1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:03,200 Speaker 1: Now, the government's ditching open planning classrooms, much to the 2 00:00:03,240 --> 00:00:07,320 Speaker 1: relief of many teachers and kids and parents. Many schools 3 00:00:07,440 --> 00:00:10,640 Speaker 1: have already spent thousands to revert back to single cell rooms. 4 00:00:10,960 --> 00:00:13,960 Speaker 1: The Education Minister Erica Stanford reckons the big open spaces 5 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:17,000 Speaker 1: have had a negative effect on kids learning. New classrooms 6 00:00:17,040 --> 00:00:19,919 Speaker 1: will be built using standard designs, just like classrooms have 7 00:00:19,960 --> 00:00:22,840 Speaker 1: always been in the past, and will allow for flexibility 8 00:00:22,880 --> 00:00:25,880 Speaker 1: when needed. That's called a sliding door. Linda Stewart is 9 00:00:25,920 --> 00:00:28,520 Speaker 1: a principal at Mayroe Primary in West Auckland and joins me. 10 00:00:28,560 --> 00:00:31,640 Speaker 2: Now, Hello, Linda, Morena Andrew. 11 00:00:31,960 --> 00:00:33,680 Speaker 1: Do you like open classrooms or. 12 00:00:33,640 --> 00:00:37,040 Speaker 2: A d not. Well, it's funny that you should ask 13 00:00:37,080 --> 00:00:40,920 Speaker 2: me that, because today I have the pleasure of hosting 14 00:00:40,960 --> 00:00:45,800 Speaker 2: people through our innovative learning environment. It's one year since 15 00:00:45,800 --> 00:00:47,960 Speaker 2: we moved into our new classroom and. 16 00:00:47,880 --> 00:00:49,880 Speaker 1: We love it and it's open. 17 00:00:51,240 --> 00:00:55,200 Speaker 2: It is so it's really complex, isn't it? This whole 18 00:00:55,240 --> 00:00:58,240 Speaker 2: issue because people talk about open classrooms, and I've heard 19 00:00:58,240 --> 00:01:02,160 Speaker 2: people talking about barns. Ours is an innovative learning environment, 20 00:01:02,560 --> 00:01:07,479 Speaker 2: was a purposeful design for children's learning. We took teachers 21 00:01:07,720 --> 00:01:11,399 Speaker 2: and the community and our children on a journey over 22 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:16,479 Speaker 2: at least two years to really design a classrooms that 23 00:01:16,560 --> 00:01:21,200 Speaker 2: were really fit for purpose and future focused. So when 24 00:01:21,240 --> 00:01:24,479 Speaker 2: we talk about just putting sliding doors into an area, 25 00:01:24,600 --> 00:01:27,119 Speaker 2: that is not what teaching and learning is all about. 26 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:31,280 Speaker 2: And I think that we're getting into a conversation that 27 00:01:32,880 --> 00:01:36,080 Speaker 2: is being very binary around this, around do you like 28 00:01:36,120 --> 00:01:40,000 Speaker 2: them or don't you like them? Actually, the number one 29 00:01:40,080 --> 00:01:42,959 Speaker 2: factor that affects children's learning is the quality of the 30 00:01:43,000 --> 00:01:45,960 Speaker 2: teaching that goes on in the classroom. Where you've thought 31 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:51,280 Speaker 2: about those children who have neurodiversity, who need the space 32 00:01:51,440 --> 00:01:55,640 Speaker 2: to move, where you've thought about all of those different 33 00:01:55,720 --> 00:01:59,360 Speaker 2: things that children will need, and you've had your children 34 00:01:59,400 --> 00:02:02,920 Speaker 2: in mind, and you've designed a learning environment for them. 35 00:02:03,200 --> 00:02:07,080 Speaker 2: It works well. And that's what we see. Intentional design 36 00:02:07,800 --> 00:02:11,359 Speaker 2: has worked well for our children. Yes, we can close 37 00:02:11,400 --> 00:02:13,720 Speaker 2: off areas if we need to or not. 38 00:02:14,320 --> 00:02:16,480 Speaker 1: Well, what's the trick? Then? What is the trick? Because 39 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:18,799 Speaker 1: I've had kids in an open classroom and they've said 40 00:02:18,800 --> 00:02:22,160 Speaker 1: it's noisy as all hell. You know, and we've had many, 41 00:02:22,200 --> 00:02:25,360 Speaker 1: many reports about this is it can be very very 42 00:02:25,400 --> 00:02:28,480 Speaker 1: distracting and very hard for a teacher to command the 43 00:02:28,520 --> 00:02:31,440 Speaker 1: attention of twenty kids when there's another sixty kids who 44 00:02:31,480 --> 00:02:34,440 Speaker 1: are doing something completely different right next door. So what's 45 00:02:34,480 --> 00:02:35,000 Speaker 1: your trick. 46 00:02:35,919 --> 00:02:39,600 Speaker 2: The trick is the intentional design where you think about 47 00:02:39,680 --> 00:02:45,360 Speaker 2: actually the activities that children take part in during the day. Yes, 48 00:02:45,440 --> 00:02:48,560 Speaker 2: if you put children together and you haven't had that thinking, 49 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:52,160 Speaker 2: and you haven't had worked with your teachers around the 50 00:02:52,200 --> 00:02:56,320 Speaker 2: effect of pedagogy, then then it can be. It can 51 00:02:56,360 --> 00:02:59,800 Speaker 2: be tricky. But in our give me. 52 00:03:01,800 --> 00:03:06,320 Speaker 1: Give me a specific for instance, the spill of noise 53 00:03:06,440 --> 00:03:10,200 Speaker 1: from teaching cells, from one teaching cell to another. How 54 00:03:10,240 --> 00:03:13,359 Speaker 1: do you mitigate that in an open classroom at Mays Road. 55 00:03:15,000 --> 00:03:17,760 Speaker 2: So if you were to come into our classroom, you 56 00:03:17,800 --> 00:03:20,360 Speaker 2: wouldn't hear a lot of noise at all. What you 57 00:03:20,400 --> 00:03:23,960 Speaker 2: would see is you would see children who are purposely 58 00:03:24,120 --> 00:03:29,720 Speaker 2: engaged in their learning. You would see teachers and learning 59 00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:34,359 Speaker 2: assistants working alongside children in different parts of the building. 60 00:03:34,760 --> 00:03:38,080 Speaker 2: You would see some children involved in workshopping with a teacher. 61 00:03:38,400 --> 00:03:42,400 Speaker 2: You would see other children involved in independent activities. You 62 00:03:42,480 --> 00:03:45,600 Speaker 2: might see a child who is working to the side 63 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:48,920 Speaker 2: with a learning assistant because that's what they need. 64 00:03:49,040 --> 00:03:51,760 Speaker 1: How much how much did you with a new classroom cost? 65 00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:56,920 Speaker 2: Oh, it's not one classroom. It was fifteen classrooms, and 66 00:03:56,960 --> 00:04:01,320 Speaker 2: I think it was around twelve million something around that. 67 00:04:02,080 --> 00:04:06,440 Speaker 1: Would it have been cheaper to make twelve single cells well. 68 00:04:06,320 --> 00:04:09,320 Speaker 2: With the work that we have done before, I don't know. 69 00:04:10,440 --> 00:04:14,400 Speaker 2: I'm not sure about that, Andrew. I think that the 70 00:04:14,920 --> 00:04:19,640 Speaker 2: real question is what is the pedagogical practice that is 71 00:04:19,680 --> 00:04:24,120 Speaker 2: happening in our classrooms. That's the difference for kids, And 72 00:04:24,520 --> 00:04:27,960 Speaker 2: this conversation takes us away from some of the real 73 00:04:28,040 --> 00:04:31,360 Speaker 2: issues that I think are facing education at the moment. 74 00:04:31,680 --> 00:04:34,599 Speaker 1: Linda Stewart's Linda Stewart, thank you so much for fighting 75 00:04:34,600 --> 00:04:35,839 Speaker 1: your corner. We're going to have to go, and I 76 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:38,760 Speaker 1: thank you for your time today. For more from earlier 77 00:04:38,880 --> 00:04:41,880 Speaker 1: edition with Ryan Bridge, listen live to News Talks it 78 00:04:42,000 --> 00:04:46,000 Speaker 1: Be from five am weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.