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Speaker 1: Look, it's been revealed that a man who killed a

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Speaker 1: person more than twenty years ago, who was ruled insane

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Speaker 1: at the time, has gone on to kill again. So

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Speaker 1: after the first killing, the man was found not guilty

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Speaker 1: of murder by way of insanity. He was then detained

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Speaker 1: in a special secure unit, and then he was released

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Speaker 1: into the community about ten years ago, and since then

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Speaker 1: he stabbed a person to death. Ruth Money is the

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Speaker 1: chief Victims advisers to the government have Ruth Hi Ruth.

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Speaker 1: Was this a case of this guy having another breakdown

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Speaker 1: that no one could see coming? Or did everyone know

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Speaker 1: he was a risk and they should have been watching

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Speaker 1: him and they didn't And there's a system breakdown here?

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Speaker 1: Which of the two is it?

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Speaker 2: I believe there is a system breakdown and that is

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Speaker 2: why I am very involved in calling for reviews of

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Speaker 2: this and other mental health status changes.

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Speaker 1: What is the system breakdown? What went wrong here?

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Speaker 2: Well? Mental health forendsic. Mental health units are there to

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Speaker 2: protect the person who was the patient, but also the community. Essentially,

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Speaker 2: you will be sentenced either via the court and into

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Speaker 2: a corrections facility so a prison or a community service,

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Speaker 2: or you will be sentenced and sent off under the

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Speaker 2: Mental Health Act to live in a forensic unit. The

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Speaker 2: problem that I believe is that in those units we

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Speaker 2: are treating people and we are not looking with a

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Speaker 2: view of risk assessment and the risk assessment to themselves

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Speaker 2: and all the community.

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Speaker 1: And so are you arguing that, Okay, so he didn't

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Speaker 1: get the right kind of treatment that you think should

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Speaker 1: have happened, or the right kind of assessment. But are

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Speaker 1: you saying then he shouldn't have been let out.

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Speaker 2: I am somewhere in this person's history and it will

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Speaker 2: all come out. I am sure this person's status has

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Speaker 2: changed to be able to be released back into the community. Now,

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Speaker 2: there are senior people, There are assessments that need to happen,

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Speaker 2: and there are senior people that sign off on that.

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Speaker 2: And this is not a one off event, which is

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Speaker 2: why I am involved and why I think there needs

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Speaker 2: to be a review, probably actually a Royal commission into

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Speaker 2: how are we assessing people in these forensic mental health

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Speaker 2: units to make sure that they are not released and

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Speaker 2: will reoffend.

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Speaker 1: So reading the case, and to be fair, there is

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Speaker 1: not a lot of detail that is available publicly because

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Speaker 1: of all the suppression around it, and so there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of secrecy. But what is available suggests that he

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Speaker 1: was let out ten years ago and he's actually been

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Speaker 1: okay mentally and then there was a breakdown. So would

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Speaker 1: you say that even if he looks okay, he stays

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Speaker 1: in there.

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Speaker 2: No, But what I would say is he needs to

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Speaker 2: stay or this person people in this environment need to

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Speaker 2: stay engaged with care and therapy and treatment. Just as

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Speaker 2: when you kill someone and you get a life sentence,

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Speaker 2: you may get out on parole, you're always recallable, and

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Speaker 2: so we need to be really clear here that while

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Speaker 2: the offenders in this environment go into a forensic mental

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Speaker 2: health unit, they then are treated and sent back into

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Speaker 2: the community, whereas if you go to prison with life

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Speaker 2: and of course victims that way, then you are always

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Speaker 2: recallable and you are always managed by the prole board.

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Speaker 2: What is happening in the mental health space is not

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Speaker 2: good enough. These people are going on to kill and

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Speaker 2: it is not good enough. It is too dangerous for

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Speaker 2: the community, and there needs to be a level of

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Speaker 2: inquiry that has teeth. We've got the issues in Hilmorton

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Speaker 2: and now we've got the issues here revealed with this

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Speaker 2: particular person. What else is happening.

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Speaker 1: Ruth, thanks very much for talking us throud to appreciate

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Speaker 1: it as Ruth Money, the government Chief Victims Advisor. For

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Speaker 1: more from Heather Duplessy Allen Drive Listen Lived to US Hawks.

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Speaker 1: It'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow the podcast

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