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Speaker 1: The All Blacks in England name so they have named

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Speaker 1: their teams for the second Test match at Eden Park

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Speaker 1: on Saturday. There's just one change for both teams. Finnly

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Speaker 1: Christie's going to start in the place of t J.

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Speaker 1: Perinado who's out with an injury, and Finn Baxter is

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Speaker 1: going to start in the place of Joe Mahler. Both

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Speaker 1: again another one another injury sustaining last week's match. Chris

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Speaker 1: Jones is a BBC rugby commentator and is with us

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Speaker 1: now in the studio.

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Speaker 2: Hey, Chris, great to be here, Heather.

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Speaker 1: How are you are you feeling confident?

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Speaker 2: I think there's a degree of confidence because this England's

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Speaker 2: team has been on a good trajectory. You know that

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Speaker 2: they struggled a year ago, got to the third place

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Speaker 2: of the World Cup, then come the Six Nations Again,

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Speaker 2: the start didn't look up too much and then ever

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Speaker 2: since the midpoint of the Six Nations have really been

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Speaker 2: been growing and they will have seen last weekend as

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Speaker 2: a missed opportunity. Their challenge now is to go right.

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Speaker 2: They can go toe to toe with the All Blacks.

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Speaker 2: There are areas to work on. Can they fix those?

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Speaker 2: Because you know the All Blacks are going to be

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Speaker 2: coming strong, especially at a place like Keet in.

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Speaker 1: Part Yeah, absolutely, What do you make you think that

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Speaker 1: confident because of how they're performing? When you look at

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Speaker 1: how the All Blacks are performing, what do you think?

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Speaker 2: Well? I think it was really notable. The main emotion

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Speaker 2: from Scott Robertson after the game was relief, wasn't it.

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Speaker 2: It wasn't kind of ecstasy, It wasn't joy, it wasn't

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Speaker 2: kind of unbridled happiness. It was just relief because he's

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Speaker 2: been waiting for this job for so long, not just

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Speaker 2: the kind of years with the Crusaders, but even the

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Speaker 2: last sixteen months since he's been appointed. And you can't

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Speaker 2: really start with the loss of the All Blacks coach,

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Speaker 2: candn't you? And he would have had it up against

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Speaker 2: him because you know, their preparation was only ten days,

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Speaker 2: England been in camp for longer, England looking settled, the

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Speaker 2: All Blacks and a load of players not around since

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Speaker 2: the World Cup. So they then played in eight months

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Speaker 2: have felt like the chance for England to catch New

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Speaker 2: Zealand cold, and they almost did so. Robertson probably feels

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Speaker 2: so relieved he's got that done. An extra week together

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Speaker 2: really noticeable how both coaches have gone. Look, let's not

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Speaker 2: mess around with the team selection. Of course Perinara and

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Speaker 2: Marlon need to be replaced, but Robertson is thinking not

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Speaker 2: have much time make the one change he's got to make.

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Speaker 2: Apart from that, it's just about getting those combinations, honing

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Speaker 2: them and trying to get the Scott Robertson All Blacks

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Speaker 2: way up and running.

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Speaker 1: What is it about the English team that has become

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Speaker 1: so difficult for the All Blacks lately? It feels like

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Speaker 1: they they are harder to beat than they should be.

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Speaker 2: I think that those are the operative words, hard to

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Speaker 2: beat and I think this England team has become hard

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Speaker 2: to beat and I think that's something Steve Borthwick could coach,

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Speaker 2: has been trying to drill in them for the last

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Speaker 2: year eighteen months or so. I think it's to do

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Speaker 2: with the defense, things to do with some of the

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Speaker 2: types of players they've got. Now, you know, kind of

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Speaker 2: out of nowhere. England have got a core of young

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Speaker 2: guys that have really announced themselves on the international stage.

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Speaker 2: You wouldn't have seen loads of them down here because

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Speaker 2: it was mainly during the Six Nations, but guys like

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Speaker 2: Chandler Cunning himself. He's familiar because he knows New Zealand

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Speaker 2: so well having lived here as a boy. Guys like

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Speaker 2: many fair Bosa, George Martin at second row. There's a

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Speaker 2: few players now who just started to look more and

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Speaker 2: more comfortable at Test level, and the more comfortable to get,

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Speaker 2: the more experienced to get, the more chance they'll have

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Speaker 2: a winning those kind of arm wrestles. But all Steve

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Speaker 2: Borthwick coach teams over the years have been really hard

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Speaker 2: to beat, first and foremost, and he's definitely trying to

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Speaker 2: instill this in England team.

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Speaker 1: What's you take on Razer? Is he the one?

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Speaker 2: Look? I think it was his time. I wouldn't say

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Speaker 2: the whole process was handled that well, was it? You know?

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Speaker 2: He was? I dare say it's been a few hours

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Speaker 2: of air tive on this station taken up talking about

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Speaker 2: how it was all handled with kind of you know,

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Speaker 2: it looked like Ian Foster was going to go in

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty two, kind of getting the stay of execution,

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Speaker 2: then being told you're not going to continue even if

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Speaker 2: you win the World Cup, which he so only did,

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Speaker 2: and man, they got so close in that that final.

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Speaker 2: But it's felt as if Roberson has been the coming

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Speaker 2: man for years. It's so interesting. He's not part of this,

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Speaker 2: this lineage of All Blacks coaches that you've had with

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Speaker 2: Sir Graham, Henry and Steve Hanson and Foster, all great mates,

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Speaker 2: worked for each other, all a certain style, certain type

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Speaker 2: of personality, done wonderful things. Robinson's different, isn't he. You know,

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Speaker 2: He's got that kind of unique personality. The way he

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Speaker 2: thinks and talks and answers questions very very different. So

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Speaker 2: it's exciting for us to get to know someone new.

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Speaker 2: But ultimately, an All Blacks coach is judged between the whitewashes,

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Speaker 2: isn't he?

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Speaker 1: You know, he's not affoord to He can't afford to

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Speaker 1: lose the first match? Can he afford to lose the second?

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Speaker 2: No? I think, I mean I think he can he can.

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Speaker 2: I think that'd be I was going to say a

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Speaker 2: degree of patients from the All Blacks fans, but I

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Speaker 2: don't think. You know, it's not the most patient fan

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Speaker 2: based on for obvious reasons. You guys demand success and standardly,

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Speaker 2: so I think when he knows what's coming up with,

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Speaker 2: you know, games against South Africa Rugby Championship Tour at

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Speaker 2: the end of the year. I think he saw this

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Speaker 2: England series and probably thought, oh, that's a banana skin

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Speaker 2: that that's tricky. That's a bit of a tough series

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Speaker 2: to get through, no time with the players having to

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Speaker 2: deal with and you set up lots of experienced players

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Speaker 2: overseas on not available new captain. So I think if

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Speaker 2: he came away with two nil, regardless of how it

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Speaker 2: comes about. And I know all Blacks fans want running

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Speaker 2: rugby and triest in the end of the earth, but

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Speaker 2: I think any to nil against an England team that

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Speaker 2: have come down here with a real point to prove

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Speaker 2: would be a really good result for Robertson to get

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Speaker 2: that Regiene up and running.

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Speaker 1: Chris, thank you. I really appreciate you. I hope you

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Speaker 1: have a terrible night on set.

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Speaker 2: I'm sure we will. I think I look either way,

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Speaker 2: it's test magic Eden Park. We've loved our week in

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Speaker 2: Awk and we've loved last day in New Zealand, so

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Speaker 2: let we goin have a good time whatever.

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Speaker 1: Brilliant stuff. Thank you so much, Mike go Well. That's

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Speaker 1: Chris Jones, BBC Rugby commentator.

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Speaker 2: news talks it'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow

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