Speaker 1: You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talks.
Speaker 2: Explanation of the World.
Speaker 3: And welcome back to the Weekend Collective. By the way,
Speaker 3: if you've missed any of the previous hours, always an
Speaker 3: interesting chat with Kelvin Davidson from core Logic on what
Speaker 3: the property market's doing and whether it matters whether you're
Speaker 3: buying a new house or an old one. But if
Speaker 3: you've missed and up, my goodness that the panel today
Speaker 3: with Luke Dallo and Carmacdonald was raucus and quite good fun.
Speaker 3: Actually it was a lot of fun. But if you've
Speaker 3: missed any of the ours and you feel you'd like
Speaker 3: a distraction from you to day, then go and check
Speaker 3: out the podcast. Go to the Weekend Collective on iHeartRadio.
Speaker 3: But now it's time for the Parents Squad, and we've
Speaker 3: got a new guest on the show, which is sort
Speaker 3: of all my fault because she is the former principal
Speaker 3: at Bardine College. She's I wouldn't say she's retired, she's
Speaker 3: the former principal. She's moved on to a few other things.
Speaker 3: And her name is Sandy Pasley and Sandy is with
Speaker 3: me now, Sandy, good afternoon. How are you doing.
Speaker 4: I'm great, Tim, thank you.
Speaker 3: Thanks for coming on board. By the way, we thought
Speaker 3: we'd just ease you in with that song. We always
Speaker 3: have a song choice, and you didn't necessarily have a
Speaker 3: choice of song, but you said I like a bit
Speaker 3: of the Carpenter and who doesn't because and you coincided
Speaker 3: with my producer Tyra, who I think Tyra is a
Speaker 3: big fan of the Carpenters as well. So that's just
Speaker 3: to ease it into it. Hey, Now, the question for
Speaker 3: you out there on one hundred and eighty ten to
Speaker 3: eighty is the question of values and who's responsible for
Speaker 3: teaching your children values? And that sounds like a really
Speaker 3: dumb question, doesn't it, Because you'd instantly say, well, the parents,
Speaker 3: of course, in the family. But who else do you
Speaker 3: trust to instill values into your children? Because you know,
Speaker 3: as the saying goes, it's it takes what is the saying,
Speaker 3: It takes a village. That's the one, thank you, Tira.
Speaker 3: It takes a village. So it's one thing for parents
Speaker 3: to have a role on the values that they want
Speaker 3: their children to grow up with and to take on.
Speaker 3: But of course they're not the only influence in their
Speaker 3: children's lives. Their sports clubs are influencers, the dance schools
Speaker 3: they go to, the and the schools. And so how
Speaker 3: far do you think schools should go when it comes
Speaker 3: to well, what is the school's role in teaching values
Speaker 3: to kids? And that I know that can be a
Speaker 3: triggering question because you might think, well, that school's got
Speaker 3: ideas about X, Y and Z that I don't agree
Speaker 3: with at all. But schools are there to educate our kids,
Speaker 3: and it's not just about teaching them that one on
Speaker 3: one is too and how to read and write and
Speaker 3: all that sort of thing, and the more sophisticated learnings
Speaker 3: that they get to when when they're older. Values are
Speaker 3: a huge part of it. So, Sandy, you're obviously from
Speaker 3: a school barot In College that's a special character school
Speaker 3: in the form of being a Catholic school. How importantly
Speaker 3: did you take the question of values in addition to
Speaker 3: teaching scholarly issues.
Speaker 4: I think it's incredibly important him. I think values are
Speaker 4: what make having strong values or what make a good
Speaker 4: community person. And the role of schools is surely to
Speaker 4: educate a community so that they become really valued members
Speaker 4: of that community and are able to contribute, and that's
Speaker 4: the whole point of governments being involved in schools is
Speaker 4: so that the population is educated and educated in such
Speaker 4: a way that they are all good community members.
Speaker 3: Because values are also subjective, aren't they. So I guess
Speaker 3: it's easier when you're with a school like Barridine there
Speaker 3: is a specific charter and people know when they send
Speaker 3: their children. There's a buy in, isn't there Definitely, Whereas
Speaker 3: I guess if somebody is going to just the college
Speaker 3: that they're in zone or the school they're in zone.
Speaker 3: But there's still a role for a huge role for
Speaker 3: schools to play. It's just like, I guess, how far
Speaker 3: can they go with teaching values? Do you think?
Speaker 4: I think even any school has got an important role
Speaker 4: playing imparting values for instance, social justice, the importance of
Speaker 4: social justice, the importance of equality, and the importance of
Speaker 4: being responsible for others as well as yourself. Those things,
Speaker 4: no matter whether you're at a Catholic school or a
Speaker 4: state school or a private school, all really important.
Speaker 3: I meant to actually sorry, I needed one of the
Speaker 3: audience to get to know you a little bit, so
Speaker 3: I launched into the question there because I was running hot.
Speaker 3: But how long have you been involved in an education
Speaker 3: yourself or roughly? Actually actually no, no, let's just shorten
Speaker 3: that one. You were a principal of Bardeene College for
Speaker 3: how long?
Speaker 4: Thirteen and a half years, and before that, I was
Speaker 4: principal of Saint Mary's College in Pontsmbe for nine and
Speaker 4: a half years, and before that I was deputy principal
Speaker 4: at Birkenhead College on the North Shore.
Speaker 3: Okay, because you and before that you're teaching, you're a teacher.
Speaker 3: Obviously before you come on principal. It's chemistry. You're bad,
Speaker 3: was it?
Speaker 4: That's right?
Speaker 3: Wow? What made you get into chemistry?
Speaker 4: I did a degree in chemistry at a target university,
Speaker 4: which I loved and so much so that when I
Speaker 4: finished the degree, I didn't really feel like I wanted
Speaker 4: to leave and went back for another year post grad.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Oh, that's just what my students do when you
Speaker 3: haven't quite worked out what you're going to do. I guess,
Speaker 3: is that right exactly?
Speaker 4: And in those days you could get a studentship and
Speaker 4: be paid to go to university, which I appealed to
Speaker 4: me in those times at that time, because I was
Speaker 4: really quite feeling like I needed some money not relying
Speaker 4: on my appearance. So I actually took up a studentship,
Speaker 4: and with that studentship meant I had to teach for
Speaker 4: a year.
Speaker 3: OK so you sort of you sort of fell into
Speaker 3: teaching in a way because that was just a requirement.
Speaker 3: And then what did you think, this is not so bad?
Speaker 4: Yep, exactly that. I really perhaps, looking back, I didn't
Speaker 4: choose to be a teacher when I was younger. Yeah,
Speaker 4: but it got under my skin.
Speaker 3: Really was it an instant thing? Or as soon as
Speaker 3: you did it you just sort of thought, I mean,
Speaker 3: you must have had some good kids as well at
Speaker 3: your teaching, because if you'd had a bunch of rat bags,
Speaker 3: it might have been a bit less fun. I'm guessing. Sorry.
Speaker 4: I think when I was a young teacher, I wasn't
Speaker 4: that good. I can't remember having it. Probably in those
Speaker 4: days they had classes streamed and I had four C two,
Speaker 4: which was the lowest science class in form four in
Speaker 4: at wait take you girls? Yeah, and I found them
Speaker 4: quite uncontrollable sometimes, so I resorted to things I wasn't
Speaker 4: supposed to do, like send them out of the classroom
Speaker 4: to stand outside of like I really annoyed at them.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, that doesn't sound too radical, does it? When
Speaker 3: did you just? When did? When did leaderships? When did
Speaker 3: taking roles like being a deputy principal? When did that
Speaker 3: become part of your sort of picture?
Speaker 4: I guess I loved the classroom and I love teaching,
Speaker 4: but I also saw the benefit of being able to
Speaker 4: influence things on a wider scale, and that's what you
Speaker 4: can do in senior leadership in particular as a principle.
Speaker 3: Does it when you do end up in those positions,
Speaker 3: does it make you examine how hard do you have
Speaker 3: to think about what, in fact you do want to
Speaker 3: impart to young people? And how how far a school
Speaker 3: can go in having a say in values, because there'd
Speaker 3: be certain social issues where families would think, actually, that
Speaker 3: school should have nothing to do with it. How did
Speaker 3: was that a different Was it an interesting journey for
Speaker 3: you working out that side of things?
Speaker 4: I think it was. It was really important to me
Speaker 4: that students get the opportunity to be educated now, and
Speaker 4: I guess that was inherent because my mother certainly went
Speaker 4: through high school, but my father was never given the
Speaker 4: opportunity to go to high school. And I saw what
Speaker 4: a very able man he was, and how much. It
Speaker 4: really affected his life not being able to go to
Speaker 4: high school and how empowering education is and what a
Speaker 4: responsibility we have to ensure that every student in New
Speaker 4: Zealand gets your opportunity to have a fantastic education.
Speaker 3: Do you think general schools, I mean, this is hard
Speaker 3: to make a judgment on this sort of thing, but
Speaker 3: do you think that we're doing a good job with
Speaker 3: outside of the family home, with the institutions like schools
Speaker 3: of teaching kids about values or are people a bit
Speaker 3: Is it something that you sort of tread lightly because
Speaker 3: I know you get the wrong message out there, or
Speaker 3: something that parents give you a hard time and then
Speaker 3: all of a sudden you're like, hang on, are we
Speaker 3: right doing that? What do you think?
Speaker 4: Oh? I think it's important because I think that not
Speaker 4: only should you be saying and educating about values, but
Speaker 4: you should also be modeling it in the school. And
Speaker 4: I think that's something that parents sometimes as a parent
Speaker 4: it's hard you say what you think, but are you
Speaker 4: really modeling it to your children? And that's always more
Speaker 4: difficult as a parent.
Speaker 3: It's easier in a way for schools, doesn't it to
Speaker 3: sort of push that values because you're not around the
Speaker 3: twenty four to seven where you can be accused of hypocrisy.
Speaker 3: Swearing would be the classic one where you say to
Speaker 3: your kids, don't use that sort of language. Well, dad,
Speaker 3: but I've heard you say that word. And I go, well,
Speaker 3: and I must say, I think I have fallen back
Speaker 3: on the line. It's like, Okay, I've got to be honest.
Speaker 3: I think I've said to them once. Look, I can
Speaker 3: get away with it because I'm better at picking my
Speaker 3: context and all that sort of thing. And I think
Speaker 3: I'm worried to lose in the argument. But does it
Speaker 3: always have to be? Do you always have to exactly
Speaker 3: mirror the values you're teaching your kids? Look, you're going
Speaker 3: to tell me, yes, it is.
Speaker 4: I think you should.
Speaker 3: Yes, definitely to But it's harder for parents though, isn't it.
Speaker 1: Oh?
Speaker 4: It is If you say that you really care and
Speaker 4: about others and you don't want to make sure they're okay,
Speaker 4: and then you, as a parent, don't show that by
Speaker 4: something that you do. It's really hard. You know, what
Speaker 4: are your children picking up on? And it's really hard.
Speaker 4: Nobody's perfect. We'll all make mistakes.
Speaker 3: Well, I guess that's part of it as well. Is
Speaker 3: that if you make mistakes, and it's how you deal
Speaker 3: with that side of things. I always I do struggle
Speaker 3: with the whole hypocrisy things because I guess, for instance,
Speaker 3: there are rules around what adults and children count and
Speaker 3: can't do, and they're different. There's a different set of
Speaker 3: rules as well around alcohol and things like that, and
Speaker 3: so I don't know. I'm not sure how to manage that.
Speaker 3: But we're probably getting off the topic here, but we
Speaker 3: want your cause on this, by the way, is who's
Speaker 3: responsible for teaching your kids' values core values? And if
Speaker 3: you are looking for support beyond that your home on
Speaker 3: teaching your kids' values, what are the values they are
Speaker 3: actually important to you that the school supports your children
Speaker 3: in learning. What do you think some core values are
Speaker 3: sandy when it comes to schools and other parts of
Speaker 3: the community supporting parents with that well, I.
Speaker 4: Think it's important that each student feels that they have
Speaker 4: got something special and that they are confident, and I
Speaker 4: really believe that. I think that if you feel good
Speaker 4: about yourself, then you'll certainly support and help other people.
Speaker 4: I think that if the child is not feeling good
Speaker 4: about themselves, it's very difficult for them to look outside themselves.
Speaker 3: How important for you then at Barradine. And look, it's
Speaker 3: not for you to be singing the praises of Barradine,
Speaker 3: but Baradine at least when it comes to academic results,
Speaker 3: features up the top. There, along with some other very
Speaker 3: fine schools, is part of that academic success absolutely contingent
Speaker 3: on the value side of things, which is a difficult question.
Speaker 3: I know, yes, because you can really drum things into
Speaker 3: people and people can you know, learn by fear? And
Speaker 3: I mean I learned a lot about in one particular
Speaker 3: class because I was terrified of the teacher back in
Speaker 3: the days of corporal punishment, and I probably learned a lot.
Speaker 3: And I'm not sure that was the right way to
Speaker 3: learn it. But then again, there was the teacher. I
Speaker 3: probably learned the most from mister Paul when I was
Speaker 3: eight years old. He he taught us well because we
Speaker 3: loved him. He was great fun. He made us feel
Speaker 3: ten feet high. I think every kid in that class
Speaker 3: felt special that that Again, that wasn't so much about values,
Speaker 3: I don't think, well, maybe it was his there was,
Speaker 3: Maybe there was some sort of values lesson in the
Speaker 3: way he treated us like individual respected human beings even
Speaker 3: though were eight year old, little troublesome upstarts.
Speaker 4: Yep. And I think you probably absorbed that and he
Speaker 4: cared about you. Yeah, And I think that that's what
Speaker 4: teach do. They can look at who's in front of
Speaker 4: them and think, I really care about these students. Now,
Speaker 4: how do I get the best out of them? And
Speaker 4: as for academic success, I think the reason academic success
Speaker 4: is good if each student reaches their potential, is it
Speaker 4: opens doors for the future and it's really a gate
Speaker 4: opening process where it means that they have got possibilities.
Speaker 3: Is it more difficult because one of the things we
Speaker 3: had I think you might have caught this hour we
Speaker 3: had with the principle of Vanguard School as well, which
Speaker 3: surprised me. I was expecting a discussion which was all
Speaker 3: about what we did cover off discipline and things. But
Speaker 3: it was interesting about what was driving their success. But
Speaker 3: the question around discipline, how much does that play a
Speaker 3: part in it? Because we live in a society where
Speaker 3: we obviously don't have physical discipline and I'm quite glad
Speaker 3: about that, But how important a role is that in
Speaker 3: educating kids?
Speaker 4: And I think it's important in students if they make mistakes,
Speaker 4: there are consequences, and I think that's what's hard about
Speaker 4: being a parent is teaching your child consequences at an
Speaker 4: early stage. I think the most difficult thing for schools
Speaker 4: is when parents and schools are not on the same page.
Speaker 3: And how is that possible from because it's there's hundreds
Speaker 3: of parents and hundreds of students in one school. What
Speaker 3: are the sort of are they sort of non negotiable
Speaker 3: I don't mean non negotiable, but what are the clear
Speaker 3: areas of easy overlap? Do you think?
Speaker 4: Well? I think sometimes with schools, a student may make
Speaker 4: a mistake and the school may want the student to
Speaker 4: learn from that mistake, and it needs really the parents
Speaker 4: to be on board with that learning because if it
Speaker 4: doesn't happen, the consequences down the track when they leave
Speaker 4: school and they realize, you know, they've been not made
Speaker 4: to face consequences, it can be quite serious if they
Speaker 4: do silly things.
Speaker 3: So actually, if we were talking about this off I
Speaker 3: was going to say, off camera, off Mike before the
Speaker 3: show started, because you have When you were the principal
Speaker 3: at Barrideen, you would meet every student, There'd be a
Speaker 3: get together and the student would be front and center,
Speaker 3: Mum and dad just on the side there, but you
Speaker 3: would interview them. Was that an important part of sort
Speaker 3: of like an informal contract or agreement. This is what
Speaker 3: our school's about, this is what we expect. Is that
Speaker 3: an important thing for you?
Speaker 4: Is it exactly exactly? Tim ittt was really important and
Speaker 4: being a Catholic school was really important that the parents
Speaker 4: were buying into all that meant and hence the discussion
Speaker 4: because I think it's important people know and therefore there's
Speaker 4: no surprises, it's transparent.
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, look your calls on this, Sandy and I
Speaker 3: are going to continue chatting about this, about the role that,
Speaker 3: as they say, it takes a village, parents, caregivers, family community.
Speaker 3: But and parents do their best. We all do our
Speaker 3: best to instill the values that we hold dear, But
Speaker 3: what are the what role do you tolerate? I guess
Speaker 3: would be the slightly more stronger way of asking the question,
Speaker 3: what role do you tolerate your school making when it
Speaker 3: comes to teaching kids' values? And I know, look, I've
Speaker 3: had a couple of texts with saying that they've got
Speaker 3: no business none, they're not your values. But I don't
Speaker 3: think anyone seriously thinks they don't expect your kids to learn.
Speaker 3: Children to learn some significant values in the way that
Speaker 3: they treat others and the way they respond to challenges
Speaker 3: and all those sorts of things. So what do you
Speaker 3: think and where does when do parents actually have to
Speaker 3: start checking out of that equation? If ever, we'd love
Speaker 3: your calls on it. Eight hundred and eighty ten eighty
Speaker 3: text on nine two nine two. My guest is Sandy Pasley,
Speaker 3: she's a former principal at Barriding College. We'll be back
Speaker 3: in just a moment. News Talk z bun by myself.
Speaker 2: By week the.
Speaker 3: News Talk zed b. My name's Tim Beverages. You know,
Speaker 3: my guest is Sandy Pasley, who's the former princill at
Speaker 3: baradin College. Now the idea, the idea to get Sandy
Speaker 3: on the show as well was because she is I
Speaker 3: haven't had hidden which school my kids go to. Of
Speaker 3: course I share a little bit about them, but they
Speaker 3: do go to Baradene College. And for me, the journey
Speaker 3: to as a non I'm an atheist, as someone who's
Speaker 3: not religious, the decision to go along with my wife's
Speaker 3: decision to send my children to Baradine was huge. But
Speaker 3: that's why I'm fascinated with the role of values, because
Speaker 3: while I have a different view religiously, i was brought
Speaker 3: up in an Anglican schoo all myself, and I've always
Speaker 3: thought that the discussion around values and ethics and morals
Speaker 3: and things, and that the religion comes in and out
Speaker 3: of that equation is a fascinating one because in the end,
Speaker 3: we don't want to just turn out kids who know lots.
Speaker 3: We want to turn out good people. So we're taking
Speaker 3: your cause on how important it is for your school
Speaker 3: to teach your children values. And Sandy's with us right now,
Speaker 3: and I'll shut up and we'll talk to Graham.
Speaker 5: Hello, oh hello, how's it going all right?
Speaker 3: Thanks? What you got a question or an observation? What
Speaker 3: would you like to say.
Speaker 5: More than observation. I've been living in Queensland, Australia for
Speaker 5: probably about four years. I've got two children over there,
Speaker 5: my daughter's sixteen and my son's nineteen, and I would
Speaker 5: have loved to have bought them up, but with their
Speaker 5: special needs and that they were with the grand care
Speaker 5: parents for probably for probably a good eight years or
Speaker 5: so until my mother in law passed away, probably longer
Speaker 5: with my son and my daughter, and so that's one
Speaker 5: of the reasons I went over there. I've just come
Speaker 5: back to New Zealand for a while because I've had
Speaker 5: an auntie that passed away and the other auntie hasn't
Speaker 5: been well.
Speaker 3: You've got a couple of teenagers. I gather they're nineteen
Speaker 3: and sixteen now.
Speaker 5: Ah yeah, no, the both of them are bigger than
Speaker 5: me now, so they're both different from one another. My
Speaker 5: son Caleb, his likes adventure and when we had that
Speaker 5: cyclone over there, he disappeared because he wanted to ghost
Speaker 5: from the flooded creek.
Speaker 3: How did you influence how did you influence their values?
Speaker 3: Then we can bring it on to our the sort
Speaker 3: of focus of our conversation, how you influenced their values
Speaker 3: or have you had to trust others to do it?
Speaker 4: Graham, I've had.
Speaker 5: A good support network. Both my parents have passed away,
Speaker 5: and I haven't been that close to my immediate family
Speaker 5: because I mean they've had their own kids and so forth.
Speaker 5: And but just I'm part of a church group or
Speaker 5: network because I've been to different ones and I've just
Speaker 5: tried to get my son, my daughter. It's a bit
Speaker 5: different she's not, so she's such struggling with.
Speaker 3: Got a question you'd like to put to Sandy. I've
Speaker 3: got to hear, so I want to bring her own
Speaker 3: on the conversation.
Speaker 5: Was it, yeah, oh sure, okay, this kind of thing
Speaker 5: because my children they dropped out of school just like
Speaker 5: a year or two ago.
Speaker 3: Yeah, look, I might just put you on hold there
Speaker 3: and Graham and Steff my produce might have a quick
Speaker 3: tat to this if you want to pass on a
Speaker 3: question for Sandy. But actually that isn't that is a
Speaker 3: What Graham has mentioned is we've got broken families all
Speaker 3: the time, and the challenge of it it is of
Speaker 3: who's raising your children? So I don't even know what
Speaker 3: to say apart from that, what how on a second,
Speaker 3: let's see have Graham's still there? No, No, I'll tell
Speaker 3: you what. We'll move on from that, because I don't
Speaker 3: think we're going to get to the point on that. Hey, Sandy,
Speaker 3: he's a text here that says, hello, Tim and Sandy.
Speaker 3: When I went to school, he called your teacher mister
Speaker 3: or missus. Now it's on a first name basis a
Speaker 3: small point, but a fundamental slip in respect. Thanks mister Tim.
Speaker 3: That's from Shane. Yeah, does it matter how what a
Speaker 3: school's policy is on names? Is that is there something
Speaker 3: in respect on that or is that? What do you
Speaker 3: reckon Sandy.
Speaker 4: Well, I think some schools that might be the case,
Speaker 4: but also a lot of schools probably still call the
Speaker 4: teacher mister or missus or miss and I think that's
Speaker 4: all part of a value in society. We have respect
Speaker 4: for doctors, we call them doctor so and so, and
Speaker 4: it's learning that people have a title and it's nice
Speaker 4: to be respecting of that title. But also the same
Speaker 4: I'd say teachers also respect students as.
Speaker 3: Well, because and in the end, it doesn't matter what
Speaker 3: you're being called if you're not. If you're not treating
Speaker 3: your children or the students with respect, then you're probably
Speaker 3: not going to end much back in return, are you No?
Speaker 4: I agree entirely, And students pick up on that pretty quickly.
Speaker 3: At Barradine, What were the values for that you think
Speaker 3: were important to instill in your students that were, you know,
Speaker 3: the fundamental ones that were also an important part of
Speaker 3: their education.
Speaker 4: I think the big one is respect is respecting who
Speaker 4: you are. Because we were Catholic. Catholic school it's respecting
Speaker 4: that everyone has been given life that's precious, and we
Speaker 4: respect each other but also respect ourselves, and that respect
Speaker 4: has to be fundamental through a school for a school
Speaker 4: to function well. I also think those values of social
Speaker 4: justice are really important. It's and that one of the
Speaker 4: goals at Baradene was social justice impals to action. It's
Speaker 4: not enough to see what needs to be done, it's
Speaker 4: actually important to do it. And that's where you get
Speaker 4: opportunities to actually be of service to the community. Which
Speaker 4: is important.
Speaker 3: Is that one of the is that one of the
Speaker 3: things where we it's one of the modern society traps
Speaker 3: that we have. I don't want to generalize, because we
Speaker 3: all do, don't we But I might say if I
Speaker 3: was generalizing that there is a lot of virtue signaling
Speaker 3: that goes on with perhaps the younger generation, but in
Speaker 3: society in general, people say this is what I stand for.
Speaker 3: I believe in X, Y and Z or saving the
Speaker 3: planet or whatever. But they're not following it up. They're not.
Speaker 3: It's all words and it's not they're not making a
Speaker 3: difference anyone except their friends on social media. Do you
Speaker 3: think that that's a big that's something we need to
Speaker 3: work on more.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I do. And that's why that goal is so
Speaker 4: important that impels to action doing something about it, not
Speaker 4: just talking about it. And I think that's saying that
Speaker 4: your actions speak loud strong than words is really important.
Speaker 3: So what did you do at Barodam with regard to
Speaker 3: those sorts of things to teaching those kids.
Speaker 4: Yell social awareness? As students had to actually go out
Speaker 4: into the community, and it was part of the program
Speaker 4: at year eleven, but they went out for six weeks,
Speaker 4: went into retirement villages, went into schools that needed some support,
Speaker 4: went into places like food banks where they could see
Speaker 4: the need and actually worked and did something about it.
Speaker 4: And I think young people really respond to actually being
Speaker 4: able to get their hands into something and not just
Speaker 4: talk about it.
Speaker 3: Yeah. I was just thinking of the things that you
Speaker 3: were talking about, going in to homes and hospitals or
Speaker 3: where you can do something useful in it. I just
Speaker 3: remember some of the things I've done with charity wise,
Speaker 3: and there's one is a huge difference to doing something
Speaker 3: that's detached from the reality of it and then suddenly
Speaker 3: getting in and being hands on the ground and whatever
Speaker 3: charity that you're involved with makes a huge difference, isn't it.
Speaker 3: Actually we have got Graham. They we're going to give
Speaker 3: a Graham a chance there, Hey Graham, Yeah, hello, Hey,
Speaker 3: what values did you teach your kids and what did
Speaker 3: you leave for your parents and your schools to teach them?
Speaker 5: Well? I was brought up in a Catholic family. I
Speaker 5: had good parents who try to install me good values,
Speaker 5: and they were all I was a youngster of six.
Speaker 5: I've failed at times, but later on I learned about respect.
Speaker 5: God turned my life around from drugs, alcohol and suicide
Speaker 5: for my team, and then I ended up becoming a
Speaker 5: father myself with two children that ended up with special needs.
Speaker 5: They've got add all these different labels that they put
Speaker 5: upon kids, But I just knew that.
Speaker 3: So you must have relied that. You must have relied
Speaker 3: on their school to text me a bit of values
Speaker 3: as well, I guess as well, if you weren't there
Speaker 3: for them at the time.
Speaker 5: Ah. My son went to a good school was Varsity
Speaker 5: Lakes on the Gold Coast, near a place called Rabina.
Speaker 5: And if my son was good and listening to the
Speaker 5: teachers and so forth, they had a therapy dog that
Speaker 5: was there. And my son loves animals and so he
Speaker 5: got to spend time with the dog. You know.
Speaker 3: Oh good stuff, No good stuff. Hey Graham, we're running
Speaker 3: but short of time, so we'll keep moving on. But
Speaker 3: thanks for your core mate, I appreciate it. It is
Speaker 3: twenty four minutes to six News Talks, he'd be The
Speaker 3: question we're looking at is just the role of the
Speaker 3: of organizations like schools and other community organizations outside of
Speaker 3: the home, and how far you expect your children's school
Speaker 3: to teach your kids certain values and what should those
Speaker 3: values be that you'd like them to be taught. It
Speaker 3: is twenty three minutes to six. Back in the moth.
Speaker 6: Oh yeah, swait a minute, this pro closed man.
Speaker 2: Such a time.
Speaker 3: It's welcome back to the show. I'm Tim Beverager. This
Speaker 3: is the weekend Collective Parents Parents Squad and my guest
Speaker 3: is Sandy Pasley, who's a former principal at Barridine College,
Speaker 3: which is a Catholic school. It's a very high performing school.
Speaker 3: But what is the secret and not necessarily what's the secret,
Speaker 3: but what's the role in teaching values to your children?
Speaker 3: Because when we signed our kids up to Burrading, we
Speaker 3: were clear about what sort of values the school was
Speaker 3: going to be teaching our kids regardless of me. It
Speaker 3: was aside from the religion side of things, because well,
Speaker 3: basically I thought I wanted my kids to learn the
Speaker 3: values that Buriing represented. But Sandy, one of the texts
Speaker 3: that's coming has said talked about don't parents pick schools
Speaker 3: based on their values? Not everyone can pick their schools,
Speaker 3: can they? No?
Speaker 4: I mean it's great if parents have got a choice
Speaker 4: and they've got the ability to move to a school
Speaker 4: that they might see as espousing the same values that
Speaker 4: they appreciate. But a lot of schools, for a lot
Speaker 4: of people, they're zoned for a particular school, and it's
Speaker 4: not possible.
Speaker 3: So what happens with this? What's the policy? Do you
Speaker 3: know within the education of the way schools teach certain values,
Speaker 3: because there are some values which is totally subjective.
Speaker 4: There's some pretty inherent values in our education system, as
Speaker 4: I said about social justice, equality, learning, resilience, working hard,
Speaker 4: being respectful.
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, So here's a question on consequences high sanity.
Speaker 3: What consequences to teachers generally use now that corporal punishment
Speaker 3: is not an option. I'm hearing you talking about presenting
Speaker 3: a sense of purpose and value and worth, which I
Speaker 3: imagine deter much bad behavior. Is that sort of part
Speaker 3: of the whole thing is that we fell back too
Speaker 3: much in corporal punishments like where you've stepped out of
Speaker 3: line whack, rather than approaching it from a different angle.
Speaker 4: Yep. I think it's important for students to feel the
Speaker 4: school that they go to that sense of belonging in
Speaker 4: sense of community and sense of being part of something
Speaker 4: that's special and more than themselves.
Speaker 3: Really, is that the biggest part of it, because I
Speaker 3: get the sense that that is probably one of the
Speaker 3: most important things that kids get. Is I shouldn't say
Speaker 3: kids all the time. Children is the community as just
Speaker 3: being part of something that's bigger than themselves. If a
Speaker 3: school gets that right, does a lot of it work
Speaker 3: out for it? Does the rest sort of follow in
Speaker 3: a way without having to get into the nitty gritty
Speaker 3: about other values.
Speaker 4: Yes, it definitely does, I mean, and it's the same
Speaker 4: for parents, and parents are part of that community too,
Speaker 4: and they feel it's their school. You get that tremendous
Speaker 4: support from parent body and that's some things like taking
Speaker 4: sports teams and volunteering and just and also supporting when
Speaker 4: a school makes a decision that they might.
Speaker 3: How do you manage that when you get resistance from
Speaker 3: parents because you know it's a large community. How do
Speaker 3: you manage the pushback from some parents to say, I
Speaker 3: don't like what you've done there?
Speaker 4: Yeah? I think first of all, you've got to listen.
Speaker 4: As a school and as a parent, you can understand
Speaker 4: sometimes where they're coming from, but sometimes as a principal,
Speaker 4: you've got to look at the greater You've got to
Speaker 4: look at everybody and how that's affecting other people. So
Speaker 4: you can't just say it doesn't matter that your child
Speaker 4: does that. It does matter because it is affecting others.
Speaker 4: So you've got to look at the bigger picture.
Speaker 3: How much of a conflict is there between being a
Speaker 3: parent and being a principle for you, because well, they're
Speaker 3: two different jobs, aren't they?
Speaker 4: But they I think they give you a really good
Speaker 4: insight being a parent, which.
Speaker 3: Was more useful, is much more useful to be a
Speaker 3: parent if you were did being a principal help you
Speaker 3: better with being a parent or did it being a
Speaker 3: parent help you more with being a principle.
Speaker 4: I think being a parent helped me with being a principal.
Speaker 4: You understand kids. You understand, they make mistakes, You realize,
Speaker 4: you know how difficult it can be for them transitioning
Speaker 4: certain times in their life. And I think you've got
Speaker 4: that greater understanding. That's not to say somebody who's not
Speaker 4: got children is not understanding, but it's it's.
Speaker 3: Just an aspect of your life which you bring to
Speaker 3: the job. I guess here's a text, he says, Hey, mate,
Speaker 3: my children's school has a meet the teacher in term
Speaker 3: four for the next year's class, and parents are giving
Speaker 3: one given a one page of the new teachers values
Speaker 3: and hobbies, et cetera, and things like that. The school
Speaker 3: try is hard to match children to teachers and families
Speaker 3: to see see the starts and values of the teachers,
Speaker 3: and families aren't happy with the match for whatever reason.
Speaker 3: Pros and cons with us, of course, because one year
Speaker 3: the neighbors saw the teacher was a different religion to
Speaker 3: theirs and took their kids out of that class. That's
Speaker 3: a little problematic, isn't it. You been a little bit
Speaker 3: too helpful?
Speaker 4: Absolutely goodness, I think that would be quite hard to
Speaker 4: run a school like that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, let's have a look at a couple of
Speaker 3: other texts I, Sandy, what consequences? Oh, Sor, I've already
Speaker 3: read that one. I've just got a little note for
Speaker 3: you from someone who was taught you taught at y Tech.
Speaker 3: It says Sandy Pasley was an inspiring and fun chemistry teacher.
Speaker 3: When she taught me at why Tachi, we learned, well,
Speaker 3: here's the list. We learned kindness, respect and responsibility from her.
Speaker 3: Of great memories of having Sandy's baby daughter Penny in
Speaker 3: the classroom. Thanks to Sandy, I passed bursary chemistry. Now
Speaker 3: I love teaching chemistry to primary school children. So there
Speaker 3: you go.
Speaker 4: Oh that's so nice to Did you have your.
Speaker 3: Baby with your class went back to work early?
Speaker 4: I did, and I can tell you a funny story
Speaker 4: about that, because they were desperate for a chemistry teacher.
Speaker 4: And I came back. I was on maternity leave and
Speaker 4: Penny was a bit of a monkey on stage.
Speaker 3: She your baby daughter.
Speaker 4: Yeah, she was underneath the desk when I was teaching
Speaker 4: chemistry and she one day she took off all her
Speaker 4: clothes and I had to get the whole class not
Speaker 4: to react because otherwise it would have been something she
Speaker 4: did all the time.
Speaker 3: That does sound a difficult one these days, doesn't it?
Speaker 3: With THEE in a chemistry lab. Yeah, anyway, I look
Speaker 3: what else we got. It's not a school's okay, it's
Speaker 3: not a school's job to teach values, but it's vitally
Speaker 3: important that the values of the school and in the
Speaker 3: home are consistent or at least simpatico with each other.
Speaker 6: Well.
Speaker 3: That seems like a bit of common sense, doesn't it.
Speaker 4: Definitely?
Speaker 3: So what are you up to from now that you've
Speaker 3: we haven't retired, you have your former principal at Barode
Speaker 3: But what's what are the challenges that you're working on
Speaker 3: now in education?
Speaker 4: Well, Tim, I've set up a company as an education consultant,
Speaker 4: and what I'd like to do is support the education
Speaker 4: in Auckland in ways that I can, especially leaders in
Speaker 4: Auckland principles.
Speaker 3: Yeah, was it hard to leave the job of being
Speaker 3: principal at Baradine.
Speaker 4: Very I loved it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I imagine it must have been a hell of it.
Speaker 3: In fact, I imagine you probably have to keep away
Speaker 3: for a little bit, don't you, Because when you've been
Speaker 3: a principle of some standing in that community, you sort
Speaker 3: of got to remove yourself from the shadow of the
Speaker 3: or not cast your shadow, I guess, isn't it?
Speaker 4: Or Alex the new Principal's fantastic. So I think Baradine's
Speaker 4: future is in great hands.
Speaker 3: Yeah, hey, look, we'd love to have you back sometime.
Speaker 3: That has flown by, and it's lovely to have you
Speaker 3: in the studio. Thanks so much, and we'll look forard
Speaker 3: to catching you know.
Speaker 4: Thanks very much, Tom, I've enjoyed it.
Speaker 3: Cheers. We'll be back in just a moment with sport.
Speaker 3: Who's joining us? Nathan Lim will be joining us in
Speaker 3: just a moment. This is news Talk, said B. It's
Speaker 3: coming up to twelve minutes to six.
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