WEBVTT - Mike Atkinson: The dynamic between tenants and landlords is changing 0:00:05.721 --> 0:00:09.721 You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talks. 0:00:33.601 --> 0:00:36.121 And welcome back to the One Roof Radio Show. I 0:00:36.201 --> 0:00:38.321 was just saying to my producer t I said, well, 0:00:38.361 --> 0:00:40.761 this music sucks, and She's like, this is exactly the 0:00:41.441 --> 0:00:43.481 question that the tune you asked for. And I was thinking, 0:00:43.481 --> 0:00:45.721 maybe it's not the version I'm thinking of, but yes, 0:00:45.841 --> 0:00:48.921 you're right. Who's got the power or whatever? Welcome back. 0:00:48.921 --> 0:00:51.201 I'm Tim Beverages. This is the One Roof Radio Show. 0:00:51.241 --> 0:00:52.881 By the way, if you missed our panel with Annibin's 0:00:52.881 --> 0:00:54.881 Francis and Pete wolf Camp, you can go and check 0:00:54.881 --> 0:00:58.841 out where you get your podcasts and which I suggest 0:00:58.881 --> 0:01:01.161 would be iHeartRadio. Just look for the Weekend Collective and 0:01:01.161 --> 0:01:02.721 the way you go. But right now, as I say 0:01:02.761 --> 0:01:04.921 it's One Roof Radio show, we have a new guest 0:01:05.121 --> 0:01:07.841 with us. He is the managing director of a Spire 0:01:07.881 --> 0:01:11.441 Property Management and his name is Mike Atkinson. And Mike, 0:01:12.281 --> 0:01:13.641 good afternoon. How are you doing good? 0:01:13.681 --> 0:01:15.041 Thank you happy to be here? 0:01:15.201 --> 0:01:18.561 Yeah? Yeah, well we'll find out in about an hour's time. 0:01:19.241 --> 0:01:20.841 Hey tell us how long have you been in the 0:01:20.881 --> 0:01:21.881 property management game. 0:01:22.081 --> 0:01:25.001 I've been running Aspire Property Management for twelve years, and 0:01:25.041 --> 0:01:27.881 I've been in property management overall for coming up to twenty. 0:01:27.921 --> 0:01:29.601 Now, what made you want to get into that. 0:01:30.201 --> 0:01:32.201 I was in London and I had no money left 0:01:32.201 --> 0:01:34.761 in my bank account and an ad in the gum 0:01:34.761 --> 0:01:37.241 tree and I did my first day in property management. 0:01:37.281 --> 0:01:38.481 I just loved it right away. 0:01:38.841 --> 0:01:40.441 What was it you loved about it so much? 0:01:40.561 --> 0:01:43.681 There's always something happening in property management, so you get 0:01:43.681 --> 0:01:45.601 to do quite a lot of relationship building, you get 0:01:45.601 --> 0:01:47.961 to go out to property. I do really like property. 0:01:48.881 --> 0:01:51.721 You're always on the move, always something happening, and you 0:01:51.761 --> 0:01:54.881 can make a difference in people's home life as well 0:01:54.921 --> 0:01:56.081 if you do a good job for them. 0:01:56.241 --> 0:01:58.601 Wow. We'll take into that a bit more in the moment. 0:01:58.641 --> 0:02:01.161 But if you've joined US, eight hundred and eighty ten 0:02:01.241 --> 0:02:02.841 eighty is the number you can text on nine two 0:02:02.961 --> 0:02:07.201 nine two, and we're going to into with the recent 0:02:07.281 --> 0:02:10.521 changes and tendency laws. You might remember that under the 0:02:10.521 --> 0:02:13.801 previous government they got rid of ninety day notice periods, 0:02:14.161 --> 0:02:17.281 which meant that it became very tricky to get rid 0:02:17.281 --> 0:02:21.041 of a lousy tenant. But now that they're back in 0:02:21.361 --> 0:02:23.441 one might argue that it is now easy for a 0:02:23.481 --> 0:02:25.641 bad landlord to get rid of a really good tenant 0:02:26.601 --> 0:02:29.481 and so it's hard to get the balance. But the 0:02:29.561 --> 0:02:31.641 question is, and we want your calls on this, do 0:02:31.721 --> 0:02:34.241 you think that it's that the government have made the 0:02:34.321 --> 0:02:37.001 right moves restoring the ninety day notice period, which basically 0:02:37.001 --> 0:02:38.681 means you don't have to have cause, you just have 0:02:38.721 --> 0:02:41.761 to say ninety days see you later. Do you think 0:02:41.841 --> 0:02:44.761 that that has been a shift towards restoring the balance 0:02:44.801 --> 0:02:46.121 to where you'd like it to be already think was 0:02:46.161 --> 0:02:47.961 a bad move. We want your calls on eight hundred 0:02:47.961 --> 0:02:49.841 and eighty ten to eighty. And of course, as we've 0:02:49.841 --> 0:02:53.161 briefly heard from Mike's experience in property management, you give 0:02:53.201 --> 0:02:54.921 him a call if you've got some questions as well 0:02:54.921 --> 0:02:57.681 you would like to get a bit of guidance on. 0:02:57.761 --> 0:03:00.721 But yeah, so just a little bit more about the 0:03:00.721 --> 0:03:05.241 London situation. How much different is London to New Zealand. 0:03:06.121 --> 0:03:08.801 Well, I was working in Body corporate then, okay, and 0:03:08.921 --> 0:03:10.561 yes it was a little bit different than the work 0:03:10.561 --> 0:03:13.361 that I'm doing now. But it was very interesting as well. 0:03:13.241 --> 0:03:16.041 Because what's the percentage of people in residential property who 0:03:16.041 --> 0:03:18.161 would rent? And I mean, if you're in London, it 0:03:18.281 --> 0:03:20.721 seemed that well, I didn't know anyone who owned just 0:03:20.761 --> 0:03:21.441 about No, it. 0:03:21.801 --> 0:03:23.481 Was pretty high. There was a big company over there 0:03:23.521 --> 0:03:25.321 called Foxton's who did a lot of that, and it 0:03:25.361 --> 0:03:28.841 was very dodgy over there, the rental management sector, and 0:03:28.961 --> 0:03:30.681 I experienced it as a tenant anyway. 0:03:30.841 --> 0:03:34.081 Were most people are a lot of tenancies over in London? 0:03:34.121 --> 0:03:36.281 Are they sort of just still managed by landlords who've 0:03:36.281 --> 0:03:38.281 got lodgers or they've got a spare room or a 0:03:38.721 --> 0:03:41.041 spare of flat downstairs. But I don't know how it works. 0:03:41.281 --> 0:03:42.801 I think it's a bit of a mix. They still 0:03:42.801 --> 0:03:45.841 have people managing them privately and a few established agencies 0:03:45.881 --> 0:03:46.201 as well. 0:03:46.361 --> 0:03:50.761 Yeah, so okay, tell us what was the problem that 0:03:50.801 --> 0:03:53.361 the government wanted to address when they brought back in 0:03:53.441 --> 0:03:54.961 the ninety day notice period. 0:03:55.361 --> 0:03:58.401 Well, the previous government bought in the you could only 0:03:58.401 --> 0:04:00.481 get rid of a tenant if that met a certain 0:04:00.521 --> 0:04:03.521 set of criteria, and I think they decided that was 0:04:03.561 --> 0:04:06.801 a little bit too rigid and the landlords had given 0:04:06.881 --> 0:04:09.481 up too much control. People wanted to be able to 0:04:09.521 --> 0:04:11.881 have the final say on who stayed and who went 0:04:12.841 --> 0:04:14.201 from a property that they owned. 0:04:15.921 --> 0:04:17.881 Yeah, look, how I did talk back on this all 0:04:17.921 --> 0:04:19.961 the time, and it did talk back on it quite 0:04:20.001 --> 0:04:22.081 a bit, and it seemed that one of the problems 0:04:22.241 --> 0:04:25.361 was that if you had really bad tenants sometimes it 0:04:25.401 --> 0:04:27.521 was quite hard to get rid of them because one 0:04:27.521 --> 0:04:29.721 you had to have neighbors who would give evidence, and 0:04:29.761 --> 0:04:33.241 it became quite a rigmarole. And yet now we have 0:04:34.001 --> 0:04:36.561 you know, you can give literally ninety days and somebody 0:04:36.601 --> 0:04:38.721 could be a fantastic tenant and you could have a 0:04:38.801 --> 0:04:41.321 landlord who's I don't know or to think that value 0:04:41.321 --> 0:04:44.441 having tenants right now anyway, But what are the ills 0:04:44.481 --> 0:04:46.761 that can come around simply by this system. 0:04:47.161 --> 0:04:49.321 Yeah, I mean, I think it's given the landlords quite 0:04:49.361 --> 0:04:51.521 a lot of power. So if you have a good 0:04:51.561 --> 0:04:55.201 tenant and a bad landlord, that landlord can say, you 0:04:55.201 --> 0:04:57.161 know what, let's just get rid of that person, and 0:04:57.201 --> 0:04:59.241 it can make them have to move house, which is 0:04:59.241 --> 0:05:02.761 a big undertaking, as we all know. So the new 0:05:02.881 --> 0:05:07.721 legislation does have a retael notice stageboard into it. So 0:05:08.121 --> 0:05:10.601 if you are a landlord and you issue a ninety 0:05:10.681 --> 0:05:14.761 day notice and it is partly or wholly motivated by 0:05:14.801 --> 0:05:18.481 a tenant having tried to exercise their rights, So for example, 0:05:18.961 --> 0:05:21.121 a tenant saying, hey, the dishwash is broken. 0:05:21.641 --> 0:05:23.241 No, you can't come around your notice. 0:05:23.361 --> 0:05:24.921 Yeah, and then they just say, you know what, I 0:05:24.921 --> 0:05:27.841 don't want to deal with you. Here's your ninety day notice. Well, 0:05:27.921 --> 0:05:30.401 the tenant has twenty eight days to apply to the 0:05:30.401 --> 0:05:33.161 tribunal to have the notice thrown out. Then they have 0:05:33.521 --> 0:05:35.481 if they don't use it in the twenty eight days, 0:05:35.481 --> 0:05:38.281 they've got up to a year to take the landlord 0:05:38.361 --> 0:05:41.041 to the tribunal to seek to rule that that was 0:05:41.081 --> 0:05:43.881 an unlawful notice. And if it's unlawful, it can be 0:05:43.961 --> 0:05:46.761 up to six thousand, two hundred dollars fine for the landlord. 0:05:47.081 --> 0:05:50.041 So they haven't gone back to the previous rules of 0:05:50.121 --> 0:05:53.041 ninety days. Okay, they've added one extra layer in there 0:05:53.081 --> 0:05:54.441 to protect tenants as well. 0:05:54.601 --> 0:05:57.801 That does sound like quite a good layer. Where does 0:05:57.841 --> 0:06:00.241 it sit for you? I guess you're dealing with this 0:06:00.361 --> 0:06:03.041 all the time. I would have actually, I would guess 0:06:03.161 --> 0:06:07.561 as a property manager, because you are acting for landlords 0:06:08.001 --> 0:06:11.281 and looking after tenants and so you're interfacing. But I 0:06:11.321 --> 0:06:15.281 guess you are the landlord's representatives, aren't you. So I 0:06:15.281 --> 0:06:18.081 would have thought you'd like the restoration of the ninety 0:06:18.121 --> 0:06:20.361 day period because it is because you guys aren't just 0:06:20.401 --> 0:06:22.601 about turfing people out for fun. You like to have 0:06:22.681 --> 0:06:25.241 people in properties, except the lousy ones. 0:06:25.521 --> 0:06:27.161 Yeah, And I mean it's the same for a landlord 0:06:27.161 --> 0:06:29.521 as well. If you ever do exercise your right to 0:06:29.641 --> 0:06:32.121 use this ninety day notice, you are going to be 0:06:32.121 --> 0:06:34.161 incurring quite a bit of cost. As a landlord. Your 0:06:34.161 --> 0:06:36.321 property is probably going to be vacant for three weeks 0:06:36.361 --> 0:06:39.041 because of your relationship's broken down so much with your 0:06:39.081 --> 0:06:41.921 tenant that you give a ninety day notice, you're probably 0:06:41.921 --> 0:06:44.241 not going to get viewings done there until after they leave. 0:06:44.601 --> 0:06:46.641 You're going to pay your property manager a leading feet, 0:06:46.921 --> 0:06:50.561 so they're still only going to be used in extreme circumstances. 0:06:50.601 --> 0:06:52.481 It's not good business to get rid of tenants. When 0:06:52.481 --> 0:06:54.841 you're a landlord, you don't get much rent without a tenant. 0:06:55.401 --> 0:06:57.761 And actually, how as just while we're on that, how 0:06:57.881 --> 0:07:01.321 is the sort of letting landscape in terms of the 0:07:01.361 --> 0:07:03.001 balance between supply and demand. 0:07:03.321 --> 0:07:05.841 Well, so at the moment, the ballot is definitely in 0:07:05.881 --> 0:07:09.761 favor of the tenants. Around about June last year we 0:07:09.801 --> 0:07:12.921 had five thousand, five hundred rental listings in Auckland. By 0:07:12.961 --> 0:07:16.961 December it was up to six thousand, seven hundred and 0:07:17.041 --> 0:07:20.201 now it is only just returning to five thousand, five 0:07:20.281 --> 0:07:23.681 hundred levels now. So whenever there's over six thousand listings, 0:07:23.801 --> 0:07:25.481 it feels like there's more. 0:07:25.761 --> 0:07:27.241 Property in New Zealand or Auckland. 0:07:27.281 --> 0:07:30.201 Auckland, sorry, yep. When there's more than six thousand, it 0:07:30.281 --> 0:07:33.481 feels like there's not enough good tenants for the properties. 0:07:33.681 --> 0:07:35.561 So it's like musical chairs and all of a sudden 0:07:35.601 --> 0:07:37.961 it's around the other way. Instead of having people dying 0:07:37.961 --> 0:07:40.841 to rent your property, you're actually struggling to find them. 0:07:40.881 --> 0:07:44.001 So the market at the moment favors tenants, so they've 0:07:44.001 --> 0:07:46.161 got an upper hand in that area in Auckland at 0:07:46.161 --> 0:07:46.521 the moment. 0:07:46.721 --> 0:07:50.681 How much pressure is there on landlords therefore too, I 0:07:50.721 --> 0:07:54.521 mean people reducing their their rents or are they making 0:07:54.561 --> 0:07:57.201 their properties more appealing instead, or what are they doing? 0:07:57.521 --> 0:08:00.321 Well, if you've got a property that's really well looked 0:08:00.361 --> 0:08:04.361 after and you know actually it's quite attractive to tenants, 0:08:04.361 --> 0:08:07.121 you'll still be doing okay. When you've got a sort 0:08:07.161 --> 0:08:09.961 of bull market, so to speak, Your even your bad 0:08:10.121 --> 0:08:12.641 properties are going to get rented. But when as soon 0:08:12.641 --> 0:08:14.721 as the market turns, which it has, if you've got 0:08:14.721 --> 0:08:17.801 a property where you haven't invested in repairs and maintenance, 0:08:18.201 --> 0:08:21.561 you'll be the last last property to go. So yeah, 0:08:21.601 --> 0:08:24.241 people are dropping their rents, and you know, we're encouraging 0:08:24.241 --> 0:08:27.321 our owners to use professional photos, get some painting done, 0:08:27.721 --> 0:08:30.761 do something to make your properties stand out at the moment. Otherwise, 0:08:30.881 --> 0:08:34.481 you know, it might be sitting online for four weeks plus. 0:08:34.601 --> 0:08:36.681 And that Actually it's funny because when you think four 0:08:36.681 --> 0:08:38.361 weeks so it's been empty for a few weeks, it 0:08:38.361 --> 0:08:40.801 sounds like such a casual sort of comment to throw away, 0:08:40.801 --> 0:08:42.761 But that can actually be quite a lot of rent 0:08:42.761 --> 0:08:45.161 that you'd really count on, especially if you've got the 0:08:45.801 --> 0:08:47.481 you know, you haven't managed to bring your mortgage right 0:08:47.481 --> 0:08:48.201 down yet. 0:08:48.081 --> 0:08:50.001 Or yeah, and then you normally would have to pay 0:08:50.001 --> 0:08:52.961 your property manager one week's rent plus GST letting fee, 0:08:53.001 --> 0:08:56.201 plus advertising costs and things like that. New tenant will 0:08:56.201 --> 0:08:58.681 normally ask for some repairs and maintenance to be done. 0:08:59.481 --> 0:09:01.481 So yeah, it can get expensive for landlords leaving your 0:09:01.481 --> 0:09:02.561 properties empty at the moment. 0:09:02.641 --> 0:09:04.401 Now I'm just trying to think, I'm not sure if 0:09:04.481 --> 0:09:07.361 maybe do you like the way the law is at 0:09:07.361 --> 0:09:09.681 the moment with ninety day period, if you were designing it, 0:09:09.921 --> 0:09:13.041 if Mike Atkinson was designing the law around getting rid 0:09:13.121 --> 0:09:16.521 of lousy tenants and keeping good ones and protecting tenants 0:09:16.561 --> 0:09:19.641 at the same time. Is the legislation so ninety days? 0:09:20.081 --> 0:09:24.681 But if it's vexatious or vindictive, I, as a tenant, 0:09:24.761 --> 0:09:26.481 could say, hang on the man, I'm going to the 0:09:26.481 --> 0:09:29.481 tennis tribunal because you're being to. 0:09:29.521 --> 0:09:31.521 Give you a really good answer. I'd need to see 0:09:31.561 --> 0:09:34.601 how this actually plays out by testing it, Because is 0:09:34.641 --> 0:09:36.961 the tribunal going to say that if the tenant has 0:09:37.041 --> 0:09:39.721 mentioned one thing about the grasp being not cut in 0:09:39.721 --> 0:09:41.641 the right amount of time, does that throw out the 0:09:41.721 --> 0:09:44.161 ninety day notice? How strict are they going to be? 0:09:44.841 --> 0:09:48.441 But under the old law there was still quite good 0:09:48.481 --> 0:09:51.601 avenues available to get rid of problem tenants. And I 0:09:51.641 --> 0:09:54.321 did like the idea that people were able to know 0:09:54.361 --> 0:09:56.681 that they weren't going to get kicked out of their houses. 0:09:57.041 --> 0:09:59.481 I guess there is one thing that you can do 0:09:59.921 --> 0:10:02.681 which so convinced that is to sign a fixed term tenancy. 0:10:02.721 --> 0:10:05.441 Isn't it there is? I mean, do we seem of that? 0:10:05.721 --> 0:10:09.521 We About five years ago I tried to convince tenants 0:10:09.561 --> 0:10:12.361 to sign up for three year two year fixed term tenancies. 0:10:12.401 --> 0:10:14.441 I couldn't get anyone to agree to sign up for 0:10:14.481 --> 0:10:16.881 longer than twelve months. It just seems like, for some reason, 0:10:16.881 --> 0:10:19.321 it's just bedded into the culture here that you sign 0:10:19.321 --> 0:10:21.201 a twelve month fixed term tendency. Is that? 0:10:21.241 --> 0:10:24.121 What are we commitment fobes? I don't know what it is, 0:10:24.201 --> 0:10:26.361 but you might want to go to Australia. Oh, I'm 0:10:26.401 --> 0:10:28.081 not sure. Things don't feel great. I don't want to 0:10:28.081 --> 0:10:28.921 time a south down. 0:10:29.281 --> 0:10:30.881 Yeah, but that so that is a way if you're 0:10:30.921 --> 0:10:33.561 a tenant and you want to have some security of 0:10:33.601 --> 0:10:36.401 tenure is approach your property manager or your landlord and 0:10:36.401 --> 0:10:39.041 ask for extension. If you're on a periodic tendancy, you 0:10:39.081 --> 0:10:42.521 can sign a new extension anyway. So you know that 0:10:42.561 --> 0:10:44.441 gives you a bit of security around your property. 0:10:45.241 --> 0:10:47.441 So how on, So what do you think of the law? 0:10:49.841 --> 0:10:52.161 Would you would you tweak what we've got at the 0:10:52.201 --> 0:10:56.961 moment still allowing notice? And it's actually we should point 0:10:57.001 --> 0:11:00.601 out I'm going back on my you know, I studied 0:11:01.081 --> 0:11:03.281 property law about thirty years ago or something, so I 0:11:03.321 --> 0:11:05.721 can't remember too much about it, but maybe not quite 0:11:05.761 --> 0:11:08.601 that long ago. But you can still give notice, say 0:11:08.641 --> 0:11:12.321 for if you are a landlord and you have to 0:11:12.361 --> 0:11:14.801 move back into the property yourself. That is still a 0:11:14.881 --> 0:11:17.281 legitimate cause and always has been, hasn't it. Yeah, that 0:11:17.281 --> 0:11:19.641 has always been, and that just shortweeks notice, doesn't They've 0:11:19.641 --> 0:11:21.681 shortened them down to forty two now to give a 0:11:21.721 --> 0:11:23.601 little bit less time. Okay. 0:11:23.721 --> 0:11:26.001 At the same time, they've also now tenants only have 0:11:26.041 --> 0:11:27.921 to give twenty one days notice if they want to 0:11:28.001 --> 0:11:29.721 leave a periodic tendency. 0:11:30.041 --> 0:11:31.801 So would you go with the law as it was 0:11:31.881 --> 0:11:33.361 or as it is now, or with some sort of 0:11:33.401 --> 0:11:35.241 subtle change because we're going to play around. It's fun 0:11:35.281 --> 0:11:36.601 to play around with these things, and no one's going 0:11:36.641 --> 0:11:37.081 to quote you. 0:11:37.481 --> 0:11:40.601 I would say the old law, with a bit more 0:11:40.641 --> 0:11:44.001 action from the tenancy tribunal not making it so impossible 0:11:44.041 --> 0:11:47.201 to prove that a tenant is antisocial, would probably have 0:11:47.281 --> 0:11:50.961 been a better system. But the tendancy tribunal lags behind. 0:11:51.361 --> 0:11:53.921 And I'm also not sure how the tenancy tribunal is 0:11:53.961 --> 0:11:56.561 going to interpret the new changes. 0:11:57.041 --> 0:11:59.001 Do you guys have a lot of mean I'm guessing 0:11:59.041 --> 0:12:00.281 this is a dumb question, but do you have a 0:12:00.321 --> 0:12:02.121 lot of involvement with the tendency tribunal? 0:12:02.601 --> 0:12:05.241 We do, Yes, We go probably once every two week. 0:12:06.201 --> 0:12:09.161 A lot of the times it's just unpaid rent, but 0:12:09.241 --> 0:12:11.321 it can be any sort of dispute these days. Who 0:12:11.321 --> 0:12:13.521 should pay for cockroaches? Who should pay for. 0:12:15.201 --> 0:12:19.521 Sounds like rare. It's some sort of dodge you take away, John, Yeah, Actually, 0:12:19.521 --> 0:12:20.001 what's that mean? 0:12:20.041 --> 0:12:20.321 What a man? 0:12:20.401 --> 0:12:22.721 Who should pay for cockroaches? What is it? What is it? 0:12:22.841 --> 0:12:23.801 Even that question? What's that? 0:12:23.801 --> 0:12:23.961 Well? 0:12:24.561 --> 0:12:26.401 You can have Let's say a tenant's been in the 0:12:26.401 --> 0:12:28.321 property for two years and then all of a sudden 0:12:28.441 --> 0:12:31.161 there's just a lot of cockroaches in the property. It 0:12:31.201 --> 0:12:33.281 can be once you've been in for about two years, 0:12:33.281 --> 0:12:36.401 it's normally assumed that you, as the tenant, has probably 0:12:36.561 --> 0:12:39.841 allowed this cockroach infestation to come in. But if the 0:12:39.881 --> 0:12:41.921 property has only been you know, if you only moved 0:12:41.961 --> 0:12:43.921 in for a couple of months, that was probably there 0:12:44.081 --> 0:12:46.801 when you moved in. And so then you get a 0:12:46.801 --> 0:12:49.121 two hundred dollar bill for getting rid of the cockroaches. 0:12:49.201 --> 0:12:51.321 Landlord doesn't want to pay, tenant doesn't want to pay, 0:12:51.321 --> 0:12:52.601 and off to the tribune. 0:12:52.281 --> 0:12:55.081 Or you go, wow, I never knew that that was 0:12:55.161 --> 0:12:58.041 who's paying for the cockroaches? We'll say that these are 0:12:58.081 --> 0:13:00.401 the big topics that well, I looked seriously though, if 0:13:00.401 --> 0:13:01.921 you've got a few cup I mean, what does the 0:13:01.921 --> 0:13:03.801 bad cockroach infestation look like? 0:13:03.921 --> 0:13:06.841 Well, it depends if they're German cockroach. For a native. 0:13:10.161 --> 0:13:13.281 It sounds slightly munty. Pythony asked, But look, we want 0:13:13.321 --> 0:13:15.521 to take your cause. If you do you think that 0:13:15.841 --> 0:13:17.201 the government was right to bring the back in the 0:13:17.241 --> 0:13:19.801 notice period. Look my gut reaction, but I'm not I'm 0:13:19.801 --> 0:13:22.961 not a landlord or a tenant. Fortunately that if I 0:13:23.001 --> 0:13:25.521 had a bad tenant, I wouldn't want to have basically, 0:13:25.561 --> 0:13:27.921 wouldn't want to have to go near the tenancy tribunal 0:13:27.921 --> 0:13:29.441 because it just sounds like one big house or so 0:13:29.441 --> 0:13:31.201 I'd be like, I'd want to just give them notice. 0:13:31.281 --> 0:13:33.761 But of course, if you're an unscrupulous landlord, there are 0:13:33.801 --> 0:13:35.361 lots of good people who can be in the way 0:13:35.401 --> 0:13:37.041 of that. So what do you reckon? Do you think 0:13:37.041 --> 0:13:39.121 the government have got it right or would you like 0:13:39.161 --> 0:13:41.121 to see the ninety days scrapped and go back to 0:13:41.161 --> 0:13:44.761 the former system Maybe weether slightly more effective tenancy tribunal. 0:13:45.001 --> 0:13:46.841 And the number is eight hundred and eighty ten eighty. 0:13:47.201 --> 0:13:49.641 Text is nine two nine two. My guest is a 0:13:49.681 --> 0:13:52.241 new guest on the Wonderrouf radio shows Mike Atkinson from 0:13:52.241 --> 0:13:54.601 a SPA Property Management. We'll be back in just a moment. 0:13:54.681 --> 0:14:19.961 It's twenty past four. Yes, welcome back to the Weekend Collective. 0:14:19.961 --> 0:14:23.081 There's a one roof radio show where with Mike Atkinsoni's 0:14:23.081 --> 0:14:26.721 managing director Aspire Property Management. Actually, just how do people 0:14:26.721 --> 0:14:29.481 get in touch with your company? Mike, Hang on a second, 0:14:29.481 --> 0:14:30.681 I'll just turn your microphone on. There we go. 0:14:30.921 --> 0:14:33.201 They can go to our website Aspire Property dot co 0:14:33.241 --> 0:14:35.441 dot nz and they can get in touch with us 0:14:35.441 --> 0:14:35.761 that way. 0:14:36.001 --> 0:14:38.401 I imagine it's if they just Google your company as well. 0:14:38.401 --> 0:14:41.081 Google'srett effective at getting you as one of the top hits, 0:14:41.081 --> 0:14:44.161 isn't it. It is Aspire Property Management, right. I'm still 0:14:44.201 --> 0:14:47.081 hung up on this German versus casual cockroach sort of 0:14:47.081 --> 0:14:49.841 thing before we but we'll dig into that in a moment. 0:14:50.761 --> 0:14:52.001 Let's go to Ivan. 0:14:52.081 --> 0:14:55.041 Good a, Yeah, good, good afternoon. 0:14:55.961 --> 0:14:59.441 I just wanted to ask the guys. You guys built 0:14:59.481 --> 0:15:01.841 a brand new town here. It's not doubt for rental, 0:15:02.001 --> 0:15:05.441 right had I had tenants and I haven't managed and 0:15:06.401 --> 0:15:09.921 anyhow I thought they were doing a good job managing it, 0:15:10.001 --> 0:15:13.561 but obviously they weren't the fight after three and a 0:15:13.641 --> 0:15:17.161 half four years, I actually had a went inside the 0:15:17.201 --> 0:15:21.801 place to have a look and and the property. They 0:15:21.841 --> 0:15:25.481 had fans poured all over the carpet and from here 0:15:25.521 --> 0:15:28.361 and there. It was a terrible mess. They had animal 0:15:28.481 --> 0:15:32.921 damage to the carpet. They had they demaged the garage door. 0:15:33.561 --> 0:15:37.161 They had broken the spouting with a camper van. We 0:15:37.481 --> 0:15:42.281 went up against it and that, and they had. 0:15:42.201 --> 0:15:45.401 Fat right, right, it sounds pretty bad. 0:15:46.521 --> 0:15:49.841 Fat on the oven, right, And I had the electrician bowling, 0:15:49.921 --> 0:15:51.961 but it was a fire hairs. I had to replace it. 0:15:53.761 --> 0:15:55.201 I took him in to have a look at it. 0:15:55.561 --> 0:15:59.161 And anyhow, the whole ones I went to the private uni, right, yep, 0:15:59.161 --> 0:16:01.961 we're with ye, And the tribeian just sat there and 0:16:02.041 --> 0:16:05.041 smiled at me. All right, yeah, And they said care 0:16:05.201 --> 0:16:09.761 you and can you prove that this was intentional damage 0:16:11.041 --> 0:16:14.681 by the tenant. I just know what I could proved 0:16:14.681 --> 0:16:18.561 an intention or she intentionally did it, all right? Of 0:16:18.601 --> 0:16:20.881 course they said, well you've got to claim insurance. So 0:16:21.401 --> 0:16:24.721 insurance each time they spuilt the old tina on the 0:16:24.881 --> 0:16:28.761 on the carpet, that was a separate claim. And there 0:16:28.801 --> 0:16:31.241 was a live the place, so everyone was a seam 0:16:31.321 --> 0:16:35.041 or there was an excess of seven of them, so 0:16:35.241 --> 0:16:38.121 you know it was I saw it as being really unfit. 0:16:38.281 --> 0:16:40.081 Now was that more still in place? 0:16:40.361 --> 0:16:40.601 Right? 0:16:41.001 --> 0:16:45.561 Yeah? Okay, thanks thanks Ivan, Mike, what do you what 0:16:45.641 --> 0:16:46.161 do you reckon? 0:16:47.841 --> 0:16:49.801 Well, that's the thing when we were talking about who 0:16:49.881 --> 0:16:53.641 has the power overall, is that at the moment because 0:16:53.641 --> 0:16:55.641 of that ninety day noticed, landlords have the power, but 0:16:55.801 --> 0:16:59.041 throughout the sort of life cycle of a tenant, and 0:16:59.081 --> 0:17:01.441 what this caller was discussing is an example of where 0:17:01.441 --> 0:17:03.521 the tenants have the power and when it comes to 0:17:03.641 --> 0:17:07.601 dispute resolution if you go to the tenancy tribunal. That 0:17:07.681 --> 0:17:11.081 caller's story is incredibly common for people where you have 0:17:11.121 --> 0:17:14.481 a tenant and they let the property go really downhill, 0:17:14.601 --> 0:17:16.641 and you go to the tribunal and they treat you 0:17:16.721 --> 0:17:20.841 like you're the bad guy and you are awarded next 0:17:20.921 --> 0:17:22.721 to nowhere towards your cost. 0:17:22.841 --> 0:17:27.561 Well, why does that happen? Because my understanding that intentional 0:17:27.641 --> 0:17:30.481 damage is also to do negligence is another thing as well. 0:17:31.041 --> 0:17:34.121 If you are deliberately leaving things uncleaned and well we 0:17:34.241 --> 0:17:35.481 get to the cockrate just then, don't we. 0:17:35.721 --> 0:17:39.161 But anyway, yeah, so careless and intentional is supposed to 0:17:39.161 --> 0:17:43.201 be paid by the tenant, But if the landlord has insurance, 0:17:43.321 --> 0:17:46.561 then they can claim the excess or the rent up 0:17:46.561 --> 0:17:49.161 to four weeks rent, whichever is lower. But then your 0:17:49.161 --> 0:17:52.121 insurance company will do as this caller said, and every 0:17:52.201 --> 0:17:54.521 drop on the carpet is one extra excess. 0:17:55.721 --> 0:17:57.721 Well that's pretty obnoxious, isn't it. 0:17:57.881 --> 0:18:00.041 Yeah, So in an example like that, if you've had 0:18:00.081 --> 0:18:02.681 a property manager looking after the property for four years 0:18:02.721 --> 0:18:05.001 and it's been one tenant and it's gotten to four 0:18:05.241 --> 0:18:09.241 years where you've finally seen the property, I would recommend 0:18:09.281 --> 0:18:11.561 that you go and review the routine inspection reports that 0:18:11.561 --> 0:18:14.561 you've been sent and have a look to see if 0:18:14.601 --> 0:18:17.801 this happened quickly. Was the property manager doing their job, 0:18:18.641 --> 0:18:20.961 because you go to the tenancy tribunal to hold the 0:18:21.041 --> 0:18:24.201 tenant to account. But if you have a property manager 0:18:24.201 --> 0:18:26.161 and they've been charging you twenty seven hundred dollars a 0:18:26.241 --> 0:18:28.121 year to manage the property and they haven't been doing 0:18:28.161 --> 0:18:30.561 the job, then you may have a claim against the 0:18:30.561 --> 0:18:31.281 property manager. 0:18:31.481 --> 0:18:34.961 Ah, the problem is litigation. I mean, for the most 0:18:35.361 --> 0:18:37.761 I think that's why I still prefer the notice thing 0:18:37.801 --> 0:18:43.881 because for most people busy live big responsibilities with owning 0:18:43.921 --> 0:18:46.841 property or and just our general lives. The idea of 0:18:46.881 --> 0:18:49.841 having to go to a tribunal would probably I mean, 0:18:49.921 --> 0:18:52.481 this is the argument why you'd have a property manager, really, 0:18:52.521 --> 0:18:54.281 isn't it. Yeah. I know you're not here to spruk 0:18:54.321 --> 0:18:57.521 for that necessarily, but look, to be honest, every expert 0:18:57.521 --> 0:18:59.961 who's involved with property we've had on this show who 0:18:59.961 --> 0:19:02.641