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Speaker 1: In Wellington, some patients have been declined specialist appointments based

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Speaker 1: on their BMI. According to reports. Several local gps say

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Speaker 1: this is happening at Wellington Hospital and they worry that

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Speaker 1: it's being done to manage waiting lists. The chief clinical

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Speaker 1: officer at Health and Z is Richard Sullivant's with me

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Speaker 1: this afternoon.

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Speaker 2: Hi Richard, Yeah, cure Brian, how are you good things?

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Speaker 2: Is this true? No? Look Ryan, so I think to

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Speaker 2: talk through this, So it's not. Well. What's not true

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Speaker 2: is we're not using what we call body mass index,

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Speaker 2: which is a really combination of someone's height and weight

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Speaker 2: to manage wait list. So that's absolutely not true. The

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Speaker 2: body mass index is one of many tools that we

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Speaker 2: do use for says somewhat and sup belief of surgery,

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Speaker 2: but not not its own account.

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Speaker 1: So are you turning people of what I mean? Surgery

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Speaker 1: is one thing, right, but getting to a specialist is

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Speaker 1: quite another. Are you stopping people from seeing a specialist

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Speaker 1: because too you know they're over away?

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Speaker 2: So based on their weight alone. No, there are criterias

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Speaker 2: I say around you know, within different areas. So for instance,

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Speaker 2: if you need any replacement degree of damage to than

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Speaker 2: any joint other illnerses someone they have to decide on

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Speaker 2: whether someone go to search or not. There are different

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Speaker 2: criteria across the country about accessing to be seen and

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Speaker 2: that is something we are blackling as Health News eleans,

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Speaker 2: so trying to make sure what we were turned thresholds

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Speaker 2: are the same across all our districts. They are not

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Speaker 2: at the moment, So that's alike.

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Speaker 1: In Wellington, here's a question, have you turned anyone away

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Speaker 1: from seeing a specialist based on their BMI?

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Speaker 2: So from what I understand that there are different criteria

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Speaker 2: in Wellington versus HUT Hospital. They are the same organization,

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Speaker 2: but they do have different criteria for people who should

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Speaker 2: be seen. And you're all one?

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Speaker 1: Are you're all one?

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Speaker 2: Now?

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Speaker 1: I guess I'm asking and I have a hospital. Has

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Speaker 1: anyone been turned away because of their BMI?

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Speaker 2: Not my knowledge specifically on their BMI. People are being

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Speaker 2: declined assistance because of multiple reasons, but not purely just

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Speaker 2: on their BMI.

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Speaker 1: Because there was a letter in the post today from

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Speaker 1: the hospital that declined based on BMI. Did you see that?

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Speaker 2: So we're just don't gather up the communications we're sending

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Speaker 2: out to patients because it's really important day that our

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Speaker 2: communities you have trust in us and know that, no,

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Speaker 2: we don't decline people purely based on weight, that it's

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Speaker 2: multiple factors. But we are just looking into the communication

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Speaker 2: that we are sending. And to your point, you know,

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Speaker 2: as a single organization, we should have consistent communication with

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Speaker 2: our patients, right criteria.

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Speaker 1: There was a mistake. I mean, we're there in this case,

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Speaker 1: were there are other reasons other than BMI which led

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Speaker 1: to them being declined.

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Speaker 2: I don't have the teachers of that particular case. We're

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Speaker 2: looking into that particular case, but I can assure you

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Speaker 2: that as one of the many factors when we make

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Speaker 2: these choices.

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Speaker 1: Is there a case to be made for declining people

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Speaker 1: the right to see a specialist if their BMI is

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Speaker 1: too high? I mean, if they're not going to be

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Speaker 1: able to qualify for surgery, then are you not wanting

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Speaker 1: to clog the weight lists you know, all the way

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Speaker 1: down the track?

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Speaker 2: Great question. So look, I think everyone who should be seen,

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Speaker 2: where they even need to be seen, should be seen.

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Speaker 2: There are very key criteria though, around the benefits. So

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Speaker 2: there are some surgeries whereby some people's weight or BMI

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Speaker 2: is extremely high, they get a poor outcome. So it's

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Speaker 2: not the right thing to do to operate. But that's

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Speaker 2: a conversation that patients aren't find and obviously deserve to

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Speaker 2: be aware of. So yeah, there's no doubt that the

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Speaker 2: BMI is one of the clinical tools we used to

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Speaker 2: assess people's fitnesses Stidrey, and we do need to get

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Speaker 2: better and you know, the aising with our GPS to

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Speaker 2: ensure that it's clear about where that sets and weird

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Speaker 2: it doesn't sit. I think that's an ear we need

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Speaker 2: to do better and so that patients know and we

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Speaker 2: set the right expectations.

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Speaker 1: Okay, all right, Hey, are you going to quit any

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Speaker 1: time soon? Most of your colleagues seem to be.

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Speaker 2: No, not at all. It's a critical role. Hey, deliver

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Speaker 2: healthcare for New Zealanders, and I'm certainly in the long haul.

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Speaker 1: Doesn't feel like a sinking ship.

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Speaker 2: No, No, Look, you know we've got some great stuff

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Speaker 2: happening in health and we provide really great healthcare in

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Speaker 2: many years. That's not to say we've got don't have

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Speaker 2: your as f improvement. We absolutely need to improve access clearly,

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Speaker 2: you know, in this context for people who are waiting

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Speaker 2: to be seen by a specials or waiting for suitable treatment,

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Speaker 2: so these are big focuses for us to.

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Speaker 1: Improve well handled. Richard Sutherland Sullivan, thank you very much

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Speaker 1: for being on the show, and he's the Health New

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Speaker 1: Zealand Chief Clinical Officer with us this afternoon talking BE

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Speaker 1: and MI for more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive. Listen

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