1 00:00:06,667 --> 00:00:10,547 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine 2 00:00:10,707 --> 00:00:13,267 Speaker 1: from Newstalk ZB all. 3 00:00:13,147 --> 00:00:16,467 Speaker 2: Right, hands either got numbers the Wallabies, Tom Wrights. 4 00:00:16,147 --> 00:00:19,867 Speaker 1: Right, Reacher's out right to try and the Wallabies will 5 00:00:19,907 --> 00:00:22,187 Speaker 1: have a chance to try and win this game out 6 00:00:22,187 --> 00:00:22,747 Speaker 1: of nowhere. 7 00:00:22,787 --> 00:00:25,107 Speaker 3: Yeah, that tribe was converted thirty one twenty eight, So 8 00:00:25,147 --> 00:00:28,387 Speaker 3: a final few nervous moments for All Blacks fans before 9 00:00:28,787 --> 00:00:31,627 Speaker 3: the result was finally secure. Let's get you across the 10 00:00:31,667 --> 00:00:36,067 Speaker 3: Tasman for an Australian viewpoint from Wallaby's legend David Campisei, 11 00:00:36,147 --> 00:00:39,787 Speaker 3: who joins us now. David thirty one twenty eight. Do 12 00:00:39,827 --> 00:00:41,827 Speaker 3: you think the Wallabies will look at this one is 13 00:00:42,027 --> 00:00:44,427 Speaker 3: one that perhaps they let slip away? 14 00:00:45,267 --> 00:00:47,947 Speaker 2: Yeah? Mate, I think it's the way the game started. 15 00:00:47,987 --> 00:00:49,427 Speaker 2: It looked like the All Backs were going to just 16 00:00:49,627 --> 00:00:53,427 Speaker 2: win by fifty. But then obviously, you know, I've never 17 00:00:53,427 --> 00:00:58,027 Speaker 2: seen an All Black team really make so many mistakes 18 00:00:58,107 --> 00:01:02,107 Speaker 2: and the obviously the first the first two tries at 19 00:01:02,107 --> 00:01:06,187 Speaker 2: the Stralis Corps with pretty simple especially defensive erarors, which 20 00:01:06,227 --> 00:01:09,627 Speaker 2: is very unusual. But again the Wallabies came back well 21 00:01:09,787 --> 00:01:12,827 Speaker 2: they you know, the pretty good performance. We've got some 22 00:01:12,867 --> 00:01:16,467 Speaker 2: really good individual players, but we still haven't really gelled 23 00:01:16,507 --> 00:01:22,387 Speaker 2: properly yet and I just think it's Look, it's kind 24 00:01:22,387 --> 00:01:25,467 Speaker 2: of it might take a while, but you know, I 25 00:01:25,507 --> 00:01:28,867 Speaker 2: think it's also interesting to see the way the All 26 00:01:28,907 --> 00:01:31,827 Speaker 2: Blacks have played. I mean, they were up by twenty 27 00:01:31,827 --> 00:01:34,067 Speaker 2: one points I think it was, and it was like 28 00:01:34,387 --> 00:01:36,507 Speaker 2: the game in South Africa. They're roped by twenty points 29 00:01:36,507 --> 00:01:39,387 Speaker 2: in the first game. Most All Black teams are passed 30 00:01:39,427 --> 00:01:43,827 Speaker 2: would make it forty points. And they just don't seem 31 00:01:44,027 --> 00:01:48,467 Speaker 2: to have that killer instinct or that resolve to you know, 32 00:01:48,627 --> 00:01:52,547 Speaker 2: to make the opposition really suffer. They just sort of 33 00:01:52,547 --> 00:01:54,427 Speaker 2: took the foot off the pedel and made some mistakes 34 00:01:54,427 --> 00:01:57,227 Speaker 2: and you know, brought the Wallabies back into the game. 35 00:01:57,507 --> 00:01:59,867 Speaker 3: Why do you think that is? Why haven't they got 36 00:01:59,867 --> 00:02:02,747 Speaker 3: the killer instinct that's been a trademark, a hallmark of 37 00:02:02,787 --> 00:02:04,307 Speaker 3: All Blacks teams down the years. 38 00:02:05,667 --> 00:02:08,427 Speaker 2: Yeah, look, I'm not really sure. Look, you know, I 39 00:02:08,427 --> 00:02:12,347 Speaker 2: know the game is different now and there's so much more, 40 00:02:12,587 --> 00:02:14,667 Speaker 2: you know, there's so much more gone into the rugby, 41 00:02:14,707 --> 00:02:17,667 Speaker 2: Like there's so much more analysis, and there's so many 42 00:02:17,707 --> 00:02:21,187 Speaker 2: more different coaches and just as like a simple thing 43 00:02:21,227 --> 00:02:23,627 Speaker 2: if you watch the warm ups of most teams they 44 00:02:23,707 --> 00:02:25,867 Speaker 2: do the short little passes the warm up, but in 45 00:02:25,907 --> 00:02:27,987 Speaker 2: the game they don't do the short passes. A lot 46 00:02:27,987 --> 00:02:30,667 Speaker 2: of them do the spirals, just a little simple thing. 47 00:02:30,787 --> 00:02:33,507 Speaker 2: So it's when you get out there under pressure and 48 00:02:33,547 --> 00:02:36,547 Speaker 2: you could see, you know, even Damian McKenzie some of 49 00:02:36,547 --> 00:02:39,747 Speaker 2: the passes that went to ground, which is very unusual 50 00:02:39,867 --> 00:02:41,747 Speaker 2: that level, and that flick pass he tried to throw 51 00:02:41,787 --> 00:02:44,027 Speaker 2: in he didn't need to do that. You know, it's 52 00:02:44,067 --> 00:02:47,347 Speaker 2: probably just I don't know. Again, they're still probably learning 53 00:02:47,387 --> 00:02:50,947 Speaker 2: as a units to understand each other which are the 54 00:02:50,987 --> 00:02:53,627 Speaker 2: lines they run. And I think Bowden Barrett was missing 55 00:02:53,627 --> 00:02:56,267 Speaker 2: badly as well. I think Jordan's a very good player, 56 00:02:56,587 --> 00:02:59,067 Speaker 2: but I think he's more of a finisher. He's not 57 00:02:59,187 --> 00:03:01,507 Speaker 2: really a creator, and I think that's where Boden Barrett 58 00:03:01,507 --> 00:03:04,267 Speaker 2: sort of adds that extra spis to the back line. 59 00:03:04,787 --> 00:03:06,867 Speaker 3: How far away do you think the Wallaby is from 60 00:03:06,987 --> 00:03:09,347 Speaker 3: challenging the top three or four sides in the world. 61 00:03:09,347 --> 00:03:14,787 Speaker 2: Again, well, I just think it's just interesting that we've 62 00:03:14,867 --> 00:03:17,587 Speaker 2: we've brought another key week coach in that. Really, you 63 00:03:17,627 --> 00:03:20,627 Speaker 2: know what I would thoughts by now that it would 64 00:03:20,627 --> 00:03:23,347 Speaker 2: have been great if he sort of tried to understand 65 00:03:23,347 --> 00:03:25,507 Speaker 2: what our culture and history was and why we were 66 00:03:25,507 --> 00:03:28,107 Speaker 2: the wallabies of what we were good ats. We've got 67 00:03:28,107 --> 00:03:31,227 Speaker 2: some really good individual players, but we keep on changing 68 00:03:31,347 --> 00:03:33,827 Speaker 2: nine and ten around week in week out, and that's 69 00:03:33,987 --> 00:03:36,307 Speaker 2: as you know, in most games, nine and ten of 70 00:03:36,347 --> 00:03:38,987 Speaker 2: the general you know, they're the connection between the forwards 71 00:03:38,987 --> 00:03:44,387 Speaker 2: and backs. And I think that he's still doesn't understand 72 00:03:46,147 --> 00:03:49,227 Speaker 2: I suppose our mentality, like you know, we do really 73 00:03:49,227 --> 00:03:51,187 Speaker 2: well in that game mess so we really came back. 74 00:03:51,547 --> 00:03:53,427 Speaker 2: But really, when the All Blacks were down to thirteen, 75 00:03:53,507 --> 00:03:56,147 Speaker 2: why didn't we try and run it wide? Because there 76 00:03:56,187 --> 00:04:00,147 Speaker 2: was two backs missing? You know, I think because our 77 00:04:00,147 --> 00:04:04,467 Speaker 2: super rugby is not grades and obviously the next generation 78 00:04:04,627 --> 00:04:06,907 Speaker 2: coming through which they don't really watch lot of rugby 79 00:04:07,027 --> 00:04:09,467 Speaker 2: or they haven't really got a lot of idols who 80 00:04:09,467 --> 00:04:11,307 Speaker 2: they want to be like because most of obviously in 81 00:04:11,347 --> 00:04:15,507 Speaker 2: Australia's rugby league. And I just think that we need 82 00:04:16,147 --> 00:04:18,507 Speaker 2: we just need some players to come through and have 83 00:04:18,587 --> 00:04:21,707 Speaker 2: the skills, but also have the confidence to try and 84 00:04:21,747 --> 00:04:24,627 Speaker 2: gel and play, you know, and probably get the basic 85 00:04:24,667 --> 00:04:26,667 Speaker 2: skills right and play a bit better than we have 86 00:04:26,787 --> 00:04:27,387 Speaker 2: been playing. 87 00:04:27,627 --> 00:04:29,547 Speaker 3: Do you think he's the right man to coach the Wallabies. 88 00:04:31,827 --> 00:04:34,227 Speaker 2: Well, unfortunately, I think he was the only one available 89 00:04:34,387 --> 00:04:37,067 Speaker 2: at the time. And I think that you know, sometimes 90 00:04:37,067 --> 00:04:40,307 Speaker 2: we panic. We again, we haven't really got to set 91 00:04:40,387 --> 00:04:44,347 Speaker 2: up in Australia where you know you've got you've got 92 00:04:44,347 --> 00:04:46,427 Speaker 2: a system where we bring all the young coaches through. 93 00:04:46,507 --> 00:04:49,787 Speaker 2: Most of the young coaches have to go overseas and 94 00:04:49,867 --> 00:04:53,387 Speaker 2: another coach now, the guy called Chris Latham, you know, 95 00:04:53,427 --> 00:04:56,147 Speaker 2: helps them are in twenty nineteen Rugby World Cup. Can't 96 00:04:56,147 --> 00:04:58,467 Speaker 2: get a start in Australia, didn't want him, goes over 97 00:04:58,547 --> 00:05:02,307 Speaker 2: to America, makes the final, lost the final this year. Unfortunately, 98 00:05:02,307 --> 00:05:04,067 Speaker 2: then a couple of weeks started to gets another job 99 00:05:04,147 --> 00:05:07,227 Speaker 2: over there, and not one person for Rugby Australia is 100 00:05:07,267 --> 00:05:09,467 Speaker 2: interested in him at all. They don't speak to him. 101 00:05:09,467 --> 00:05:11,867 Speaker 2: I want to see how he's going. Is he interested? 102 00:05:12,547 --> 00:05:15,387 Speaker 2: That's our problem. We don't sort of look after our 103 00:05:15,427 --> 00:05:18,507 Speaker 2: own and I think also if you notice in the 104 00:05:18,547 --> 00:05:22,187 Speaker 2: world rugby at the moment, you've got Robertson coach. The 105 00:05:22,227 --> 00:05:24,907 Speaker 2: all Backs played for the New Zealand Russia. Rasmus played 106 00:05:24,947 --> 00:05:29,587 Speaker 2: for South Africa. More we played for England, Townsend played 107 00:05:29,627 --> 00:05:34,187 Speaker 2: for Scotland's and the French coach. Obviously he played for France, 108 00:05:34,867 --> 00:05:37,427 Speaker 2: you know, and we've got a coach that is a 109 00:05:37,507 --> 00:05:38,867 Speaker 2: New zal I don't know if he actually played for 110 00:05:38,907 --> 00:05:42,787 Speaker 2: New Zealand. He's a good coach, but at the moment, 111 00:05:42,947 --> 00:05:45,467 Speaker 2: you know, we are We were a number one two 112 00:05:45,547 --> 00:05:47,707 Speaker 2: in the world for years and years by playing a 113 00:05:47,747 --> 00:05:50,787 Speaker 2: certain style. But he's brought into our game like morel 114 00:05:50,787 --> 00:05:52,587 Speaker 2: in the war from twenty two meters out, which is 115 00:05:52,627 --> 00:05:55,107 Speaker 2: not really our style of game. We've got to go 116 00:05:55,187 --> 00:05:58,027 Speaker 2: back to what we are known for. But again, if 117 00:05:58,027 --> 00:06:02,227 Speaker 2: the guys haven't got the coach's ability to play the 118 00:06:02,307 --> 00:06:05,387 Speaker 2: game and try things, you know, we'll probably be stuck 119 00:06:05,467 --> 00:06:07,667 Speaker 2: in this in this situation for a couple of years. 120 00:06:07,907 --> 00:06:10,347 Speaker 3: Are there any you mentioned Chris Latham? Are there any 121 00:06:10,387 --> 00:06:14,067 Speaker 3: other Australian born candidates to coach the Wallabies right now? 122 00:06:15,747 --> 00:06:19,587 Speaker 2: Well, look, I think there isn't really because you know 123 00:06:19,667 --> 00:06:21,787 Speaker 2: we've got so we had a couple of South African coaches. 124 00:06:21,867 --> 00:06:25,867 Speaker 2: You had Brad Thorne, obviously he's retired as well. Now 125 00:06:26,227 --> 00:06:29,267 Speaker 2: you've got Les Kiss who's a rugby league player. I 126 00:06:29,347 --> 00:06:31,347 Speaker 2: think he's ever played rugby, but he's doing the Reds 127 00:06:32,667 --> 00:06:35,427 Speaker 2: and now we've got Kat coming in from England to 128 00:06:35,427 --> 00:06:41,107 Speaker 2: do the back line and obviously Check was around was available, 129 00:06:41,107 --> 00:06:44,627 Speaker 2: but he's now in England and he's obviously at Leicester 130 00:06:44,987 --> 00:06:48,907 Speaker 2: and enjoying his stint there. Just got there, so you know, 131 00:06:48,947 --> 00:06:51,867 Speaker 2: again all our coaches are going around the world. It's 132 00:06:51,867 --> 00:06:54,867 Speaker 2: obviously you've got to be part of I don't know, 133 00:06:54,907 --> 00:06:57,187 Speaker 2: at certain club or something that gets the jobs out 134 00:06:57,227 --> 00:07:00,387 Speaker 2: here because you know, we need to look towards the 135 00:07:00,387 --> 00:07:03,147 Speaker 2: future as we've got the lines next year and we've 136 00:07:03,187 --> 00:07:05,107 Speaker 2: got twenty seven Rugby World Cups, so we've got a 137 00:07:05,147 --> 00:07:07,667 Speaker 2: couple of massive years coming in and we need to 138 00:07:07,707 --> 00:07:10,827 Speaker 2: be in the one, two three position if otherwise, where 139 00:07:10,947 --> 00:07:13,027 Speaker 2: you know we'll probably struggle. And you know, with League 140 00:07:13,027 --> 00:07:15,707 Speaker 2: and Ozzie rules in Australia dominating week in week out 141 00:07:16,227 --> 00:07:18,867 Speaker 2: and entertaining people, we need to play a style of 142 00:07:18,947 --> 00:07:22,187 Speaker 2: rugby that we entertain the people and people come to 143 00:07:22,187 --> 00:07:24,027 Speaker 2: watch and at the moment it's just not happening. 144 00:07:24,427 --> 00:07:28,227 Speaker 3: Just one final one on Aura. It's pretty hard to define. 145 00:07:28,267 --> 00:07:32,027 Speaker 3: I know, Campo, but your teams of the early nineties 146 00:07:32,067 --> 00:07:34,547 Speaker 3: had it. The All Blacks have had it at various stages. 147 00:07:34,827 --> 00:07:38,227 Speaker 3: Once you lose an aura. Is it possible to get 148 00:07:38,267 --> 00:07:39,187 Speaker 3: an aura back? 149 00:07:41,027 --> 00:07:45,387 Speaker 2: Look? I think it's it comes from the team, you know. 150 00:07:45,707 --> 00:07:48,547 Speaker 2: I think also what's very different these days when we played, 151 00:07:49,547 --> 00:07:51,507 Speaker 2: I know, as long time ago, but we would have 152 00:07:51,547 --> 00:07:55,427 Speaker 2: the same fifteen for probably ten fifteen test matches unless 153 00:07:55,427 --> 00:07:57,427 Speaker 2: someone got injured. You know, he never came off because 154 00:07:57,467 --> 00:07:59,987 Speaker 2: if you came off, you never get another run. Now, 155 00:08:00,467 --> 00:08:02,907 Speaker 2: you know, you've got forty minutes players, you've got sixty 156 00:08:02,947 --> 00:08:07,107 Speaker 2: minutes players, you know. And we saw this Oauraeigans lose 157 00:08:07,147 --> 00:08:09,787 Speaker 2: to Argentina this morning, you know, by a very close 158 00:08:09,827 --> 00:08:13,387 Speaker 2: margin because a penalty goal, you know, and sometimes it's 159 00:08:13,427 --> 00:08:16,507 Speaker 2: just the smallest margin of error makes a difference. But 160 00:08:16,587 --> 00:08:20,187 Speaker 2: the All Blacks have always been known for start off 161 00:08:20,307 --> 00:08:22,187 Speaker 2: very strong in the first tend and they sort of 162 00:08:22,627 --> 00:08:24,867 Speaker 2: foot off the pedal the last ten minutes before halftime, 163 00:08:24,907 --> 00:08:27,947 Speaker 2: they pile on the points. Second half ten minutes, pile 164 00:08:27,987 --> 00:08:30,187 Speaker 2: on the points, take it easy and if they have 165 00:08:30,267 --> 00:08:33,067 Speaker 2: to the end. But now what we saw yesterday was 166 00:08:33,467 --> 00:08:36,867 Speaker 2: a total different team. Yes, they've got a new coach 167 00:08:36,907 --> 00:08:41,707 Speaker 2: still understanding again, they've lost a lot of experienced players 168 00:08:41,747 --> 00:08:43,347 Speaker 2: as well from last year. I think a lot of 169 00:08:43,387 --> 00:08:47,107 Speaker 2: teams have and you need the guys to stand up, 170 00:08:47,187 --> 00:08:50,187 Speaker 2: you know, you need the experienced players. And I think 171 00:08:50,227 --> 00:08:52,067 Speaker 2: that's where I think South Africa at the moment is 172 00:08:52,147 --> 00:08:54,587 Speaker 2: miles ahead. They've you know, obviously russ is a very 173 00:08:54,627 --> 00:08:57,907 Speaker 2: smart guy. He his plans for the future. I think 174 00:08:57,947 --> 00:09:00,507 Speaker 2: they can you know, but again, you know, this morning 175 00:09:00,547 --> 00:09:03,467 Speaker 2: is a simple penalty goal. Two shots that you know, 176 00:09:03,547 --> 00:09:05,587 Speaker 2: win and lose games now, so at the top level, 177 00:09:06,667 --> 00:09:09,067 Speaker 2: like the All Blacks, it'll come back. But they've just 178 00:09:09,067 --> 00:09:11,387 Speaker 2: got to understand. It's like in the Wall of be 179 00:09:11,507 --> 00:09:14,187 Speaker 2: you understand why you're playing for your country and you know, 180 00:09:14,387 --> 00:09:17,027 Speaker 2: and I think that we saw Clark in that towards 181 00:09:17,067 --> 00:09:18,667 Speaker 2: the end. He didn't have to do what he did. 182 00:09:19,347 --> 00:09:22,347 Speaker 2: You know, the All Blacks discipline has been normally unbelievably 183 00:09:22,467 --> 00:09:25,587 Speaker 2: good over the years and years. But in the game, yes, though, 184 00:09:25,667 --> 00:09:28,387 Speaker 2: the discipline was very poor, which is very very unusual. 185 00:09:28,547 --> 00:09:30,507 Speaker 2: And again that could be down to the leadership on 186 00:09:30,547 --> 00:09:34,867 Speaker 2: the field and obviously new coach who knows. But you know, 187 00:09:34,987 --> 00:09:37,907 Speaker 2: they're just not the same as they you know, they 188 00:09:38,107 --> 00:09:41,227 Speaker 2: haven't been for war dominated rugby for many years. 189 00:09:41,227 --> 00:09:43,427 Speaker 3: Interesting times on both sides of the testament. Thanks for 190 00:09:43,427 --> 00:09:45,267 Speaker 3: your time this afternoon, David really appreciate it. 191 00:09:45,987 --> 00:09:48,707 Speaker 2: Well, I mean well into next week. So it's not 192 00:09:48,747 --> 00:09:50,667 Speaker 2: a good Honting ground for the All Blacks the moment. 193 00:09:50,947 --> 00:09:52,547 Speaker 2: You never know, it could be a bit of a surprise. 194 00:09:53,227 --> 00:09:54,907 Speaker 2: Look well in it any way. 195 00:09:55,067 --> 00:09:57,147 Speaker 3: Well that's that's the question being asked over here. It's 196 00:09:57,147 --> 00:09:58,747 Speaker 3: a bit of a graveyard as to say we should 197 00:09:58,787 --> 00:10:00,547 Speaker 3: play really good even park David, you know that. 198 00:10:01,707 --> 00:10:04,387 Speaker 2: Yes, that's a long times we were there too, but yeah, 199 00:10:04,387 --> 00:10:05,387 Speaker 2: I under said it right away. 200 00:10:05,467 --> 00:10:08,027 Speaker 3: Good one, you thanks David. David Campci there with his thoughts, 201 00:10:08,347 --> 00:10:11,147 Speaker 3: what a player, What a player he was some interesting 202 00:10:11,147 --> 00:10:14,187 Speaker 3: thoughts there too. Clearly not a fan of Joe Schmitt 203 00:10:15,307 --> 00:10:17,787 Speaker 3: coaching the Wallabies, would prefer an Australian to do it. 204 00:10:18,987 --> 00:10:21,547 Speaker 3: He made the point about the coaches at various other 205 00:10:21,587 --> 00:10:31,747 Speaker 3: places having played for that country. You know, I often 206 00:10:32,027 --> 00:10:35,107 Speaker 3: think to myself, how would we feel if a non 207 00:10:35,147 --> 00:10:38,507 Speaker 3: New Zealander coach the All Blacks. It may well happen 208 00:10:38,547 --> 00:10:41,867 Speaker 3: one day. I think we've got a decent production line 209 00:10:41,867 --> 00:10:45,867 Speaker 3: of coaches who I'm sure will helm up our All 210 00:10:45,867 --> 00:10:48,507 Speaker 3: Blacks for quite some time. But over in Australia it's 211 00:10:48,627 --> 00:10:50,467 Speaker 3: not the first time, is it. David Renn. David Rennie 212 00:10:50,467 --> 00:10:52,587 Speaker 3: had them, didn't he. Eddie Jones's Australian. Look what he 213 00:10:52,627 --> 00:10:55,147 Speaker 3: did with that team. So I'm not sure that nationality 214 00:10:55,267 --> 00:10:57,347 Speaker 3: is to be all and end all clearly, David Campese 215 00:10:57,467 --> 00:10:59,627 Speaker 3: not a fan necessarily the way Joe Schmitt's going. 216 00:11:00,547 --> 00:11:03,747 Speaker 1: For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Fine, Listen live 217 00:11:03,867 --> 00:11:07,147 Speaker 1: to News Talk sad BE weekends from midday, or follow 218 00:11:07,187 --> 00:11:08,787 Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio