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Speaker 1: So Winston Peter's met with China's Foreign minister overnight. As

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Speaker 1: those warships in closer to Australia, they're well into Australia's

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Speaker 1: Exclusive Economic zone at this point. But New Zealanders and

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Speaker 1: Australians are like a hopeful that Winston has had some

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Speaker 1: words with Chinese officials. But to give us some sort

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Speaker 1: of insight about what's happening at that level, I'm joined

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Speaker 1: by former Defense Minister Andrew Little from the Labor Party.

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Speaker 2: Hello Andrew, good morning.

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Speaker 1: So what are the rules around being in an exclusive

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Speaker 1: economic zone?

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Speaker 2: Well, as long as they as long as you're in

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Speaker 2: international waters and you're obeying the rules under the United

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Speaker 2: Nation's convinced on the law of the Seat, then that's

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Speaker 2: all fine. They and that's what China is doing. But

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Speaker 2: there's no question why they are down here and during

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Speaker 2: live firing and all the rest of it is they

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Speaker 2: are projecting and making it very clear to Australia and

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Speaker 2: New Zealand and no doubt the rest of the Pacifics

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Speaker 2: that are capable of doing this, that they have this

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Speaker 2: was it can come the star and this is about

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Speaker 2: projecting their military strength that they have at the moment

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Speaker 2: power projection.

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Speaker 1: This is true. How close can the ships get before

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Speaker 1: they've overstepped.

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Speaker 2: Once around the twelve mile zone of twelve miles or

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Speaker 2: four then at that point it's expected that there would

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Speaker 2: be permission, and that would be that would be probably

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Speaker 2: notified in a way that hasn't happened so far. But

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Speaker 2: at the moment, every indication is that they are observing

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Speaker 2: the law of the sea, and all we can already

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Speaker 2: do is observe at the moment.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So wis Peter's met with Wang Yi, who's China's

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Speaker 1: foreign minister last night. We've all seen the releases. You've

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Speaker 1: been a defense minister. Can you read between the lines

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Speaker 1: and tell us how successful that meeting was or not?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I saw the statement that they've released, and they've

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Speaker 2: recorded to those recorded the issues that were raised. That's

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Speaker 2: the way these things happen. The statements tend to be

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Speaker 2: pretty blend and very polite and all the rest of it.

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Speaker 2: But I think we can be assured that the aid

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Speaker 2: that the issues were raised, and I expect that Peter,

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Speaker 2: as a long serving foreign minister, done it many times,

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Speaker 2: and who knows when he would have been pretty forceful.

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Speaker 2: I expect and his representations about that. The way you

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Speaker 2: deal with China, to make your point is, you know,

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Speaker 2: what you say behind closed doors in the room is

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Speaker 2: one thing. The way you talk about what you've said

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Speaker 2: afterwards is a different thing. That's just the way you

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Speaker 2: keep face with China. That has more of an impact

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Speaker 2: than sort that the megaphone diplomacy that we've seen in

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Speaker 2: another case, Well, you're.

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Speaker 1: Talking about megaphone diplomacy. Acting Prime Minister David Seymour yesterday

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Speaker 1: had some fairly harsh words for China, and is there

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Speaker 1: really a risk in using strong language and domestic media

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Speaker 1: to define our positions, just trying to really take offense.

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Speaker 2: I think China will understand that, you know, politicians of

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Speaker 2: whatever country but here in his Zinn need to speak

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Speaker 2: to a domestic audience and we'll say those things. I think, however,

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Speaker 2: they will also expect that when there is a bilateral

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Speaker 2: dialogue such as the one that mister features has been them,

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Speaker 2: that issues will be raised and it's that's the forum

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Speaker 2: to have the argument about it. And I think the

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Speaker 2: I mean, I think the other thing about dealing with

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Speaker 2: China is understanding that the relationship with China is multi dimensional.

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Speaker 2: So there is you know, there's betrayed relationship which is

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Speaker 2: really positive, but there's also what they do and how

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Speaker 2: they relate to other countries, particularly in our region, so

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Speaker 2: that isn't protected positive and that's that's we We just

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Speaker 2: have to navigate that style of relationship with China. But

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Speaker 2: having having the dialogue is important. Raising COFUSA is important,

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Speaker 2: but China will understand that politicians have to speak to

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Speaker 2: a domestic audience as well.

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Speaker 1: Okay, Andrew Little and I thank you so much for

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Speaker 1: your expertise. Andrew is the former Defense Minister and has

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Speaker 1: talked to China before. For more from Early Edition with

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Speaker 1: Ryan Bridge, listen live to News Talks.

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Speaker 2: It'd be from five am weekdays, or follow the podcast

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Speaker 2: on iHeartRadio