1 00:00:06,667 --> 00:00:10,467 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine 2 00:00:10,707 --> 00:00:12,627 Speaker 1: from newstalksb. 3 00:00:12,747 --> 00:00:14,667 Speaker 2: For commentary of the All Black Spring Box game from 4 00:00:14,667 --> 00:00:17,227 Speaker 2: three tomorrow morning with our rugby editor and match commentator 5 00:00:17,267 --> 00:00:19,227 Speaker 2: Elliot Smith, who's been with the All Blacks and Joe 6 00:00:19,267 --> 00:00:22,227 Speaker 2: Burg all week. Elliott, what feeling gear get from the 7 00:00:22,267 --> 00:00:24,307 Speaker 2: All Blacks ahead of what will be I'm sure a 8 00:00:24,387 --> 00:00:25,667 Speaker 2: massive test match for them. 9 00:00:26,107 --> 00:00:28,747 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's interesting Plinny. I spoke to Jordi Barrett earlier 10 00:00:28,747 --> 00:00:32,187 Speaker 3: in the week and Toroll Lomax sort of in a 11 00:00:32,227 --> 00:00:34,667 Speaker 3: one on one extended conversation where you learn a bit 12 00:00:34,707 --> 00:00:37,547 Speaker 3: more about the player and also about how they're feeling 13 00:00:37,547 --> 00:00:40,427 Speaker 3: about the game, and Toiroll, Lomax was fairly upfront and 14 00:00:40,507 --> 00:00:44,227 Speaker 3: saying that, you know they are underdogs for this game, 15 00:00:44,267 --> 00:00:46,307 Speaker 3: but there's a sense in the team that obviously that 16 00:00:46,387 --> 00:00:51,307 Speaker 3: they believe they can go to Ellis Park. Everything's against 17 00:00:51,307 --> 00:00:53,947 Speaker 3: them in a recent form, the way the Springboks been 18 00:00:53,947 --> 00:00:58,507 Speaker 3: playing sixty thousand South African fans in the stands, everything 19 00:00:58,627 --> 00:01:01,467 Speaker 3: like that, the altitude too. But speaking to him and 20 00:01:01,947 --> 00:01:04,947 Speaker 3: to Jordi Barrett as well, who you know played the 21 00:01:05,867 --> 00:01:09,267 Speaker 3: old Fox sort of line and they're the biggest foe 22 00:01:09,307 --> 00:01:12,387 Speaker 3: that they can face. I think there's a steely determination 23 00:01:12,507 --> 00:01:15,667 Speaker 3: for this All Blacks team that they believe they're capable 24 00:01:15,707 --> 00:01:18,867 Speaker 3: of delivering a result at Alice park and almost sort 25 00:01:18,907 --> 00:01:22,187 Speaker 3: of embracing that underdog tag a little bit that they 26 00:01:22,187 --> 00:01:24,947 Speaker 3: feel that they've got given the results so far between 27 00:01:24,947 --> 00:01:26,827 Speaker 3: the two sides and the fact you're playing the World 28 00:01:26,907 --> 00:01:29,067 Speaker 3: champions for the first time since that World Cup final. 29 00:01:29,307 --> 00:01:31,387 Speaker 2: Do you think that World Cup Final is being used 30 00:01:31,427 --> 00:01:34,267 Speaker 2: in any way as motivation, even if they're not saying it. 31 00:01:35,987 --> 00:01:40,107 Speaker 3: I don't think so. Maybe for specific players, I'm sure 32 00:01:40,107 --> 00:01:42,627 Speaker 3: Sam Kine maybe at the back of his mind has 33 00:01:43,067 --> 00:01:45,947 Speaker 3: a desire to get a better outcome than what we 34 00:01:45,987 --> 00:01:48,147 Speaker 3: saw in that World Cup final, and for a number 35 00:01:48,147 --> 00:01:51,187 Speaker 3: of players it's still there. But so a man this 36 00:01:51,307 --> 00:01:53,747 Speaker 3: week that you know, they said that that just hasn't 37 00:01:53,787 --> 00:01:56,587 Speaker 3: been mentioned in camp, but I'm sure you can't escape it. 38 00:01:56,587 --> 00:01:59,507 Speaker 3: There will be memories when they go out into Alice Parker, 39 00:01:59,707 --> 00:02:01,987 Speaker 3: you know, and see the springbox jersey, see that dark 40 00:02:01,987 --> 00:02:05,187 Speaker 3: green with gold trim spring box jersey that you know, 41 00:02:05,227 --> 00:02:07,387 Speaker 3: the last time they played was the World Cup Final, 42 00:02:07,387 --> 00:02:10,187 Speaker 3: and the hurt that wins along with that Scott Barrett 43 00:02:10,187 --> 00:02:12,987 Speaker 3: said earlier Get Today that you know it's a game 44 00:02:13,027 --> 00:02:16,187 Speaker 3: that he doesn't think you'll ever get over. So I 45 00:02:16,267 --> 00:02:18,827 Speaker 3: think individually it'll play a part in their build up, 46 00:02:18,827 --> 00:02:21,507 Speaker 3: but sort of collectively as a team. It sounds like 47 00:02:21,507 --> 00:02:25,347 Speaker 3: it hasn't been mentioned and hasn't been drawn upon for 48 00:02:25,427 --> 00:02:27,627 Speaker 3: their build up for this game. A lot's changed since 49 00:02:27,667 --> 00:02:30,467 Speaker 3: then in terms of the coaching set up for the 50 00:02:30,747 --> 00:02:33,427 Speaker 3: All Blacks, new captain, a lot of new backroom stuff 51 00:02:34,267 --> 00:02:36,827 Speaker 3: as well, and has been changes to the spring box too, 52 00:02:36,907 --> 00:02:40,227 Speaker 3: So the All Blacks fairly keen on down playing that 53 00:02:40,267 --> 00:02:42,707 Speaker 3: the significance of the World Cup Final and very much 54 00:02:42,747 --> 00:02:44,227 Speaker 3: looking forward rather than backwards. 55 00:02:44,747 --> 00:02:47,707 Speaker 2: If you, I guess, thought of the full strength All 56 00:02:47,707 --> 00:02:50,707 Speaker 2: Blacks team with everybody fit and available, and then you 57 00:02:50,707 --> 00:02:52,107 Speaker 2: look at the team that's going to run out at 58 00:02:52,107 --> 00:02:53,987 Speaker 2: Alice Park, you land on a couple of players. I'm 59 00:02:54,027 --> 00:02:55,827 Speaker 2: keen to get your thoughts on them. How big a 60 00:02:55,907 --> 00:02:57,747 Speaker 2: test is this for to Mighty Williams. 61 00:02:59,027 --> 00:03:01,147 Speaker 3: Yeah huge, This is the biggest test that he'll face 62 00:03:01,187 --> 00:03:04,747 Speaker 3: in his career to date. I think finally he's impressed 63 00:03:04,747 --> 00:03:07,067 Speaker 3: in the opportunities that he's had. Seems to have been 64 00:03:08,547 --> 00:03:11,027 Speaker 3: not if pigeon holds the right word, but certainly he 65 00:03:11,067 --> 00:03:14,227 Speaker 3: either starts or he doesn't. Gets an opportunity too often 66 00:03:14,667 --> 00:03:16,987 Speaker 3: on the bench. They seem pretty set on Fletcher Newell 67 00:03:17,067 --> 00:03:19,947 Speaker 3: and offered Thawing a Fassi backing up the starters, so 68 00:03:19,987 --> 00:03:22,507 Speaker 3: it's hard to crack there. They've got a pretty good 69 00:03:22,547 --> 00:03:24,867 Speaker 3: punch they feel in terms of the props. But I 70 00:03:24,947 --> 00:03:29,947 Speaker 3: think it is a major opportunity for him on Sunday morning, 71 00:03:30,227 --> 00:03:32,747 Speaker 3: New Zealand time. He's coming for Ethan de Groot. I 72 00:03:32,747 --> 00:03:35,907 Speaker 3: think to Mighty Williams is only improving as a scrummager. 73 00:03:36,227 --> 00:03:38,947 Speaker 3: I think his worker in the park is also on 74 00:03:38,987 --> 00:03:41,107 Speaker 3: the improve as well. I thought he had a very 75 00:03:41,107 --> 00:03:44,547 Speaker 3: good test last time out against Argentina in Auckland. But 76 00:03:44,787 --> 00:03:47,147 Speaker 3: when you match up against the springbox scrum and both 77 00:03:47,227 --> 00:03:50,227 Speaker 3: these teams like using it as a weapon. We saw 78 00:03:50,307 --> 00:03:53,627 Speaker 3: the All Blacks use it really well against England, a 79 00:03:53,707 --> 00:03:57,947 Speaker 3: similarly strong scrummaging pack front row. So big test with 80 00:03:57,987 --> 00:04:00,267 Speaker 3: to Mighty Williams. You look at him and go he's 81 00:04:00,267 --> 00:04:02,147 Speaker 3: the kind of body frame that the All Blacks have 82 00:04:02,227 --> 00:04:06,027 Speaker 3: been searching for. Ethan de Grout is still obviously the incumbent, 83 00:04:06,107 --> 00:04:08,427 Speaker 3: but I think he can make some real in roads 84 00:04:08,427 --> 00:04:11,187 Speaker 3: with a sort of statement performance over the next couple 85 00:04:11,187 --> 00:04:11,827 Speaker 3: of weekends. 86 00:04:12,067 --> 00:04:14,347 Speaker 2: And Caleb Clark's got the not on the left wing. 87 00:04:14,387 --> 00:04:16,507 Speaker 2: He didn't get a lot of opportunities last year, did he. 88 00:04:16,547 --> 00:04:18,667 Speaker 2: But and even at the start of this year he 89 00:04:18,667 --> 00:04:21,187 Speaker 2: probably thought he was behind the likes of Mark Talayer 90 00:04:21,227 --> 00:04:22,987 Speaker 2: and others in the pecking order. Why do you think 91 00:04:23,027 --> 00:04:24,867 Speaker 2: they've gone Caleb Clark and how big a game is 92 00:04:24,907 --> 00:04:26,787 Speaker 2: this for him? Yeah? 93 00:04:27,107 --> 00:04:29,427 Speaker 3: I think it's a big game for Caleb Clark to 94 00:04:29,427 --> 00:04:31,987 Speaker 3: try and cement back that eleven jersey. You think back 95 00:04:32,067 --> 00:04:34,387 Speaker 3: to the winning debut for the All Blacks in twenty 96 00:04:34,427 --> 00:04:36,387 Speaker 3: twenty and it felt like we had a new superstar 97 00:04:36,907 --> 00:04:39,307 Speaker 3: on our hands. And the way he played, especially the 98 00:04:39,347 --> 00:04:43,707 Speaker 3: bleder is low against Australia Eden Park that year. He 99 00:04:43,867 --> 00:04:47,267 Speaker 3: was dynamic, He was exceptional. Since then he struggled to 100 00:04:47,307 --> 00:04:49,987 Speaker 3: sort of recapture those heights. But I think the hard 101 00:04:50,067 --> 00:04:55,027 Speaker 3: running style of Caleb Clark, the big body, will be huge. 102 00:04:55,067 --> 00:04:57,947 Speaker 3: He's great under the high ball as well. I really 103 00:04:58,027 --> 00:05:00,747 Speaker 3: like this selection. I also actually like the way they've 104 00:05:00,787 --> 00:05:03,707 Speaker 3: gone about it with Mark Talia off the bench. I 105 00:05:03,707 --> 00:05:06,707 Speaker 3: think he's still developing as a bench player, Mark, But 106 00:05:07,627 --> 00:05:09,907 Speaker 3: you know he's so slippery, isn't he And you think 107 00:05:09,907 --> 00:05:13,787 Speaker 3: about that coming on late in the game against tired defenses. 108 00:05:13,827 --> 00:05:15,947 Speaker 3: He's kind of the player that can break the lion 109 00:05:16,067 --> 00:05:18,867 Speaker 3: can get through. Caleb Clark has been exceptional with his 110 00:05:18,947 --> 00:05:22,027 Speaker 3: line breaks, as stats and Super Rugby speak to themselves. 111 00:05:22,147 --> 00:05:24,187 Speaker 3: This year he had a very good Super Rugby season 112 00:05:24,187 --> 00:05:26,427 Speaker 3: and built into it quite nicely with a hat trick 113 00:05:26,467 --> 00:05:29,467 Speaker 3: in the finals. So in terms of cementing that eleven jersey, 114 00:05:29,707 --> 00:05:32,867 Speaker 3: I think it's still firmly a live conversation. Mark Kalia 115 00:05:32,987 --> 00:05:34,507 Speaker 3: is right there and in fact they'll be on the 116 00:05:34,547 --> 00:05:37,187 Speaker 3: bench of course looking over. So a big opportunity for 117 00:05:37,227 --> 00:05:39,667 Speaker 3: Caleb Clark if the ball goes as way. It probably 118 00:05:39,707 --> 00:05:42,027 Speaker 3: didn't go as way too often in that game at 119 00:05:42,147 --> 00:05:45,107 Speaker 3: Eden Parker, you know last time out, so he'll be 120 00:05:45,187 --> 00:05:48,987 Speaker 3: came to get more opportunities in the game. And I'm 121 00:05:49,027 --> 00:05:52,267 Speaker 3: sure trying, as I say, cement that jersey for the 122 00:05:52,507 --> 00:05:53,467 Speaker 3: coming test matches. 123 00:05:53,827 --> 00:05:56,027 Speaker 2: And a lot made of the fact that this game 124 00:05:56,067 --> 00:06:01,067 Speaker 2: is at altitude. Johannesburg Pretoria obviously are the two altitude 125 00:06:01,067 --> 00:06:03,227 Speaker 2: grounds if you like, compared to Cape Town, where you'll 126 00:06:03,267 --> 00:06:06,947 Speaker 2: be next week for the average person like yourself Hannesburg. 127 00:06:07,467 --> 00:06:10,027 Speaker 2: Is the change in altitude obvious. 128 00:06:10,907 --> 00:06:14,467 Speaker 3: Yes it is. Yeah, I've noticed this week there is 129 00:06:14,467 --> 00:06:17,067 Speaker 3: a little thinner going up steps. You get a little 130 00:06:17,107 --> 00:06:21,147 Speaker 3: more puffed out of breath than you probably should, and 131 00:06:22,827 --> 00:06:26,107 Speaker 3: you know, you feel a little bit more tired, I 132 00:06:26,107 --> 00:06:29,907 Speaker 3: think is the way about it, and you're desperate for 133 00:06:29,947 --> 00:06:32,787 Speaker 3: a bit more water than maybe you'd usually take on board. 134 00:06:32,787 --> 00:06:34,627 Speaker 3: I find my mouth getting a little bit drier than 135 00:06:35,547 --> 00:06:38,107 Speaker 3: it probably worked throughout the times of the day, so 136 00:06:38,147 --> 00:06:40,227 Speaker 3: I've been well armed with a water bottle to make 137 00:06:40,267 --> 00:06:42,627 Speaker 3: sure of that. And I've had the dreaded altitude nose 138 00:06:42,667 --> 00:06:44,987 Speaker 3: bleed as well, so I've had it all pinty over 139 00:06:44,987 --> 00:06:47,147 Speaker 3: the last few days. But you do notice it. 140 00:06:47,147 --> 00:06:47,507 Speaker 2: It is. 141 00:06:49,467 --> 00:06:52,347 Speaker 3: A different experience and for a few of these players 142 00:06:52,387 --> 00:06:55,147 Speaker 3: in the All Blacks, they won't have experienced it at 143 00:06:55,227 --> 00:06:57,667 Speaker 3: least before was sort of training earlier in the week 144 00:06:57,707 --> 00:07:01,347 Speaker 3: and landing on the grounds. You know, there's been a 145 00:07:01,467 --> 00:07:03,587 Speaker 3: number of players in the squad. You look at the 146 00:07:03,587 --> 00:07:07,307 Speaker 3: bench in Quartez Ratama seven penny fee now who haven't 147 00:07:07,427 --> 00:07:09,667 Speaker 3: traveled to South Africa before in super rugby because that 148 00:07:09,707 --> 00:07:13,227 Speaker 3: opportunity doesn't exist anymore. So when you land in Johannesburg, 149 00:07:13,227 --> 00:07:15,747 Speaker 3: it's not like you've had the experience of playing the 150 00:07:15,827 --> 00:07:18,147 Speaker 3: Lions at Alice Park and you know the way around 151 00:07:18,627 --> 00:07:20,987 Speaker 3: the high Vault and gone to Loftus and played the Bulls. 152 00:07:20,987 --> 00:07:23,987 Speaker 3: You were experiencing it for the first time. And as 153 00:07:24,227 --> 00:07:27,227 Speaker 3: you know, as as a civilian you do, you do 154 00:07:27,387 --> 00:07:30,507 Speaker 3: notice those differences and the lungs burn a little bit deeper. 155 00:07:30,547 --> 00:07:33,267 Speaker 3: And spoke to Jordi Barrett and he mentioned your lungs 156 00:07:33,267 --> 00:07:35,027 Speaker 3: burn a little bit deeper earlier in a game than 157 00:07:35,067 --> 00:07:37,107 Speaker 3: you would expect. And it's all new to some of 158 00:07:37,107 --> 00:07:39,307 Speaker 3: those players in your black setup, so they have to 159 00:07:39,347 --> 00:07:41,227 Speaker 3: be ready to combat it. I know, as we mentioned 160 00:07:41,227 --> 00:07:43,987 Speaker 3: this week around some of those tactics you can use 161 00:07:44,107 --> 00:07:48,467 Speaker 3: to improve and deny it for as long as you 162 00:07:48,467 --> 00:07:50,827 Speaker 3: possibly can, but it's certainly something you'll have to combat 163 00:07:51,667 --> 00:07:53,307 Speaker 3: on Saturday afternoon here in local time. 164 00:07:53,387 --> 00:07:55,667 Speaker 2: All right, keep the water bottle nice and handy, Elliott, 165 00:07:55,707 --> 00:07:57,387 Speaker 2: can't wait for your call in the early hours of 166 00:07:57,427 --> 00:08:00,227 Speaker 2: New Zealand time. I really appreciate your work this week, 167 00:08:00,227 --> 00:08:02,027 Speaker 2: and yeah, can't wait to see how it plays out 168 00:08:02,027 --> 00:08:02,707 Speaker 2: of Ellis Park. 169 00:08:02,987 --> 00:08:04,227 Speaker 3: I'll stay well hydrated. 170 00:08:04,227 --> 00:08:06,347 Speaker 2: Thanks bye, good on you made Elliott Smith that right 171 00:08:06,427 --> 00:08:09,227 Speaker 2: be editor and match commentator three o'clock tomorrow morning. Full 172 00:08:09,227 --> 00:08:11,587 Speaker 2: commentary of the all black Springbox test here on news 173 00:08:11,587 --> 00:08:12,067 Speaker 2: talks EDB. 174 00:08:12,707 --> 00:08:15,907 Speaker 1: For more from Weekends Sport with Jason Fine, listen live 175 00:08:15,987 --> 00:08:19,387 Speaker 1: to News Talks EDB Weekends from midday, or follow the 176 00:08:19,427 --> 00:08:20,947 Speaker 1: podcast on iHeartRadio