1 00:00:05,960 --> 00:00:09,039 Speaker 1: CHIELDA. I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page, 2 00:00:09,360 --> 00:00:17,680 Speaker 1: a daily podcast presented by the New Zealand Herald. Losing 3 00:00:17,680 --> 00:00:20,400 Speaker 1: a loved one is one of the worst things a 4 00:00:20,480 --> 00:00:23,239 Speaker 1: family can go through, but it can get a lot 5 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:26,319 Speaker 1: worse if people start fighting over the will before the 6 00:00:26,320 --> 00:00:29,360 Speaker 1: body's even cold. With so many of us relying on 7 00:00:29,440 --> 00:00:32,520 Speaker 1: inheritance these days to get on the property ladder, being 8 00:00:32,560 --> 00:00:35,479 Speaker 1: cut out of a will can be a devastating blow, 9 00:00:35,960 --> 00:00:39,280 Speaker 1: but contesting it can sometimes be more trouble than it's worth. 10 00:00:41,920 --> 00:00:44,480 Speaker 1: So how should you go about getting your fair share 11 00:00:44,960 --> 00:00:46,920 Speaker 1: and what can you do to make sure your final 12 00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:50,959 Speaker 1: wishes are clearly communicated? Today on the Front Page ends 13 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:54,360 Speaker 1: at Herald, senior journalist Jane Fair joins us to share 14 00:00:54,400 --> 00:00:57,520 Speaker 1: the dues and don't She's picked up from legal experts 15 00:00:57,560 --> 00:01:05,440 Speaker 1: when it comes to inheritance. Jane, when we talk about 16 00:01:05,560 --> 00:01:09,080 Speaker 1: laws and inheritance, how much of the decision making is 17 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:11,679 Speaker 1: in the hands of the person actually writing the will 18 00:01:11,959 --> 00:01:14,160 Speaker 1: and how much is dictated by the law. 19 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:19,320 Speaker 2: A bit of both, because the willmaker has specific wishes, 20 00:01:19,800 --> 00:01:21,880 Speaker 2: but they have to do the will within the law. 21 00:01:22,000 --> 00:01:25,480 Speaker 2: So only personal property can become part of the estate. 22 00:01:26,000 --> 00:01:28,200 Speaker 2: So one way that people if they want to cut 23 00:01:28,200 --> 00:01:30,480 Speaker 2: someone out of their will, perhaps a family member they've 24 00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:34,319 Speaker 2: fallen out with, they can use a trust and that 25 00:01:34,440 --> 00:01:38,240 Speaker 2: means that no one in the family can attack that 26 00:01:38,319 --> 00:01:41,080 Speaker 2: trust if they're not a beneficiary. But that is something 27 00:01:41,080 --> 00:01:44,200 Speaker 2: that the Law Commission want changed. They had a big 28 00:01:44,240 --> 00:01:46,839 Speaker 2: review that came up with one hundred and forty recommendations 29 00:01:47,600 --> 00:01:51,320 Speaker 2: about the succession laws and inheritance, and they want the 30 00:01:51,320 --> 00:01:53,520 Speaker 2: courts to have greater power to attack trusts. 31 00:01:53,800 --> 00:01:56,360 Speaker 1: You've recently spoken to a number of legal experts about 32 00:01:56,360 --> 00:02:00,400 Speaker 1: the intricacies of writing and contesting wills. What are some 33 00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:03,480 Speaker 1: of the most common familial battles that can emerge when 34 00:02:03,520 --> 00:02:05,000 Speaker 1: it comes to this kind of thing. 35 00:02:05,160 --> 00:02:06,680 Speaker 3: I think it's the element of surprise. 36 00:02:07,080 --> 00:02:10,040 Speaker 2: The people I spoke to, the estate planners and the lawyers, 37 00:02:10,560 --> 00:02:14,480 Speaker 2: they recommended that you are transparent about your will, that 38 00:02:14,520 --> 00:02:17,399 Speaker 2: you discuss it with your family, your children, so they're 39 00:02:17,400 --> 00:02:20,600 Speaker 2: all aware there are no naszi surprises, and you tell 40 00:02:20,639 --> 00:02:24,080 Speaker 2: them the reasons why they might not like it, but 41 00:02:24,360 --> 00:02:28,400 Speaker 2: they probably won't react quite as violently as if they 42 00:02:28,440 --> 00:02:30,920 Speaker 2: didn't know what was coming. One of the things they 43 00:02:30,919 --> 00:02:32,760 Speaker 2: also said that is, if you are going to cut 44 00:02:32,840 --> 00:02:35,600 Speaker 2: a child out or someone who is expecting to inherit. 45 00:02:36,280 --> 00:02:37,320 Speaker 3: They didn't recommend that. 46 00:02:37,320 --> 00:02:40,040 Speaker 2: They morell As said, you have to show that you've 47 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:43,560 Speaker 2: discharged your moral duty, that you've thought about them. So 48 00:02:43,720 --> 00:02:46,120 Speaker 2: a better way, they say, is to leave a normal amount. 49 00:02:46,160 --> 00:02:48,640 Speaker 2: It might only be five thousand, or it depends on 50 00:02:48,680 --> 00:02:50,960 Speaker 2: the size of the state, but you leave a nominal 51 00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:56,240 Speaker 2: amount and also some documentation explaining why you haven't treated 52 00:02:56,240 --> 00:02:58,680 Speaker 2: them equally, so that if it did go to the court, 53 00:02:59,160 --> 00:03:01,600 Speaker 2: the court had an idea of what you're thinking was. 54 00:03:01,880 --> 00:03:05,000 Speaker 1: What are some of the worst will fights that you've 55 00:03:05,040 --> 00:03:05,600 Speaker 1: heard about. 56 00:03:06,080 --> 00:03:08,200 Speaker 3: Some of them go on for years. 57 00:03:08,480 --> 00:03:10,640 Speaker 2: You have to go through the High Court and the 58 00:03:10,680 --> 00:03:13,079 Speaker 2: High Court's backlogs, so you have to wait a long time. 59 00:03:13,480 --> 00:03:17,440 Speaker 2: It can be incredibly expensive. Fifty one hundred thousand, but 60 00:03:17,960 --> 00:03:20,480 Speaker 2: some of the lawyers I spoke to said way more 61 00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:22,600 Speaker 2: than that, and it can go on for years because 62 00:03:22,639 --> 00:03:25,400 Speaker 2: they just keep relitigating. And in the end, it's not 63 00:03:25,440 --> 00:03:28,720 Speaker 2: really about the money. It's about them being hurt. It's 64 00:03:28,760 --> 00:03:33,120 Speaker 2: about old family rivalries, probably sibling stuff that goes back 65 00:03:33,320 --> 00:03:36,080 Speaker 2: decades that comes out after mum and dad are dead, 66 00:03:36,680 --> 00:03:39,720 Speaker 2: and if they're not going to inherit, then no one's 67 00:03:39,760 --> 00:03:42,520 Speaker 2: going to inherit because the estate gets whittled down with 68 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:45,200 Speaker 2: legal costs the executives have to defend. 69 00:03:45,920 --> 00:03:47,280 Speaker 3: So you've spoken to the experts. 70 00:03:47,360 --> 00:03:50,520 Speaker 1: What are some tips to writing a will to ensure 71 00:03:50,560 --> 00:03:52,720 Speaker 1: things don't go pear shaped after you die. 72 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:56,600 Speaker 2: Making sure that the will is up to date, making 73 00:03:56,680 --> 00:03:59,680 Speaker 2: sure that the family are treated equally. 74 00:03:59,720 --> 00:04:00,800 Speaker 3: That's the main thing. 75 00:04:00,920 --> 00:04:03,240 Speaker 2: And if you're not going to that, you leave clear 76 00:04:03,280 --> 00:04:06,520 Speaker 2: reasons why you're not. You need to think about step 77 00:04:06,640 --> 00:04:11,400 Speaker 2: children and if a step mother is left, whether your 78 00:04:11,400 --> 00:04:13,960 Speaker 2: own children in other words, is step children of the stepmother. 79 00:04:14,480 --> 00:04:17,359 Speaker 2: They might fall out with her and attack the will 80 00:04:17,520 --> 00:04:20,200 Speaker 2: or vice versa. She might think that the children have 81 00:04:20,320 --> 00:04:22,039 Speaker 2: had enough and they've been left too much and she 82 00:04:22,080 --> 00:04:24,960 Speaker 2: hasn't been left. So it's all those sort of family dynamics. 83 00:04:25,040 --> 00:04:27,680 Speaker 2: And if you don't get it right and the family 84 00:04:27,720 --> 00:04:31,760 Speaker 2: do fall out, it causes bitter family divisions that are 85 00:04:31,839 --> 00:04:33,000 Speaker 2: never resolved. 86 00:04:33,560 --> 00:04:36,520 Speaker 1: And when it comes to making claims, who does and 87 00:04:36,839 --> 00:04:38,800 Speaker 1: doesn't have the right to make one. 88 00:04:39,240 --> 00:04:42,200 Speaker 2: Interestingly, the Law Commission, one of their recommendations, which I 89 00:04:42,200 --> 00:04:45,479 Speaker 2: think will be quite controversial, is that they've recommended one 90 00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:47,839 Speaker 2: of the options is that children over the age of 91 00:04:47,839 --> 00:04:51,159 Speaker 2: twenty five will not be able to contest their parents' will. 92 00:04:51,680 --> 00:04:53,800 Speaker 2: The Ministry say that they are a long way from 93 00:04:53,880 --> 00:04:55,760 Speaker 2: even looking at those recommendations, so it's not going to 94 00:04:55,760 --> 00:04:58,400 Speaker 2: happen anytime soon, but that is something to keep in mind. 95 00:05:00,880 --> 00:05:03,159 Speaker 4: One of the options put forward by the Law Commission 96 00:05:03,240 --> 00:05:06,039 Speaker 4: is that only children under twenty five can make a 97 00:05:06,040 --> 00:05:09,480 Speaker 4: claim against their estate, and really it's taking into consideration 98 00:05:09,680 --> 00:05:13,279 Speaker 4: the differences between the obligations of a parent to pass 99 00:05:13,320 --> 00:05:17,200 Speaker 4: on an inheritance or look after their children versus actually 100 00:05:17,240 --> 00:05:19,480 Speaker 4: the freedom of a person to make a choice about 101 00:05:19,520 --> 00:05:22,240 Speaker 4: how they want their estate to ultimately be distributed. 102 00:05:25,720 --> 00:05:28,240 Speaker 2: So who does have the right to claim against a 103 00:05:28,279 --> 00:05:34,560 Speaker 2: will are children and spouses and long term partners, and 104 00:05:34,600 --> 00:05:39,360 Speaker 2: in some circumstances, step children if they've been supported by 105 00:05:39,360 --> 00:05:43,320 Speaker 2: the willmaker during their lifetime, and even parents and grandparents 106 00:05:43,320 --> 00:05:46,440 Speaker 2: who have been supported by the willmaker can make a claim. 107 00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:49,360 Speaker 2: Those who can't claim a sibling, so a brother or 108 00:05:49,400 --> 00:05:53,400 Speaker 2: sister can't claim against each other's wills, and adopted children 109 00:05:53,640 --> 00:05:55,600 Speaker 2: they can claim against the parents who brought them up, 110 00:05:55,600 --> 00:06:00,040 Speaker 2: but they can't claim against biological parents' will, and in 111 00:06:00,120 --> 00:06:03,840 Speaker 2: the case of fungi where Maori children have been adopted 112 00:06:03,880 --> 00:06:07,039 Speaker 2: out to a family member. There's been a recent case 113 00:06:07,080 --> 00:06:10,080 Speaker 2: in the High Court that failed, so fungi children can't 114 00:06:10,080 --> 00:06:12,479 Speaker 2: claim against their biological parents. 115 00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:16,400 Speaker 1: Why isn't it as simple as this is what the 116 00:06:16,440 --> 00:06:17,920 Speaker 1: deceased person wanted. 117 00:06:18,279 --> 00:06:21,760 Speaker 2: I think it's human nature that the children might behave 118 00:06:21,800 --> 00:06:23,760 Speaker 2: when mum and dad are alive, they keep their the 119 00:06:23,839 --> 00:06:27,839 Speaker 2: family bond in a way. But then all those rivalries, 120 00:06:27,880 --> 00:06:30,280 Speaker 2: like mum always favored your dad always favored you. You've 121 00:06:30,320 --> 00:06:33,080 Speaker 2: got a lot more help than me, you're more successful 122 00:06:33,080 --> 00:06:35,040 Speaker 2: than me. I need the money more. All those sort 123 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:37,719 Speaker 2: of human dynamics come out, and you know where this 124 00:06:37,839 --> 00:06:39,560 Speaker 2: money people behave really badly. 125 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:42,560 Speaker 1: Does the fact that there's so much wealth in this 126 00:06:42,640 --> 00:06:46,320 Speaker 1: country tied up in property complicate inheritance at all? 127 00:06:46,680 --> 00:06:49,240 Speaker 2: One of the interesting things that Patrick Gamble said, he's 128 00:06:49,240 --> 00:06:53,559 Speaker 2: the CEO of Perpetual Guardian. He said that if estate 129 00:06:53,600 --> 00:06:56,320 Speaker 2: planning is not done well and the will maker is 130 00:06:56,360 --> 00:06:59,400 Speaker 2: not a clear will, he called it tumbling out of 131 00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:03,000 Speaker 2: the middle class. So he was talking about the wealth 132 00:07:03,040 --> 00:07:05,400 Speaker 2: of the baby boomers. A lot of the next generation 133 00:07:05,520 --> 00:07:08,720 Speaker 2: and the generation after that are relying on that wealth. 134 00:07:08,839 --> 00:07:11,920 Speaker 2: To buy a home or pay off their mortgage, and 135 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:14,040 Speaker 2: if it goes wrong where they get cut out or 136 00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:17,920 Speaker 2: the estate gets whittled away with everybody fighting over it. 137 00:07:18,080 --> 00:07:20,920 Speaker 2: Suddenly you've got someone who was brought up, you know, 138 00:07:20,960 --> 00:07:24,600 Speaker 2: in a reasonably wealthy family, expected to own a home, can't. 139 00:07:27,040 --> 00:07:29,200 Speaker 5: Society is always evolving and the way we live is 140 00:07:29,240 --> 00:07:31,680 Speaker 5: always evolving, so you can, I'm sure understand that the 141 00:07:31,800 --> 00:07:33,760 Speaker 5: number of blended families is much higher now than it 142 00:07:33,840 --> 00:07:37,400 Speaker 5: was seventy years ago. There's also an emphasisthakonga maori now 143 00:07:37,400 --> 00:07:39,760 Speaker 5: and other cultural norms and making sure they're covered in 144 00:07:39,760 --> 00:07:42,600 Speaker 5: the legislation. And also we're facing the largest transfer of 145 00:07:42,680 --> 00:07:44,520 Speaker 5: wealth we've ever seen in New Zealand history, so the 146 00:07:44,520 --> 00:07:46,679 Speaker 5: baby wom is over the next fifteen to twenty years 147 00:07:46,840 --> 00:07:49,320 Speaker 5: we'll leave around about a trillion dollars in assets. So 148 00:07:49,360 --> 00:07:51,440 Speaker 5: you need to make sure that inheritance law is very tight, 149 00:07:51,640 --> 00:07:55,320 Speaker 5: make sure we get it right. 150 00:07:57,320 --> 00:08:00,520 Speaker 1: What's the best advice for how to contest? Still will? 151 00:08:00,600 --> 00:08:03,240 Speaker 1: I've thankfully not how to do that yet, hopefully never will. 152 00:08:03,280 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 1: My brother and I usually get along, but how would 153 00:08:06,640 --> 00:08:08,480 Speaker 1: I go about it if I did have to? 154 00:08:08,960 --> 00:08:13,320 Speaker 3: You have to contest within a year of probate. 155 00:08:13,360 --> 00:08:16,480 Speaker 2: So probate is where the will is more or less 156 00:08:16,560 --> 00:08:18,840 Speaker 2: made an official document by the High Court, so you 157 00:08:18,920 --> 00:08:21,720 Speaker 2: got twelve months, but they recommend it contesting it as 158 00:08:21,760 --> 00:08:26,320 Speaker 2: soon as possible, because the executives can actually disperse the 159 00:08:26,360 --> 00:08:29,600 Speaker 2: assets within six months of probate, so if there's nothing 160 00:08:29,680 --> 00:08:32,120 Speaker 2: left to disperse, there's nothing left to fight about it. 161 00:08:32,240 --> 00:08:33,600 Speaker 3: So the sooner the better. 162 00:08:34,200 --> 00:08:36,400 Speaker 2: Lawyers more or less say don't go to court if 163 00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:39,000 Speaker 2: you can, and most are settled out of court because 164 00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:41,640 Speaker 2: everybody understands how much it's going to cost, so. 165 00:08:41,679 --> 00:08:44,199 Speaker 3: Mediation is a possibility. 166 00:08:44,760 --> 00:08:47,520 Speaker 2: The issue with mediation is it's not legally binding, so 167 00:08:47,720 --> 00:08:49,640 Speaker 2: if they change their mind, it could still end up 168 00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:52,559 Speaker 2: in court. And the other, I think better way is 169 00:08:52,640 --> 00:08:55,240 Speaker 2: a deed of family arrangement, and that's where the executives 170 00:08:55,280 --> 00:08:57,920 Speaker 2: and the family members and everybody is fighting actually come 171 00:08:57,960 --> 00:09:00,360 Speaker 2: to an agreement to alter the terms of the will 172 00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:03,079 Speaker 2: so that they say, yeah, fair enough, we'll give you 173 00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:14,079 Speaker 2: ten grand to go away or whatever. 174 00:09:16,679 --> 00:09:19,720 Speaker 1: You've mentioned. The one hundred and forty recommendations that have 175 00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:22,679 Speaker 1: been made by the Law Commission to tidy up these rules, 176 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:25,160 Speaker 1: how many of those have it been actually taken up 177 00:09:25,200 --> 00:09:27,479 Speaker 1: and put into law or is it quite a process? 178 00:09:27,840 --> 00:09:30,360 Speaker 2: No, none of them and it will be years. The 179 00:09:30,440 --> 00:09:32,960 Speaker 2: only one, the only recommendation, it was actually one hundred 180 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:35,200 Speaker 2: and thirty nine out of one hundred and forty is 181 00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:39,079 Speaker 2: the limit when someone dies and the estate is worth 182 00:09:39,120 --> 00:09:42,480 Speaker 2: fifteen thousand or less, you don't need to go for 183 00:09:42,559 --> 00:09:45,080 Speaker 2: probate and go through all the drama. You can just 184 00:09:45,160 --> 00:09:48,440 Speaker 2: if you're a family member disperse that The Commission have 185 00:09:48,440 --> 00:09:49,959 Speaker 2: recommended that that amount, I mean. 186 00:09:49,920 --> 00:09:51,000 Speaker 3: It's ridiculously low. 187 00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:53,760 Speaker 2: It was set in two thousand and nine, so they 188 00:09:53,840 --> 00:09:57,319 Speaker 2: recommended that that amount be brought up to twenty twenty 189 00:09:57,320 --> 00:10:00,520 Speaker 2: four level, or that it is adjusted to inflation from 190 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:03,199 Speaker 2: then on. That's the only recommendation that there's even been 191 00:10:03,240 --> 00:10:06,520 Speaker 2: looked at. The issue is that the Commission also looked 192 00:10:06,559 --> 00:10:10,480 Speaker 2: at the property relationship issue as well, and the government 193 00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:12,760 Speaker 2: wants to look at both those together. It's a huge 194 00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:16,000 Speaker 2: body of work. It will need consultation. You've got quite 195 00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:19,840 Speaker 2: contentious issues like children under the adju of twenty five 196 00:10:19,960 --> 00:10:23,200 Speaker 2: can't inherit, which are going to divide the community. So 197 00:10:23,360 --> 00:10:26,000 Speaker 2: I think it's probably not in this decade. 198 00:10:26,400 --> 00:10:28,920 Speaker 1: I guess if you're thinking about creating a will and 199 00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:31,840 Speaker 1: doing something before you die and to make sure that 200 00:10:31,880 --> 00:10:33,000 Speaker 1: your wishes. 201 00:10:32,760 --> 00:10:34,079 Speaker 3: Are held up. 202 00:10:34,400 --> 00:10:36,760 Speaker 1: Are there any other ways other than a will where 203 00:10:36,840 --> 00:10:39,520 Speaker 1: you can make sure that your family members get what 204 00:10:39,559 --> 00:10:39,959 Speaker 1: you want. 205 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:43,679 Speaker 2: The other way is to gift assets and money in 206 00:10:43,720 --> 00:10:48,000 Speaker 2: your lifetime, and as a result, there's nothing really left 207 00:10:48,040 --> 00:10:51,280 Speaker 2: or very little left to fight over in the estate. 208 00:10:51,880 --> 00:10:54,959 Speaker 2: The only way that anyone could contest that was if 209 00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:57,720 Speaker 2: they felt you'd done that under duress or that you 210 00:10:57,760 --> 00:11:00,800 Speaker 2: went mentally capable. That those sorts of reasons they could contest. 211 00:11:00,800 --> 00:11:03,680 Speaker 2: But other than that, you're free to give you two 212 00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:06,720 Speaker 2: sons and a daughter assets and leave another one out. 213 00:11:09,200 --> 00:11:11,520 Speaker 6: More than a third of older kiwis are not waiting 214 00:11:11,600 --> 00:11:14,080 Speaker 6: until they die to transfer their wealth to loved ones. 215 00:11:14,080 --> 00:11:17,840 Speaker 6: According to New Zealand's Seniors Report, fifty seven percent of 216 00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:20,480 Speaker 6: those surveyed so they're worried about what they'll leave behind 217 00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:23,520 Speaker 6: to their kids because of current economic challenges. Ninety one 218 00:11:23,520 --> 00:11:27,120 Speaker 6: percent thought home ownership in particular is becoming increasingly difficult, 219 00:11:27,360 --> 00:11:29,400 Speaker 6: especially for those whose parents can't help them out. 220 00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:39,439 Speaker 1: I guess it's an incredibly interesting but also sad topic, 221 00:11:40,000 --> 00:11:44,840 Speaker 1: isn't it, Because we're essentially talking about someone having wishes 222 00:11:45,000 --> 00:11:49,040 Speaker 1: and doing a will and then once they pass it 223 00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:52,320 Speaker 1: could break up entire families. Have you seen in your 224 00:11:52,360 --> 00:11:56,240 Speaker 1: research in your writing, is it generally quite upsetting? 225 00:11:56,640 --> 00:11:57,000 Speaker 3: It is. 226 00:11:57,120 --> 00:12:00,480 Speaker 2: I've written about this before. I've written about puritance, and 227 00:12:00,520 --> 00:12:03,440 Speaker 2: I've also written about how you pass the family batch 228 00:12:03,480 --> 00:12:06,600 Speaker 2: and holiday home on to your children without them all fighting, 229 00:12:06,880 --> 00:12:09,600 Speaker 2: and also the family farm. And every time I write 230 00:12:09,600 --> 00:12:12,199 Speaker 2: those stories, I get emails and from people with quite 231 00:12:12,200 --> 00:12:15,280 Speaker 2: sad stories that date back years, some of them, some 232 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:17,680 Speaker 2: of them back to the seventies, and they've never quite 233 00:12:17,720 --> 00:12:20,920 Speaker 2: got over the fact that they fell out with their brother, 234 00:12:21,160 --> 00:12:24,080 Speaker 2: or their sister was given more than they did, or 235 00:12:24,120 --> 00:12:26,640 Speaker 2: a stepmother ended up with everything and she'd only been 236 00:12:26,640 --> 00:12:28,960 Speaker 2: with a husband for five years and they lost all 237 00:12:29,000 --> 00:12:33,280 Speaker 2: their mothers. China, all those sort of emotional stories has 238 00:12:33,520 --> 00:12:36,280 Speaker 2: plenty of them around, And I know in my own life, 239 00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:39,040 Speaker 2: I know some of my family friends who don't speak 240 00:12:39,080 --> 00:12:41,480 Speaker 2: to each other as a result of falling out over 241 00:12:41,480 --> 00:12:43,760 Speaker 2: the will, and so their children, the cousins grow up 242 00:12:43,800 --> 00:12:47,760 Speaker 2: not knowing each other. Whereas when my parents died, my 243 00:12:47,880 --> 00:12:51,080 Speaker 2: mother died first, but when my father died, he left 244 00:12:51,240 --> 00:12:53,959 Speaker 2: really clear instructions. He talked to the three of us 245 00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:57,520 Speaker 2: individually and together. We had a family lawyer involved, and 246 00:12:57,600 --> 00:13:00,480 Speaker 2: it was all done amicably and we're all was a 247 00:13:00,520 --> 00:13:01,359 Speaker 2: great experience. 248 00:13:01,400 --> 00:13:01,640 Speaker 3: Really. 249 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:05,000 Speaker 1: I know that my papa back in Adelaide has given 250 00:13:05,080 --> 00:13:08,680 Speaker 1: us post it notes before he passes, and where to 251 00:13:08,720 --> 00:13:11,840 Speaker 1: put colored post it notes on things around the house 252 00:13:11,920 --> 00:13:14,080 Speaker 1: that we want, So it can actually be quite a 253 00:13:14,160 --> 00:13:17,560 Speaker 1: nice experience, you know, remembering that Papa wanted me to 254 00:13:17,640 --> 00:13:20,880 Speaker 1: have the brown chest to Field that I've always loved. 255 00:13:20,960 --> 00:13:23,600 Speaker 1: You know, it's quite somber, isn't it. But also it 256 00:13:23,640 --> 00:13:26,400 Speaker 1: can be translated into a quite nice experience. 257 00:13:26,760 --> 00:13:30,000 Speaker 2: Well, yes, unless somebody swaps the post it notes or 258 00:13:30,320 --> 00:13:32,400 Speaker 2: accidentally on purpose drops off. 259 00:13:32,280 --> 00:13:35,480 Speaker 1: Unless my brother wants that chest to field after Papa goes, 260 00:13:35,559 --> 00:13:38,600 Speaker 1: and someone and one of the family says, but she 261 00:13:38,720 --> 00:13:40,400 Speaker 1: promised those pills to me as well. 262 00:13:40,600 --> 00:13:42,439 Speaker 3: So yeah, it's better to write it down. 263 00:13:42,880 --> 00:13:46,200 Speaker 1: I have to remember that next time I go home. Finally, Jane, 264 00:13:46,200 --> 00:13:49,040 Speaker 1: reading a piece, it does seem that the overall advice 265 00:13:49,120 --> 00:13:51,920 Speaker 1: is that contesting a will might cost more than it's worth, hey, 266 00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:53,960 Speaker 1: and do more harm than good. 267 00:13:54,000 --> 00:13:54,440 Speaker 3: I guess. 268 00:13:54,840 --> 00:13:58,680 Speaker 1: So from the experts you've spoken to, what's the overall advice, 269 00:13:58,800 --> 00:14:01,120 Speaker 1: Is it really worth kicking up that much for fast? 270 00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:04,319 Speaker 2: Well, I guess the lawyers want you to because they're 271 00:14:04,400 --> 00:14:07,120 Speaker 2: charging the fees hit they get paid. They're the only 272 00:14:07,160 --> 00:14:09,520 Speaker 2: ones that get paid. And it isn't cheap. I mean, 273 00:14:09,840 --> 00:14:12,719 Speaker 2: it is fifty to one hundred thousand. If there's only 274 00:14:12,720 --> 00:14:16,360 Speaker 2: two hundred thousand to fight over, the estate has to 275 00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:19,000 Speaker 2: pay similar legal fees on the other side, so they're 276 00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:22,440 Speaker 2: paying fifty to one hundred thousand or more, so there's 277 00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:24,880 Speaker 2: not much left to fight over, depending on how many 278 00:14:24,960 --> 00:14:26,040 Speaker 2: beneficiaries there are. 279 00:14:26,440 --> 00:14:27,640 Speaker 3: Thanks for joining us, Jane. 280 00:14:32,680 --> 00:14:35,480 Speaker 1: That said for this episode of the Front Page. You 281 00:14:35,520 --> 00:14:39,000 Speaker 1: can read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage 282 00:14:39,040 --> 00:14:42,680 Speaker 1: at enzed Herald dot co dot nz. The Front Page 283 00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:46,200 Speaker 1: is produced by Ethan Siles with sound engineer Paddy Fox. 284 00:14:46,640 --> 00:14:50,880 Speaker 1: I'm Chelsea Daniels. Subscribe to The Front Page on iHeartRadio 285 00:14:51,000 --> 00:14:53,960 Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts, and tune in tomorrow 286 00:14:54,120 --> 00:14:56,200 Speaker 1: for another look behind the headlines.