turmoil around them, So I didn't necessarily think
Speaker 7: that this would have any bearing on on on them
Speaker 7: and the way they play the game. And if it did,
Speaker 7: the only way we could ever elicit sort of any
Speaker 7: advantage out of that was to be even better with
Speaker 7: our skill execution and not let them into the game.
Speaker 7: And I think that was the important thing. It's just
Speaker 7: focusing purely on on on that and and being better
Speaker 7: every single time as a team. And you know, then
Speaker 7: if they're if there are cracks in the opposition, then
Speaker 7: that'll expose them even more.
Speaker 6: You know.
Speaker 7: The last thing you want to do is let them
Speaker 7: into the game. And you know, we weren't. We weren't
Speaker 7: very well, very crit clinical at certain times, but we've
Speaker 7: got better and better throughout this series, which is great
Speaker 7: to see.
Speaker 2: Fairy organized man quite clearly rob Botron and he seems
Speaker 2: to be the kind of architecture want. He doesn't want
Speaker 2: to be in the front line of anything. He analyzes
Speaker 2: things very clearly, and I think he makes fair points
Speaker 2: in that little bit that we played.
Speaker 4: Very much so Brian in fact, if you compare, I mean,
Speaker 4: he's quiet, he likes being in the background. He's out
Speaker 4: there first every day. I was at the ground quite
Speaker 4: early and he was already out there looking at the
Speaker 4: practice pictures and getting the bat ready and getting all
Speaker 4: everything that he needed for his training and giving the throwdowns,
Speaker 4: talking to the batsman. You know, he just goes about
Speaker 4: his business in a gentle kind of way, but at
Speaker 4: the same time make sure every box has tipped. Very
Speaker 4: different from McCullum, isn't it. And I just highlight that
Speaker 4: because those are That's the way the two teams behaved
Speaker 4: as well. You know, New Zealand seemed much in terms
Speaker 4: of the two sides, much more calmly determined, confronting a
Speaker 4: lot of changes that they had to in this last
Speaker 4: Test match. All the families there. I stayed at the
Speaker 4: same hotel all their families there. You know, probably about
Speaker 4: fifteen to twenty young children between sort of one and
Speaker 4: four or five. A lot of noise, a lot of noise.
Speaker 4: Tom Nathan removing a child who's being a boisterous and
Speaker 4: has to walk them in the walker away for a
Speaker 4: while before he can bring them back. So it's just
Speaker 4: a nice touch, I think, and it says a lot
Speaker 4: about the way that they could cope with the changes,
Speaker 4: and there were a lot of them, weren't there with
Speaker 4: the three Phillips and Jamison and Henry missing initially and
Speaker 4: then of course Technic going as well with the concussion,
Speaker 4: so and a lot to the bowling. But but yeah,
Speaker 4: you know, they had to bounce back from a loss
Speaker 4: and they won the next match pretty comfortably by two
Speaker 4: hundred plus runs. England. I just looked they were just
Speaker 4: in turmoil, really, a lot of rumor surrounding them, particularly
Speaker 4: the guys in charge, a lot of innuendo, and they
Speaker 4: just didn't seem as settled kind of side. And they
Speaker 4: and the way they tried to win things was with
Speaker 4: either well the day where they came out and just
Speaker 4: literally could not win the Test after that hour and
Speaker 4: a bit, they just couldn't in the game day four
Speaker 4: and yeah, so very two very different sides under pressures,
Speaker 4: particularly England with a voracious media.
Speaker 2: Just thinking on that, I don't take much notice of
Speaker 2: necessary normally, but he made one pertinent comment to my
Speaker 2: mind that it was New Zealand showing England how to
Speaker 2: do it. Yet the England camp has got a lot
Speaker 2: of New Zealanders in terms of leadership, with Southy McCollum
Speaker 2: and Jet and Patel in there, and that to me
Speaker 2: was a telling point.
Speaker 4: Well, I don't know why those three New Zealanders aren't
Speaker 4: able to keep the rest of the side calm. There's
Speaker 4: certainly a lot more media there, Brian, There's no doubt
Speaker 4: about that, and there's a lot of things written and
Speaker 4: so that place is pressure on you. But you need
Speaker 4: to somehow retain a way of thinking about the game.
Speaker 4: And I mean I think perhaps that the toss was
Speaker 4: quite employ ston't You could see little cracks on the
Speaker 4: first day. It was a dry pitch and the ground
Speaker 4: staff were concerned that it was a little dry, and
Speaker 4: of course then the two hot days occurred beyond that time.
Speaker 4: It's not the only thing though, of course you've got
Speaker 4: to still take advantage of it, don't you. And Conway,
Speaker 4: the more aggressive and lath them, the more compact constructed,
Speaker 4: you know. The first key element in the game, and
Speaker 4: that was three hundred and seventeen runs in a partnership,
Speaker 4: and it was it was hot work for the English side.
Speaker 4: It was almost about perfect, wasn't it that first day?
Speaker 4: And yet you know we lost a couple late in
Speaker 4: the day. Phase two kind of belonged to England. I
Speaker 4: felt four thirty eight New Zealand ten for one hundred
Speaker 4: and twenty odd and then being two hundred and twenty
Speaker 4: three for three. At the end of that day, Bethel
Speaker 4: and Route had established themselves, you know, it evened up
Speaker 4: and of course New Zealand. That was the day New
Speaker 4: Zealand lost. Tichner and folks came in and made a
Speaker 4: bit of an impression, didn't he. Actually, in terms of
Speaker 4: wickets batted okay. But Phase three was New Zealand's again,
Speaker 4: like Lazarus, they would turn from the dead. Really, I
Speaker 4: was wondering how on earth if the pitch stayed the same,
Speaker 4: would New Zealand get back into it. But Rute and
Speaker 4: Betel rut and Bethel went early and they ended up
Speaker 4: eighty four precious runs behind, and Folks left. His mark
Speaker 4: I think was what was it three wickets something like that,
Speaker 4: I think, and making the ball suddenly go down and up.
Speaker 4: And this was the day, I think where it became
Speaker 4: very clear that batting was not going to be easy
Speaker 4: for the rest of the match. Ravendra in the second innings,
Speaker 4: I mean, we lost Conway later and Nichols quickly didn't
Speaker 4: we yep, and then Revendra set about on an innings
Speaker 4: to me which kind of showed that he has the judgment,
Speaker 4: that he has the shots that we know he can
Speaker 4: and if he can put the two together. He kind
Speaker 4: of worked to eradicate the first innings blunder that he
Speaker 4: had made. And for about his first thirty balls he
Speaker 4: must have been twenty two twenty three not out. He
Speaker 4: made a significant difference to the start of that New
Speaker 4: Zealand secondaries after losing those three early wickets, and he
Speaker 4: took the sting out of the new ball that was
Speaker 4: being bold. So that was it was a very important
Speaker 4: little cameo to get his innings started. At the time,
Speaker 4: Mitchell was really supportive, but no more than that it
Speaker 4: was Revendra who was driving the way the game was changing.
Speaker 4: And even though the conditions themselves were becoming variable, a
Speaker 4: bit up and a bit down, there were more cracks
Speaker 4: you could see day in Day three, player traffic was
Speaker 4: becoming obvious. Running down the pitch, you could get targets,
Speaker 4: you know, the whole pitch started to look spent and tired.
Speaker 4: And then we got to day four when all the
Speaker 4: things happened, was Revender and Mitchell going almost to lunch,
Speaker 4: Revender getting out to one that just kept a smidge
Speaker 4: and low, and then Mitchell for the rest of the
Speaker 4: day accepted the responsibility. It was what you might not
Speaker 4: call it a pretty innings, but man grim, determined, gutsy,
Speaker 4: showed his will, showed his character and his bravery. Really,
Speaker 4: I don't know how many times he was hit on
Speaker 4: the hand, on the arms, on the helmet, helmets changed,
Speaker 4: you know that this was an innings of the Really,
Speaker 4: I mean, he was just terrific. I thought, I don't
Speaker 4: know what you thought, but one hundred and seventy balls
Speaker 4: for his first fifty, full of concentration and cleverness on
Speaker 4: defense because the ball coming back in LBW when it
Speaker 4: was keeping low was the obvious way of getting out.
Speaker 4: He looked after his inside edge and he made sure
Speaker 4: that it didn't hit his pad, getting it right out
Speaker 4: in front. That was very clever defense. And so that
Speaker 4: was an absolutely critical part of the game. The crowd
Speaker 4: was shouting Mitchell boring, and he had give them a
Speaker 4: little wave and then he'd go on and just carry
Speaker 4: on with his defiance.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but that's the proof that Test match cricket is
Speaker 2: not all about reverse sweeps and T twenty cricket. It's
Speaker 2: about putting your body on the line and taking a
Speaker 2: hit for the team. And he played like an all Black,
Speaker 2: didn't he in a tight situation.
Speaker 4: That that was a very very special Mitchell hundred and strange,
Speaker 4: you know. Strangely enough, that first fifty actually meant a
Speaker 4: lot more to me than the second part, which was
Speaker 4: seventy balls for fifty. So it was the fact that
Speaker 4: he went through all that work that gives you an
Speaker 4: opportunity to play more freely later on, you know. And
Speaker 4: he was rebuffing the Atkinsons and the Stokes and the
Speaker 4: Archers and the tongues, you know, and you know they
Speaker 4: were hurling themselves at him, and yet he just worked
Speaker 4: at it, you know. So that was a key partnership.
Speaker 4: And then Blundell and Santana wentz and then Smith and folks,
Speaker 4: Folks getting out the very next ball. After of course
Speaker 4: the crowd heard about Stokes retiring, but then we got
Speaker 4: sixty five sixty five more critical runs after that moment,
Speaker 4: and that again showed to me a lot about I mean,
Speaker 4: Sears played. I saw him in the lifter, came down
Speaker 4: the lift with him today. Well played, man, he said,
Speaker 4: thank you so much. It was a great test to
Speaker 4: be part of. And who got nineteen or fourteen hit
Speaker 4: on the fingers had to retire hurt Also out came
Speaker 4: o'rourt got out. Who came back and it's only been
Speaker 4: off the field for about two minutes. Sears came back.
Speaker 4: They could not pin us down.
Speaker 3: Yep.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I mean it was a lot of individual performances,
Speaker 2: but no one individually stamped their total authority on the performance.
Speaker 2: It was a real team effort, wasn't it. And I
Speaker 2: think that that was what showed through more than anything
Speaker 2: else when you put all those individual pieces together. And
Speaker 2: that's why I spoke to Rob Walter about winning the
Speaker 2: key moments. That was the difference between the two, wasn't it?
Speaker 4: And he was absolutely right, absolutely right, So three seventy
Speaker 4: three and then there was mayhem, wasn't there. Then there
Speaker 4: was a farcical period of and you could hear you
Speaker 4: could hear the New Zealanders. I don't know whether you
Speaker 4: could if you turned up the stump mic you could
Speaker 4: hear them say whoa, they'd be laughing when Brooke got
Speaker 4: out nine balls for you know, twenty one off nine
Speaker 4: balls and quite yeah, they will laugh at what's going on?
Speaker 4: What are they doing? It was great and it was great.
Speaker 2: They've taken real stick over there in the UK, haven't they.
Speaker 4: Oh they have totally totally. It was just it was
Speaker 4: It would have been okay if they were chasing one
Speaker 4: hundred and seventy, not three hundred and seventy. They're used
Speaker 4: to doing that, so that's very much the Melbourne target.
Speaker 4: One hundred and seventy. That sort of thing, and you
Speaker 4: might get a with a very quick start where you
Speaker 4: lose wickets and you're prepared to do so. They lost
Speaker 4: two thirds of their top order and amidst all the shots,
Speaker 4: Bessel got out playing no shots, which is a bit ironic,
Speaker 4: and I you know they just I couldn't understand it
Speaker 4: what I was seeing either, so especially after they'd seen Ravendra,
Speaker 4: especially after they'd seen Mitchell. But they didn't back themselves
Speaker 4: to be able to bat the same way.
Speaker 2: And yet they believe in themselves an ability to take
Speaker 2: sides apart under the bas ball scenario. We'll be hearing
Speaker 2: from Stephen Finn very shortly and also from side Man.
Speaker 2: Just a final word from eu Jery. I know we
Speaker 2: could talk a lot more about this and we will
Speaker 2: reflect on it over a period of time. Do you
Speaker 2: see personally Brendan McCallum surviving as coach?
Speaker 4: Well, it's got a chance because I know that there
Speaker 4: are calls. But you know, while the inner sanctum of
Speaker 4: McCullum and Key, I think the Key is less at
Speaker 4: risk than McCullum just because of the job that he's got.
Speaker 4: I think the ECB who will be making the decision
Speaker 4: really Gould and co McCullum. For the first thing, he
Speaker 4: convinced them that Gould that he had changed right we're
Speaker 4: going back to just between us arriving and the end
Speaker 4: of the Ashes right that period. Secondly, they won the
Speaker 4: first Test Lord's which they might regard as signs of progress.
Speaker 4: Then twenty four hours later that's gone a bit, but
Speaker 4: not the fault of the management, not the fault of McCullum.
Speaker 4: I think they would look at it, and they might
Speaker 4: look at the fact that the crew the toss was
Speaker 4: fairly important and they lost it. However, they've only had
Speaker 4: two wins out of ten the last ten and since
Speaker 4: twenty twenty three it's a losing record. So mcculum is
Speaker 4: lucky to be there. I think That's how I feel.
Speaker 4: But who would they what would they do? I mean,
Speaker 4: they will probably feel that they would be more in
Speaker 4: control if Brooker's captain than they would if it was Stoked.
Speaker 4: Who would argue with them and be much more strong
Speaker 4: about it, I think, And so they might feel that
Speaker 4: they have got more power at that stage to run
Speaker 4: the run the cutter if you like. So it's a
Speaker 4: mixed and confusing picture, Wads. I don't really mind, to
Speaker 4: be honest, I'm just thrilled New Zealand have come from
Speaker 4: one down and they've won the last two Test matches convincingly.
Speaker 4: They've deserved the victory. They've quietly gone about the way
Speaker 4: to play Test cricket better than the opposition.
Speaker 1: Brian Waddell, Jeremy Coney on the front foot.
Speaker 2: It's a pleasure to be joined by former England pasteballer
Speaker 2: now BBC tist met special commentator Stephen Finn, who I've
Speaker 2: been fortunate enough to work with him the past, and
Speaker 2: of course he's a very close friend of New Zealand,
Speaker 2: having played a bit of time here in New Zealand.
Speaker 2: But I guess you don't celebrate sucist to the same
Speaker 2: extent that we do when New Zealand beat England.
Speaker 8: Funny, Not quite, i'd say, Brian, No, not quite. It's
Speaker 8: it's been a weird few days here. I think there's
Speaker 8: been loads of stuff going on on our side of
Speaker 8: the fence, clearly with the Ben Stokes retirement and all
Speaker 8: of the conjecture around that. But nothing should be taken
Speaker 8: away from the way New Zealand have played here. It's
Speaker 8: been it's been outstanding, and I think even more so
Speaker 8: given the fact that they were injury ravaged in this game,
Speaker 8: missing for of their what you would consider main players
Speaker 8: coming into this Test match, to then need a concussion
Speaker 8: substitute as well, but still come out with a huge victory.
Speaker 8: It's not just a small victory. This is a huge
Speaker 8: victory here at trent Bridge. They fully deserve this series winen,
Speaker 8: So I'm not celebrating it as much as you, but
Speaker 8: I respect it as much as you.
Speaker 2: That's great. Does it reflect that there are issues in
Speaker 2: the England game then at the moment.
Speaker 8: I think there's certainly a lot to look at. I
Speaker 8: think we'll have to let the dust settle on this
Speaker 8: series and then take a view looking forward about what
Speaker 8: is done next. But certainly when you're beaten this badly
Speaker 8: at home for the first time in a long time.
Speaker 8: I think it's the first series that England have lost
Speaker 8: at home in fourteen years, so that's a significant moment
Speaker 8: in time. So there's going to have to be a
Speaker 8: lot of reflection from the powers that v at the
Speaker 8: ECB about how this team and how the game in
Speaker 8: this country moves forward.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's interesting because after the Lord's Test, where England
Speaker 2: won quite comprehensibly, they were not quite the same side.
Speaker 2: Do you think they were slightly in disarray because of
Speaker 2: the issues that came out of that Test match.
Speaker 8: Well, I think clearly those things didn't help. And when
Speaker 8: you go into the second Test match of a series
Speaker 8: having to give three debuts and five of the players
Speaker 8: in the team sharing two caps between them, I think
Speaker 8: that you're certainly up against it, especially when you come
Speaker 8: up against such a pragmatic team like New Zealand who
Speaker 8: just seemed to have a mentality that gets every ounce
Speaker 8: of talent out of each of their players on a
Speaker 8: consistent basis. So yeah, I'm sure those events didn't help,
Speaker 8: and certainly the disruption to the team didn't help, But
Speaker 8: again I don't think that should take anything away from
Speaker 8: what New Zealand have achieved him.
Speaker 2: It was a series that I suppose small moments played
Speaker 2: an important part, and those small moments were on both sides.
Speaker 2: But this third Test match, I guess the opening partnership
Speaker 2: between Latham and Conway and then the partnership between Mitchell
Speaker 2: and Ravendra were key moment.
Speaker 8: Yeah, I'd say that Mitchell and Revendra partnership was the
Speaker 8: one where I think at that stage New Zealand eight
Speaker 8: for two was it eighteen for two something like that
Speaker 8: in the second innings with a lead but still a
Speaker 8: low number for two in the second innings, I think
Speaker 8: that that was the moment that England could have come
Speaker 8: piling through the door but both of those guys said no,
Speaker 8: not today. And Daryl Mitchell's innings in particular, I thought
Speaker 8: Revener was really classy and he put the pressure back
Speaker 8: on the bowlers. But the way that Mitchell, he must
Speaker 8: have worn blows on almost every inch of his body.
Speaker 8: I think all of his fingers on his right hand
Speaker 8: got hit, his head, his ribs, his inner thigh, and
Speaker 8: he just kept going and was resolute in his defense
Speaker 8: and then opened up as the innings went on when
Speaker 8: he was batting with the tail to score a brilliant
Speaker 8: Test Match hundred. So I think that was the partnership
Speaker 8: that really won New Zealand the game. But certainly that
Speaker 8: opening partnership, having won the toss and batted first, put
Speaker 8: the key was in a fantastic position.
Speaker 2: Was there relation in that for England, particularly in their
Speaker 2: second and English when they came out with the attacking
Speaker 2: approach that has been well part of their game in
Speaker 2: recent times, but didn't really have the ability to adjust
Speaker 2: to the style that was needed.
Speaker 8: Yeah, I think certainly that a lot can be learned
Speaker 8: by England for the way that New Zealand played in
Speaker 8: this series. And I think the way that New Zealand
Speaker 8: played the moments is the most important thing. The way
Speaker 8: that New Zealand managed to manage to play the significant
Speaker 8: moments within games and make the right decisions in those
Speaker 8: moments is what sets them apart from other teams. And
Speaker 8: just like to fin off on Ben Stokes, Yeah, look
Speaker 8: what a career. He's had a remarkable career. He's been
Speaker 8: part of some of the most significant moments in English sport,
Speaker 8: not just not just cricket in English sports. So yeah,
Speaker 8: he's It was a surprise decision I think with the
Speaker 8: Ashes just twelve months away. But a player who wears
Speaker 8: his heart in his sleep like Ben Stokes is going
Speaker 8: to be a sore mist for English cricket and it's
Speaker 8: sad to see him not playing for England again.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the timing was pretty strange. Wasn't the middle of
Speaker 2: a Test match?
Speaker 5: Yes?
Speaker 8: Yeah, I think it was. But Ben Stokes is an
Speaker 8: unconventional character and he doesn't do things like everyone else,
Speaker 8: so it was kind of fitting.
Speaker 2: Just one final question, it's been a Test series of
Speaker 2: past bowlers. Both sides had significant past bowling bettery that
Speaker 2: would probably please you as a former England past bowler.
Speaker 8: Yes, I love watching fast bowling. I think Will O'Rourke
Speaker 8: is someone that I've really enjoyed watching, especially over the
Speaker 8: last few weeks, but since he started his career with
Speaker 8: New Zealand. I like my tall quicks Brian, so yeah
Speaker 8: to see him thundering in and causing problems. I hope
Speaker 8: his injury here that he walked off with today isn't
Speaker 8: too bad because he's a star of the future for sure.
Speaker 2: All right, Fanny, thanks very much for your time.
Speaker 8: Patrick, No, I was sorry about that.
Speaker 5: That's right.
Speaker 2: Might be able to catch up some other time, I
Speaker 2: hope sounds good.
Speaker 1: Matt, all right, thanks mate on the front foot with
Speaker 1: Waddle and Cody.
Speaker 2: Well, my thanks to Stephen Finn for joining us. Haven't
Speaker 2: spoken to Finny for quite some time since he was
Speaker 2: out here in New Zealand such a long time ago.
Speaker 2: Another man who I've worked with over a long period
Speaker 2: of time one of the leading commentators for BBC Test
Speaker 2: Match specialists, Simon Mann, who's followed the trials and tribulations
Speaker 2: of the game in England. And Simon, I'm sure it
Speaker 2: must be hard for you, as a broadcaster and a
Speaker 2: cricket fan as well to see the way things are
Speaker 2: going at the moment. So particularly around the captaincy, the coach,
Speaker 2: the leadership of the side, and the game is taking
Speaker 2: second place, isn't it.
Speaker 5: It's nice to be with you, Brian.
Speaker 9: Firstly, I think one thing I would say is we've
Speaker 9: kind of seen all this before many times over the years,
Speaker 9: so it feels a little bit like a soap opera
Speaker 9: sometimes English cricket nothing really surprises you. But the really
Speaker 9: disappointing thing I think was last winter in the Ashes
Speaker 9: where England played. They didn't prepare properly and their tactics
Speaker 9: were poor, and I think that was the that felt
Speaker 9: like the nadir, and they tried to sort it out
Speaker 9: from here and have continuity. It's not worked. Ben Stokes
Speaker 9: is obviously standing down. Brenda McCullum says he wants to continue.
Speaker 9: It feels like the end of an era. It feels
Speaker 9: like a time for change again. We'll see what happens
Speaker 9: in pro sport. Watching it, observing it is fascinating. It's
Speaker 9: better not to get too emotionally involved, and it's probably
Speaker 9: better not to get too up or too down.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I mean it must be disappointing. Does it
Speaker 2: seem to you as just another retirement story? Or are
Speaker 2: their biggest issues involved in this peak Because England cricket
Speaker 2: over the period of time, particularly after the Ashes had
Speaker 2: to fight up to that defeat, there seems to be
Speaker 2: conspiracy theories abounding far and wide. Is it a bigger
Speaker 2: issue than just failure of the team at the top level.
Speaker 5: I think that's a really good question.
Speaker 9: I think that's I think sometimes you have to take
Speaker 9: players coaches at face value.
Speaker 5: Not all the time.
Speaker 9: I think sometimes they do dissemble, but I think sometimes
Speaker 9: you do have to take them at face value. And
Speaker 9: what I think has been clear over the last three
Speaker 9: weeks four weeks of this series is that Ben Stokes
Speaker 9: has felt kind of frazzled and it has been time
Speaker 9: to quit. So you had the Ashes where England had
Speaker 9: all these high hopes. They thought they've got it all together,
Speaker 9: they were going to challenge Australia and it fell so
Speaker 9: flat and they were hammered in Australia and the cricket
Speaker 9: was abysmal, and there was so much criticism and there
Speaker 9: was so much anger among England supporters. So I think
Speaker 9: what happened then sort of right, we're going to continue.
Speaker 9: It's going to be the same structure they went to
Speaker 9: the start of the season. Benston turned up at Lauds
Speaker 9: and he just it just didn't feel right for him.
Speaker 9: And then of course the events subsequently I think probably
Speaker 9: pushed him over made him think, yeah, that really sort
Speaker 9: of made his mind up. So I think there is
Speaker 9: an element in which the politics, if you like, of
Speaker 9: the situation, his frustration that like, for example, I don't
Speaker 9: think he thought he broke a curfew on that night
Speaker 9: out in Chelsea, but you also think, well, would after
Speaker 9: everything happened in the Ashes, would the captain not think
Speaker 9: it's best not to go out after a Test match win? So,
Speaker 9: and whether that was kind of symptomatic of where his
Speaker 9: head was. You know, I just need to I just
Speaker 9: need to go out. I just need to unwind whatever
Speaker 9: and whatever the consequences, you know, we'll find that tomorrow.
Speaker 9: But I think what they were unlucky with is the
Speaker 9: fact that the players can easily have gone out, but
Speaker 9: no one would have known about it when it kicked off.
Speaker 5: In that you know, when the.
Speaker 9: When the the rugby player swung a punch, it then
Speaker 9: became an incident, so we might not have ever found
Speaker 9: out about it without that incidance. So it was kind
Speaker 9: of an unlucky set of circumstances in a way, although
Speaker 9: you know you put yourself in danger by going out
Speaker 9: and then I think what happened then is that there
Speaker 9: was a real kickback into bend stakes for that and
Speaker 9: he thought, well, really that's just made my mind up.
Speaker 9: But I'm here saying yesterday that yeah, it was, it
Speaker 9: was part of it. But he was felt he was
Speaker 9: kind of done. And I think the ash's defeats, especially
Speaker 9: the nature of one England suffering in the winter, that
Speaker 9: they're kind of hard on a on a captain and
Speaker 9: he's been doing the job for four years, he's been
Speaker 9: playing international cricket for well over a decade and he's
Speaker 9: had always injuries over time and bounced back out all
Speaker 9: sorts of other controversies as well and bounced back. But
Speaker 9: in the end it might just it might just wear
Speaker 9: you down.
Speaker 2: I since from Afar that he's a beloved character in
Speaker 2: the majority of cases with people that he is regarded
Speaker 2: as one of the best all round us that England
Speaker 2: has been able to put out on the park. But
Speaker 2: I don't see that the sense that there's the same
Speaker 2: feeling about Brendan McCullum and even Rob Key, and there
Speaker 2: are people on social media, I know the Keyboard Warriors
Speaker 2: and they become anonymous. But those are the things that
Speaker 2: basically cause issues in the administration of the game. Is
Speaker 2: McCollum safe.
Speaker 9: That's again, Brian, you're asking all the personal questions and
Speaker 9: that's a that's a very good question. I mean I
Speaker 9: did an interview with them afterwards where I said to
Speaker 9: you know, do you intend to carry on? He said, yeah,
Speaker 9: I'm totally committed. I said do you expect to carry on?
Speaker 9: And he gave me basically a one word answer, yeah,
Speaker 9: that's part of the process or something like that.
Speaker 5: It's to be decided.
Speaker 9: Really, I think there is a there is no You
Speaker 9: could kind of get a sense that among England cricket
Speaker 9: sports because it's difficult without you going to speak to
Speaker 9: all of them. I get a sense that they feel
Speaker 9: the wrong person that's gone.
Speaker 5: Not everyone.
Speaker 9: I think some people frustrated, say what Ben Staates did
Speaker 9: after the Test match. But I think there's the feeling
Speaker 9: that Brenda McCullum's coaching methods have run their course. Now
Speaker 9: they work for a while because a low EBB and
Speaker 9: they were able to kind of reinvent the team get
Speaker 9: the fun back into the game, get the crowds going,
Speaker 9: but then the results of a dip because teams have
Speaker 9: adapted playing against them, they've kind of.
Speaker 5: Let themselves disrupt, if you like.
Speaker 9: And so it's time for something a bit more if
Speaker 9: for want of a better word, a bit more serious,
Speaker 9: a bit more strategic. So we'll see. I mean, one
Speaker 9: aspect for Benda McCullum now is and this is slightly ridiculous,
Speaker 9: is that because he's the white bull coach as well,
Speaker 9: is that tomorrow England have got a white ball series
Speaker 9: starting against India, which is high profile here. You know
Speaker 9: what an India series is like, it pays all the bills,
Speaker 9: you know, the crowds are behaving, so and there's a
Speaker 9: World Cup next year as well as the One Day
Speaker 9: International Series afterwards, and England are struggling in the in
Speaker 9: the ranking in one day international cricket, so the most
Speaker 9: important matches coming up, so it's kind of like not
Speaker 9: just red ball, but it's also white ball as well
Speaker 9: in England haven't been that good in one day cricket recently,
Speaker 9: so there's there's a bit going into this. But then
Speaker 9: there's a break of about a month while we played
Speaker 9: one hundred and then there's another Test series, so there's
Speaker 9: a bit of time after this series to sort it out,
Speaker 9: to sort out what they're going to do.
Speaker 2: The sad effect of all of this is that there
Speaker 2: was a three Test series and it produced some spectacular cricket.
Speaker 2: At times, there were moments where individual came to the
Speaker 2: fore and did the business. And a lot of this
Speaker 2: is basically taking the away from the fans that there
Speaker 2: is a game of cricket there and they're still turning
Speaker 2: up to watch and there's still a lot of interest
Speaker 2: in the game in England.
Speaker 9: Yeah, that the crowds have been fantastic for this Test series.
Speaker 9: I also feel a bit sorry for New Zealand because
Speaker 9: you know, they've come here, they won the last two
Speaker 9: Test matches, played really good, sort of sensible, professional, hard
Speaker 9: nosed cricket and in a way that the bench states
Speaker 9: yesterday and the day before, his retirement has kind of
Speaker 9: been the central focus and you can understand that to
Speaker 9: some extent because it's you know, he has been an
Speaker 9: important figure for English cricket. He was the captain and
Speaker 9: he's produced some amazing things over the years, so you
Speaker 9: kind of do celebrate the end of that, but it
Speaker 9: has kind of like shifted the focus away from an
Speaker 9: excellent performance from New Zealand and also that in a
Speaker 9: way the last Test match as well, because all that
Speaker 9: was about, you know, England sort of mixing matching their
Speaker 9: team having to make five changes for various reasons, and
Speaker 9: so here the story would have been so much focused
Speaker 9: on that and very little on you know what New
Speaker 9: Zealand have done well. I mean Daryl Mitchell for example,
Speaker 9: what a what a fantastic innings he played. You know
Speaker 9: everyone's probably seen the images of his body bruised and battered,
Speaker 9: and you know the England supporters barracking him with boring,
Speaker 9: boring Mitchell. But you know, if you're dal Mix and
Speaker 9: I think he loved it. I mean, any self respecting
Speaker 9: cricketer would love it when the crowd get on their
Speaker 9: back like that.
Speaker 5: Because it shows he's making a good job of it.
Speaker 9: And he did and it was brilliant and just played
Speaker 9: so well to come back in the series and win
Speaker 9: the first that's a bit of lottery. Second Test, you know,
Speaker 9: they exploited English problems and this one they just played
Speaker 9: that excellent cricket but not always but you know, they
Speaker 9: played enough of it to get over the line.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Daryl Mitchell obviously enjoyed the fact that his father
Speaker 2: was an all Black rugby player, probably bred that in
Speaker 2: to his mentality. But I mean that was you know,
Speaker 2: that was one issue. And I think in that Test
Speaker 2: match that has just been completed, his betting should have
Speaker 2: been a lesson for England. I can't believe. And I
Speaker 2: saw some of the television footage of New Zealanders at
Speaker 2: a fall of a wickets saying what are they doing?
Speaker 2: And Jamie Smith I think proved that. You know, England
Speaker 2: might well have got close had they had wickets in hand,
Speaker 2: but they fired them away. Was that part of their mentality?
Speaker 2: Was it a two fingers salute to the English cricket board.
Speaker 2: What brought about that? Or was it just you know,
Speaker 2: this is bearsball, will play it this way and.
Speaker 9: Again I wonder whether this will come out in time.
Speaker 9: But what that was about, I mean, in a way
Speaker 9: it was that was how Igland were playing in the
Speaker 9: first two years. They would come out and they would
Speaker 9: they would go at it really hard and I think
Speaker 9: they thought the pitch was really poor and I think it, yeah,
Speaker 9: I thought like two sevenths of the pitch was actually
Speaker 9: quite dangerous by the end or you know, one seventh
Speaker 9: of the pitch, but obviously if you didn't, if you
Speaker 9: didn't hit those dangerous bits, then it was fine. You
Speaker 9: could bat and you kind of bided your time like
Speaker 9: Jamie Smith did, like Mitchell did, and if you know
Speaker 9: you're going to take the odd blow, the wants.
Speaker 5: Going to fly over your shoulder.
Speaker 9: But if you could survive that on, you go, because
Speaker 9: there were enough good bits of the surface to survive on.
Speaker 9: I think they thought the pitch was poor and that
Speaker 9: the only way that they could chase that down was
Speaker 9: to go back to old methods, was just to really
Speaker 9: try to put the pressure on New Zealand and take
Speaker 9: it on.
Speaker 5: And it kind of worked for a bit. Brian.
Speaker 9: They were fifty for no wicket. I thought when they
Speaker 9: got to about forty in the field was back. I thought,
Speaker 9: why didn't you just knock it around, Just knock it
Speaker 9: around and build the innings come back tomorrow and the
Speaker 9: build the pressure on New Zealand. But States got caught
Speaker 9: the mid wicket.
Speaker 5: As we know. It's also worth just bearing in mind.
Speaker 9: I know there were one or two extravagant shots played
Speaker 9: by they say a media gay came in on the
Speaker 9: pair and played reverse sweet first ball, but Bethel played
Speaker 9: no shot. Duckett got a really good ball, So those,
Speaker 9: you know, those were two of the wickets as well.
Speaker 9: Harry Brooke, I think was always going to come out
Speaker 9: and play in that way, and I'm probably in a
Speaker 9: minority of one with that. I actually thought he was
Speaker 9: a bit unlucky with his dismissal because the ball he
Speaker 9: hit for six was very similar to the ball that
Speaker 9: got him out, and it was there for that. It
Speaker 9: was there for the instinctive stroke. Okay didn't execute particularly well.
Speaker 9: He was caught on the fine name boundary and it
Speaker 9: looked a terrible dismissal in the context of his innings.
Speaker 9: But that could easily have sailed away for six as well.
Speaker 9: So there was a lot going into that evening.
Speaker 5: I think that was it. They felt the pit was poor.
Speaker 9: They wanted to put the pressure back on New Zealand,
Speaker 9: but I think the adrenaline of the situation meant they
Speaker 9: did get a bit carried away. But I don't think
Speaker 9: any team, I really don't think any team was chasing
Speaker 9: three seventi on that surface, although as it turned out,
Speaker 9: of course he zoom Brian New Zealand have had half
Speaker 9: a bowling attack because there'd so many injuries.
Speaker 2: In normal circumstances, England probably would have been capable of
Speaker 2: chasing that down if pitch conditions and other things have
Speaker 2: been in their favor. The one final question, though, Simon,
Speaker 2: is looking here part of your job to see what
Speaker 2: is forthcoming in terms of England cricket. Is Harry Brooke
Speaker 2: the right man to take over from being stakes?
Speaker 9: My instinct says no, But I don't know what the
Speaker 9: alternatives are. That's the problem. And he has done captaincy before.
Speaker 9: He's captain of the white ball team. I don't think
Speaker 9: he can captain the white ball team and the Red
Speaker 9: Bull team. Well he can captain. He obviously can't do it,
Speaker 9: but it is the burden to be you know. For example,
Speaker 9: I was just saying, they've just gone for a Test match,
Speaker 9: they've got one day's break and they're into a twenty series.
Speaker 5: Well you can't.
Speaker 9: You can't put that on a captain, you know, how
Speaker 9: can you plan? For example? So I wonder if they
Speaker 9: did make Harry Brooke Red Bull captain, whether they'd have
Speaker 9: to have a different white Ball captain relieving of the
Speaker 9: whiteboard captaincy someone like Sam Cohen or possibly possibly even
Speaker 9: Jacob Bethel. But how they could go back to Joe
Speaker 9: Rooter's Test captain, but it's feels as though that ship
Speaker 9: has sailed unless they say to Joe, right, Joe, you're
Speaker 9: our captain for a year until the end of the
Speaker 9: Ashes and that's it. You know, that's your that's your tenure.
Speaker 9: So not appoint in England captain such, but appointed England
Speaker 9: captain with a clear end point in mind. So the
Speaker 9: options aren't obvious, Brian, because this is now a youngish
Speaker 9: team and a lot of the older senior players are gone.
Speaker 9: I think in the future someone like Jacob Bethel could
Speaker 9: turn into an England captain. I'd be and I would
Speaker 9: be if you said to me, now, do you think
Speaker 9: one Jacob Bethel will one day Beingland Test captain? I'd
Speaker 9: say yes, I think he probably will be. But obviously
Speaker 9: he's got to start, you establishing himself in the team's
Speaker 9: school runs. So not many options, Brian. That's the that's
Speaker 9: the problem I think for England. So they kind of
Speaker 9: might have to go to Harry Brook. Ben Stokes said yesterday,
Speaker 9: you know, he said Harry Brook is the man. He
Speaker 9: gave his firm backing afterwards, so we'll see what happens.
Speaker 1: Brian Waddell, Jeremy Coney on the front foot, thanks.
Speaker 2: Forms too, Slim and man for joining the program after
Speaker 2: what has been a fairly hectic week of Test crickets
Speaker 2: at trent Bridge and quite bizarre to a certain extent.
Speaker 2: Peter Holland joins us once again, and I mean what
Speaker 2: I finished to that Test match. It just highlighted to
Speaker 2: me how superior the Black Caps were to England in
Speaker 2: that series, bearing in mind the way both sides played
Speaker 2: the latter stages of the Test.
Speaker 3: I think you used the word bizarre, and it was
Speaker 3: something that was knocking around on my head as well,
Speaker 3: because when you sit back and reflect on the three
Speaker 3: Tests and what happened at Lord's and then to think
Speaker 3: that two victories by New Zealand comprehensive at that should
Speaker 3: ensue with essentially quite in some respects quite different teams
Speaker 3: between the second and the third Test in regards of
Speaker 3: bowling reserves. It was. It was truly quite mesmerizing. What
Speaker 3: I also love. Of course we got under the fifth
Speaker 3: day and twice. Wasn't that good?
Speaker 2: Yeah, almost definitely, even though you didn't get the number
Speaker 2: of overs in a day you should get. I guess
Speaker 2: we have to make allowances for the heat, but it
Speaker 2: was it was impressive stuff from New Zealand. And you
Speaker 2: as a well, I think he might have been sort
Speaker 2: of vaguely and all round it, but basically a batsman
Speaker 2: at the top level. You must have enjoyed some of
Speaker 2: those innings. And I've been trying to toss up on
Speaker 2: my mind which innings was the best, and there were
Speaker 2: some really good ones there, but I've narrowed it down
Speaker 2: to one between two. Was the innings of Mitchell in
Speaker 2: the second innings and outstanding one hundred or was it
Speaker 2: the innings of Phillips and his ability to combat an
Speaker 2: evil spell of bowling by Joffra Archer. I mean, they
Speaker 2: were both significant features of the series, weren't they.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 3: You make a very an interesting point there, Briant, because
Speaker 3: I I thought Mitchell, you know, earlier, earlier in the series,
Speaker 3: wasn't really giving us what we were looking for, hadn't
Speaker 3: really sort of clicked in, and yet that was just
Speaker 3: just fantastic knock on every level, and the way he
Speaker 3: went about it and the way he took England out
Speaker 3: of the game against a good attack too. It's not
Speaker 3: it's not disregard that. But then you roll back to
Speaker 3: Phillips and as both of those innings has put New
Speaker 3: Zealand or took the game away from England, so they
Speaker 3: were significant. It wasn't as if it wasn't as if.
Speaker 10: It was just like a yeah, any hundreds of great hundred,
Speaker 10: but these were These were special hundreds, both of them,
Speaker 10: and in very try condition and playing in a way
Speaker 10: which which in Phillips's case was sort of counterintuitive to
Speaker 10: what we normally see of him, and and as Jerry
Speaker 10: pointed out last week, trying not to play the ball
Speaker 10: and getting overs into Archer which ultimately caused him in
Speaker 10: they're boling an eight over spell which and then he
Speaker 10: couldn't turn up the next day according to the whoever
Speaker 10: controls these things. So Phillips that that was a fantastic noto.
Speaker 10: But probably I end up landing on on Mitchell simply
Speaker 10: because of the way that he just took on the
Speaker 10: English attack and ge wears I mean getting belted in
Speaker 10: the elbow, I mean that hurts, and he just shrugged
Speaker 10: it off and attacking a couple in the ReBs if
Speaker 10: you don't mind in the fingers. I mean, that's that's
Speaker 10: that's that's good stuff. And I think a lot of
Speaker 10: commentators were watching that and saying this is this is
Speaker 10: a pretty special earnings and and so so it was
Speaker 10: so I am hard to split, but I think I'm
Speaker 10: gonna I'm gonna land on on on the case of
Speaker 10: Mitchell because it really it really put put England out
Speaker 10: of the game big time.
Speaker 2: To score one hundred against England in England is as
Speaker 2: a as a as a great achievement.
Speaker 3: What this is done again when you when you sit
Speaker 3: down and looked at the three Test series and what's
Speaker 3: ended up happening is is that you've got Nichols coming
Speaker 3: in and playing. And I was rather critical of him.
Speaker 3: So I've got to eat humble pie there, You've got
Speaker 3: to You've got a lot of pike.
Speaker 11: Maybe too much pike for me, but but and then
Speaker 11: you had you had he came in and performs extremely well,
Speaker 11: you know, gets it, gets gets a, gets a twenty
Speaker 11: and twenty five when it was needed, you know, twenty
Speaker 11: five off seveny odd balls.
Speaker 3: That sort of stuff. That's good stuff. And then then
Speaker 3: the other players, the breadth of players we've ended up
Speaker 3: using because you see, well the team that ended up
Speaker 3: going me picked for the third Test, absent Phillips, absent
Speaker 3: Henry Well. That going to be under pressure, aren't they?
Speaker 3: You would have thought, because I argued with the world's
Speaker 3: best bowl is not bothering, And yet they turned up.
Speaker 3: And I don't know how this concussion stuff works, but
Speaker 3: all of a sudden Zach Volks runs in and plays brilliantly,
Speaker 3: helped in a great part by a fabulous Test series
Speaker 3: from the keeper Blundon.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was going to I was going to say
Speaker 2: that he was the next point because Nathan Smith won
Speaker 2: the Player of the Series award and he bowled superbly,
Speaker 2: and you know he's a new boy on the block
Speaker 2: when when you start talking Test cricket. But to me,
Speaker 2: it was between him and Blundell, and you know, to
Speaker 2: keep wickets in those conditions on variable bounce against one
Speaker 2: thirty five K takes guts, but it takes skill too,
Speaker 2: doesn't it.
Speaker 3: Oh look, I you know we touched on it before
Speaker 3: when he when he did that back in back at
Speaker 3: the base and reserved two three years ago. And then
Speaker 3: it's been somewhat mimicked by Australia because all of a
Speaker 3: sudden it brings the players back into the back onto
Speaker 3: the crease and therefore they don't get that extra hob
Speaker 3: which they love. Brook and Roote and those guys, all
Speaker 3: of a sudden they're back there and then it opens
Speaker 3: them up. But as you quite rightly point out, Brian
Speaker 3: on a variable bouncing wicket and have won thirty five clicks,
Speaker 3: I mean, Smith is no slouch. He gets it through
Speaker 3: and then of course he's doing it to folks. The
Speaker 3: keeping is keeping in again a more humble pie for
Speaker 3: me to eat, because I was thinking that perhaps, you know,
Speaker 3: the Canterbury keeper might have had a shot when we
Speaker 3: were chatting about it a few weeks ago. But hell no,
Speaker 3: Blundell has been a revelation and I really have to
Speaker 3: applaud him because he's probably probably arguable the difference in
Speaker 3: the whole series because of what he did at the
Speaker 3: contribution across all three Test matches. I think he's fantastic
Speaker 3: and I just think and it was a joy to watch,
Speaker 3: and it was really interesting when you're listening and watching
Speaker 3: on the TV how many applaudits he was getting from
Speaker 3: people like a saying ATHLETs and broad and so on.
Speaker 3: They were very effusive in their praise for Blundell, and
Speaker 3: for that matter, they were a fusive in their praise
Speaker 3: for New Zealand full stop, and somewhat disparaging about their
Speaker 3: own mob.
Speaker 2: So an interesting time, fascinating stuff, Jerry, the kind of
Speaker 2: cricket I know you love and like to embroil yourself
Speaker 2: the tactics and the way players play the game. And
Speaker 2: I'm sure you've enjoyed it, but I'm sure you also
Speaker 2: enjoy a bit of a holiday because it's hard commentating
Speaker 2: tests series that are packed together like that. The players
Speaker 2: quite have hard but you know, mentally it's tough, isn't it,
Speaker 2: And you need a bit of a break, So God
Speaker 2: have you one.
Speaker 4: Yeah, thanks Wads. I've really enjoyed the tests. Of course,
Speaker 4: it's always easier, as you know, if New Zealand come
Speaker 4: out on top, and what's bred in the bone will
Speaker 4: come out of the wicket. And so I'm delighted for
Speaker 4: the group that I was with because they were there
Speaker 4: the last and we were having breakfast together, you know.
Speaker 4: But I'm ready for a break and looking forward to
Speaker 4: to spending some time away and then I'll catch you
Speaker 4: back at home, so that'll be good fun. So look
Speaker 4: after yourself and enjoy, enjoy, and enjoy the victory.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you enjoy a heat wave. We'll talk again
Speaker 2: in a week or.
Speaker 4: Say good words, take care of summer.
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