1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:02,560 Speaker 1: Barry serving Joys is good afternoon, Andrew. 2 00:00:02,720 --> 00:00:04,840 Speaker 2: So we've got Judith Colin saying we're not working on 3 00:00:04,840 --> 00:00:08,240 Speaker 2: a hate speech legislation anymore as they drop the recommendations 4 00:00:08,240 --> 00:00:11,000 Speaker 2: from the Royal and Commission of Inquiry into the Mosscitech. Okay, 5 00:00:11,080 --> 00:00:14,280 Speaker 2: so today the hate speech legislation gone. They're not working 6 00:00:14,280 --> 00:00:17,120 Speaker 2: on anymore. It's part of their coalition agreement. However, you're 7 00:00:17,120 --> 00:00:21,000 Speaker 2: going to talk about hate speech, Well, the thing. 8 00:00:20,960 --> 00:00:26,840 Speaker 1: Is that basically speech that incites violence is already illegal. Yeah, 9 00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:30,280 Speaker 1: so you know, I mean the Free Speech Union. I've 10 00:00:30,320 --> 00:00:33,680 Speaker 1: been sounding off about it today because apparently cops are 11 00:00:33,720 --> 00:00:37,560 Speaker 1: now being taught to just keep their eye on what's 12 00:00:37,600 --> 00:00:42,839 Speaker 1: going on out there. And they cite examples that have 13 00:00:42,920 --> 00:00:47,120 Speaker 1: been given to them that Keiwis should be free to 14 00:00:47,200 --> 00:00:51,240 Speaker 1: express themselves, and police are being trained to protect key 15 00:00:51,240 --> 00:00:55,400 Speaker 1: wei's right to express their opinions, not trained to speculate 16 00:00:55,440 --> 00:00:58,640 Speaker 1: whether they're hateful or not. And they cite a couple 17 00:00:58,720 --> 00:01:03,200 Speaker 1: of examples that the officers are being told hate speech 18 00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:07,959 Speaker 1: can include claims that there are only two genders and 19 00:01:08,000 --> 00:01:12,640 Speaker 1: that's a debatable thing. That and or that billboard, that 20 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:16,000 Speaker 1: very famous billboard that came out I think was under 21 00:01:16,040 --> 00:01:19,360 Speaker 1: Don Brash. Actually key We, not e We, and I 22 00:01:19,360 --> 00:01:23,000 Speaker 1: thought it was quite a clever billboard. Actually, but that's 23 00:01:23,040 --> 00:01:25,760 Speaker 1: not hate speech. I mean, that's you know, that's for 24 00:01:25,840 --> 00:01:29,960 Speaker 1: your comment, I suppose. But the hate Speech Union were 25 00:01:29,959 --> 00:01:34,280 Speaker 1: written to by a senior police officer. He said he 26 00:01:34,400 --> 00:01:39,399 Speaker 1: was really concerned about it because he said, essentially a 27 00:01:39,440 --> 00:01:42,120 Speaker 1: hate hub has been set up in the police and 28 00:01:42,160 --> 00:01:46,240 Speaker 1: the being taught now in session, and he said he 29 00:01:46,319 --> 00:01:50,000 Speaker 1: didn't sign up to be and they've quoted him directly. 30 00:01:50,080 --> 00:01:52,600 Speaker 1: He didn't sign up to be part of the thought police, 31 00:01:52,600 --> 00:01:55,920 Speaker 1: he said. In fact, he became a police officer to 32 00:01:56,040 --> 00:02:00,160 Speaker 1: protect people's inherent rights. And that's to speak the way 33 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:02,120 Speaker 1: I want to as we do. Dear, I say that 34 00:02:02,520 --> 00:02:03,480 Speaker 1: on news talk Z. 35 00:02:03,840 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 2: I wouldn't swear to the police officer though, particularly when 36 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:09,600 Speaker 2: they're trying to detain you, because that's not free speech. 37 00:02:10,240 --> 00:02:13,679 Speaker 1: It's But the actor has climbed into this as well. 38 00:02:13,760 --> 00:02:16,960 Speaker 1: It says that all of it highlights the fundamental problem 39 00:02:17,000 --> 00:02:20,679 Speaker 1: with hate speech laws, and that is they're completely subjective. 40 00:02:21,080 --> 00:02:22,079 Speaker 1: And I think that's absolutely. 41 00:02:22,240 --> 00:02:24,320 Speaker 2: It depends on the tenor, it depends on the tone, 42 00:02:24,360 --> 00:02:27,400 Speaker 2: it depends on the intention and it's so hard to do. 43 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:29,639 Speaker 2: By the way, I was talking about why can't nationals 44 00:02:29,919 --> 00:02:32,560 Speaker 2: keep working on hate speech edustation? Can you write hate 45 00:02:32,600 --> 00:02:35,440 Speaker 2: speech and edgustation while I'm retaining free speech? And I 46 00:02:35,480 --> 00:02:38,920 Speaker 2: got a text through which said, you're a dick. You 47 00:02:38,960 --> 00:02:41,080 Speaker 2: can't have free speech and a hate speech law. So 48 00:02:41,120 --> 00:02:43,160 Speaker 2: I guess that is what we would call free speech 49 00:02:43,200 --> 00:02:44,120 Speaker 2: with a little touch of eight. 50 00:02:44,360 --> 00:02:47,200 Speaker 1: That is the problem. And I've just had a statement 51 00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:50,960 Speaker 1: from the police in the last few minutes. They acknowledge 52 00:02:51,200 --> 00:02:56,320 Speaker 1: that they are instructing their police officers or taking them 53 00:02:56,360 --> 00:03:00,360 Speaker 1: to what they call a hate crime learning hard and 54 00:03:00,880 --> 00:03:06,040 Speaker 1: they say it's to support frontline staff to confidently, recognize, record, 55 00:03:06,080 --> 00:03:11,080 Speaker 1: and respond to and resolve hate motivated crimes. But I 56 00:03:11,200 --> 00:03:13,519 Speaker 1: just wonder, you know the problem that like the Free 57 00:03:13,600 --> 00:03:16,880 Speaker 1: Speech Union would see, are they filing this off and say, look, 58 00:03:16,880 --> 00:03:19,120 Speaker 1: I don't like I don't like what that bloke was 59 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:21,800 Speaker 1: saying the other day and attached the name to it, 60 00:03:21,840 --> 00:03:22,679 Speaker 1: and that's it. 61 00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:25,160 Speaker 2: You've got somebody who is full of hate and he's 62 00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:28,839 Speaker 2: screaming at somebody who's about he's going to actually go 63 00:03:28,919 --> 00:03:30,880 Speaker 2: for it. You might want to say that sounds like 64 00:03:30,919 --> 00:03:33,480 Speaker 2: hate speech and I might actually, you know, put his 65 00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:36,040 Speaker 2: arms behind his back and stop him from heading the 66 00:03:36,040 --> 00:03:37,440 Speaker 2: other guy. So you need to know that. You know, 67 00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:39,960 Speaker 2: it's not like hate speech does not exist. But there 68 00:03:40,000 --> 00:03:43,000 Speaker 2: we go. No, absolutely, now here's a bit of free speech. 69 00:03:43,000 --> 00:03:44,800 Speaker 2: And pooy. They just turned around and walked out of 70 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:46,600 Speaker 2: a meeting with Christopher lux of the Prime Minister. 71 00:03:46,680 --> 00:03:51,120 Speaker 1: Yes they did, and the meeting was essentially in Auckland 72 00:03:51,400 --> 00:03:56,240 Speaker 1: and now pooe. They basically say that this government is 73 00:03:56,320 --> 00:03:59,480 Speaker 1: running rough shold over Moldy and it's a claim that's 74 00:03:59,480 --> 00:04:03,000 Speaker 1: been made and time again because they've cited things like 75 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:07,320 Speaker 1: the Mauldi Ward legislation, which passed its final reading this week, 76 00:04:07,920 --> 00:04:13,080 Speaker 1: changes to the Iraunga Tamariki Act and moves to soften 77 00:04:13,120 --> 00:04:18,039 Speaker 1: the seaboard bed and force short judgment, and that Treaty 78 00:04:18,080 --> 00:04:22,159 Speaker 1: Principles bill being promoted by Act. The legislation hasn't seen 79 00:04:22,200 --> 00:04:23,960 Speaker 1: the light of day yet, so we have to see 80 00:04:24,279 --> 00:04:27,640 Speaker 1: what that's going to say. But it's interesting they turn 81 00:04:27,720 --> 00:04:30,320 Speaker 1: their backs in a meeting where they could have some 82 00:04:30,520 --> 00:04:33,320 Speaker 1: influence exactly. And that's the problem, isn't it When we 83 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:36,160 Speaker 1: talk about speech. Isn't it better to be at the 84 00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:40,560 Speaker 1: table and arguing with the government than to boycott it. 85 00:04:40,760 --> 00:04:43,640 Speaker 1: So you don't know what's going on here. We have 86 00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:44,800 Speaker 1: shot themselves and the feet. 87 00:04:45,040 --> 00:04:46,600 Speaker 2: If you have an enemy, you've got to speak with 88 00:04:46,680 --> 00:04:49,960 Speaker 2: them and actually proved to them that your argument is right, 89 00:04:50,360 --> 00:04:52,040 Speaker 2: because if you turn around and walk round, I mean, 90 00:04:52,120 --> 00:04:54,359 Speaker 2: that's a that's a They had many. 91 00:04:54,240 --> 00:04:56,240 Speaker 1: Years of the government at this meeting. There was the 92 00:04:56,400 --> 00:05:00,919 Speaker 1: Justice Minister, Paul Goldsmith, they had Tama pol Tucker, the 93 00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:04,560 Speaker 1: Minister of Morrow Development, and several other ministers were there, 94 00:05:04,839 --> 00:05:07,880 Speaker 1: including the Police Minister Mark Mitchell. So to me, what 95 00:05:07,920 --> 00:05:12,920 Speaker 1: they're doing is losing their opportunity for free speech. 96 00:05:14,080 --> 00:05:15,880 Speaker 2: And that's a good place to end it. If you 97 00:05:15,880 --> 00:05:17,560 Speaker 2: don't mind, can you come back after six o'clock. I 98 00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:18,360 Speaker 2: we'll do the whole week. 99 00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:21,640 Speaker 1: I'll review the whole We will for more from hither 100 00:05:21,720 --> 00:05:24,760 Speaker 1: Duplasy Allen Drive listen live to news talks. It'd be 101 00:05:24,880 --> 00:05:28,760 Speaker 1: from four pm weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.