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Speaker 1: Pressing the newsmakers to get the real story.

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Speaker 2: It's Andrew Dickens on hither due to sellen drive with

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Speaker 2: one New Zealand let's get connected.

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Speaker 1: You stop, said b.

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Speaker 3: It's good up to you.

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Speaker 4: It is Wednesday, the fourth of December. I'm Andrew Dickens

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Speaker 4: here until seven. Ayesha Viril has gone all out. She's

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Speaker 4: accuses Health Commissioner Lester Levy of cooking the books. He's

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Speaker 4: gone all out. He's demanded an apology. She'll be with

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Speaker 4: us after five thirty. Today, the Chief Onwardsman has slammed

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Speaker 4: the Ministry for Social Developments, saying it's payments to abuse

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Speaker 4: and care survivors are unreasonable and arbitrary and not nearly enough.

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Speaker 4: But what is enough in these times? And we will

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Speaker 4: talk to the Onwoodsman as well. And Barry Soper had

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Speaker 4: lunch with Boris Johnson again. Yes, that's two lunches in

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Speaker 4: two days. So what happened today? He joins me at

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Speaker 4: four forty five. And next, are we willing to pay

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Speaker 4: extra to put wool carpets in state houses? That's the program.

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Speaker 4: You can text me ninety two. You can email Dickens

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Speaker 4: at newstorkstb dot co dot and z it is eight

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Speaker 4: out to four.

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Speaker 1: Andrew Dickins or.

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Speaker 4: Under fire for ditching will carpets in favor of nylon,

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Speaker 4: and that is despite government plans to direct government agencies

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Speaker 4: to use wool over anything else where possible. Caring Aura

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Speaker 4: says it's cost analysis has shown nylon was thirty four

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Speaker 4: percent cheaper than more alternatives. And so joining me to

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Speaker 4: talk about this is the man who blewed the whistle.

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Speaker 4: Associate Agriculture Minister Mark Patterson.

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Speaker 3: Hella, Mark Hill Angela, you are going today, I'm good.

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Speaker 4: If nylon's really that much cheaper, can we really be

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Speaker 4: upset with caring Aura?

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Speaker 3: Well, how do they know. They haven't even given the

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Speaker 3: carpet manufactures a chance to tender, So that's pretty premature statement.

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Speaker 4: How do you think it's cheaper?

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Speaker 3: Look, it's not all about price, it's about value. And

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Speaker 3: you know, wil carpets certainly have some attributes that synthetics

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Speaker 3: will never be able to match the sofa, healthier, more

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Speaker 3: environmentally friendly targets. There's a big swing back to war actually,

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Speaker 3: and there's good reason for that. But this isn't the

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Speaker 3: coalition agreement. I think that's get issues here and somewhere

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Speaker 3: deep within the bowels of mb that decided to defy that.

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Speaker 3: So that's a problem.

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Speaker 4: Yes, I was wondering whether this was just a knee

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Speaker 4: jerk somebody going the government wants to save money. I

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Speaker 4: believe that nylon is cheaper, and they just went we'll

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Speaker 4: go nylon.

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Speaker 3: Oh look, it could be. And I mean, this is

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Speaker 3: sort of an operational issue for them at one level,

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Speaker 3: but then it is directly in the coalition agreement. It's

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Speaker 3: clear the intent of the governments here. We're trying to

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Speaker 3: revitalize the sheep industry and the war industry. We're starting

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Speaker 3: to make some progress on that, but this is a

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Speaker 3: bit of a kick in the guts and certainly to

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Speaker 3: feedback from getting from farmers and the industry in general.

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Speaker 4: Well, you mentioned you mentioned it briefly already. The Brend

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Speaker 4: with CEO Greg Smith was on with Mike Hosking this

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Speaker 4: morning and when I asked, he claimed that they could

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Speaker 4: be competitive on price, but even more worryingly, they weren't

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Speaker 4: asked to forward a price at all. So is KO

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Speaker 4: not shopping around for the best deal and therefore breaking

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Speaker 4: its promise with the government, And isn't this what they

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Speaker 4: were supposed to be doing to give the taxpayer bang

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Speaker 4: for buck.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely that they didn't. That tender did not allow

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Speaker 3: for the tablets to even be considered in new builds,

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Speaker 3: which is a direct contradiction to the government's and key.

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Speaker 3: So Greg has got every right to be a bit

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Speaker 3: agreed about that, as am I.

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Speaker 4: The other bigger question is also do government agencies actually

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Speaker 4: have an obligation to the state, to the people, to

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Speaker 4: the farmers to support our wool industry even if it

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Speaker 4: costs more.

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Speaker 3: Well, as I say, it's not all that price. It's

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Speaker 3: about value on a more holistic part of it, which

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Speaker 3: is safer, healthier, more environment and friendly at supporting our

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Speaker 3: law industry as sheep farmers that have really been struggling

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Speaker 3: of late. So it is that's white. It's in a

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Speaker 3: coalition agreement. It's why New Zealand First has campaigned on

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Speaker 3: it for a number of elections and National have been

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Speaker 3: good enough to come on board with it in the

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Speaker 3: coalition agreement. And we want it to be wanted.

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Speaker 4: But the other coalition partner Act will claim that this

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Speaker 4: is good old classic corporate welfare.

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Speaker 3: Well, we all sign up to various things in the

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Speaker 3: coalition agreement that we might not totally be on board with,

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Speaker 3: but you know it's there in black and white, and

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Speaker 3: that's the way this government operates, and we'll work through this.

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Speaker 3: I'm sure we're will and we've just been blindsided. This

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Speaker 3: has come out of NBM. We'll have a look at

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Speaker 3: this and see if there's anything we can do at

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Speaker 3: least get the wall guys a chance to put in

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Speaker 3: it in, because that's the at least they can expect.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, that sounds fair. My Pattison course associated Agriculture Minister

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Speaker 4: in New Zealand first as well, so that's his thing.

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Speaker 4: But yes, Ac would say, you know, you go to

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Speaker 4: the market Texta and already Andrew, some of the KO

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Speaker 4: homes have vinyl in the living areas. You could do

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Speaker 4: that as well. Someone wanted me to ask him whether

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Speaker 4: he was wearing woolen socks or not. But is a

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Speaker 4: little factoid for you from caying Aura. In the last

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Speaker 4: six years they've laid six hundred thousand meters of synthetic carpet.

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Speaker 4: The volume that volume in the last six years of

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Speaker 4: that synthetic carpet requires importing one point seven million kilos

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Speaker 4: of plastic for its production. Meanwhile, the wolve's right here

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Speaker 4: now very important for our lists in Northland. If you

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Speaker 4: are listening on ten twenty six am in Fangala, we're

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Speaker 4: about to go off here for an hour because we're

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Speaker 4: fixing things up. The texts are replacing the air conditioning

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Speaker 4: up there. It's your fault, you're too hot Northland. But

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Speaker 4: this will be call and you can keep on listening

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Speaker 4: on iHeartRadio. Go get the app, then you put it

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Speaker 4: on the phone, then you bluetooth to a speaker. It's

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Speaker 4: called the twenty first Century and it's in perfect stereo,

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Speaker 4: not muldy old Am, though I probably shouldn't have said that.

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Speaker 4: It's at thirteen minutes after four now black Caps out

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Speaker 4: in England to both find and lose championship points because

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Speaker 4: when they were playing cricket they played it too slow.

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Speaker 4: Was that fair or not? Darcy Waldgravers with us next,

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Speaker 4: it is thirteen minutes after four.

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Speaker 2: Who will take the White House results and analysis of

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Speaker 2: the US election?

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Speaker 1: On hither Dupless Alum drive with one New Zealand. Let's

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Speaker 1: get connected news talk said b.

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Speaker 2: Sport with tab get your bed on RI team bet responsibly.

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Speaker 4: It's sixteen enough to four respndent in blue. It's your color,

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Speaker 4: Darcy Waldegrave. Hit to toe today, hit to toe? And

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Speaker 4: why not blue cap? Blue blue? And then do you

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Speaker 4: call it love and lover? What do you call your funga?

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Speaker 4: There we go?

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Speaker 5: What's the sum one version means with pockets considering the

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Speaker 5: heat of the day in this area, yep. And then

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Speaker 5: and blue burks and blue burks, I might do well

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Speaker 5: white tomorrow will grow the next day all black? Something

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Speaker 5: to entertain myself in the morning in the sun.

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Speaker 4: Are used to porting the English cricket team with this

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Speaker 4: color choice? No, why would I do that?

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Speaker 5: Next thing?

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Speaker 6: You know?

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Speaker 5: Well, no, it's news talk Z e B colors? How

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Speaker 5: about that.

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Speaker 4: Nice black caps? Did England find the lose championship points?

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Speaker 4: That's the champion chances for us? Over or because we

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Speaker 4: couldn't pull our finger out and bowl an extra three

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Speaker 4: overs each? Is this fair?

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Speaker 5: Well, we're going to talk about that with Greg Barclay,

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Speaker 5: former chair of the ic C.

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Speaker 4: He joins us on the.

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Speaker 5: Show this evening to talk about how they actually come

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Speaker 5: to this conclusion around do they find do they find

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Speaker 5: individuals that they need to find the team? Do they

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Speaker 5: need to take points off them? What effect it has

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Speaker 5: on the crowd, because the new term around is putting

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Speaker 5: the fans at the center of the room, and this

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Speaker 5: is what they've got to do. How does this affect

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Speaker 5: the fan base? Anything else? Nothing else is important, the

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Speaker 5: people at home and the people at the ground.

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Speaker 4: Did the fans feel ripped off that they didn't get

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Speaker 4: six people? Same people don't What did they know that

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Speaker 4: they were six overs a cricket they may or may

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Speaker 4: not have had.

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Speaker 5: Yep, Well they lost a whole lot at the end

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Speaker 5: because the game stopped.

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Speaker 4: Well this is right. Well that's a very good point.

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Speaker 5: There's a whole day's madness. I suppose when you're enoughy

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Speaker 5: like myself, and you really enjoy the game and you

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Speaker 5: know it's being slow and you know the messing, and

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Speaker 5: it's like, oh, I didn't pay my money to sit

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Speaker 5: here and watch you scuff the floor. A little bit

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Speaker 5: of a conversation about you feel do something, don't just

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Speaker 5: do something? Stand there. That's what it's like cricket. It

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Speaker 5: is cricket and it's slow, but in some relevant arguments

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Speaker 5: both ways. But what gets me about this is the

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Speaker 5: Black Cats win the final two matches in Wellington and Hamilton,

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Speaker 5: they will still need a number of results to go

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Speaker 5: their way to qualify for the World Chest Final. They

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Speaker 5: mean South Africa needs to lose a home series to

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Speaker 5: nil to Pakistan, Sri Lanka needs to lose a home

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Speaker 5: series to Australia, and Indy need to win the current

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Speaker 5: series and Aussie four to one or the hosts win

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Speaker 5: three to two or better. So you're telling me there's.

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Speaker 4: A charge, Nick, But can I also say how good

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Speaker 4: it is that the international cricket's scene right now any

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Speaker 4: of that could actually happen.

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Speaker 5: Yes, And also let's throw in there, kuld be a

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Speaker 5: team with loads slow overrage, which is what happens to

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Speaker 5: the Australians, which is why we get onto the final

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Speaker 5: of the first place that we won.

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Speaker 4: New Bull World Cup could shift to every two years.

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Speaker 5: They're looking at this is only an idea. They throw

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Speaker 5: it around saying how can we catch up with the Joneses.

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Speaker 5: Everybody has a pinnacle event every couple of years, don't they.

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Speaker 5: It's always something big to look forward to. So a

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Speaker 5: Continental Cup to be added to the international calendar, possibly,

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Speaker 5: which is the top five teams from each playing continent

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Speaker 5: base if you will, maybe the fast five World series

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Speaker 5: will be more regular and global, the aligned global calendar,

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Speaker 5: which of course the World Cup coming every alternate year

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Speaker 5: between the continental Cups. So they're looking at ways again

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Speaker 5: of eyeballs, and fast fire is probably the way because

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Speaker 5: it's easily digestible, it's quick as fast it's done. And

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Speaker 5: I think that in order to get more global traction,

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Speaker 5: you need to attract more teams, more teams playing the

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Speaker 5: game with something that's slightly more not that netball isn't

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Speaker 5: dynamic because it has.

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Speaker 4: More accessible you know, and I and the example there

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Speaker 4: is seven's rugby, you know, where Spain beat New Zealand

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Speaker 4: twice in the last tournament.

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Speaker 5: Stop there, please to endure that.

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Speaker 4: I'm sorry, yeah, but there we go. And how good

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Speaker 4: is that for the game of rugby.

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Speaker 5: It's great for rugby, terrible for us. And then the

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Speaker 5: Australians managed to wallop not wallet, they managed to squeeze

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Speaker 5: past the ferns and the final of that too. This

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Speaker 5: was my weekend.

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Speaker 4: Thanks, but that's the whole thing. You know, maybe fast

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Speaker 4: five could do for netball what sevens done for rugby.

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Speaker 5: We want that more eyeballs and it's great that world

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Speaker 5: netball are going right they're not. I don't think this

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Speaker 5: conceding that's broken. But they're saying we need change. We don't.

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Speaker 5: It will break.

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Speaker 4: Good stuff does is on from seven. This is a

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Speaker 4: new stalks At.

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Speaker 1: Beat digging deeper into the day's headlines.

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Speaker 2: It's Andrew Dickens on Heather duples see Ellen drive with

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Speaker 2: one New Zealand.

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Speaker 1: Let's get connected and.

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Speaker 4: Use talks that'd be well versus nylon, nylon versus wool.

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Speaker 4: The battle is on text through Andrew from a firefighter

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Speaker 4: thirty five years via a wool carpet does not burn

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Speaker 4: like synthetics. To synthetics melt, then they burn fiercely, hence

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Speaker 4: the toxic black smoke from house fires. Modern houses have

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Speaker 4: a very high amount of plastics and noll. It's not good.

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Speaker 4: There we go, there's one another person, those says Andrew.

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Speaker 4: For God's sake, it is all about price. In the

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Speaker 4: current environment, there is no money, so we need to

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Speaker 4: move on. But here's the thing. Kanga Order did not

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Speaker 4: ask Bremworth for a price, and they would have sharpened

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Speaker 4: their pencils. I've had another text from Ben Ben says

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Speaker 4: Kanga Order did not ask New Zealand owned and made

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Speaker 4: carpet mill to supply. I don't know exactly how they

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Speaker 4: made the decision, but it sounds like they just assumed.

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Speaker 4: You know about an assumption. If you assume, it makes

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Speaker 4: an ass out of you and me. That's how it's spelled,

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Speaker 4: you know that thing. Somebody else says, definitely wool carpet

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Speaker 4: for the state houses. This is colleen and much more

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Speaker 4: healthier for the children. Also support the farmers. So this

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Speaker 4: is a great debate. We had good debate over the

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Speaker 4: course of the afternoon wol versus Nylon. But also are

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Speaker 4: we really being forensic about this? Are we really sharpening

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Speaker 4: our pencils? And are we really finding the best deals

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Speaker 4: the way we were promised we will operate in the future. Now,

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Speaker 4: can I just tell you how good boris Johnson is

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Speaker 4: half an hour with Kerry Woodham yesterday and he almost

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Speaker 4: made me support Brexit. So I'm not a natural supporter

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Speaker 4: of Brexit. I'll tell you why I have a UK passport.

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Speaker 4: I was born in hamil Hamstead. I used it to

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Speaker 4: live and work in France for nearly three years. Thirty

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Speaker 4: years ago. All my friends were British. They were all

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Speaker 4: in the same place. They were all in pan European business.

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Speaker 4: They were part of the EU. It expanded their domestic

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Speaker 4: market by five hundred percent. They loved it. It was

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Speaker 4: a free trade agreement that we all took advantage of.

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Speaker 4: And I then went and parts of my British passport

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Speaker 4: onto my kids and they were itching to grow up

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Speaker 4: to go and live and work in whatever so did

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Speaker 4: they wanted Berlin or Rome. So we were not automatic

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Speaker 4: lovers of Brexit for purely selfish reasons. I'll give you that.

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Speaker 4: But here yesterday was Bojo on this station, in full flow,

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Speaker 4: eloquently and charmingly pointing out about how Britain regained regulatory

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Speaker 4: control of its products and services and public policy, how

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Speaker 4: it made their economy more nimble and able to explore

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Speaker 4: other alternators like a New Zealand free trade deal and

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Speaker 4: a more trade with the United States, and how its

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Speaker 4: benefits will only accrue as time marches on. And I

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Speaker 4: started listening to him and going, okay, you are seducing

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Speaker 4: me with your wise words. Mister Johnson. You are awesome.

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Speaker 4: And it has been easy from Afar to view him

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Speaker 4: as a clown with the crazy hair who likes the bikes,

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Speaker 4: but to see the beast up and close and unfettered.

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Speaker 4: It is quite a thing. His charm and his wit

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Speaker 4: at his ease of argument explains why he was successful

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Speaker 4: winning first the Mariorty of London and then the top

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Speaker 4: job in the UK. And it also explained to me

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Speaker 4: how he's managed to have so many children by so

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Speaker 4: much any women. He's been asked whether he may return

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Speaker 4: to politics, but you know, come on, why should he.

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Speaker 4: He's having lunch all over the world right now. He's

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Speaker 4: making an absolute fortune. He is free to be an

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Speaker 4: unadulterated Boris, which is quite a thing, rampaging freely over

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Speaker 4: the world, eating lunch, drinking wine and saying wires things.

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Speaker 4: By the way, that thing, that unadulterated Boris Barry Soper

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Speaker 4: had lunch with again today. That is twice during his

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Speaker 4: visit that Barry has been talking with Bojo. And apparently

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Speaker 4: today he was even better because he wasn't in a

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Speaker 4: big room full of a whole lot of people. He

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Speaker 4: was with some industry people. He was with some farmers,

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Speaker 4: and he was just full flight and full flow and

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Speaker 4: apparently very very scruffy. But I won't tell you all

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Speaker 4: the stories because that's what we've got Barry Soper here

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Speaker 4: for Barry Soper is here a round about a quarter

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Speaker 4: to five on news talks, But we'll go to America

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Speaker 4: with Dan Mitchenson. Trump is using the underbid and pardon

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Speaker 4: as the reason why he should be pardoned for everything.

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Speaker 4: My name is Andrew Dickens. Heather's fine, but not fine

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Speaker 4: enough to come to work. We'll be soon.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, the day's newsmakers talk to Andrew first, Andrew

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Speaker 2: Dickens on Hither Duper see Alan drive with one New Zealand.

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Speaker 1: Let's get connected news talk as it'd be.

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Speaker 7: Marry ponyboy Bunny combat to get off first body.

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Speaker 8: Okay, I've been breaking my back just keeping the waiting down.

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Speaker 1: YU mean, y'au no with gold when it's a barfied.

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Speaker 4: Nor are you keep missing me saying the fact that

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Speaker 4: Heather's fine but not fine enough to come to work.

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Speaker 4: We're not sure about tomorrow, but I'm quite happy to

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Speaker 4: be here for a little bit. It's a lot of thing.

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Speaker 4: So I've had a text from a fella called Joel Sterling.

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Speaker 4: Joel Sterling's an NBA student who's done all sorts of things.

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Speaker 4: He's hung out with Sir Richard Branson and all that

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Speaker 4: sort of stuff. Anyway, this is what Joel has written

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Speaker 4: to me. He said, I have had the privilege to

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Speaker 4: spend some time with Boris Johnson yesterday. He was everything

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Speaker 4: I expected him to be. He had everyone around him

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Speaker 4: at laughter and had ease to ask him anything. I

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Speaker 4: took this is Joel Sterling. I took a handmade chest

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Speaker 4: set to the event with a huge hope that he

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Speaker 4: would be able to sign it for me and then

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Speaker 4: donate it to the New Zealand Parliament. Boris was very

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Speaker 4: open and very willing to sign it. I suggested he

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Speaker 4: sign for King and Country, but Boris, being the amazing Boris,

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Speaker 4: said no for King and Commonwealth. It was at this

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Speaker 4: moment I understood why he was PM for the UK.

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Speaker 4: Love him or hate him, he is amazing at what

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Speaker 4: he does and so likable when you get to speak

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Speaker 4: with him. By the way, at the same event with

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Speaker 4: some Peters was also amazing in his speech and history

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Speaker 4: lesson on the entire world, which comes when you've actually

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Speaker 4: been live for a thousand years. He'd get to know

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Speaker 4: some stuff. And Barry Soaper was there as well, and

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Speaker 4: he's going to join me at four forty five to

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Speaker 4: talk more about this.

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Speaker 1: It's the world wires on news talks. He'd be drive

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Speaker 1: all right.

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Speaker 4: The White House has expressed relief that South Korean President

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Speaker 4: Yun has withdrawn his decoration of martial law. It's an

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Speaker 4: outbreak of democracy. He backed down after the country's parliament

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Speaker 4: voted to reject the decoration. The presidents initially justified martial

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Speaker 4: law by accusing opposition parties of having ties to North Korea.

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Speaker 4: But everyone says, mate, that doesn't stack up.

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Speaker 9: In the past, there have been a partner was a

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Speaker 9: party in South Korea that was investigated and tried and

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Speaker 9: banned from office. He could have taken legal steps to

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Speaker 9: try and remove anyone who actually did have ties to

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Speaker 9: North Korea. So it seems like this was really an

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Speaker 9: affecitake and settle a domestic political dispute, all right.

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Speaker 10: Ope.

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Speaker 4: The ditch in Australia has once again broken ranks with

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Speaker 4: the US and Israel at the United Nations, and for

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Speaker 4: the first time since two thousand and one, Australia voted

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Speaker 4: in favor of emotion to manding the end of Israel's

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Speaker 4: presence in the occupied Palestinian territories one hundred and fifty

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Speaker 4: six other countries, all including New Zealand, also voted in favor.

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Speaker 4: Now Here is Australia's UN ambassador.

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Speaker 11: We welcome the resolution's confirmation that a high level international

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Speaker 11: conference be convened in twenty twenty five aimed at the

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Speaker 11: implementation of a two states solution for the achievement of

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Speaker 11: a just, lasting and comprehensive piece in the Middle East.

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Speaker 4: And finally, archaeologists in Arizona have found what they believe

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Speaker 4: is the oldest surviving gun in the continental United States

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Speaker 4: of America. They've dug up a bronze cannon. Well it's

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Speaker 4: more than just a gun. It's a bronze cannon that

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Speaker 4: they think was built to defend a town established by

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Speaker 4: Spanish conquistadors in the mid sixteenth century. The conquistadors, we're

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Speaker 4: searching for the Seven Cities of Goals. You know that

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Speaker 4: if you've read your Scrooge mcdac comics, because the Junior

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Speaker 4: Woodchucks are also on the search. Always He's always on

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Speaker 4: the search. But of course they never found any Golden

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Speaker 4: Cities in Arizona, so they wound up abandoning the town

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Speaker 4: before they even had a chance to fire.

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Speaker 2: The Canon International Correspondence with ends and eye insurance, peace

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Speaker 2: of mind for New Zealand business.

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Speaker 4: Yes, and now to the United States of America, Dan Mitchison,

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Speaker 4: Welcome to the program.

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Speaker 8: Hey, thanks, Andrew.

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Speaker 4: So Donald Trump not one to you know, not take

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Speaker 4: advantage of a situation. He's using the Hunter Biden pardon

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Speaker 4: to argue that he should be pardoned and everything.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, here he is.

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Speaker 8: I mean, this decision has kind of had all kinds

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Speaker 8: of blowback, and that's one of the main ones as well.

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Speaker 8: And legal experts are now saying that he's got a

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Speaker 8: fresh president on this because of what Joe Biden did.

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Speaker 8: And I mean most people are using the example of

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Speaker 8: Gerald for the former president that pardon Richard Nixon, and

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Speaker 8: with the exception of him, I don't think there's been

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Speaker 8: a president that's ever issued such a broad grant of

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Speaker 8: clemency here. So Hunter Biden is now effectively cleared of

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Speaker 8: all the consequences for the next ten or eleven years.

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Speaker 8: And the whole process was so secretive the Justice Department's office,

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Speaker 8: a partner attorney, which typically advises a sitting president on

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Speaker 8: these clemency issues, was caught off guard. So I think,

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Speaker 8: you know, you've got people on the left end the

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Speaker 8: right here that aren't very happy with the decision. But

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Speaker 8: as a dad, maybe you understand a little bit. You

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Speaker 8: know why the president might have done what he did.

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Speaker 4: Well, the question is when the Trump administration takes over,

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Speaker 4: will they continue a which hunt against Hunter Biden or

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Speaker 4: does this step actually just a new hunter for the rest.

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Speaker 2: Of his life.

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Speaker 8: Well, I think that's what President Biden was going for,

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Speaker 8: just because he saw what the hand riding on the

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Speaker 8: wall and knew that if if President Electro came into office,

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Speaker 8: that this was going to be at the top of

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Speaker 8: his list. You know, he had a he had a

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Speaker 8: list of vendettas and he was going to go after this.

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Speaker 8: So basically, as a dad, Joe Biden said, I'm going

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Speaker 8: to have to do this. I know, I said I

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Speaker 8: wasn't going to do this. I was vocal about it.

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Speaker 8: So as a voter you may be disappointed. As somebody

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Speaker 8: in the Democratic Party you're probably disappointed as well. Republicans

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Speaker 8: are outraged, as you know the sound bites on the news.

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Speaker 8: But you know, again, going back to being a dad,

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Speaker 8: maybe you're thinking, this is the this is the best

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Speaker 8: way I can protect my son at the you know,

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Speaker 8: the last few years of my life.

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Speaker 4: Do you do realize that the rest of the world

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Speaker 4: looks at America and the way their prisons can actually

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Speaker 4: pardon people for anything and go, well, you know, are

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Speaker 4: you really the defenders of freedom and law and all

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Speaker 4: that stuff?

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Speaker 5: Yeah?

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Speaker 8: Do we have another four hours for that conversation? You

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Speaker 8: bring up a good point, but you know that's that's

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Speaker 8: the you know, Trump, but it pardons at Bill Clinton.

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Speaker 8: I mean, every president has done their own pardon and

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Speaker 8: every time there's at least one or two about and

437
00:22:01,160 --> 00:22:04,159
Speaker 8: are controversial. And this is just the only one that

438
00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:06,159
Speaker 8: we know of now before he leaves office, but I'm

439
00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:06,919
Speaker 8: sure there will be more.

440
00:22:07,080 --> 00:22:09,920
Speaker 4: Okay, So it's moved to California where a law maker

441
00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:14,640
Speaker 4: wants priority given to slave descendants looking to get into college.

442
00:22:15,400 --> 00:22:16,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is kind of interesting.

443
00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:18,960
Speaker 8: They want the descendants of slaves to be able to

444
00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:21,879
Speaker 8: get into the University of California and California State University,

445
00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:24,560
Speaker 8: which are two of the largest public schools and public

446
00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:26,080
Speaker 8: universities that we have here in the country.

447
00:22:26,119 --> 00:22:26,600
Speaker 1: And there's been a.

448
00:22:26,600 --> 00:22:30,320
Speaker 8: Big push by people, especially on the left, for reparations

449
00:22:30,480 --> 00:22:32,520
Speaker 8: giving money or land to descendants.

450
00:22:32,040 --> 00:22:32,760
Speaker 1: Of these slaves.

451
00:22:33,440 --> 00:22:34,879
Speaker 8: But this is the first time that something like this

452
00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:37,239
Speaker 8: has been introduced. And with the again we go back

453
00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:41,159
Speaker 8: to the incoming Trump administration, they're expected to dismantle a

454
00:22:41,240 --> 00:22:44,879
Speaker 8: lot of the diversity and equity and inclusion programs. So

455
00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:46,400
Speaker 8: I don't know how this is going to take off.

456
00:22:46,440 --> 00:22:48,120
Speaker 8: I mean one senator saying, you know, when you think

457
00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:51,600
Speaker 8: about reparations, you think about cash payments, but then there's

458
00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:55,160
Speaker 8: also the harm that goes down from generation to generation.

459
00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:59,240
Speaker 8: And these policies are a bigger process than writing somebody

460
00:22:59,280 --> 00:23:01,080
Speaker 8: a check, which they're already starting to do.

461
00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:03,560
Speaker 4: Yes, but do you want a doctor who's got in

462
00:23:03,720 --> 00:23:08,040
Speaker 4: purely because you know the dead and the great grandfather

463
00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:09,359
Speaker 4: happened to be a slave.

464
00:23:09,200 --> 00:23:10,120
Speaker 1: You know, right?

465
00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:11,879
Speaker 8: Yeah, And that's what they're saying right now. This is

466
00:23:11,920 --> 00:23:13,480
Speaker 8: gonna this is going to open a floodgate for a

467
00:23:13,560 --> 00:23:15,440
Speaker 8: lot of other people too. I mean we had we

468
00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:18,400
Speaker 8: had Asians that were in internment camps during the Second

469
00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:20,080
Speaker 8: World I mean there's you could just go back to

470
00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:21,480
Speaker 8: a lot of people.

471
00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:24,480
Speaker 4: And is it entry requirements or is it over you know,

472
00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:27,320
Speaker 4: like like final qualifications.

473
00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:30,159
Speaker 8: Well that's what they're still trying to work out right now.

474
00:23:30,240 --> 00:23:32,400
Speaker 8: This bill has just been introduced at this point in time.

475
00:23:32,480 --> 00:23:33,600
Speaker 8: So I think he's going to have a lot of

476
00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:35,479
Speaker 8: people that are going to be coming up with questions

477
00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:37,920
Speaker 8: exactly like this. And then that's why this, this whole

478
00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:40,600
Speaker 8: thing is going to probably stall once Trump gets into office.

479
00:23:40,920 --> 00:23:43,359
Speaker 4: Okay, they are porch pandits. That's steal your passes that

480
00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:46,840
Speaker 4: arrive with Kuria. Apparently you can get insurance for that.

481
00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:49,399
Speaker 8: Now, well, well you can, and I don't know how

482
00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:51,159
Speaker 8: big the problem is over there, but over here, I

483
00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:54,600
Speaker 8: mean it's terrible. We have one hundred and nineteen million thefts.

484
00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:58,800
Speaker 8: The costs about thirteen billion dollars each year over here.

485
00:23:58,880 --> 00:24:01,600
Speaker 8: So there's this company called porch Pals, and what you

486
00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:03,000
Speaker 8: do is you write them a check for one hundred

487
00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:05,280
Speaker 8: and twenty bucks or fifty or a year for fifteen

488
00:24:05,320 --> 00:24:07,760
Speaker 8: dollars a month, and you can file three claims for

489
00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:10,160
Speaker 8: something that's been stolen off your front porch and each

490
00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:12,480
Speaker 8: one covers about two thousand dollars and it doesn't really

491
00:24:12,720 --> 00:24:15,360
Speaker 8: matter the value of the purchase. Now, it's a good idea,

492
00:24:16,040 --> 00:24:19,400
Speaker 8: I guess, in theory, But I mean you're also thinking

493
00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:22,040
Speaker 8: about all the fake claims that these companies are going

494
00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:24,600
Speaker 8: to start getting, especially around the holidays too, with people

495
00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:26,440
Speaker 8: trying to get a refund. But I'll tell you that

496
00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:28,879
Speaker 8: this is a this is a growing problem. People are

497
00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:30,040
Speaker 8: just blatant about doing it.

498
00:24:30,119 --> 00:24:30,239
Speaker 1: Now.

499
00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:32,719
Speaker 4: It's the same down here, mate, don't worry. It's it's

500
00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:34,080
Speaker 4: will wide and I thank you for your time. That

501
00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:35,879
Speaker 4: is dam Mitch Isson out of the United States of

502
00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:37,720
Speaker 4: America at the time is now sixteen to five. This

503
00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:41,800
Speaker 4: is news. I'm Andrew dickens Ayeshaverro ran all out and

504
00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:45,159
Speaker 4: accused Health Commissioner Lisa Livy of cooking the books. She

505
00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:48,400
Speaker 4: did it at a selict committee. She's said it outside

506
00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:51,080
Speaker 4: the house as well, so she's pretty confident because she's

507
00:24:51,119 --> 00:24:54,200
Speaker 4: outside of privilege to essays all of this. Barry Sopa

508
00:24:54,359 --> 00:24:56,399
Speaker 4: is with us in just a few moments time here

509
00:24:56,440 --> 00:24:57,679
Speaker 4: on newskiv.

510
00:24:57,560 --> 00:25:01,320
Speaker 2: Politics with Centric Credit, check your custom and get payment certainty.

511
00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:06,200
Speaker 4: He's talk to b It is now thirty minutes to

512
00:25:06,280 --> 00:25:06,520
Speaker 4: find it.

513
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:09,439
Speaker 12: Was stunned into silence as I walked into the studio.

514
00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:10,320
Speaker 4: This is true.

515
00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:10,960
Speaker 12: I didn't believe.

516
00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:13,040
Speaker 4: I thought there might be some wishing, big show business

517
00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:15,119
Speaker 4: thing to herold the arrival of the man who has

518
00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:19,480
Speaker 4: had not one but two lunches with Boris Johnson and

519
00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:21,359
Speaker 4: this despite what you said about him yesterday.

520
00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:24,720
Speaker 12: Well, yes, I was quite critical of Boris yes today.

521
00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:29,639
Speaker 12: And when I met him today over lunch, when he

522
00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:32,480
Speaker 12: was introduced to me, he said, oh you're you're the man.

523
00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:35,840
Speaker 12: You're the man I heard on radio yesterday talking about me.

524
00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:38,680
Speaker 12: He said people have said worse things about me. So

525
00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:42,600
Speaker 12: I thought, well yeah. And he went on around lunch

526
00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:46,560
Speaker 12: and it's Chathamhouse rules, you can't say exactly what was said.

527
00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:51,200
Speaker 12: But he did defend free speech, hates woke asm, defended

528
00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:54,520
Speaker 12: free speech and said that anybody's got an entitlement to

529
00:25:54,600 --> 00:25:58,920
Speaker 12: say anything they want about anything. But I found it

530
00:25:59,160 --> 00:26:02,800
Speaker 12: absolutely curious that a former Prime Minister of Britain would

531
00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:06,800
Speaker 12: bother tuning into radio to see what people were saying

532
00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:09,240
Speaker 12: about him. So if you're listening at the moment, Boris,

533
00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:14,680
Speaker 12: you're not a bad bugger's he was pretty good. Today's

534
00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:19,240
Speaker 12: lunch was hosted by General Finance, was around a table

535
00:26:19,800 --> 00:26:20,600
Speaker 12: and it was.

536
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:23,439
Speaker 5: Really just a yarm your cass.

537
00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:26,440
Speaker 4: How many people are fifteen to twenty other? Okay, So

538
00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:28,359
Speaker 4: this is a much bit of a different environment to

539
00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:31,240
Speaker 4: the big public one last where people bought their ticket.

540
00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:34,080
Speaker 4: This one was invitees. So did this mean there was

541
00:26:34,119 --> 00:26:36,920
Speaker 4: a different Boris that was on show, perhaps even more unfettered.

542
00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:38,800
Speaker 5: Well, he was very different.

543
00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:41,200
Speaker 12: I mean yesterday what I didn't like about it was

544
00:26:41,560 --> 00:26:44,800
Speaker 12: I said it was like watching a mowhead jersey being

545
00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:51,359
Speaker 12: unraveled because he did it and through the speech. But

546
00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:54,760
Speaker 12: it's part of the whole persona of Boris Johnson. I

547
00:26:54,840 --> 00:26:57,920
Speaker 12: mean I said yesterday that Whenston Peters cracked a great

548
00:26:58,000 --> 00:27:00,360
Speaker 12: joke saying he looked as though just for all out

549
00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:03,680
Speaker 12: of a shower and used the towel as his hair brush.

550
00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:04,800
Speaker 5: And that's what he did.

551
00:27:04,880 --> 00:27:07,879
Speaker 12: But that's part of the brand of Boris Johnson. And

552
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:10,600
Speaker 12: I've got to say now having sat down and talked

553
00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:15,160
Speaker 12: to the man, I really enjoyed his company. He's a journo,

554
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:19,120
Speaker 12: so he remembers, you know, the media. And in fact

555
00:27:19,160 --> 00:27:20,760
Speaker 12: I had an interview, as I said to him, at

556
00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:25,359
Speaker 12: the Daily Telegraph for he was at one stage a

557
00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:28,719
Speaker 12: reporter on it, and I said, I was interviewed by

558
00:27:28,760 --> 00:27:30,200
Speaker 12: a man that was a field marshal.

559
00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:35,440
Speaker 5: Remember that's really old funny, don't you So? Yeah, No,

560
00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:36,000
Speaker 5: he was.

561
00:27:36,440 --> 00:27:39,400
Speaker 12: He's very entertaining, Its very clever he talked a lot

562
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:43,000
Speaker 12: about Ukraine and it was a good backgrounder if he

563
00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:43,399
Speaker 12: wanted that.

564
00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:47,280
Speaker 4: But a massive amount of institutional knowledge from all sides

565
00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:49,760
Speaker 4: of the fence, so obviously very entertaining. Let's get into

566
00:27:49,760 --> 00:27:53,080
Speaker 4: some serious But so Asha Vero makes an accusation and

567
00:27:53,200 --> 00:27:55,800
Speaker 4: Select Committee Jimmy Markroff gets her niggers in the night

568
00:27:55,840 --> 00:27:58,320
Speaker 4: about it. She says that Lester Levy cook the books.

569
00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:01,920
Speaker 4: Now this is covered by but she since said that outside.

570
00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:04,359
Speaker 12: Well, yes, there's limited privilege when it comes to a

571
00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:09,080
Speaker 12: parliamentary Select committee anyway, but because the members of the public,

572
00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:13,800
Speaker 12: they appear before the privilegeous committee. But aischeverel, she was

573
00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:19,680
Speaker 12: asked whether they are named by Lester Levy produced a

574
00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:23,399
Speaker 12: deficit that looked like it was worse than it actually was,

575
00:28:23,640 --> 00:28:29,240
Speaker 12: and she said he had three recorded three former district

576
00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:34,080
Speaker 12: health boards, she said, where he claimed that the produced

577
00:28:34,119 --> 00:28:38,440
Speaker 12: surpluses were great and then they turned into deficits when

578
00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:43,920
Speaker 12: he left. Verell said that that was the state of

579
00:28:44,040 --> 00:28:46,880
Speaker 12: New Zealand's health system and in fact it was used

580
00:28:46,920 --> 00:28:50,880
Speaker 12: by this government to effect big cuts there. But this

581
00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:53,840
Speaker 12: is how the exchange unfolded. The Select Committee to.

582
00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:56,120
Speaker 13: Day, given your reputation for cooking the box.

583
00:28:56,360 --> 00:28:58,960
Speaker 1: Did any minister one order order?

584
00:29:03,400 --> 00:29:06,400
Speaker 5: I don't think that's appropriate to attack in that manner.

585
00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:10,000
Speaker 14: There were no deficits while I was there. The deficits

586
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:13,800
Speaker 14: that occurred when I left is when, and the record

587
00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:16,239
Speaker 14: will show this. Anyone can go have a look at

588
00:29:16,280 --> 00:29:20,320
Speaker 14: that were when provisions first started to be made for

589
00:29:20,560 --> 00:29:24,640
Speaker 14: Holiday Act. So that is incorrect. I will provide that information,

590
00:29:25,280 --> 00:29:28,000
Speaker 14: and on the provision of that information, I would preferably

591
00:29:28,080 --> 00:29:29,560
Speaker 14: love to have an apology for that.

592
00:29:30,120 --> 00:29:32,040
Speaker 4: And I can understand why, of course, of course, And

593
00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:35,200
Speaker 4: that's I can understand that excuse as well, because the

594
00:29:35,280 --> 00:29:38,760
Speaker 4: Holiday Acts and provisions for extra stuff and the pay

595
00:29:39,240 --> 00:29:41,440
Speaker 4: changes has blown all the budgets.

596
00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:43,320
Speaker 12: All over the place and it came into effect after

597
00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:44,160
Speaker 12: after he did that.

598
00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:46,640
Speaker 5: So yeah, I mean he has a good argument.

599
00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:49,960
Speaker 12: And look, the thing is that this man's integrity is

600
00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:54,480
Speaker 12: without question. I mean, he's a very renowned professor and

601
00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:58,000
Speaker 12: he's an expert, So you know, to malign him in

602
00:29:58,080 --> 00:29:59,960
Speaker 12: that way before a select committee, I think is.

603
00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:01,800
Speaker 4: But rich, do you think she should give him an

604
00:30:01,920 --> 00:30:02,080
Speaker 4: up on?

605
00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:02,880
Speaker 5: Absolutely?

606
00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:05,840
Speaker 12: Okay, Well, when she sees the evidence, and no doubt,

607
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:08,520
Speaker 12: we'll all go digging for the evidence now and when

608
00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:10,560
Speaker 12: we see it, of course he deserves an apologies.

609
00:30:10,600 --> 00:30:13,200
Speaker 4: She's here at five point thirty today on this radio show,

610
00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:15,560
Speaker 4: and maybe she'll do it that you get it there.

611
00:30:15,640 --> 00:30:17,760
Speaker 4: I reckon, I reckon now very quickly. We only have

612
00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:21,480
Speaker 4: a minute. Apparently Christmas parties in the in Wellington.

613
00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:25,960
Speaker 12: The Gritch has stolen Christmas absolutely in Wellington. And you

614
00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:28,000
Speaker 12: know it has been tough for the public service, let's

615
00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:30,520
Speaker 12: face it, but the biggest, one of the biggest ministries

616
00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:34,160
Speaker 12: are mb They've told staff, they told them last month

617
00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:38,120
Speaker 12: that they won't be providing any subsidies for an end

618
00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:41,720
Speaker 12: of the year function workers the Ministry of Housing and

619
00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:45,480
Speaker 12: Urban Development. They are also going without any Christmas cheer

620
00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:50,440
Speaker 12: this year. Customs are not arranging to fund a party,

621
00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:54,400
Speaker 12: Crown Start, Crown Law stuff. They can pay for their

622
00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:58,000
Speaker 12: own BYO when they get along to their Christmas party.

623
00:30:58,400 --> 00:31:00,720
Speaker 5: And I required as to whether we're going to have

624
00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:03,160
Speaker 5: an end of the year party, Andrew, and you'll be pleased. No,

625
00:31:03,360 --> 00:31:04,400
Speaker 5: we are, we are.

626
00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:07,520
Speaker 4: I know, godness, we're not a public service. I know

627
00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:10,080
Speaker 4: exactly right. Well, I've got I've got family in public

628
00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:13,360
Speaker 4: service and in local government. They haven't had paid for

629
00:31:13,560 --> 00:31:17,280
Speaker 4: parties in years, and they are still having parties. They

630
00:31:17,360 --> 00:31:19,560
Speaker 4: pay for it for them themselves, yep, you know. And

631
00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:22,840
Speaker 4: the managers in local government are all taking the key

632
00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:25,400
Speaker 4: staff out for dinner and they're all lunch and they're

633
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:28,800
Speaker 4: paying for it themselves, you know, because that's just the

634
00:31:28,840 --> 00:31:31,360
Speaker 4: way it is. Yes, thank you so very very much.

635
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:34,120
Speaker 4: It's news talks here, b it's coming up six minutes

636
00:31:34,320 --> 00:31:34,840
Speaker 4: to five.

637
00:31:37,520 --> 00:31:41,400
Speaker 2: Putting the tough questions to the newsmakers the mic asking breakfast.

638
00:31:41,560 --> 00:31:43,040
Speaker 15: The grand old die in Auckland is one of the

639
00:31:43,080 --> 00:31:45,840
Speaker 15: city's more disliked operations. Auckland Transport got a fair bit

640
00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:47,920
Speaker 15: of power taken off them and it will be transferred

641
00:31:47,920 --> 00:31:50,240
Speaker 15: back to the council Transport Minister Simming and Brown is

642
00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:51,800
Speaker 15: whether us would you have still done it, no matter

643
00:31:51,880 --> 00:31:53,080
Speaker 15: how good eighty were or not.

644
00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:55,120
Speaker 6: I did a key thing here is every other region

645
00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:58,960
Speaker 6: across New Zealand disciplin's around who approved the Regional Land

646
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:02,080
Speaker 6: Transport plan for road controlling authorities those decisions set with

647
00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:04,080
Speaker 6: elected members and Auckland it does not.

648
00:32:04,560 --> 00:32:05,320
Speaker 16: This is actually a.

649
00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:08,680
Speaker 6: Principal decision to restore democracy to those decisions and allow

650
00:32:08,760 --> 00:32:11,040
Speaker 6: Aucklanders if they don't like the fact that their local

651
00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:13,440
Speaker 6: board or their counselors are removing some car parks to

652
00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:15,320
Speaker 6: put in a cycle way, they can boat them out.

653
00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:17,240
Speaker 1: At the moment, they don't have that ability.

654
00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:20,360
Speaker 15: Back Tomorrow at six am, the mic asking breakfast with

655
00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:22,680
Speaker 15: the rain driver of the LAHM used talk zb.

656
00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:25,640
Speaker 4: It is coming out three minutes to five. We don't

657
00:32:25,640 --> 00:32:27,240
Speaker 4: have enough money. I mean, we just had the wall

658
00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:30,400
Speaker 4: versus nylon carpet debate at Kanga Aura, which is the

659
00:32:30,520 --> 00:32:33,040
Speaker 4: cheapest wat should we put in our houses? Even though

660
00:32:33,080 --> 00:32:35,400
Speaker 4: the wolves supports, of course our farmers. But you know,

661
00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:37,320
Speaker 4: we've got no money. We've got the money. You hear

662
00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:40,560
Speaker 4: that chant all the time. There's no money now. Peter Bochier,

663
00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:42,560
Speaker 4: the chief onwardsman, has come out and said we're not

664
00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:46,560
Speaker 4: paying the victims of state abuse enough. He's called the

665
00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:49,880
Speaker 4: rates arbitrary and the criteria to narrow. He wants them

666
00:32:49,920 --> 00:32:52,920
Speaker 4: to have more. But do we have the money? Does

667
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:55,480
Speaker 4: he even consider that anyway? Peter Boche will be joining me.

668
00:32:55,840 --> 00:32:58,440
Speaker 4: Asha Verel is joining me, of course, to talk about

669
00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:00,840
Speaker 4: how Lester Levy cooked the books, whether she's going to

670
00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:04,120
Speaker 4: apologize to him or not, and the whole heap war.

671
00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:06,920
Speaker 4: It's news Talks. I'm Andrew Dickens go on in.

672
00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:27,200
Speaker 2: The only Drive show you can trust to ask the questions,

673
00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:30,760
Speaker 2: get the answers by the facts and give the analysis.

674
00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:33,920
Speaker 2: Andrew Dickens on, hither dup to see allan drive with

675
00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:37,680
Speaker 2: one New Zealand Let's get connected news talk as sid be.

676
00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:41,720
Speaker 4: After then welcome to the program. Heather's a little bit ill,

677
00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:43,520
Speaker 4: not bad, but not good enough to come to work.

678
00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:45,520
Speaker 4: Should be here as soon as she came. The Chief

679
00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:49,320
Speaker 4: Ombardsman says the Ministry of Social Development's payment scheme for

680
00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:54,200
Speaker 4: survivors of abuse and care is unreasonable. Peter Bocha says

681
00:33:54,280 --> 00:33:58,000
Speaker 4: the rates of compensation are arbitrary and the criteria for

682
00:33:58,120 --> 00:34:01,680
Speaker 4: accepting claims are too narrow. And the finding comes after

683
00:34:01,720 --> 00:34:04,440
Speaker 4: a complaint by a law firm representing one thousand claiments

684
00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:07,120
Speaker 4: saying that the payments are just not enough. Peter Bosher now,

685
00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:08,680
Speaker 4: and Busha joins me.

686
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:11,680
Speaker 17: Now, how Peter, good afternoon to you, Andrew.

687
00:34:11,960 --> 00:34:14,680
Speaker 4: So you're saying that MSD is paying victims of state

688
00:34:14,719 --> 00:34:15,880
Speaker 4: abuse too little.

689
00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:19,520
Speaker 17: There are a number of things about the scheme, Andrew,

690
00:34:19,600 --> 00:34:22,880
Speaker 17: which are unsatisfactory. Can I quickly put a context for

691
00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:28,320
Speaker 17: your listeners. Everyone's heard of the Royal Commission of Abuse

692
00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:32,280
Speaker 17: and Care and redress that will occur to our survivors

693
00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:36,640
Speaker 17: of abuse. This relates to the period before two Thy

694
00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:41,880
Speaker 17: seventeen and MASB set up a scheme whereby ED would

695
00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:46,440
Speaker 17: offer redress to those who claimed. We've found that aspects

696
00:34:46,520 --> 00:34:51,000
Speaker 17: of this are unreasonable. The basis upon which decisions were

697
00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:55,440
Speaker 17: being approached not clear, what was being taken into account

698
00:34:55,560 --> 00:34:58,120
Speaker 17: not clear. But perhaps worst of all, Andrew and something

699
00:34:58,640 --> 00:35:01,880
Speaker 17: I'm really keen on on this role. People not getting

700
00:35:02,040 --> 00:35:06,160
Speaker 17: clear reasons for decisions and not understanding why what they

701
00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:10,200
Speaker 17: received was the amount in question. So a number of

702
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:11,400
Speaker 17: things we were unhappy.

703
00:35:11,440 --> 00:35:14,120
Speaker 4: Well, well, have you also investigated why the ministry might

704
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:19,680
Speaker 4: be actually, you know, being arbitrary and being I don't

705
00:35:19,680 --> 00:35:21,239
Speaker 4: want to say the word tight, that's a terrible way

706
00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:25,600
Speaker 4: to say, but you know why the purse strings closed?

707
00:35:25,840 --> 00:35:27,560
Speaker 4: Have you looked into why they're doing it? Can you?

708
00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:28,600
Speaker 4: Can you even answer that?

709
00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:33,279
Speaker 17: Yes, I can look look. Some schemes for redress, such

710
00:35:33,320 --> 00:35:37,960
Speaker 17: as the accident compensation scheme, are quite prescriptive and quite known,

711
00:35:38,400 --> 00:35:40,400
Speaker 17: and I think a number of people when they have

712
00:35:40,480 --> 00:35:45,120
Speaker 17: an acc situational claim have a pretty fair idea of

713
00:35:45,400 --> 00:35:48,600
Speaker 17: what's likely to happen to their claim in terms of outcomes.

714
00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:54,279
Speaker 17: The real problem here was a lack of structure in

715
00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:57,520
Speaker 17: terms of what was being considered and what might be

716
00:35:57,600 --> 00:36:00,600
Speaker 17: felt to be appropriate. So I think the best way

717
00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:03,200
Speaker 17: for me to answer your very good question is the

718
00:36:03,280 --> 00:36:07,239
Speaker 17: results were two arbitrary. I think what people want is

719
00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:10,440
Speaker 17: to know the territory into which they're heading. Here they

720
00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:14,719
Speaker 17: didn't know, and sometimes when the result came couldn't understand

721
00:36:14,840 --> 00:36:18,520
Speaker 17: why it was what it was, So just to arbitrary, really, Andrew.

722
00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:20,920
Speaker 4: Okay, sure, but of course the reaction from people who

723
00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:23,479
Speaker 4: haven't been involved in the decision is New Zealand currently

724
00:36:23,560 --> 00:36:25,239
Speaker 4: is in a bad economic state. We just don't have

725
00:36:25,400 --> 00:36:25,839
Speaker 4: more money.

726
00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:33,960
Speaker 17: The fact is that for anyone who is injured or damaged,

727
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:39,080
Speaker 17: whether it's a road accident or whether it's through state

728
00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:43,719
Speaker 17: care which has been careless and negligent, that person has

729
00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:47,800
Speaker 17: the right to have their dignity restored. The can, for instance,

730
00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:50,719
Speaker 17: go to court and see, which is a very expensive exercise,

731
00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:55,319
Speaker 17: and if they succeed, there will be meaningful redress. Look,

732
00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:59,120
Speaker 17: I'm afraid we are a society. We care for everyone.

733
00:36:59,320 --> 00:37:04,239
Speaker 17: That's what we do as a caring, civilized society where

734
00:37:04,320 --> 00:37:09,160
Speaker 17: the state has cared for someone carelessly and in for them,

735
00:37:09,440 --> 00:37:12,800
Speaker 17: the state has the responsibility to say so into front.

736
00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:14,800
Speaker 4: Up, Peter, I thank you for your time this afternoon.

737
00:37:14,840 --> 00:37:17,600
Speaker 4: Peter Boscher is the chief on Woodsman. This is Newstalks.

738
00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:21,960
Speaker 4: Who'll be it's eleven enough to find Dickens okay, horrified,

739
00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:25,520
Speaker 4: disgusted and a step backwards? Who said this? Well, the

740
00:37:25,600 --> 00:37:28,839
Speaker 4: science community, and they found out this afternoon that there's

741
00:37:28,840 --> 00:37:31,200
Speaker 4: been a decision by the government to no longer fund

742
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:35,880
Speaker 4: research into humanities and social sciences. Instead, all the science

743
00:37:35,920 --> 00:37:38,920
Speaker 4: funding will be directed to physics and chemistry and maths

744
00:37:38,960 --> 00:37:42,520
Speaker 4: and engineering and biomedical sciences, the sorts of skills that

745
00:37:42,719 --> 00:37:46,120
Speaker 4: the government says will rebuild the economy. So Nicola Gaston

746
00:37:46,320 --> 00:37:48,560
Speaker 4: is a smart person and co director of the mcdarmod's

747
00:37:48,640 --> 00:37:55,160
Speaker 4: Institute for Advanced Materials in Nanotechnology. Hello Nikola, Hello, So

748
00:37:55,800 --> 00:37:58,959
Speaker 4: are you horrified, disgusted? And is this a step backwards.

749
00:38:00,160 --> 00:38:03,480
Speaker 18: Completely? So I'll just correct you on one thing that

750
00:38:03,560 --> 00:38:06,160
Speaker 18: you said in the intro, which is that this is

751
00:38:06,239 --> 00:38:09,040
Speaker 18: not all of science funding, right. So this is the

752
00:38:09,120 --> 00:38:14,279
Speaker 18: Marsden Fund, which is the fundamental science, basic research, blue

753
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:18,080
Speaker 18: Sky's research in some terms. And there are other research

754
00:38:18,239 --> 00:38:22,520
Speaker 18: funding mechanisms for science. There is mb funding, There is

755
00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:26,319
Speaker 18: the Endeavor Fund, There is the Smart Ideas Fund. There

756
00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:30,480
Speaker 18: is also the Health Research Council funding for health specific

757
00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:34,400
Speaker 18: medical research. Right, so there's a lot out there for

758
00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:37,840
Speaker 18: science which is not the mars And Fund. The mars

759
00:38:37,960 --> 00:38:42,200
Speaker 18: And Fund is the only funding mechanism that is equitable

760
00:38:42,480 --> 00:38:47,320
Speaker 18: in the way that is distributed across research areas. And

761
00:38:47,440 --> 00:38:52,920
Speaker 18: it is equitable because it is not granted with the

762
00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:57,080
Speaker 18: intention that there should be specific impact. It's about creating

763
00:38:57,280 --> 00:39:00,360
Speaker 18: knowledge first and foremost, and so it does that in

764
00:39:00,520 --> 00:39:03,040
Speaker 18: science and social science, in the humanities as well.

765
00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:03,480
Speaker 19: I get it.

766
00:39:03,480 --> 00:39:05,440
Speaker 4: I get in the Mars and mars And Fund will

767
00:39:05,480 --> 00:39:09,200
Speaker 4: help fund physics and chemistry, maths and engineering and biomedical sciences.

768
00:39:09,680 --> 00:39:12,319
Speaker 4: Are what upside are there in the areas that they're

769
00:39:12,360 --> 00:39:14,640
Speaker 4: not going to do, such as humanities and social sciences.

770
00:39:14,719 --> 00:39:17,440
Speaker 4: In terms of you know, pure economics.

771
00:39:18,200 --> 00:39:22,600
Speaker 18: Yeah, there's oh, in the terms of pure economics. One

772
00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:26,840
Speaker 18: of the really funny things around scientific investment because funding

773
00:39:26,920 --> 00:39:30,040
Speaker 18: of science is always funding of research is always a

774
00:39:30,160 --> 00:39:33,440
Speaker 18: form of investment, right, governments do it because there is

775
00:39:33,520 --> 00:39:40,120
Speaker 18: an economic upside downstream. That's clear, it's well understood. But

776
00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:44,799
Speaker 18: the problem is that governments, the politicians in place, are

777
00:39:44,920 --> 00:39:48,760
Speaker 18: not very good at picking what actually has an economic

778
00:39:48,960 --> 00:39:53,520
Speaker 18: upside downstream. And when you're doing fundamental research, and it

779
00:39:53,600 --> 00:39:56,720
Speaker 18: doesn't matter if it's science or humanities or social science,

780
00:39:57,200 --> 00:40:02,919
Speaker 18: if you're doing fundamental research, that the economic up turn,

781
00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:08,840
Speaker 18: the economic benefit is a decade or even multiple decades away.

782
00:40:09,760 --> 00:40:11,480
Speaker 13: And so politicians are not.

783
00:40:11,640 --> 00:40:16,080
Speaker 18: The people the best second guess what this impact is

784
00:40:16,120 --> 00:40:20,040
Speaker 18: going to be. And so we tend to measure these

785
00:40:20,160 --> 00:40:25,600
Speaker 18: proposals for research by having experts in that particular field

786
00:40:26,360 --> 00:40:29,560
Speaker 18: who look at the proposal and they evaluate it on

787
00:40:29,680 --> 00:40:35,120
Speaker 18: its excellence in terms of is this likely to change

788
00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:38,239
Speaker 18: the way that we think about something that's really important?

789
00:40:39,040 --> 00:40:41,800
Speaker 18: And so it's all about knowledge generation.

790
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:45,040
Speaker 4: Okay, there was a very eloquent argument. But at the

791
00:40:45,080 --> 00:40:46,760
Speaker 4: same time, I don't know if you've noticed that everyone

792
00:40:46,840 --> 00:40:48,320
Speaker 4: has been saying we don't have money. This is this

793
00:40:48,360 --> 00:40:50,719
Speaker 4: is the theme of this afternoon program. We do not

794
00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:53,640
Speaker 4: have money. People have to be cut. Where there are

795
00:40:53,680 --> 00:40:55,440
Speaker 4: cuts happening all over the place. People are being cut

796
00:40:55,480 --> 00:40:57,960
Speaker 4: in all sorts of businesses, all sorts of services are

797
00:40:58,000 --> 00:40:59,680
Speaker 4: being cut in this case. I'm sorry.

798
00:41:00,280 --> 00:41:03,200
Speaker 20: I know this very very well.

799
00:41:03,640 --> 00:41:07,040
Speaker 18: So I'm a physicist and a physics department. I've had

800
00:41:07,200 --> 00:41:10,759
Speaker 18: colleagues who I work with very closely who's been made

801
00:41:10,800 --> 00:41:15,040
Speaker 18: redundant over the last year across our universities, across our

802
00:41:15,120 --> 00:41:19,040
Speaker 18: CRI system. I have had students who have gone overseas

803
00:41:19,120 --> 00:41:21,400
Speaker 18: because they see absolutely no prospect of a job in

804
00:41:21,480 --> 00:41:24,040
Speaker 18: New Zealand. And that's in the physical sciences. So I

805
00:41:24,320 --> 00:41:29,160
Speaker 18: understand very very well the financial constraints that we're working under.

806
00:41:29,640 --> 00:41:32,040
Speaker 18: But I work in a field of research that has

807
00:41:32,960 --> 00:41:37,680
Speaker 18: significant potential for economic impact as the Minister sees it.

808
00:41:37,880 --> 00:41:40,640
Speaker 18: Jennis Collins pointed to this in her press release today.

809
00:41:42,680 --> 00:41:46,080
Speaker 18: I lead an institute that has two hundred and forty

810
00:41:46,120 --> 00:41:50,160
Speaker 18: students at the moment across nine institutions working on these

811
00:41:50,280 --> 00:41:53,839
Speaker 18: areas of physical science research. In the last three years,

812
00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:57,160
Speaker 18: we've had eleven startup companies come out of the type

813
00:41:57,160 --> 00:41:59,759
Speaker 18: of research that we do. I have colleagues working in

814
00:42:00,040 --> 00:42:04,360
Speaker 18: based research. I have colleagues working in quantum technologies research.

815
00:42:04,840 --> 00:42:07,640
Speaker 18: I have colleagues working in clean tech research, really trying

816
00:42:07,680 --> 00:42:11,560
Speaker 18: to leverage the renewable energy resources of New Zealand for

817
00:42:11,760 --> 00:42:16,680
Speaker 18: all of our economic benefits. So I get the economic arguments,

818
00:42:16,800 --> 00:42:19,600
Speaker 18: and we are trying to do this, okay, but well

819
00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:22,000
Speaker 18: it's not something that relies.

820
00:42:21,680 --> 00:42:22,960
Speaker 17: On the physical sciences alone.

821
00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:25,360
Speaker 18: We need our colleagues and the social sciences, Nicolin, our

822
00:42:25,400 --> 00:42:26,680
Speaker 18: colleagues and the humanities as well.

823
00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:30,000
Speaker 4: Nicola, I thank you for your championing. And every issue

824
00:42:30,080 --> 00:42:31,600
Speaker 4: needs a champion, and I thank you, said very much

825
00:42:31,680 --> 00:42:34,120
Speaker 4: Nicola Gaston's point of view there, and Nicola, of course

826
00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:36,560
Speaker 4: is the co director of the McDermond Institute for Advanced

827
00:42:36,600 --> 00:42:40,160
Speaker 4: Materials at Nanotechnology. We're losing little bits here and there.

828
00:42:40,160 --> 00:42:41,560
Speaker 4: At sixteen after five.

829
00:42:44,239 --> 00:42:47,719
Speaker 1: This is news Talk, said the breaking news and the.

830
00:42:47,800 --> 00:42:52,719
Speaker 4: Yana Bow murder trial. The jury has a turned and

831
00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:57,600
Speaker 4: as found Tinging shall guilty of murdering christ Urge real

832
00:42:57,680 --> 00:43:07,160
Speaker 4: estate agent jan fey Bell. So he's guilty. It wasn't

833
00:43:07,200 --> 00:43:08,000
Speaker 4: a long deliberation.

834
00:43:08,080 --> 00:43:08,640
Speaker 5: How long was it?

835
00:43:08,719 --> 00:43:10,640
Speaker 4: Well, I think we should find out we often We're

836
00:43:10,680 --> 00:43:12,839
Speaker 4: going to talk to our reporter who is there at

837
00:43:12,880 --> 00:43:15,600
Speaker 4: the court as we speak, Emily Ansel, to find out

838
00:43:15,680 --> 00:43:18,279
Speaker 4: what has gone down in this case over the last

839
00:43:18,320 --> 00:43:24,440
Speaker 4: few minutes. Here on news Talks. Heb right here is

840
00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:27,320
Speaker 4: a rose deal that is so good we actually have

841
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Speaker 4: to keep the full details on the download tonight. It's

842
00:43:30,000 --> 00:43:33,240
Speaker 4: available online exclusively from the guys at the Good Wine Company,

843
00:43:33,680 --> 00:43:36,600
Speaker 4: and the wine is being sold as this the Mystery

844
00:43:36,760 --> 00:43:40,280
Speaker 4: Hawks Bay Rose twenty twenty two. And the wine is true.

845
00:43:40,560 --> 00:43:42,440
Speaker 4: The wine's true label is actually on the box and

846
00:43:42,480 --> 00:43:44,640
Speaker 4: the bottle. And so when you get this, when it

847
00:43:44,760 --> 00:43:47,040
Speaker 4: arrives on your doorstep, you know you unrapid and oh

848
00:43:47,120 --> 00:43:48,839
Speaker 4: you find out who it is and you are very

849
00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:53,240
Speaker 4: very very very very pleasantly surprised. This is a wine

850
00:43:53,280 --> 00:43:55,200
Speaker 4: that scored an Impressed of ninety out of one hundred

851
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Speaker 4: from Master of Wine Bob Campbell. It's a winning Top

852
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Speaker 4: Value Awards well. Bob has described it as a pale

853
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Speaker 4: pink with strawberries and cream flavors and a smooth texture,

854
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Speaker 4: a simple, nicely balanced rose with an off dry finish,

855
00:44:08,800 --> 00:44:11,680
Speaker 4: and with tough economic conditions and a slow export market,

856
00:44:11,960 --> 00:44:14,279
Speaker 4: the winery that made it has reluctantly made the call

857
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Speaker 4: to discreetly clear stocks of it at the price of

858
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Speaker 4: wait for this, ten ninety nine a bottle. That's ten

859
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Speaker 4: dollars ninety nine a bottle. It is an award winning

860
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Speaker 4: off dry Rose. You'll page as one dollar per case,

861
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Speaker 4: delivery to your door anywhere in New Zealand. Some conditions apply.

862
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Speaker 4: You can order online right now at the Goodwine dot

863
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864
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Speaker 4: double six two.

865
00:44:40,880 --> 00:44:42,200
Speaker 1: Andrew Dickens.

866
00:44:43,520 --> 00:44:46,440
Speaker 4: In the breaking news the Yumphai Boo murder trial, the

867
00:44:46,560 --> 00:44:50,399
Speaker 4: jury found Tingjung Cutch Owl guilty of murdering Christ Church

868
00:44:50,440 --> 00:44:54,240
Speaker 4: real estate agent Yumfae Bell and our reporter Emily Ansel

869
00:44:54,680 --> 00:44:57,000
Speaker 4: was there and has been there for the past few weeks. Emily, Hello,

870
00:44:57,120 --> 00:44:57,680
Speaker 4: great drama.

871
00:44:57,920 --> 00:45:00,319
Speaker 20: Hello Hello, how's it going good?

872
00:45:00,680 --> 00:45:04,040
Speaker 4: It was not a long deliberation, not in the end.

873
00:45:04,040 --> 00:45:07,319
Speaker 20: There was speculations liberations would be on the shorter side

874
00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:10,480
Speaker 20: from those convinced by the Crown's argument, believing their case was,

875
00:45:10,680 --> 00:45:14,360
Speaker 20: as Crown lawyers put it, a slam dunk, and in total,

876
00:45:14,440 --> 00:45:17,239
Speaker 20: deliberations took just over an hour and a half from

877
00:45:17,360 --> 00:45:18,160
Speaker 20: late this afternoon.

878
00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:21,560
Speaker 4: Of course, he represented himself. How did he react?

879
00:45:22,880 --> 00:45:25,279
Speaker 20: Yeah, he did represent himself. He chose to do that

880
00:45:25,480 --> 00:45:29,000
Speaker 20: quite early on. I've definitely seen him far more animated

881
00:45:29,320 --> 00:45:32,560
Speaker 20: and frustrated and angry throughout this process compared to how

882
00:45:32,640 --> 00:45:35,920
Speaker 20: he reacted. He he left as he walked in this afternoon,

883
00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:38,279
Speaker 20: with his hands behind his back, his head slightly down.

884
00:45:38,960 --> 00:45:42,200
Speaker 20: He seemed silent. He seemed to calm, my meaning and

885
00:45:42,400 --> 00:45:47,680
Speaker 20: quiet throughout the jury reading out their verdict. The court

886
00:45:47,800 --> 00:45:51,600
Speaker 20: was silent too, however, Boo's partner, while he kept a

887
00:45:51,640 --> 00:45:54,960
Speaker 20: straight face in it, initially he did call out, as

888
00:45:55,280 --> 00:45:57,400
Speaker 20: charl left, you might want to get a refund of

889
00:45:57,600 --> 00:46:01,440
Speaker 20: for that plane ticket, scumbag, before he broke down silently

890
00:46:01,840 --> 00:46:03,640
Speaker 20: being comforted by the man sitting next to him and

891
00:46:03,680 --> 00:46:04,359
Speaker 20: those around him.

892
00:46:04,920 --> 00:46:09,840
Speaker 4: It certainly seemed like a crazy defense, and can we

893
00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:11,480
Speaker 4: ask was the man all there.

894
00:46:12,840 --> 00:46:13,000
Speaker 1: Right?

895
00:46:13,120 --> 00:46:16,239
Speaker 20: So his defense was one that those around me say

896
00:46:16,280 --> 00:46:20,759
Speaker 20: they hadn't seen necessarily those reporters have been, especially to

897
00:46:21,040 --> 00:46:25,320
Speaker 20: a few trials themselves. His defense was essentially that the

898
00:46:25,480 --> 00:46:28,399
Speaker 20: Crown and police had made up the evidence, that most

899
00:46:28,480 --> 00:46:31,680
Speaker 20: of the evidence was falsified and fake. He sometimes accused

900
00:46:31,719 --> 00:46:36,040
Speaker 20: police of planting evidence themselves. He also said that his

901
00:46:36,280 --> 00:46:38,520
Speaker 20: actions on the day were largely to do with this

902
00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:41,800
Speaker 20: man named mister Toungue, who we hadn't heard from until

903
00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:45,520
Speaker 20: about until quite late in the trial. Apparently mister Tongue

904
00:46:45,600 --> 00:46:47,680
Speaker 20: was sort of directing him around christ Church by a

905
00:46:47,719 --> 00:46:50,279
Speaker 20: walkie talkie on where to go to find a job,

906
00:46:50,440 --> 00:46:53,200
Speaker 20: and that Tongue had drove his car foxshoes to do

907
00:46:53,400 --> 00:46:55,319
Speaker 20: so had been he was the one who had been

908
00:46:55,400 --> 00:46:59,680
Speaker 20: seen cleaning his car, and that you know, Chow himself

909
00:46:59,760 --> 00:47:03,399
Speaker 20: never actually saw miss Bow at the property in which

910
00:47:03,440 --> 00:47:06,040
Speaker 20: he was accused of attacking her and then killing her

911
00:47:06,120 --> 00:47:06,719
Speaker 20: later that day.

912
00:47:07,280 --> 00:47:10,439
Speaker 4: Wow, strange, but it sounds like justice has been done.

913
00:47:10,600 --> 00:47:13,440
Speaker 4: So what's next sentencing? When's that schedule for?

914
00:47:15,200 --> 00:47:18,720
Speaker 20: So he has been remanded in custody until next March,

915
00:47:19,600 --> 00:47:21,320
Speaker 20: and that is we will just have to wait and

916
00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:24,279
Speaker 20: see to see what the judge decides on that. The now,

917
00:47:24,320 --> 00:47:26,279
Speaker 20: the sort of six and a half week trial was

918
00:47:26,280 --> 00:47:29,520
Speaker 20: supposed to be six is now over, which I'm sure

919
00:47:29,560 --> 00:47:32,000
Speaker 20: will be a relief to the jury, to lawyers, and

920
00:47:32,160 --> 00:47:34,240
Speaker 20: to those loved ones of Missyiantepal.

921
00:47:34,400 --> 00:47:35,839
Speaker 4: And how much of it did you get to see?

922
00:47:37,640 --> 00:47:39,400
Speaker 20: I was here for most of it. I think there

923
00:47:39,480 --> 00:47:41,640
Speaker 20: was about a week where I wasn't in court, But

924
00:47:41,760 --> 00:47:44,560
Speaker 20: I have been here throughout. I was actually there when

925
00:47:45,239 --> 00:47:46,960
Speaker 20: she went missing, and so I've been following it for

926
00:47:47,040 --> 00:47:49,279
Speaker 20: a long time. So it is a relief. I guessed

927
00:47:49,320 --> 00:47:52,000
Speaker 20: to see this wrapped up, but yeah, we'll be waiting

928
00:47:52,080 --> 00:47:53,920
Speaker 20: to see what happened next year.

929
00:47:54,120 --> 00:47:55,920
Speaker 4: Good work, Emily, write the book and I thank you

930
00:47:56,000 --> 00:47:58,000
Speaker 4: so much for your time. It is now five twenty four.

931
00:47:58,120 --> 00:48:01,319
Speaker 4: News Talks hereb the name you trust.

932
00:48:01,160 --> 00:48:02,440
Speaker 1: To get the answers you need.

933
00:48:02,680 --> 00:48:05,879
Speaker 2: Andrew dickens On, Heather duple c Allen drive with One

934
00:48:05,960 --> 00:48:08,920
Speaker 2: New Zealand let's get connected and news talk as they'd be.

935
00:48:09,320 --> 00:48:11,000
Speaker 4: This is five twenty seven. So we talked to Nikola

936
00:48:11,080 --> 00:48:14,240
Speaker 4: cars Gaston, who's the co director of the mcdarmood Institute

937
00:48:14,239 --> 00:48:17,240
Speaker 4: for Advanced Materials and Nanotechnology, all about the Marsden Fund,

938
00:48:18,000 --> 00:48:20,759
Speaker 4: which is science funding and it has been decided that

939
00:48:20,840 --> 00:48:23,440
Speaker 4: the funding will be directed to physics, chemistry, maths, engineering

940
00:48:23,480 --> 00:48:28,960
Speaker 4: and biomedical sciences and not towards the humanities and social sciences.

941
00:48:29,360 --> 00:48:33,200
Speaker 4: So big reaction next written. Nicola was very eloquent as

942
00:48:33,280 --> 00:48:35,960
Speaker 4: she was, but she made the most salient point. Yes

943
00:48:36,040 --> 00:48:38,120
Speaker 4: she did. I heard it too, and that is that

944
00:48:38,239 --> 00:48:41,960
Speaker 4: the governments are not good at picking scientific winners long term.

945
00:48:42,600 --> 00:48:45,439
Speaker 4: And this is true and this has been always David

946
00:48:45,480 --> 00:48:47,960
Speaker 4: Semow's point about some of this corporate welfare that the

947
00:48:48,000 --> 00:48:51,960
Speaker 4: picking of winners by government's not great. Therefore, argues Nick,

948
00:48:52,040 --> 00:48:54,800
Speaker 4: why should the public person fund such risky investments in

949
00:48:54,880 --> 00:48:57,800
Speaker 4: science activity that may not ever return value to the

950
00:48:57,840 --> 00:49:00,879
Speaker 4: public that's paying for it at this time? Maybe it's

951
00:49:00,880 --> 00:49:02,719
Speaker 4: best to leave that to private investment to take the

952
00:49:02,800 --> 00:49:06,640
Speaker 4: risk and reap any future reward. Fair point. And here's

953
00:49:06,640 --> 00:49:09,760
Speaker 4: another one from a fellow who is a retired chemistry teacher,

954
00:49:09,840 --> 00:49:12,640
Speaker 4: so you'd think he'd have something to say. Totally agrees

955
00:49:12,680 --> 00:49:15,000
Speaker 4: with the government policy on what it will fund in science.

956
00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:19,720
Speaker 4: Science has to be reproducible and certain until proven in exact.

957
00:49:20,200 --> 00:49:23,320
Speaker 4: This does not apply to humanities. If you know the

958
00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:26,600
Speaker 4: opinions of the researcher, you can probably predict their findings.

959
00:49:26,640 --> 00:49:28,680
Speaker 4: That's a very good point, Toning. And certainly some of

960
00:49:28,719 --> 00:49:31,400
Speaker 4: that mars and funds was used to study tinder, And

961
00:49:31,560 --> 00:49:33,920
Speaker 4: really is that helping? Is that helping our economy?

962
00:49:34,239 --> 00:49:34,719
Speaker 5: I don't know.

963
00:49:35,280 --> 00:49:37,840
Speaker 4: Well, it depends whether an economist finds love through tinder

964
00:49:37,920 --> 00:49:41,680
Speaker 4: or not. I guess I don't know. Aysha Verel says

965
00:49:41,840 --> 00:49:46,160
Speaker 4: that less Levy, cooked books, lester demands and apology, we

966
00:49:46,280 --> 00:49:50,319
Speaker 4: can't have duels. That's unfortunate, but we do have Asia on.

967
00:49:50,480 --> 00:49:53,000
Speaker 2: Your smart speaker, on the iHeart app and in your

968
00:49:53,040 --> 00:49:56,239
Speaker 2: car on your drive home it's Andrew Dickens on hither

969
00:49:56,360 --> 00:49:58,880
Speaker 2: duplicy Alan drive with one New Zealand.

970
00:49:59,040 --> 00:50:03,319
Speaker 1: Let's get connected a news talk as they'd be. You'll

971
00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:10,600
Speaker 1: meet together and to day whence kiss.

972
00:50:13,760 --> 00:50:21,880
Speaker 4: The Knollida welcoming into the program. It's summer went on

973
00:50:21,920 --> 00:50:24,239
Speaker 4: the west coast, but pretty warm everywhere else. It is

974
00:50:24,480 --> 00:50:27,040
Speaker 4: twenty three minutes to six. We got the huddle coming

975
00:50:27,080 --> 00:50:29,680
Speaker 4: up very shortly. We're going to be joined by Ryan

976
00:50:29,719 --> 00:50:32,320
Speaker 4: Bridge from the early addition, but also Mark Sainsbury. Have

977
00:50:32,360 --> 00:50:35,239
Speaker 4: it talked to Mark for Ages and Mark Sainsbury Extra

978
00:50:35,600 --> 00:50:38,200
Speaker 4: seven sharp will be joining us in about five or

979
00:50:38,239 --> 00:50:41,680
Speaker 4: six minutes. Citi is now twenty three to six. Right,

980
00:50:42,239 --> 00:50:44,960
Speaker 4: this is a big thing. Health Commissioner Leicester Levy has

981
00:50:45,040 --> 00:50:49,240
Speaker 4: demanded an apology from Labour MP Aisha Verel at Select

982
00:50:49,280 --> 00:50:52,120
Speaker 4: Committee today. What happened well, Leicester was fronting up to

983
00:50:52,120 --> 00:50:54,360
Speaker 4: the Select Committee as part of Scrutiny week. He was

984
00:50:54,440 --> 00:50:57,640
Speaker 4: talking about Health New Zealand's finances and then I show

985
00:50:57,719 --> 00:50:59,600
Speaker 4: got up and did some of the old cross examining

986
00:50:59,680 --> 00:51:02,760
Speaker 4: thing and that got less than a few Government MPs

987
00:51:03,000 --> 00:51:05,480
Speaker 4: quite riled up because this is what she said.

988
00:51:05,520 --> 00:51:08,480
Speaker 13: Doctor Levy, given your reputation for cooking the box, did

989
00:51:08,600 --> 00:51:10,280
Speaker 13: any minister order.

990
00:51:15,360 --> 00:51:18,360
Speaker 5: I don't think that's appropriate to attack in that manner.

991
00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:22,399
Speaker 4: Well, Asa Verel joins us, Now, how are you good evening?

992
00:51:22,480 --> 00:51:22,760
Speaker 13: Andrew?

993
00:51:23,040 --> 00:51:25,200
Speaker 4: It's pretty full on, isn't it. And one which you

994
00:51:25,280 --> 00:51:28,280
Speaker 4: repeated without privilege is the limited privilege in this sect committee.

995
00:51:28,320 --> 00:51:29,919
Speaker 4: But you've said it outside as well, so you're pretty

996
00:51:29,920 --> 00:51:31,800
Speaker 4: confident you're telling the truth. But it's pretty full on.

997
00:51:32,640 --> 00:51:32,799
Speaker 21: Well.

998
00:51:32,880 --> 00:51:35,720
Speaker 13: The important issue here is that the Order to General

999
00:51:35,880 --> 00:51:40,800
Speaker 13: has identified two transactions and two reversals that have to

1000
00:51:40,840 --> 00:51:43,880
Speaker 13: be made to help New Zealanders. New Zealand's accounts that

1001
00:51:44,000 --> 00:51:47,800
Speaker 13: show that they had tried to put costs into the

1002
00:51:47,880 --> 00:51:50,440
Speaker 13: past financial years and that would have the result of

1003
00:51:50,520 --> 00:51:54,440
Speaker 13: making that look worse and have it and make the

1004
00:51:54,840 --> 00:51:57,960
Speaker 13: next financial year look better. And the reason this matters

1005
00:51:58,120 --> 00:52:01,280
Speaker 13: is because New Zealanders have been told that health services

1006
00:52:01,400 --> 00:52:03,759
Speaker 13: need to health budgets and services need to be cut

1007
00:52:04,400 --> 00:52:06,560
Speaker 13: because Health New Zealands and a deficit. Well, we found

1008
00:52:06,560 --> 00:52:10,200
Speaker 13: out over two hundred million of that deficit is due

1009
00:52:10,239 --> 00:52:13,520
Speaker 13: to these unusual accounting treatments. So that's actually what we

1010
00:52:13,640 --> 00:52:15,040
Speaker 13: went into the Selectimittee today.

1011
00:52:15,280 --> 00:52:19,120
Speaker 4: Still cook the books suggest criminal activity. That's a heavy.

1012
00:52:18,880 --> 00:52:22,760
Speaker 13: Fat rubbish Andrew, that's actually rubbish. That's not a crime.

1013
00:52:23,200 --> 00:52:24,600
Speaker 13: What it says is that there's.

1014
00:52:24,680 --> 00:52:28,800
Speaker 4: Using I said, the phrase cook in the books is

1015
00:52:28,880 --> 00:52:30,160
Speaker 4: what you say to fusters.

1016
00:52:31,000 --> 00:52:35,080
Speaker 13: No, it could be that these accounts had been presented

1017
00:52:35,280 --> 00:52:37,440
Speaker 13: in a way that's non conventional. That's what cooked the

1018
00:52:37,440 --> 00:52:40,640
Speaker 13: books means, and that's exactly what I'm saying. This is

1019
00:52:40,719 --> 00:52:43,640
Speaker 13: pretty fishy. You have this process which is being used

1020
00:52:43,680 --> 00:52:47,040
Speaker 13: tostify healthcares, where the Order to General said the accountman

1021
00:52:47,120 --> 00:52:51,160
Speaker 13: treatment is not right. We also had the Chief Financial

1022
00:52:51,200 --> 00:52:54,239
Speaker 13: Office of Health New Zealand having her job changed and

1023
00:52:54,320 --> 00:52:56,480
Speaker 13: she had to leave. Plus we had most of the

1024
00:52:56,560 --> 00:53:00,520
Speaker 13: people in finance at Health New Zealand non disclosure. This

1025
00:53:00,840 --> 00:53:03,359
Speaker 13: is very strange. It needs to be explained a lot

1026
00:53:03,360 --> 00:53:03,520
Speaker 13: of this.

1027
00:53:03,640 --> 00:53:05,840
Speaker 4: Of course very hard for many people to actually comprem ahend.

1028
00:53:05,920 --> 00:53:08,040
Speaker 4: But can I just suggest that what you're suggesting is

1029
00:53:08,080 --> 00:53:10,200
Speaker 4: that when mister Levy was in charge of DHBs, he

1030
00:53:10,239 --> 00:53:12,600
Speaker 4: made the accounts look better, and now that he's in

1031
00:53:12,680 --> 00:53:14,640
Speaker 4: charge of Health New Zealand, he's making the accounts look

1032
00:53:14,680 --> 00:53:16,400
Speaker 4: worse well that.

1033
00:53:17,160 --> 00:53:21,680
Speaker 13: What I read to least levy around that the treatment

1034
00:53:21,760 --> 00:53:25,000
Speaker 13: of DHDS was a quote already in the public donate it.

1035
00:53:25,520 --> 00:53:27,399
Speaker 4: So I get the impression here.

1036
00:53:28,600 --> 00:53:32,359
Speaker 13: Back in June, the government told the country that there

1037
00:53:32,400 --> 00:53:34,440
Speaker 13: was a massive deficit at health in New Zealand and

1038
00:53:34,560 --> 00:53:36,960
Speaker 13: that a commissioner is being brought in, and that said

1039
00:53:37,000 --> 00:53:39,480
Speaker 13: and train a series of cuts to health services, that

1040
00:53:39,640 --> 00:53:42,480
Speaker 13: have nurses on strike, that have people being told that

1041
00:53:42,560 --> 00:53:45,279
Speaker 13: they can't even get on wasting lists, and all of

1042
00:53:45,360 --> 00:53:48,399
Speaker 13: this is because of the finances. So of course it's

1043
00:53:48,440 --> 00:53:51,680
Speaker 13: incredibly important that we understand the finances. And this is

1044
00:53:51,719 --> 00:53:54,759
Speaker 13: the point the Bembs regularity that it is totally my

1045
00:53:54,920 --> 00:53:56,160
Speaker 13: job as a parliamentarian.

1046
00:53:56,320 --> 00:53:58,360
Speaker 4: I get the impression of them. I shall get the

1047
00:53:58,360 --> 00:53:59,759
Speaker 4: impression you're not going to apologize.

1048
00:54:01,160 --> 00:54:07,719
Speaker 13: Well, the I'm not going to apologize. When the Health

1049
00:54:07,800 --> 00:54:11,320
Speaker 13: New Zealand accounts land in Parliament on the day of

1050
00:54:11,360 --> 00:54:15,719
Speaker 13: scrutiny week, when every other Crown entity has them in

1051
00:54:15,840 --> 00:54:19,799
Speaker 13: Parliament beforehand, it does seem like they are a repeated opportunity,

1052
00:54:20,520 --> 00:54:23,040
Speaker 13: a repeated measures taken by the government to make sure

1053
00:54:23,120 --> 00:54:25,880
Speaker 13: we don't have the information we need to get to

1054
00:54:25,960 --> 00:54:28,759
Speaker 13: the bottom of these very important questions for the New

1055
00:54:28,840 --> 00:54:32,160
Speaker 13: Zealand public. But if you go to if you go

1056
00:54:32,320 --> 00:54:34,960
Speaker 13: to work to leave, the r outlined a very different

1057
00:54:35,000 --> 00:54:37,279
Speaker 13: process to the chair of the Selectility. We'll see what

1058
00:54:37,360 --> 00:54:37,759
Speaker 13: comes with that.

1059
00:54:37,960 --> 00:54:40,279
Speaker 4: You've also accused leader of manufacturing a crisis, but the

1060
00:54:40,320 --> 00:54:42,440
Speaker 4: thing is he was brought into actually fix a crisis.

1061
00:54:42,480 --> 00:54:44,440
Speaker 4: He can't manufacture the crisis when he wasn't there to

1062
00:54:44,480 --> 00:54:45,759
Speaker 4: manufacturer in the first place.

1063
00:54:45,800 --> 00:54:48,640
Speaker 13: There are times of a manufactured crisis across the country.

1064
00:54:49,120 --> 00:54:50,960
Speaker 13: You look at the fact that the government claimed that

1065
00:54:51,000 --> 00:54:53,120
Speaker 13: there was a three billion dollar cost of need in

1066
00:54:53,200 --> 00:54:56,800
Speaker 13: hospital and then they've never actually provided the unreducted documents

1067
00:54:56,840 --> 00:54:59,359
Speaker 13: to prove that's the case. You look at what they've done,

1068
00:54:59,400 --> 00:55:01,880
Speaker 13: what the Health ca Zealand accounts, which are just detailed.

1069
00:55:01,960 --> 00:55:04,520
Speaker 13: They said it was going to be a one what

1070
00:55:04,680 --> 00:55:06,560
Speaker 13: was it a one point four and then a one

1071
00:55:06,600 --> 00:55:09,400
Speaker 13: point eight billion dollar deficit and neither of those figures

1072
00:55:09,400 --> 00:55:13,480
Speaker 13: are any longer on the count aunt and they were

1073
00:55:13,520 --> 00:55:16,560
Speaker 13: two hundred million dollars out. All of these things are

1074
00:55:16,600 --> 00:55:20,400
Speaker 13: being used to justify cats the services that all ordinary

1075
00:55:20,480 --> 00:55:23,840
Speaker 13: New Zealanders need and deserve. That is exactly what a

1076
00:55:23,920 --> 00:55:25,360
Speaker 13: manufactured crisis.

1077
00:55:25,040 --> 00:55:29,040
Speaker 4: Is okay, but using such inflammatory language completely diverts the

1078
00:55:29,160 --> 00:55:31,800
Speaker 4: attention away from the issues that you are talking about.

1079
00:55:31,880 --> 00:55:37,800
Speaker 13: Now, Andrew, that's a robust radio show. It's routine on

1080
00:55:37,880 --> 00:55:40,600
Speaker 13: this show that you hold people to account. Are we

1081
00:55:40,719 --> 00:55:44,480
Speaker 13: really saying in New Zealand it's too tough to say

1082
00:55:44,520 --> 00:55:47,640
Speaker 13: to a public official cock the box? Is that really

1083
00:55:47,719 --> 00:55:51,319
Speaker 13: the case? Because that seems to be incredibly fragile if you.

1084
00:55:51,320 --> 00:55:53,960
Speaker 4: Look up cook the books and the Oxford dictionaraders associated

1085
00:55:54,000 --> 00:55:56,719
Speaker 4: with illegal fraudulent behavior, and it wouldn't be surprised if

1086
00:55:56,719 --> 00:55:58,960
Speaker 4: thisster Levy wanted to take a defamation case against you.

1087
00:56:01,239 --> 00:56:05,560
Speaker 4: Yet all he asked for was an apology. Well nice,

1088
00:56:05,640 --> 00:56:07,320
Speaker 4: You're going to go around telling people their crooks the

1089
00:56:07,360 --> 00:56:09,480
Speaker 4: whole time. Are they ever going to do anything great?

1090
00:56:09,719 --> 00:56:09,879
Speaker 19: Yeah?

1091
00:56:11,000 --> 00:56:14,439
Speaker 13: So I think that that's not the point. I asked

1092
00:56:14,480 --> 00:56:17,359
Speaker 13: him a fair enough question about the treatment of health

1093
00:56:17,440 --> 00:56:20,520
Speaker 13: New Zealand accounts, and the fact is that what was

1094
00:56:20,600 --> 00:56:23,959
Speaker 13: presented to our committee last and September, a week after

1095
00:56:24,000 --> 00:56:27,239
Speaker 13: he appeared, I might add, is very different and that

1096
00:56:27,360 --> 00:56:29,879
Speaker 13: tells a very different story. I think it's totally fair

1097
00:56:30,200 --> 00:56:32,400
Speaker 13: for us to hold people to account on this very.

1098
00:56:32,280 --> 00:56:34,600
Speaker 4: Good and I thank you for your time today. Thank you,

1099
00:56:35,200 --> 00:56:37,560
Speaker 4: Hi Severil, who is not going to say sorry.

1100
00:56:38,640 --> 00:56:39,040
Speaker 13: We've got a.

1101
00:56:39,239 --> 00:56:43,440
Speaker 2: Huddle with New Zealand Southby's international realty, local and global

1102
00:56:43,520 --> 00:56:45,000
Speaker 2: exposure like no other.

1103
00:56:45,440 --> 00:56:50,480
Speaker 4: So on the huddle we have Ryan Bridge, who's still awake.

1104
00:56:52,320 --> 00:56:54,400
Speaker 4: Good evening, Thank you to be very good man, and

1105
00:56:54,560 --> 00:56:57,319
Speaker 4: of course Mark Sainsbury as well, broadcaster, welcome back back,

1106
00:56:57,920 --> 00:56:59,919
Speaker 4: get a andry what you're doing these days?

1107
00:57:01,200 --> 00:57:04,600
Speaker 21: Well, well, bits and pieces. I still do a lot

1108
00:57:04,640 --> 00:57:06,439
Speaker 21: of well used to do a lot of event work

1109
00:57:07,120 --> 00:57:09,279
Speaker 21: and a bit of media advice, so.

1110
00:57:09,600 --> 00:57:12,800
Speaker 4: You can I just ask the question, is the media?

1111
00:57:12,880 --> 00:57:15,560
Speaker 4: So obviously you're preparing to actually become mayor of Willington,

1112
00:57:15,640 --> 00:57:21,280
Speaker 4: is okay? Now look, gentlemen, you have just heard a

1113
00:57:21,400 --> 00:57:23,840
Speaker 4: severel and the Battle against Leicster Levy, And as I

1114
00:57:23,880 --> 00:57:25,680
Speaker 4: said beforehand, you know, gosh, don't you wish we had

1115
00:57:25,680 --> 00:57:27,360
Speaker 4: a duel and we could actually do ten pieces and

1116
00:57:27,440 --> 00:57:29,840
Speaker 4: you know see what happens next. What did you make

1117
00:57:29,920 --> 00:57:30,400
Speaker 4: of that run?

1118
00:57:32,240 --> 00:57:34,800
Speaker 7: Well, it's scrutiny, wheat and shock horror.

1119
00:57:34,840 --> 00:57:35,840
Speaker 19: There's a bit of scrutiny.

1120
00:57:36,120 --> 00:57:39,360
Speaker 7: I mean the problem I sort of agree with what

1121
00:57:39,560 --> 00:57:41,880
Speaker 7: Isshaba was saying towards the end of that interview, like,

1122
00:57:41,960 --> 00:57:45,160
Speaker 7: are we being a bit precious with the whole use

1123
00:57:45,240 --> 00:57:48,640
Speaker 7: of that phrase? But it's kind of it's the right

1124
00:57:48,720 --> 00:57:50,640
Speaker 7: issue to wrong approach. I think for her, she's at

1125
00:57:50,720 --> 00:57:53,120
Speaker 7: risk of looking like she's playing the man and not

1126
00:57:53,240 --> 00:57:55,560
Speaker 7: the ball. And she didn't need to bring up the

1127
00:57:55,680 --> 00:57:57,880
Speaker 7: past because she said it was a history of cooking

1128
00:57:57,960 --> 00:58:00,880
Speaker 7: the books. She's got a smoking gun in the newsroom

1129
00:58:00,960 --> 00:58:03,680
Speaker 7: reporting from today that there was this financial trickery that

1130
00:58:03,800 --> 00:58:06,560
Speaker 7: they were trying to do, trying to switch the cost

1131
00:58:06,680 --> 00:58:09,640
Speaker 7: for some years, attribute them to others. There was a whistleblower.

1132
00:58:10,040 --> 00:58:12,800
Speaker 7: The order to general says you can't do that. There's

1133
00:58:12,840 --> 00:58:16,360
Speaker 7: your spoken gumb that's your amo for your session. No

1134
00:58:16,560 --> 00:58:19,880
Speaker 7: need to raise the passing discretion. So I think right issue,

1135
00:58:20,200 --> 00:58:23,440
Speaker 7: probably wrong approach because the headline now looks like you

1136
00:58:23,520 --> 00:58:24,760
Speaker 7: know ver all ghosts there.

1137
00:58:25,000 --> 00:58:26,760
Speaker 4: Well, that's right, and that's is Zach how I treated

1138
00:58:26,880 --> 00:58:29,040
Speaker 4: the interview. That you went so ballistic that you're taking

1139
00:58:29,120 --> 00:58:32,240
Speaker 4: all all detension off your message.

1140
00:58:32,320 --> 00:58:32,520
Speaker 18: Mark.

1141
00:58:33,680 --> 00:58:36,000
Speaker 21: Yeah, look, I'm a bit I'm a bit with Brian

1142
00:58:36,080 --> 00:58:37,800
Speaker 21: on this one. I mean, in one, in one sense,

1143
00:58:37,840 --> 00:58:39,400
Speaker 21: you could sort of say, oh, look you know that's

1144
00:58:39,720 --> 00:58:42,040
Speaker 21: is this a fametory calling someone the cooking the books.

1145
00:58:42,080 --> 00:58:42,640
Speaker 19: Lest the leave.

1146
00:58:42,680 --> 00:58:45,320
Speaker 21: He's been round a long time and he's suffered the

1147
00:58:45,360 --> 00:58:47,560
Speaker 21: slings and arrows at most places.

1148
00:58:47,600 --> 00:58:48,240
Speaker 19: That he's gone.

1149
00:58:48,760 --> 00:58:51,560
Speaker 21: So yeah, I mean, you look at those select committee

1150
00:58:51,600 --> 00:58:54,040
Speaker 21: processes in the UK, you know, once we had murd

1151
00:58:54,120 --> 00:58:56,040
Speaker 21: up get the pie in the face. I reckon, they're

1152
00:58:56,080 --> 00:58:59,680
Speaker 21: great and it's a great forum to have a look

1153
00:58:59,720 --> 00:59:01,600
Speaker 21: at things. So I think there's a bit of both.

1154
00:59:01,640 --> 00:59:03,560
Speaker 21: I think, yes, she probably could have been more had

1155
00:59:03,560 --> 00:59:06,200
Speaker 21: a more fruitful attack taking it from another way, but

1156
00:59:06,440 --> 00:59:07,840
Speaker 21: you know, it's not the end of the world. And

1157
00:59:08,000 --> 00:59:10,160
Speaker 21: boy boy, I mean I've heard worse things thrown around

1158
00:59:10,200 --> 00:59:10,920
Speaker 21: in that place.

1159
00:59:12,240 --> 00:59:12,480
Speaker 19: Than that.

1160
00:59:13,000 --> 00:59:15,080
Speaker 4: Absolutely, gentlemen, it's lovely to have you on the program.

1161
00:59:15,160 --> 00:59:16,600
Speaker 4: We're back in just a few months time and it's

1162
00:59:16,640 --> 00:59:17,560
Speaker 4: fourteen to six.

1163
00:59:20,080 --> 00:59:23,720
Speaker 2: The Huddle with New Zealand Southeby's International Realty Elevate the

1164
00:59:23,840 --> 00:59:25,120
Speaker 2: Marketing of your Home.

1165
00:59:25,520 --> 00:59:28,280
Speaker 4: Mark Jamesbury and Ryan Bridge on the Huddle today. Mark,

1166
00:59:28,280 --> 00:59:31,120
Speaker 4: can I ask you, are you a Nylon man or

1167
00:59:31,200 --> 00:59:33,479
Speaker 4: a wool man when it comes to a KO home?

1168
00:59:34,360 --> 00:59:35,720
Speaker 19: Oh, definitely definitely.

1169
00:59:35,840 --> 00:59:36,120
Speaker 16: Wolf.

1170
00:59:36,680 --> 00:59:39,080
Speaker 4: What if I think, you know, what if it's more expensive.

1171
00:59:40,040 --> 00:59:42,120
Speaker 19: Well, see this this thing has to be a trade off.

1172
00:59:42,200 --> 00:59:45,080
Speaker 21: Iign Lander years ago they refurbished the beehive, they discovered

1173
00:59:45,360 --> 00:59:47,720
Speaker 21: all the veneer that used has sort of come from

1174
00:59:47,880 --> 00:59:51,360
Speaker 21: some endangered forest in Indonesia or somewhere, you know, with

1175
00:59:51,480 --> 00:59:53,080
Speaker 21: ire supposed to and they had to sort of rip

1176
00:59:53,160 --> 00:59:54,720
Speaker 21: it all out and do it again. Becau, they're supposed

1177
00:59:54,720 --> 00:59:57,880
Speaker 21: to also show an example. And if you're tunning government departments,

1178
00:59:57,960 --> 01:00:01,520
Speaker 21: try and look support our industry support products. You know,

1179
01:00:01,640 --> 01:00:04,320
Speaker 21: I think there should be a buying guy from supporting

1180
01:00:04,400 --> 01:00:07,560
Speaker 21: New Zealand supplies wherever possible. And I think in the

1181
01:00:08,320 --> 01:00:10,440
Speaker 21: wool in the street needs us much support and get

1182
01:00:10,480 --> 01:00:12,000
Speaker 21: and it's a fantastic product.

1183
01:00:12,320 --> 01:00:13,120
Speaker 4: Yeah, I agree.

1184
01:00:13,120 --> 01:00:13,439
Speaker 19: I agree.

1185
01:00:13,480 --> 01:00:15,200
Speaker 4: Well, look they say it's going to be thirty four

1186
01:00:15,200 --> 01:00:17,480
Speaker 4: percent more expensive to put it in wool. But then

1187
01:00:17,480 --> 01:00:20,200
Speaker 4: the brimwidth guy and the carpet milk guy have come

1188
01:00:20,240 --> 01:00:21,840
Speaker 4: out and said they didn't even ask us. And you know,

1189
01:00:22,040 --> 01:00:24,600
Speaker 4: we see so little of this carpet Ryan that that

1190
01:00:25,040 --> 01:00:27,520
Speaker 4: we could have sharpened the pencil and be more than competitive.

1191
01:00:28,320 --> 01:00:28,520
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1192
01:00:28,800 --> 01:00:31,360
Speaker 7: I think hold fire for a one to eighty U

1193
01:00:31,520 --> 01:00:34,800
Speaker 7: turn on this one. Mark Patterson, the associate Agriculture Minister

1194
01:00:34,960 --> 01:00:37,240
Speaker 7: sounds like he's going to do some tweaking to the

1195
01:00:37,320 --> 01:00:40,280
Speaker 7: procurement rules and they'll reverse it. I mean, when else

1196
01:00:40,360 --> 01:00:44,880
Speaker 7: do you get farmers, the Greens, Winston Peters all sitting

1197
01:00:44,960 --> 01:00:48,760
Speaker 7: down holding handsinging kumbaya on the same issue. And it's

1198
01:00:48,840 --> 01:00:51,240
Speaker 7: in the coalition agreement with New Zealand First as well.

1199
01:00:51,520 --> 01:00:54,320
Speaker 7: There is a tabat on that agreement where it says

1200
01:00:54,480 --> 01:00:57,040
Speaker 7: we're practical, and you could argue that maybe with that

1201
01:00:57,240 --> 01:01:00,200
Speaker 7: cost in seventy five thousand honds, it's not practical. But

1202
01:01:00,400 --> 01:01:01,720
Speaker 7: I think they're going to go back to the drawing

1203
01:01:01,760 --> 01:01:03,640
Speaker 7: board and they're going to come back and they're going

1204
01:01:03,720 --> 01:01:04,480
Speaker 7: to one eight.

1205
01:01:05,120 --> 01:01:08,600
Speaker 4: Right, Well, okay, we'll see. Ryan. You're right, it's part

1206
01:01:08,600 --> 01:01:10,720
Speaker 4: of the New Zealand First coalition agreement. But at the

1207
01:01:10,800 --> 01:01:15,360
Speaker 4: same time, you know, doing preferential deals for corporates would

1208
01:01:15,400 --> 01:01:17,680
Speaker 4: not be what ACT believes in, So the other coalition

1209
01:01:17,760 --> 01:01:19,680
Speaker 4: partner we'll be saying, no, that's corporate welfare.

1210
01:01:20,880 --> 01:01:21,080
Speaker 9: Yeah.

1211
01:01:21,400 --> 01:01:23,960
Speaker 7: The most interesting part of the story, I think is

1212
01:01:24,440 --> 01:01:27,600
Speaker 7: the wording in the document. I mean, why not even

1213
01:01:27,760 --> 01:01:33,160
Speaker 7: allow the wool industry to apply to be a for

1214
01:01:33,240 --> 01:01:35,600
Speaker 7: the contract. Of course, it is specifically no, Well, I

1215
01:01:35,680 --> 01:01:39,440
Speaker 7: mean they might discount their products and beat the nylon price.

1216
01:01:39,560 --> 01:01:40,960
Speaker 19: You know, why not let them try.

1217
01:01:41,280 --> 01:01:42,440
Speaker 5: That doesn't make sense to me.

1218
01:01:42,600 --> 01:01:44,360
Speaker 4: I think it was a low level functionary who just

1219
01:01:44,440 --> 01:01:46,160
Speaker 4: made a decision based on a gut feeling.

1220
01:01:47,040 --> 01:01:48,360
Speaker 19: You record, Andrew.

1221
01:01:48,480 --> 01:01:50,160
Speaker 21: They could have said, you guys are telling us to

1222
01:01:50,240 --> 01:01:54,280
Speaker 21: save money everywhere. Well snuffed you in your preference cheap adoption.

1223
01:01:54,440 --> 01:01:55,120
Speaker 19: Then you can wear it.

1224
01:01:55,440 --> 01:01:57,640
Speaker 4: Okay, we're talking about the lack of money. Of course,

1225
01:01:57,680 --> 01:02:02,200
Speaker 4: we have the reports through the public sector. Christmas parties

1226
01:02:02,200 --> 01:02:04,400
Speaker 4: are going to be pretty sad that nobody's actually having one.

1227
01:02:04,440 --> 01:02:06,320
Speaker 4: They can't afford to have one, and they're not even

1228
01:02:06,360 --> 01:02:08,040
Speaker 4: going to have one and pay for it themselves. So

1229
01:02:08,760 --> 01:02:12,440
Speaker 4: do you feel any sympathy, Mark, Yeah.

1230
01:02:12,280 --> 01:02:13,040
Speaker 19: Look I do.

1231
01:02:13,240 --> 01:02:14,880
Speaker 21: But look I can remember back in the days when

1232
01:02:15,200 --> 01:02:17,919
Speaker 21: you know you're working at tv ins. The Christmas party

1233
01:02:18,000 --> 01:02:20,720
Speaker 21: is greatly reduced over time, but it used to be

1234
01:02:20,800 --> 01:02:21,200
Speaker 21: when you're.

1235
01:02:21,120 --> 01:02:23,240
Speaker 19: Working some of the Christmas party is something you affward

1236
01:02:23,280 --> 01:02:24,720
Speaker 19: to all year. That's gone.

1237
01:02:24,880 --> 01:02:27,160
Speaker 21: I mean those days are gone when they started asking

1238
01:02:27,240 --> 01:02:30,600
Speaker 21: people to pay for it. You organize it yourself, you

1239
01:02:30,680 --> 01:02:33,800
Speaker 21: get a better do. But you know, once again, you're

1240
01:02:33,840 --> 01:02:35,800
Speaker 21: in a public service. You're just laid off sort of

1241
01:02:35,920 --> 01:02:38,760
Speaker 21: whatever percentage of your work colleagues are down the road.

1242
01:02:39,360 --> 01:02:41,240
Speaker 21: It's not a great look to be seen in spending

1243
01:02:41,320 --> 01:02:42,360
Speaker 21: money on a Christmas.

1244
01:02:42,080 --> 01:02:44,560
Speaker 4: Okay, well here here's another point of it is well

1245
01:02:44,640 --> 01:02:47,120
Speaker 4: known the public service pay packets are actually lower than

1246
01:02:47,160 --> 01:02:49,960
Speaker 4: private areas. So you've taken you've taken a hit in

1247
01:02:50,040 --> 01:02:53,320
Speaker 4: your personal money to actually help the world, Ryan and

1248
01:02:53,440 --> 01:02:55,800
Speaker 4: to help the country, and they don't even say thank

1249
01:02:55,840 --> 01:02:57,440
Speaker 4: you by buying you a couple of chardies.

1250
01:02:58,680 --> 01:03:01,600
Speaker 7: No, these bureaucrats don't bother turning up for work these days.

1251
01:03:02,600 --> 01:03:05,440
Speaker 7: They instead of working from home, they can party from

1252
01:03:05,480 --> 01:03:07,640
Speaker 7: home and they can do it on their own dime.

1253
01:03:08,360 --> 01:03:11,360
Speaker 7: I'm not having I did feel bad actually reading the

1254
01:03:11,440 --> 01:03:14,120
Speaker 7: story said that there was it spoke about Crown Law.

1255
01:03:14,240 --> 01:03:17,720
Speaker 7: I think it was there's a Crown Law Social Committee

1256
01:03:17,880 --> 01:03:21,520
Speaker 7: fund raising group. Yes, I mean how that just sounds sad,

1257
01:03:21,600 --> 01:03:24,360
Speaker 7: doesn't it. Imagine someone going around doing a sausage or

1258
01:03:24,880 --> 01:03:26,240
Speaker 7: happening around.

1259
01:03:28,680 --> 01:03:30,880
Speaker 4: Can I just say the city council has been doing

1260
01:03:30,920 --> 01:03:33,160
Speaker 4: that forever because they don't fund that sort of stuff,

1261
01:03:33,200 --> 01:03:35,440
Speaker 4: and you've got all their managers. If they're going to

1262
01:03:35,440 --> 01:03:37,320
Speaker 4: say thank you, they pay for their own pocket.

1263
01:03:38,120 --> 01:03:38,360
Speaker 19: I did.

1264
01:03:38,520 --> 01:03:41,360
Speaker 21: Let's create some envy here you guys having a Christmas

1265
01:03:41,400 --> 01:03:42,080
Speaker 21: were of course we are.

1266
01:03:42,880 --> 01:03:43,720
Speaker 9: Do you have to pay?

1267
01:03:44,720 --> 01:03:47,200
Speaker 19: No any jobs going?

1268
01:03:49,680 --> 01:03:53,720
Speaker 4: You can enter Ryan, Ryan took the job. Mate, you

1269
01:03:53,760 --> 01:03:54,600
Speaker 4: should have applied. Thank you.

1270
01:03:55,240 --> 01:03:55,840
Speaker 6: You must be the.

1271
01:03:55,840 --> 01:03:59,400
Speaker 19: Only guys running a bready. Well you know successful.

1272
01:03:59,400 --> 01:04:01,720
Speaker 4: Successful have you ever?

1273
01:04:01,920 --> 01:04:02,080
Speaker 10: Have you?

1274
01:04:02,320 --> 01:04:04,720
Speaker 4: Mark Sainsbury? You call yourself a broadcaster. You've never heard

1275
01:04:04,760 --> 01:04:05,400
Speaker 4: of the word contra?

1276
01:04:06,640 --> 01:04:09,560
Speaker 19: Yeah? Yes, well, in fact we used to do that

1277
01:04:09,720 --> 01:04:10,040
Speaker 19: in there.

1278
01:04:10,560 --> 01:04:14,320
Speaker 4: We don't know, sirch what stays and broadcasting stays and

1279
01:04:14,880 --> 01:04:17,000
Speaker 4: stays and broadcasting you know what I mean? Thank you gentlemen,

1280
01:04:17,280 --> 01:04:19,960
Speaker 4: Ryan Bridge, Mark Sainsbury. This is news talks in b.

1281
01:04:22,200 --> 01:04:24,960
Speaker 2: Red or Blue, Trump or Harris? Who will win the

1282
01:04:25,040 --> 01:04:28,520
Speaker 2: battleground states? The latest on the US election. It's Heather

1283
01:04:28,680 --> 01:04:33,000
Speaker 2: Duplicy Alan drive with one New Zealand. Let's get connected talk.

1284
01:04:35,280 --> 01:04:37,560
Speaker 4: All right, we're in this business. We talk a lot

1285
01:04:37,600 --> 01:04:41,440
Speaker 4: about optics. Optics are very very important things. You know,

1286
01:04:41,560 --> 01:04:44,000
Speaker 4: you can do something that is you think right, but

1287
01:04:44,080 --> 01:04:46,280
Speaker 4: if it looks bad, it looks bad, and then sudden

1288
01:04:46,440 --> 01:04:50,000
Speaker 4: things go a bit funny. So let's talk about Aischeverril

1289
01:04:50,280 --> 01:04:54,160
Speaker 4: and the optics of he cooked the books, as someone

1290
01:04:54,240 --> 01:04:57,400
Speaker 4: said as a finance professional, cooking the books as a

1291
01:04:57,520 --> 01:05:03,200
Speaker 4: profoundly insulting phrase and implies malfeasants. She knows exactly what

1292
01:05:03,400 --> 01:05:06,000
Speaker 4: she said, and that was the point of my interview

1293
01:05:06,040 --> 01:05:09,040
Speaker 4: with Aisher. She knew exactly what she meant by that,

1294
01:05:09,720 --> 01:05:11,480
Speaker 4: and it took away from the Actually, I wasn't there

1295
01:05:11,520 --> 01:05:14,880
Speaker 4: to argue about whether the books work were wrong or

1296
01:05:15,000 --> 01:05:17,040
Speaker 4: right or where we're at. I was there to talk

1297
01:05:17,040 --> 01:05:19,640
Speaker 4: about her behavior in this select committee and the ways

1298
01:05:19,680 --> 01:05:21,760
Speaker 4: she said cook the books. Sue says that was a

1299
01:05:21,760 --> 01:05:25,000
Speaker 4: good interview because Aischer was showing herself to be unprofessional.

1300
01:05:25,400 --> 01:05:27,600
Speaker 4: She did a low blow in politics. She knew what

1301
01:05:27,680 --> 01:05:30,200
Speaker 4: cooked the Books meant and it is a serious accusation

1302
01:05:31,120 --> 01:05:36,000
Speaker 4: and she kept with it. Speaking of optics, we have

1303
01:05:36,120 --> 01:05:40,000
Speaker 4: two high profile presenters departing Television New Zealand. It's just

1304
01:05:40,080 --> 01:05:42,880
Speaker 4: been announced the presenters to go, and we know the

1305
01:05:42,920 --> 01:05:45,360
Speaker 4: problems that TV instead are going through right now, our

1306
01:05:45,440 --> 01:05:50,240
Speaker 4: breakfast co hosts Ada Burns Francis and also sports presenter

1307
01:05:50,560 --> 01:05:55,320
Speaker 4: Haley Holt leaving as the broadcaster looks to show presenters.

1308
01:05:55,720 --> 01:06:00,200
Speaker 4: Both those women are currently absent from work on the

1309
01:06:00,280 --> 01:06:03,280
Speaker 4: Trinity leave and how would you feel if you were

1310
01:06:03,320 --> 01:06:05,439
Speaker 4: a woman working for TV and Z right now seeing

1311
01:06:05,480 --> 01:06:08,880
Speaker 4: how they were being treated at that moment. So when

1312
01:06:08,920 --> 01:06:10,880
Speaker 4: I talk about optics, there's a bit of bad optics

1313
01:06:10,920 --> 01:06:14,360
Speaker 4: as well. But that's what's happened in these hard times.

1314
01:06:15,520 --> 01:06:18,880
Speaker 4: All right, coming up we mean business between six and seven.

1315
01:06:19,240 --> 01:06:22,120
Speaker 4: Guess what international students are on the rise big time.

1316
01:06:22,440 --> 01:06:25,600
Speaker 4: We're nearly up to pre COVID levels. Remember the money

1317
01:06:25,640 --> 01:06:28,080
Speaker 4: they brought to CBDs. So we'll talk about that round

1318
01:06:28,080 --> 01:06:31,040
Speaker 4: about six thirty five. Next Todd McLay about what are

1319
01:06:31,040 --> 01:06:32,919
Speaker 4: we going to do about all these pine trees taking

1320
01:06:33,000 --> 01:06:34,920
Speaker 4: good lands? This is New Stalks EB.

1321
01:06:38,960 --> 01:06:43,640
Speaker 2: If we're Business meets Insight the Business Hour with Andrew

1322
01:06:43,680 --> 01:06:46,880
Speaker 2: Dickens and my Hr on New Stalks at B.

1323
01:06:49,600 --> 01:06:51,680
Speaker 4: Thanks, good evening and welcome to the program. It is

1324
01:06:51,720 --> 01:06:54,720
Speaker 4: now seper but it's after sex. So let's talk about

1325
01:06:54,800 --> 01:06:57,840
Speaker 4: converting farmland into forestry. The government has brought in new

1326
01:06:57,960 --> 01:07:00,800
Speaker 4: rules to stop so much farmland being converted into that

1327
01:07:00,960 --> 01:07:03,440
Speaker 4: forestry land. It's now going to be more difficult to

1328
01:07:03,480 --> 01:07:08,520
Speaker 4: get exotic forest planted on the most productive land, going

1329
01:07:08,560 --> 01:07:11,080
Speaker 4: to become difficult to get it into the emissions trading scheme.

1330
01:07:11,440 --> 01:07:14,360
Speaker 4: So Tom McClay is balancing two of his ministerial hats

1331
01:07:14,400 --> 01:07:16,520
Speaker 4: on his head at once for this announcement, and the

1332
01:07:16,600 --> 01:07:24,120
Speaker 4: Minister of Agriculture and also the Minister of Forestry jointing. Now, hello,

1333
01:07:24,200 --> 01:07:27,640
Speaker 4: Minister Andrew, good afternoon. What are you actually changing? How

1334
01:07:27,680 --> 01:07:28,200
Speaker 4: have you done this?

1335
01:07:29,280 --> 01:07:31,240
Speaker 22: Yeah, well, this is something we campaigned on, it was

1336
01:07:31,280 --> 01:07:34,120
Speaker 22: policy before the election when we're in opposition, and we've

1337
01:07:34,240 --> 01:07:35,920
Speaker 22: just taken the year to make sure we can get

1338
01:07:36,000 --> 01:07:39,439
Speaker 22: the detail right so there's no unintended consequences. What we're

1339
01:07:39,440 --> 01:07:42,720
Speaker 22: saying is for our most productive food producing land that

1340
01:07:42,880 --> 01:07:46,120
Speaker 22: has a classification sort of a one through five think

1341
01:07:46,200 --> 01:07:50,960
Speaker 22: of dairy and horticulture land, things like that, we're putting

1342
01:07:50,960 --> 01:07:53,800
Speaker 22: a moratorium in place so there can be no full

1343
01:07:53,920 --> 01:07:57,760
Speaker 22: farm full farm to forest conversion, but we are allowing

1344
01:07:57,920 --> 01:08:00,240
Speaker 22: farmers to convert up to twenty five percent of their

1345
01:08:00,280 --> 01:08:02,560
Speaker 22: own land to go into the missions trading scheme should

1346
01:08:02,600 --> 01:08:05,160
Speaker 22: they wish, because you know there is a role for that,

1347
01:08:05,320 --> 01:08:08,040
Speaker 22: particularly in areas that they think should have trees rather

1348
01:08:08,120 --> 01:08:11,000
Speaker 22: than perhaps be farming on Luck six land, which is

1349
01:08:11,080 --> 01:08:14,680
Speaker 22: some of the quite hilly sheep type land where we're

1350
01:08:14,720 --> 01:08:18,040
Speaker 22: putting in place a quota or a cap of fifteen

1351
01:08:18,200 --> 01:08:23,160
Speaker 22: thousand hectares per year, which can be converted outside of

1352
01:08:23,200 --> 01:08:24,960
Speaker 22: that any other types of land, a land that's not

1353
01:08:25,080 --> 01:08:28,040
Speaker 22: actively farmed, there will be no change to the rules.

1354
01:08:28,560 --> 01:08:30,640
Speaker 22: And we're also looking at any land that has a

1355
01:08:30,720 --> 01:08:34,320
Speaker 22: treaty obligation on it. It's MARI multiple owned land would

1356
01:08:34,479 --> 01:08:36,040
Speaker 22: be Aside from that, does.

1357
01:08:35,960 --> 01:08:38,880
Speaker 4: This classification Do these categories already exist or are you

1358
01:08:38,960 --> 01:08:40,559
Speaker 4: going to have to do a survey of New Zealand

1359
01:08:40,600 --> 01:08:43,439
Speaker 4: land to classify it all and say that's good, that's

1360
01:08:43,479 --> 01:08:44,519
Speaker 4: really good, that's rubbish.

1361
01:08:45,479 --> 01:08:48,839
Speaker 22: No, it already exists and it is already used by council,

1362
01:08:48,960 --> 01:08:50,880
Speaker 22: so it does exist. But one of the things we're

1363
01:08:50,920 --> 01:08:53,839
Speaker 22: also saying is that where a landowner or a farmer

1364
01:08:54,560 --> 01:08:58,880
Speaker 22: thinks that the classification that a council has may not

1365
01:08:59,000 --> 01:09:02,559
Speaker 22: be correct, they can ask for reassessed at a farm level.

1366
01:09:03,120 --> 01:09:06,439
Speaker 22: We're also being very clear that we're not taking away

1367
01:09:06,640 --> 01:09:08,800
Speaker 22: the ability for people to do things where they've already

1368
01:09:08,840 --> 01:09:11,760
Speaker 22: made a decision. So any decision that somebody has to

1369
01:09:11,760 --> 01:09:14,439
Speaker 22: have invested where they have already or can demonstrate an

1370
01:09:14,479 --> 01:09:17,320
Speaker 22: intention to be able to, you know, to want to

1371
01:09:17,520 --> 01:09:20,880
Speaker 22: go and plant trees. Up to today, they're able to

1372
01:09:21,000 --> 01:09:24,040
Speaker 22: continue to but the you know, the decision will take

1373
01:09:24,080 --> 01:09:27,040
Speaker 22: effect from today onwards once a law comes into place.

1374
01:09:27,080 --> 01:09:29,080
Speaker 4: Well, it's their land, it's their choice, isn't it. There

1375
01:09:29,160 --> 01:09:31,080
Speaker 4: is a freedom of doing what you want with your

1376
01:09:31,120 --> 01:09:31,599
Speaker 4: own property.

1377
01:09:32,560 --> 01:09:33,960
Speaker 19: Yeah, that's that's exactly right.

1378
01:09:34,000 --> 01:09:36,080
Speaker 22: But what we are finding is that because of the

1379
01:09:36,120 --> 01:09:39,519
Speaker 22: emission trading scheme and an expectation of that the carbon

1380
01:09:39,600 --> 01:09:43,240
Speaker 22: price will go up over time, that investors.

1381
01:09:42,760 --> 01:09:45,479
Speaker 19: Are looking to do things with land they wouldn't otherwise.

1382
01:09:45,680 --> 01:09:48,080
Speaker 19: But I do agree with you. If a landowner wants

1383
01:09:48,120 --> 01:09:51,479
Speaker 19: to plant trees on their farm and not going to

1384
01:09:51,520 --> 01:09:54,840
Speaker 19: the mission's trading scheme, our announcement today will have no

1385
01:09:54,920 --> 01:09:56,400
Speaker 19: effect upon that, they're able to do so.

1386
01:09:56,640 --> 01:10:00,280
Speaker 4: So this moratorium on certain bands for etes cre and

1387
01:10:00,320 --> 01:10:03,400
Speaker 4: all that, how much how much would it decrease the

1388
01:10:03,479 --> 01:10:06,080
Speaker 4: amount of forestation of productive land?

1389
01:10:06,760 --> 01:10:09,280
Speaker 22: Well, there are estimates from Beef and Lamb and others

1390
01:10:09,360 --> 01:10:11,200
Speaker 22: that over the last six to seven years about two

1391
01:10:11,280 --> 01:10:15,519
Speaker 22: hundred and sixty thousand hectares of land forests farmland has

1392
01:10:15,600 --> 01:10:18,360
Speaker 22: been converted into trees for the emissions trading scheme.

1393
01:10:18,840 --> 01:10:21,960
Speaker 19: A lot of that is the luck six land are

1394
01:10:22,080 --> 01:10:23,519
Speaker 19: less four one through five.

1395
01:10:23,560 --> 01:10:25,439
Speaker 22: Although I've just been with the Prime ministers out in

1396
01:10:25,520 --> 01:10:29,320
Speaker 22: Southland where some dairy farms have been purchased to be converted,

1397
01:10:29,640 --> 01:10:31,960
Speaker 22: and that's because the people purshoning that believes I'll make

1398
01:10:32,000 --> 01:10:34,200
Speaker 22: more money out of those carbon credits and they will

1399
01:10:34,800 --> 01:10:38,280
Speaker 22: milking cows. And so what we have seen over the

1400
01:10:38,360 --> 01:10:40,200
Speaker 22: last three or four years or towards the end of

1401
01:10:40,280 --> 01:10:43,960
Speaker 22: the Labor government a very fast, deep escalation of purchasers

1402
01:10:44,040 --> 01:10:45,479
Speaker 22: of farmland to go into trees.

1403
01:10:45,760 --> 01:10:48,040
Speaker 19: So this will slow that down. That doesn't stop it.

1404
01:10:48,400 --> 01:10:49,280
Speaker 19: That slows it down.

1405
01:10:49,479 --> 01:10:52,240
Speaker 22: There is a very important role for pine trees and

1406
01:10:52,320 --> 01:10:54,760
Speaker 22: other types of trees to play, not only in the

1407
01:10:54,840 --> 01:10:58,479
Speaker 22: economy but also to meet our carbon reduction obligations. We

1408
01:10:58,600 --> 01:11:00,599
Speaker 22: just want to get that balance right and some rule

1409
01:11:00,720 --> 01:11:04,240
Speaker 22: so you know, the highly productive land that produces the

1410
01:11:04,320 --> 01:11:07,680
Speaker 22: food in the export doesn't get taken away to the

1411
01:11:07,720 --> 01:11:08,479
Speaker 22: grid has been.

1412
01:11:08,640 --> 01:11:10,240
Speaker 4: And we'll see it as well. But you know, at

1413
01:11:10,280 --> 01:11:12,880
Speaker 4: the same time, do you honestly believe that the planting

1414
01:11:12,920 --> 01:11:15,960
Speaker 4: of trees is actively decreasing climate change?

1415
01:11:17,240 --> 01:11:19,920
Speaker 19: Well, it's sequest as carbon is the point, and we

1416
01:11:20,040 --> 01:11:23,400
Speaker 19: have an obligation in to nationally to reduce That was

1417
01:11:23,560 --> 01:11:24,080
Speaker 19: the question.

1418
01:11:24,040 --> 01:11:26,040
Speaker 4: Do you believe it? Do you believe it works well?

1419
01:11:26,240 --> 01:11:30,200
Speaker 19: Because well, the answer is yes. The answer is yes,

1420
01:11:30,280 --> 01:11:30,439
Speaker 19: I do.

1421
01:11:30,600 --> 01:11:34,120
Speaker 22: Because if you get to a net zero situation where

1422
01:11:34,439 --> 01:11:38,440
Speaker 22: the amount you're emitting, the carbon you're emitting is sequested elsewhere,

1423
01:11:39,040 --> 01:11:40,799
Speaker 22: then actually you can stop warning.

1424
01:11:41,439 --> 01:11:43,720
Speaker 19: We'll have a bit more to talk about that over

1425
01:11:43,760 --> 01:11:45,080
Speaker 19: the next few days and some other.

1426
01:11:45,080 --> 01:11:48,760
Speaker 22: Areas where we have policy we're developing where we want

1427
01:11:48,800 --> 01:11:50,960
Speaker 22: to part with the Provo sixs of plant trees on

1428
01:11:51,160 --> 01:11:55,599
Speaker 22: crown land that has very low conservation of farming value.

1429
01:11:55,760 --> 01:11:56,720
Speaker 19: But the answer is yes.

1430
01:11:56,800 --> 01:11:59,640
Speaker 22: It is shown around the world that actually you can

1431
01:11:59,720 --> 01:12:03,680
Speaker 22: plant Teresa supquested of carbon that mitigates where you may

1432
01:12:03,680 --> 01:12:05,479
Speaker 22: be emitting carbon somewhere else in the economy.

1433
01:12:05,600 --> 01:12:07,320
Speaker 4: Very good, and we need to remember that there's an

1434
01:12:07,320 --> 01:12:09,439
Speaker 4: awful lot of unproductive land in New Zealand. There's only

1435
01:12:09,479 --> 01:12:12,040
Speaker 4: a very small amount that is actually the primo land,

1436
01:12:12,160 --> 01:12:14,600
Speaker 4: and so we do have upside on there. I know

1437
01:12:14,760 --> 01:12:19,559
Speaker 4: you've also announced our methane admissions targets. What are they

1438
01:12:19,600 --> 01:12:20,280
Speaker 4: and how are we going to meet?

1439
01:12:21,920 --> 01:12:24,879
Speaker 22: Well, no, we haven't announced the targets. What we committed

1440
01:12:25,040 --> 01:12:28,400
Speaker 22: for the election was an independent scientific review of a

1441
01:12:28,479 --> 01:12:32,439
Speaker 22: biogenic methane so methane from animals against additional warming. We

1442
01:12:32,520 --> 01:12:34,960
Speaker 22: set up an independent panel of experts from New Zealand

1443
01:12:35,000 --> 01:12:37,160
Speaker 22: and around the world to give government advice.

1444
01:12:37,240 --> 01:12:39,000
Speaker 19: We've published that advice today.

1445
01:12:39,600 --> 01:12:41,840
Speaker 22: The Climate Change Commission also is about to publish some

1446
01:12:41,960 --> 01:12:44,240
Speaker 22: advice as well. We're going to take some time to

1447
01:12:44,840 --> 01:12:47,360
Speaker 22: consider both of these pieces of advice and during the

1448
01:12:47,400 --> 01:12:49,280
Speaker 22: course of next year we'll come up with a target

1449
01:12:49,360 --> 01:12:53,720
Speaker 22: for agriculture. Currently in legislation, agriculture has to reduce its

1450
01:12:53,720 --> 01:12:58,479
Speaker 22: omissions methane emissions by twenty four to forty twenty fifty

1451
01:12:59,200 --> 01:13:02,040
Speaker 22: what the pendent to review has said, so that there

1452
01:13:02,040 --> 01:13:05,080
Speaker 22: would be no additional warming and to meet our international obligations,

1453
01:13:05,640 --> 01:13:09,519
Speaker 22: a reduction of twenty four percent by twenty fifty would

1454
01:13:09,560 --> 01:13:11,600
Speaker 22: be required. But we're going to take some time to

1455
01:13:11,680 --> 01:13:15,240
Speaker 22: consider that before the Climate Change Minister has the legislative

1456
01:13:15,280 --> 01:13:18,600
Speaker 22: responsibility and Cabinet will make a decision on exactly what

1457
01:13:18,720 --> 01:13:20,160
Speaker 22: the target for agriculture should be.

1458
01:13:20,960 --> 01:13:24,120
Speaker 4: Well, a very comprehensive answer of a very complicated business,

1459
01:13:24,160 --> 01:13:26,720
Speaker 4: and I thank you so much, Tom McLay, Minister of

1460
01:13:26,920 --> 01:13:28,600
Speaker 4: lots of Stuff that I thank you very much. It

1461
01:13:28,720 --> 01:13:31,200
Speaker 4: is now fourteen minutes after six, but here's one in

1462
01:13:31,280 --> 01:13:33,680
Speaker 4: text Cavin during it, I didn't ask the question. It

1463
01:13:33,840 --> 01:13:35,640
Speaker 4: wasn't what was on the table, but it is a

1464
01:13:35,680 --> 01:13:38,080
Speaker 4: good question, Andrew. Will there be a cap for productive

1465
01:13:38,160 --> 01:13:41,800
Speaker 4: land going into housing, which is certainly a big issue

1466
01:13:42,040 --> 01:13:45,679
Speaker 4: book a co. Immediately somebody says, that's a bigger issue

1467
01:13:45,720 --> 01:13:48,439
Speaker 4: on our best land. Well, yeah, maybe maybe not. In

1468
01:13:48,520 --> 01:13:50,080
Speaker 4: a few moments time, we're going to talk about the

1469
01:13:50,120 --> 01:13:53,640
Speaker 4: government's plans to reduce the amount that employees can be

1470
01:13:53,760 --> 01:13:57,840
Speaker 4: compensated by their employers, in some cases to zero. I

1471
01:13:57,920 --> 01:13:59,920
Speaker 4: know you're interested. It's next here on news storks he.

1472
01:14:00,120 --> 01:14:04,040
Speaker 2: Be analysis from the experts, bringing you everything you need

1473
01:14:04,120 --> 01:14:06,880
Speaker 2: to know on the US election. It's the Business Hour

1474
01:14:07,000 --> 01:14:10,640
Speaker 2: with Heather Duplicy, Allen and my Hr Ehr solution for

1475
01:14:10,800 --> 01:14:12,400
Speaker 2: busy SMEs news talks.

1476
01:14:12,439 --> 01:14:12,720
Speaker 1: They'd be.

1477
01:14:15,160 --> 01:14:18,680
Speaker 4: There's an interesting one news talk SEB. The government has

1478
01:14:18,800 --> 01:14:22,600
Speaker 4: unveiled plans to reduce the amount aggrieved employees can be

1479
01:14:22,680 --> 01:14:27,160
Speaker 4: compensated by their employees to zero in some cases. All right,

1480
01:14:27,240 --> 01:14:29,400
Speaker 4: so this is a change, you know, to the Employment

1481
01:14:29,479 --> 01:14:32,160
Speaker 4: Relations Act. Brook van Velden is driving this. She's the

1482
01:14:32,200 --> 01:14:38,120
Speaker 4: workplace relations. She has the worry that employees are incentivized

1483
01:14:38,479 --> 01:14:42,320
Speaker 4: to and I quote, try their luck with a personal

1484
01:14:42,439 --> 01:14:46,639
Speaker 4: grievance in the hope of getting a payout. So Genative

1485
01:14:46,720 --> 01:14:49,719
Speaker 4: Shrenni is The Herald's Wellington business Editorncy's been looking.

1486
01:14:49,600 --> 01:14:50,040
Speaker 5: At the story.

1487
01:14:50,080 --> 01:14:53,560
Speaker 4: Hello, hi Andrew, how are you doing very good? So

1488
01:14:53,960 --> 01:14:57,000
Speaker 4: to zero? So, so the minister is wanting to reduce

1489
01:14:57,040 --> 01:14:59,720
Speaker 4: the money that an employee can get. But what if

1490
01:14:59,760 --> 01:15:03,519
Speaker 4: the complaint has been upheld, you know, and BORI decided

1491
01:15:03,560 --> 01:15:05,720
Speaker 4: it's zero. Do they not get money even though their

1492
01:15:05,760 --> 01:15:07,360
Speaker 4: complaint has been upheld? This seems weird.

1493
01:15:08,200 --> 01:15:11,360
Speaker 23: Yeah, that's right. So basically, if you're an employee, you

1494
01:15:11,520 --> 01:15:15,200
Speaker 23: can take your employer to the employment relations authority or

1495
01:15:15,240 --> 01:15:18,240
Speaker 23: the employment court and you can bring forward a personal grievance.

1496
01:15:18,280 --> 01:15:21,160
Speaker 23: So that's if you think you've been unfairly dismissed or

1497
01:15:22,040 --> 01:15:24,400
Speaker 23: you know, harassed or humiliated or something like that in

1498
01:15:24,439 --> 01:15:28,600
Speaker 23: the workplace, you can take your complaint forward. Now, the

1499
01:15:29,320 --> 01:15:32,120
Speaker 23: authority or the court could uphold your complaint. They could

1500
01:15:32,120 --> 01:15:34,240
Speaker 23: say yes to nay, that's fine. You know you have

1501
01:15:34,479 --> 01:15:37,960
Speaker 23: been treated badly by your employer. But what Brooke van

1502
01:15:38,080 --> 01:15:41,360
Speaker 23: Valden is saying is that she reckons the authority and

1503
01:15:41,439 --> 01:15:44,479
Speaker 23: the court should be able to discount the amount that

1504
01:15:44,560 --> 01:15:47,280
Speaker 23: you get paid out if you've actually done something bad

1505
01:15:47,320 --> 01:15:49,840
Speaker 23: as well in the process. So currently that's the case.

1506
01:15:49,920 --> 01:15:55,240
Speaker 23: Let's say I'm dismissed because I perform really poorly. Currently

1507
01:15:55,520 --> 01:15:56,920
Speaker 23: they can say, well, you're not going to get the

1508
01:15:56,960 --> 01:16:00,760
Speaker 23: full payout because you actually haven't been a very good employee.

1509
01:16:01,400 --> 01:16:03,400
Speaker 23: What she's saying is that if you've done something really

1510
01:16:03,479 --> 01:16:07,800
Speaker 23: bad like stolen or hurt somebody, your employer doesn't need

1511
01:16:07,880 --> 01:16:11,080
Speaker 23: to pay you out at all. So the authority in

1512
01:16:11,120 --> 01:16:14,080
Speaker 23: the court can say, yes, actually you're you know, you've

1513
01:16:14,120 --> 01:16:18,920
Speaker 23: been unfairly dismissed, but you've acted so badly your employer

1514
01:16:19,000 --> 01:16:20,160
Speaker 23: doesn't need to pay you anything.

1515
01:16:20,680 --> 01:16:24,160
Speaker 4: So as the idea will she have to will have

1516
01:16:24,360 --> 01:16:29,960
Speaker 4: to therefore schedule all the various complaints that employee employees

1517
01:16:30,000 --> 01:16:32,800
Speaker 4: can have of employers and vice versa, so that we

1518
01:16:32,920 --> 01:16:35,600
Speaker 4: know exactly whether you're a zero you're whether you're a

1519
01:16:35,680 --> 01:16:37,479
Speaker 4: ten buck, or whether you're a one thousand.

1520
01:16:38,400 --> 01:16:39,080
Speaker 19: Yeah, good question.

1521
01:16:39,680 --> 01:16:42,879
Speaker 23: So currently the court and the authority has some discretion

1522
01:16:43,200 --> 01:16:47,479
Speaker 23: to discount the amount that you get paid out. But

1523
01:16:47,720 --> 01:16:50,040
Speaker 23: she wants to tweak the law to say that actually,

1524
01:16:50,200 --> 01:16:54,920
Speaker 23: if the employee employee has engaged in serious misconduct, now

1525
01:16:55,000 --> 01:16:58,599
Speaker 23: that has some sort of legal definition serious misconduct, then

1526
01:16:58,680 --> 01:17:02,320
Speaker 23: you get nothing. There's another thing that she wants to

1527
01:17:02,400 --> 01:17:08,720
Speaker 23: change here, whereby if reducing the sort of compensation you

1528
01:17:08,800 --> 01:17:12,200
Speaker 23: might get for hurt and humiliation again if your behavior

1529
01:17:12,560 --> 01:17:15,960
Speaker 23: contributed towards the dispute. So there's already a bit of

1530
01:17:16,000 --> 01:17:19,439
Speaker 23: a scale here where, you know, because these things are

1531
01:17:19,479 --> 01:17:21,439
Speaker 23: never clear cut right. Often it's you know, a bit

1532
01:17:21,479 --> 01:17:22,600
Speaker 23: of give and take, and it's a bit of this,

1533
01:17:22,680 --> 01:17:27,639
Speaker 23: and the court and the authority can already use that scale.

1534
01:17:27,960 --> 01:17:31,080
Speaker 23: But she wants to tip things very much in favor

1535
01:17:31,200 --> 01:17:35,559
Speaker 23: of employers because she thinks people are sort of taking

1536
01:17:35,600 --> 01:17:38,640
Speaker 23: the mickey a little bit, and you know, and this

1537
01:17:38,760 --> 01:17:41,120
Speaker 23: is creating uncertainty and hurting businesses.

1538
01:17:41,280 --> 01:17:43,880
Speaker 4: And whenever people, whenever people make these sorts of accusations

1539
01:17:43,920 --> 01:17:45,920
Speaker 4: and they say we're doing this, you say, well, have

1540
01:17:46,040 --> 01:17:49,439
Speaker 4: you got evidence? Has Brook van Alden van Velden got

1541
01:17:49,600 --> 01:17:53,800
Speaker 4: evidence of employees exploiting personal grievances because there's money tree

1542
01:17:53,840 --> 01:17:54,280
Speaker 4: at the end of it.

1543
01:17:55,120 --> 01:17:57,920
Speaker 23: Yeah, well that's that is a good question. And you know,

1544
01:17:58,040 --> 01:18:01,400
Speaker 23: she's just referred to some and don't evidence. For example,

1545
01:18:01,520 --> 01:18:03,760
Speaker 23: she said, there was a case where you know, no

1546
01:18:03,960 --> 01:18:06,679
Speaker 23: names or anything, just where someone worked in health care,

1547
01:18:06,840 --> 01:18:09,519
Speaker 23: they abused a patient and then they got their job

1548
01:18:09,560 --> 01:18:11,000
Speaker 23: back at the end of it. She said, well, that's

1549
01:18:11,320 --> 01:18:14,040
Speaker 23: that's not on. But the thing here is that, you know,

1550
01:18:14,120 --> 01:18:16,719
Speaker 23: if you do have a personal grievance, it still costs

1551
01:18:16,760 --> 01:18:20,240
Speaker 23: you money to take it forward in most cases, depending

1552
01:18:20,320 --> 01:18:23,640
Speaker 23: on you know, sorts of legal services you have access to.

1553
01:18:24,120 --> 01:18:24,599
Speaker 19: So I yess.

1554
01:18:24,800 --> 01:18:28,240
Speaker 23: The unions would argue that actually, as an employee, you

1555
01:18:28,360 --> 01:18:30,360
Speaker 23: might already be on the back foot. You don't want

1556
01:18:30,400 --> 01:18:33,679
Speaker 23: to cause a saga and go through all that stress

1557
01:18:33,760 --> 01:18:37,800
Speaker 23: and everything unnecessarily. So the unions say, well, there's already

1558
01:18:38,320 --> 01:18:43,360
Speaker 23: power and balance. But then the employer's groups they say, well,

1559
01:18:44,439 --> 01:18:48,400
Speaker 23: you know, an employer and employer shouldn't be penalized if

1560
01:18:48,720 --> 01:18:51,880
Speaker 23: they just did their paperwork incorrectly or did something minor,

1561
01:18:52,160 --> 01:18:54,360
Speaker 23: but the employee actually did the bad thing, like the

1562
01:18:54,439 --> 01:18:57,599
Speaker 23: employee actually didn't turn up to work or punch somebody

1563
01:18:57,640 --> 01:19:00,840
Speaker 23: at work or stole So it's a it's a pretty

1564
01:19:00,880 --> 01:19:03,280
Speaker 23: heated debate. I think it's sextually it's quite complicated.

1565
01:19:03,520 --> 01:19:06,200
Speaker 4: Yeah, absolutely, very abstract and very hard to actually quantify.

1566
01:19:06,360 --> 01:19:08,920
Speaker 4: And you know, the employers feel like sitting ducks and

1567
01:19:08,920 --> 01:19:11,599
Speaker 4: they feel that they're being exploited, and the employees feel

1568
01:19:11,640 --> 01:19:13,160
Speaker 4: like they're just pawns at the end of the day

1569
01:19:13,760 --> 01:19:14,839
Speaker 4: again getting exploited.

1570
01:19:14,880 --> 01:19:15,439
Speaker 8: And so there we go.

1571
01:19:15,600 --> 01:19:19,000
Speaker 4: An interesting story. Thank you Jane Janet de Brishani, who

1572
01:19:19,120 --> 01:19:22,160
Speaker 4: is our Wellington Business editor. And this is News Talks

1573
01:19:22,200 --> 01:19:25,599
Speaker 4: heb It is now twenty two minutes after six.

1574
01:19:27,479 --> 01:19:29,799
Speaker 1: Quenching the numbers and getting the results.

1575
01:19:30,040 --> 01:19:33,519
Speaker 2: It's Andrew Dickens with the Business Hour thanks to my

1576
01:19:34,000 --> 01:19:38,520
Speaker 2: HR the HR solution for busy Smmy's on News talksb.

1577
01:19:38,640 --> 01:19:40,760
Speaker 4: Sex twenty five. Let's talk about the n z X

1578
01:19:41,080 --> 01:19:43,839
Speaker 4: and I'm joined by Sam Trathui and he's from Milford

1579
01:19:44,000 --> 01:19:44,879
Speaker 4: Asset Management.

1580
01:19:44,920 --> 01:19:46,759
Speaker 24: Hellos, Sam evening Andrew.

1581
01:19:47,479 --> 01:19:49,400
Speaker 4: So, the market, the ins and X has been a

1582
01:19:49,479 --> 01:19:54,760
Speaker 4: material underperformer, particularly when you're compared to major offshore share

1583
01:19:54,840 --> 01:19:55,519
Speaker 4: markets this year.

1584
01:19:56,000 --> 01:20:01,760
Speaker 24: Why I think, Look, firstly, it's ten percent over the

1585
01:20:01,840 --> 01:20:03,920
Speaker 24: course of the year, which is not a bad years

1586
01:20:03,960 --> 01:20:07,000
Speaker 24: and it's definitely what I call respectable, but agree like

1587
01:20:07,120 --> 01:20:09,400
Speaker 24: it's not the twenty five thirty percent that we are

1588
01:20:09,520 --> 01:20:11,760
Speaker 24: seeing in major offshore share markets the likes of the

1589
01:20:11,880 --> 01:20:15,160
Speaker 24: S ANDB five hundred, et cetera. So why hasn't kept

1590
01:20:15,240 --> 01:20:19,479
Speaker 24: up Really three key reasons. So firstly, interest rates the

1591
01:20:19,600 --> 01:20:21,960
Speaker 24: first half of this year, the stance taken by the

1592
01:20:22,120 --> 01:20:25,280
Speaker 24: RBNZS was a really big headwind to the local market.

1593
01:20:25,600 --> 01:20:28,240
Speaker 24: It's pretty sensitive dentist rates, the dividen yields, et cetera.

1594
01:20:28,280 --> 01:20:32,000
Speaker 24: The attractive and attractiveness of them as a big driver

1595
01:20:32,120 --> 01:20:35,000
Speaker 24: of performance, and it wasn't until that first cut that

1596
01:20:35,080 --> 01:20:38,960
Speaker 24: we saw from the RBNS in July that that pressure is. Secondly,

1597
01:20:39,600 --> 01:20:43,160
Speaker 24: corporatings have been under pressure. That's the what we all

1598
01:20:43,200 --> 01:20:45,439
Speaker 24: can see and feel in the economy coming through and

1599
01:20:45,520 --> 01:20:48,280
Speaker 24: heading the market. And then finally, if you look closely

1600
01:20:48,360 --> 01:20:51,439
Speaker 24: at the performance of those major share markets offshore at

1601
01:20:51,479 --> 01:20:54,679
Speaker 24: the return, it's really been driven by a handful of stocks.

1602
01:20:54,760 --> 01:20:58,519
Speaker 24: So take the US for example, the Magnificent seven there

1603
01:20:59,000 --> 01:21:03,280
Speaker 24: led by Navidi on the artificial official intelligence theme. That

1604
01:21:03,360 --> 01:21:05,920
Speaker 24: stock is up one hundred and eighty percent this year,

1605
01:21:06,000 --> 01:21:06,400
Speaker 24: so it's.

1606
01:21:06,240 --> 01:21:07,240
Speaker 1: A big part of the market.

1607
01:21:07,880 --> 01:21:10,439
Speaker 24: The INXETX does have some winners. Frish and Buckle Health

1608
01:21:10,479 --> 01:21:12,560
Speaker 24: get the largest stock up sixty percent this year, but

1609
01:21:12,800 --> 01:21:16,120
Speaker 24: not to the same extent, So three key differences there.

1610
01:21:16,160 --> 01:21:18,599
Speaker 4: Andrew, Okay, so what about the year ahead?

1611
01:21:19,640 --> 01:21:22,400
Speaker 24: I think, Look, the headline really is that I'm probably

1612
01:21:22,479 --> 01:21:25,680
Speaker 24: more optimistic about the outlook for the inxet X that

1613
01:21:25,840 --> 01:21:27,679
Speaker 24: we than I have been in some time. And that's

1614
01:21:27,760 --> 01:21:32,000
Speaker 24: really since the pandemic. So where interustrates are heading, the

1615
01:21:33,120 --> 01:21:36,320
Speaker 24: official cash rate towards three percents, and the prospect of

1616
01:21:36,520 --> 01:21:40,719
Speaker 24: improving economic conditions in the year ahead and then therefore

1617
01:21:40,760 --> 01:21:43,920
Speaker 24: improving corporate earnings really are the big drivers there. If

1618
01:21:44,000 --> 01:21:48,240
Speaker 24: you look back at history pre the pandemic, when we're

1619
01:21:48,320 --> 01:21:51,240
Speaker 24: last cutting intostrates back and from say twenty fifteen to

1620
01:21:51,360 --> 01:21:54,680
Speaker 24: twenty twenty, back then we had the rockstar economy, but

1621
01:21:54,760 --> 01:21:57,160
Speaker 24: we also had a rockstar share market, and that's when

1622
01:21:57,200 --> 01:22:00,720
Speaker 24: we saw some pretty persistent steady flow market looking for

1623
01:22:00,800 --> 01:22:01,559
Speaker 24: better returns.

1624
01:22:01,960 --> 01:22:03,240
Speaker 19: Most of that was term deposits.

1625
01:22:03,280 --> 01:22:06,559
Speaker 24: So it will be interesting to see as ten rates

1626
01:22:06,560 --> 01:22:09,479
Speaker 24: a stem deposit rates come down, will that drive the

1627
01:22:09,520 --> 01:22:11,479
Speaker 24: share market higher like it has in the past.

1628
01:22:12,080 --> 01:22:15,120
Speaker 4: Well, we always said, you know, survive until twenty five,

1629
01:22:15,160 --> 01:22:17,120
Speaker 4: but these days they're saying, well, twenty five is still

1630
01:22:17,120 --> 01:22:18,760
Speaker 4: going to be a grind. Let's get to twenty six.

1631
01:22:18,800 --> 01:22:19,560
Speaker 4: Would you agree with that?

1632
01:22:20,800 --> 01:22:23,479
Speaker 24: I think, well, the testers and what we're not seeing

1633
01:22:23,600 --> 01:22:27,320
Speaker 24: yet as if the interest rate cuts that are coming

1634
01:22:27,360 --> 01:22:30,040
Speaker 24: through from the Reserve Bank when they do actually start

1635
01:22:30,080 --> 01:22:33,400
Speaker 24: to start to influence the local economy, and that's what

1636
01:22:33,479 --> 01:22:36,000
Speaker 24: we really need to see. And I think people are

1637
01:22:36,000 --> 01:22:39,160
Speaker 24: hopeful of it at the stage. But twenty six, to

1638
01:22:39,240 --> 01:22:41,840
Speaker 24: your point, certainly looks a lot easier and a lot

1639
01:22:42,080 --> 01:22:43,920
Speaker 24: better set up than twenty five And.

1640
01:22:44,000 --> 01:22:45,760
Speaker 4: Does the nz X. Does do New Zealand need a

1641
01:22:45,840 --> 01:22:48,080
Speaker 4: hero stock like in video? And before we go too

1642
01:22:48,160 --> 01:22:50,680
Speaker 4: much about in video, see the SMP says that AAI

1643
01:22:50,840 --> 01:22:53,080
Speaker 4: might be being a little bit over hyped in America,

1644
01:22:53,120 --> 01:22:55,719
Speaker 4: but still there's are hero stock there. Do we really

1645
01:22:55,840 --> 01:22:58,040
Speaker 4: need one of those to make our markets perform?

1646
01:22:58,880 --> 01:22:59,240
Speaker 19: I think it.

1647
01:22:59,320 --> 01:23:02,200
Speaker 24: Look it's certainly was the biggest story, the biggest thematic

1648
01:23:02,280 --> 01:23:05,080
Speaker 24: of twenty twenty four, and I expect that to evolve

1649
01:23:05,160 --> 01:23:08,080
Speaker 24: in the video to the aartmatic and Nvidia to evolve

1650
01:23:08,640 --> 01:23:11,320
Speaker 24: into the next test stage over the year head So

1651
01:23:11,360 --> 01:23:14,439
Speaker 24: maybe it's into software companies that benefit from that AI

1652
01:23:14,600 --> 01:23:18,639
Speaker 24: tech to new point around how long it can last.

1653
01:23:18,800 --> 01:23:22,120
Speaker 24: But locally we have had these stocks before at Milk

1654
01:23:22,160 --> 01:23:26,240
Speaker 24: for instance, dominated the market a while ago. And you know,

1655
01:23:26,320 --> 01:23:28,400
Speaker 24: sure it does help performance, but I think the biggest

1656
01:23:28,479 --> 01:23:32,519
Speaker 24: drivers that interest rate set up and where the economic

1657
01:23:32,600 --> 01:23:35,840
Speaker 24: conditions he had. So certainly if they do improve, it

1658
01:23:36,000 --> 01:23:37,760
Speaker 24: is a very good prospect to your head.

1659
01:23:39,000 --> 01:23:42,240
Speaker 4: Sam, Thank you so much. Merry Christmas, Sam tra Thority

1660
01:23:42,280 --> 01:23:47,400
Speaker 4: from Milford's Asset Management. Christmas Music Goodness Sake is in December.

1661
01:23:47,439 --> 01:23:48,040
Speaker 5: Oh it is too.

1662
01:23:49,040 --> 01:23:55,760
Speaker 1: News is next, whether it's macro micro or just playing economics.

1663
01:23:56,000 --> 01:23:59,040
Speaker 2: It's all on the Business Hour with Andrew Dickens and

1664
01:23:59,360 --> 01:24:03,400
Speaker 2: my HR the HR solution for busy SMS news talks.

1665
01:24:03,439 --> 01:24:03,680
Speaker 10: It be.

1666
01:24:05,880 --> 01:24:09,000
Speaker 1: A friend with lasses, mass.

1667
01:24:10,640 --> 01:24:14,080
Speaker 7: Can friends.

1668
01:24:15,080 --> 01:24:23,840
Speaker 4: God, it's a Chrystmas song. It's a real Christmas songs

1669
01:24:23,880 --> 01:24:24,600
Speaker 4: to change.

1670
01:24:26,160 --> 01:24:27,240
Speaker 1: Last Christmas?

1671
01:24:29,760 --> 01:24:33,320
Speaker 4: Where's the sleigh belt? All Christmas songs have a sleigh

1672
01:24:33,360 --> 01:24:35,880
Speaker 4: bell in it. You know, it's been a while since

1673
01:24:35,920 --> 01:24:37,679
Speaker 4: I've been on news and I was hoping you wouldn't

1674
01:24:37,720 --> 01:24:39,880
Speaker 4: actually fall for the disease of playing Christmas music far

1675
01:24:39,920 --> 01:24:43,840
Speaker 4: too early, but you have. It's okay. Now, do you

1676
01:24:43,920 --> 01:24:46,080
Speaker 4: remember about an hour ago and I was talking about

1677
01:24:46,080 --> 01:24:51,160
Speaker 4: I said Verel and you may also remember that she

1678
01:24:51,360 --> 01:24:53,719
Speaker 4: said that she accused Lester Levy of cooking the books,

1679
01:24:53,760 --> 01:24:55,200
Speaker 4: and I said to her, do you know that cooking

1680
01:24:55,200 --> 01:24:57,960
Speaker 4: the books under the Oxford English Dictionary is considered to

1681
01:24:58,000 --> 01:24:59,920
Speaker 4: be a criminal and a legal activity? And I would

1682
01:25:00,200 --> 01:25:03,320
Speaker 4: be surprised if Lester Levy wanted to take a defamation

1683
01:25:03,479 --> 01:25:06,720
Speaker 4: suit against you. And she said, oh, heart it up,

1684
01:25:07,200 --> 01:25:10,559
Speaker 4: or something to that line. This is what Lester Levy

1685
01:25:10,600 --> 01:25:11,479
Speaker 4: said a short time ago.

1686
01:25:11,720 --> 01:25:14,360
Speaker 25: I'd like her to reflect on her comments that she

1687
01:25:14,479 --> 01:25:19,640
Speaker 25: made to me, which were totally unfair, disappointing and inappropriate.

1688
01:25:20,080 --> 01:25:23,520
Speaker 25: I think that it could be considered to be defamatory

1689
01:25:23,800 --> 01:25:26,439
Speaker 25: and we will have a look at that, but it

1690
01:25:26,640 --> 01:25:27,600
Speaker 25: was unnecessary.

1691
01:25:28,640 --> 01:25:32,759
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, we're going to watch this one. I remember

1692
01:25:32,840 --> 01:25:36,479
Speaker 4: I just said that there's limited there's limited privilege in

1693
01:25:36,560 --> 01:25:39,519
Speaker 4: the Select committee halls. That's because there are members of

1694
01:25:39,520 --> 01:25:41,800
Speaker 4: the public there. So okay, when you're in the House

1695
01:25:42,439 --> 01:25:44,040
Speaker 4: you can go go for broke. You're not going to

1696
01:25:44,120 --> 01:25:46,240
Speaker 4: be done. You get into the Select committee. There's a

1697
01:25:46,240 --> 01:25:48,400
Speaker 4: limited privilege there because there are members of the public

1698
01:25:48,400 --> 01:25:51,080
Speaker 4: who can hear the terrible slurs that you make about

1699
01:25:51,200 --> 01:25:55,040
Speaker 4: your fellow parliamentarians, et cetera. And then if you're outside well,

1700
01:25:55,080 --> 01:25:57,519
Speaker 4: it's open slother guess what I should did it in

1701
01:25:57,600 --> 01:25:59,960
Speaker 4: a select committee and then outside in a stand up

1702
01:26:00,720 --> 01:26:03,080
Speaker 4: and on this program she said, I'm not saying sorry,

1703
01:26:03,560 --> 01:26:05,280
Speaker 4: so she's all on. We will keep an eye on

1704
01:26:05,360 --> 01:26:07,360
Speaker 4: this for you. Thank you so very very much. Asha,

1705
01:26:07,840 --> 01:26:11,800
Speaker 4: it's gold. It's twenty one to seven. Andrew dickens, Okay,

1706
01:26:12,080 --> 01:26:15,240
Speaker 4: good news for our universities. International student numbers are up

1707
01:26:16,080 --> 01:26:18,799
Speaker 4: all up. There were seventy three thousand enrollments between January

1708
01:26:18,840 --> 01:26:21,600
Speaker 4: and August this year, up twenty four percent. Remember this

1709
01:26:21,760 --> 01:26:28,200
Speaker 4: is tertiary, secondary and primary. The Tertiary Education Ministers says

1710
01:26:28,360 --> 01:26:32,679
Speaker 4: international student enrollments at universities are now just seven percent

1711
01:26:33,240 --> 01:26:37,639
Speaker 4: below pre COVID levels. So University's New Zealand CEO Chris

1712
01:26:37,720 --> 01:26:41,120
Speaker 4: Wheelan joins, you are now good eving to here, Chris Hi,

1713
01:26:41,280 --> 01:26:42,920
Speaker 4: how are you good? How big a win?

1714
01:26:43,120 --> 01:26:44,760
Speaker 19: Is this? Look?

1715
01:26:45,080 --> 01:26:50,240
Speaker 16: Very pleasing to see We are almost back to where

1716
01:26:50,320 --> 01:26:54,600
Speaker 16: we were pre COVID and it's just very pleasing to

1717
01:26:54,680 --> 01:26:58,240
Speaker 16: see students coming back from our traditional markets. You know,

1718
01:26:58,320 --> 01:27:00,800
Speaker 16: we knew there was strong dem and it's just good

1719
01:27:00,800 --> 01:27:02,280
Speaker 16: to see it actually play out like this.

1720
01:27:02,680 --> 01:27:05,160
Speaker 4: Are some universities getting stronger interests than others.

1721
01:27:06,320 --> 01:27:10,000
Speaker 16: It varies a little bit, but in general numbers are

1722
01:27:10,040 --> 01:27:13,960
Speaker 16: coming back very strongly across all of our universities. There

1723
01:27:14,040 --> 01:27:19,599
Speaker 16: are broadly they're only on average they're down only slightly

1724
01:27:20,320 --> 01:27:22,920
Speaker 16: pretty much for every university from what they were pre COVID.

1725
01:27:23,400 --> 01:27:25,960
Speaker 4: China and India obviously lead the statistics. Are we getting

1726
01:27:25,960 --> 01:27:26,800
Speaker 4: other students too.

1727
01:27:28,320 --> 01:27:31,760
Speaker 16: Look, we're trying to. We certainly still have more than

1728
01:27:31,800 --> 01:27:34,639
Speaker 16: fifty percent of our students from China. It's a massively

1729
01:27:34,680 --> 01:27:37,320
Speaker 16: important market for us, and you know we love having

1730
01:27:37,439 --> 01:27:41,680
Speaker 16: Chinese students, but obviously we would also like to be

1731
01:27:41,760 --> 01:27:44,080
Speaker 16: able to grow in other markets, perhaps a little bit

1732
01:27:44,160 --> 01:27:48,439
Speaker 16: less dependent. That's a set of ongoing conversations that we'll

1733
01:27:48,479 --> 01:27:55,400
Speaker 16: be having, particularly with ministers and immigration in immigration New

1734
01:27:55,439 --> 01:27:59,799
Speaker 16: Zeoning colleagues, because often it's some of the evidentiary requirements,

1735
01:28:00,000 --> 01:28:03,759
Speaker 16: requirements around things like finances and such that students struggle

1736
01:28:03,800 --> 01:28:06,439
Speaker 16: from some countries to demonstrate to be able to get here.

1737
01:28:07,240 --> 01:28:09,240
Speaker 4: Universities have always put in a lot of effort to

1738
01:28:09,280 --> 01:28:12,400
Speaker 4: get international student enrollments. Have we put in even more

1739
01:28:12,560 --> 01:28:14,040
Speaker 4: efforts since the Great Coapse?

1740
01:28:15,720 --> 01:28:18,000
Speaker 16: Look, I don't know that we've put in any more

1741
01:28:18,080 --> 01:28:22,200
Speaker 16: effort I think it's perhaps been different effort. So we know,

1742
01:28:23,360 --> 01:28:26,640
Speaker 16: you know, we've had to rebuild interest in our pipelines.

1743
01:28:27,320 --> 01:28:30,439
Speaker 16: A lot of our students come through, for example, overseas agents.

1744
01:28:31,080 --> 01:28:33,320
Speaker 16: We've spent a lot of time working with those agents.

1745
01:28:33,400 --> 01:28:36,920
Speaker 16: We've spent a lot of time going back to university

1746
01:28:37,080 --> 01:28:40,960
Speaker 16: fairs to make sure we're visible to our students, and

1747
01:28:41,320 --> 01:28:42,280
Speaker 16: it's clearly paying off.

1748
01:28:43,439 --> 01:28:46,400
Speaker 4: Just one thing, primary school enrollments are up sixty nine percent.

1749
01:28:46,479 --> 01:28:48,920
Speaker 4: That's about thirty thousand people. Who are these people and

1750
01:28:49,000 --> 01:28:51,880
Speaker 4: they're surely not people seeking news on education, more likely

1751
01:28:51,920 --> 01:28:53,960
Speaker 4: the children of immigrant workers that are here in only

1752
01:28:54,000 --> 01:28:56,400
Speaker 4: part time. So is this making the statistics seem a

1753
01:28:56,439 --> 01:28:57,760
Speaker 4: little bit better than they really are.

1754
01:29:00,080 --> 01:29:05,240
Speaker 16: Always had reasonably good numbers of primary and secondary school students.

1755
01:29:06,120 --> 01:29:08,040
Speaker 16: You know, what we know as a system is that

1756
01:29:08,720 --> 01:29:12,240
Speaker 16: you know, these you know, we don't know necessarily that

1757
01:29:12,400 --> 01:29:15,280
Speaker 16: much around their backgrounds, except that obviously they're not permanent

1758
01:29:15,320 --> 01:29:19,040
Speaker 16: residents or citizens, so they are recorded as international students.

1759
01:29:20,000 --> 01:29:22,120
Speaker 16: We know that a lot of them do continue through

1760
01:29:22,120 --> 01:29:24,759
Speaker 16: from primary school to secondary school and on to tertiary education.

1761
01:29:26,240 --> 01:29:29,240
Speaker 16: And those that actually remain after tertiary education, it's a

1762
01:29:29,240 --> 01:29:32,439
Speaker 16: small percentage but they do add an awful lot to

1763
01:29:32,520 --> 01:29:35,360
Speaker 16: our economy, so it's well worth getting those students in

1764
01:29:35,479 --> 01:29:35,960
Speaker 16: through school.

1765
01:29:36,160 --> 01:29:40,720
Speaker 4: How healthy are universities and certainly after COVID and of

1766
01:29:40,760 --> 01:29:44,120
Speaker 4: course also and the drop at international students and a

1767
01:29:44,280 --> 01:29:47,360
Speaker 4: falling trust in tertiary education, It saw some of our

1768
01:29:47,479 --> 01:29:50,400
Speaker 4: universities over the last few years just interest from collapse.

1769
01:29:50,800 --> 01:29:51,720
Speaker 4: Where are they at now?

1770
01:29:53,080 --> 01:29:55,720
Speaker 16: Look, I don't think i'd characterize any of our universities

1771
01:29:56,000 --> 01:29:59,960
Speaker 16: being anywhere near collapse. I think it's a challenging financial environment.

1772
01:30:00,360 --> 01:30:04,240
Speaker 16: I think international students are an incredibly helpful part of

1773
01:30:05,120 --> 01:30:09,280
Speaker 16: managing our way through that environment. But far more than that,

1774
01:30:10,800 --> 01:30:14,120
Speaker 16: So much of the success of our universities depends on

1775
01:30:14,240 --> 01:30:17,360
Speaker 16: having good international relationships. An awful lot of those come

1776
01:30:17,400 --> 01:30:19,560
Speaker 16: out of our international students. So it's just great to

1777
01:30:19,640 --> 01:30:20,160
Speaker 16: have them back.

1778
01:30:21,000 --> 01:30:22,800
Speaker 4: And here's the big question, of course, do you think

1779
01:30:22,840 --> 01:30:25,439
Speaker 4: we're seven percent down on what we used to have

1780
01:30:25,760 --> 01:30:28,200
Speaker 4: pre COVID? Do you think we can get to that level?

1781
01:30:28,240 --> 01:30:30,240
Speaker 4: In fact, do you think we can go beyond that level?

1782
01:30:31,120 --> 01:30:36,320
Speaker 16: I'm more than confident of that. We know from these

1783
01:30:36,320 --> 01:30:39,040
Speaker 16: are applications for students who are wanting to start next year.

1784
01:30:39,680 --> 01:30:43,920
Speaker 16: We should easily return to pre COVID levels for next year.

1785
01:30:45,080 --> 01:30:47,479
Speaker 4: Thank you so much. Chris Whelan is the university's New

1786
01:30:47,520 --> 01:30:50,120
Speaker 4: Zealand CEO and the time is now seventeen minutes to seven.

1787
01:30:50,160 --> 01:30:51,680
Speaker 4: So one of the big stories that we've had over

1788
01:30:51,720 --> 01:30:55,760
Speaker 4: a little while there is the renaissance, the rebirth of

1789
01:30:55,920 --> 01:30:59,559
Speaker 4: the Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris five years since the fire,

1790
01:30:59,720 --> 01:31:01,920
Speaker 4: and they managed to rebuild this whole thing. A number

1791
01:31:01,920 --> 01:31:04,360
Speaker 4: of things I want to talk about about that. Number one,

1792
01:31:04,400 --> 01:31:05,960
Speaker 4: they did it. They did the whole job for what

1793
01:31:06,120 --> 01:31:09,400
Speaker 4: was it a billion euros? And what's that? That's about

1794
01:31:09,400 --> 01:31:11,920
Speaker 4: what two billion New Zealand dollars. And yet we to

1795
01:31:12,000 --> 01:31:15,200
Speaker 4: build a train line through Auckland's costing five point five

1796
01:31:15,280 --> 01:31:18,479
Speaker 4: and going up. Could we have all those French guys

1797
01:31:18,520 --> 01:31:20,120
Speaker 4: with the oak, could they come down here and actually

1798
01:31:20,120 --> 01:31:22,400
Speaker 4: build our trains because they appeared to be a lot

1799
01:31:22,479 --> 01:31:25,960
Speaker 4: more efficient in building a beautiful thing than we are.

1800
01:31:26,120 --> 01:31:27,880
Speaker 4: That's the first thing. But I think they built it

1801
01:31:27,960 --> 01:31:30,560
Speaker 4: because of a national pride and they know they felt it.

1802
01:31:30,640 --> 01:31:32,280
Speaker 4: It was in their heart and their soul. They would

1803
01:31:32,320 --> 01:31:33,680
Speaker 4: have done it for free, they would have paid to

1804
01:31:33,720 --> 01:31:35,640
Speaker 4: do it, I guess. So that's the first thing. The

1805
01:31:35,680 --> 01:31:37,599
Speaker 4: second thing is I know that Doctre done quite well.

1806
01:31:37,600 --> 01:31:38,960
Speaker 4: I lived in France for quite a lot of time,

1807
01:31:39,000 --> 01:31:41,240
Speaker 4: and I spend a lot of time up there, and

1808
01:31:41,320 --> 01:31:43,880
Speaker 4: it used to be dark and dingy and gothic, and

1809
01:31:43,960 --> 01:31:46,880
Speaker 4: the new Notre Dame is bright and light and airy.

1810
01:31:47,760 --> 01:31:50,640
Speaker 4: It's amazing and as the guy said, it's going to

1811
01:31:50,680 --> 01:31:52,760
Speaker 4: be great for the next eight hundred and sixty years,

1812
01:31:53,040 --> 01:31:56,080
Speaker 4: because the whole place is eight hundred and sixty years old. Anyway,

1813
01:31:56,120 --> 01:31:58,840
Speaker 4: We're going to talk more about that sort of stuff

1814
01:31:58,920 --> 01:32:03,760
Speaker 4: about brands with Devin Gray because apparently their prime minister

1815
01:32:03,880 --> 01:32:06,479
Speaker 4: is facing a no confidence vote. The good Priss from

1816
01:32:06,479 --> 01:32:08,840
Speaker 4: the Notre Dawn doesn't last, obviously. That's next. It is

1817
01:32:08,840 --> 01:32:09,920
Speaker 4: a quarter to seven.

1818
01:32:11,240 --> 01:32:14,760
Speaker 2: Everything from SMEs to the big corporates, The Business Hour

1819
01:32:15,040 --> 01:32:18,560
Speaker 2: with Andrew Dickens and my HR the HR Solution for

1820
01:32:18,680 --> 01:32:21,080
Speaker 2: busy SMS on Newstalk ZIBB.

1821
01:32:22,000 --> 01:32:24,160
Speaker 4: Yes, it is twelve minutes to seven. Off to the

1822
01:32:24,240 --> 01:32:27,200
Speaker 4: Northern Hemisphere we go Gavin Gray from the UK. Hello, Gevin,

1823
01:32:28,240 --> 01:32:30,559
Speaker 4: either Andrew, how's is it cold?

1824
01:32:32,360 --> 01:32:32,559
Speaker 9: Yeah?

1825
01:32:32,640 --> 01:32:36,639
Speaker 10: Well, last night was cold and people are still suffering.

1826
01:32:36,720 --> 01:32:39,519
Speaker 10: I'm afraid from the storm of last week. Very heavy

1827
01:32:39,640 --> 01:32:40,519
Speaker 10: rains and so forth.

1828
01:32:40,600 --> 01:32:42,280
Speaker 19: But yeah, not not too bad.

1829
01:32:42,360 --> 01:32:44,320
Speaker 10: It doesn't look at the moment in the long term

1830
01:32:44,400 --> 01:32:46,559
Speaker 10: forecast like a white Christmas.

1831
01:32:46,640 --> 01:32:49,479
Speaker 4: However, no, this is true, but there are floods in Spain,

1832
01:32:49,520 --> 01:32:51,000
Speaker 4: and of course there is snow on the Alps, and

1833
01:32:51,000 --> 01:32:53,519
Speaker 4: everyone's getting quite excited about this. Let's get down to possess.

1834
01:32:53,600 --> 01:32:57,519
Speaker 4: The French Prime Minister Michel Bagnier faces a no confidence

1835
01:32:57,600 --> 01:33:00,320
Speaker 4: vote today. This was of course after I think we're

1836
01:33:00,320 --> 01:33:02,519
Speaker 4: on hold during the Paris Olympics. But it's all foot

1837
01:33:02,560 --> 01:33:05,240
Speaker 4: born down, yes, it sure is.

1838
01:33:05,400 --> 01:33:09,800
Speaker 10: And Michelle Barnier and indeed the French government facing I

1839
01:33:09,920 --> 01:33:13,200
Speaker 10: think a very very important day for French politics. Plenty

1840
01:33:13,240 --> 01:33:17,800
Speaker 10: of people believing that the political spectrum could enter a

1841
01:33:17,920 --> 01:33:20,880
Speaker 10: period that we've never seen before in France. So what

1842
01:33:21,040 --> 01:33:23,960
Speaker 10: has happened, of course, is that back in the day,

1843
01:33:23,960 --> 01:33:26,920
Speaker 10: as it were, Emmanuel Macron called an election. He thought

1844
01:33:26,960 --> 01:33:29,720
Speaker 10: he would strengthen his party. Instead it led to a

1845
01:33:29,960 --> 01:33:34,599
Speaker 10: really bad, cobbled together coalition party, and then he put

1846
01:33:34,720 --> 01:33:37,840
Speaker 10: in place the president that put in place the Prime

1847
01:33:37,880 --> 01:33:41,160
Speaker 10: Minister Michelle Barnier, to try and sort things out. Now,

1848
01:33:41,200 --> 01:33:46,240
Speaker 10: Michelle Barnier put before politicians this really tough cost cutting,

1849
01:33:46,680 --> 01:33:51,640
Speaker 10: tax rising budget. Unsurprisingly, people and the politicians don't like it.

1850
01:33:52,000 --> 01:33:54,840
Speaker 10: They keep voting it down. He has then said, well,

1851
01:33:54,920 --> 01:33:56,920
Speaker 10: I'm just going to push it through, which he did

1852
01:33:57,320 --> 01:34:00,880
Speaker 10: using special powers. And now today they're holding a vote

1853
01:34:00,880 --> 01:34:03,680
Speaker 10: of no confidence in him, in which both the far

1854
01:34:03,960 --> 01:34:07,599
Speaker 10: right and the left wing parties are uniting to vote

1855
01:34:07,600 --> 01:34:10,880
Speaker 10: against him. So he is set to become the shortest

1856
01:34:11,280 --> 01:34:15,479
Speaker 10: reigning prime minister in the fifth Republic of France's history

1857
01:34:15,920 --> 01:34:19,320
Speaker 10: just three months. He says, there is no better way forward.

1858
01:34:19,400 --> 01:34:21,720
Speaker 10: We have to do these things. They're unpleasant, but we've

1859
01:34:21,760 --> 01:34:24,240
Speaker 10: got to cut costs. Others are saying, well, not on

1860
01:34:24,439 --> 01:34:24,920
Speaker 10: my watch.

1861
01:34:25,400 --> 01:34:28,639
Speaker 4: No, No, has anything ever happened that was good. After

1862
01:34:28,720 --> 01:34:32,600
Speaker 4: someone's used special powers to push through an attractive legislation,

1863
01:34:33,200 --> 01:34:34,920
Speaker 4: It's very autocratic, isn't it.

1864
01:34:36,200 --> 01:34:38,639
Speaker 10: Yeah, it seemed an odd thing, but he felt forced

1865
01:34:38,680 --> 01:34:40,840
Speaker 10: to do it. He kept having to water it down

1866
01:34:40,960 --> 01:34:43,240
Speaker 10: so that people would agree to vote for it. But

1867
01:34:43,360 --> 01:34:45,280
Speaker 10: in the end he just couldn't water it down anymore.

1868
01:34:45,320 --> 01:34:48,560
Speaker 10: So it wasn't worth it, and he pleaded on television

1869
01:34:49,040 --> 01:34:53,280
Speaker 10: last night, to our time last night, to say to people, look,

1870
01:34:53,320 --> 01:34:56,559
Speaker 10: you know this will plunge the country into crisis because

1871
01:34:56,800 --> 01:35:00,519
Speaker 10: a general election cannot be held until July, which means

1872
01:35:00,560 --> 01:35:02,639
Speaker 10: the parties are just going to have to muddle along

1873
01:35:02,720 --> 01:35:05,600
Speaker 10: for that period and that is where the stock exchanges

1874
01:35:05,640 --> 01:35:08,160
Speaker 10: have taken fright as well in France.

1875
01:35:08,880 --> 01:35:11,040
Speaker 4: Finger are quite good at muddling. But anyway, yes, okay,

1876
01:35:11,120 --> 01:35:13,960
Speaker 4: thank you very much. Right, you've got a COVID corruption commissioner.

1877
01:35:15,400 --> 01:35:18,880
Speaker 10: Yes, and the staffing work and this is all about

1878
01:35:19,160 --> 01:35:23,719
Speaker 10: how much PPE personal protective equipment was ordered for health

1879
01:35:23,800 --> 01:35:28,920
Speaker 10: workers during COVID and it was an amazing amount. Some

1880
01:35:29,280 --> 01:35:34,200
Speaker 10: eighteen billion New Zealand dollars worth of PPE was bought

1881
01:35:34,280 --> 01:35:37,360
Speaker 10: during the pandemic that now has had to be written

1882
01:35:37,439 --> 01:35:40,680
Speaker 10: off from the government's books. Now there are reports that

1883
01:35:40,800 --> 01:35:42,960
Speaker 10: some of it didn't meet the standards, some of it

1884
01:35:43,120 --> 01:35:46,200
Speaker 10: fell apart, some of it was ordered the wrong way,

1885
01:35:46,320 --> 01:35:49,679
Speaker 10: it's alleged, and today we're now finding out this COVID

1886
01:35:49,800 --> 01:35:53,040
Speaker 10: Corruption Minister Tim Haho is going to look at that

1887
01:35:53,880 --> 01:35:56,360
Speaker 10: amount that was written off in the government books and

1888
01:35:56,520 --> 01:35:59,840
Speaker 10: also likely to review the previous government's abandoning of it

1889
01:36:00,320 --> 01:36:03,000
Speaker 10: to reclaim the money from deals that were said to

1890
01:36:03,080 --> 01:36:06,439
Speaker 10: be worth at least one point four billion New Zealand

1891
01:36:06,520 --> 01:36:09,639
Speaker 10: dollars and the government simply let the trails go cold

1892
01:36:09,720 --> 01:36:12,439
Speaker 10: because it was felt many people were deliberately trying to

1893
01:36:12,520 --> 01:36:15,960
Speaker 10: rip off the taxpayer. There is a separate investigation with

1894
01:36:16,200 --> 01:36:21,120
Speaker 10: criminal offenses potentially at stake committed in the procurement system.

1895
01:36:21,160 --> 01:36:25,200
Speaker 10: Of course, in truth Andrew, it was chaotic. Everyone wanted PPE.

1896
01:36:25,640 --> 01:36:27,600
Speaker 10: People were just trying to get it from anywhere, and

1897
01:36:27,760 --> 01:36:32,400
Speaker 10: people were offering it as having never made any PPE before.

1898
01:36:32,720 --> 01:36:35,880
Speaker 10: And this is this what this new COVID Corruption Commissioner

1899
01:36:36,120 --> 01:36:36,920
Speaker 10: is going to have to wait for.

1900
01:36:37,280 --> 01:36:40,360
Speaker 4: What I found amazing is that sitting members of the

1901
01:36:40,439 --> 01:36:43,799
Speaker 4: House of Parliament were also trying to get into the record,

1902
01:36:43,960 --> 01:36:45,599
Speaker 4: you know, and I thought, what are you doing there?

1903
01:36:45,640 --> 01:36:45,800
Speaker 19: Boy?

1904
01:36:46,200 --> 01:36:46,360
Speaker 1: You know?

1905
01:36:46,960 --> 01:36:50,240
Speaker 10: Yeah, yeah, there's some lots of oddities, including a fast lane,

1906
01:36:50,560 --> 01:36:53,200
Speaker 10: a fast track lane of vip lane as it was

1907
01:36:53,280 --> 01:36:56,400
Speaker 10: called for certain companies. Well you know, why were they

1908
01:36:56,439 --> 01:36:58,920
Speaker 10: allowed to bed you know, extra fast and of course

1909
01:36:58,960 --> 01:37:03,280
Speaker 10: the answer as well, sometimes allegedly friends of friends and

1910
01:37:03,439 --> 01:37:06,080
Speaker 10: sometimes because yeah, the government was just desperate.

1911
01:37:06,280 --> 01:37:08,240
Speaker 4: Yeah, okay, now how's Queen Camilla?

1912
01:37:10,040 --> 01:37:10,080
Speaker 18: Not?

1913
01:37:10,320 --> 01:37:10,519
Speaker 19: Well?

1914
01:37:10,760 --> 01:37:15,120
Speaker 10: So the Kataris have had a state visit here to

1915
01:37:15,200 --> 01:37:18,479
Speaker 10: the UK. The Red carpet has been rolled out quite literally,

1916
01:37:19,240 --> 01:37:22,519
Speaker 10: a visit the House of Parliament for the emmett and

1917
01:37:22,720 --> 01:37:26,360
Speaker 10: also a state banquet, and on show was the King

1918
01:37:27,360 --> 01:37:31,360
Speaker 10: and Prince William and Princess Catherine, So Princess Catherine's first

1919
01:37:31,400 --> 01:37:35,000
Speaker 10: state visit since sending her chemotherapy, but no sign of

1920
01:37:35,080 --> 01:37:38,960
Speaker 10: the Queen. She apparently has taken part of the state visit,

1921
01:37:39,240 --> 01:37:43,440
Speaker 10: but not having taken part in any event that's outside.

1922
01:37:43,840 --> 01:37:48,400
Speaker 10: We're now being told her chest infection, which she's had

1923
01:37:48,479 --> 01:37:50,360
Speaker 10: for several weeks and was told it would be over

1924
01:37:50,439 --> 01:37:52,400
Speaker 10: in a couple of days, that's been off for several

1925
01:37:52,439 --> 01:37:55,760
Speaker 10: weeks but has transformed and she's struggling with the side

1926
01:37:55,800 --> 01:37:58,479
Speaker 10: effects of a form of pneumonia. And that's the first

1927
01:37:58,560 --> 01:38:02,200
Speaker 10: time the said seven year old has had the word

1928
01:38:02,280 --> 01:38:05,760
Speaker 10: pneumonia described about her from the press officers, And so

1929
01:38:05,920 --> 01:38:08,080
Speaker 10: it does look a little bit more serious than perhaps

1930
01:38:08,160 --> 01:38:09,200
Speaker 10: we were all being told.

1931
01:38:09,320 --> 01:38:11,280
Speaker 4: Yes, but you know, we still don't know what happened

1932
01:38:11,280 --> 01:38:12,840
Speaker 4: to Princess Kate, but we do know she's.

1933
01:38:12,720 --> 01:38:17,080
Speaker 10: Back, yes, and many people delighted, of course to see

1934
01:38:17,760 --> 01:38:21,120
Speaker 10: that it might make mark a full return now to

1935
01:38:21,280 --> 01:38:25,080
Speaker 10: royal duty for her. And she was looking remarkably good.

1936
01:38:25,120 --> 01:38:27,040
Speaker 10: I think you know those sorts of things you never

1937
01:38:27,200 --> 01:38:30,639
Speaker 10: potentially quite recover from. But doing it in the full

1938
01:38:30,800 --> 01:38:32,960
Speaker 10: face and glare at the media is going to be tough.

1939
01:38:33,520 --> 01:38:35,800
Speaker 10: And of course yes, all eyes were on her rather

1940
01:38:35,960 --> 01:38:39,519
Speaker 10: than anyone from Katar or the King himself, just to

1941
01:38:39,560 --> 01:38:40,599
Speaker 10: see how she was looking.

1942
01:38:40,760 --> 01:38:42,519
Speaker 4: Brilliant stuff. Kevin Grave from the UK, I thank you

1943
01:38:42,560 --> 01:38:43,800
Speaker 4: for your time. It is now six to.

1944
01:38:43,800 --> 01:38:44,280
Speaker 19: See him.

1945
01:38:46,040 --> 01:38:48,880
Speaker 1: Getting ready for a new administration in the US. What

1946
01:38:49,120 --> 01:38:49,960
Speaker 1: will be the impact?

1947
01:38:50,280 --> 01:38:53,519
Speaker 2: It's the Business Hour with hither duplicy Ellen and my

1948
01:38:53,840 --> 01:38:57,200
Speaker 2: HR the HR solution for busy news talks.

1949
01:38:57,240 --> 01:39:02,000
Speaker 4: It'd be new talks be Andrew, Are you on tomorrow? Yes,

1950
01:39:02,040 --> 01:39:05,759
Speaker 4: I just found out I am so I'll see you tomorrow. Andrew.

1951
01:39:05,880 --> 01:39:08,679
Speaker 4: Please note that the French led the CRL contract in Auckland,

1952
01:39:08,760 --> 01:39:11,679
Speaker 4: so they're not all good. Good point, John and Andrew.

1953
01:39:12,280 --> 01:39:15,040
Speaker 4: Compare the restoration of the Notre Dame to our christ

1954
01:39:15,120 --> 01:39:17,920
Speaker 4: Church Cathedral fifteen years and tens of millions to do

1955
01:39:18,080 --> 01:39:19,840
Speaker 4: nothing other than to think about what to do. This

1956
01:39:19,960 --> 01:39:22,600
Speaker 4: is true, Simon, It's not ten hundreds of millions of

1957
01:39:22,640 --> 01:39:24,439
Speaker 4: billions like the French. The French were proud of it.

1958
01:39:24,520 --> 01:39:27,160
Speaker 4: And also the corporates stood up and actually donated money

1959
01:39:27,200 --> 01:39:29,080
Speaker 4: to fix Notre Dame. But we're not seeing that with

1960
01:39:29,160 --> 01:39:33,160
Speaker 4: christ Church Cathedral. But hey, that's another story. Hey missus, DJ,

1961
01:39:33,439 --> 01:39:34,200
Speaker 4: what are you going to play?

1962
01:39:34,680 --> 01:39:35,960
Speaker 26: Who's Afraid a Little Old Me?

1963
01:39:36,120 --> 01:39:36,360
Speaker 16: To play?

1964
01:39:36,439 --> 01:39:39,719
Speaker 26: Us out tonight? Andrew by Taylor Swift. She has thanked

1965
01:39:39,760 --> 01:39:41,760
Speaker 26: all her fans for listening to her so much that

1966
01:39:41,880 --> 01:39:45,200
Speaker 26: she became the most streamed artist on Apple Music this year.

1967
01:39:45,439 --> 01:39:48,040
Speaker 26: Apple Music has released the Apple Music Replay, which is

1968
01:39:48,120 --> 01:39:50,680
Speaker 26: not Spotify raps but would be if they had got

1969
01:39:50,720 --> 01:39:51,200
Speaker 26: there first.

1970
01:39:51,640 --> 01:39:52,760
Speaker 19: And yeah, she was the top.

1971
01:39:52,680 --> 01:39:55,320
Speaker 26: Streamed artist and the album The Torture Poets Department was

1972
01:39:55,400 --> 01:39:57,360
Speaker 26: the top stream album. This is my favorite song with

1973
01:39:57,400 --> 01:39:58,680
Speaker 26: the album, so I thought we'll go up with that one.

1974
01:39:58,840 --> 01:40:02,080
Speaker 4: My problem. Does she also say even I'm over me?

1975
01:40:02,479 --> 01:40:02,519
Speaker 18: No?

1976
01:40:02,720 --> 01:40:03,080
Speaker 17: She didn't.

1977
01:40:03,240 --> 01:40:06,559
Speaker 4: No, of course, not pretty good? See you tomorrow me.

1978
01:40:13,439 --> 01:40:23,360
Speaker 1: Hello, Who's Afraid a Little Me?

1979
01:40:26,800 --> 01:40:29,960
Speaker 2: For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to

1980
01:40:30,040 --> 01:40:33,080
Speaker 2: news talks. It'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow

1981
01:40:33,160 --> 01:40:34,880
Speaker 2: the podcast on iHeartRadio