Speaker 1: Yoda.
Speaker 2: I'm Chelsea Daniels and This is the Front Page, a
Speaker 2: daily podcast.
Speaker 3: Presented by the New Zealand Herald.
Speaker 2: New Zealand fashion has had a shakeup in recent years,
Speaker 2: with both well known and homegrown brands shutting up shop
Speaker 2: Kate Sylvester will shut its doors this year after thirty
Speaker 2: one years of trade, and newer labels like Mina, Heyhei
Speaker 2: and Nissa have all ended production. The struggles are perhaps
Speaker 2: best epitomized by New Zealand Fashion Week, which canceled its
Speaker 2: twenty twenty four season after cancelations in twenty twenty, twenty
Speaker 2: twenty one and twenty twenty two, and the issues show
Speaker 2: no sign of stopping, with global trade wars highlighting how
Speaker 2: many designers actually manufacture their goods in China, Vietnam and
Speaker 2: Cambodia all hit hard by tariffs. Today on the Front
Speaker 2: Page to discuss the state of.
Speaker 4: The industry, we're joined by Weaver's departing fashion and creative director,
Speaker 4: Dan Alwa. So Dan, when you think of New Zealand fashion,
Speaker 4: what first comes to mind?
Speaker 5: That's a really great question. Has changed so much over
Speaker 5: the years, but I think the first thing that comes
Speaker 5: to mind is our innovation. You think of brands like
Speaker 5: Untouched World, for example, who are such a stalwar of
Speaker 5: New Zealand manufacturing. Their textile innovation is incredible. And over
Speaker 5: the years, you think of designers like the ones that
Speaker 5: showed at London Fashion We can the early two thousands
Speaker 5: that cohort of Karen Walker's and Busy World. You think
Speaker 5: of innovation, and you think of creativity, and because of
Speaker 5: our proximity to the rest of the world, we just
Speaker 5: are resourceful and.
Speaker 3: The textiles and stuff as well.
Speaker 2: Like you mentioned like Untouched World, I think of Marino,
Speaker 2: you know, I think of Cashmere Juliet Hogan on the
Speaker 2: world stage, those moments and those prints and everything. It's
Speaker 2: quite nice to kind of look at a New Zealand
Speaker 2: designer and kind of know that they're from New Zealand.
Speaker 5: Almost There's a huge appetite for New Zealand fashion on
Speaker 5: the world stage and there will continue to be in
Speaker 5: the past, now and into the future. Even now we're
Speaker 5: looking at the incredible work that Ambia work Sted has
Speaker 5: done for the Air New Zealand uniforms, and just recently
Speaker 5: there's two Kiwi designers confirmed for the Australian Fashion Week
Speaker 5: schedule in may Win, Hamlin and Paris, Georgia. So brands
Speaker 5: like that will continue to fly the flag for New
Speaker 5: Zealand fashion. And I think we really do punch above
Speaker 5: our weight in terms of what we can deliver in
Speaker 5: terms of fashion. Good design qualities really paramount and right
Speaker 5: now we're thinking about how to close the gap and
Speaker 5: make more of a circular economy around textile waste and
Speaker 5: finding waste to be less wasteful with the way that
Speaker 5: we consume.
Speaker 2: You've mentioned a lot of those big brands as well,
Speaker 2: but there are also those smaller, down to earth kind
Speaker 2: of homegrown brands as well. And I noticed that Nissa
Speaker 2: is one of the latest brands to shut down. They
Speaker 2: cited a continued decline in sales while costs kept rising.
Speaker 2: In a statement that staff said, if we raise our
Speaker 2: prices anymore to cover these our products will become less
Speaker 2: attainable for our customers. Now, is that one of the
Speaker 2: main hurdles for these local brands, the cost to actually
Speaker 2: make things on shore.
Speaker 5: It's one of the biggest hurdles for all fashion brands
Speaker 5: at the moment, whatever level you are, whether you're established
Speaker 5: or emerging, and if you want good quality garments, especially
Speaker 5: with the brand like Nissa who trade in undergarments. You
Speaker 5: want these garments to last as long as as they can,
Speaker 5: so to invest in good quality fabrics and to pay
Speaker 5: people the fair wage to create these onshore, it does
Speaker 5: require a lot of sacrifice, and I think there's a
Speaker 5: disconnect between the consumer and designers, where designers are really
Speaker 5: trying to focus on good quality manufacturing. There's not a
Speaker 5: lot of manufacturing left in New Zealand, but the manufacturers
Speaker 5: that we do have we have to try and support
Speaker 5: because I think what people forget is they have the
Speaker 5: power to spend money not only on the brands, but
Speaker 5: they're actually supporting a whole infrastructure behind the designers. It's
Speaker 5: the pantern makers, it's the suppliers, it's the logistics. So
Speaker 5: there's a whole industry of people that we need to
Speaker 5: get behind to really support the local industry to see
Speaker 5: them survive. And so when you mentioned brands like that,
Speaker 5: it is quite sad to hear because it has been
Speaker 5: really challenging. There's just not enough of a market here
Speaker 5: to scale. So they're comparing with ultra fast fashion, which
Speaker 5: is the likes of Tamil and Shin it's really disheartening
Speaker 5: for a designer to sort of compete with that competition
Speaker 5: when the consumers are really stall driven by price. And
Speaker 5: when you think about it, New Zealand Made it used
Speaker 5: to have a really beautiful cachet when we had campaign
Speaker 5: maybe I think in the late eighties, early nineties, and
Speaker 5: today it's sort of is the same as a premium
Speaker 5: Japanese denum, you know. I think New Zealand Made we
Speaker 5: have to really think about what that actually stands for now,
Speaker 5: and I think it's a really critical time.
Speaker 6: We're just going to keep growing a business, but it's
Speaker 6: not just about growth. It's one of the things that
Speaker 6: upset me early on was that no one could talk
Speaker 6: about anything about how big businesses were or what the
Speaker 6: GDP of the country was. There was no conversation about
Speaker 6: what was happening to the planet and the people on
Speaker 6: the way through to get those numbers. So we'll definitely
Speaker 6: keep growing.
Speaker 2: How do we change the consumer's mindset into buying underwear
Speaker 2: that cost fifty dollars but will last you potentially a
Speaker 2: lifetime if you look after them, versus a pack of
Speaker 2: ten for ten bucks.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think we're just really spoiled by choice. I
Speaker 5: think that's what we're comparing with in terms of these
Speaker 5: fast fashion retailers. So when you work in media, when
Speaker 5: you're talking to designers, we really have to nail the
Speaker 5: message home that shopping local is better for the long term,
Speaker 5: not for the short term. Buying underwear or bad quality
Speaker 5: clothing that's destined for landfall will only last you so long,
Speaker 5: so have to really educate consumers about that. So in
Speaker 5: twenty twenty four, Mindful Fashion New Zealand teamed up with
Speaker 5: EY to release a industry report called Threads of Tomorrow,
Speaker 5: which was really a comprehensive lock at the wider industry
Speaker 5: and how much value it brings to the economy. And
Speaker 5: I think in twenty twenty three the fashion industry actually
Speaker 5: accounted for one point nine percent of the GDP, which
Speaker 5: is more than the building industry, but that's a paralleln
Speaker 5: retail sector combine. So in terms of supporting the local
Speaker 5: fashion industry, it's just really about getting behind our designers
Speaker 5: and really changing the mindset of how we consume. Think,
Speaker 5: you know, with the announcement of the tariffs, for example,
Speaker 5: that maybe that will be it's sort of a wait
Speaker 5: and see what will happen there because it's how that
Speaker 5: impacts and trickles down to our designers. We've got to
Speaker 5: really stay in touch with how that impacts them. It's
Speaker 5: very much a wait and see.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you mentioned the tariffs as well, and I
Speaker 2: know that a lot of those She and Timmy, those
Speaker 2: ultra fast fashion retailers that just pump out those micro
Speaker 2: trends and trends, and that's what you see on the
Speaker 2: TikTok the Instagram. That's what the kids are going for
Speaker 2: those massive halls with all these clothes and everything. Hopefully
Speaker 2: the tariffs, so that's the tariffs are going to make
Speaker 2: those clothes more expensive to Americans. Do you think that
Speaker 2: how Americans shop and how Americans treat trends does trickle
Speaker 2: down to New Zealand and how consumers here feel?
Speaker 3: Yes, sir no.
Speaker 5: I think as New Zealand is because we're so isolated
Speaker 5: by nature. We are opshop lovers, We love vintage. There's
Speaker 5: an opshop in every small talent in New Zealand. And
Speaker 5: I think we are pioneers in terms of sustainable fashion design.
Speaker 5: So I feel like as a nation we are inherently
Speaker 5: more connected to the environment. So yes, there's a truckle
Speaker 5: down impact from the way that Americans consume, but the
Speaker 5: way that we consume is a little bit different. So
Speaker 5: I think that will serve us well in this period
Speaker 5: while we're going through this change. And to go back
Speaker 5: to your question around educating the consumers around being better shoppers,
Speaker 5: I think we just have to keep reminding each other
Speaker 5: that New Zealand is naturally concerned about the planet and
Speaker 5: the environment, and we do have talented designers that are
Speaker 5: coming up with solutions to be more sustainable designers.
Speaker 2: So I don't know about you, but I've seen online
Speaker 2: videos of these Chinese manufacturers lifting the lead, so to speak,
Speaker 2: on which high luxury ash and brands actually have their
Speaker 2: goods made in China. So from Prita to Tzara to Lululemon,
Speaker 2: people are thinking, well, why am I paying X amount
Speaker 2: when it only costs so much to make Why do
Speaker 2: you think people are so surprised by this.
Speaker 5: I think because we live in an era where everyone's
Speaker 5: talking about digital marketing and marketing, and you know, consumers
Speaker 5: are still there's like an allure to luxury. But I
Speaker 5: think that's changing too. I think people are realizing, you know,
Speaker 5: with a report like that factories make the same handbags
Speaker 5: as they do for say a sublux brand like Michael
Speaker 5: Cores or Caspade, and then it trickles down to something
Speaker 5: that you might find in a department store. They all
Speaker 5: come from the same factory at the end of the day.
Speaker 5: I think it's a good thing that we're communicating that,
Speaker 5: and I think the luxury industry should be more transparent.
Speaker 5: And that's not to sort of paint all luxury brands
Speaker 5: in the same light. I think there's something to be
Speaker 5: said about brands that still manufacture and quality controlled factories.
Speaker 5: So there's an artisanal aspect to luxury that is inherently
Speaker 5: sustainable too. So yeah, it's an interesting one. I've seen
Speaker 5: those tiktoks two and I think they're quite funny.
Speaker 1: This is Ermes Penny Himalaya. It is the shared dream
Speaker 1: or Chinese women. No, not just Chinese, it is the
Speaker 1: shared dream of all human women.
Speaker 3: Do you know how much it cost?
Speaker 1: That's the pootique two hundred and sinty thousand US dollars.
Speaker 1: But do you want to know what the price we
Speaker 1: have for our bag made by our factory. Well, I'll
Speaker 1: just Terry Risk. That's the one tenth of the price
Speaker 1: at the Potick. And what you should see and know
Speaker 1: is that we use exactly the same leather. This is
Speaker 1: crabile letter, exactly the same as Ermes.
Speaker 2: So jarring to see these brands and these clothes and
Speaker 2: bags that we love so much, the Emes belt bag
Speaker 2: or something, you know, and seeing them in that kind
Speaker 2: of environment, it's kind.
Speaker 3: Of like a switch up, like oh oh wow. But that,
Speaker 3: like you.
Speaker 2: Said, there are still a tilias in Paris. But at
Speaker 2: the same time, you know, brands like Prata do manufacture
Speaker 2: the goods in China because brands in France are seeing
Speaker 2: the same thing as the brands in New Zealand, that
Speaker 2: it's getting costlier to make stuff.
Speaker 5: And it's a whole education piece. And that's not to
Speaker 5: say that making in China's bad. I think made in
Speaker 5: China is really It's changed a lot over the years,
Speaker 5: and some of those factories have cutting each technology that
Speaker 5: you can't find anywhere. It's the reason why so many
Speaker 5: of our designers manufacture in China. But you're right, I
Speaker 5: think you know, it is quite gyring to see a
Speaker 5: brand that's so world renowned, you know, made in these
Speaker 5: factories and it might be certain categories. For example, you've
Speaker 5: got the footwear in China, but then you've got sort
Speaker 5: of the ready to wear in Paris. So it's kind
Speaker 5: of like, I think it's a good thing that the consumer.
Speaker 5: The more the consumer is educated, the better we are,
Speaker 5: and it trickles down to how we consume locally.
Speaker 2: So I also read an article about the fashion industry
Speaker 2: break for the impact of Trump's tariffs and a comment
Speaker 2: about it potentially setting the sector back fifty years, right.
Speaker 2: But then on the other hand, I read another article
Speaker 2: that in the fifties and sixties, ninety five percent of
Speaker 2: clothes that America wore were made in America, and that's
Speaker 2: now two percent. So could a reset for the industry
Speaker 2: actually end up being a good thing for local manufacturing.
Speaker 5: It's early days. I feel like it's watch and wait
Speaker 5: and see, because you could see it both ways. But
Speaker 5: either way, I think a reset is a really good
Speaker 5: way to look at it. There are pros and cons,
Speaker 5: and I think it also depends on the capability of
Speaker 5: onshore manufacturers. Do we have the infrastructure still that we
Speaker 5: used to have fifty sixty years ago? Does America even
Speaker 5: have that? So we really have to question that and
Speaker 5: look at our cottage industries. We have to look at
Speaker 5: our makers, our knitters, our weavers and really kind of
Speaker 5: find solution to come together to work together. And it's
Speaker 5: one of the reasons why there's so few and far
Speaker 5: between opportunities for the industry to connect. So I'm excited
Speaker 5: also to talk about New Zealand Fashion Week coming back
Speaker 5: because that is an opportunity to look at that event differently.
Speaker 5: You know, I think a lot of the argument over
Speaker 5: the years is that it's turned into some sort of
Speaker 5: influencer playground. But one of the missions this is to
Speaker 5: really connect with designers to come up with solutions for them,
Speaker 5: to find ways to get people backshopping, supporting local and
Speaker 5: working with designers to figure out how they want to
Speaker 5: turn up. Designers don't have the resources that they used to,
Speaker 5: So do they want to do an ind season store
Speaker 5: event in store? Why not? You know? Does it always
Speaker 5: have to be a runway show? Can it be conversations,
Speaker 5: Can it be lunches. Can it be a chance to
Speaker 5: network and meet people in real life? Because we just
Speaker 5: currently don't have that. So I think the more that
Speaker 5: the industry is able to have opportunities to come together
Speaker 5: to meet other people in the industry, not just for
Speaker 5: designers to meet other designers, but designers to actually connect
Speaker 5: with the wider industry. I think that's when you can
Speaker 5: start thinking about the solutions that are urgent and how
Speaker 5: we can come together to talk to government about support
Speaker 5: because there's just a huge lack of support there.
Speaker 2: And in terms of New Zealand Fashion Week, have you
Speaker 2: seen any other fashion weeks around the globe that have
Speaker 2: taken things from the runway, say, and taking them into
Speaker 2: real world situations.
Speaker 3: What are some cool ideas that you've seen.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think Copenhagen Fashion Week is one that we've
Speaker 5: been looking at closely, just in terms of the way
Speaker 5: they organize the programming. There's a diversity in programming that's
Speaker 5: relevant to the consumer, which is really important. Traditionally New
Speaker 5: Zealand Fashion Week's been a trade event, but increasingly it's
Speaker 5: become more sort of half trade half consumer, which it
Speaker 5: has to be to survive. And so some might argue
Speaker 5: that it becomes a fashion festival and not a fashion week,
Speaker 5: but it's sort of like, to me, they're both the same.
Speaker 5: With semantics, It's like the public doesn't care it's a
Speaker 5: week long event of fashion that they can be involved with.
Speaker 5: I'm excited about that. And Copenhagen's really been a good
Speaker 5: one to look up in terms of how they approach sustainability.
Speaker 5: London Fashion Week's another good one. I think they really
Speaker 5: made a huge commitment to making it actually a sustainable
Speaker 5: fashion week across the board. So yeah, I mean it's
Speaker 5: returning to New Zealand in August and I hope that
Speaker 5: people turn up for it, and after a hiatus last year,
Speaker 5: but it's a chance for us to really look at
Speaker 5: what fashion means to us as New Zealanders, how we
Speaker 5: can support our designers. Yeah, and a time where we're
Speaker 5: sort of questioning our identity as a country, I think
Speaker 5: how we get dressed in the morning is still something
Speaker 5: that we have power over.
Speaker 2: And Dan Media Watch recently asked if there's life in
Speaker 2: lifestyle journalism in New Zealand now, do you think that
Speaker 2: there is and how does that flow onto the success
Speaker 2: of our local industries.
Speaker 5: I think there is, you know. I think having worked
Speaker 5: on beav and the brand and built it up with
Speaker 5: a really great team for the last ten plus years,
Speaker 5: we've seen changes come and go in the media in general.
Speaker 5: Lead alone lifestyle. But I still feel like this value
Speaker 5: with strong lifestyle content in a newsroom environment. Not everyone
Speaker 5: wants to be bombarded with hard news every single day,
Speaker 5: and I think there's value in lifestyle journalism. I think
Speaker 5: even here at in Zinni, we have the best lifestyle
Speaker 5: journalists in the country, so I think that's something to
Speaker 5: be incredibly proud of. I'm excited, especially about the independent
Speaker 5: lifestyle media that we have. You know, we've got some
Speaker 5: great examples here like Ensemble Magazine, Capsule, even a heritage
Speaker 5: magazine like Fashion Quarterly that's independent. So I think there's
Speaker 5: room for everybody at the table. But I think we
Speaker 5: also need to think about the quality of content that
Speaker 5: we're putting out there and really investing in our lifestyle journalists.
Speaker 2: Are you optimistic for the future of fashion in news Land?
Speaker 2: I saw just this week that Kate Sylvesta's sons are
Speaker 2: actually going to keep one of her brands going despite
Speaker 2: her namesake brand closing, which is an amazing development. Are
Speaker 2: there more bright spots like this out there?
Speaker 5: I think there are, But I think, as going back
Speaker 5: to Las Star Media, it's our responsibility to shine a
Speaker 5: light on those stories as well as the closures, So
Speaker 5: I'm excited about it. I think it's a brilliant story
Speaker 5: because the boys three sons are all graduates of design
Speaker 5: and they've been working with the business since they were teenagers,
Speaker 5: so it's a natural progression for them. But it's a
Speaker 5: really good timely conversation to have because we're thinking about
Speaker 5: succession plans for some of our established brands. It's like
Speaker 5: where to next when you've got people that are figureheads
Speaker 5: in those businesses, but you know, getting on in age,
Speaker 5: and I think it's really important to think about the
Speaker 5: future right now. And I feel positive. You know, I've
Speaker 5: been in this industry for over twenty years, and it's
Speaker 5: you know, it's easy to be jaded in an economy
Speaker 5: that's so small like New Zealand, but actually there's some
Speaker 5: really great stories to continue telling and to celebrate. And
Speaker 5: I think we're so creative and innovative, you know, as
Speaker 5: a country, and I think that's something to still hold
Speaker 5: on to.
Speaker 3: Thanks for joining us, Dan, Thanks.
Speaker 5: For having me.
Speaker 2: That's it for this episode of the Front Page. You
Speaker 2: can read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage
Speaker 2: at enzedherld dot co dot enz. The Front Page is
Speaker 2: produced by Ethan Sills and Richard Martin, who is also
Speaker 2: our sound engineer.
Speaker 3: I'm Chelsea Daniels.
Speaker 2: Subscribe to the front page on iHeartRadio or wherever you
Speaker 2: get your podcasts, and tune in tomorrow for another look
Speaker 2: behind the headlines.